Goodbye HubPages

When I first started out here at HubPages I found the site, and the ease at which I could publish my content very inviting. It was a writer, friendly site. At least it felt that way. I never felt that my content was going to be filtered in any way. At least, if anything was filtered here, I always felt that it was within reason—though there are a few examples a few of us have run into that might put that to task a bit. Still, I never once felt that this site was not for me.

Not so anymore.

At least three of my hubs have been taken down by the site for what I would call unreasonable reasons. For example, my hub titled, "How To Clean Your Gas Grill," was pulled because it had a link and reference to having a beer while I cook my food. My hub titled, "Lottery Payout: The Dream of the Big Win," was pulled because it pertains to gambling. My hub, "Made in the USA: After the Great Recession Pt. 2," I can only assume was pulled because I made reference to The Boston Beer Company in it, which I made reference to because it is the last major beer company based in the United States.

Perhaps the mere mention of those things here will have this hub banned soon as well. Guns are mentioned as well in the terms, and so I suppose if I were to write a hub about the exercise of my 2nd amendment rights, that hub would likely be banned as well.

HubPages has lost its way in my opinion, and I simply cannot and will not participate. If we are to truly call ourselves writers then no writer I have ever spoken to has ever been for censorship in any form. This is censorship if you ask me.

Look, I've defended HubPages now and again stating that HubPages is more like a magazine or a newspaper than a writer's personal site. That means I'll concede that a site like this should have some editorial control over content. That's reasonable. It's their site and we are guests here. However, when you put the site into a context that suggests that it is a self-publishing site, then their editorial control should be very limited. It was before. It is not now. When you pull someone's hub down for the mere mention of a beer, or the mere link to a beer website, then I think you've crossed a line. You've lost your legitimacy as a writer's site. And you've lost me as contributor of content to your site.

It's a sad moment for me. I rather enjoyed my time here. I've been in good company every step of the way. Even those who disagreed with my opinions were welcome. Opposing viewpoints are the heart of any real discussion, right?

Nothing of what I have published here has been out of line. Nothing I have published here has ever warranted, in my view, being unpublished. Yet here we are. So I bid farewell to HubPages. I will be slowly gathering my things and placing them elsewhere on the web. It may take me some time, but I'll try to drop a few hints about where you can find me if you'd like to keep track of me. Thanks for being there in any event. It's been real.

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Comments 120 comments

Sneha Sunny profile image

Sneha Sunny 5 years ago from India

A lot of people got their hubs unpublished after the recent changes in hubpages... One of my hub too was unpublished when the new rules were set up but I agree that my hub was nothing but simply had some funny I don't mind that it got unpublished, not a big deal. But yes if any of my major hub was unpublished without any proper and logical reason then I too might have decided to leave the site. I think if your hubs are banned just because you mentioned beer in it then I think its too much.... I don't think any site should be that much strict that they unpublish a hub just because of mentioning or linking beer companies.. Otherwise it may be a reason that the publisher may quit publishing, like you, from the site.

I wish you all the best!! Happy publishing... :-)

fancifulashley profile image

fancifulashley 5 years ago

I would say mentioning beer or guns is a bit overboard on the content filtering. It is not like children will, by accident, stumble on a hub containing links to a beer company. Even then, this site has not be geared towards younger readers and such should not have the content filtered like the readers are minors.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Sneha, I don't think that any hub should simply be pulled without having some real moderation in play. If you want to insert a filter to flag a hub, fine. But then there should be some individual interaction between the site moderator and the content provider to determine if the link or reference is pertinent, or relevant to the piece in question. Without this, it simply makes the process of writing cumbersome, and it makes the site less than genuine. I just can't participate in that sort of an environment, and think that I have the ability to write what I want, where I want, and don't have to bother with things like these new rules and terms, which don't really make a whole lot of sense, to put my content out there for people to read and decide for themselves what it is appropriate and what is not.

It still saddens me nonetheless. I really enjoyed being a part of this site and I leave it with a bit of mixed emotion.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Fanciful, I agree. Although, these things could well be referenced in an irresponsible or inappropriate way, and I think there should be some editorial discretion there based on how the owners of this site wish for this site to be seen. Simple filtering without directly looking at a hub and determining the relevance of content is simply not fair to the content provider, not fair to the hub, nor is it fair to the readers. I think that this site may run into some difficulty going forward if it continues this practice.

Amy Becherer profile image

Amy Becherer 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Springboard, I am sorry to see you leave, but I understand. I've lost my initial exuberance. The other day my BFF was telling me about a female author she is now a big fan of. She was telling me some of the hilarious stories she has read and I caught myself asking my friend if she actually used the "F" word, like my friend had relayed. Laura said "yes, it emphasized the frustration of the author perfectly". This opened a discussion between my friend and I about how indoctrinated I've become to writing at the hub. What was I thinking? I read articles in Vogue and books that involve real, adult life and most use real, adult language. Yet, although the time here has helped my creativity, it has actually set back involving "offending" others. Now, when I read an article that is excellent enough to be published in a major magazine, I am hyper-aware and, yes, sometimes shocked at the "real" in life. A steady diet of fairytales and sugar plums is boring.

drbj profile image

drbj 5 years ago from south Florida

Jim - I understand your frustration and I will be sorry to see you and your writing talent go elsewhere. Please leave a forwarding address.:)

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Amy, very true indeed. What's missing for me is the opportunity to determine the context of something being said or linked to. If I just insert the word "penis," for example, it could have both sexual or clinical contexts. The two need to be separated out, and a simple process of filtering and a demand of "fix it or else" just doesn't work for me. Thanks for stopping in and commenting.

Spook Moor profile image

Spook Moor 5 years ago from Clonakilty

Seems somewhat odd as most of the adverts here I see are about dating sites. Wonder if that leads to anything more interesting than having a beer? profile image 5 years ago

Springboard - don't go - you're not only leaving hubpages you're leaving the friends you made if you do and they wont be able to enjoy your contributions anymore. Good luck whatever you decide!

breakfastpop profile image

breakfastpop 5 years ago

I am so sorry to hear that you are leaving. You will be missed. I also can't understand why your hubs were banned. What are theses new rules? I refer to alcohol all the time as you know. It would be wonderful if you changed your mind. We are like a family here and we need to stick together.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Drbj, I certainly will.

Spookmoor, what's even more interesting is that a hub I wrote, "Lost Wages, Nevada" has not been pulled, is clearly related to gambling as it chronicles a gambling trip, and contains ads for casinos in the Las Vegas area. Here is what my "warning" says:

"WARNING: Your hub is at risk of being identified as a HubPages Policy violation

This hub contains links that indicate that it is likely to be violation of HubPages policy. This hub may:

contain content that is illegal, promotes illegal activity or infringes on the legal rights of others

contain content regarding programs which compensate users for clicking ads or offers, performing searches, surfing websites, posting in forums, or reading emails

contain gambling or casino related content

contain content promoting the sale of prescription drugs, alcohol, tobacco related products, or weapons and ammunition

contain content related to racial intolerance or advocacy against any individual, group or organization

link to sites that have been identified as hosts of phishing or malware

link to sites that contain spun or automatically-generated content

Please verify that the content in your hub meets all the provisions of the HubPages Content Policies and Terms of Use. If you feel like the sites that you link to have been incorrectly categorized, please contact us.

The following links indicate a likely violation of one or more of HubPages Policies:

"(From Springboard in posting this portion of the comment)—the Mega Millions link was not allowed here"

Note: It is your responsibility to remove any links that match the description above. This list is provided as a courtesy; the classification of links is subject to change.

Please address the moderator set alert below before submitting this Hub for publication."

In this hub in particular it is the link to the MegaMillions lottery site that is the problem. My question is why? It is not illegal activity. It is a legitimate site. It is relevant to the article, "Lottery Payout: The Dream of the Big Win."

Perhaps I SHOULD contact the moderator and get further information as to why this has triggered the hub to be unpublished, and maybe they can explain why THIS hub was pulled, and not one clearly related to gambling, "Lost Wages, Nevada," and why LEGAL gambling activity is somehow a violation of terms?

