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Apprenticeship Program

  1. wjack2010 profile image60
    wjack2010posted 4 years ago

    What's the apprenticeship program like?

    I've just applied for it, and am now waiting for the approval process that apparently takes 4-6 weeks.

    1. paradigmsearch profile image91
      paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      You do know that there is a physical exam and background check...?

      1. wjack2010 profile image60
        wjack2010posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Actually no. tongue Sounds interesting.

        1. paradigmsearch profile image91
          paradigmsearchposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          big_smile

          With your 2 years seniority you have a shot.

          http://hubpages.com/search/include%3Ahe … %2Bprogram

          http://hubpages.com/search/apprenticeship+program

          Good luck! One of these years I'll work up the energy to apply. smile

      2. cperuzzi profile image94
        cperuzziposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It's the doctor with the rubber gloves and lubricant, who keeps asking me where my photo sources are, is the only real thing to be frightened of.

        1. ESPeck1919 profile image90
          ESPeck1919posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Too funny and maybe a little frightening!

      3. CrisSp profile image83
        CrisSpposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        @paradigmsearch:  "You do know that there is a physical exam and background check...?"

        Lol! You always makes me Lol!

    2. Knightmare Golem profile image96
      Knightmare Golemposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I just applied for the program myself.  Not sure if I'll get in or not, but seems like it would be interesting to go through.

    3. RichieMogwai profile image80
      RichieMogwaiposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I was approved about three weeks ago but was told there is a long waiting list,  so I think it will take a long time to even get started.

    4. 0
      summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It is well worth the ride. smile

      1. Steve West profile image84
        Steve Westposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Agreed. Hi summerberrie.

        1. 0
          summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yea! You're in! See at the finish line! smile

  2. ESPeck1919 profile image90
    ESPeck1919posted 4 years ago

    It's a lot of fun! The program really pushes you to get a decent amount written every month, and you learn a great deal about the different features hubpages offers, how to better identify and use keywords and meet all sorts of people. I've really enjoyed it so far. smile

    1. adjkp25 profile image92
      adjkp25posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      ESPeck1919 - Is right and the program taught me a ton on how writing online really works.  It wasn't easy and there are criteria that you have to meet during the 6 month program (like a min of 8 hubs a month) but I'm glad I did it.

      I know that writing online changes but I now feel I have a better chance at adapting to these changes.

  3. GoodLady profile image83
    GoodLadyposted 4 years ago

    As others have already explained, you learn how to be an online writer - but it is grueling work and you need to be meticulous about your learning.  At the end of the six months, when you look back at your progress, you realize just how much you have learned.  It is a very serious program.

  4. cperuzzi profile image94
    cperuzziposted 4 years ago

    I loved the Apprenticeship Program that Hubpages has.  It's a great FREE course on SEO strategy, how to make interesting hubs, how to use googleAds, how to use eBay space, and it's a great vehicle to being a content generator.

    Plus, it helps you get into the habit of writing regularly - maybe not every day, but definitely regularly.

    I recommend it highly.

  5. 0
    Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago

    You have to be a prime candidate however.  I was told I didn't write well enough to get into the program.  Uh, maybe I'd be one to benefit from it then, ya think?  Life goes on.

    1. wjack2010 profile image60
      wjack2010posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I probably won't fit in then, my English is probably above-average, but not "one of the best to stand out" as it goes.

      1. 0
        Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I would think that HubPages would want to help their authors to improve their writing skills.  Isn't that why they have the apprenticeship program to beging with?

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Sarra, check your email please.

    2. Kathleen Cochran profile image87
      Kathleen Cochranposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I think we should all stop kidding ourselves about the apprenticeship program.  It's about making money for HubPages.  The fact that promising online writers gain the benefit of honing their craft is a plus for HP and those who are accepted into the program.  Telling an applicant they don't write well enough to qualify is beside the point and reflects poorly on HP.

      1. wjack2010 profile image60
        wjack2010posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        You do have a good point there.

      2. IzzyM profile image85
        IzzyMposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        +1

        I think that is terrible that Hubpages actually told a writer that she didn't write well enough to go on the program.

        I also got a knock back, but they just fed me the "too many applicants, reapply in six months" line. I doubt if they could teach me much anyway. If they'd said it was because I didn't write well enough, I'd be off, with all my hubs too.

        Anyway, I won't be re-applying.

        I asked to join at a time when I knew I had six months to spare, knowing I wouldn't have in the future. I couldn't do it now even if I wanted to, which I don't.

        I still hate that the apprentices win the HOTD 9 times out of 10 and have an advantage when it comes to competitions.

        Blatant favoritism is not a nice trait on a content site like this.

        If someone is good enough to have their hubs featured here, they are good enough for the apprenticeship program, and whoever wrote that note to Sarra should hang their heads in shame.

        1. SimeyC profile image88
          SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Just based on November - it seems 16 of the last 27 were apprenctice hubs(60%). Quite a few of those were well established authors who already were good writers. Do you know how many active writers there are? and how many of them are APs? What is the proportion of active AP writers to active non-AP writers?


          Why do you say there is blatant favoritism in the competitions? Because they are taught how to write a hub? - All the info you are taught in the AP is freely available in the Learning Center.

          Are you saying that AP hubs that win competition awards are sub-standard and would not have won the competition if a non-AP writer had written them?

          (Just checked the latter part of October - 9 out of 17 were AP)

          1. IzzyM profile image85
            IzzyMposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So those of us who are not apprentices, cannot write an apprenticeship level hub?

            That is what you are saying?

            I am not surprised you wrote in support of the program, being an alum yourself.

            I learnt the hard way. I have many hubs that are not of the high standard HP now requires. That is how I learned - trial and error.

            It seems to be the mostly the same people who time and again win the competitions, and who get awarded HOTD.

            It's of no consequence to me. I no longer depend on HP for income, and the comp and HOTD winning hubs benefit from some internal boosting, nothing more.

            I write for the search engines. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't.

            The apprenticeship program is great for newbies. Yet here we have a relative newbie being told her writing is not up to standard??

            I also think it gives experienced hubbers like yourself a sense of superiority.

            I'm OK with that too, just so long as you don't act superior with me. Experienced hubbers deserve a little recognition.

            I am upset for Sarra, and anyone else HP have treated this way.

            That is a disgraceful way to treat a writer.

            1. SimeyC profile image88
              SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              See my answers in brackets:

              So those of us who are not apprentices, cannot write an apprenticeship level hub? (Where did I say that?)

              That is what you are saying? (no - I'm wondering if you took my statistics to mean that? I was just saying that the percentage of HOTD from AP seems to hover around 50%, not the 90% as you stated)

              I am not surprised you wrote in support of the program, being an alum yourself. (So if a group is attacked they cannot defend themselves?)

              I learnt the hard way. I have many hubs that are not of the high standard HP now requires. That is how I learned - trial and error. (I have deleted 100s of hubs that I have realized do not reach the standard – I probably have at least another 200 to delete)

              It seems to be the mostly the same people who time and again win the competitions, and who get awarded HOTD. (Maybe  - I really don’t take note)

              It's of no consequence to me. I no longer depend on HP for income, and the comp and HOTD winning hubs benefit from some internal boosting, nothing more. (I use the competitions to try and produce ‘stellar’ hubs – I don’t always get it right)

              I write for the search engines. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't.

              The apprenticeship program is great for newbies. Yet here we have a relative newbie being told her writing is not up to standard?? (I don’t think that is right – they should be encouraged – I agree with you).

              I also think it gives experienced hubbers like yourself a sense of superiority. (I know there are hundreds of better writers on here than myself – just because I am experienced doesn’t mean I am superior. I defend the AP because I feel it’s wrong to judge dozens (hundreds) of writers simply because you feel the scheme is unfair. Out of all the AP writers I know, I would say 95% of them are very humble and want to learn from the non-AP successes)

              I'm OK with that too, just so long as you don't act superior with me. Experienced hubbers deserve a little recognition. (I am not superior to you or anyone on here, or at least I don’t believe that I am – some of the new writers on here far surpass my writing skills)

              I am upset for Sarra, and anyone else HP have treated this way. (I agree)

              That is a disgraceful way to treat a writer. (I agree)

            2. wilderness profile image96
              wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              "So those of us who are not apprentices, cannot write an apprenticeship level hub?"

