How to deal with liars at work

Dealing with Liars in the Workplace

I wrote much of this as a response to a question about how to deal with liars in the workplace. I hope this is helpful and I welcome any feedback or questions.

There are different types of liars that you may encounter varying in the level of self-awareness and intentionality of their lying. Some people tend to embellish or exaggerate. Those actions, usually required by the embellishers to stroke or build their own fragile egos, can certainly be categorized as lies, but they tend to be less harmful overall than the lies of pathological or manipulative liars.

Some liars are pathological and compulsive, meaning that they seem not to be able to help themselves. They may lie out of habit, or fear, or simply because they've learned that lying has worked better for them than telling the truth.These liars may lie without even thinking about it as being a lie. In fact, they may even believe the reality that they construct.

Then there are the manipulative liars, fully aware of what they are about and being strategic about making others look bad and themselves appear better in comparison. These people will lie about the work they themselves do, and they will lie to you and about you to other people.

Once you've figured out that you are dealing with a pathological or manipulative liar, you must take steps to protect yourself and your reputation in the organization. Here are some techniques that you can use:

1) Very quickly avoid trying to resolve issues with them as you would with a person of integrity. All that does is put you in a situation of vulnerability. They will just use the information you share with them against you, and will see your efforts to resolve issues with them as an indication of weakness.

2) Calmly and directly confront the liar immediately upon the lie-whether it occurs in front of witnesses or not. Simply state the truth and then avoid the crazy arguing that the liar will try to engage you in. If that person is a liar, it's not just you in the organization that will know it, and your standing up to him or her might give someone else the courage to do so as well. A liar is a bully, and bullies need standing up to or they run amok.

3)NEVER meet alone with a liar to resolve a situation as you would a regular colleague. Doing so will set you up for further lies, including accusations on their part that you were somehow inappropriate or abusive in the meeting. Remember, they will lie, and also, since they lie, any agreement or resolution the two of you come up with will be broken by them anyway. Always try to have a witness in your dealings with a liar.

4)Document! Don't let a situation develop where it's your word against his or hers. Liars can be very smooth and practiced in presenting a distorted reality to your organizational superiors.

5)Let your integrity shine! Don't stoop to the liar’s level. Show your integrity consistently in such a way that if it ever comes down to your boss or others having to believe you or the liar it will be no contest.

Lying at work is a form of harassment and bullying. It's an activity that is often reflective of a dysfunctional organizational culture and a lack of consistent firm leadership that demands accountability to organizational values and standards. No one should have to put up with abuse and the accompanying experiences of distrust, insecurity, and anxiety at work. If you're not satisfied with leadership's response to your concerns, you may wish to consult with an employment lawyer, as well as talk with your physician about the stress you're experiencing.

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Comments 163 comments

michelle 7 years ago

i am working with a lier. a meeting has taken place between us both and management. the person in question spent over an hour lieing. how do you cope with someone like that. i have agreed to carry on working with him, as that is the proffesinal procedure to take, however, i do feel quite unsafe working with him. he was asking my managers if he could bring a lie detector machine in, oh he also said i was the devil in disguise. will finish there as i have been awake alnight it is now 5.45 i cannot sleep because of this incident. some people are quite out of this world


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 7 years ago Author

Hey Michelle,

I'm sorry you're going through this. One strategy that may be useful is to make sure that he provide evidence that his statements are factual. So rather than get into emotional exchanges with him, put it to him to prove what he is saying to be true. That way both of you are documenting which makes it more challenging to get away with a lie. Lie detectors are actually fairly useless as they can be fooled.


Becky 7 years ago

I have been going thru the same thing where I work, and it had gotten to the point I applied for another job, in which I did get..So my former boss would lie and talk about everyone, try and do things for you, that were not legal, so somehow she could hold something over your head, even when I would say, No I dont need you to do that, and she would anyhow, andthen mention how we could both lose our jobs if this is ever brought up, she also would give us verbal promotions within the office, like move up to another position, then not pay you what that position offers, then take it from you and give it to someone else, and tell coworkers of private conversations, evn show them messages we exchanged, tell ppl they could not have a position until we trusted her, then list a job posting, then tell us its to late, the job is already offline now you cannot have it within a few days, when it was not like that before, we applied by paper, then submiited the online form upon hire..she also bullies people and talks you down and asks in front of people what does your brain not comprehend ? which I thought she should take someone to her office for that, and usually it was just hard anyway because 3 of us, work 3 diff positions within the company, everyday, and just be told to do more, while she does nothing, I could spend hours in the chamber room without a break to go to the bathroom, or lunch, and call and call her to see who would be relieving me, and it was OH, Im sorry I forgot...When really she just sits in her office with her husband and kids..and on that subject she would hire women her son was interested in, and then try run them off when the women didn't like her son so much anymore, I could go on and on and on..she lies about the doctors at theoffice..everyone, she lies about everything, everyone an slanders your name, then blames everyone else, and I do mean everyone.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 7 years ago Author

Hi Becky,

Thanks for the comment. Wow! Sounds like you are well out of there. It's very difficult to know where to begin to make changes in those situations because, as we all know, culture and values start from the top. If you have an insecure boss who leads through manipulation, power-playing and game playing, it's just really hard to do much more than survive your work day and focus on maintaining your own integrity. Good for you to take care of yourself and find a healthier situation.

Take care.

Theo


Jane 7 years ago

I am having a very hard time dealing with my co worker. It is just me and her in the office and 2 days a week our boss/owner is there. I just started 6 months ago and this person has thrown me under the bus since the beginning. She lies to get herself out of things she does and puts the blame on me to our boss. Unfortunatley, he does not see what is going on because she is so good at it. My boss will then come to me and say things need to be done better or faster. She lies her way out of situations, but now I am being affected by it. My boss is also very callous and will reprimand or criticize performance in front of people. Sometimes I feel like I am in a no-win situation. It is hard to get jobs right now and I don't know what to do. I am a very sensitive and honest worker and have always dealt with people in a positive and helpful way. Sometimes I think I am too sensitive in life! I just want to do a good job, get a salary and feel good about myself. I have addressed the situation at two different times with my boss when he has been rude or humiliates me in front of people. He stops for awhile and then when things get tough or he is frustrated it starts again. I feel like I can handle him but I am so upset and frustrated about the lying and having to always feel that I have to protect myself. There is definitely no teamwork hear. Any suggestions.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 7 years ago Author

Hi Jade,

Thank you for writing.

I think there are two issues here; your relationship with your co-worker and how you deal with that, and your relationship with your boss.

You feel your co-worker lies about your performance to your boss, and then your boss says you have to work better or faster. I'm wondering if there is any element of truth to what your boss is saying to you, regardless of your co-workers lies. If so, get very clear and specific directions from him about what he needs to have done better and faster, document your efforts and results, and proactively present them to him when he visits the office. Don't let your co-worker's lies set your agenda at work. Don't react to her; instead, focus on your job and responding to your boss's specific feedback.

As for your boss, I'm glad that you've addressed the times with him where he's been rude and humiliated you. I'm hoping that you documented that. You say that you "can handle him", so perhaps you're building a relationship with him where you can clearly let him know that he can't take out his frustration on you. Perhaps ask him when he's not frustrated to stratigize with you about how he can give you feedback more respectfully.

Having said that, no one has a right to be abusive to you at work. If you feel it crosses the line, perhaps research workplace harassment law in your area, as well as review your organization's policies about harassment and personal conduct. Do that, then have a consult with an employment lawyer to see what your options are.

One of my fans is an employment lawyer. Maybe you would consider sending a note to him.

Good luck.

Theo


tnderhrt23 profile image

tnderhrt23 6 years ago

This is an excellent HuB, with sound advise! I think we all encounter a liar in the workplace at some point. God knows, I have certainly met my share. Was also married to a compulsive, pathological liar...(not something I am particularly proud of)...what a totally horrible experience that was!...Wish I had run into some advise like this earlier in my journey! Thank you!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

You're welcome.

Yes, we've all met them, and it must have been very hard for you to live with one. I'm sure you learned a great deal from it.

Thanks for reading and for the comment. All the best to you.

Theo


Help 6 years ago

I am a supervisor who has a pathological liar working under me. When I have confronted this person about her lies, she has denied what I know to be true and gotten angry to the point I was scared. Her lies and the games she plays with her schedule are taking a toll on myself and her coworkers. I would like to get her help, but I am scared she will blame me and possibly seek retribution.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Thanks for writing.

Document, document, document! Always document behaviours-in other words, write down inconsistencies between what she says and what she does and what has actually happened.

Also, confide and consult! Bring your concerns to a fellow supervisor or your supervisor and explain the situation-and again, document after you ask them for their ideas about how to handle this. They may have had similar experiences as you.

Document her co-workers concerns so that it does not become just you against her.

What retribution are you afraid of? Head that off by bringing that fear to your supervisor and asking how you can feel safe to supervise this person without that fear. Ask for support and back-up, and again, document!

You are entitled to a safe work environment. Document what she is doing that scares you when she is angry.

Bring all of this together into her performance review, again focusing on her documented behaviours, and make it clear that she must change her behaviour in order for her to remain part of your team. At that point, ask her if she would like your help (perhaps you have an Employee Assistance Program you can refer her to).

Check your organization's policy and procedures about disciplinary procedures and what is entailed in dismissing a person if needed and follow those steps carefully.

Bottom line is that you must feel free to supervise, and that means you should not ever be intimidated from doing your job which is to get the best out of your team. Not dealing with her will erode not just your morale, but will cause your team's productivty to drop significantly-not to mention their confidence in you. "One bad apple..."

Hope that helps.

Theo


Help 6 years ago

Thank you Theo.

I have documentation and people to verify my stories. I spoke to human resources last week and they offered an intervention. I was afraid to pull the trigger at the time. I don't know how this girl will react. Plus, she knows where I live etc. After researching this illness and seeing how serious it is, I think I will have to speak to them again. I have

I started saving e-mails to and from this girl over a year ago. I know her coworkers would also verify my stories. I definitely have enough ammunition to get her fired at this point, which is what I would prefer to do. I'm just scared of what this girl is capable of.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

You're welcome.

Don't hesitate to consult with the police as well. Take any threat seriously, and give a "head's up" to any people who live in your home.

All the best. If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to know if you're okay. Please check back in to give me an update.

Take care.

Theo


Kathy 6 years ago

I work with someone who has the ability to lie and people believe her. I want to just do my job and forget about it, but our jobs depend on a quota of people and this person is on another team doing the same thing. We have had meetings and have written down ground rules but this person continues to go against all rules. She always has a reason or good excuse for stealing clients that should go to our team and no one sees this. I kept allowing this to happen for months last year and when I finally put my foot down, the trouble began. My direct supervisor doesn't see it, but an advisor with the state sees what she is doing. The problem is, my direct supervisor is the one who is suppose to take care of these issues. I don't want to spend a lot of time on these issues, but the success of my team is at stake and my team members want me to continue to address the stolen clients with our supervisor. How do I stop this without looking really petty by my supervisor? How do we make our supervisor see that this person just has the ability to make people believe what she is saying instead of seeing what she is doing. We are all so frustrated at this point.

Thank you for your help.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

There's an interesting book that I reviewed on the resources page of my website that comes to mind, "Snakes in Suits". You should check it out.

A lot is going to depend on your relationship with your supervisor. Lowered morale, stealing clients, "success of team" are certainly not petty issues, and framed that way, it would be hard for your supervisor to dismiss them.

You say at first that "no one sees this", but later you say an advisor and the rest of the team all see it. That, plus your documentation, could help your supervisor see the seriousness of the issue. What if your whole team met with the supervisor, and not just you? If this person has gone against written ground rules, your documentation of this, plus the corroboration of your team could help.

I am hoping that you have some organizational policy and procedures in place which determines how clients are assigned. Make sure you document specifically when those procedures weren't followed. The whole point of these policies is to prevent this sort of thing from happening.

Let me know how things go-and thanks for writing. I can understand your frustration.

Sincerely,

Theo.


bERYL 6 years ago

Liars are dangerous. what can one do when their own daughter and son inlaw spread damaging lies about their parent?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Hi,

Thanks for the question.

You're right, liars can be dangerous to your reputation, but remember, if you have a solid reputation in the first place, people will take that into consideration.

I'm sorry this is happening with your family. I hope you'll be able to sit down with them and try to understand the issues they have with you.

Theo


kat 6 years ago

I do not work with liars but I live with some in a refuge. Since I have been in refuge I have come across some emotionally distraught people who are very critical of others but not themselves.

One girl complained that I was a racist because she was asian. Then she started to complain that I did not clean although she never picked up a broom stick. The refuge manager noticed that she did not clean yet had the audacity to complain about me (with three kids and her being childless). Yet the refuge manager seemed to take her side of things and never dealt with the situation.

This lady was evicted from the refuge for not following the rules (she invited someone into the refuge and I told on her)

Now a new lady has come in who harrasses me non-stop through out the day. If the bathroom has water on the floor with some footprints, or there is negligent amount of rubbish on the kitchen floor, or to keep quiet at 5pm. She once shouted at me for my son cleaning out a glass she had on the windowsill. and much more.

Her shouting started immediately after she arrived however when I go to the refuge manager she says that she sees two sides to the story. Just the other day this lady hit me in the chest. She admitted to the refuge manager that she pushed me softly and shouted. And has now been making false accusations that I called her a bitch.

Although she was clean when she first arrived I noticed that she does not do her chores when she is supposed to but one minor glip (that she percieves) is treated as a crime.

The manager said she didn't know whose side to take in the matter due to me having problems with the first tenant. And that she is thinking about evicting both of us.

To top it off when the lady first came another tenant saw her actions and reported them (but saying that she wanted to stay out of it). Which I took offense too and told her I did not wish to be her friend anymore as a result.

Now she hangs out with this abusive lady in order for the abuse not to affect herself and just this evening lied on a paper stating that she did her chores.

I am too old for this type of behaviour. Feel I am being bullies and abused. And that if I do not put up with it then I will be evicted from the womens refuge for battered women where I live.

I feel sick to my stomach with the situation. And feel the refuge manager has not been properly writing down all of the story (and the shouting) because she feels sorry for tenants. But this has a long term negative affect.

What advice can you give me?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Hi,

Thank you for your note. I'm sorry that you're having a hard time of it.

The first thing I'd like to know is whether you have taken a hard look to see if there is anything you have contributed to the problem. Then, let your manager know that you are willing to hear any feedback that would help you address any concerns people have of you. Taking that kind of leadership may show the manager that you're not the problem, and may give you the chance to address any things you've overlooked about yourself. Then you can ask the manager to mediate between you and the other woman.

If you do that, and the bullyiing continues, (and physical touch of that sort is never acceptable) ask if there is a third neutral party to speak with outside of your manager to help resolve the problem. I am hoping that you can't just get evicted without cause, and that there is someone (an ombudsman) that supervises the program. Ask your manager if you can receive another perspective on the issue.

Hopefully your willingness to look at yourself and work with your manager will pay off in showing that you should not have to leave. If the other woman is the problem you say she is, her true colours will soon emerge and she will show that she is not able to work things out. That might show your manager where the problem or part of the problem) lies.

Take care.