BTW, the link to MegaMillions which was a part of this warning was caught in trying to post this comment, and it would not let me publish this comment with that link intact.

That bothers me even more.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Psychicdog, I certainly can appreciate that and am happy to learn that anybody may care. :) That is part of what made HubPages, for me, such a great place. It's as much a social networking site as it is a place to write things you know, and things you feel, and get positive or encouraging feedback from other writers about what you've written. It makes the effort of writing worthwhile. But in THIS particular case my own rights have been infringed upon, and I think the site has unleashed unreasonable terms which seem to be bent toward an agenda which I don't think has any business being promoted here. If this WERE a magazine then maybe I'd be more inclined to allow HubPages much more freedom to have much more editorial control over content. But being that they promote themselves as a self-publishing website, I think these new rules and terms have overstepped bounds, and are in violation of my right to free speech, and therefore I cannot participate in a site which does that.

I HAVE contacted the site regarding the lottery hub and I'll let you know what happens with it. I'll likely contact them regarding the other two hubs as well. But I'd prefer to focus on each one individually.

Thanks for stopping by.

kimberlyslyrics 5 years ago

Hi Springboard, wise decision I say yet suppose I am not ready to make the move as I am even busy writing a book. Anyways; Springboard ,I like you, now 29 months here, loved the interaction and freedom of any expression. It has progressively gotten worse and my hubs being pulled, ads disabled, and banning have added to what I believe is no longer what the hubpages i joined with.

I miss the challenge of raising our own bars by sheer desire knowing restrictions would not alter the end creative result. Or the process.

I believe in my case hubpages is attractive now for yes some hubbers but it has the most creative control visually that I can find.

The money put into training moderators who don't read content, just key words that are flags must be enormous.

Am I stupid to want an editor not moderator approve my content before it's published? Maybe even work with me before it's published, people are commenting I am doing back-links then BAM unpublished and sometimes fixable to their criteria which is a 4 day process?

Which brings me to dare I say, I haven't believed I am publishing here for some time-a button doesn't make it publishing, people and editors working together helping one another in a community have to be the core elements in such a mix to be published, at least I believe.

Springboard I wish you such success and have always admired you from afar. Hubpages is completely a machine now which is sad but maybe the money will drive most decision makers, regardless of consequences.

I'll be sure to find you!

peace my friend

davenmidtown profile image

davenmidtown 5 years ago from Sacramento, California

It always amazes me that the hubpage people never respond to hubs like this. I would offer this as advice. As a writer, it is sometimes necessary to conform to rules that we may not agree with, because as a write it is important that our voice be heard/read. I agree with much that you have written here, and I fully feel your frustration, but you do make a difference here and leaving will not change the rules. I say, keep writing here but save your more sensitive articles for other venues... I value as a writer and would not want to see you leave.

onegoodwoman profile image

onegoodwoman 5 years ago from A small southern town

You will, apparently be missed..........even so, go with our good wishes. Each of us, in time, will move on, and others will take our places. It is now your time for moving on.

It is the nature of such a forum.

Go,...... and be well.

Wesman Todd Shaw profile image

Wesman Todd Shaw 5 years ago from Kaufman, Texas

I've had to deal with what I thought were idiotic moderators several times.

They seemed to always love to pull my more...controversial hubs at exactly the point when Google and everyone else was really loving them.

I don't give in to them - I just keep at it with the attitude that if they didn't like what I'd said - that I'd say it a thousand times more and in a thousand more ways.

I've got hubs about beer and wine - it's absolutely true that my wine hub was persecuted by staff for absolutely idiotic reasons.

I don't know why they sometimes seem to get vendettas against people - but I can concur that they seem to ....get vendettas against certain people.

I'm not letting it bother me too much anymore, and they've chilled out considerably on my end.

Hell, they even sometimes persecute James Watkins - AS IF they don't have some shitty content to be attending too instead of some of the best folks on site.

Don't run off though - just figure out what they don't like about those hubs - and make a point of saying whatever it is that you think that they object to in a thousand more ways.

Pollyannalana profile image

Pollyannalana 5 years ago from US

Well I have felt their bias for a long long time but it is more about people here they allow to flag and run the roost you might say. I don't have ads because it wasn't worth it anyway, so now I use it for my own reason, and if you think about that, you could do that. But I am sorry whatever you decide, I know the shock and anger and am sorry to see you leave. Maybe something else will come along better than them who have more business about them and not ran by a bunch of inexperienced hubbers who it seems ... ....... so they can spend their money. I don't like anything where you can't figure what you have made and knowing you are a decent person, and your hubs are likely to be down within minutes, depending what bully is after you now. Have you read James A Watkins remarks on his Jimmy Carter hub? He was way down to 89 and I know he has so many visitors I would be surprised if he is not top at hubs whether he receives it or not and not that I am even saying he does my favorite hubs, just what I see to be true, but here that is not the way it is. Rules are random, they tell you right up front it will always be that way, there are no rules and they owe you no answers because they have none. Bullies seem to rule and they can flag me all day and you but they will never have another say on any of my hubs unless I choose to show them for the butts they are. That is my right. And now that I have used my freedom of speech let's see where that leads, lol. Really I am sorry and I would never say now is your time for moving on. I hope you will give it good thought, I have been hurt here many times in two years, but now it is for me, not anyone else.

Arlene V. Poma 5 years ago

This is your call, and for whatever reason(s) you leave HubPages, I certainly wish you the best of luck as a writer. It's all about growth. Your growth. Only you know what is best for you. I've always been a firm believer that things happen for a reason. As you close this door, I hoped many, many opportunities welcome you, and you will find your way.

arunii profile image

arunii 5 years ago from Delhi

It is your personal choice but i think handling such a big website is not a easy task that's why such big sites taking every precaution so that to comply with adsense. That's why mentioning beer and guns causing violations. I think no loss to hubpages and as well as for you if you leave !

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Kimberlyslyrics, the thing HubPages should be real careful of is losing it's REAL writers. Those are the ones who will be far less likely to allow such control over content without human editorial interaction between the written word and the person who wrote them down. If they lose THEM the value of the site will decrease dramatically, and I'd be inclined to believe that they'd likely also wind up with a new competitor on the block.

Thanks for enjoying my work. I have enjoyed yours here always as well. I wish everyone here the very best, and again, leave this space with mixed feelings, yet confident that it is the right choice.

Pop, I'll certainly be around to continue to read and comment from time to time. As far as publishing here, that's what'll end first. I can't say I won't change my mind. As I've often said here in my hubs, I consider myself to be an open-minded and fair person. I'll give HubPages the benefit of the doubt if they deserve it. Right now that's a big IF, though.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Davenmidtown, I agree with most of what you said, that is IF we were talking about an online magazine or even if the rationale, according to HubPages, for the WHY the hubs were unpublished, made sense. For example, in the article "Lottery Payout: The Dream of the Big Win," the link to the MegaMillions multi-state lottery is the link in question, while the link to the Powerball is not mentioned. In another article the link to the Samuel Adams website is the issue, while links to other beer companies are not. My entire article, "Lost Wages, Nevada," is ENTIRELY about a gambling trip to Las Vegas and there are links in there to casinos, and that Hub remains, and the gambling links don't seem to be a problem...

Maybe because big Las Vegas casinos are big Google advertisers?

My issue is really with two things here on HubPages. 1) the site claims it is a self-publishing website, and in my opinion that means the website should have VERY limited editorial control over content, and 2) the Hubs have been deemed by the site as violation of their terms based on a filter, not by any human interpretation as to the context of a link, or used term. I find this problematic on so many levels.

I WILL say that I've given some thought to using the site in certain ways, but I must tell you this situation really leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.

Like you I am surprised the HubPages staff doesn't bother to check in and see what the issue is. Their site's success is due, directly, to the efforts of folks like you and I who take the time to share our hard work with them which makes their paychecks possible.

Pollyannalana profile image

Pollyannalana 5 years ago from US

You are not the first or last to be furious with them, but apparently that does not concern them.

davenmidtown profile image

davenmidtown 5 years ago from Sacramento, California

Is there another site that you think works better? I was talking with someone last week who had all of her hubs unpublished by hubpages moderators after she updated her profile to say she was from Malaysia. I wonder how many of the total accounts listed here are actually active?