              That's not the point, true or not, Izzy.  The point is that few hubbers that have not gone through the program DO write apprentice style (style, not quality) hubs.  They can of course, they just don't.

              Add in, as Simey says, that there are ever more apprentices writing in a style that HP finds appropriate, and you begin to see exactly what you posted; that most HOTD hubs are coming from apprentices.  And before you jump down my throat none of my 4 entries won and I've not won a HOTD since last year, so perhaps I don't do so well either.

              I haven't addressed what happened to Sarra, and won't except to say that I'm really surprised by it and don't understand it at all.  Although her hubs are vastly different from what the AP teaches, they do not show poor writing skills.  At least IMO.

            3. Millionaire Tips profile image89
              Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Do you think that maybe part of the reason that we seem to be around so much is because we have minimum requirements of hubs to write?  Since we write more hubs, we are around more, so we wind up representing a greater percentage of hubs being written.

              Maybe part of it is also the fact that we are writing more WTI (which is one of the suggestions in our lesson plans.)  I have read that writing WTI gives you a higher chance of getting a HOTD.  Since it is staff who is deciding these things, you sit in front of them instead of hiding in the back hoping they will see you.

              Another part of it may have to do with the fact that staff has to read (at least some of) our hubs to give us feedback. Since there is only so much time in the day, there is a limit to how many articles they can read, so they would likely pick from the ones they have read.

              1. watergeek profile image93
                watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Very good points, Millionaire Tips. I'm just finishing up the program, write pretty well, and have received two HOTDs and one Rigorous Contest win . . . in six months. My hubs have improved since I started barely two years ago.

                Meanwhile, there are many non-Apprentices who get HOTDs and many who get the newbie prizes too (which I didn't get). I think it makes a big difference that you write a lot and write quality, informational hubs, rather than emotional rants (which I used to).

                1. Millionaire Tips profile image89
                  Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  That's true watergeek. Since our hubs have to meet the HubPages standards for the Apprentice Program, we are again more likely to meet them for the awards as well.  Simone keeps telling us that a reason lots of hubs get rejected for HOTD and other awards is that they aren't using images that the Hubber has a right to use that are properly attributed. Since that is the first thing they require from us, our hubs stand a greater chance of getting these HOTD and contest awards.

        2. 0
          Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Thank you. I'm trying to find it on my email trash so I can post it here.

        3. cperuzzi profile image94
          cperuzziposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I couldn't disagree more.

          I'm happy that hubpages could tell someone that their writing quality is not good.  Seriously, it's how you view your own work, too.

          I'd like to think that there is a quality check for this site.  And quality is a funny thing, you don't notice it when it's there but it's really noticable in its absence.  If there was someone who had terrible writing (like, I don't know, "doesn't use verbs") or had consistently bad spelling, I think it would reflect badly on all of us who are trying to take this seriously.

          When I decided to do this and join the apprenticeship, I was happy to have the opportunity to show off some really good articles.  I even contemplated using some of what I wrote as a portfolio.

          If a really bad writer came in and started to produce abysmal hubs, it devalues what the rest of us do.

          And if you think that's harsh, try reading some rejection letters from a reputable publisher.

          1. 0
            Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I'm not the best writer in the world and I'm not the worst either. I certainly invite you to critique my hubs.  An apprenticeship program is to help people become better writers not discourage them.

          2. Isabel Melville profile image87
            Isabel Melvilleposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            If you are talking about someone writing really badly, I'd agree.

            Sarra is a good writer - I checked out her hubs.

            Just because you got on the program does not mean you are a cut above, but maybe you think you are? I haven't looked at your work to see.

          3. WriteAngled profile image91
            WriteAngledposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Well now, if we judge writing quality by the style featured on the replies to this forum, I am afraid that your style falls very far below the minimum quality standard I would expect of any writer I would be prepared to hire.

          4. LauraVerderber profile image87
            LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I'd like to think there is a quality check going on with hubs too but sometimes I have doubts. I don't want to hurt the person who got featured today. In fact, I am happy for them but I casually read the article and noticed many grammatical errors. I did like the subject and the photographs she used. They were very charming. However, the information contained was pretty shallow and not very helpful. If there is a live person working for Hubpages that read and chose this article to be featured, shouldn't they have higher standards? I was frustrated by this choice and felt like I should write about fluff because that's what is popular apparently.

          5. Millionaire Tips profile image89
            Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            The Apprenticeship program was not designed to teach people how to write, only how to write online.  They teach things like formatting, SEO, legal use of images, etc.--  NOT grammar and spelling. I think it is a good idea to not accept candidates who cannot write correctly.  They don't have to be perfect - none of us are - but they do have to be acceptable.

            Please note that this comment is not about Sarra, who seems to write well based on the hub I read.  I agree with Cardisa that her issue may have more to do with writing frequency than writing quality.

      3. cloverleaffarm profile image79
        cloverleaffarmposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I have to agree with you on this. HubPages is here for HubPages. While the apprenticeship program is nice, it is going to benefit them.

    3. EmpressFelicity profile image82
      EmpressFelicityposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I've just read a couple of your hubs and your writing seems fine to me! I can't believe they said that to you. Makes me think that they're using other criteria to decide who becomes an apprentice, and are just hiding behind "writing not good enough" as a stock (and untrue) response.

      1. 0
        Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Thank you.  I know I have room for improvement which is why I wanted to get into the program.  Oh well, I'll keep writing and I can only get better.

        1. MizBejabbers profile image90
          MizBejabbersposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I am an editor and I train new editors. I just read one of your hubs to check your writing ability. It is a heck of a lot better than some of the stuff I edit. I think you would make great trainee and if you applied to me for a job, I would hire you.

    4. Cardisa profile image91
      Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      @Sarra, is there the possibility that you misunderstood the email you received? I really can't believe they told you that. I am not defending HP staff but that would be bad for the program and for the site. I am wondering if you not getting in has more to do with the frequency in which you publish rather than your writing abilities.

    5. Joseph041167 profile image59
      Joseph041167posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      @ Sarra- I enjoy reading your stuff, there are lots of good articles, nothing overtly wrong. I was not analyzing it very hard. There are writers on here, who are not very good at all. I am just glad they are trying, and encouraging the rest of us. And Sarra puts out a lot of articles too. She is a writer, for real. Me, it takes me sometimes months, many months, to put one out. The six I have in there now, I am still working on, tonight even, doing research. I work at a snails pace, and get distracted also, and I have to use library equipment. I wish I could be an article factory, and still do it right. Studying ancient Teleology in Ancient Greece tonight, gotta go. Holla!

      1. LauraVerderber profile image87
        LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I also write at a snail's pace and get distracted easily. I'm hoping that writing on Hubpages regularly will help increase my pace. Have you experienced anything like that?

        1. thejeffriestube profile image83
          thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Oh we all do. Don't worry about that, you'll get into the swing, but don't force it. By the way, my site now has a link to yours. Awesome pictures and captions!

          1. LauraVerderber profile image87
            LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh! Thank you very much. big_smile I'm really glad you like it. Man, you've just made my day, hehe.

    6. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image92
      Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Sarra - The criteria initially used for the Apprenticeship Program included writing skills (the program isn't designed to teach people to write in the style HP prefers), and some knowledge/use of the formatting tools on the site.  I can't speak for HP, but in looking at a few of your hubs, I noticed you often use just one text capsule, and some of your hubs are written in a first-person narrative style.

      Those of us who went through the program were asked to write only informative hubs, and to use a wide variety of the capsules available (maps, polls, quizzes, tables, etc.). When HP put out the word that people could apply for the program, I'm sure the staff was flooded with many good applicants, and it may be that the style of writing some Hubbers use is different from the 'informative' style the program encourages, which is a bit like the style seen in newspapers or non-fiction magazine pieces.

      To answer the OP's question, the program covers a number of things that can help you create good titles and improve your hubs, but it does not cover how to how to write in a certain style. You will learn how to properly cite photos, how to research keywords, ways to use various capsules on this site, how to use Google analytics and several other tools and skills related to SEO and to this site.

      During the six months of the program, you are required to publish at least eight hubs that meet the program's requirements. At first, eight hubs doesn't sound like a huge goal for one month, but six months can cover a lot of ground in your life, and there are times it's a challenge to meet that goal.

