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Flagging Abuse

  1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
    Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago

    How is it that one person has the ability to go through all your hubs and with a few clicks, take them all down?

    For instance: http://hubpages.com/hub/Marrying-a-Philippines-Girl

    (I realize it is down at the moment, but go to google and type site:http://hubpages.com/hub/Marrying-a-Philippines-Girl and it will show you what the contents was).

    It was flagged as overly-promotional.  It promotes nothing, there isn't even an outgoing link on the page.  42 comments of people thanking me, yet someone flagging me can instantly remove it from hubpages.

    Or how about this one: http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-write-go … thor-Score

    That's right ... a hub about helping other people raise their hub score.  Again, flagged as "Overly promotional", yet it promoted nothing but to help people with their hubpages.

    I've said screw it and deleted 13 of my hubs.  I've got places for them to be where I'm not worried about them being yanked at the fancy of someone who wants to harass me.

    I know exactly who did it, but I don't know who I should be more angry with -- them for doing it, or hubpages for allowing it to happen in the first place.

    So I have two questions:

    #1)  How does hubpages discipline members who abuse the flagging button?

    #2)  How is it that hubpages thinks it can allow someone to remove 15 (presumably 100) hubs with a few clicks and think they're doing a service to their authors?

    1. WryLilt profile image87
      WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Flagging a hub CANNOT make it be unpublished. Only a STAFF MEMBER can unpublish a hub. So if you get 15 flags on a hub and a moderator thinks it's ok, then it will stay up.

      Hubpages has mentioned previously that people who flag things appropriately have a higher rating within the system for flagging - I assume the same goes for false flagging. However no member can make a hub be unpublished without review.

      As for the two hubs in question, I cannot see a reason for them being unpublished as overly promotional.

      http://hubpages.com/faq/#overly_promotional

      If the cache of those two pages is unaltered (you haven't added any extra links) then I really think this is rather ridiculous.

      When you click on the warning message, does it expand with further information?

      Currently new moderators are being trained so I'd recommend emailing the team directly and finding out why it was unpublished.

      I'd be interested to hear Jason or Simone's opinion on this one, actually.

      1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
        Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        WryLilt, see my response further down the page.  It essentially boils down to someone who doesn't like my disagreement with them being a moderator and abusing their ability to unpublish hubs.

        To answer your question though ... I haven't edited or updated a hubpage (besides commenting) in probably over half a year, so the google cache is the correct copy.

        1. WryLilt profile image87
          WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Then I would definitely email the team about it. If a moderator is personally doing something like this then I think they should lose their job. If it's a mistake well, I think they need more training!

          1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
            Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            That would have been the first line of action I would normally take, except "directly mailing the team" didn't seem like a very intuitive thing to do ... i.e. there's no way to do it that is obvious to me.

            1. WryLilt profile image87
              WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Just email team@ or use the contact form: http://hubpages.com/contact_us/

        2. Susana S profile image91
          Susana Sposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I saw the hub you commented on as it's the hub of someone I follow. Just to let you know, that person isn't a moderator or staff member of hubpages - just a regular hubber.

          You might be pissed that your hub has been unpublished, and I would be too, especially as it doesn't seem to have broken any rules, but don't get paranoid!

          1. WryLilt profile image87
            WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I should have checked that. If it's the guy from Scotland, yes he's just a normal member. And I very much doubt he'd stoop to flagging you. He's far too busy with non-Hubpages earning pursuits.

            1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
              Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              With all due respect WryLilt, this guy you're saying is too busy said this as his last comment to me ...

              "but as soon as it is reported HP staff they have the intelligence to remove it. I wonder, do you know that spun content is not allowed on HubPages?"

              So somehow that guy made the assumption that I was article spinning on HP, and said they remove it as it is reported.

              So after reading that, do you still think he had nothing to do with it?

              1. WryLilt profile image87
                WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Yes.

          2. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
            Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I've been a member here an awfully long time.  For all my hubs to disappear within an hour of posting on his hub is fishy enough not to rule out his involvement in my banning.

            Someone abused their powers at hubpages.  They can either remedy it to my satisfaction or suffer bad press over it.

            1. WryLilt profile image87
              WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Within an hour? Then you definitely can't blame that user!

              From what I've seen the flagged hubs queue can take hours to process - hubs can take 48 hours or longer to come to moderator attention.

              1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
                Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Ok this is getting frustrating.  Go out of your way to defend the guy, I don't care.  Hubpages should have a record of who deleted it and why.