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Davenmidtown, odd. Hmmm. I don't know. It poses another interesting question though.

Onegoodwoman, I must stress I go with mixed feelings. Then again, it might be interesting to make a short term focus on opinions on what's going on here. Perhaps I'm not alone in my thinking that something is amiss here, and tightening rules can have a real negative impact on ALL our hubs. I would not be opposed at all to having my friends here also stand by me. As a community, shouldn't the community have some say in what goes on in it? Shouldn't that matter? In the end I would hope so, and I would think that the owners of this site would appreciate the concept of that. It's their site. But it's OUR community. And again, the work is all ours. They (the owners of this site) benefit because we take the time to sit down to write what we write. What say do my followers have in getting to choose to read what I write or not? Like anything, if you don't like what I write you can tune out. If at the end of the day my score falls, and my followers leave, then the message is clear what I write has no place here. If that isn't the case, and my numbers are good and my followers want me here, who is HubPages to decide EVEN IF ultimately it is their site?

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

Gosh they really pushing their luck. I am pretty upset because They kept on with my pictures being pixtel (I think I got it right). Now I got pictures kopied from Wikipedia and had them half size for the reader to give a good idea what I am writing about it. Now I had to go down to the smallest size otherwise they would have unpublished my hub. It does not give the reader a proper perspective. I think my hubs lost value which does not quite inpress the reader. Also the reader does not spend more time to look properly at the pictures which is a loss to me as well as to hub. Surely they must think a bit further.

Writing about beer and lottery winnings surely that is a every day thing today. Pelting down litres of Vodca yes I would agree. Also writing about guns I might not like it because it is so lightly used today.

Don't go I would hate to see another good writer go. There were so many already.

Randy Godwin profile image

Randy Godwin 5 years ago from Southern Georgia

Yep, who knows what to do here anymore. Some of the mods have always caused strife and this is apparently not going to change any time soon. You just can't get good help these days!

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Wesman, I really like your idea. That is, say what I want that they don't like in a thousand different ways. Dare I say the thought is genious? I think that's the one benefit writers have, that is, a command of the english language which allows us to say things in, well, many different ways. What's that old saying that there's more than one way to skin a cat? Hell, it may even be a bit fun. :) Thanks for giving me some reason to ponder sticking around just to ruffle a few feathers...something I do well by the way. lol

onegoodwoman profile image

onegoodwoman 5 years ago from A small southern town

I am not familair or privy to your politics or struggles. I do not pretend to verse that I am. Nor, do I wish to involve myself at the midnight hour,

I simply wished you well.

Yet, it is you, who wished to convey an undercurrent.

I said it before...........go and be well.

To go, you must leave behind.

This, is a proven truth,

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Polly, I've thought about turning off the ads a few times. Truth is there's another site where I use the Adsense, and it far outpays this site. Still, I feel there's no reason to NOT have ads on since, while this stuff doesn't pay the bills per se, getting a check once every quarter which is about what the average is for me is always a bit fun.

In any event, I also like a good fight. ;) That alone may sway me to not pack it in just yet.

As to your second comment, I have to tell you that as I say in my hubs many times about our power as Americans, we too have power here as THE WRITERS. If we allow HubPages to tread on us, we deserve what we get. If we stand against them and remind them of THEIR PLACE in this whole thing, and remind them that it is OUR work and not THEIRS which lines their pockets and makes this whole thing happen, then we get the keys to the place and they (the powers that be) will be out of our hair.

Anyone can write a program. But it takes writers to write a hub.

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

Pefectly put, Springboard, and I agree with you. Would you be so kind and tell me which site this is? I would be ever so grateful.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Onegoodwoman, though my departure may be kicking and screaming and certainly not without a fight. BTW, might I only point out that this site, while applauded for the most part, is really not part of the established press, but rather a good place to ply the trade. In the world of publishing, HubPages has little, if any legitimate credential.

Randy Godwin profile image

Randy Godwin 5 years ago from Southern Georgia

Addressing your last comment here--As long as there are writers willing to write for a pittance, content sites will not care much if they ruffle the feathers of their previously loyal writers. I know this because I've experienced it on other sites, often by losing my entire portfolio of articles with no compensation at all.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Arlene, I can appreciate that. Thanks for the well wishes. HubPages is but one stop along the way. It is by no means THE way. Again, a good ground to ply the trade, and therefore perhaps it serves as a stepping stone, but by no means a credentialed acheivement for having been here.

Arunii, if they want to run the site like a magazine, then they need to have the staff of one to sift through all the details and maintain reasonable editorial control. If they cannot do that then they need to distance themselves. If you want to be in business, ANY business, you cannot expect to be successful and make the excuse it's become too big to have a personal stake in what goes on. Real publishers have staffs. Real businesses do too. Neither of them run on algorythms.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Hello, Hello, I simply wish that sites like this would be what they say they are. In this case a self-publishing website. That's what they say they are, but by their actions, clearly are not. They want to call themselves a place for writers to write, but then dictate what gets written. They want to decide what gets linked to by singling out links they don't like.

The latter seems to be the only explanation. A link to The Boston Beer Company triggers an alert but a link to MillerCoors does not? A link to MegaMillions triggers an alert but a link to Powerball does not? It doesn't make sense, and until it does I'm going to have to beat my drum. :)

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

I am glad you do this because if HP listens it would help to improve it. Many people just carry on or leave. In my opinion that it not the way to do it. For good site there had to be a line and had to be kept. Only then the real writers will come abd stay.

onegoodwoman profile image

onegoodwoman 5 years ago from A small southern town

Dear Springboard.........

Point , I did say, we will all leave in our own time, and others will take our place. I keep that thought in mind in most places that I go........time changes Everything.

Something tells me that you are not 'quite' ready to go.....and I have no history with you........I can not take a fair side, at the end of the game. That is what your fans and followers will do.

I , simply, wish you well in your journey. It is the best that I can do, and it is all that I will do.

It is your choice........go and be well.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Randy, good help is EXTREMELY hard to find. :) As to your second comment, from my experience writing has always been for a pittance. Those who make an actual living at it, and especially those who make an ESPECIALLY good living at it are few and far between if you were to take a percentage. Writers write because they must, and I think most are happy to do so whatever the compensation, even if that compensation is zero. But as I said, there are not many writers I've met who enjoy censorship in any form. Again, if this were a magazine site and I was submitting a piece for pay, and the magazine editors told me no, they don't want to publish it, I'd take my lumps and try harder next time to write something more salable. But this site is NOT a magazine site, and therein lies my complaint—AND of course there's the question of the part of it that just doesn't make any sense as to why certain links and not others? Why certain hubs which pertain to the same thing and not others? It's a big question mark for me.

Thanks very much for stopping in.

Hello, I certainly will. I'm still working out the details of the 'where.' It's a question as to whether I want to piggyback on someone else's site like I've been doing here and on Blogspot, or if I want to go it alone. I will definitely keep everyone posted, however.

I should only add, I may just stick around after all, at least for now. The PEOPLE here would be what would keep me. Certainly not the HubPages team.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Onegoodwoman, I am tending to lean toward sticking around. My followers have been rather supportive, and I can only be appreciative about that, and happy about that. HubPages has certainly stirred my pot. They've gone somewhere they really should have no business going. But like Hank Williams uses the power of his song to communicate his concerns when he feels people are on the wrong path, I have the written word to do it, and I don't think beating my drum here ABOUT HubPages breaks any Terms of Use. At least not to my knowledge. So here we are for whatever it's worth.

Besides. As my profile suggests. I love a good argument, and with this I seem to have one. :)

jfay2011 profile image

jfay2011 5 years ago

Ive noticed that they don,t want you to use swear words so i have to go back tomorrow and fix my fiction. So i have to take out the word dick a few times.

teriyaki profile image

teriyaki 5 years ago from Croatia

Hmm, I've got the word "cock" in a hub of mine, but it's a historical quote pertaining to a male chicken... Am I and my cock to be stomped upon?

On a serious note, dude, if they do censor your hubs its their prerogative and their shame. Their loss, in short. Be smart, open a Squidoo account, move the "offending" hubs and backlink the... excrement out of the whole shebang.