      Many experienced Hubbers here are already experts at SEO, so they know the things the program covers (and probably much more).  Many of us who haven't been around that long, however, did not come to the site with that knowledge.  The program is demanding, but worth the time and effort for those who already write in a somewhat journalistic style and who aren't fluent in SEO.

      1. 0
        Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        However, isn't the idea of HP to have informative and excellent hubs?  I do tend to write in first person, however, with some tutoring and mentoring wouldn't I become a better writer?  If I am that bad then why haven't they not published any of my hubs?  Just a thought.  I'll keep writing however, as the more you write the better you get.  HP is not going to step on me and I will prosper.

        1. SimeyC profile image88
          SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          One thing I've been thinking about overnight is the fact that while the AP is there to help some writers, you don't need it to be successful. If you are a good writer who creates very good hubs then you will get traffic from Google whether or not you are in the AP.

          The AP is there to help people create better hubs - and I feel it achieves that for most APers - but even if you don't get accepted into the AP (for whatever reason) - you can still continue to learn and improve.

          The AP is an internal thing that may gain a little traction internally - but aside from that and the perceived favoritism, the only way it helps get external traffic is by the fact that the writers are creating longer, more multimedia base hubs.

          This has always been the way we should write.

          It's sad that you and others were rejected as you were - the rejection note could have been far more constructive - but at the end of the day it's not a measure of your success - you will succeed anyway!

          My advice is to look at the top writers on HP and emulate what they do. How do they format their hubs? What modules do they use? How many pictures do they use? etc. Take every opportunity to learn from the best writers and you will improve. Note - the best writers on the site come from non-AP and AP - I ignore the 'a' and look at the quality.

          The other thing to do is Hub-Hop every day - not only can you influence the 'quality' of HP but you will also find some amazing hubs from all writers - again another great way to learn.

          1. 0
            Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            thank you SimeyC

          2. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I can only agree with you to a point here, Simey.  The best writer in the world isn't going to find much traffic writing about things people don't search for, and not much better if they don't write for google as well as the reader.  We may not like it, but it's a fact we have to live with. 

            That was another facet to the AP - choosing "searchable" titles and topics, and probably more valuable to those that didn't know how than any multimedia/capsule use we might come up with.

            Yes, length, multimedia, capsules, pictures, appearance, etc. are all important in the program, but title/topic choice takes, IMO, top honors.

            1. SimeyC profile image88
              SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              True - didn't want to go into the importance of SEO, as that's a opening up a totally different bag of chips!

              1. watergeek profile image93
                watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                But that's what the apprenticeship program is for. It's all about teaching writers to enhance their SEO. That's what I meant in one of my comments above, that I had to give up some topics of interest to me to focus on more SEO friendly topics. It was good in the end, 'cause I learned to choose more for mutual interest, but the whole program is about choosing titles, topics, and formats that are SEO friendly.

        2. Mark Ewbie profile image81
          Mark Ewbieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I love first person narrative.  It's me.. talking to you.. not some brain dead asshole off Wiki.  The faux dictionary style - scraping tedious facts from one place to another - does not appeal in the slightest.

          And anyway.

          How do you sell a toaster?

          This toaster is red and uses electricity.  It costs n pounds.

          Or...

          I love my toaster.  Now my wife has left me it's all I have as a reminder.

          OK.  I don't sell many toasters.

          1. SimeyC profile image88
            SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            big_smile Well it should be a combination of both, and also a more positive approach!

            This toaster is red and uses electricity.  It costs n pounds.
            My wife was going to leave me, but she loves my toaster so she stayed.

            big_smile

            1. Mark Ewbie profile image81
              Mark Ewbieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Thanks Simey,. and that's why you are the King.  Respect.

          2. mistyhorizon2003 profile image90
            mistyhorizon2003posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            ROFLMAO lol

            Seriously though, it wasn't that long ago that it was being recommended that we wrote in the 'first person' because it showed the writer was talking from experience and therefore made them appear a more trusted source of information. Apparently this theory has changed then!!!

  6. tandaa profile image79
    tandaaposted 4 years ago

    I'm also checking it out, from what I'm reading it has helped many people in their writing and SEO skills. My curiosity would be have they increased their earning after the 6 months from those hubs???

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It's only been one month since I finished the AP program, but I will respond as the earlier hubs are over 6 months old.

      My earnings have indeed increased far above what they were when I started (double or more), but not from the AP hubs. 

      More importantly, traffic has gone up since starting the program, and here I can tell what those hubs are doing.  I counted the other day out of curiosity, and found that the 49 hubs produced, as I recall, about 85 views that day.  Today the total is nearly  250 views, but 100 of those are coming from just one, seasonal, hub that will soon go to zero.

      One unanswered question is if Google has become impressed with a large influx of "quality" hubs.  Traffic is far up, as I say, but there is no way of knowing if those hubs are affecting googles rating of the older material.  Possible, I suppose, but impossible to tell.

      1. tandaa profile image79
        tandaaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Ha! interesting. So most of all is traffic. In the AP program do you learn 'how to improve traffic on ones hubs?"

    2. GoodLady profile image83
      GoodLadyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Lots going on here.  Thanks Simey and wilderness and Marcy G (AP people!)

      The AP is a lot of work; you learn how to be an online writer, an information writer, you earn your 'a' and if you get the HOTD it's because you've written a valid hub.
      I've been awarded two HOTD and they were both really good pieces which were well researched and very full of information.

      I'm not used to being chosen for things, or winning things in life, but getting onto the AP was an amazing break.  Those HOTDs were well earned! 
      I've written all my life and been published very often, had my plays staged, poems published etc. but I needed to know how to be more practical with writing. The AP seemed the way to go (it didn't cost anything to be on it either, not a cent).
      I'd hoped to make money, for money is hard  to come by if you are a writer, but I haven't increased my HP earnings much at all in 6 months, though I do hope one day that I will see some financial reward.
      My peers say 'keep on chuggin'.  I'd say that's good advice for everyone, if you want to get on board.

  7. SimeyC profile image88
    SimeyCposted 4 years ago

    The other point I should make IzzyM is that without the writers like you and the many other experienced writers who have been here through thick and thin, there would not be any Hubpages, let alone AP.

    The AP bascially codifies the learning center; the learning center is, IMHO, based on the feedback and advice that the experienced writers have been given everyone for years.

    While I disagree with the critisism of the AP, I can see how it can be viewed as unfair, even though i do not feel it is intended to be - I still have the utmost respect for those writers (too many to name) who have made HP the place it is today.

    I know I have learnt so much from them, and with the help of the AP I have moved closer to them - but I am under no illusions - I am not superior, in many ways I still have a lot more to learn.

    Most of us in the AP feel that way - we feel that the AP was a stepping stone that will help us become more like the top writers.

    I am sorry that you feel we are given preferential treatment - I don't believe we are - but I cannot change your opinion, and respect your opinion!

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      +1.  Agree, right down the line.

    2. IzzyM profile image85
      IzzyMposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Gosh sorry I went off on one! I never meant to have a go at you Simey, my apologies.

      I think I am only one of many who feel the AP program is unfair and that those who are on or who have  completed the program  are singled out for extra praise (look at how well OUR AP program is working, sort of thing), and I suppose that is just business too.

      This is a business after all. We are just cogs in the wheel.

      1. SimeyC profile image88
        SimeyCposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        IzzyM - I know you weren't being personal - I think there's a lot of frustration on both sides. There's a perceived favoritism - it really doesn't matter if it is real or not, the perception is there - therefore you have a lot of quality writers who feel they are not having a fair bite at the cherry. There's also frustration from the AP members who feel they are being 'pointed at' and (like me) feel we have to defend ourselves.

        You aptly put it - we are cogs - and that means all of us. We're all trying for the same goals, and everyone wants success.


        One way to look at it though is internal things such as HOTD, competition results etc. don't really mean anything - it's the Google traffic that counts!!!

        I hope that we all can move forward and forget about this - start working together to help each other improve - I know there's a lot more I could do to make better hubs....

  8. Cardisa profile image91
    Cardisaposted 4 years ago

    I really hate how a reasonable question like this turns into something of a grudge against Apprentices.

    I must say I am a bit disappointed that people see the Apprentices as being favored above the rest of the community. I won the HOTD way back long before I was an Apprentice an none of my Apprentice hubs have been chosen and I have not won any contests either. I see other threads referring to us as HP pets and that is a bit unfair.