Theo


Help! 6 years ago

I'm having a rough time at work right now. A coworker and I have been close friends for quite some time now. We've always helped each other out and confided in each other about life problems. We've never really had a problem with each other, until she started treating customers with rude disrespect. I've been afraid to approach her about it since we're close, but when a supervisor and I agreed that someone had to talk to her about her behavior, the other supervisor decided she would handle it the nicest way she could. Somehow my coworker twisted every word the supervisor said to her and called corporate on me and is now gossiping to people saying that I've been harassing her for a while now. I'm shocked and hurt, and I feel like I'm being backed into a corner. She's taking situations that have happened and adding words to them that I've never said and telling people that I'm harassing her. I'm a very sensitive person, so I don't take slander and defamation of character lightly. In fact, the day I found out she called corporate I had a full-on panic attack right there at work. I have to make an appointment with my doctor now because I've been having chest pain since then and have had absolutely no appetite. I am the only one she is doing this to. I'm a very honest and respectful person, and the only problems I've had at work have been related to my fear of approaching coworkers about behaviors they need to correct in fear that something like this would happen. What do I do to bring light to the truth?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Hi,

Thank you for your comments and question. I'm sorry you're experiencing such pain. I'll try to help.

First of all, you haven't said whether you actually did talk to your co-worker friend first, or how you got to speaking with a supervisor where you agreed that your co-worker needed to be spoken to. If you didn't speak with her first it's not surprising that she feels betrayed and is acting out.

Having said that, she is not entitled to spread rumours about you or harass you. I'm assuming that you have approached her to try to resolve this. If you have, and that clearly has not worked, I suggest that you go to the supervisor who was involved and ask for his/her help to resolve the situation. Explain the situation to them and see if they would set up a meeting between you, her, them, and corporate to resolve the issue.

You might also consider working on building some communication and assertiveness skills so that you have more confidence approaching your co-workers and other people directly about issues that need to be addressed.

Let me know how it goes, and good luck.

Theo


nancy 6 years ago

I have been working with this co-worker for over 5 years, All the time, I tried to focus on my work & not to care what others did or said. Just recently I found out this co-worker gossip and spread lies against me to other co-workers and worse of all to my boss and that caused me harm. I spoke to my boss, but no help, like he cannot hear or see only her, he's influenced so much by what this co-worker doing or saying. I even asked for a meeting with her & the boss, she ignored the meeting and my boss will not step to solve any lies or to put limit for the harm she causes me. Plese advise me, how should I deal with it?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Hi Nancy,

First of all, I hope you're documenting everything that is happening-from the lies that are being spread to your attempts to resolve the issues, and to your efforts to set up a meeting with your boss. Once you've documented eveything you're in a much better position to refute the lies, and to inform your boss that you need to take the complaints to the next level-if your boss answers to anyone. You can also point out that you are feeling harassed, and you have the evidence to prove it. You are entitled to a safe work environment, so if you don't get help at work you might consider speaking with your doctor about time off, and using some of that time to consult with an employment lawyer. Consult with one of my followers on Hub (Undercover Lawyer) who will give you some solid legal advice. Ignoring things by focusing on your work hasn't helped stop what you experience as lies/harassment, so it may be time to be more assertive about your rights.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

Theo


Seth Fichtner 6 years ago

A colleague of mine got promoted to boss 3 years ago and in that time frame has managed to manipulate, lie, and outright deceive around any situation in a vain attempt to make herself look good. I have caught her in three lies myself in the past couple of years and has recently railroaded 2 of my colleagues for a mistake of her own that is jepoardising their impeccable reputations. Everyone at work is aware of her self-serving behaviours and she is single-handedly driving moral into the ground. I equate her to Captain Smith of the Titanic with the only difference being she has her binoculars on the iceberg while the ship's leaving England and is heading straight for it at breakneck speed!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 6 years ago Author

Well, the good thing about it is that more people than you are aware of it and hopefully keeping very detailed and corroborated notes. Have you read the book, "Snakes in Suits"? If not, check it out. Thanks for the note. Theo


james 5 years ago

Trying to figure out the best way to deal with a coworker who is trying to convince everyone that I dislike them. I work for a small branch of a larger company that only houses about 10-12 employees per branch. I have worked here for two years now and love my job and get along with almost everyone. The problem I am having is one coworker who uses everything I say against me. He doesn't do this to my face its always behind my back. He is just as sweet as pie to my face. To give an example if I happen to say something to him about what I might dislike about a particular assignment he will run behind my back and blow it completely out of proportion. My boss and I had a decent relationship until whatever got said to him because now he avoids even speaking to me unless he absolutely has to. My coworker has gone to the lengths of going to my boss's boss to try to get my boss fired and just like me he is as sweet as pie to his face. Not sure if he has done this to anyone else but I do know that he has most of the people at work feeling sorry for him for various reasons. Reasons in my book that would be listed under "life" and this makes it even harder to confront because I feel like they will side with him over me if I was to try to set the record straight. Part of this is my fault for speaking my mind to him in the beginning because he seemed to speak his mind to me. What I mean by that is my job can be very stressful and it helps to be able to vent to someone from time to time. Not sure what to do because I have caught him red handed lying about this or that and other employees have too but they blamed the lies on his ex wife saying she was the reason he acted like that. Im frustrated because Im to the point where I have to be guarded at all times to prevent the next lie. I feel that he doesn't like me because he is not very good at his job and I have picked up more in two years than he has in five. I know that sounds arrogant but its true. I have listened to others complain that they have to hold his hand sometimes. Like I said I like my job and I dont plan on losing it because of a pathetic twerp like this but Im baffled on the best way to handle it due to his ties with the other employees. Even though they have agreed with me in some instances I believe they would side with him for two reasons. One because they have known him longer and have built a stronger friendship and two they feel sorry for him. What is the safest course of action to deal with this??


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Wow! Did you read my comments in response to an earlier question where I recommended the book, Snakes in Suits. Read it-better yet, read it and then pass it on to your boss.

First of all, your organization needs to reconnect with its values (if it has them). It has to establish a conflict resolution process that everyone is expected to follow, and it could benefit from some directed team-building focused on eliminating back-biting and gossip.

In addition, here's what I suggest you do. First, disengage from him. Do not trust him with any comment or thought. Be civil about it and work with him as needed so you don't end up looking like you're not a team-player, but do not trust him with anything beyond what is needed to perform your duties.

Second, let your co-workers know that you will not be competing with your manipulative co-worker about who is telling the "truth." Tell them they will have to figure that out based on what they know of you and your character. Then carry on being you at work. Do not stoop to his level. They will soon figure things out for themselves.

Third, approach your boss with your concerns about your relationship with him, and ask if there is a problem that needs to be resolved. Share your perception of how you used to have a good relationship with him and ask if it's changed from his perspective. That may open the door to you then sharing about your experience with your co-worker and your plan to disengage and stop getting involved in petty work gossip and politics. Tell him you love your job and that you are ready to do what it takes to repair any rift in your relationship with your boss.

Good luck!

Theo


james 5 years ago

That sounds like sound advice. Actually,I have approached my boss before and tried to try to mend things but he has problems of his own. He doesn't seem to engage when I have attempted this in the past but I haven't went to the lengths of pointing out exactly where the problem is originating from. I will try again but I will have to approach it carefully so he wont think I am just trying to stir trouble. Our office is setup differently than I have experienced before. We have an office manager and a field manager. My relationship with the office mgr. is sound. (as far as I know?)He is very professional and doesn't get involved with office gossip. The field mgr however who is below the office mgr in rank trys to be one of the guys but obviously still has influence with the office mgr which means he still has influence with the companies opinion of me. The office mgr and my coworker however have not always seen eye to eye which is putting it lightly. Anyways, thank you for the advice and I think I will check out the book as well,lol. Thanks again.


anon 5 years ago

How do you deal with people who lie t covr-up someone else's back especially wen that person dd something really bad.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

I think it depends on what they are lying about and what your work relationship is to them. Too many unknown variables to answer this question. Would you like to expand?


Melissa 5 years ago

Last week the teacher that I work with accused me of helping a student cheat on a test, he continued to accuse me and then told me that my job was to observe our students. The worse part of the situation was that it occurred in front of two students. I repeatedly explained what I was doing (encouraging the student to use testing statagies that he learned in his regular ed class) I also told him that I felt that our conversation was not appropriate in front of students and I asked him to stop. The situation got so hostilethat I started to pack up my things and go to another classroom. I told him that it was unacceptable to speak that way to me, ever, but especially in front of students and that it was not acceptable to question my integrety. I asked to see the IEP, for the specific testing accomodations/modifications pertaining to this student and he refused. We are now meeting the priciple tomorrow and I am having my union rep present, but I don't want to just complain, I want to resolve the situation and I don't know my specific rights. I attempted to research it online, Cal. ed code, labor laws, my employment contract and I couldn't find anything specific enough. Any ideas, suggestions or thoughts?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Thanks for writing.

The best resource for you would be a guy I'm following, Undercover Lawyer. Connect with him for legal questions.

Here's what's in your favour right now: You have witnesses, the teacher was unprofessional in accusing you of, first cheating, and then lying in front of students which is inappropriate, and he declined to let you see the IEP which looks suspicious, and you'll have a union rep with you, and you want to resolve the situation. All very positive things, assuming you've had no previous record of misconduct.

Go in with all of the documented material. Start off by stating your intent is to resolve the issue (that always sounds positive), stay calm so that the teacher can't make the claim that you aren't rational, and don't rush to agree to anything without first consulting with your union rep and Undercover Lawyer. If you can suggest that the concern the teacher raised about cheating was valid but mistaken, perhaps your teacher will be able to save face and acknowledge that possibility. Don't rush your words. Take time to breathe and think before saying anything.


Cris 5 years ago

Hello,

I have had various co-workers report to me the difficulty of communincating and giving feedback to a particular staff mmember. This staff member will lie about things that other staff report and does not take any accountabilty for her areas of development. She blames everyone but herself and holds grudges against anyone who gets promoted over her, especially because she has seniority. Most of all, other staff are not consistent in approaching her so they let things slip by. It gets to the point that once they get fed up, even after trying to give her feedback, they report things to me (supervisor) but I have no concrete documentation of the scenarios or facts that are being reported. By the time it gets reported, it becomes more difficult to apply a consequence.

It is also very difficult to deal with this situation because my direct bosses have a policy of never mixing two staff in a conflict resolution to avoid further damage. Staff also are afraid to confront her about her bad and negative attitude.

I use to have a close friendship with her, but upon my promotion, she stopped this sort of relationship. I have been able to resolve our issues by documenting scenarios and confronting her with facts. Usually she tries to blame someone else and when this is confronted, she starts to cycle through other ways not to be at fault. She is starting to understand that I will not give in but in the practical work setting, she still abuses her schedule and changes her tasks which affects the entire team.Staff have told me that she manipulates my direction at work and takes a complete change when we hang out outside of work. I am one of the very few people that will confront her and this is when she will stay quiet around me during work hours.

I would like to get advice on how to encourage the team (now that they have all talked her) to confess to upper management the rumors, lies, and breaking of the rules they see and experience on a daily basis.

Also, how would I guide myself with my direct bosses to be more assertive with this situation?

Thank you for your time and feedback.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Cris,

Thanks for contacting me.

There are basically two things you wrote that really stand out for me as being at the crux of the problem:

"...but I have no concrete documentation of the scenarios or facts that are being reported. By the time it gets reported, it becomes more difficult to apply a consequence." First of all, that has to change. The people who are having issues must document them specifically including the event and what they did in response. Otherwise their concerns are simply gossip and rumours, and contribute to making matters worse.

"It is also very difficult to deal with this situation because my direct bosses have a policy of never mixing two staff in a conflict resolution to avoid further damage. Staff also are afraid to confront her about her bad and negative attitude." Your organization must establish a clear conflict resolution process that people are expected to follow. There can be no exceptions to that. I have an example of one on my website under Resources/Articles for you to read.

Documenting on your part and implementing a conflict resolution gives you and the problem employee an opportunity to resolve the issues. If they can't be resolved, you need the documentation in order to let that person go. Keeping someone who is that distracting, disruptive, and demoralizing undermines your team and greatly affects production. Before you know it you'll be losing valuable team members, or they'll be dreading coming in to work and taking stress leaves and the like.

This sounds like the classic case of an organization either not having stated values, or not taking care to live by them. Let me know if there is anything else I can offer.

All the best,

Theo


Marie 5 years ago

Wow... my issue at work is somewhat similar to these problems. Only I'm a nurse in a private doctors office, the receptionist lied to the boss a.k.a the doctors wife in getting her nineteen year old daughter a Job there as a rooming nurse by saying she is in school for nursing. The young girl confided in me she didn't even have a high school diploma or ged. This came about when she was asked to pull up or draw an injection for a patient which required mixing and she couldn't do it due to lack of training and education. Not only is that dangerous but I think it might be illegal as well.

The receptionist will also decide to pick on one or two people in the office at a time by calling the boss during the day and sneaking off into the bathroom to spread her lies about co workers. She pawns work off onto others around her and covers up really big mistakes before they can be noticed by the boss. I have been documenting the mistakes I've fixed and I know the worst thing you can do for a liar is fix their mistakes but in my field if mistakes are over looked someone would in fact die.

Our boss believes this woman is made of gold and says she'll fix the situations, I believe to just shut us up. The icing on the cake is the only other person in the office is medical records and they both have the reputation of driving any other person out with their lies by making up documents to get them fired. Any good advice?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Marie,

This is an ethical issue and thus needs to be treated very seriously.

You haven't told me where you are located, but I assume you are governed as a nurse by a Professional Body. As there seems to be an issue here about endangerment to patients, I advise you to consult with it about what your professional responsibilities are in this situation, and document that you did so.

Continue to document your concerns regarding the receptionist and bring that to the doctor you work with. Follow the guidelines set out for you by your governing body about how to approach the doctor. This way the doctor will hopefully be more likely to see the issue as being of a professional nature, rather than a personal one. I believe that the doctor could be liable for any harm coming to her patients if she does not take effective action about a documented concern. That might do it. If not, you may need to consider looking for another position where your professional ethics are not compromised.


Chartreuse 5 years ago

I work at a government agency and lying is standard operating procedure here. Written documents mean nothing. Those of us with integrity are in the minority, and it is very hard. You start to wonder if you're the one who's crazy!

It's encouraging to see others struggling with this. I have almost lost hope in America. If there are not more liars than honest people in general, at least there seem to be more liars in positions of power. Here, integrity is a black mark on your record that people remember.

Hopefully I will be able to escape someday. I see no hope for change. There are too many liars.

