Experiments in Socialism

SOCIALIST POSTER IN RUSSIA SAYS THAT UNDER CAPITALISM THE EXPLOITERS GET THE INCOME BUT UNDER SOCIALISM THE WORKERS GET THE INCOME
SOCIALIST POSTER IN RUSSIA SAYS THAT UNDER CAPITALISM THE EXPLOITERS GET THE INCOME BUT UNDER SOCIALISM THE WORKERS GET THE INCOME
VLADIMIR LENIN THE SOCIALIST
VLADIMIR LENIN THE SOCIALIST
RUSSIAN SOCIALIST POSTER PROMISES THAT RUSSIA WILL FAR OUTDO THE CAPITALISTS IN AMERICA
RUSSIAN SOCIALIST POSTER PROMISES THAT RUSSIA WILL FAR OUTDO THE CAPITALISTS IN AMERICA
THOSE OPPOSED TO SOCIALISM GET TO GO TO THE GULAG WHERE THEY WILL ALL HAVE EQUAL OUTCOMES
THOSE OPPOSED TO SOCIALISM GET TO GO TO THE GULAG WHERE THEY WILL ALL HAVE EQUAL OUTCOMES
A GOOD SOCIALIST WILL LEARN FROM LENIN AND STALIN HOW TO THINK
A GOOD SOCIALIST WILL LEARN FROM LENIN AND STALIN HOW TO THINK
SOCIALIST LEADER JOSEPH STALIN
SOCIALIST LEADER JOSEPH STALIN
UNDER SOCIALISM LIFE WILL BE HAPPIER EVERY DAY
UNDER SOCIALISM LIFE WILL BE HAPPIER EVERY DAY
SOVIET BREAD LINES AFTER SOCIALISM WAS IMPLEMENTED MADE SURE NO ONE HAD MORE BREAD EXCEPT THE BUREAUCRATS AND PARTY LEADERS
SOVIET BREAD LINES AFTER SOCIALISM WAS IMPLEMENTED MADE SURE NO ONE HAD MORE BREAD EXCEPT THE BUREAUCRATS AND PARTY LEADERS

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM

Vladimir Lenin was filled with hatred, and he was a compulsive liar. He promised various groups of Russians self-determination until he came to power in 1917; fully knowing he intended no such thing. Promises of a grassroots democracy were made, but they were lies; what Lenin delivered was a dictatorship. Lenin and his circle of Socialist intellectuals imposed Communism on Russia while spouting democratic slogans. Their untruths then enabled them to take control of the world’s largest country and fifth-largest economy without having any business experience at all. None of these men had ever administered anything. Lenin was acutely aware that in order to enforce the will of a small minority of intellectuals upon the populace, it was necessary to have a totalitarian dictatorship in place, a dictatorship ruled by coercion, violence, and terror.

It would have been impossible for this small band of intellectuals to have prevailed under “normal” methods. The only way they could have come to power was through radical, brutal violence and retaliation. The cruelty, the crimes, and the repression created the greatest tragedy of the human experience.

Lenin preached class warfare; he encouraged the poor to seize the land from those who owned it, and he incited workers to take over the factories in which they worked. He fully intended from the beginning that both the land and the factories would be taken from them—which they were. The state ultimately owned and organized everything—all property, industry, transportation, wholesale trade, retail stores, and other institutions. Within eight years, the country’s productivity fell to less than 20% of what it was before Lenin took control.

To manage all of this, a huge bureaucracy was required, one that would place its collective interests above those of the population. To ensure loyalty, bureaucrats were granted special privileges, such as better food, clothes, housing, household goods, health care, resorts, and cemeteries. This would provide the bureaucracy with a vested interest in the survival of the regime, but it also served to make a mockery of the social equality that was supposedly at the heart of Socialism.

Socialism promised that the state could run the economy more efficiently than Capitalism. This was proved to be wrong. The free market went underground. The government flooded the country with freshly printed money; their express intent being to cause the inflation that would destroy private savings. Prices increased by 100 million times in six years. The Russian economy was destroyed.

Socialist attempts to run agriculture were so poor that 5.2 million people starved to death. That number would have been six times higher had not Americans, led by Herbert Hoover, rushed in to feed the Russian people.

In 1923, Joseph Stalin took over. His first act was to confiscate the assets of all Russian churches, supposedly to feed the masses, but in reality to enrich the state. All places of worship were closed, and 106,800 clergymen were shot. 60,000 more were exiled to Siberia.

Stalin thrived on crisis. He said, “Crisis alone permitted the authorities to demand—and obtain—total submission and all the necessary sacrifices from its citizens.”

In 1929, Stalin instituted full governmental control to central plan the entire national economy. He ensured the Russian people that “construction of socialism” would greatly improve living standards. But living standards dropped precipitously, to less than 10% of what they were, within five years. Since all workers were paid the same wages regardless of effort and competence, effort nearly ceased and the unqualified had no incentive to acquire new skills.