    We need to stop this nonsense and try to help each other as much we can. I have never felt any form of favoritism here. As a matter of fact I was reprimanded several times for errors in my work and flagged for links to prohibited sites. Mark you that those links were to normal sites with no drugs, gambling or tobacco as the moderator pointed out. No favors there. I was even warned to brush up on my typos in my hubs or I would be dropped from the program. I was asked twice to delete hubs while in the program...so where is the favoritism there?

    We need to have the facts before we talk or we run the risk of offending people as I am right now.

  9. Mark Ewbie profile image81
    Mark Ewbieposted 4 years ago

    I don't have a view on the "a" thing.  No time to do it and I hate being educated.

    I found my reject letter...

    Der Mark, u ain;t much gud riting and you smell funy.

    1. thejeffriestube profile image83
      thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago

      I can't believe I'm actually responding in the forums, but this one hit a bit close to home. I was rejected admission to the program as well. While I may not have the favor of the HP gods, I consider myself to be a decent writer. I'm not an SEO expert, but I do understand what you need to do to build an audience with readers and the search engines. I actually write quite heavily in my day job, and HP was a natural extension of something I really do like to do.

      I was told I was a substandard writer, that my 100 Hubs were not good enough. I decided I had had enough with HubPages, through this, Panda slaps, and constant changes. I had enough with empty platitudes instead of honest, well-researched ways to make this the best place to write. I started my own website, moved EVERY hub there, and feel better that I am in control of my destiny again.

      I guess what I'm saying is that if HubPages thinks you're a substandard writer, and you aren't, stop making them profits and break free. It feels good.

      1. IzzyM profile image85
        IzzyMposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I don't think I ever read your hubs (sorry!) but this is shocking.

        All they had to say was "try again in six months" like they said to me. I thought that was hurtful enough, but if they had said my writing was substandard, I'd have been off like a shot.

        I hope your website is doing well. Really.

        You did the right thing.

        This is obviously not a solution for Sarra who is struggling with homelessness and to get this slap on the face on top of that is horrendous.

        I think we should all read her hubs, and boost her earnings through it.

        And show some solidarity to a fellow writer.

      2. WriteAngled profile image91
        WriteAngledposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Kudos to you, sir or madam. I am not bothering to move existing hubs, however, in the last month. single Adsense clicks on my own sites are earning more than I earn in a week with HP Ads.

        1. thejeffriestube profile image83
          thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I appreciate the thought, WA. I have been watching forums for some time, and I consider getting a kudos from you better than any "accolade" that was bestowed upon me by HP.

      3. LauraVerderber profile image87
        LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I hope your website works out! I just started my own website too. I just got rejected by Google Adsense. Ouch, it stings a bit. Oh well.

        1. thejeffriestube profile image83
          thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Keep trying on the Adsense, just get some more content going, and wait a week or two. And do not fart around with any kind of questionable SEO tricks. They are smart. Perhaps........too smart.

          1. LauraVerderber profile image87
            LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            No, nothing questionable. Is it ok to post my website link here? www.lolsnake.com/reptiles.html. All the content on there I have gotten permission in writing from the creators to use or I created the content myself, so I don't have a lot. I don't know what the usage rights are on content so I figured it is best to just ask people for permission. I don't do any black hat SEO tricks. I actually don't how to do that. I think should add some articles on there and certainly add more photos and videos. The email I got said "Rejected because of not enough content and text." So yeah, I think I just need to keep working on my website. How long have you had your website going? Did you go with paid hosting (I did) or did you do a free blog thing?

            1. thejeffriestube profile image83
              thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I've had my site in various forms for about a decade. (link is in my profile) It's been morphed many times over, but now it's going to stay like this. I use paid hosting from HostRocket, for about 10 years now, never had an issue with them. I am wondering though, your site seems to link to a specific page, rather than the web site root (ex www.hostname.com). So if that's your site, sweet, quality content is king. And even the blackhatters agree on that.

        2. mistyhorizon2003 profile image90
          mistyhorizon2003posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          You know that you use the same Adsense code on your own website as you do here? I am assuming you are registered with Adsense here already of course, and assuming you are the answer is simply to use the same code on all your sites (you can only have one Adsense account).

    2. spartucusjones profile image90
      spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago

      To answer the original question, the apprenticeship program is a great program. I have learned a lot and have benefited greatly. I have also seen increases in both traffic and earnings.

      As far as the supposed favoritism goes, I still have never won a HOTD. As far the review contest, the only review I wrote won in the random draw, but if it truly is a random draw then the fact that I am in the program would not make a difference.

      Concerning the fact that there may be a higher percentage of winners that are in the AP, can be a very simple explanation. HP has certain ideals for their hubs. For example even though AP hubs are a minimum of 500 words, we are also encouraged to write stellar hubs that generally have 1500 words. Also a stellar hub would have a variety of capsules (maps, tables, poll, quizzes, videos,etc). They also generally have at least 5 properly attributed (or preferably original) photos. If you were to check most HOTD winners, most of those hubs would meet the above criteria (in all honesty most of my hubs don't meet that criteria which is why I never win). Of course any hubber could write a hub which meets those criteria, but because it is taught and encouraged in the AP, it isn't necessary a huge surprise that apprentices may be writing a higher percentage of them. It also shouldn't be a huge surprise that certain hubbers may be putting forth more of the effort to meet that criteria (after all it does take more time and effort to write over 1500 words, multiple capsules, etc...).

      1. LauraVerderber profile image87
        LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks for the logic. I think people's judgement are clouded by jealousy.

    3. tillsontitan profile image91
      tillsontitanposted 4 years ago

      I haven't read all of the replies to your post but I do know I applied and had a typo in my HP name so I was denied and told to reapply.  I did reapply and was accepted but do to the volume of applicants I was told I had to wait until December to begin participating.  I am patiently waiting and looking forward to the experience.

    4. khmohsin profile image60
      khmohsinposted 4 years ago

      Physical exam and then training in the Capacity where you best fits.

    5. Li Galo profile image86
      Li Galoposted 4 years ago

      I am in it.  I had to wait a couple months to get in.  I work f/t and take online studies so it's tough to "make the time" for me but it's been completely worth it.  My articles look better, are making more money and are gaining readership.

    6. mistyhorizon2003 profile image90
      mistyhorizon2003posted 4 years ago

      I suspect a lot of the resentment towards the apprenticeship program is caused by the 'a' badge' that appears next to the participant's or graduate's profile image. It is causing the same problems as the 'e' for elite caused when displayed the same way, i.e. creating an 'us and them' kind of mentality. If this 'course' is purely to improve individual's writing skills, or hone the writing skills of those who are already fairly good at writing, then why give them a 'badge' at all? It just isn't necessary to advertise their participation in an HP course to the masses. I suspect the only purpose the badge serves is to encourage others to apply for the program so that on some level they will feel 'special' compared to other Hubbers (whether or not this ends up actually being the case). Of course the end result is a 'win win' for HP as they get more hubs churned out of a good quality and therefore make more money, plus they have a never ending waiting list of people waiting to join the program, many of whom feel that the 'a' badge on their profile image will give them more credibility in the eyes of those who they offer advice or suggestions to. To be honest ever since the program came out I was left wondering how the various mentors were qualified to tell any writer how to improve their writing looking at their working backgrounds prior to joining HP (no offence intended, just my observations).

      1. IzzyM profile image85
        IzzyMposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I think you have nailed it, Misty!

        I can see the point in having the letter on the name, but as more and more people undertake the program I can see those of us without the letter being regarded as somehow substandard, unable to have passed the course.

        It's such a pity they took away the 'length of time on HP' badge from our forum posts. Can we have them back please?

        Most people who have been here for a few years do not need to undertake the program because they have already learned how to write online, and are aware too that the rules are ever-changing.

        What works now might not work after the next algo change.

        Though it has to be said that the way HP are encouraging people to write - long, detailed, evergreen hubs with a range of capsules used - are likely to weather any future storm.

        1. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image92
          Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I personally would prefer either no public emblem, or at most, an accolade.  The program is good, but I don't know that everyone needs to know who has been through it.  And, it doesn't feel all that great to have the "a" referred to when you post comments on the forum, etc. It ends up being a filtering  mechanism through which people judge you and judge your comments.