There's no reason to loose all your hard earned points, followers and existing backlinks.

Cheers and keep smilin!

PegCole17 profile image

PegCole17 5 years ago from Dallas, Texas

Interesting Springboard. This is starting to remind me of other sites where this kind of unpublishing stuff surfaced. Sorry to hear about this happening to you and hope you'll stay here. There must be creative ways to work around the restrictions.

smcopywrite profile image

smcopywrite 5 years ago from all over the web

i am so sorry to see a writer of your caliber going out of the hubpages arena. thank you for the pleasure of reading your content here at hubpages.

AmaTainted profile image

AmaTainted 5 years ago from Texas

i just found you and you are going away... ~sigh~. sorry to read that your hubs were in violation. i truly do not understand there censoring. you can post poems about death and suicide that have dark pics with them but you cant talk about helping another in a life or death situation... go figure? like JFAY2011 i write erotica. i cannot post anything here without getting flagged but i see others have made successful post. again, go figure...

sorry you are going away but i will try to read as much as i can before you disappear. ;)

chipsball profile image

chipsball 5 years ago from Houston, Texas USA

Springboard...there are many issues I would not chose to write and publish on Hubpages. Choosing instead to write and publish elsewhere. Keep writing on Hubpages...continue to get your thoughts out. No one can in fact censor's like holding water in your hand...forever...impossible.

jenniferrpovey profile image

jenniferrpovey 5 years ago

This made me do some research, and you're blaming the wrong party.

It is not Hub Pages that has the 'no beer' policy. It's Google AdSense.

It appears that the AdSense content policy is a lowest common denominator 'don't include anything that might offend anyone' thing, because last I checked, alcohol consumption is legal, but the temperance people ARE still out there.

James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago

I hate to see you go, my friend. I have always enjoyed your writings and our interactions here on HubPages. I haven't had my work taken down but I have had quite a few demonetized.

One called "ACLU" is demonetized because it discusses a Supreme Court case where the ACLU defended the right of child pornographers to ply their trade.

I had one demonetized because of comments total strangers made. I deleted the offending comments but HubPages refused to monetize the Hub again. It was by far my most viewed Hub of all time.

family2010 profile image

family2010 5 years ago

I am just starting here with Hub pages and I am truly sorry to see talented writer like yourself leaves on issues that has no significant effect with the context of the publication. If they have started with you after being a hubber for almost 2 years, so what would happen with me and others who are new to the site??

Good Luck and Never stop writing

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Jfay, there's another example of why it's so important to have a human element. In writing it's all about context. You can have a filter to find questions, but then you have to have humans to decipher the answers. IS it inflammatory? IS it aggregious? IS it inappropriate? IS it out of context? Part of the problem is that the people who run this site have never been in the publishing world, and so they don't have a clue about editing and publishing—they are website designers who happened to create a self-publishing website.

Teriyaki, I've been considering something along those lines. I'm happy to have received the support I have since this whole thing happened. As for the hubs that have been taken down, yes. I'd like to take them elsewhere. I've already made it clear to HubPages that I will not change a single word, nor remove a single link. Thanks for stopping in, and again, I appreciate the support.

Mark Pitts profile image

Mark Pitts 5 years ago from United States

I read this hub with some anxiety. I have long wanted someway to just have my work read by people I didn't know, and thought this (Hub Pages) was it. Now, I think I will have to look further. I am a father, a professional, happily married, and go to church. But a story is a story, and can only be "fixed" so much before it isn't yours anymore.

davenmidtown profile image

davenmidtown 5 years ago from Sacramento, California

Mark: If the story needed to be fixed by hubpage standards it probably was not yours to begin with. Those kinds of violations are usually because of copied work. I have to deal with people "using" my work without my permission a lot. If you came here to write.. then write.

whoisbid profile image

whoisbid 5 years ago

A large percentage of my questions get deleted and there is no good reason for it. Some of the questions were very popular and I had Twitter friends come and answer them but a moderator decided to delete it. Hubpages can't do this forever and these kinds of moderators who destroy blogs will get caught eventually.

htodd profile image

htodd 5 years ago from United States

That's really sad

SanXuary 5 years ago

I never came here to have anything published but I have no idea what they even want or consider to be in their interest. I imagine it is nothing but an idea shop for authors who use their own ideas some where else but that is expected. The idea is that maybe you our good enough to become one of those writers or they really do not care and intend to profit from some other extension. Perhaps the people running this sight might be able to elaborate more on what it is they hope to profit from. A writer has to have a target audience and with-out one they are deciding if you missed the target. Getting up-set about it is pretty useless since everything is about profit and using others to achieve it. I am not an employee just a writer trying something new and wondering what this stuff is even about. If any of my stories get interest great if not I really do not care.

fpherj48 profile image

fpherj48 5 years ago from Beautiful Upstate New York

This is very sad. I am rather new to Hubpages and had no idea that this even occured.....the pulling and/or banning of hubs based on mentions of booze, gambling or guns, etc. In fact, I'm shocked! Obviously I need to read about the "rules," or discover what these issues are! To have an excellent author feel the need to leave is unacceptable. I wish you much luck and success, whatever you do in life. Bless you, Springboard..

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

PegCole, I may, and I think there ARE creative ways around the restrictions. Wesman Todd Shaw reminded me of something very true about writers. We can say one thing a thousand different ways that all mean exactly the same thing. :)

Smcopywrite, thanks for the compliments, "writer of your caliber." I certainly appreciate that. I have been very impressioned upon by the support of all of my fellow hubbers. I think they (my fellow hubbers) are far more important than any of the staff here at HubPages, or any of their cumbersome rules, and it definitely is swaying a decision to hang on a little while longer. I am a follower of many great writers here too, and I don't want to miss out either. Thanks very much for stopping in and for your confidence and support.

Pollyannalana profile image

Pollyannalana 5 years ago from US

Well..glad you are still here. Being here as long as I have been, same as you, I have slowed way down. For about a year or more I did about a hub a day, it really took my time and I was read and accepted well and to get so near a year and find out I had a dime made, don't tell me that is just me and my writing. I would guess I have taken down 500 hubs if not more and I have had time now to look around and some people who are very high and probably making the most money I type in some of what their title is about and am astonished at what I find. That really gets me too since I have several times been made to close a hub and redo it until it suits them sounding like no one elses and believe me, no one sounds like me! The others I find typing a search have been written by ppl months ago usually and they are doing nothing anymore. But as I say I don't worry about it anymore. It will all come out in the I just try too have fun with it and am doing other things I think will start paying off real soon.

CJStone profile image

CJStone 5 years ago from Whitstable, UK

You say: "It's their site and we are guests here." Well I disagree with that. It's our site. They provide the means of publishing, but we do all the work, and we give them our content for free, and for that they take a cut of our earnings. It's not like a magazine. A magazine will commission you and pay you. In that case, they have every right to argue with the content because they are paying you for it. In HubPages' case, they do no more than allow us to use their software. Not sure why you are being censored. The examples you give seem very petty to me. Good luck with finding a site that appreciates what you are doing for them.

jenniferrpovey profile image

jenniferrpovey 5 years ago

Because if Google sees a lot of violations of the *AdSense* terms of service (which her hubs did violate), they might decide not to allow HubPages to host Adsense ads any more...and then we would ALL stop making nearly as much money. I think even the HubPages ad program is somewhat integrated into Adsense.

They are running a business here and they are not censoring at all beyond what's needed not to get people's AdSense accounts disabled. Or, worse, their own.

blake4d profile image

blake4d 5 years ago from Now Rising Out of Phoenix Arizona Earthlings

I think you have to ride out storms anywhere you are going to write. It is more important to pick battles with those you stand beside, but not in conflict. Good luck with all of your points of view. Keep On Hubbing. Blake4d

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Ama Tainted, thanks for the support. One thing I have always said here is that no matter what, one's writing always stays with them. HubPages is but one place in a million where one can present their work. Whatever happens to or WITH HubPages, the writers won't lose. HubPages will.

Chipsball, love the way you put that. :) Thanks for that.