If you work someplace where the leadership is basically honest, it would be encouraging to hear about it. This place is perverse.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi,

Thank you for your comment. I am sorry to read what you wrote, though not really surprised. It's a good invitation, though. How about it readers, any good encouraging stories to share?


christine 5 years ago

I'm facing problems with my line Manager. If she is confronted with a problem,she can talk her way out of it,denying the incident ever happened and making herself out to be the victim. I was being bullied a couple of month's ago, and another member of staff saw it happen. The staff member told me to go to my manager and report it, said I couldn't go to her as she is bullying me too.Recently another staff member reported her, the manager said that the incident never happened, and said the 'reporter' was proved to be a liar - according to her.I have had many confrontations with her, her view of things obviously doesn't match what is going on. I have never trusted her, and today I myself reported her - I feel I am being 'pushed' out of my job. She will never have her 'perfect team' if she is not honest with herself, which I don't think she is capeable of.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Christine,

I appreciate you writing. You seem to be in a bad situation, and I have some advice for you that may be unexpected. You need to document what happens from your perspective. A difficulty you need to overcome is lack of clarity in your documentation. Read what you wrote me, or better yet, have someone else read it, and tell me if your perspective seems coherent and clear. I was left very unsure of any logical sequence of events from what you wrote. You need to be more clear and provide a logical step-by-step account of the events and issues. If you don't, you will "be eaten alive" in any situation where a third party will make a decision regarding your story vs. your manager's story. This is actually a message to all people considering filing a complaint. Be very clear and present your documented sequence of events is a coherent time line.


christine 5 years ago

Thanks Theo, Thankfully, I write a daily diary which has been very useful in other situations of a similar nature. Last night I was going through them.I have quite a few events, in the few short months I have been there.I always pass it to my husband before I send/deliver anything, as I have a tendancy make a problem bigger 'saying it as it is' in my head. The Manager refused my resignation. I went to see Personnel yesterday, but I am sure her view of the truth will be accepted, and it looks like I will have to go before I become her next meal!


Jen 5 years ago

I work in an office that is very odd, spacially. We have two people on one floor, five on another, and three downstairs. Because of this, I work closely with two people and our boss is oblivious to much of what happens downstairs. The issue is that my two coworkers have become close friends and that has affected our working relationship. I have no problem with their friendship, as they lead very different lives than me and that's fine. However, the two of them have continually ganged up to start or finish projects together, and intentionally do not include me. I have tried addressing the problem with them directly and calmly, giving specific examples and even admitting that maybe I could be more "open" to things. Yet, the problems have continued and the two of them continue to undermine my authority in front of those we supervise (we are supposed to co-bosses) and make comments about me on Twitter and through IM (sidenote: I caught one of the messages when one of them was showing me something on their computer). I have gone to my boss twice and I get the feeling she does not want to address it and wants me to. I have tried this several different ways, with no success. And, today, I caught my coworker in a lie about something he says he told me but did not. What can I do because I love my job but I don't know how to work with two childish people?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Jen,

This seems to be a classic case of what I refer to as an "Anti-Team." You have a very small group of people who are not working as a team but rather as little cliques, and your boss seems to be the sort of manager who hopes things will just work out on their on.

I appreciate your approach in addressing the situation calmly with your co-workers first, and then talking with your boss trying to get her to do her job. You hopefully have documented the incidents and have presented that to her as well.

Undermining you in front of others and gossiping about you via twitter and IM are serious concerns. What if you framed what was happening in terms of harassment? Does your organization have a harassment policy?

What needs to happen is that the harassment needs to be addressed by your boss by following the procedures set out in your harassment policy. If there isn't a policy, know that your organization should have one and that you are protected by law from harassment in the workplace. Putting it like that might get your boss's attention.

Your group of workers would really benefit from some directed team-building with a focus on how everyone can support everyone (and not just a favoured friend) and conflict resolution.

You could present these ideas to your boss letting her know that you do love your job but insist on having her help you resolve matters with your co-workers.


Marilyn 5 years ago

I am not sure if the woman I work with is a narcissist, sociopath, compulsive liar or just blatantly lazy, useless, manipulative and deceptive.

I work for a very busy surgeon's practice (I'm just the receptionist - as she loves to put it).

I had been working for this particular surgeon for a year and a half before she came to the practice.

She is a 56 year old spinister who has been a nurse her whole life.

At first, both myself and our office manager (who also happens to be my boyfriend) did our best to make her feel welcome. We are both extremely helpful people and do our best to help people (anyone) who needs assistance. This included going past her house which is approximately 45km away from ours one evening to set up her new DVD player. We have taken her to the airport because she had no one else, amongst a range of other things.

However, after about 3 years of working together it turned out she was the typical "office bitch". Friendly and smiles to your face, but running us down to the boss behind our backs. Lying about our work performances, etc. You name it.

Our boss is a person who is unable to manage people. He likes to be popular and consider the "nice guy". Yet has unrealistic expectations of people and his staff and is a total control freak.

Obviously hearing all these things that we (myself and the office manager) were and weren't doing, how we were taking advantage of him and all the other ridiculous stories she fed him, freaked him out and created big conflict in the practice - which we had never experienced before.

Things only got worse. Our boss was becoming more and more agitated and nit-picky about things that only the office manager and I did. The nurse was his golden girl.

Things eventually reached a point at work, and the surgeon's wife was suspicious of the surgeon's relationship with the nurse (as she never seemed to do anything wrong. No one could mention her name to the surgeon in the same sentence as what might be critical or accuse her of any wrongdoing. He continuously said that she was the best thing ever to have happened to his practice - which his wife, the office manager and I strongly disagree with as the surgeon has no idea who and what she truly is.

I also reached a point of desperate frustration. I likened it to being in a horror movie and my character being the only person who knew the popular cheerleader was the callous murderer.

The nurse would be a certain way in front of the surgeon and the patients. But when no one else was around she would sit reading her novels, filing her nails, eating, smsing and talking on her cellphone.

For all of these reasons, we secretively installed spy cameras in the office just above her desk.

We have about two years worth of video footage and it is totally and utterly gobsmacking when you watch and hear what goes on.

The lies and bullshit she tells the surgeon everyday when we are not there (behind our backs). So absurd and crazy that any logical person who heard these stories, would probably question her stories and their validity. But the surgeon laps it all up. Whether to keep in her good graces or for whatever reason - we don't know.

It has now been 7 years that I have had to work with this useless, lazy piece of work who's only talents are manipulation, deceit and lies.

I have found the best way to deal with this troll, is to ignore her and act as if she doesn't exist - which at times is incredibly hard as she is also one of those people who has no regard or respect for other's personal space. She is constantly in your face. Her voice is so loud and shrill. (The surgeon's wife calls her "foghorn").

Everything about her is about being noticed. She loves nothing better than talking - her favourite topic being herself. But any (needed or unneeded) comment, advice, info that she can spew out (whether it be accurate or not), she is only too happy to provide; as long as she can have her say and the mouth is flapping.

I compare her to the Rainman because even if there's noone else in the office but me (who chooses to ignore her) she'll walk around talking to herself. But most of the time it's repeating the same thing to herself. "I've got to phone so 'n so, I've got to phone so 'n so . . . .". She's nuts!!!!

I have thought of posting the video footage onto YouTube and starting a series called "The Lies and Life of Judi".

I just find it so frustrating that she has still succesfully managed to pull the wool over so many peoples eyes.

Everything about her is an act and so insincere and fake. (including her teeth, hair colour and accent).

Really don't know if I can do this anymore. I try to hold onto my beliefs of karma, character and good always triumphing over evil. But the slimy snake always seems to wiggle her way out of situations where she is at obvious and visible fault and blame; through more lies (or more often is the case, feining ignorance coupled with lies).

I just wish people would open their eyes and wake up to see the person she really is. I feel like I am fighting a loosing battle against this woman. I don't know what to do anymore.

When you go to the surgeon with any issues he turns a blind eye or puts it down to a personality clash. I now have the reputation of being "out to get her because I don't like her". Yes!!! I don't like her. I don't tolerate liars, backstabbers, insincerity, laziness and idiocy. I will help and assist ANYONE who has tried to help themselves, someone who is decent and sincere.

Even she's made a comment about how patient I am with the patients. My reply, "Yes, because they're decent people who need guidance and assistance".


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Marilyn,

Thank you for your post. I'm sorry you're going through this. The biggest problem here is that your boss is showing no indication of wishing to manage. Lies only hold up in an office when they aren't throughly investigated. And liars are only able to keep their jobs when standards and values aren't enforced. Sadly, when people are not held accountable through regular fact based performance evaluations and reviews, the liars amongst us thrive.


christine 5 years ago

hi Theo, I wrote a couple of months ago about my bullying boss. One of the other members of staff sent a formal complaint to the Senior Manager. The result of this complaint was that both the member of staff and our boss were suspended. A quick investigation took place, and each member of staff in the depatment was interviewed individually. It was our chance to speak up on the situation and support our suspended collegue. I also gave a report of times dates and situations. By the end of the week, all the information was looked at. Both our collegue and the boss were re-instated and we were informed, by Senior Management, that we had made 'false allegations' against the boss. The investigation was supposed to be confidential, but it seems that the few of us that made a stand are now being shunned by her supporters in the staff. New rules are being made daily - but not upheld - and since her return, it feels like she is watching my every move. She has been hiding and listening into conversations, then made up excuses for being there. She often walks down my corridor and just looks at me without speaking and walks off. I want to talk to her about it, but it will end up in an argument, which I don't want. But on the other hand would it solve anything? So it seems I am her next meal!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

It seems highly unlikely that talking with her directly will do any good. As I metioned in my article, the last thing you want to do is meet alone with a liar as they may contort everything you say and make up more lies. If you're going to talk, make sure it's in the company of a witness!


Christine 5 years ago

My brain says 'give in Christine,you tried'. She made another new rule last Friday, which I reminded her of on Monday. She claimed she hadn't said it, so I told her who she said it in front of, myself and two other members of staff, and named names. It threw her a little, then she quickly composed herself and added to the rule to cover her tracks. And this is how everyday goes, very frustrating. I've told her if she wants me to go, don't mess me about, just ask me and I will. At the end of every -poinless- staff meeting, she says 'If you have any problems, just come and see me.' It's the last place I'd go, but after the investigation, it seems we have nowhere else to turn either for fear of not being believed. Her creeping about is freaky, but I see her having a nervous breakdown, and probably blaming me for it. Thanks for the advice.


Nancy  5 years ago

I have been with my job for five years and our receptionist has been there for one year. She has said all sorts of lies about me and she is taking over my work and also has management believing her. We had a meeting and she lied about everything. She said that I don't respect her and I talk about her in our supply room with everyone at work. She said that I yelled at her and hit the desk with my fist. This is so not true, but management seems to believe her. I brought it up in a meeting that part of my job function is doing what she is doing, and management said they can give the work to who they want. I know all sorts of things that she did like take account of when people would leave and say how they were gone for hours and never get any work done. I was going to mention this in our meeting, but I thought way bother no one believes what I am saying. Please advise on what I should do. I know that she is after my job and is doing a great job of getting it, as I have very little work left. She told me before I knew what she was doing that one manager should have never gotten her job because she never works and I would be slammed with all of her work. Well this is the same manager that no longer wants to work with me because of the lies our receptionship have said. How do I handle what is going on. I have no proof it's her word against mine. Also in our meeting she was crying like a baby and everyone was saying all look how upset she is. Please help.....Thanks


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi Nancy,

Some of what you wrote is a bit unclear, but I think I get the gist. I suggest that you not engage directly with her but whenever she makes up a story about you put the onus on her to prove it. If you can, go to your manager and ask to be given the chance to address the complaints she has made against you and again, make sure that the emphasis is on fact, not rumour or perception. Reaffirm your commitment to the organization and keep doing the best job you can do, regardless of the lies. Document any interactions with her and try to have a witness present during any encounters. In the meantime, keep an eye out for another job. Sometimes Liars win.


Karmen 5 years ago

Hello,

I have a coworker who is always getting in trouble and lying her way out of getting fired. This has been going on for several years now. We recently got a new boss who decided to throw out all the old files. She wanted us all to have a fresh start. Well this lying coworker has been yelling at me in front of customers and telling lies about me to our boss. I have never been in trouble before. This coworker is suppose to answer to me. I don't feel it is ok for her to talk to me or accuse me of these outrages lies. I went to my boss to have a meeting with lying coworker and boss. In the meeting my boss told my coworker she didn't do anything wrong and I need to just ignore her when she makes disrespectful comments to me. She also did not discipline the coworker for slandering me. She said we were being childish and this was ridiculous. That we should both be embarrassed. Now I'm angry. I need advice on how to handle this. My boss basically said my coworker could talk to me however she wants and spread lies. I am suppose to be her superior but she treats me as if I'm underneath her. Now my boss has the wrong impression of me. Since we both had new files. She doesn't know my coworkers history. Should I just leave this alone? Am I over reacting? I feel my boss should back me in regards to this lying coworker.


Christine 5 years ago

Hi Theo, did what I could and did as my brain kept telling me! I gave in and resigned. I finished my employment with the company yesterday. It took me 4 hours to leave the building, as it is a retirement home. The residents have got used to having me being there,so it was sad to go. I have a list of visits,shopping trips,and requests just to sit and listen.I have enqiured about being a volunteer. Think there is a cooling down period before I can apply, we shall see. Thanks for the advice. CJ


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Good luck, Christine. Sounds like you did what you felt you had to do for your health and emotional wellbeing. Sad that the residents will miss you.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hello Karmen,

I need to clarify a few things with you. Is this a coworker or is this someone you directly supervise? What do you mean when you say that your coworker has to answer to you and that you are superior? Also, you say that your boss told your coworker that she did nothing wrong, yet you also say your boss said that you both should be embarrased. Which one is it?


Karmen 5 years ago

I'm sorry. I didn't make any sense did I? I am suppose to be this persons leader. Make sure things are done on my shift and things are running smoothly. If i ask her to do something she is suppose to do it. I do not discipline though management does that. Our manager actually works a different shift then us. She hasn't been here very long and doesn't really know who we are or our reputation. When she came aboard she wanted everyone to have a clean slate so she threw away all old personnel files. I sent our manager an email letting her know of the situation I was having with this person. How she was yelling at me and accusing me of ridiculous things.  I don't feel it is ok to talk to anyone that way even an equal. Our manager scheduled a meeting. In the meeting my manager told me when my coworker says things i don't like I should just ignore her and in regards to her lying she doesn't have proof so I need to ignore that as well. If i have a problem with her actually doing her job that would be something worth discussing.  The problem I'm having is now she's going to think it's ok to tell lies about me   (who knows who else she's telling these lies to) and speak to me however she likes. Our manager felt that we wasted her time and we should be embarrassed for acting so childish. I sent her the email to get help in regards of how to handle the situation.  It was my bosses idea to have the meeting. Our boss flat out told my coworker that she didn't feel like she did anything "that wrong". Sounding as if I'm over reacting. Maybe I am. I just expect respect. I have never had an issue with anyone else who works here yet my coworker has been having issues for years (our boss doesn't know this because she threw out our files). My boss now has a completely wrong idea of who I am. Not sure what to do??? Should I just drop this? What should I do if the liar starts spreading lies and screaming at me again? Do i need to just ignore her and let her get away with treating me so disrespectful?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

One more question: You mention your boss and your manager. Are these two one and the same or different people?


Karmen 5 years ago

Sorry boss and manager same person.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Your manager has given you very clear feedback about what she wants from you and whether it's fair or not, it makes sense for you to follow what she says. She apparently is one of those managers who wants coworkers to work things out between themselves. That is unfortuate and possibly short-sighted, but that's what she is telling you.

Having said that, you have a right to a safe workplace free of bullying. I don't know where you are located, but if I were you, I would do some research into employment law covering your workplace. Workplaces are increasingly expected to have policies in place which protect employees from harm. Educate yourself about your rights, ask your manager when it would be appropriate to speak with her, and if there are policies, draw attention to them and make sure you follow them to a tee! If there aren't, and there should be, bring that up in your next performance evaluation meeting as something that is necessary to enhance your performance.