                However, I'd just like to say that my automatic assumption (based on evidence) that it is the guy in question is responsible for it may be no more founded than your absolute insistence that he had nothing to do with it.

                We're talking about moderator abuse here.  For the sake of argument, lets just assume that a moderator that wants to abuse the system ... they have the option of speeding up their abuse on a case by case basis?

                1. WryLilt profile image87
                  WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  If you're questioning a moderator, yes they could be responsible for abusing the system. No, the member in question is not a moderator..

    2. Marisa Wright profile image93
      Marisa Wrightposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      They can't. 

      When a person flags a Hub, all it does is place it in the moderators' queue for review.  It doesn't unpublish the Hub.

      When the moderators get to your Hub, they review it and decide whether it breaks any rules.   They don't take the original flagger's opinion into account, they make their own decision.

      1. recommend1 profile image71
        recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You are speculating here - my experience is that hubs can be unpublished from malicious flagging.  Whether this is because some 'old established' hubbers have the ability to do this or moderators are automatically unpublishing without looking to save time is immaterial - whatever the reason it does appear that hubs are unpublished form incorrect flagging pretty immediately.

        1. WryLilt profile image87
          WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I gave you the link explaining that: http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/68719#post1501537

          And remember, there are many new moderators currently in training. That's the reason so many mistakes are happening with moderation at the moment.

          1. recommend1 profile image71
            recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            You did give me the link - and I answered you.

            However, while I know you are trying to help and just trying to diffuse the criticism of the staff here - you do not know that is still the case unless you have information that we don't.

            I also do not accept that new moderators in training is a reasonable excuse for the havoc and poor quality moderation incidents - any office with sufficient staff and proper structure would be on top of this almost trivial aspect of business in a few days, maybe a week if they are all outworkers.

            Insufficient moderators and poor guidelines and rule book is far more likely.  And if there were competent guidelines and rules then why are'nt they published so that we can 'moderate' our own hubs without being unpublished ??

  2. recommend1 profile image71
    recommend1posted 5 years ago

    This is an issue that should be addressed by 'the team',  there do appear to be elements of abuse in this.

    Hubs improperly flagged due to pure ignorance of the TOS

    Hubs flagged maliciously

    I have been critical of witch-hunters who seem to be very active but with little understanding of wht they are doing and commented about it in the threads where they ask for what seems to be very basic guidance AFTER the event.

  3. LeanMan profile image81
    LeanManposted 5 years ago

    The hubs are meant to have a "human" review before they are taken down.. I don't see any links within the body of your hub apart from to other hubs... so as you say how can it be over-promotional?? There is only one other link and that is in the comments and is to a well established and relevant site.

    The flagging button should only make the moderators aware of the hub, they then have to make a decision, but the emails they send are generic in nature!

    People can make mistakes in flagging and as you say maybe someone could also be malicious, but they can't take down a hub automatically!

    I like your hubs, I commented months ago!!!!

    HP needs to get their act together over this!!!!

    1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
      Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      LeanMean, I really hope what you're saying is true.  If true -- then the person with malicious intent, who took down every single one of my hubs -- must be a moderator, right?

      I made a comment on this person's hub (about SEO) that he disagreed with.  Fair warning -- if you disagree with this person, they take it personally enough to abuse their moderator powers to remove all your hubs, even ones of the quality I mentioned above.

      I hope that this abuse of his can cause enough of a stink to get his moderator powers removed.  Lets find out.

  4. bgpappa profile image85
    bgpappaposted 5 years ago

    I am sorry that this has happened and believe there should be some mechanism to reverse this.  If it is a malicious attempt to take down a writer for whatever reason, perhaps banning that person from the site is in order???

    Hope HP fixes it soon

    1. WryLilt profile image87
      WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      A flag can't remove a hub. Only a staff member can unpublish a hub.

      1. recommend1 profile image71
        recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I am not aware of any 'pronouncement' of the team that this is true - can you point me to somewhere this is said ?

        1. WryLilt profile image87
          WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I don't have the time or energy to find an appropriate post. However it's been said repeatedly by the staff in the past that a flagged hub will NOT be taken down until viewed by a staff member.

          Some examples which pretty much say that:

          http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/72331#post1575534
          http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/68937#post1507306

          1. recommend1 profile image71
            recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I took a quick run through and no - neither of these threads say this that I could find.