Jennifer, if it were Google to blame, then the policy should be to demonetize the hub. Not unpublish it. Again, the hubs in question are not inflammatory, inappropriate, and do not promote any activity. I am also strongly against HubPages pulling anything without having read it first. If they want to be editors and start controlling content, then they can't do that without determining and UNDERSTANDING context. I used an example earlier about the word 'penis.' It could be used in both a good and bad way depending on the context of its use. The word itself being any sort of trigger that automatically forbids its use would be silly and unfair, and that's sort of what the case is here with regard to the links in question.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

James Watkins, as have I. Would it be wrong of me to stick around just to be annoying as hell? lol

Family2010, what it means for newer hubbers is the same as it means for older ones. You can always take your writing with you. One thing that is significantly different about your writing and HubPages is that your ability to write is forever and HubPages is nothing more than the latest place to put some of it.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Mark, very true. And like I've said, if the site wants any editorial control they need to act like editors and read any material that falls into question. Paul Deeds has told me they can't read the bulk of hubs. I say then that they cannot have editorial control over content because CONTEXT is essential to be determined in every situation when it comes to writing. If they (the creators of this site) had spent any time in the writing business (which I've spent most of my life in or around it), they'd understand the importance of CONTEXT over simple content. I don't know Paul's actual background, but I'd find it hard to believe he's been around actual publishing before based on what's going on around HubPages of late.

Whoisbid, I think what Paul Deeds and the other creators/moderators of this site are forgetting is that they benefit from the content WE provide. Without our efforts I am not certain that the work of Paul Deeds and the others could stand up. So really their revenue stream and the success of their business is directly a result of the efforts of others to provide the content which attracts real readers, and especially the organic traffic which is what they're after. If they are going to aggravate the content providers (the writers) then they'll have more crickets than hubs, and some of the hubbers here will probably come up with something of their own which will be everything that HubPages is not, and better. They need to be very careful about one thing that is a severe thorn in the side of anyone who puts words on paper for others to read, and that's censorship. It will be the death knell for HubPages to be sure.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Htodd, I agree. It is. Unfortunately so. Thanks for stopping by.

San, what I like about HubPages, and why I continue to write here despite it all, is the community. The followers. It IS a little bit of you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours here, but I don't think that detracts from the worthiness of writing here, publishing here, or even attracting an audience for "other writing endeavors" here. The feedback on ideas and the exchange on the issues is something that makes, to me, the whole process of writing and sharing here worth every bit of effort. This is a fantastic community of some fantastic people at HubPages. I may disagree with the governence of the site and the people who govern it. I may find myself a bit frazzled when I find that some of my work is deemed not worthy by the staff, but I take some consolation in the general idea that I am not here for them. I am here for me, and for those who enjoy reading what I write. In the end, and for now, I think that's all that matters.

Peggy W profile image

Peggy W 5 years ago from Houston, Texas

Hi Springboard,

Thankfully you must have decided to stay because this hub has some newer ones above it. I was just curious as to why you would say goodbye to HubPages. I have some hubs about wineries we have visited and have not received any negative alerts. Perhaps it is because I did not put a link in to actually buying the wine...only wine accessories?

I'm glad you are not leaving. I enjoy reading your hubs although generally I only have time to go to ones who comment on mine and then I comment on theirs. Please stay and keep writing!

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

I was marked down with my hub about Tenko and the next one Wallenstein being duplicates. Naturally, everything was written about once. According tho that rule what can you write about. Not even the flee. An article exists. I am really upset. I wrote an email to team but didn't an answer for the first one and a very broad one the second time because there is now answer. Both hubs were written as a tribute at a time of remebrance. Now I have to take them down or they will be taken down and this is a insult to them and to me.

Dolores Monet profile image

Dolores Monet 5 years ago from East Coast, United States

HI, looks like you are still here! Anyway, are you sure that the reason they took down your hub was due to the mention of beer? I know there are some links they don't like. Anyway, I have yet to be smacked by HP, but I feel like it's their site and they can do what they want. If I really want to create something all my own, without someone overseeing it, or whatever, I'll just write a blog!

IntimatEvolution profile image

IntimatEvolution 5 years ago from Columbia, MO USA

Don't go. Quitting isn't the right way either. Write articles that are within their boundaries and i then suggest you start a personal blog on blogger for your lottery and beer articles. That way you are still earning money either way. I have a personal blog of my own and that is where all my racy hubs go if hubpages thinks they are too adult. I submit them to Google for approval and when they are okay'd I publish them on my own site where i have Google adsense ads their too. There is more than one way to skin a cat, as the old saying goes.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Fpher, my best suggestion is to write what you know, write what you feel, write what you want, and let the cards fall where they may. As I've said in some of the other hubs comments about this issue, I won't allow the process to become cumbersome just because someone here in the staff might see fit to pull something down. I'll write it and see what happens. If what I write is pulled, I'll just put it somewhere else. :)

Pollyanna, I think that's the best way to go when it comes to writing here, and I'll just reiterate what I said to Fpher about just writing what you want and letting the cards fall where they may. Things have certainly changed at HubPages and I think not for the better as far as the behind the scenes goes. One thing that has not changed, and it's a large part of why I'm still here, is the strong sense of community and the support of the readers. That makes all the difference, and for now makes up for all that's wrong with the site. Thanks for stopping and do keep hubbing...with a smile. :)

CJ, you're spot on, and it's a point I tried to make to Paul Deeds and apparently failed. I told him essentially that if the site wants to be a magazine then fine. Call it that and then act as editors.

By the way, that would likely mean they'd have to pay us too? Ahem.

Editors can determine not just content, but CONTEXT which is the key. According to what Paul told me they don't want to be editors but they want editorial control. Hmmm. Funny that from my perspective. You are exactly right when you say it's our work, our effort, and they get to benefit from it. I don't think Paul Deeds and the others who run this place ever stepped foot in a real publishing house, or even sent a single manuscript to a real publisher as an aspiring writer, and that's precisely why I think they don't get it.

Thanks for stopping in.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Jennifer, for one thing my hubs (and I have looked deeper into it) contextually do not violate anything to do with Adsense. What HubPages has done is sort of a CYA on all counts ill-respective of common sense. You oversimplify the matter. I will state again, just so that we are all clear here, that many, many, many ads to Las Vegas casinos are advertised on Google Adsense. Casinos, if you may not be familiar with them are businesses too. They generate a lot of money. AND they advertise through Google, and you bet Google lets them. Oh yeah, and one other thing about those casinos. Shhh...people gamble in them.

A link to a lottery website is wrong why?

Let's take a closer examination of what Paul Deeds said in response to my very simple question of why one link and not another. It was, in another hub, a link to the Boston Beer Company that was the one they must have "reviewed." Interesting that they had not yet reviewed Guinness? Budweiser? MillerCoors? I mean, of course they haven't gotten to those yet. They're just the LARGEST breweries in the world.

I think Paul Deeds, with all due respect to him as well, simply was talking out of his ass.

If what Paul Deeds said had an ounce of truth to it, or common sense for that matter, the FIRST links to hit the list would have been the most obvious ones.

jenniferrpovey profile image

jenniferrpovey 5 years ago

Yes, because Google applies that policy only to publishers, not to advertisers. Publishers can then control what ads appear on their sites. It appears to be all about allowing both sides to determine what they are associated with. Advertisers can't control what sites they appear on, as far as I can tell.

I'm not saying it's fair, but that IS how I read the policy.

carol3san profile image

carol3san 5 years ago from Hollywood Florida

Sorry to hear that you are leaving. Maybe you should re-think your plan. The more you work publish hubs, the more exposure you will get. And you can use that to your advantage one day.

icountthetimes 5 years ago

Thanks for sharing your hubpages experience. I'm new here and at least I now have an idea of what topics to avoid. It's sad that you've been censored in such a way though, and that you feel that the excitement of being part of hubpages has gone away for you.

wanzulfikri profile image

wanzulfikri 5 years ago from Malaysia

This is so sad. I am still new and I didn't knew things like this could happen.

MikeNV profile image

MikeNV 5 years ago from Henderson, NV

Hubpages is in business to do one thing - Make money for Hubpages.