In the mean time, document any lies/slander that your coworker spreads about you. That could come in handy should you lose your job and need to hire a lawyer to get compensation. It will also come in handy since your manager understandably requires proof of your allegations.

Since you don't trust your coworker try to avoid one on one time as much as possible. If your coworker lies to the degree you say she does, you need witnesses around as much as possible to corroborate your word against hers. Your manager is telling you clearly that it's not your job to police your coworker so you need to step back and let your manager be responsible for your coworkers behaviour. And, if your manager seems to take a liking to this coworker and feels you are over-reacting, you might be advised to keep an eye out for another job in case you have to leave or are asked to leave.

Hope this helps.

Theo

So, I would recommend that you let your boss know you understand and that you will attempt to work the best you can with your coworker.


Karmen 5 years ago

Thanks for your help :)


helplease 5 years ago

Hi,

If it's not too late to post something here, here goes:

I have been in this dept for 10 yrs. One coworker came a year later, wouldn't be respectful to me and everyone that has come since she immediately gets to train them & befriends them. Meanwhile she is the biggest gossipper on the face of the earth. one of her bosses left & they haven't replaced him yet, but have said they will. One of my bosses took another open position & they did not replace her position, so I lost half of the clients I'd worked with for years & developed good relationshps with. One day i was filing at my desk, she walked by & said "Well I'm not going anywhere!" to me when I was minding my own business, filing. She had be=friended a guy who came 5 or so years ago, "trained" him & everything, and he never would be friendly to me, but overly friendly to everyone else. he is on the other side, but i always was pleasant to him when i saw him. He would repay my kindness with snide remarks & subltle digs, and twice said I was stealing the mail, when I was sorting it for the receptionist. In our monthly meetings, we take turns running the meeting, and also are supposed to take turns bringing up new things about work. I was on the schedule to talk about a new promotion, & when it was my turn, i said a few things about the promotion, & before I could give out the handouts, he said "Are ya done yet?" so I looked up from my notes & he said "___ already has that" referring to someone not in the meeting. I said what? and he and the Gossiper both said at the same time "___ already has that!" then he said to me again, "are ya done !?" so i said "i guess so" feeling like i was set up. the next day i talked to ___ and found out it was not the same info I was going to hand out. By the way, He knew what I would be talking about because he put me on the agenda. I tried to ask him about it, he yelled at me (there was noone around) & he didn't want to answer me so he said that I was yelling. He told everyone I yelled, I wernt to my mgr who was in a different area of the dept to tell him he yelled at me & was saying I was. my mgr said to ask him for a meeting, he followed me yelling & i felt threatened. Then he wanted HR involved. Because there was noone on my side of the office when he yelled, HR believed him, & I ended up with a verbal warning! I cannot trust anyone in the dept and feel like I have worked so hard all these years & because of this liar & bully, my reputation has gone down the tubes...this is my livelyhood & I always try to be extra nice to people, but have lost all trust in these people. I feel like I need a recorder on me at all times, can I do that?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hi,

Thanks for the note. From what you've written, it seems as if you're in a world of pain at work. From your perspective, you're being ganged up on at work and there's no managerial support or leadership in the organization that you can turn to to end the "cliquey" bullying environment. Even worse, HR gave you a verbal warning when you went to them for help. Meetings aren't run professionally-the inmates are running the assylum!

First of all, you need some legal advice. One of my hub page followers is Undercover Lawyer. You need to ask him what the law will allow regarding carrying a recorder. I suspect you can't tape people without their knowledge but you can check in with him to be sure. Secondly, your whole organization needs help. I don't think it's likely that you will be able to resolve this matter person to person as the people who are gossiping can't be trusted. Have you thought of approaching HR with the suggestion of using staff development training dollars to bring in a trainer who specializes in developing positive corporate culture and team building? That way you position yourself as being positive about bringing in change rather than trying to point fingers at individuals who will just deny and make it your word against theirs. Do you have colleagues you trust who are experiencing similar issues who would also join in in favour of training to prevent cliques and bullying? I'm sure you are thinking of looking for other work, and though that may be wise, it makes sense, given your years of service, to first see if you can be a leader in guiding your organization towards a healthier work environment.


helplease 5 years ago

Thank you for the excellent response. You are absolutely correct - the inmates ARE running the asylum. these coworkers have said so many things to me I'm afraid any interaction with them will be turned around and just lead to a written warning or worse! there was another girl who worked there for just a few months and these animals were relentless and she went back to her old dept. My dept mgr values false perceptions over what was really said. I'm trying to find something else where I can do my work in an environment that is not so hostile. It is hard to find another job right now, but I'm looking. I did call a local attorney thru a free consult referral number, he wasn't very understanding & said he could write a comment letter for my verbal warning form for $500. I just wrote my own. I will try the Undercover Attorney you mentioned, but I Hope I can get something else! Thanks again!!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

You are welcome. Good luck!


betrayedrn 5 years ago

Hi,

I am a nurse and was called into a meeting today with the Director and Asst Director of Nursing to find out that a CNA who was directly working under me had not only lied, but convinced the other two CNA's on the floor to lie as well and put it in writing.

The scenario is this....She was not happy with the schedule, which was made up by another RN prior to me arriving to work. I had no say, nor did I comment on the schedule. However, she was so bitter that day that she would not communicate with me at all. I heard her constant complaining, as did my other two RN coworkers. I also heard one of the CNA's comment to the fact they were going to put this issue in writing and turn it into the Director. I suggested that we write down our stories as well and turn them in. I was FLOORED to find out that she said things that were so UNTRUE and go the other two to lie as well. She states that the other nurses I work with are afraid of me and that is why the schedule was made that way. This lead to the Director saying I was a bully! I was totally hurt by this, especially since I work with the same nurses and we are all friends. No one bullies anyone! She, in fact, is the bully, as somehow she got these other workers to lie as well. The director said that having three people say the same thing doesn't look good for me and that she is forwarding it to the HR director and mentioned violence in the workplace! I stated that I had two people that would side with me, which she challenged by saying "of course they would, because they are scared of you!" ,even after speaking with my coworkers, who assured her I am not a bully! So now, I have to continue to work with her because the director says she refuses to change her work assignment. I am just afraid she is going to continue this behavior, and I have no way to disprove anything further that she claims. I am now depressed, cannot sleep, and am scared to go to work, as I worked hard for my nursing license and I enjoy where I work and everyone else I work with. Please, can you give me any advice that helps me to stand my ground and save my job and my sanity???? Thanks:)


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

Hello Betrayedrn,

What strikes me about this situation is that there is no mention of specific bullying behaviour. In other words, you have been accused of being a bully, but exactly how? Changing or enforcing a work schedule does not constitute bullying behaviour. Saying that people are afraid of you without identifying why is not evidence of bullying either.

I would meet with the Director and the HR Director and point this out. I would tell them that I was horrified by the accusation as I am not a bully. I would ask whomever was making the accusation to specify specific bullying behaviours that I had committed. I would tell them the story you just told me which might explain how three people colluded to come up with the bullying story. I would, of course, be open to the possibility that there is something I do that does lead to people being afraid of me and take steps to address that. I would let both Directors know of my willingness to do so. I would document these meetings and everything that happened in case it came down to a case of wrongful dismissal. If people are able to come up with a list, complete with real examples, of your bullying behaviour, you need to change. If they are not able, then it should become clear that the charges are false and made up out of spite. Feel free to share our correspondence with the Directors to show them that you were serious enough about this topic that you asked for help in dealing with it.

I hope this helps. Good luck.

Theo


betrayedrn 5 years ago

Thank you for your response. I did ask who said I was bullying them, and she refused to give me names and could give me no examples neither. I have been contemplating contacting the HR director, as I am fearful that if I work with this person again, there will be more false accusations made since the initial ones were so well received by the director. Thanks again, and I will keep you posted.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

You are welcome. The fact that she could provide you with no examples should be documented.

Good luck.

Theo


doloresumbridge 5 years ago

I work with a manager (same level as me) who is the production manager. He constantly undermines me in front of other colleagues, he stirs trouble for other colleagues (general comments about how they're 'doing his head in') and generally lies about anything he talks about. Sounds like an exageration I know!

He is not performing well in his job but to make sure the business doesn't suffer my other colleagues cover for him and arrange everything that he should be sorting out.

my boss obviously doesn't realise as everything is running as it should. A comment was made to my boss some time ago with his response being do your own job, let him do his and if he's not doing it it'll be obvious. However none of us will let the business suffer as a result of his general apathy.

He is keen to work hard on special projects but not so keen to get stuck into the nitty gritty of every day manufacturing.

To top this off he has defrauded the company (my boss is aware of this and has confronted him and this incident has been dealt with)in the past and i suspect this is still going on (to a certain degree).

Any advice would really be appreciated. It's causing a lot of resentment in the office (and the shopfloor) and it's unfair that one person is letting the rest of us down so badly.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 5 years ago Author

I think you need to let your boss know that you will be following his advice. Tell him you and your colleagues will leave it to him to ask you for the details and reasons leading to your decision.

As for this fellow manager undermining you in front of other people, I think you need to very clearly and directly in the moment and in front of these witnesses let him know that what he is doing is inappropriate and that you will not be accepting his behaviour. Do this every time and document what happens. This way you can back up your story should it come to your boss's attention. Your colleagues should do the same.

Theo


dmayer 4 years ago

I work with a hygienist who has always, what I'll call "double talks." Over the holiday our office has been working with skeleton crews. She came in 12/28 asking if she's scheduled to work and proceeds to say the doctor told her before levaing on vacation he was not coming back and there is no money left. Well, at that time I could barely hold back my laughter at the absurdity of her comment! As she stood there I dialed up the doctor's cell phone and left a v/m with the "news" I just received. Last night, after work hours, the doctor asked me to stay there while he spoke to the hygienist to relieve her of her position with the practice. I was dumbstruck as she began pointing at me saying I yelled at her and she denied and turned everything as though I was the one that made the ludicrous comment!...

I was dumbfounded and hoping to find some resolve out in the virtual world. Help!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Well, is she still at the office, or was the firing a real one?

What is important here is that you do not react to her in any way. Don't get defensive and don't emote. Stay calm and simply repeat the truth. Leave it to the doctor to decide who is more credible. If she is still there and she continues to make up stories, simply go to the relevant person in that story and ask them if what you've heard is true. Ultimately you can't stop her from either lying or denying, and you can't convince anyone to believe you. In fact the more convincing you do, the less believable you appear. Simply state the truth calmly and matter of factly, and then let it go leaving it to the world to either believe you or not. Do not get caught up in her drama. Be truthful, calm, and live with yourself well.

Hope that helps.

Theo


dmayer 4 years ago

Thank you for your comments. They make sense and I will follow your counseling. In the mean time, as of last night the firing was not a real one. Time will tell what the doctor will do.

Again, thank you!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

You are very welcome.

I hope things turn out well for you.

Theo


Rich Rivera 4 years ago

Hi, I am amazed at all the stories. I actually thought that i was the only one dealing with this situation. I can go on and on about all the problems I have dealt with for the past two years out of my 8 years in my organization. Taking credit for work that the person never worked on , stealing ideas that he did not think of , and the best is barking orders because he knows he's found out. All i have to say is that it took me some time to shed light of the situation by working carefully and watching my every move . I informed many people of the situation and i would beat him to the punch before I would tell him about my success stories. He would run to the hire ups to fill them inn with what he had accomplished and they finally realized that everything he was doing was not of his own. I will not let him take me down . It is stressful having to work with eyes behind my back but to tell you the truth there are worst things i can be going through. I am a believer and i had a great support group behind me. This still continues but I am not letting it beat me. Expose it Expose it Expose it is my medicine for the disease.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Brilliant! Thanks, Rich.

Theo


alison 4 years ago

I work in a hospital for 12 years now, i work in a constant hostile department,i supervise, My problem is staff cannot not be spoken to or carnt be bothered to do their work. My boss pulls me on everything down to doing overtime which i dont do that often. But other members of staff whom do 50/60 overtime in a month are never pulled in. I am a strong person that does stick to the rules as i know that if i didn't i would be pulled in the office about. I have been off work for alot of weeks as i was set up with some rotas and my friend lied saying that i asked her to change a rota . Then i find evidence suggesting that my boss had put i was not happy with rota changes.I am being taken to a disciplinary for acting inappropriately as we had words. The statements make out i am some kind of terrible person with the lies. My manager wants me to be sacked and denies anything that she has said to you. She has accused me in the past of coming in drunk and was going to suspend me but never as she said i was so good at my job. I am so upset with the statements that i have read i dont know weather to give up and resign. In the past she did nothing about my shoes/clothes/money/a4 piece of paper with magazine cuttings on get a job somewhere else you bitch/ sympathy card pushed through my letterbox/ personal file going missing/dog poo at my back door. Nothing has happened or did about that.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Every once in a while I will receive a letter reminding me that the people who write me with complaints may not be entirely blameless themselves. This is one of them. You may not like to read what follows, but I feel obliged to share this with you. Take it any way you like.

You may indeed be encountering injustice at work, but the abrupt manner with which you addressed me and the rather incoherent message that you provided tells me that you may be responsible for generating hostility towards you. You are a supervisor. You are in charge of directing people. There is NO way that you should be presenting yourself in this manner. If you do so with me, I wonder how you are with the staff whom you supervise. In this case, I'm sorry to say, I advise you to look very closely inward for the causes of your distress. I can see how your staff would have difficulty with you if you communicate with them in any way similar to how you communicated to me. Frankly, I felt hostile reading your message, and I don't even know you, let alone have to work with you.

I know this is likely not the sympathetic and supportive reply you wanted or expected to hear, but I do hope you will find it helpful.

Theo


Naeem H 4 years ago

Hello i am i the process of being sacked a a number of co workers have lied to get me sacked. it all started when i put a grievence against a supervisor due to the fact the way she speaks to me and the way she shouts. Even her partner who is the assistance manager has lied.

Been suspended for that last 3 weeks and have got 5 points of gross misconduct.

1) refusing to shake a staff members hand

2) faling to comply to a reasonable task

3) Saying that i am refusing to speak and ignoring supervisor (form of bullying)

4) Letter in my wording was inappropraite ( in which have stated was wrong) No swearing or abuse, just stated supervisor is lying.

Dont know whaat to do anymore ??


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hello Naeem,

Trying to reading your letter led me to understand how the wording in your letter of grievance (if that is what you meant) may indeed have been inappropriate. Your letter to me is very unclear, let alone full of spelling errors. For example, I'm not sure if you are saying that the four reasons given for the misconduct did not happen or if you are saying they are insufficient reasons for a finding of misconduct. To me, if you actually engaged in those behaviours, a finding of misconduct would not be unreasonable.

If I were you I would read the last letter I wrote in this forum and then go to your supervisor and tell her/him that you wish to take responsibility for your part in this situation. I'm not saying that your supervisor is necessarily blameless, but perhaps if you showed leadership in taking accountability for your actions, he/she would as well. I am suggesting this assuming that you would like to try to save your job. Start with you, and perhaps others will follow.