          I respect the writers here, and have learned so much from everyone (still have many things to learn), and it's sad for the program to create a divisive atmosphere.

          1. cperuzzi profile image94
            cperuzziposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            "A" for effort.

            Not for nothing, but there were days that I had to crunch down hard to make the minimum hubs while balancing this and my professional life.  So, if I get judged for my little "a", they should know I worked for it.

            (Incidentally, I can count on my thumbs the amount of times I did a "500 word" article - at minimum they were at least 800.)

            1. gmwilliams profile image86
              gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Cperuzzi,  A+ all the way.   No need to apologize for being an Apprentice.    We need to be supportive of our Apprentices and to stop having an animus against those who are successful either in society or on HubPages.   I, for one, am totally sick of this envy and jealousy.     How puerile indeed!    As I said and written in many of my hubs on the subject, those who are highly successful in their socioeconomic and/or job/career endeavors strategized, organized, and worked smart to get where they are!   If one cannot support the more successful among us, what kind of society is this?!

          2. gmwilliams profile image86
            gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Marcy,  I am proud of you.    I believe that the Apprentice accolade should be public.  Why not?   You and the other Apprentcies earned it!   To those who are envious,  please GROW UP!     This is not trophy day where everyone gets a trophy.    Hard/smart work=high rewards!   In other words, high and prestigious honors requires smart work, good writing, technical, and analytical skills.     Yes, the program has rigorous qualifications.   So what, the Apprentices are the BEST!   Nothing is wrong with being the best.

            1. thejeffriestube profile image83
              thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I think you're missing the point here. I don't think any one of us has any specific beef with Apprentices themselves; in fact, they are awesome writers who did hard work.

              What I am critical of is HubPages. If you tell me I'm a shitty writer enough times, I won't start to believe it, I'll just go make money on my own. There are some though, who may take that personally, and may cause more psychological harm. If HubPages was serious about their future, they would be lining up SEVERAL classes at a time, and inviting people to participate.

              1. 0
                summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                They do have multiple class at once and I was invited to participate.
                If being turned down by an online writing site's program causes someone psychological harm, it is not the fault of HPs nor is it their responsibility to cushion the fall.

                1. gmwilliams profile image86
                  gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Totally agree.    This animus is akin to the everyone getting the trophy mentality.   One gets in life what he/she earns, no more, no less.     To elucidate the point further, in order to get into Harvard, one must have an above average GPA.    If one has an average or below average GPA. he/she has no chance of getting into Harvard.     

                  The premise that if a writer applies for the Apprentice program, he/she should be automatically accepted is totally bogus to say the least.   There are certain, prerequisite qualifications for a writer to be accepted into the program.    HubPages wants to maintain its quality standards which is quite apropos.     

                  This contention regarding the Apprentice Program and the Apprentices who passed the program is totally beyond histrionic melodrama.   This action on the part of the negaters and other malcontents are more appropriate to a tv reality show than it is to HubPages.   This is a writer's community, not a teenage reality show!

            2. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image92
              Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Thanks for the words of support, gmwilliams - yes, the program was demanding, but I hope people don't feel that those who are accepted are somehow distinct from others on the site. This site has a ton of great talent, and I'm honored to be here.

              In thinking about what we were told (somewhere in the Learning Center, possibly) about the criteria for the program, it seems there were a number of factors HP considered, and I'm sure each participant had different backgrounds, writing interests, areas where they could learn and writing strengths.

              None of those in the program, as far as I know, focused mainly on poetry or fiction, but as HP has said, the site greatly values that type of writing. The program, however, didn't cover that type of hubs (you would seldom include multiple capsules, polls, quizzes or similar capsules in a poem, for example).  So there are some great writers on HP who may have applied, but been turned down because they don't have a lot of history in writing non-fiction on the site.

              Other factors included frequent publishing (being able to produce the eight hubs the program requires each month), a history of writing prior to being on the site, and having hubs that show the writer can use various capsules, etc. Since each writer is different, some had strong backgrounds or experience in one area, and other writers may have had less in the exact same area.

              Given the large number of writers on the site, there would be no way to have everyone who wanted to be in the program enrolled at the same time. It only makes sense, then, that the site might figure someone who is already an expert in SEO (which is a heavy focus of the program) wouldn't need the program - and in fact would probably be bored to tears with some of the lessons. It also makes sense that HP would consider the type of writing (style and preferred genre) a Hubber focuses on, since the poets on the site, for example, might find non-fiction hubs tedious to produce.

              The divisiveness I mentioned comes when people refer to Hubbers who have been through the program as the 'pets' of the site, or suggest there's favoritism. If anything, during the time you're in the program, your writing is subjected to far more scrutiny than other writers here experience, and you are given some very candid feedback. For six straight months, your writing is watched microscopically. Fun, huh?

              Yes, I am glad I was given that opportunity to learn, and I am glad I stuck with it for six months (there were times it wasn't easy to do so).  And I learned that I still have much more to learn, and that's perhaps one of the biggest benefits.

        2. Millionaire Tips profile image89
          Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I think the a is just for marketing as well - to remind people to join the program.  When I don't see an a, it simply means to me that they did not participate in the program.  It doesn't mean that they are inferior - they may be busy, or don't need the course since they learned the lessons in another way.  You are assigning meaning where there isn't any.

      2. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I agree here, WA, and wish that badge was gone.  I don't mind an indication on my profile - visitors might feel it gives more authority (although the term "apprentice" could be changed!), but I don't really like seeing it in the forums.

        At the same, time it's great advertising for the program.  Anyone seeing it is going to want to know what it means, what it's for, and want one themselves.  A never ending stream of applicants.

        For the forums, Izzy is right - seeing the time on site is more important to me, and would sure make it easier to spot those dozens of sock puppets we've been seeing that joined a few hours ago and immediately begin their bashing agenda.

        1. Cardisa profile image91
          Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Wilderness, in my humble opinion, are were 5th graders here? We are not children, we are all adults. Why should someone wearing a badge for a program they worked hard to accomplish be a problem to others?

          I think it is petty the way we think and we need to realize that this is the way life works.  I am going to be selfish here. All the time things like this come up, I sit back and play peacemaker. I am sick of how the people in this here HP community think and act. This is not a contest. Why should a badge be removed in the forums because other people are having a grudge against the people wearing it? There is no valid reason to do that but to soothe some people ego.

          When the "e" badge was a problem I agreed as that was given on a volunteered basis only. My "a" badge I earned through death and grief, sadness and sickness. I will not sit back and have people ridicule and belittle it because they can't deal with it and they have some hang ups about the HP community. I am proud to wear the badge because I earned it. I struggled to stay in the program so I deserve to show it off and too bad for those who can't handle it.

          1. 0
            summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Cardisa, I agree. The badge is a reward for hard work for the completion of a program. We should all be proud of it. I know I am.

            I have yet to see or hear anyone here in these or other threads indicate any feelings of superiority because there is an 'a' beside their name. Nor have I seen others indicate feelings of inferiority by not having an 'a'.

            No doubt however there will be those who feel superior with or without and 'a' and those who feel inferior with or without an 'a' on their avatar.

            Like you said it is life.

            As far as those who are being denied acceptance into the program, it sounds like HP is sending a form letter that sounds a bit too general. It might be better PR if they were more specific to each hubber and provide constructive feedback on ways to meet the criteria.

            1. thejeffriestube profile image83
              thejeffriestubeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Agreed; damn right it would be better PR. Not to mention, I know at least one decent writer that was denied enough times that HP just plain LOST the traffic to 100 hubs. If there's one, there's got to be others in a community this large leaving without so much a whimper.

          2. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You're right, of course, Cardisa.  For me, I just don't care one way or the other if it is shown in the forums.  If it causes dissension, take it away, because I really don't care.  If it is useful, or if people want it shown, leave it.  Again, I don't care one way or the other.

            Speaking for myself, and ONLY for myself, I went through the AP.  It was tough, but I made it and I learned doing it - badge or not I retain both the feeling of accomplishment and the learning.  I retain the friends I made there and the camaraderie - that doesn't come from having the badge, either, but from working with people, helping each other as we go.

            Take the badge away and I still have everything of value that I gained from the program.  But that's just me, and others will feel differently.

            1. habee profile image91
              habeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I agree, Wildie. I enjoyed the program and benefited from it, but I wouldn't shed any tears if the "A" was removed from my avatar.