            I appreciate that you are trying to help but unless you have inside information about who the moderators are and whether they are hubbers, and whether 'some' hubbers flags automatically unpublish a hub then I remain unconvinced.

            I understood that in the past certain 'long standing' hubbers could moderate the forums, and this certainly appeared to be the case in some instances of totally biased and unearned bannings.  If this is a normal tactic of HP then conferring that kind of right regarding flagging would be likely, if not probable, to deal with the many cases they claim they are snowed under with.

            1. WryLilt profile image87
              WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I will try and find a link about it. However I am 100% positive that no hub or thread can be removed without a staff member viewing it. This is why, in the past, there have been calls for volunteer international hubbers to cover the times when staff moderators aren't online - spammers take advantage of that time and post links which can stay there for hours despite repeated flaggings.

              The member in question is not a staff member - I'm friends with him on facebook so know that for a fact.

            2. WryLilt profile image87
              WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Update: is this black and white enough for you?

              http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/68719#post1501537

              1. recommend1 profile image71
                recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                ok - that'll do smile    I don't necessarily believe it though big_smile

                1. earnestshub profile image88
                  earnestshubposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  That post is now missing, and my ugly mug is up in it's place! lol

                  1. recommend1 profile image71
                    recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    To be fair to the cute and lovely, but occasionally high-handed,  Maddie this is still there:

                    "Please rest assured, a flag does not mean a Hub will automatically be taken down.  All a flag does is bring the Hub to our attention, so that a moderator can review it and unpublish if necessary."


                    but that was quite a while ago and may not be the case any more or was just incorrect, and  as "Norah pointed out about Simone, she may not know what she is doing" and Jason about himself, "is unaware of all the changes" (paraphrasing)

                    Kinda makes it hard for a simple hubber to work out what is going on when the staff admit they don't know themselves big_smile

      2. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
        Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Then I'm going to call the staff member out.  All you got to do is look at my latest hub activity ... the very last hub I posted on (about article spinning).

        He said it wasn't effective.  I said it was effective.  He mistook my disagreement and labeled me a dirty article spinner.  I don't spin articles -- I said it was effective only so that one can pull their head out of the sand and focus on the problem of getting google to stop it.

        I outlined a multi million dollar spinning operation -- for the purpose of outing it and drawing a spotlight to it so google can ban them all.  But the guy who wrote the hub (obviously a moderator) mistook me as promoting article spinning (which if it sounds like that, its called SARCASM).

        So my sarcasm in trying to draw a spotlight on, and get a multi million dollar article spinning operation banned from google, had the effect of getting every one of my quality hubs deleted by a banhappy moderator.  Go ahead and click on my profile, I'm sure everyone can figure out who it was by looking at my last posting activity.

  5. SunSeven profile image62
    SunSevenposted 5 years ago

    I think Wrylit should be a moderator for HP, if she already not is.

    Most of the time when the real forum moderators like Maddie, are absent from the forums, she answers your doubts and questions, from the HP point of view. To be honest she does a better job than Maddie, Simone, and Norah combined.

    I propose, HP absorb wrylit as VA.

    Best Regards

    1. Kevin Hemminger profile image61
      Kevin Hemmingerposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      For everyone's information, the hubs I decided to let stay here have all been reinstated.

      Except for my horrible, rotten, no good lousy hub on how to raise your hub score and article score.  I'm sure the moderator in question received a double dose of satisfaction when they banned that sorry excuse for a hub.  Everyone run to Google now and grab it from the cache while its still there, this is your last chance!

      1. WryLilt profile image87
        WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Based on the fact that the hub has only one external (non hubber) comment, I'll go with the assumption that it's not a money making hub - so I doubt anyone would be in a rush to scrape or steal it. Yes it sucks when you have a hub unpublished but sometimes there are good reasons.

      2. IzzyM profile image85
        IzzyMposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I had a look at the two hubs in question, and while the first one is fine, the second contains a link to two other articles which may or may not be against TOS, being sexual in nature. It could just be removing those links will get that hub republished?

        1. WryLilt profile image87
          WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Ah good catch Izzy. I didn't check where they went just that there weren't more than two to one external domain.

          One of the links is unpublished too...

        2. recommend1 profile image71
          recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Then surely the "elite hubber" who has the "vibrator instead of sex with your husband" hub which apparently is featured in the 'hot list' will be against the TOS ?????????

          1. IzzyM profile image85
            IzzyMposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Absolutely have to agree. Those hubs were acceptable when they were published, but rules have changed.