All the best,

Theo


amResearch 4 years ago

Hello,

Thank you for this forum, I have been desperate to find ways to deal with a very difficult co-worker. From everything I have read he seems to be a pathological and manipulative liar. He continuously lies about his past, education background and expertise to people both inside and outside of the organization including the media. The lies appear to be getting larger and they recently began attacking my reputation. It is a chronic behavior and I am not the only target. One minute he will engage in disingenuous banter and as soon as the person leaves the attacks begin. The new lies appear to be meant to cut out my contributions in order to inflate his girlfriend. Interviews with the media claiming to have done work previously published by others within the organization are the most recent examples. In the past week he has tried to insert himself into duties and responsibilities that have been assigned to me in order to control the situation. He has asked to meet with me multiple times via email but has yet to come and speak with me. Instead, he has assigned his subordinate to do the job assigned to me in parallel. This kind of thing has happened before has created confusion on important aspects of a big project.

It is comforting to know that virtually everyone in the organization knows that this individual and his girlfriend misrepresent and lie for their own gain while accomplishing little. However, management has done little to control the situation even after numerous meetings with HR. He claims he is misunderstood and trying, then reverts back to the same behavior. Employees with similar issues have recently left the organization because of these individuals. . I have been applied for other jobs because I feel like there are no options left. Are there any steps I can take rather than just leaving the situation?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hello,

I am assuming that you have documented this person's lies and misrepresentations, and that you have presented them to management. And since everyone knows about him you had no problem gaining corroboration. Apparently management still feels he has some value - more value to keep than to lose. Maybe management needs to review that position and you can help them do it.

Make a business case about how his behaviour is impacting the organization. Meet with your manager and talk about this issue, not from a personal, emotional perspective, but from a "big picture" point of view. Talk about the value of the people who have left and the cost of replacing them, and how they have brought their talent elsewhere, perhaps to competitors. Talk about how your organization's credibility and reputation will continue to suffer as the lies continue and are inevitably uncovered. Talk about decreased morale and the impact of that on productivity. Talk about the legal costs should people file lawsuits if they feel their reputation and good name has slandered by his lies. Talk about the cost to the organization of people going on stress leaves because of his impact on them in poisoning the work place. You could also direct management to this resource to educate them: http://www.snakesinsuits.com/

I do think it is wise of you in the meantime to look for other work in case this does not go well. Hopefully if you are valued management will do what it takes to keep you and to protect your organization from him before he does further damage. Be careful, though, as the person you describe usually has managed to weasel his way to the top pretending successfully to be someone he is not.

I hope this helps and I wish you well.

Theo


Sandee 4 years ago

I have the same problem at work. My manager is very manipulative, liying and narcistic person. As reading every comments here, "document", document" and ect. If I document everything, then what? Higher manager, Human Resources, District Controller, or any higher person.....they all sided with the snake manager. Then what should I do?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Sandee,

Good question. The sad truth is that the good "guy" doesn't always win.

You document for a few reasons, firstly for your own protection. Sure, you might be able to show with your documentation that you are telling the truth and the liar is lying, and in an ideal world, management then removes the liar. However, that does not always happen and in that situation you document in case the lying snake sours management on you and you are let go unfairly. Then you can sue for wrongful dismissal and you can refer to specific incidents that occurred as well as your attempts to resolve them. It would look bad for your organization if they were to let you go after you tried to resolve conflict and brought issues to their attention.

Your organization may make allowances for bad behaviour, but that doesn't mean they can get away with not protecting you from harassment and a toxic work environment. Documenting and consulting with an employment lawyer is a good approach to take, hopefully before things come to a head between you, the snake, and the organization.

Documentation is also very helpful to bring to your doctor in case you need to take sick leave due to the snake. Incidently, sometimes higher management and Human Resources really only pay attention when people are forced to go off work as that represents a major cost to the organization. It doesn't look good for the snake if s/he has herim's reports going of on sick leave because they can't deal with herim. Consider the value of your health over the importance of your job. If you go on sick leave, only come back under a specific "return to work" transition plan that includes management dealing with the snake manipulation issues.

Document, educate yourself about your workplace rights, and consider your health. If no one at work seems to be inclined to protect you, consider leaving for another job (easier said than done, I know) but don't allow yourself to be bullied. There are laws and you have rights. In the mean while, stay true to your values, don't get pulled down to snake level, and do your job as best you can unless you feel your job is making you sick. If that's the case, consider sick leave BEFORE you get physically ill.

Hope that helps.

Theo


Sandee 4 years ago

Thanks Theo!! I will show your comments to my co worker friends. I just wish I can help them more and wondering if theres a lawyer who will take the case. As for me....I already have a case and have my lawyers. My case is that they discriminated against my handicap, denied promotion, denied raise, denied for another job, I did a lot of work and got no credit for it, trained people, did special projects that no one has the skills, coerced, promised me bonus.....its a long list. As of me and my co worker friends....its not easy finding another job in Illinois. Theo, I wish I could ask you a lot more questions to help my friends because they are also suffering and its not fair for them.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

You are welcome.

One of my Hub "Followers" goes by the name of Undercover Lawyer. Connect with him. He might be able to help your friends. And, they can always ask me whatever questions they have.

All the best.

Theo


Melissa 4 years ago

Ive worked in sales for 15 years at this store. 6 years ago a women was hired who has been stealing my clients and taking my comision. Ive gone to managers, owners and no one will help me. One manager confided in me and told me the owner wont do anything as long as she brings in good numbers and makes them money.I and other employees have tried for years to just have something done. This women lies, manipulates and bullys anyone in her path or me when I stand up to her. Again, nothing changes.I truly love my job, my co- workers and manager. I feel such anxiety and stress that I can't sleep and I'm having panic attacks. I'm now on med's to help. Please help me get through to the GM and the owners and just once have them listen to me, us and make her stop. I think their afraid of her themselves but again, love the money she brings them...


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Melissa,

Well, it sounds like you've hit on the crux of the matter: the powers that be figure that the money she brings in outweighs the trouble she causes. You may have to come to terms with the reality that they believe she has more value than you do.

Read the responses I made just previously regarding self care, sick leave, and proper documentation. Ask yourself if you have done everything you can to let the owners know how much this is impacting you and the organization. Have you and your coworkers shown a united front about this to management? Is there a conflict resolution program or workplace health and safety policy dealing with bullying to fall back on?

If the owners really do value her that much then it might be best for you to take your sales skills elsewhere if possible. Find out what legal protection you have from being bullyed (contact a hub follower of mine, "Undercover Lawyer" for employment law advice). She does not have the right to bully you from a job that you love, regardless of your organization's policies or lack thereof.

Hope this helps.

Theo


Drew 4 years ago

I went through hell at work last yr with a crazy coworker. He spread lies to any one who would listen. Told everyone that I am racist and much more. Thank god he retired or so I thought. Now that he has retired he found some one at work to continue where he left off. It is sad that this guy has retired and still has found a way to continue harassing me. He has even turned people against me who I thought where good friends. These guys are masters at bullying and there is no point in arguing with them as they just reload and twist any thing I say.The problem isn't even me . They are actually after my coworkers who I am friends with If they are mad at some one you are not permitted to be friends with them and If you are you end up where I am today.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Thanks Drew,

Sadly a familiar story. I hope you and your coworkers will rally around each other to protect against this poison.

Theo


Portland ShoeGirl profile image

Portland ShoeGirl 4 years ago

Help! Can a liar change?

I've been snowed by an employee for over five years. I would catch her lying over stupid things to cover her slacking, lack of skills, or mistakes. She has never said I'm sorry about a thing. She lies over things no adult lies about so it took me a long time to catch on. By the time I realize she was untruthful I can't go back and bring it up... it would create more issues than solutions. She is upbeat, and good with clients... but the lies are making me really crazy. It is like dealing with a 15 yr old, not a woman in her 40's. HELP.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

My first response was, "Fire her!". But I imagine it comes down to whether you feel she has value and whether she is worth the effort it would take to rehabilitate her. It does seem to make sense to document instances from now on and bring them to her attention when they occur. If you do so over a period of time she may find it difficult to deny her issues. She may be suffering from a personality disorder and she may require professional help. Showing her that she has a problem may be what she needs in order to take that step. If, on the other hand, she continues to be a problem and doesn't acknowledge her issues, you need to let her go. If that's your choice, at least you'll have documentation showing that you brought issues to her attention so she can't claim wrongful dismissal.

Be very careful, though, about how much time you invest in one troublesome employee. You might spend so much time and energy on her that you neglect the positive employees who may end up feeling that their efforts aren't recognized. And it is true that one bad apple can spoil the whole barrel. Someone like her can have a devastating impact on organizational morale.

Deal with her directly, firmly, and clearly. Make it very clear what the negative behaviour is, what is expected of her to change, and what are the consequences for not doing so. Make a nonnegotiable timeline as this energy draining and destracting situation cannot continue.

Can liars change? Read my Hub, "Can people change?" and let me know what you think.

I hope this helps.

Theo


Portland ShoeGirl profile image

Portland ShoeGirl 4 years ago

Dear Theo,

I've struggled with this issue for several years. Each time I'd try to call her on her deceptions she would become very aggressive. I need to make a plan, with a timeline to nip this in the bud or fire her. My only concern is how she bad mouthed her last employer, tells me that she will do the same to us. I feel legal advice might be in order, perhaps have a severance package with a non-disclosure document (to prevent her from calling clients to undermine us) is in order. Having that in hand will shift the power back to me.

I'll let you know people can change, or if I need to change people.

Thanks,

PDX ShoeGirl


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

That sounds like a wise plan. I have a Hub follower (Undercover Lawyer) who might be able to offer some legal guidance as well.

Good luck!

Theo


SamySWamy 4 years ago

Hey theo my boss is ki

nd of new and gives me verbal report to improve my team work.well I hardly see her may be twice a

month. Hi and how are you as she walks by. I have Asked her to give me spicifics What I need to improve about my team work but she sAys,your team doesn't percieve you as team player.only perception and you called your assistant away from duty when you could have done it yourself. I love my job and have no problems with people I work with Except 2 charge nurses that can't stand my confidence And not stooping down to their ignorance and hatred because I don't suck up on them. Thanks for your time. This cheap and false accusations are stressing me at work and At home.when I explain my position my manager said I should take ownership for my coworkers perception and stop arguing. I am frustrated


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi,

Honestly, I can't really understand much of what you have written. I don't know if part of your coworker and manager's issues with you have to do with difficulties with communication, organization, and general sloppiness, but I suspect it's possible.

This is a professional forum. If you take as little time to think and review how you present and conduct yourself at work as you have done here, your manager may indeed have a point when she tells you to take ownership.

Take a good long hard look at what and how you have written. Review your spelling, grammar, sentence structure, and apparently random use of capital letters. Then take a good hard look within and think about what you may be doing to contribute to your problems at work.

I'm sorry this wasn't what you hoped to hear, but I suspect it's something you needed to.

Take care,

Theo


Samy 4 years ago

Hi theo. I am writing you from my I phone. This the 1st time I have used it to do this. Plus, it was late in the morning and was so upset and confused. I didn't get much of sleep the last couple of nights because unfairness at my work. Thanks for the constructive criticism, may be I needed to hear that from stranger rather people I work with. Some of them have say something at my presence and another with my boss. I appreciate you taking the time let me venge out and to revisit with in my self. I have been strong enough to deal with issues before and so capable of doing it again. ThAnks Theo


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

You are welcome.

Good luck.

Theo


Jim 4 years ago

I have a boss that continues to harrass me and make false accusations just to get under my skin. Tomorrow, we have our normal management meeting with HR. My boss has already been question by his boss on integrity and moral issues at work. I have a good working relationship with my boss, but the mental harassment is unbearable.

Friday night (I work night shift and my boss was off), he called me and said he had recevied several phone calls from Team Members that I was going around saying announcing the termination of a recent Team member (which is False, I didn't know he had been terminated until my boss called me).

Should I take this opportunity tomorrow in the meeting with HR and the big bosses to make a statement and say what happened and ask my boss to provide the names of the team members who called him so we can take "corrective action" for them spreading false and malicious rumors (which is a major violaton of our company policy) and we could call them in while we have everyone together. See, I don't believe anyone called and he will be forced to either produce the names and when/if he does not, this will confirm and prove to our KEY management how my boss has been intimidating and mentally harassing/bullying me. It's a gamble, but I know I didn't do this.....and the people in the room already know my boss's integrity is suspect, this will just drive the point on home. This will harm my relationship with my boss. Please help me? Should I take this risk?

Thanks!


Perceptive101 4 years ago

I realize that it is my boss who is a liar. I am trying not to confront it directly because what the article says about speaking with them about it alone is spot on. Each time I have tried I just became more vulnerable. I am trying to make a safe exit. This article and comments is helpful.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Jim,

Thanks for writing.

I think whether you talk about this issue at the management meeting depends on a number of factors. First of all, do you want to repair your relationship with your boss? I found it confusing to hear that while you say your boss harasses you unbearably, you also say you have a good working relationship with him. If you wish to repair your relationship, I'd advise you not to bring the topic up in the meeting, but advise him that you were thinking of doing so and would do so at the next meeting if he did not resolve his issues with you. If you bring it up without prior conversation at the meeting, he will very likely feel ambused and your relationship could be damaged beyond repair.

Second, it depends on whether you wish to stay at the company. If so, do you believe that your future would be enhanced if you brought this issue up at the meeting? In other words, would your boss's bosses respect you for what you did? Would they believe and support you? If so, what would you expect to happen with you and your current boss? Would he still remain your boss, and if so, what would it be like working with him?

Here's what I suggest: Your company likely has an anti bullying/harassment policy. If so, familiarize yourself with it and follow its protocol. If your company doesn't have a policy, ask HR what the procedure is for you to follow, then follow it. It likely would involve you telling your boss that you feel harassed, what the harassment is, and that it needs to stop. You also would tell him what the next step would be if he didn't. You document this latest issue and tell him that this is an example of harassment. If he responds positively then the problem is solved. If not, move to next steps which likely involves HR and or your boss's superiors.

I get the importance of the truth and the desire to openly tell it and expose your boss in this meeting. But if you don't go through steps with him prior to doing so, you might come across as an undermining insubordinate ambusher who can't be trusted, even if they think what your boss did was wrong.

However, if the topic comes up in the meeting, I think it would be completely appropriate to say that you were told by your boss that people told him that you announced the termination and that you are disturbed by this falsehood and would like to understand how such a rumour started. But be calm and responsive about this rather than initiate it as an attack which makes you look like you have a personal vendetta against your boss. In other word, don't start the proceedings with a statement, but if the topic comes up, then you can respond with your concerns and ask for help resolving them.

Does that help?

Theo


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Perceptive,

Thanks for the note and for reading.

Good luck.

Theo


geekgirl00 4 years ago

Great article!

I have worked for 6 years with 2 other master manipulators who are liars and they are abusive. They both are dishonest about everything taking credit for the work they never did or they just don't do the work. If I could not attend a meeting the one witch would say "oh tell me your ideas so I can tell everyone at the meeting"

They also tried to say I was falsifying time sheets, abusive to others and that I was stealing.

The other witch who is senile would pass medications and make mistakes and blame me for them and since she used to work as an RN and they believed her until she got caught and realized she could not do that anymore.