              1. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image92
                Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I agree with Habee and Wilderness - I feel a sense of accomplishment from completing the program, and if the 'a' went away, I would still have that feeling, as well as everything I learned.

                Someone posted a comment in one of these threads that people may have wanted to join the program just to get the badge. Well, several groups were enrolled before the site even came up with the badge, and we had no idea there would be one, so that wasn't a factor at all.

                Once we were told by the site that there would be an 'A' to signify 'Apprenticeship,' our group responded by jokingly asking them to avoid making it an "AA" after we graduated (for Apprentice Alum), and not to make it a red 'A.'  The final badge, as you can see, is a neutral greyish 'a' for those still in the six-month stage and a green one for those who completed it. Lower case.  But we would have been happy with no badge at all, I think.

    7. habee profile image91
      habeeposted 4 years ago

      I really enjoyed the AP, and I didn't find it difficult. I learned a lot, and my earnings and traffic have increased. I had no problem at all writing the required number of hubs each month, but I write hubs in my sleep! lol

    8. Whitney05 profile image67
      Whitney05posted 4 years ago

      It think it has great potential, which is why I applied for it,  but at the same time, the concepts could probably be learned on your own. I've learned a lot by researchingand subscribing SEO and blogging tip blogs/sites.

      I applied but was denied the program without any explaination, so I do not have any hands-on experience with how the program works.

    9. sgbrown profile image93
      sgbrownposted 4 years ago

      It is human nature to appreciate and enjoy badges or awards when we have accomplished something special.  They make you feel good about yourself, proud and raise your self confidence.  There is nothing wrong with this.  I am proud for you and for everyone else that has graduated from the apprenticehsip program!  Petty people are the ones who leave ugly messages, just ignore them and be proud of yourself!  smile

    10. watergeek profile image93
      watergeekposted 4 years ago

      Two more hubs and I will be finished with it. In a word: It's tedious. It's challenging. Eight hubs per month may not seem like much, but when you have to write high quality hubs with specific requirements for each, then writing takes more time than many people are used to. We are aiming for high quality with each hub. I thought I was a fairly good writer already, but my hubs improved quite a bit. Hopefully my traffic will too.

      1. watergeek profile image93
        watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Let me clarify a bit. I already had the writing skills. This training helped me learn about SEO - about writing online.  I have a particular message I want to get out and I want people to read it. That means I need to know how to generate traffic. When I applied to the program I told them I was poor on SEO skills, which is probably why I got in. I believe my writing quality has increased as well, but that is incidental to the SEO training they give in the program.

    11. 2uesday profile image88
      2uesdayposted 4 years ago

      Thanks for the explanation Marcy I had wondered if there was a change in the badge once the apprenticeship program was completed.

      When 30 hubs in 30 days was buzzing, I completed that on my second try and found it difficult to find the time to do it. Which is probably why the apprenticeship program did not appeal to me.

    12. LetitiaFT profile image83
      LetitiaFTposted 4 years ago

      In response to the "badgering" against apprentices, five points come to mind:
      1.) If you look closely, those big "A"s are green, as in go for it, not scarlet, as in harlot (a reference for hub authors who read as well as write...);
      3.) Of course HP created the apprentice program in their interest, and their interest resides in the success of the writers who provide the content. Success is therefore necessarily something they wish for all HP writers, not just apprentices.
      2.) The program was never intended as a writing class--apprentices are supposed to have that skill to begin with--but as a way to train writers to write for the web, and more specifically HP. Some people may not be ready for it while others may not need it.
      4.) HP has stated elsewhere that the letter was intended to signal to other writers that these were writers with hubs they could learn from since they have been closely supervised by HP staff, said staff being unable to follow everyone's work closely;
      5.) For those who resent not having that "badge," there are plenty of others at HP if you're really into that kind of thing. If it's just a question of showing seniority and popularity, hub and follower numbers already attest to that.
      Apprentices have reason to feel good about their achievements, but certainly no one should feel bad (or made to feel bad) about being, or not being, an apprentice.

      1. 0
        Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I don't feel bad anymore about not being able to get into the AP program.  I did at first, but I have chaulked it up to experience.  I would think, however, if you are writing articles on HP that HP would welcome a contributor to become better at what they are trying to accomplish....be a better writer.  I now have the attitude that if I was that 'sub par' then they wouldn't allow me on this site.  So a thumbs up for me.

        1. theraggededge profile image93
          theraggededgeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Hi Sarra, glad you feel better. I am dismayed that your writing was disparaged.

          As others have already said, the AP program does not teach writing skills - it helps you optimise your hubs, create hubs on topics that people are looking for, keeps you to deadlines and teaches the technical stuff about images and layouts. Those mentors are strict!

          Also, someone mentioned writing in the first person - I do that all the time and was never pulled up on it. I was told a chatty, one-to-one style was okay.

          1. 0
            Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Thank you Theraggededge.  I would love to optimize my hubs so forget HP I'll learn to do it myself.  I've had quite a few compliments on my articles so I can't be doing all that bad.

        2. LetitiaFT profile image83
          LetitiaFTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Hi Sarra,
          My comment wasn't directed at you, but at those who may be absolutely terrific, successful writers but who have been bashing apprentices and, frankly, using your case as an excuse to do it. You merely expressed your disappointment at not being accepted, which is a totally honest response.
          I've looked at your hubs and your topics are of tremendous value. The fact you didn't meet the criteria for the HP apprentice program doesn't change that. HP simply doesn't have the resources to devote to every one of their tens of thousands of hub authors, though I'm sure they wish they could. However their intention is for the apprentices that they do work with to serve as examples and help others improve in turn. With a few tweeks & edits like those recommended by Summerberrie, Empress and others, and by studying on your own in the learning center, your valuable writing could reach a lot more people. Then you could reapply. That is, if you're even still interested. In the meantime, there is a forum where you can get constructive criticism directly, and maybe more of it than you would as an apprentice. I wish you the best of luck and look forward to reading more of your hubs.

    13. 0
      Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago

      To set the record straight and to free myself from being burned at the stake let me say that those who have been accepted into the AP program: "Bravo to you".  You all are excellent writers and have had the ability to have an education in the writing field before you joined HP.  Me, not so much.

      I remember in school I had to write a short story for English class.  I started my story at the end and then completed my story with the beginning.  I thought I was being creative and if I say so myself it was a good story.  My teacher threw my story back at me with my very first "F" and screamed "The end comes last" or something close to that.

      Low and behold many movies and books today start with the ending......Gee maybe I had something going on.  It took 20+ years for me to get up the guts to write again.  I'm not the best, but you know what?  I have readers and followers.  I tell my stories from the heart and am passionate about what I write.

      So, blllppp to my teacher and the same to HP.  I was born on my own, live on my own, survive on my own and will die on my own.  I will continue to write and tell my stories, I will continue to write and tell my ideas on helping the homeless and try to make this a better world and I will continue to write about what I am passionate about.  Homelessness, Veterans, The lack of jobs, Trying to make money, Animal Rescue and Animal Therapy. 

      Just because you have an "a" next to your avitar doesn't mean that your getting the biggest cookie in the jar.  It simply means you went through a teaching opportunity to improve your writing.  I don't have an extended school education, however, I have so far passed the school of hard knocks and have accomplished and survived more in my life than most have.

      I am a survivor of life, I live simply, love my son, love my dogs and love God. I don't wish any ill will upon anyone even my enemies.  However, if given the opportunity even at my age of 50 to better myself I'm going to jump at the chance.  Where I am right now there is no where else to go but up.  I'm not 20, I'm 50.  An old grey mare that has seen better days that has many broken bones.  I have fought for my Country in third world places, believe in the Pledge of Alligence and the Constitution.  I'm no better than anyone else because you know why?  I pull my pants on one leg at a time, just like everyone else.

      1. EmpressFelicity profile image82
        EmpressFelicityposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Sarra, I'm guessing here but my gut instinct is that the reason you were rejected for the apprentice program wasn't the standard of your writing, but the type of subjects you write about.

        You write about what I describe as "motivational" subjects, rather than concrete subjects (things like like recipes and "how to's"). I think that your type of subject matter doesn't have a future in the New HubPages World Order. You would be better off setting up your own website and putting your hubs there.

        You won't make much money, but at least you will be your own "boss" and won't have to contend with endless rule changes and the "idle" feature.