Stalin, unwilling to admit to the deficiencies in Socialism’s theories, decided to place blame for the ruination of the Russian economy on its peasant farmers. They were herded into collective farms thereby reducing 75% of the Russian people to government chattel. All of their belongings, including livestock and farm implements, were confiscated. Any farmers who were financially independent found themselves deported to labor camps, presumably because they were more intelligent than the average bear, and because they might be useful. The death penalty was instituted for stealing a few grains of wheat. Peasants quickly became slave laborers—told by the state when to work and what to do— and paid just enough per year to buy one pair of shoes, for backbreaking work. The state reaped the profits from agriculture, at 300%, far higher than any Capitalist operation in history.

40% of the USSR’s national income went into the country’s military budget. When there proved to be too many ignorant mouths to feed, Stalin created an artificial famine that was responsible for the starvation and death of 6.5 million people in 1933. Russia, once the world’s leading exporter of cereal, could no longer feed itself. If people criticized Socialism, they were simply killed—1.5 million of them in 1938 alone. Many common citizens were compelled to participate in this orgy of destruction by informing on others; ordinary people were forced to spy on their friends and neighbors in order to stay alive.

Free speech was eliminated in order to create the illusion of unanimity. Minds as well as bodies were to be dispossessed for the good of the Socialist State. Lenin’s first act was to shut down the free press and implement censorship. Under Stalin, not only were people told what not to write, but also what to write, stage, film, or broadcast—according to what the state decided was Politically Correct. History was rewritten for Soviet schools; the reality of history no longer existed. The official doctrine of the country became “Socialist realism” in 1932. Lying and cheating became a means of survival. Social ethics and civil society were shattered. Everyone looked out for himself, a far cry from the stated aim of Socialism, “all for the common good.”

Max Eastman, Lenin’s old friend, said, “Stalinism is worse than fascism, more ruthless, barbarous, unjust, immoral, anti-democratic, unredeemed by any hope or scruple. Stalinism is Socialism, the nationalization and collectivization on which Stalin had relied in his plan to erect a classless society.”

The Soviet experiment in Socialism was a terrific tragedy. Lines to buy bread stretched for blocks. Productivity was pitiful. Laborers who worked hard found themselves beaten up for their efforts, for making the others look bad, “They pretend to pay us and we pretend to work.” Central Planning either missed or ignored innovations such as plastic, synthetic fibers, computers, and other information technologies.

When the Soviet Union finally collapsed, one-half of the population earned less than ten dollars a month. Many stayed drunk. Corruption flourished, and the officials in charge of goods and services expected bribes. Positions with the greatest opportunity to receive bribes were sold to the highest bidder. The three million people who ran the country were the same percentage of the population as the nobles and capitalists who ran it before Socialism took over, and they enjoyed similar privileges. The Russian people had simply traded one group of “exploiters” for another. In the words of a Soviet bureaucrat: “It’s not simply a matter of good cars or apartments. It’s the continuous satisfaction of your own whims, the way an army of boot-lickers, ready to do everything for you, allows you to work painlessly for hours. Your every wish is fulfilled. You can go to the theatre on a whim; you can fly to Japan from your hunting lodge. You are like a king; just point your finger and it is done.”

If you wonder how people could treat each other so cruelly, remember that the Socialists were Atheists and Darwinists. People were expendable because people have no inherent worth under such a belief system. Existing humanity was debris, and killing off garbage was no matter of consequence to an enlightened Socialist.

 

THE SYMBOL OF GERMAN SOCIALISM (THE TWO CYRILLIC "S" LETTERS MEAN "SIEG SOCIALISMUS" OR "VICTORY FOR SOCIALISM")
THE SYMBOL OF GERMAN SOCIALISM (THE TWO CYRILLIC "S" LETTERS MEAN "SIEG SOCIALISMUS" OR "VICTORY FOR SOCIALISM")
SOCIALIST POSTER IN GERMANY SAYS THAT THE WORKERS HAVE AWOKEN
SOCIALIST POSTER IN GERMANY SAYS THAT THE WORKERS HAVE AWOKEN
THESE FOLKS GOT IN THE WAY OF SOCIALISM
THESE FOLKS GOT IN THE WAY OF SOCIALISM
THE GREAT SOCIALIST ADOLPH HITLER
THE GREAT SOCIALIST ADOLPH HITLER

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM

The word Nazi means National Socialist. The Nazis were genuine Socialists, as evidenced by their antagonism toward Capitalism and Democracy, and love for coercive collectivism. The ideas that guided the German state under Hitler were the ideas of Socialism. The most important ancestors of Socialism were Germans (Fichte, Rodbertus, and Lassalle).

The Soviets backed Hitler by allowing him to produce and test his weapons on their soil; they also provided the Nazis with food and metal. The common enemy of the Soviets and the Nazis was liberal democracy—meaning liberal in the classical sense, as in the ideas of the American Founding Fathers, not in the postmodern use of the word “liberal” in American politics to denote Socialists. Classical Liberal Democracy reveres free enterprise, private property, and individual rights.

Hitler admired the Soviet model of the totalitarian one-party state, and applauded its Socialist ideology that human beings were expendable raw material to be used for state purposes. The Soviets and the Nazis wanted to control every aspect of organized life, to impose iron discipline on all persons, through the use of secret police endowed with unrestricted powers, using law to advance the goals of the state not to protect the individual.