My boss at the time bought into it hook, line and sinker

I now have a new boss but recently a client complained that one of the witches threatened her well being (yes she did do that) and then she said to me oh don't you remember that you said this to her in from of me and the other witch as I sure the dementia witch would go along with it because she can hardly remember her name or how to drive. I told her she was full of crap and I never said that, she backed down I told my new boss who realizes what kind of games the witches play. The senile witch has attempted to ruin my new boss several times unsuccessfully. I could have lost everything I have worked for my job, license and everything. I do not talk to them except about basic things. My boss does her best but I fear these witches. Their behavior in this field is unethical and wrong. what can I do to protect myself?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Thank you, Geek.

The part about the client complaining about being threatened by one of the witches is a bit unclear. Who said "oh don't you remember that you said this to her in from of me" and what relevance does this have?

If you hear from a client that she was threatened by someone from your organization you need to document this and in this case you need to pass that information on to your boss who can then choose to follow up on this or not. This is especially true if, as I surmise, you work in the health care industry.

It sounds like your boss is aware of the Witch issues which is a great thing. You need to tell your boss about the specific incident but then also have a conversation with her about your concern overall about losing everything ("job, license and everything").

If their behavior in this field is unethical, you can protect yourself by offically filing a complaint with your boss, in both written and verbal format (documentation, now and in the future, is CRITICAL). Frame your conversation with your boss as being about ethics and prevention of harm to your clients, yourself, your boss, and your organization to prevent it from seeming about not liking your co-workers. Keep it focused on ethics and refer to governing body standards, if any apply. Follow up with your boss about "next steps" that will be taken to protect everyone involved. And keep doing what you are doing in not giving the witches any ammunition to twist and use against you.

I hope that helps.

Theo


Db326 4 years ago

Theo, I work with a liar and in an attempt to prove its not a personal conflict I asked others who have come to me as a supervisor to document their own concerns about this person. He is now saying I am having others gang up on him. Any advice? I am now in fear of losing my job


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

I nee to clarify a few things before I answer.

Are you saying you are the supervisor of these other people and are they members of your team along with him?

Theo


Db326 4 years ago

Yes, that is correct. unfortunately my supervisor is not helpful. I have met with both mt supervisor and the "liar" over four times since october. We have had discussions about his lyong and in general, accountability. Now that other employees are coming forward, he is feeling "mobbed"


Marilyn 4 years ago

Hi Mr. Selles,

Thank you for your enlightening website. I have just had my first rude awakening with a compulsive liar. Unfortunately, she is my granddaughter who is living with my husband and me while she finishes a college degree. I have observed her in several little lies, all delivered for the purpose of avoiding responsibility for something. For example, when she first moved in and started her junior year, she actually asked one of her classmates to provide her with a copy of the test she was to take the next day! The classmate told the instructor, and granddaughter was called in, informed that she would have to take a zero on the test, and if she was ever caught trying to cheat again, she would be expelled. She INSISTED that the junior college she had just graduated from allowed cheating! "The teachers all knew that we were cheating and they even didn't try to stop it. It was understood that everyone could cheat." Hubby called her on this, but she never backed down. A few days ago, she gave me a silly story to get out of being responsible for some big dirty spots on the towels in her bathroom. I laughed at the story, but believed her. A few days later, she called me on the carpet for laughing at her! "Grandma, I don't like to be laughed at," said repeatedly and very pointedly. Today I figured out exactly what had happened, and had proof of it, so I confronted her, explaining that the towels had washed up as good as new, so it had been unnecessary for her to make up the silly story. Woops! Wrong thing to say! She INSISTED that she had not lied. Hubby had told me this would happen, but I want her to know that a job or a relationship can both be destroyed by lying.

This girl's father, our son-in-law, is the most dishonest person I have ever met, and everyone knows it, including our granddaughter. He will go to his dying day absolutley refusing to admit that he has EVER lied, and he lies even when he doesn't have to. Our granddaughter was poster child for ADHD as a child, and is still a risk taker, talks 100 miles per hour, and is a know-it-all, just like her dad. Is it possible that people are born to lie? And they just can't help it? And there is nothing anyone can do to help them?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Db326

Well, that is his perogative. He can feel whatever he wants. And it's not surprising that his reaction would be defensive, especially if he tends not to be accountable.

I can see how you would be worried about losing your job if you hadn't taken the step to meet with your supervisor and the liar. If you hadn't had those meetings than it could be seen as you ganging up on the liar. But, you followed good protocol, and it makes perfect sense for others to be invited to substantiate what you have said privately to your supervisor. You are giving your supervisor more information that s/he needs to actually act on the information you have previously provided. It is important that your supervisor is made to understand that it is not just you because that shows it is NOT personal but rather organizational. It is actually your responsibility that the liar be revealed for what he is, and that other employees have the opportunity to be heard as their morale and performance would have been affected by the liar as well.

If your supervisor has an issue with you inviting other employees to come forward, tell her/him that it is not personal on your part, but purely professional. You are merely doing what it best for the organization and giving the liar an opportunity to hear the impact he has on others and either come clean or understand that he isn't a good fit.

I hope that helps.

Theo


Db326 4 years ago

Thank you so much


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Marilyn,

I am very familiar with this kind of story. I teach college/university students and am continously taken aback by what seems to be a growing aversion to taking accountability while at the same time feeling entitled to any possible privilege. These same students are always ready to attack when there is even a hint of wrong doing on the part of others. It's tiring and disturbing to the extreme. They do little work for themselves, indulge themselves in anything they can get their selfish greedy little hands on, offer nothing to others, expect everything from others, and seem to have a distorted way of looking at the world. Honesty and accountability are values that appear as foreign to them as decency and hard work.

I do not believe that your granddaughter was born to lie. She learned how to do it, and she has been allowed to get away with it. Can she help it? At this point it's probably so deeply ingrained in her personality that it's become a habit, or perhaps more accurately, an addiction that she may not even be aware of having. She's learned to take the easy route and she has likely never developed empathy for others.

How to help her and you? You need to train her. Get her out of your house if she continues this behaviour. Make it very clear to her that the next lie she tells you is her ticket out of your home. These people can only possibly change when they are forced to be accountable and when their lies hurt them. They aren't motivated by realizing that their lies hurt others as they typically don't care and only see others as objects to manipulate anyway. Do yourself a favour, don't get caught up in her sociopathy. Be firm, clear, and then enforce the consequence. That will protect you, your marriage, and your health, and it may be the wake-up call she needs.

Good luck!

Theo


Alex Campbell 4 years ago

I JUST NEED HELP!!!

Here is my story.......

seven years ago I began serving in a restaurant/bar after 1 month after busting my hump and proving myself and basically being at the right place right time sort of thing I became General Manager. The co-worker I am refrencing too was hire about a month before I was hire and was the bartender then later on was a manager with me. She managed under me for about 3 years with no problems. However about 3 and 1/2 years into my tenure as GM I was not able to resolve issues within my restaurant due to no support from the ownershiper (in example I was not granted funds for repairs etc.) So I stepped down and began bartending when new management came in they treated me poorly so I quit. The co worker in question was fired about month after I quit for "over pouring" behind the bar. Time went on when the owner of this restaurant opened a new location I was offered GM and took it. About a year in the owner decided to rehire the co worker due too the lack of evidence in which she was fired. Now she has been working for me under a year and in the past 2 months loads of issues have arisen. Main issue my assistant (co worker in question) has been accused of physical abuse towards an employee that works under us. This was about a week ago and since then four other employees have stepped forward claiming the same thing. At first I knew that a claim had been made and apparently one of the employees that was a witness and that was questioned about one of the incidents leaked to my assistant that this was going on. She immediatley called me and asked me if it was true now based that we have been working together in total for about five years I felt TERRIBLE that I did not tell her the truth but however I was told that I could not say anything until the investiagation was concluded. I knew that at one point she would find out i knew but i would deal with it then. The whole time this investigation took place she accused me of knowing and not telling her etc. Once she was finally spoken too she was not even told I knew of the investigation she began slandering my name to employees she could trust not only this she also made up lies saying that I party with some of my staff thats why I dont discipline them when they do something wrong (mind you she said I drink with staff members that are not even 21!!!) Now after the owner told me she said these things I immediatley called her because I was confused as to why she would say these things. Knowing that I knew it was her I asked her and she LIED!!!. At this point there are several other issues that have arisen as in 1600$ cash missing etc. I am at the point that I am just going to quit I once thought I could trust this person and now I know WHOLE HEARTIDLY that I cannot. I know with my talents I could go elsewhere and atleast bartend or serve I am just so lost because I feel she is going to say anything to make herself look better even if it means throwing me under the bus with this money missing that I know I did not take. I mean the owner and I have such a solid business relationship that in the past if I ever needed support financially All I needed to do was ask. I just cant tolerate dishonest people and I am already an over anxious person I just feel that I am going to keel over with a stroke because not only is my reputation on the line but my career and I just dont know what I would do if all this experience was too be lost over a two face co worker that I thought was my friend. Sorry for rambling on but I honestly have not slept more than 2 hours a night since this all began I am just so lost.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Phew! I can tell how upset you are.

Here's what you need to do: Take a deep breath and then think about how much you want to stay in your job. Forget her for a moment. Do you enjoy your job? Do you want to keep it? Would you prefer to stay rather than work somewhere else? If the answers are "yes", than you need to fight for your job and deal with this situation.

You deal with it by setting up a meeting with the owner that you have a good relationship with and putting everything out on the table. Go over what you wrote to me, but write it out first in a detailed (and spell checked) time-line format. Outline to the owner your concerns, how they are affecting you, and ask what the owner can do to help resolve this matter with you. You did, after all, comply with proper procedure when you didn't confide in your assistant while the investigation was happening. Tell the owner you have a plan to deal with this (you need to act like a General Manager, and not seem helpless and ineffective) but you want to run it by him/her first and get his/her support.

You need to know that you have the full support of the owner in dealing with your assistant. Tell him/her that you plan to meet with your assistant and give her the choice of ending her lying or being let go. You have to let the owner know about the missing $1600 and what you plan to do to investigate. Should it be found that your assistant is responsible, she should be let go.

Don't let your anxiety allow people to bully and intimidate you. Fight for your rights and what belongs to you. Your reputation is something that belongs to you, and you take it where ever you go. Avoidance by running away to another position is NOT the way to go.

Good luck!

Theo


Rachel 4 years ago

I have a coworker that never shows up on time, takes extra days off, talks poorly about others to the boss, and gets away with this and a whole lot more. He recently made a statement to myself and others including the owner of the company that he had been recording conversations in the office and said he has hours of employees talking badly about him. I personally don't see how this can be legal, but wanted to find out. I hope he really did do this because each time he has ever been talked about it was because he did or was doing something wrong and many of us had no way to prove it.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Sounds like bluffing to me. I find it astounding that the owner puts up with this nonsense.

Good luck!

Theo


gaurav 4 years ago

I work for a school and my coworkers are talking behind my back. I know exactly who started the rumor, and was caught red handed and she now knows that I know everything about it. She said it indirectly in a conversation that I don't have any proof the prove it. She uses students to compare with me and uses their name to talk about me in the staff-room. she tries to be nice in front of everyone and torches me with made up stories that are related to me in a normal conversation. I don't have any proof to prove it. Even the supervisor who is very close to her also believes her.I don't like to take it to the principal as I am not comfortable discussing the topic with him. I am thinking of writing a note to the staff to not to believe as its not true and to stop the rumor. I am wondering will this affect my job. I don't want to quit the job. What else can I do. Please help me.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

I appreciate you writing but unfortunately I can't really make out from your note what the issue is. The best I can tell is that you believe that someone is spreading a false rumour about you. The rest of what you are trying to tell me is incoherent.

If this is how you typically write than DO NOT write a note to staff, at least without having someone read it first. If you like, take some time, write down your thoughts more carefully and clearly, have someone review it, and then try again with me. Make sure you include your job position as well as your rumour-spreading coworker's position.

I know you're upset, but you have to make sure you represent your perspective clearly and professionally in order to be taken seriously by anyone, including me, the supervisor, and the principal.


gaurav 4 years ago

Thanks for the reply. Here is the note that I want to hand it to the staff.

It’s better to be public than someone talking behind my back.

A person is spreading a RUMOR about me that I like to stare at everyone’s boobs. Sorry guys if this has created problem. I wonder how pathetic are they to come up with ideas like this to play with someone’s life.

Please do not share this rumor with anyone!!! Instead spread the rumor that rumors are not healthy, it hurts!! When they mess with one of us they will mess with all of us!!!

I have to take this action to challenge the veracity. It’s my rights and also my responsibility to protect myself. You all know that rumors spreads like wildfire… before proving it who, it’s better to stop, before it damages everything, my self-image, physical health, and mental health and many more. As you all are educators I don’t have to explain it more. Mainly this can affect my performance at work. I care about my job and want to do well. Our life is sacred to us, for everyone! So let's respect the life of others and hope they would return the favor.

Here I am letting you with a beautiful quote.

“I was smiling yesterday, I am smiling today and I will smile tomorrow, simply because life is too short to cry for anything.”

Thank you for taking the time to read this note.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

It's not for me to edit this, but it does need work.

Either way, though, I advise strongly to NOT address this issue with a general note. If that is the specific rumour, I would make an appointment with the principal and talk to him/her about the rumour and how it is affecting your reputation. Talk about the issue being a matter of character defamation and slander and a form of harassment. Ask for the principal to intervene. Rumours such as these can destroy a career and you want to address this seriously and professionally, not with a note.

All the best,

Theo


Lynn 4 years ago

I work in a kitchen my co worker has been there a yr b4 me and always worked in the same are for these yrs. I can work in any area because I like learning new things ... We lost 2 people ( found better paying jobs) so I run around and try to pick up the slack to be a team player ... My boss loves that I'm a hard working and always willing to help anyway that I can ;) anyhow my co worker who I became friends with inside and out of work is very upset that she got moved to another part of the kitchen ( so she can try new things) for a week ... I got put in her spot and this so called friend went to my boss claiming the boss does whatever I want and then tells her I hate working with a few people in which she lied and said I said things I would never say :( she is in her 40's and the first day wouldn't speak to me even with simple work related question the second day she told me " thanks for ruining a good effing thing" I asked her to not speak to me ( didn't want to have an argument with her any further) I'm upset that she lied and also hurt that I thought she was my friend and she right away blames me .... I had no part of my boss making this 1 week change .... Help please


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

You do two things:

1) Go to your friend and ask her for a moment of her time. Calmly tell her that you realize that she is upset and that you understand why. Tell her that if you thought SHE had gone behind your back to your boss to change work arrangements you would be upset as well. Then tell her that you think there's been a misunderstanding and that you did not go to your boss and that it was completely your boss's idea that you were moved into her spot. Tell her that you are upset that she didn't come to you first, and that you hope she will do so in the future if there is an issue. Ask her if she has any questions or anything else she needs to say. She may need to take some time to think about it, she may defensively argue out of shame and embarrassment, or she may apologize. If she apologizes tell her you would like her to go to your boss to retract her statements. Let her know you will be speaking with your boss to clarify matters as well. No matter what she does next, you will have taken the high road and acted out of integrity.