Due to our economy there is currently a nearly unlimited supply of people willing to work for pennies an hour. The reality is not business could hire them legally for this kind of pay... but Hub Authors are not employees. So they can work for as little as they want.

Everything Hubpages does is a reaction to Google... Google is the primary income source.

I've looked at the numbers and in my best estimation HubPages is pulling $5,000 to $10,000 per day in Adsense Income. And there are only a handful of people to divide that money amongst.

So the reality is what they are doing in censoring hubs has nothing to do with you... they could care less about you or any other writer, it has every thing to do with Appeasing the Google Gods to keep the money flowing.

So what is the solution? I can tell you that unless you want to do your own thing, run your own sites, there is no real alternative.

Squidoo pages don't rank without a ton of extra effort, Hubpages can ranks with little effort.

No one is ever going to make any real money on Hubpages, but it has other value.

So that's the way it is. I too think they are way overstepping their bounds.

I had a couple of hubs automatically unpublished because I was removing DEAD LINKS and that threw up a red flag?

I suppose they would rather have DEAD LINKS?

So I am no longer going to remove links from my hubs... just leave them be.

Any way I agree with the premise of your article. I promote Electronic Cigarettes online... big profits, it's amazing how many sites outright ban the promotion. They are WATER VAPOR And flavoring. Seriously. The tie to Tobacco is reason to not allow them? It's just plain stupid.

And God forbid anything be even remotely related to Porn in any way... lingerie, movies, anything.

You know who makes the REAL money in Porn? Companies like Time Warner, General Motors, Marriott Hotels. You would be Shocked at who profits from the distribution of Porn. But these companies all work "Behind the scenes" so as to not tarnish their public image.

This is the state of the country in which we live. It is certainly NOT the land of the free. And CENSORSHIP Is Rampant.

Case in Point. The Media Refuses to report anything Positive about Ron Paul... or anything at all for that matter.

I wish you luck in whatever you do. Because what America Needs is more people like you, unwilling to put up with the Status Quo.

eye say profile image

eye say 5 years ago from Canada

can you post a link to your blog sites on your profile so we can follow you before you disconnect?... sorry to see you go, being in the media biz and watching the censorship lie for 30 years i can understand your position ...

Jamie Brock profile image

Jamie Brock 5 years ago from Texas

I am sorry to hear of anybody leaving HubPages but I certainly understand why you feel the way you do. Disabling hubs just for the mention of beer seems a bit excessive to me. Whatever you decide to do, best of luck to you!

Brett.Tesol profile image

Brett.Tesol 5 years ago from Thailand

From what you have said, I can see why you might be feeling fed up with the censorship. I understand there is a need for some censorship (as they probably want the content to be suitable for all ages), but to disable a hub for mentioning having a beer seems extreme. Sorry to hear that another upper member is leaving!

alphagirl profile image

alphagirl 5 years ago from USA

Why can't a message come up that says, content may be in violation due to xyz, Please comment as we appreciate your input. If Hubbers and readers could vote/comment, then it would at least give the author a fair chance to know if their content is wrong for Hub pages and better posted elsewhere.

I did not know Hub pages censored like!

Ralph Deeds profile image

Ralph Deeds 5 years ago

Join the group. I've had more than 100 hubs unpublished for a variety of reasons, especially from among those published during the first couple of years after Hubpages started up. Most of them were pretty thin. The standards for what is acceptable have tightened up a lot since the early days. In some ways the rules are stricter than those for ordinary magazines and other family publications. Hubpages may be going a bit overboard on the family viewing issue. There's no doubt that a fair number of active, loyal hubbers have been turned off by having their hubs labeled "substandard."

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Blake4d, so far I've decided to stick around. I'll leave this battle to wither and die...this time. But if it happens again I'm not sure how much longer I can faithfully write for an organization that does not appreciate the process of writing, nor the writers who provide the revenue for the owners. I especially cannot support a site which does not have consistent rules; I'm still locked into this idea that it makes no sense when Paul Deeds told me that if other links have not been triggered on the same topics it's because they have not been reviewed yet. Not to beat a dead horse, but again, they did not review the two largest beer companies Budweiser and MillerCoors links, but DID review the Boston Beer Company? Sorry, but his answer still doesn't wash and I'm not falling for it.

Peggy, yes so far I've decided to stick around. As for the time to comment on others hubs I definitely know where you're coming from. These days I have very limited time to spend. Though I do frequent certain hubbers irrespective of whether or not they comment on any of mine simply because I like what they have to say. I always wish I had more time to follow up on everyone, that's for sure.

icountthetimes 5 years ago

I'm glad you've decided to stick around, Springboard. Let's hope that hubpages listens to the concerns of loyal members such as yourself. If people are wary that their contributions are going to be overly scrutinised, that's not a healthy situation.



I agree with you. One thing though, this is not a magazine. Each author is responsible for his or her articles!! Articles should not be censored!

Have you noticed that when one writes on a controversial issue, it lends itself to an outcry from others to censor you! It happened to me already. If you write about nice fluffy subjects like flowers, decorations and the like, nothing thought invoking about the reality of the world then they like that!

I am lucky, I write for a publication on a regular basis. I write here if and when I have time.

If a blog site wants to be true to the FIRST AMENDMENT of this constitution then they should let articles be! END OF STORY!

ruthclark3 profile image

ruthclark3 5 years ago from Arkansas, USA

I don't even know you and happened upon this hub just after I signed in. I have not even published my first hub yet and already I am regretting not knowing you!! You must go where your conscience leads you but I will have lost a potential friend and many good hubs to read. Please leave a forwarding address. I, for one, would like to read more of your hubs, posts, whatever, wherever.

ruthclark3 profile image

ruthclark3 5 years ago from Arkansas, USA

Great! Thanks.

BAndBeast profile image

BAndBeast 5 years ago from Two hours from Dallas

I had to deal with it too. One of my hubs I chose to remove after getting two violation warnings of it being a duplicate. If the moderators checked, they would have found out that "Fight for ramp an uphill battle" was removed from Yahoo 360 and

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Hello, I would simply look for another place to post them. I've been trying to find some sites that are similar to HubPages. One I'm looking into is Helium. Not sure it's exactly what I'm looking for but we'll see. Having any hub subjected to non-human intervention is a no-no, even worse is when you can't even get much more than a generic response.

Delores, technically it was link related. But I still can't make sense of the post Paul Deeds wrote which said basically that some links have not yet been reviewed. I only find that perplexing because a link to (and I hate to beat a dead horse) MegaMillions lottery site was the issue due to gambling, apparently had been reviewed and was deemed a no-go, but links to Las Vegas Casinos go unscathed. Likewise a link to the Boston Beer Company got reviewed apparently, but NOT MillerCoors? Not Anheuser Bush? Wouldn't they be the FIRST to be reviewed? It still perplexes me.

jenniferrpovey profile image

jenniferrpovey 5 years ago

Helium has the distinct downside of NOT putting your byline on your articles. It also doesn't allow comments. Which is why I rarely write there. It DOES have the advantage that you can sometimes get a dollar of upfront pay.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Intimat, I like your way of thinking. More than one way to skin a cat is right. There are a lot of places one can put their stuff—thankfully we're not limited to one. :)

VerbalHoney 5 years ago


RedSturtz profile image

RedSturtz 5 years ago from A land far far away....

Honestly, this hub is more of a whinge about things Hubpages cannot change than a comment on the real issues. Guns and alcohol are things that can get you in trouble with Adsense, which is why Hubpages has to enforce those rules strictly.

What about the other things Hubpages has done over the last 6-10 months, such as banning a huge range of affiliate links and changing all the affiliate earnings so we are forced to go through Hubpages for Amazon/eBay etc and not get full information on earnings anymore.

CZCZCZ profile image

CZCZCZ 5 years ago from Oregon

It certainly is no fun having a hub unpublished. Just make the adjustments required or post somewhere else for those stories, but thanks for the reminder to keep posts in hubpages according to the ever changing policies of hubpages. Hope you dont take all your writing away from hubpages.

jonta profile image

jonta 5 years ago from Bangkok

I think that sucks. I live in a country where there is no freedom of speech or print and censorship like that upsets me. Its there loss your leaving.

sharewhatuknow profile image

sharewhatuknow 5 years ago from Western Washington

My hub was pulled after I stated how many points I had accrued in 5 years to redeem for gift cards. I was told it was too overly promotional and cleaned up/deleted half my post. Then it was still labeled "substandard." I read the FAQs and that meant spelling errors, syntax and punctuation that would make it very difficult for other hubbers to follow what I stated...