        1. 0
          Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Thank you for your comment Empress!  I didn't think about that, however, I only have 5 idle hubs which I am going to rewrite.  My articles must be of interest as they are being read and I am making more money (not getting rich) and have a wonderful amount of followers.  Motivation is something we all need no?

          What happens if I take my articles and not only put them here but put them on Wordpress as well? I'm not cyber smart at all and just started a blog but I don't see where I can make any money on blogging but I'm slowly learning.

          1. EmpressFelicity profile image82
            EmpressFelicityposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Putting the same article in two places isn't a good idea - duplicate content isn't allowed on HP, so you'll find that the version on HP gets unpublished.

            1. watergeek profile image93
              watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              That's true, so you'd have to rewrite the article. BUT that would have to be done anyway, if your articles are to match the standards of each website. Hubpages likes longer, informational articles (1500 wds) that are search engine friendly and contain a variety of content types, e.g. tables, maps, videos. Wordpress likes short blog-type articles (500-750 wds). You could take your longer HP articles, summarize and personalize them, and post them on Wordpress without being nabbed for duplicate content.

        2. 0
          summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I think this is a great idea. Then write hubs here to link to your website. The type of hubs you might write here could be:

          How to Help the Homelessness: Ways to be Charitable

          Ten Facts about the Homeless but Were Afraid to Ask

          Homeless Organizations Worth Your Contribution

          Jobless for the Holidays: How to Cope without a Job

          Homeless Programs for Youth

          How to Find Help for the Homeless

          These titles are key word searched and should bring you traffic.

          1. 0
            Sarra Garrettposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Thank you for these suggestions! They are much appreciated.

          2. EmpressFelicity profile image82
            EmpressFelicityposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Actually, that makes a lot of sense. Put the "How To" stuff on HubPages, and link it to the more motivational stuff on the stand-alone website.

          3. watergeek profile image93
            watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Interesting titles, summerberrie!

            1. 0
              summerberrieposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              By the end of the program you can spit them out pretty fast.....

    14. Sherry Hewins profile image95
      Sherry Hewinsposted 4 years ago

      I have the same question as the one that started this thread. "What is the AP Program Like?"

      I wish someone who has been through it would write a hub about it. The good and the bad. I asked a question like this in the Q&A a couple of months ago about what people didn't like about it, or why they dropped out, and mostly got alums with glowing praise.

      I think I'm beginning to get the picture of how much work it is, and how strictly they adhere to the requirements. I think an inside look at the life of an Apprentice could enlighten applicants about what they are in for, and possibly reduce the number who drop out. Since there are only 30 slots per month, and a long waiting list, it would be preferable if people could self-screen so they are not wasting one of the coveted slots.

      1. cperuzzi profile image94
        cperuzziposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The best answer I can give is that it's like going to the University of Phoenix online.

        You can take the courses and watch the lessons any time.  The only thing that's really complex and is a challenge is putting the lessons into actual practice.  If you have questions, you can work through the forums.

        The feedback you get is really helpful and, once again, if you get accepted, it's really a great experience in knowing how to produce content. 

        Let me also tell you what it isn't.  It is not a course for "writing for the web".  That's a different type of art altogether.  "Writing website content" is when you need to use an small economy of words and cut, cut, and cut.  The hubs we produce don't necessarily require that.

      2. watergeek profile image93
        watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I have two more hubs to go and I'll be done with the program. Here are some goods: Makes you focus on quality writing (non-fiction), teaches you the importance of and techniques for attracting search engine traffic, gives you experience with using each of the capsules and blending them to make a more interesting hub, you are paid a small amount for each apprenticeship hub, helps you find your personal style.

        Here are some bads: It's a lot of pressure trying to get those hubs out, you find yourself choosing topics that please others more than yourself, you don't have as much time to take part in forums, you give up other non-HP priorities to make sure you finish up. If you don't finish your 8 or if they are low quality and not improving, you are removed from the program. In others words, you can't game it. Hope this helps.

        1. watergeek profile image93
          watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          One more good: You get to be friends with other hubbers in your group, if you choose to interact in your special forum. That's a pretty good good. smile

      3. Millionaire Tips profile image89
        Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Sherry, OP and everyone else who wants to know.  Here is my opinion of the apprenticeship program.  Apprentices are not allowed to write hubs about HubPages during the program, because they are not what Google will search for, so those hubs will likely become idle.  Since I am in it for the money, I probably won't write one afterwards either.  So I'll just tell you here.

        One big feature of the program is knowledge.  We are learning how to properly attribute images, search for keywords, etc.  Almost all, maybe even all, of this information is available in the learning center.  The difference between joining the program and doing it on your own in this case is just the motivation is greater to read the lessons as they are given.  It is like taking a class instead of simply reading the textbook.  Sure, the teacher is just reading the textbook to you, but at least you take the time to go through it.

        The next benefit is the group.  You are a part of a group of learners who are in the same class as you are.  Because of this, you can talk to each other in a special forum and maybe learn things from each other.  However, the answers you get are dependent on whether the other apprentices have time to visit the forum, and how much they know about the subject.  Since each group has a limited number of students, you may wind up having apprentices who may not know the answer, or not enough people answered for you to get a feel for all the factors to make an educated opinion.

        Another aspect is the mentor.  Your mentor will drop by the forum a few times a week to respond to your questions.  The key is to know what questions to ask, and I am afraid I am missing out on this opportunity because there are things it doesn't occur to me to ask.  The mentor will give you personalized feedback on your hubs once a month. Please note that this feedback is general (i.e. "you need to proofread your work before publishing," and not "you forgot to capitalize the A in the third sentence.") While this is a terrific feature, it is not something you cannot get by going to the forums.  In fact, in the forums, you will get a variety of opinions that may help you improve faster, and someone may be willing to give you detailed feedback.

        The last thing I can think of is the class.  Just the formality of taking the class motivates you to write the hubs and follow the instructions.  Without the class, you may not get around to reading the learning center articles or writing at least eight hubs a month, no matter what comes up in our life that makes it hard for us to do that.  Since all of you are here, writing hubs without anyone breathing down your neck, you should be able to create and follow a program with goals of its own.  In fact, you can choose the pace that works best with your schedule.

        Having sat through many boring lessons in school, I wished many times that I could just read the textbook and skip the class. I think that anyone who wants to get the information in the program can create their own classes.  The syllabus for the apprentice program is already on line.  Read the learning center articles, and apply them to your hubs.  When you have a question, look it up in the learning center. Then ask the question in the forums.  You will have a bigger group of people who can answer you, some of whom are likely to be experts in the field. You will probably get lots of opinions so you can think through the issues to come up with a reasonably informed choice or strategy.


        I recommend going through the program for anyone who has the time to write eight quality hubs (expect them to take twice as long as the hubs you write now), go through the lessons (about 1-2 hours a month), participate in the group (reading hubs, participating in forums, etc.), and familiarizing yourself with social networking sites if you haven't already done so.  You can do the minimum required in the program or you can really dive into it and get as much out of it as you can while you are in it. 

        Shasta

        1. daisydayz profile image87
          daisydayzposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Thanks for a great review, very honest and open. Nice to see someones real feelings. I am planning to apply in the new year, as I think i need that focus and motivation that the programme will give me, and help me to learn the extra stuff I dont already know.

          1. Millionaire Tips profile image89
            Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Sounds like a plan daisydayz.  They announce the apprentices once a month, so if you apply now, you wouldn't start until January or afterwards. In fact, I would think the cut off for the people who were starting in January would be November 30 (not sure about that), and they would let them know they were in the program in the beginning of December.  So more likely you would start in February unless you were put on the waiting list.

            If you are worried about being able to research and write 8 hubs a month, you can think about starting some now and put them in reserve in a Word document (or even on HubPages).  You will likely have to edit them to make them fit what you have learned during the program, but at least some of the work will be done. Of course if you learn during the program that that topic is not a good one, you would have to start all over.

            Maybe you can make meals ahead of time and freeze them, and do whatever else you can do to free up your time during the program.

      4. spartucusjones profile image90
        spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Sherry,
        I started a hub when I first found out about being accepted in the AP. I also have been updating it every month. I am in the process of finishing my final month (I still have 5 hubs to write, so I better start writing them, or I may get kicked out).