2) Go to your boss. Explain the situation and let your boss know you have spoken with your friend about this. Talking to your friend before speaking with your boss will show your boss that you take initiative and are responsible. Ask your boss if she could let your friend know that it wasn't your decision to switch work areas. Also ask your boss if she believes anything of what your friend told her about you and if there is anything she would like cleared up.

I hope this helped.

Take care.

Theo


Lynn 4 years ago

Thanks Theo !!!

I will try to talk with her. The craziest thing happened today..she tried to talk to me like nothing has been going on even trying to crack jokes.... I

Just did my work and moved a long with a smile


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

You are welcome.

Theo


sue 4 years ago

i have been suspended from workfor something i have not done i am not allowed contact so i am prevented from getting my own evidence allegations have been made before by the same group and each time the allagations get worse i have had a meeting today and yet again its a untrue allegation made up and its one of gross misconduct breaching confidentiality i dont think they are going to rest untili am out of there


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Cehck out Undercover Lawyer on HubPages and send him a note. He's one of my "followers".


Priya7 4 years ago from Pune

I am a project trainee. One of my co-worker who is always jealous of me, lied to my project guide that i speak rubbish about my guide behind her back. Then my guide phoned me and was very angry on me. She is always rude to me and this lie of my co-worker made her behavior more disgusting against me. M depressed,,,,,, plz help me how to deal with these kind of liar and rude people?? i have to tolerate them for 2 months only for my project training period.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Since you only have to deal with them for two months, you need to suck it up and bear it for a little while. Think of it as a lesson in how NOT to treat people.

In the mean time, go to your project guide and tell her you are determined to prove to her that you are not the kind of person who "talks rubbish". Tell her that you are focused on your work and you are dedicated to learning everything she is teaching you and ask her for a review of your efforts after the two months are over.

As for your co-worker, let her know you spoke to your project guide and invite her to work things out with you in person if any issues arise.

Good luck.

Theo


Priya 4 years ago

Thanks for your suggestion Theo !!

Now i have to be focused on my work and think positive


Barend 4 years ago

Good day,

I am also in a situation, were i am going to a disciplinary hearing.

The one handyman that works under me is the big lair, and he got sour grapes, because he was working for the hotel for 2 years at the time, the maintenance manager post went open and was open for about 6 months.

Then I applied for the vacancy, I got the job and then all the drama started.

He is telling so much lies to the RDM, and if I do discipline him he runs to the RDM and the GM, turns the stories around so much that I get into

trouble and the sad part off it all is that they believe him.

I dont know what to do about him, but i got some fire power for them in that hearing.


Alexis 4 years ago

hey. there is a girl that always lies not just at work. And she likes to make herself look good. but she does everything she can to make me look like the biggest liar ever. So she turns my friends against me and they cant trust me anymore. i want to set her up so i can prove shes the liar but u got anything?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Alexis,

Sorry, I don't play games. The worst thing you can do in this situation is to stoop down to a liar's level. "Setting her up" sounds too much like dishonesty and trickery to me and that doesn't meet the criteria for staying true to principles of integrity.

Theo


julie 4 years ago

My workplace recently took on another supervisor,who may i add i recommended.However since we took her on we have split the workload and areas, when she has had any contact with my areas she demoralises my workers and has referred to them as minion. I since have found out she slacks and lies,she seems to get better treatment than i do and i have comfronted my manager who agreed with me. Nothing was done and i called for a meeting with the managers and the directors, firstly i wanted to take 3 weeks off and the other supervisor had taken 4 weeks of in one go previously, i was told i was not allowed the time i refused to not take it as my managers already knew so it was allowed. she gets time off and it is made difficult for me to take days owed to me, it is very constructive how they do things, how can i prove this?? the other supervisors work is shoddy and it has led to us having to do extra work and i am expected to do this as part of the audit outcome, the manager who agreed with me in the meeting said she thought she dint but then changed her mind in front of the directors. do you have any advice as i am a good hard working person who prides herself on supporting staff and telling the truth?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hello Julie,

Thank you for reading and writing.

There are a few things I want to say, some of which you may not like to read.

First of all, I understand that you feel you are dealing with another manager who receives preferential treatment even though you believe her work is shoddy and she demoralizes your workers. If this is true, you have every right to draw this to your manager's attention and ask for help. Your workers also have a right to have a harassment free work environment. They can document their issues, submit them to you, and you can pass them on to your manager and ask for support.

HOWEVER, from the way you wrote your letter I wonder if you are merging your professional concerns with your personal ones. Your professional ones about the organization and how employees are treated appear to be merging with resentment about how the other supervisor "seems to get better treatment" than you. You called a meeting with managers and directors to address organizational issues but then it seemed to be all about whether you could get the time off you wanted. That would appear to other people as you being about you, rather than you being about the organization and your concerns overall. You calling that meeting about the issues you described concerns me. That sort of meeting would be called as a last resort, and the focus of it should not be about you and your time off.

Be careful about how you present yourself. I had a difficult time reading your letter due to issues with spelling, grammar and, at times, flat-out in-coherency. What is wrong for them being "constructive"? You "comfronted" your manager? You write about other supervisor's work being "shoddy", but your letter to me could be described that way. We all need to be careful about projecting our issues on to others. This may be one of those "take the log out of your own eye before taking the sliver out of someone else's eye" situations where you need to look long and hard at yourself; your work and your workplace relationships.

You may indeed have legitimate concerns, but in this case you may need to address your own shortcomings in order to be taken seriously by the other managers and directors. Otherwise you run the risk of coming across whiny and jealous as well as shortsighted about the quality of your own work.

I hope this helps.

Theo


hiker1000 4 years ago

Hello,

I have an excellent reputation as a middle manager. Recently, our department reorganized and many staff called me with complaints. Trying to address this head-on, I went to a trusted senior manager to share that key staff were unhappy and see if we could work to remedy that. I emphasized that I was speaking in utmost confidence, but made the grave mistake of mentioning a name (keep in mind, this senior staff person was a ten-year, highly trusted colleague.)

I was shocked the next day to find that she had shared our confidential conversation (including names!) with a large number of people, one of whom was the individual whose name I had mentioned. Needless to say, everyone she talked with denied any unhappiness at all, and the result is that now I look to my peers like a betrayer, and to the rest of senior management like a discontented manager who is falsely spreading negativity. Not at all the case.

I approached my colleague who said she had not understood our conversation to be confidential - impossible to believe given that I had emphasized that so much. I have since approached the workplace with a very positive attitude, but serious damage has been done to my working relationships. I apologized to the one person I named, and she has been understanding but the trust is destroyed.

How do I handle this? My colleague clearly betrayed a confidence knowing full well what she was doing. I'm shocked as she is usually highly professional. I'm taking the 'water under the bridge' attitude, and won't discuss anything with her confidentially again, but is there anything else I should be doing? Thanks for your adivce!


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

I think you're right to take on a "water under the bridge" attitude as long as it's understood by both you and your colleague what went wrong. Like you, I can't imagine that she couldn't have known what she was doing, and like you, I'd have a difficult time trusting her again (see my hub on rebuilding trust).

I think it would be a good idea to have a meeting with the other senior managers and your colleague to clear the air and to avoid any misconception of you being a negative discontented manager. Frame the meeting as being about clarifying possible misconceptions and learning from this as to what kinds of conversations require confidentiality.

As for people denying that they are unhappy, the truth about that is bound to surface and you may end up looking like you at least tried to make a difference. If the topic comes up, remind people that that was your motivation. As time goes on your excellent work habits and managing style will win out.

I hope this helped. Good luck. And really, good for you for trying to make your work environment a better place for peeople.

Theo


Mike O. 4 years ago

Hi, Theo.

Boy, this is a great article. Took me too long to find it, what with all the other google results saying the same (obvious) things.

I work with a liar, sort of a mix of compulsive and manipulative. I have heard him claim completely outrageous things (like running over 300 techs from our field in a previous job - more than the whole company we currently work for, and we're floor-level employees!), I know he has pencil-whipped evaluations (we're Aerospace Quality inspectors), and he seems to just answer questions with the first thing that pops into his head, whether it makes any logical sense or not.

The problem is, he's very good at quick-talking people into believing him, and he's got all of the management and lead folks bamboozled into thinking he's right (they don't know how to do our job, they just manage scheduling and whatnot). I've tried going up my chain of command, I've tried confronting him directly (just leads to a pissing match), and I've even talked to HR. Because of alll his quick-talk, I'm being looked at as a rable-rouser who can't play nice with his peers. I feel like a dog being scolded for barking at a rat. I'm actually considering a career move now, because I can't stand to work in a department that continues to employ such garbage.

I'm sorry if I seem a little crazy, here. This situation has been driving me nuts for months. What can I do?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hi Mike,

Great well-written clear letter! Thank you.

This is the typical manipulative liar described in the classic book, "Snakes in Suits." I'd buy that book if I were you.

You've done all the external things you can. You've talked with him and you've given your organization the chance to strengthen by revealing this weakness to them. They've chosen to ignore you and now you risk looking like a problem because of this problem.

Once you get to the point where it's clear that you can't make an external change it's time to focus on internal change. You need to be asking yourself just how much of your energy and time does this liar warrant. I gather that you are already going down this road by considering a career move, but be careful that you don't let him have too much of an influence on your life. Move if you want to, but don't let him make the choice, especially if overall you like your job and you worked hard to earn your position.

From what you described, the guy seems really insecure and he makes stuff up, but you haven't described him as being malicious. Maybe let him be with his over-inflated self-fantasies and let other people decide whether or not to believe him. Do your job, let your personal integrity shine, and leave him to expose himself for who he is which inevitably happens to people who depend on lies to keep their egos intact.

Now, if his lies directly interfere with your work or he slanders you, you need to deal with him and management directly. If nothing is done, then for sure, looking for another place to work (while keeping your legal options open regarding workplace harassment policies) is a good idea.

Hope this helps. And thanks for reading.

Good luck!

Theo


Diana 4 years ago

I am working on a joint project with another person and he's turning out to be a bully and a liar. He tries to dodge the bullet on real issues by pointing fingers at people and at one time kept harassing me (via email) because he started pointing fingers at a person and it turns out that he was never invited to a meeting. Then he started saying that I told him that he was invited but he didn't show. It was just finger pointing at everyone but himself for his lack of preparation. He also tried gang up on me with his group of people by forwarding the email and trying to get their agreement. It got to such a ridiculous stage that I talked to my manager.

My manager stated that I be the bigger person and build personal relationships with him first (and another one of his group who is the same way.) My manager likes them fine, and was asking me to be empathetic with them because there might be other issues that they're dealing with. He didn't know for sure, but he said he has never seen him act that way.

I tried talking to them couple of times before, but they seem to be on the same page while we talk but the next day, it just goes back to square zero. They're just who they are, completely forgets what we discussed and starts back up again on blaming games.

I am just at a stage where I have to decide whether I need to leave the company where such behavior is protected. They bully people who don't agree with their point of view and just keep on lying and dodge the real issues.

I've heard couple of coworkers who stated they have never been in such an environment. So I think it maybe a cultural issue as well.

If at least my manager had the character and strength to stand up to such behavior, I'd be okay. But even my manager is hazy on such issues, so even though I have no job lined up, I am so tempted to just quit.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

First of all, document that you did what your manager asked and report back to him. Then ask for further direction. Also ask what the manager might do, now that you have done what was asked of you.

As for quitting, it's always easier to find a job while you still have one. Quitting impulsively or out of anger is an action often regretted.

Theo


annabram 4 years ago

i had lost my job due to my coworker , a lier who fabricated a story against me with the help of my boss. I and almost all staffs are believes he is a lier . In this circumstances how could I prove my innocency.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

I hope that the lies don't have anything to do with proper grammar, spelling, and professional presentation.

You gave me very little information, but if your boss was involved in fabrication with your co-worker, your chances of proving your innocence are slim. You would need documented proof, and even then, your boss clearly would not be interested.

This may be a workplace harassment matter and for that I recommend one of my "followers," Undercover Lawyer. Check in with him, but please be more careful about how you present yourself or you will not be taken seriously.

Theo


Mark 4 years ago

Is there any response I can get from medical resources that as advice for me to explain how I should handle my stepson who is a continious liar, trouble maker for me and my wife and will never admit to his wrong doing that he creates and will never correct his say so in the community .


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

I'm not sure if medical resources are what are required, unless you're considering lobotomy.

And clearly, too little information provided for me to respond to other than to say that he may be lying because he gets rewarded for it. Remove the rewards, enforce logical consequences, and he will likely stop lying to you.

Theo


Racheyroo 4 years ago

Hi Theo,

I hope your well, I'm after a little advice about a situation I have found myself in. I am currently working for a charity as a volunteer, it is an early intervention charity and we need to have a high level of trust between all members of the charity clients and staff. I was previously involved with them as a client due to being depressed and a single mum of twins. I have since over come my depression and I am in the process of being trained as a family support worker. With the out look to being employed with them as an official trainee by Christmas (funding dependent)

The problem I have is that I have become aware of a coworker (volunteer) who has been lying about a client (who is also a friend of mine) This coworker told me that she had lent a client money which she will not repay and also told me that the client has caused trouble for a policeman and the policeman was suspended. I have recently discovered that this is not the case and the policeman was put on disciplinary for looking at someones file without there being a police investigation. Nothing to do with the lady at all. I have spoken to her about this and she is obviously upset and wants me to speak to my seniors about it. I have also been told that this coworker had told a different client that we had fallen out (news to me) she said to this lady that myself and my partner had split up because he was messaging her and asking her to coffee, I was obviously furious about this and confronted my partner they had indeed sent messages to each other but it was nothing along the lines of this just about a bag she has left in his car when we gave her a lift home one evening.

I really don't know the best thing to do here. I have told my friend/client that I don't want to cause any trouble at work because I value my job so much however she has said if I don't say anything to my seniors then she will. I'm very worried about the whole shoot the messenger syndrome and I really don't know what to do for the best. I have been worried about this for a few days now any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Kind Regards


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

Hello Racheyroo,

Thanks for the note.

This one is easy. You need to go to the volunteer coordinator of the charity, explain the situation to her/him, and follow that person's lead.

I've worked for a charity and I believe this: The charity's mandate is to be there for its members/clients. Anyone who disrupts that process, who is creating problems for the clients, needs to be held accountable. Nothing should get in the way of the charity and the people it is providing services to. You've been both a client and a volunteer, and so you know this to be true.

Explain the situation to your volunteer coordinator. He/she needs to know. Step back and let herim do herim's thing.

Good luck!

Theo


Portland Shoegirl 4 years ago

About 8 months ago I wrote in about an employee that lied over unimportant stuff that no adult lies about. She also lied and fabricated stories about things that were intended to manipulate and control me, her boss. I let her go, and she immediately started spreading stories about the company fiscal health. It hurt the business. I wish I'd never let this person get so close to my customers. Month's passed, and recently we found drugs in her desk - hidden away. Everything from downers to uppers, and ADD meds that are not hers. It explains the forgetfulness, the lack of focus one day & increased energy the next. At the end of the day, I've learned to fire people fast is better than working with them. You can't change crazy. Your first sentence was - fire her. You were right, and so was everyone that told me that exact thing for years.