Hmmm, ok.

I just deleted it!

Now if any one reading my few other hu

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Carol3san, it is certainly something I have given consideration to. When I sat down and really gave it some thought, I had to conclude I am at no great loss to stay. And again, the overwhelming support has been great as well. I can't walk away from that even if HubPages did get my panties in a bit of a bunch in the short term. It made for a couple productive hubs if nothing else in that it engages a conversation perhaps the owners of this site need to pay close attention to.

Icountthetimes, I would caution you against trying to write for the SITE. Write for yourself first. Pick topics based on what you know, and what you are passionate about. Those are going to mark your best works. If the site later on feels something isn't right with what you've written, let them do the work of making that determination. Don't they (the owners) need to earn their keep as well? WE are doing the bulk of what generates their dime here. A writer should never try to write around things. It makes for a clunky read, and it makes the task of writing non-fluid and cumbersome. Just read a little bit of that SEO garbage and you'll know what I'm talking about.

Wanzul, as most communities go, there are always a few things about it that take away from it being perfect. Sometimes it's the guy two doors down who never mows his grass. Or perhaps it's the biker bar on the corner that always get a little too roudy. Communities are never 100% perfect and I don't expect this one to be either. All one can do is focus on THEIR OWN contribution to the community and let the cards fall where they may. If the community becomes such that you simply can't live with it anymore, then it's time to leave. For me right now I think I just have a couple of neighbors I wish would keep off my grass. :)

RGNestle profile image

RGNestle 5 years ago from Seattle

I find it hard to believe (at least I wish it were hard to believe) that such innocuous things as beer consumption and beer makers would lead to a Hub being pulled, yet the GAY PORN STARS Hubs displaying their (semi-dressed) pictures and listing their Bios are still up and appearing in the side bar of my Hubs against my will.

Maybe, like Netflix and Bank of America, they will wise up and retract the unnecessary and unwanted changes to their end user guidelines.

Maybe would suit you better. Whatever you decide, I wish you the best!

Chef Joel profile image

Chef Joel 5 years ago from International Chef

I could never published a hub about recycling electronics, for no reason, substandard...i really thought this website to be better, but since reading a lot of hubs seems, like hubpages just like hubs about fruits, dogs and nonsense.

ratnaveera profile image

ratnaveera 5 years ago from Cumbum

I think we don't need to misunderstand about Hubpages. Our Hubpages team have recently made some changes to convince Google to get back previous level of traffic. However, some of my Hubs yet to get the grace of Google.

gconeyhiden profile image

gconeyhiden 5 years ago from Brooklyn, N.Y.C. U.S.A

hey springboard, look at that. you got a heap of positive comments your last hub was good. well I didn't read any of your other hubs but your last one hit the spot. As a new writer here I applaud your character. Truth is they seem to want Martha Stewart pop tarts kind of know the kind of writing that will pay off for them at hubs. Well I salute you. At least your leaving with your brains intact.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

MikeNV, all excellent comments. I think at the end of the day it comes down to knowing what your own worth is, and sort of using that worth to the best of your own ability. If that means publishing on HubPages despite it all, then so be it. If it means HubPages gives me the final boot at some point, I can sport my good somewhere else. Will it be as easy? Probably not? As lucrative? Probably not. As easy to market and promote and actually get real readers in? Again, probably not. But do I like to write? Yes. Do I believe I'm at least proficient in writing? Yes. Do I think I can attract readers outside of HubPages? Again yes. But right now, at least, I've decided to stick around if for no other reason than to focus on the writing part and just let HubPages find what they don't like in their own good time and deal with each individual situation as it arises.

I like the little money on the side. For them it's ALL about money. For me it's about the process, and that's good enough for me.

BUT, in ANY event, I will not stand down JUST for the sake of any pittance of compensation.

studentart profile image

studentart 5 years ago

yeah, its the nature of forum. and also its the time to moving on....ok.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Eye say, well so far I've decided to stick around. It's a decision that came out of support from my fellow hubbers. But I will still be branching out as well, and anything not published here will ultimately be linked either through hubs or my profile. Thanks for stopping in.

Jamie, it was actually the link to a beer website on that particular one that they had issue with. It's still screwy considering Paul Deed's explanation as to why THAT link and not others along the same lines—which is problematic in and of itself. But neither here nor there. It's the way they want to run their show. I'm powerless to stop them. All I can do is display my thoughts for all hubbers to see and discuss here. I'm sure they'll pay SOME attention, and if they want to stay in business and continue to attract good content and providers, they'll have to change their tune a bit. There is an old saying in business, and something I DO NOT think these guys who run this site are familiar with, and that is that it takes YEARS to build a loyal customer, but only seconds to lose one. They need to keep that thought in mind. I've read their work and it wouldn't stand on its own, so they need US to keep the gravy train rolling.

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gconeyhiden 5 years ago from Brooklyn, N.Y.C. U.S.A

hi again springboard, so your going and coming coming and going....hey your well named..that's just what a spring board does!!!

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Brett, unless they want to call themselves a magazine, and then structure it as such—such as having editors—I think they need to be out of the business of determining any links or content arbitrarily leading to unpublishing. What I think ought to happen is for sensible people to review hubs and determine the context of content and relevance of links as they relate to the content. If the link and content are relevant and contextually make sense, then regardless of any references in the hub, the hub should stay.

Alphagirl, I couldn't agree with you more. The COMMUNITY, not the site moderators and owners should be able to determine what is and what is not appropriate content. That community would include the readers outside the site. Let people decide what they want and tailor the site's content to what the collective thought is. ESPECIALLY if they (the owners and moderators) don't want to also read the content in question or review the relevance of links. Thanks for stopping in.

Ralph, the problem HubPages has is that it is trying to make "blanket" rules that cover every possible scenario. Just like the government overcomplicates things by trying to "cover all the bases," so does, and has, this site. As I said before, the more cumbersome they make the process of writing, the less writers will be attracted here to write. In the end, no matter how it gets sliced up, and no matter what great intentions the owners and moderators have for this site, they will lose in the end because of what they are doing. It's enough to spend time writing in the first place for a pittance. If what we write is constantly being yanked down without some personal and individual review that makes sense, writers simply won't bother to waste their time here.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Icountthetimes, no it's not. And I hope that THEY, the powers to be, realize that as well. Somehow in the back of my mind I don't necessarily think that they do because they are a) really not writers, and b) really not businessmen. So, I think looking at it from that perspective means that they may actually wind up destroying their own great efforts just by not truly understanding the dynamics of both writing and running a business. Of COURSE they believe they are doing things that are in the best interest of their business. But if their product is the work that the writers provide, and they make the process too cumbersome and restrictive, they will go away to write somewhere else, and all the rules and interests won't matter because there'll be no one left to work within them.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Observer, that has been a standing theme of mine through this issue that HubPages is not a magazine. Paul Deeds has said they, the powers that be, do not have time to go through and read all of the hubs that get published to determine whether their content is appropriate etcetera—which by the way of course disqualifies them as editors AND as a magazine which have to read EVERY SINGLE WRITTEN WORD that goes into the final product. Not only do editors often have to read all of the material, but they have to check for syntax and grammar as well, and of course there are numerous other duties of editors and editorial staff such as copywriting, and reviewing photos and magazine formatting and the list goes on. Unless they want to do all of the things that magazine editors must do, then they cannot and should not have any editorial control whatsoever for the content that writers provide here. They claim to be a self-publishing website. That means writers write, readers read, and overall readers can decide how they feel about the content, and IF something is deemed inappropriate then they can send a message to the staff and they should be able to review it on a one-on-one basis for context and to determine whether the reader who makes the beef has a legitimate one. Thanks very much for stopping in.