            1. SunSeven profile image62
              SunSevenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Then why are they sill UP?

              1. IzzyM profile image85
                IzzyMposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Because the moderators haven't got round to them yet, I imagine. Got to sort those pixelated images out first!!

  6. SunSeven profile image62
    SunSevenposted 5 years ago

    The one mistake we all do is that we consider HP as our own site, and then get sentimental about it when they have had to adapt to changes to appease google, and then please us, the users.

    Those who realized this, left.

    We, the sentimental fools , remain. smile

    They got a business to run.

    You are not running, because you dont have a business to run.

    So, run along, and all the best.

    WR

    1. IzzyM profile image85
      IzzyMposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      If I had loads of hubs unpublished like the top hubbers did, I might have left, but I haven't, so I'm staying. But I have a growing portfolio online now which I didn't have before.

    2. recommend1 profile image71
      recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      If the invitation to run was for me - then I do have a business to run - and I am waiting to see what happens here before I put any more articles on this site.

      BTW Are you related to the author of the vibrator hub, she looks a lot like you ?

      1. WryLilt profile image87
        WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Most of the "hot female Indian lady" profile pictures are actually men who admire those Indian female actors.

        1. recommend1 profile image71
          recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          the vibrator hub is the property of a hubber honoured by hubpages - who claims to be an Indian woman who looks just like Sunseven big_smile

          1. WryLilt profile image87
            WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I'm fairly certain that SunSeven is a man. And if you search the site you'll find many Indian hubbers featuring that same Indian actress. smile

            1. recommend1 profile image71
              recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Is the unlikely second language writing fake as well big_smile

              1. WryLilt profile image87
                WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Do you enjoy picking everything to pieces? I've tried my best to help you by digging up old threads and answering questions. Some things you just need to take at face value, mate.

                1. recommend1 profile image71
                  recommend1posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes I do enjoy picking pieces to find fakes, trolls, extremists, and just plain stupid who try to put up mindless political arguments.

                  In this regard the issue of hubpage mis-flagging is of particular interest as I believe that I have had two hubs 'maliciously' flagged and unpublished for around two weeks each - out of only 4.

                  And once I was banned for doing exactly what you are doing - hijacking a thread ! and I suspect that was also a biased 'hubber' with moderating rights.

                  1. WryLilt profile image87
                    WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    I don't see how I'm hijacking a thread. And I don't have any sort of moderation rights.

                    Bed time in Australia. 'Night!

                  2. Marisa Wright profile image93
                    Marisa Wrightposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Recommend1,as you know, I've been as vocal as anyone about the current situation at Hubpages - but there are enough problems without having to imagine conspiracy theories.

                    There are no Hubbers with moderating rights.  Period.  There are plenty of other explanations for why Hubs are unpublished.

                    Hubs are being unpublished by mistake.  I know, because it happened to me, and to two other Hubbers of my acquaintance.  Moderators are only human so it's inevitable it's going to happen - and probably far too often, given that they're working unreasonable hours.

                    So your Hub which was "maliciously" taken down for no apparent reason, may just be the result of a mistake.

                    Or maybe you didn't understand the rules. Many of the most indignant threads on these forums are by people who published a Hub which was always "illegal", but because HP was slack about enforcing their rules, it was never noticed.  So the Hubber was left in blissful ignorance, and got a rude shock when HP finally started applying the rules properly. Could that apply to you?

            2. SunSeven profile image62
              SunSevenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I never claimed that the profile pic is me.

              Lets leave the gender alone for the moment. How you are going to prove you are a man wrylit?

              Neither can you! smile

              1. WryLilt profile image87
                WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                I'm not a man. But I can show you the stretch marks from my last pregnancy to prove I'm a woman! big_smile

                1. SunSeven profile image62
                  SunSevenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  That wont be necessary, But I must tell you to not go out doing this often, online or offline. Ask mother smile. ( I mean showing off your stretch marks)

                  Anyway, you must've received a PM by now.

                  I hope it clarifies things, a little bit for you (at least).

                  Warm Regards

      2. SunSeven profile image62
        SunSevenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I saw a real panda a week back, I am sure you are not relatives! smile

        1. WryLilt profile image87
          WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          LOL!

          1. SunSeven profile image62
            SunSevenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Can I LOL too, please?

            1. WryLilt profile image87
              WryLiltposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Sure. Share my LoLs!

 
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