        I will be honest I really only been focusing on the good because I really don't have anything negative to say about it. As far as people dropping out, in most cases it seems to be connected to meeting the minimum requirements of 8 hubs a month, which could be a challenge if you already have a busy schedule.

        Here is my hub if you do want to check it out:
        http://spartucusjones.hubpages.com/hub/ … yself-Into

        1. leahlefler profile image97
          leahleflerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Sparucusjones - get off this forum and back to your hubs - it's the last month, man - don't get kicked out!!! smile

          Only 1 day left!!!

          1. spartucusjones profile image90
            spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You are right! I plan on doing an all nighter to night and I have the day off tomorrow, so we should be OK. But I better get started. But of course, if I didn't procrastinate I would be perfect!

            1. gmwilliams profile image86
              gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Finish the program.   Do not let your hard work go to waste.   Write that hub NOW!   DO IT, don't procrastinate!

            2. leahlefler profile image97
              leahleflerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Same here, my friend. I was scrambling this month. Life can throw some unexpected curve balls! Here's to a good all-nighter!

              Honestly, we should have a massive party when the clock ticks over to December 1. It will be a relief to go to 4 hubs/month from 8 (though I might keep writing 8/month anyway, because it is nice to see the traffic add up).

          2. watergeek profile image93
            watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You tell him, Leah! wink

    15. safiq ali patel profile image72
      safiq ali patelposted 4 years ago

      And one crucial tip for anyone who has passed the hub pages apprentice ship program. You are no in a great position to write hubs on what you learn. I'm sure you'd get  a lot of traffic from people wanting to  pick up tips from you.

      1. watergeek profile image93
        watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I think you're right, but note that I "think" you're right, I don't know you're right. Why? Because new hubs take time to build up readership. So I have suggestions for some hub prework to do to make them search engine friendly, but those suggestions haven't proven out yet. I'm kind of stymied about whether to share them or not.

    16. kathleenkat profile image89
      kathleenkatposted 4 years ago

      Two days after I published a detailed Hub about trimming cat claws, I noticed an Apprentice Hubber publish one with the same exact topic/idea.

      Now I understand I am not the only one with a cat, who also knows how to trim cat claws. But I find the timing a bit strange. It is my understanding that the Apprentice program gives Apprentice Hubbers topics to write about, so I find it a bit odd that that exact topic would show up right after I used it.

      I would probably have reacted differently if it wasn't an Apprentice doing it. Perhaps if they removed the identifying factor for Apprentices, people would feel better about the program. It seems pretentious to me to label one's self as something. I fly around on the internet with a banner under my name saying "Kathleenkat: Currently enrolled in private music lessons" because I don't think that is relevant; it would give the impression that I thought I was better than everybody else because I was selected for a program that not everybody else has been selected for.

      It baffles me why the Apprentice program would be any different. It's not like while at college we walked around with name tags saying "I got into the Art program!" or "I'm Magna Cum Laude!" This discussion probably wouldn't exist had the Apprentice program members were less flaunted.

      1. watergeek profile image93
        watergeekposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        It's only in the first month of apprenticeship that titles are given. After that, apprentices are taught how to generate titles themselves. Is it possible that you and this apprentice got the same idea from a forum discussion? If both of you are interested in the same topic anyway, it wouldn't be unusual to both get the same idea for a hub.

        1. kathleenkat profile image89
          kathleenkatposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The forum thing isn't possible, as I rarely discuss pets on here, let alone my ideas for future hubs.

          But yes, it is possible that we both have cats, and know how to trim cat claws, and enjoy writing about the same things. I just find the timing incredibly suspicious, that's all.

    17. flash167 profile image89
      flash167posted 4 years ago

      I am very grateful that I have been selected to start the apprenticeship program on the 1st of December, 2012. 

      I really look forward to it because I have never enjoyed writing in high school or college and I have a lot to learn.   

      I don't consider myself a good writer at all, however in the last 20 years or so I have learned to love sharing information and ideas with others.  Isn't that what writing is all about, sharing with others?

      My situation has changed considerably from the time that I applied until now so It's going to be a real challenge to juggle my schedule but I can't pass up the opportunity.

      I'm very happy with the earnings that I have seen from my hubs thus far and can't wait to learn to make things more profitable for myself and HubPages.

      1. gmwilliams profile image86
        gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Flash, I am so glad for you!.    Best of luck of you!

        1. flash167 profile image89
          flash167posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Thank you.  I didn't realize it was so hard to get in until after I was accepted.  I am so very grateful.

      2. JillKostow profile image87
        JillKostowposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I was extremely excited when I found out that I was accepted into the program.  I was also a bit nervous because I was worried that I wouldn't be able to meet the requirements over the six month period.  I am happy to say that this is the end of my sixth month and I did it!  As long as you put aside some time each month to devote to the lessons and writing you will do just fine!  Trust me, I finished last minute a lot of the time but if you stay motivated you will have no problem finishing the six months of writing!!

        1. LauraVerderber profile image87
          LauraVerderberposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Good job!

    18. Joseph041167 profile image59
      Joseph041167posted 4 years ago

      Does anyone know, how is this going to affect everyone else's earnings, assuming we ever get accepted into Adsense. I get this message a lot in life everywhere that I go, where, there are too many people here already, your not really wanted, or needed, or wait in line. Generally, if there is a line to wait in, that is a sign that I do not want to be there, and generally I leave if I can help it. I am not thinking about leaving Hubpages tonight immediately. I no longer entertain ideas about moving to NYC, and Nashville no longer holds a permanant status for my dreams. I do not fool with traffic or lines. So, how is the apprentice program going to affect everyone else's profits? I smell trouble.

      1. spartucusjones profile image90
        spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I really don't think google cares whether or not someone is in the apprentice program. If you write search friendly hubs they will do well regardless of whether or not you are in the apprenticeship program.

        1. cperuzzi profile image94
          cperuzziposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Are you feeling well?  Your "a" is looking a little green.

          1. spartucusjones profile image90
            spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            What I have must be contagious, because it looks like you might of caught it as well.

            1. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image92
              Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I'm loving those green 'a' badges!  Congrats!

              1. spartucusjones profile image90
                spartucusjonesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Thanks, Marcy!

    19. cfin profile image76
      cfinposted 4 years ago

      LIVE AND LET LIVE. This is a free website where people can come and go as they please.

    20. daisydayz profile image87
      daisydayzposted 4 years ago

      Ignoring all the usually bikering on here, I am actually planning to apply after the New Year. I know there is a waiting list but I was worried I wouldn't have the time before Christmas to make a proper start on it if I made the programme. I still think it is a good idea to help teach people SEO and how to write better, obviously it will help HP too as the better we get the better HP becomes and the more money they make, but also the more money we make. Its a causal circle just like every other work place in the world!

    21. Xenonlit profile image61
      Xenonlitposted 4 years ago

      I refuse to get so invested in another content mill "writer's building" program. It's not a dig on the program, it's just a warning not to put all the eggs in one basket.

      The HP apprenticeship program is a brilliant idea for new writers or for those who don't need the money.

      But it brings up the issue of perks and  advantages just for investing time and energy that could be spent learning the ropes about building a true web presence.

      There are places where we should be marketing ourselves, gettting exposure, writing at multiple mills, networking with publishers and finding out who pays us much more than we make here.

      In other words, we all need a balanced, multi pronged approach, not full time investment in one place. Trust me, I know how big a mistake that is.

      I will stick with putting up new articles, improving the old ones and trying to read more than I write here to support fellow hubbers. I highly encourage new writers to learn as much as they can here.

      1. Millionaire Tips profile image89
        Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The Apprenticeship Program does not prohibit you from writing anywhere else, as far as I know.  And once you know the ropes, you can apply your knowledge to writing in a lot of different places.

    22. sleepylog profile image87
      sleepylogposted 4 years ago

      Good luck with your application smile

      I can't wait to apply, it sounds like loads of fun and I love to challenge myself. I'm currently aiming for one hub per day and so far so good. I would write a lot more if I had the time but hopefully by the time my turn comes, things in my life won't be so hectic anymore.

      1. Millionaire Tips profile image89
        Millionaire Tipsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        HubPages recommends quality over quantity.  There is a minimum of 8 hubs and a maximum of 15 in the program.

        http://hubpages.com/learningcenter/Appr … ip-Program

     
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