Ruthclark, I am very glad you have liked what you've found so far. Having readers enjoy what I write is part of what makes writing worth the effort. As for my stint on HubPages, so far I have decided to stick around, so we'll just have to see where that leads. I do also occassionally write blogs at and I will be posting links to those more often here as well, AND I've been looking for other places to write similar to HubPages. It's a work in progress but I'll definitely post links. Thanks for finding me.

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ruthclark3 5 years ago from Arkansas, USA

Thank YOU, Springboard. I have bookmarked your blog as well, and look forward to reading more.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

BAandBeast, another glaring example why filters and flags just won't do it. These guys need to be actively engaged in running the site for this very reason. Thanks for stopping by and happy hubbing.

Jenniferpovey, hmmm, your description of Helium may cause me to rethink that. Thanks for letting me know about their practices.

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BAndBeast 5 years ago from Two hours from Dallas

They supposedly changed their TOS today. Can't say I understand it all though.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Red, I agree there are other issues. But I still stand by my argument that the rules don't make sense EVEN AS they apply to Google Adsense rules considering that NOT ALL links are in question pertaining to certain subjects. And by the way, guns are legal in this country. Killing people is not. Nor is using them in crimes such as armed robbery. SELLING guns is also legal. The distinction needs to be drawn. Gambling is only a problem for those who have gambling problems. And again gambling doesn't cause problem gambling, problem gamblers do. Gambling is legal in this country. And while we're on the subject specifically about gambling and Google Adsense rules, AGAIN I have to reiterate that links to ONE, not all lottery websites is subject to the rules, but NOT ONE SINGLE casino website link is?

As I said before, conceptually and theoretically it all sounds good. It all looks good on paper. But if you read between the lines it doesn't add up. It doesn't make sense.

Furthermore, if this is truly a writer's site, and a SELF PUBLISHING site moreover, censorship of ANY kind has no place here.

I have made it clear I want this site to be relevant, good, considerate, BUT if sensibility has to be compromised in achieving that goal then I wish this site to the dustpile.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

CZCZCZ, interestingly enough, I'll probably respost one of them on my blog at Blogspot. I say interestingly enough because for all of this talk about Google Adsense rules and blah-blah-blah I've heard, I've never once had anything questioned by Google on my blog, never had ads pulled, and certainly have never been asked to take anything down. THIS hub will probably go onto my blog and be just as untouched there as it should have been here. The Google argument to my mind is a load of crap that only seems to be a good excuse for HubPages to fulfil their personal agendas. Blogspot is owned by Google if anyone doesn't know. ;)

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sharewhatuknow 5 years ago from Western Washington

Oh Yea, Blogspot, is owned by google. Why my hub for a very legitimate point earning company I have been with since 2005, that rewards points with gift cards, was censored and inspected like a poisonous insect I will never know. But guess what, I will continue to write, and rewrite and be more creative. I see many hubbers here with hundreds of hubs to their credit. They didn't give up, neither will I, and neither should you.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Jonta, censorship of any kind can never be a good thing. And like I said, I'm still not buying the Google argument. This is entirely a HubPages thing right now. Having written MANY things on MANY topics for Google owned space much longer than I've been here, I've never had so much as a knock on my door from anyone from Google...EVER.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Sharewhatuknow, another example of why no one should be forced to write around things. It makes the process cumbersome and it makes the writing itself nonsensical...sort of like what happens with most SEO stuff by the way. ;)

RGNestle, I hope they wise up too. I am quite suspicious their terms really are a misinterpretation of Google guidelines, because as I've previously commented, I've been writing stuff using Google for a lot longer than I've been writing here, and Google has never had a problem. Only HubPages. BTW, I've checked, and the Boston Beer Company has advertised on Google. So, then...tell me why a link to their site would be disallowed by Google? Again, it doesn't make sense and Paul Deeds reply is more and more just making him look like a fool, as well as making the site have a bit of egg on its face. I'll be happy to keep pointing things out. I said I'd be a pill and I meant it. :) Thanks for stopping by.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Chef Joel, another glaring example of this "self-publishing" website not really being that at all. If I am to follow my free market principles in this, and take their (HubPages') claim that it is a self-publishing website at face value, then I say let the writers write what they want, to the degree they want, and to the level of quality they want. If readers don't like what they read, and Google doesn't like what content they provide, then the natural process will happen all on it's own that the writer will have a lower hubscore, a smaller readership, and possibly lose their Google Adsense account. That's how I thought it was supposed to work here. Apparently that is not the case at all and I think that fact detracts from the site overall to some degree.

BTW, most of the hubs and other blogs around Internetdom which rely on SEO and keywords are actually substandard. Go figure.

Ratnaveera, I tend to think that if HubPages is losing some traffic it may be due to the exact effect I've been alluding to, and that is that a site like this needs good writers to write quality content. That quality content will be recognized on its own merits by readers voting individual writers hubs up, and participating in the discussion in the comments section. If HubPages wishes to "rig" the system by not allowing writers to simply write what they want and let the writing speak for itself, then I think that's where the real problem lies. Google isn't stupid. They recognize the issues with SEO and keywords, and I think that process hurts the site. What causes good writers to walk away? Too many rules and editorial control by people who don't know anything at all about publishing, and the claim that HubPages makes that this is a "self-publishing" website while at the same time telling writers their work is not fit for their pages. I've said it before, if this site wants to be a magazine, then fine. I'm all for that. But then they'll need to read every single hub, and have editors who understand how that process should be working. In that event other standards should then be put into place like writers selling rights—for example, first North American serial rights etcetera. And those rights should be sold, and that means that HubPages should have to pay for those rights just like any other magazine publisher would have to.

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Trsmd 5 years ago from India

Thanks for sharing my feeling Springboard , in this page..

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Gconeyhiden, brains are always a good thing. :) Thanks for stopping by.

Studentart, of course by the looks of things I decided to hang around. But one thing I will say to this at the end of the day is that while I'm here I'll never stop speaking what's on my mind, and if HubPages gets it wrong, I'll step on a few toes gladly. I think we all should. It reminds HubPages who their bread and butter is, which at times I get the feeling they do not understand clearly enough.

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Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

Gchoneyhiden, I hope that doesn't make me a flip-flopper. :)

Ruthclark, thanks for stopping by. I'm glad you liked what you found.

BAndBeast, HubPages version of big brother? What a waste of a great site. Thanks for stopping in.

Sharewhatuknow, I like your words of encouragement, and you're right. Staying in the game is the best medicine, and wielding creativity to say what you want, when you want, and to whom you want is something we have the ability to do. Thanks for stopping in.

Trsmd, thanks for letting me know I'm not alone in my thinking. As I said in earlier comments, the support I got from my fellow hubbers was overwhelming, but not so shocking. The community is what kept me here. The Hub staff can still eat my shorts. :)

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

I just wrote, yesterday, a hub about Christmas being the feast of good will and peace to all mankind. I pointed out that over th holidays there were 11 murders which is terrible. Over 2000 years the message was and is send out about peace but apparently nobody had listened. I pointed out that religion is there to teach and we should live it and not keep on praying and running to church and do what we like. etc etc etc

My hub was pulled for substandard?????????????????????

This is now the fourth one and I don't know how to please them any more. Yet you read endless hubs about recipes of which Google is full with it already.

Springboard profile image

Springboard 5 years ago from Wisconsin Author

I'm really at a loss for what this site really wants to be anymore, and I know I'm not alone in thinking that HubPages has begun to lose some of it's luster. It's headed on a wrong path I think. What this site labels substandard and inappropriate is just beyond me while so much other garbage remains. I say to HubPages to each their own. What's that old saying? There are other fish in the sea. Eventually maybe I'll just start my own website. I did it once before with FrightNet Online Magazine, I can do it with a blog site as well.

My sympathies are with you.

Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 5 years ago from London, UK

Thank you, Springbard. If you think it is us who trying to help really. Most of the writers don't say a word and just move on. Anther invention they have now is that when you click in EDIT and even when you don't alter anything they still will censor it. I had this with my hub about the Sunking Louis IV and promptly they found something to make me change. I had to reduce the size of my pictures. Now this hub was up for almost two years and is one of my most successful one. Now th epictures are so small they don't impress which is the point of showing the splendour of his reign.

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