Crazy employees, make crazy bosses.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 4 years ago Author

It's good being right.

Thanks for the feedback. Let's hope your business detoxifies and that she gets the help she needs.

Theo


Daimes 3 years ago

Hi Theo,

Thank you for your post. Makes me think of the current situation I am in.

I work for a small company. I've been harassed both on a professional and personal level by co-workers who I trusted. I brought it up to management, with supporting documentation. They claim that they have "fixed" the problem however, later they started promoting those same co-workers I filed a complaint against. Mangement keeps telling me that I'm doing a great job, I'm strong in my work, etc etc however, I see no progress. Instead, I see my work declining. They smile and seriously treat me like I am "important" to the company and making me think I am given more responsibilities when in reality, it feels more like a set-up and that I am just being taken for being a fool.

Would you have any advice? I put much thought into this and I see no other option than to move on to a healthier company.

Daimes


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

Hi Daimes,

Thanks for the letter.

First of all, there is nothing wrong with your plan to look for a healthier company WHILE you continue to work for this one. It's always easier to find employment while being employed.

In the mean time, I would ask management to set some very clear targets for you to achieve in order for them to give you what you think you need in order for you to "see progress." (You don't mention if this means a raise or a promotion.) Be clear with them what you would consider progress and ask them to be clear with you about what would be required for you to attain that progress. The targets should be measurable and behavioural.

Once you've been given those targets, ask how progress on your part towards the attainment of those targets will be measured. Then call them on it once the targets have been attained. This will make it more difficult for them to simply blow you off with meaningless platitudes and make it easier for you to achieve your desired progress (while keeping your eyes open for other opportunities).

Good luck!

Theo


Alfiebear profile image

Alfiebear 3 years ago

Hi Theo,

Thank you for your post. A lot of these instances that people are posting about reminds me of a situation that I am dealing with at the moment.

It pretty much started about 6 months ago (July 2012) when a co-worker started to slack off in her work. My other colleagues an myself had noticed that she had shown signs of being stressed and we tried to support her by picking up the slack. In August this woman (Val) approached me and said that she needed to talk to me regarding something that was going on in her life and she was having trouble dealing with it. Her problem was that she had recently split up with her husband. This woman was from overseas and had only come to this country in April 2012, so she was away from her family and friends and didn't have the support network close to her during this time. I sympathized with her and told her we would support her as much as we could during this difficult time. Which we all did.

However, as time went on, (Val) continued to slack off and generally came across as not taking care or pride in her work. And my colleagues and myself were left once again to pick up the slack. This went on for a number of months ( up until November 2012). At that stage both my colleagues and I were getting very frustrated with her tardiness but we tried to point out mistakes/errors by making it a refresher for everybody and asking that everybody take care with certain projects as there were mistakes being made. We did this so as to not single (Val) out, as she came across as a very sensitive person and did not take criticism well.

This did not work and the tardiness continued and then things came to the point that Val would ask me to help her with a task at the end of the day, and then conveniently disappear and get ready to go home and leave me to finish the job. She did this a couple of times, which I took as trying to "milk her situation" for her own convenience.

Eventually, my colleagues were complaining about the mess Val was constantly leaving behind, so I went and talked to her about it. I explained to her that I understood that she has been having problems, but it has come to the stage that she wasn't pulling her weight at work. I also explained that it wasn't anything personal but we needed her to try and apply herself to her work as she was making mistakes. She seemed to take it quite well and agreed to make a bigger effort.

To clarify, I am not a supervisor or anything, I am just the most senior member of staff in this department of our workplace.

A couple of weeks later another co-worker (Helen) came up to me and told me that (Val) had approached her and said that I had talked to her, and said that she wasn't pulling her weight and then Val said" I dont know whats she's talking about though, because she said you were lazy a few weeks ago to me". Luckily, I have a good working relationship with Helen and she had no problem coming up to me and asking me directly if I had said that. Which I hadn't. Both Helen and myself felt that she was just trying to "Stir the pot" out of insecurity and decided to let it go.

In the following couple of months, this Val started acting very paranoid and would eavesdrop on conversations I was having with other co-workers, and would stand in the doorway of my work area and stare at me. I found this very un-nerving and overbearing, but I decided to try and ignore it.

Just before Christmas, I ended up working through my lunchbreak, so I went into our lunch room and asked the staff in there if one of them could please do me a favour and pop out to pick me up some lunch as I was working through lunch hour and I wouldn't be able to get out to get something to eat. I left money on the table and I then rushed back to my work.

As soon as I left the room Val said "who the hell does she think she is", I'm not getting her lunch, she can get her own lunch". One of my other colleagues (Carol) was quite disgusted at her attitude, and later told me about her rant. Thankfully, Carol helped me by getting some lunch for me.

I felt that this was unnecessary behaviour and made me feel like Val cant not be relied upon. Since then, Val has become very friendly with my boss. Before this drama, I had a very good working relationship with my boss, and I now feel that it is strained.

Now, Val has recently been acting excruciatingly "Nice" to me in front of my Boss and other senior staff and then ignoring me once they are not there. Which presents to me as being "Fake". Which it is.

I have been trying to deal with this situation by focusing on my work, as this is what I am there to do, and I have not said anything to my Boss or colleagues as I feel this will make me looking like a troublemaker or a whiner and in turn this will dis-credit me in thier eyes. Which I am now convinced is what Val is trying to do.

I am also trying to keep and good relationship with my boss and colleagues, but it is difficult as Val is constantly imposing herself into any interaction I have with the others, which makes it difficult to maintain good relations.

I do not to engage in any interaction with this woman, unless it is strictly work related. And now she is going out of her way to persistently follow me around and put on a huge show of niceness and then lies to everybody by telling them, that she has been nothing but nice to me.... and she cant understand why I dont like her.

As you can probably tell, my workplace is predominantly female, hence all the triangulation and gossiping....but I am now aggressively staying away from this type of behaviour as I feel whatever I say will be used against me.

Please help! I love my job, but this is slowly killing my enthusiasm for my work. I know a lot of this will sound paranoid, but I'm following my gut instinct here.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

Hi Alfie (Bear),

Thanks for the letter.

I can tell that this situation has caused you a great deal of turmoil. Not only that but now you find yourself in a situation where your reputation at work and your relationship with your boss could be undermined-all out of your well intended efforts to help. If you don't do something soon, your anxiety may continue to escalate and not only could your job be threatened, but your mental and physical health could erode.

Let's back up a bit to how this started and got way off track in the first place. Sometimes the solution can be found in the history of the mistake. Here's what should have happened: If Val had concerns about personal issues affecting her work performance, she should have first gone to her manager, NOT, her colleagues to discuss the issue. Then her manager could have gone to the rest of the team (with her permission) to explain why you all might need to pitch in a little extra for a while until she resolved her issues and got back on her feet. Her manager could also have directed her to any EAP support services that your company might provide. When she went to you instead, she ended up entangling you in her life without any record of this on file to explain any subsequent work disruption.

When she came to you the appropriate response would have been to advise her to speak to her manager. Instead, you took on her issues and made them your own. Now you need to backtrack and divest yourself of those issues and attempt to bring the manager in as should have happened in the first place. You and your team need to talk with your boss together to explain what happened, acknowledge that you (well intentionally) overstepped and ask her/him to deal with the situation as she/he would have if it had been handled appropriately in the first place. You will then back away from the situation and let your boss do his/her job.

Unfortunately there is no way of ensuring that it will now be handled appropriately, but this is out of your hands (as it should have been in the first place). This is a management issue that coworkers should not have taken on. It now needs to be given to management to deal with.

Does that help and make sense?

Theo


Alfiebear profile image

Alfiebear 3 years ago

Hey Theo,

yes it absolutely makes sense. I am in the process of drawing up an e-mail documenting these events, so that I can remain calm and talk to my boss about what has happened. And ask for his guidance in trying to find a resolution to this problem. In which hopefully he will take over from here. I do agree this needs to be addressed now. It will only get worse if left as it is. However, It could be difficult for me to get my co-workers to agree with having a meeting with my boss to discuss this issue, as they will not want to get involved. Do you think it would be appropriate for me to e-mail him with my concerns and then ask for a meeting to discuss and resolve these issues?

Thank you so so much for your input.... it does help immensely.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

I think it's best to document the events, print them off, and then give them to your boss in the meeting, if he wants to see them. Don't blind side him with this sort of email. Ask for a meeting, let him know it's about an issue you're struggling with and that you need his guidance, and then take the documentation with you to back up your story after you talk with him about it.

Feel free to show him our correspondence if you think it'll be helpful.

I hope things work out. Take care.

Theo


Eileen 3 years ago

I work in a place where we share space but its 2 separate companies. I work for one company and this other person i have an issue with works for the other company. This other person we will call Cheryl is a pathological lier - she is a bully and loves drama. Since she has forced many decent employees out of her company with her lies, I am now her target. The worst part of all, her boss believes all her lies and blames me for the drama. Her boss went to my boss complaining. Of course my boss has known me for 11 years and explained that there has no be even 30 seconds of drama in all those years; her boss in unconvinced, he blames me for the drama and now ignores me. How do I deal w/ this bullying and harassment since we have to work almost side by side with each other, should I ignore her which I have no problem doing or would that create more lies that she will tell or do I have to be cordial/ which is very difficult since I am trying very hard not to despise her? I need advise desparately.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

You didn't explain what "the drama" was that her boss complained about. In the absence of that, I think you should ask your boss for direction and then follow that direction very carefully documenting as you go. Let your boss know about her history. It seems as if your boss doesn't want to lose you so s/he could be a good ally in this situation. Explain that you don't want to be like the other people Cheryl forced out and ask for what you can do to prevent that from happening.


EvanF 3 years ago

Hi Theo

I am having a problem with my landlord and I can't figure out what to do about him. He says one thing and then 2 days later, he absolutely denies he ever said it. He tells me that he likes having me in the house and then hours later, he is freaking out and screaming at me that I left a plate on the counter. We live in the same house (his) and I rent two rooms on the second floor (1 office/livingroom and 1 bedroom) and we share the kitchen and bathroom. He told me that I can have 1/2 of the space in the kitchen but he didn't move anything for me. When I asked him about it, he got instantly angry and claimed he never said anything like that. He eats my food that I leave in the fridge and claims that I don't do enough around the house in general (ie. vacuuming etc.) I don't use the rest of the house though so I don't know why he would think I would be doing that anyway. If I ask him about his line of questioning, he is instantly on the offensive and I just can't talk to him because he is unreasonable in his thoughts. He is calm one minute then explosive the next for no reason. The rent is reasonable and I can't afford to move right now but I don't know how to handle this. It's like he's Jeckle and Hyde. He can be pleasant and charming to guests and when they are gone, he just loses it and starts yelling at me about the stupidest stuff and then the next day, claims he never yelled or screamed at me at all. Is this guy a pathological liar or a manipulative liar. I just can't figure him out. Any insight into this guy?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

He could be both, have a drug issue, be Manic Depressive, or even suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder. (Look that last one up and see if it fits.) In his saner moments, ask if you can write down what the agreement is between the two of you so that you can avoid the disagreements in the future about what was said.

Having said that, if he truly is unstable and has an untreated psychiatric disorder, I'd be looking for another place to live. In the mean time, don't forget to review the landlord tenant act to see what your rights are and remember that you are protected from violence and threats of violence from him by law (and police), even if you're his tenant.


Mrs Hadley 3 years ago

Hi

I'm in a dilemma. My bosses son works within my department, but someway down under me and I have had problems with him lately, not only lying but he seems to have an accident and hurt himself at every turn. The son twists the situations to make his bosses look like they aren't looking after him of bullying him. I have tried to speak to my boss about it, but he is stating that the colleagues are lying, when I know they are not.

I'm at a loss as to what to do other than to go to his boss. We are and have been documenting the situations.

Any advice would be appreciated.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 3 years ago Author

Hi Mrs Hadley,

This is a very difficult message to respond to because much of it is unclear. For instance, this sentence does not make any sense: "The son twists the situations to make his bosses look like they aren't looking after him of bullying him." As well, I can't tell whether your boss is stating that the colleagues are lying or if it's the person whom you are saying is a problem that is lying. And who is the boss's son? Which boss? Your boss? His boss? Same boss?

I'm glad you've been documenting. Be sure that if you go to a different boss to make a complaint after going to your boss that your boss won't see it as you going behind his/her back or over his/her head.

If you do go to the son's boss who is his mother/father, be sure to emphasize that you understand this is a very delicate situation and that you woudn't be approaching him/her if it wasn't so important. Talk about how awkward you feel about speaking about that person's son first. Then, and only if you receive an invitation to speak further, talk about what you have documented and be clear about what you would like to have happen.

Hope this helps.

Theo


chenill 2 years ago

i lost my job because the chef, hated me and the group lead always carry lies to him on me.i am trying to get my job back,but not with that group lead i have a meeting in the morning with human resources and the manager who let me go,i just want to tell my side and get my job back.thank you


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 2 years ago Author

Good luck.

Make sure you bring in a list of facts and stay as unemotional as you can. You want to appear as rational and competent as you can. Bring in documentation and stick calmly to the truth about you and your work.

Theo


Sylveus 21 months ago

1. A co-worker told you in confidence that another co-worker is habitually stealing. What would you do and why?


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 21 months ago Author

That's an interesting ethical dilemma question.

I think that as I had promised to keep confidence I would encourage the co-worker to allow both of us to talk with the stealing co-worker. I would feel obligated to keep that confidence as breaking it might cause as many problems as those caused by the thief.

Having said that, this scenario shows the importance of not promising to keep all and any confidences. If someone asks if they can tell you a secret, it's important to set limits on that confidentiality based on personal and organizational protection.


Sadness 21 months ago

Over the last 18 months I have seen my boss bully and harass a colleague, lie, skive, be rude, cause issues between departments and given me tasks only to promise review to job and grade, which when I asked him when was he going to do this, to be told we needed to complete the form. After delays of getting THIS FORM from him, when I asked him in an email to pass THE FORM to me to complete to avoid further delay (now 6 months later), he ignored me. I decided to get the FORM, complete and emailed it to him to process. He came into the office said nothing. I asked if he had received my email with THE FORM then he told me it was the wrong form, and that's not what we had discussed. I told him I felt that he had led me up the garden path and felt abused by him leading me on with false promises. He then went on about me recent sickness in compete ting the necessary absence forms for him, rather than discussing the cause of the stress - which is the way he has been treating me. It seems no matter what I say, his right and I'm wrong. He had a new line manager who takes his word on everything and sees me as a moaner. My colleague has had similar experience and raised this as a concern with others but nothing gets done. I work in NHS. Help me Please, he's broken me twice in 18 months.


Theo Selles profile image

Theo Selles 21 months ago Author

This is pretty hard to follow at times, but I'll try.

I hope you documented the abuse of your colleague. I hope that colleague documented it and will support your story of being abused. If he causes this many problems, others must be affected as well. Get the support of those. Document everything and present a united front so it's not just his word against yours. You did mention that your colleague raised this concern with others. Gather all of this information together and present it to your boss's boss. If he doesn't have one at least you will be able to protect yourself from being fired as you would all be able to pool resources and hire an employment lawyer and possibly file a harassment report with whatever legal or human rights organization deals with this where ever you live.

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