In the eyes of Hitler, nothing was more contemptible than the universal striving for happiness among individuals. The life of the state ranked higher than the life of individuals. Organization is the essence of Socialism, and Germany under the Nazis was the most convinced exponent of Socialism and developed the most highly organized economic system. Socialism is a power policy to centrally plan every aspect of life, and a conscious and determined opponent of individualism.

Under the National Socialist, there was no such thing as a private person. Everybody worked for the German state, all salaries and wages were set by the state, and the state administered all property. It was a fight against the capitalistic order. It was entirely socialist in worldview. It was the fusion of Socialism and Nationalism.

One would think that the outrages committed by totalitarian governments would make people in the West fearful that such a system might arise in their own countries. On the contrary, the attitude is “it couldn’t happen here.”

People seem not to be aware that to a German in 1930—and even to outsiders—the idea of a totalitarian state rising there would have seemed a paranoid fantasy, even though the influential German Jewish professor, Edgar Jaffe, wrote in 1915, “Individualism must come to an end absolutely. A system of regulations must be set up, the object of which is not the greater happiness of the individual, but the strengthening of the organized unity of the state. We must eliminate profit to kill Capitalism.” It is tragically ironic that like those of Professor Jaffe, most of Hitler’s ideas were Jewish ideas.

Socialists want to break all ties to the past, getting rid of the traditions and customs of a people, to prepare the way for totalitarianism. These Socialists are sincere idealists and often men of considerable intellectual distinction. They are relativists, not believing in objective truth, who would make morality a function of politics. They would use media to mass-produce mass opinion.

In the Germany before the rise of Hitler, political professors agitated for a scientific organization of society. These scientist-politicians were not on the side of liberty, they were “elite experts” impatient with the ways of the common man, contemptuous of anything not consciously organized by their superior minds. They insisted that the classics of Western Civilization not be taught to students, as they would instill the dangerous spirit of liberty. These scholars and scientists paved the way for National Socialism.

The role of intellectuals in the totalitarian transformation of a society was seen clearly by French philosopher, Julien Benda: “It is a superstition that science is competent in all domains, including that of morality. Those who brandish this doctrine either believe in it or simply wish to give the prestige of a scientific appearance to the passions of their hearts. They are partisans of arbitrary authority. This is quite natural, since it eliminates the two realities they most hate, i.e., human liberty and the historical action of the individual.”

Socialist intellectuals hate the distinguishing features of Western Civilization. They are Darwinists who believe in scientific planning based on evolutionary theory. In Germany they were joined by labor union leaders who yearned for the destruction of the competitive system fostered by free market Capitalism, never mind the accompanying doom of freedom for the individual. They wanted the impersonal discipline of the free market to be replaced by the will of a few individuals. If you destroy the former, you get the latter.

The bylaws of the Nazi party feature a fierce hatred of Capitalism—profit seeking, free enterprise, banks, stock, retail stores, interest, and loans. The abolition of Capitalism was the program of the Nazis to which the German people responded enthusiastically. It is noteworthy, that the young adults of Germany were nearly unanimously in favor of the end of Capitalism and Classical Liberalism. The inherent logic of collectivism could only lead to universal compulsion.

All Germans had to be coerced into accepting the anti-individualist program of the National Socialists, who scared the populace with anti-Communist propaganda before driving them into a system that only differed from Communism in name. The Nazis gradually extended the field of state activity, until they had central control of the economy.

National Socialism’s aim was to make the state the “daddy of the people.” It was contemptuous of business and free enterprise, and yet, it esteemed bureaucrats. Socialism leads to totalitarianism and dictatorship, and such a social order will inevitably fall under the control of the most heinous individuals. Socialism is the father of Nazism.

CHAIRMAN MAO THE SOCIALIST BELIEVED IN SENSITIVITY TRAINING FOR THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT
CHAIRMAN MAO THE SOCIALIST BELIEVED IN SENSITIVITY TRAINING FOR THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT
REEDUCATION CAMP IN SOCIALIST CHINA
REEDUCATION CAMP IN SOCIALIST CHINA

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM

Chairman Mao, a big hero to American college campus Socialists, was a proponent of massive violence.  Mao said, “Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.  If worst came to worst to worst, and half of mankind died, the whole world would become Socialist.”  Mao learned from Marx and Lenin that to stay in power, Socialists had to demolish every vestige of Capitalism.  Even that was not enough; Socialism’s ultimate aim was to change humankind into complete conformity with the ideals of Socialism.  This would require “reeducation camps.” 

Mao’s Little Red Book was the only book allowed in China for some time.  It was also a popular book of “wisdom” among American Socialists.  In it he says, “The outstanding thing about China’s 600 million people is that they are poor and blank. This may seem a bad thing, but in reality it is a good thing.  Poverty gives rise to the desire for change, and the desire for revolution.

Mao’s Socialist policies caused the starvation, or outright killing, of 30 million Chinese people.  In 1966, he recruited barbarous hordes of urban youth to viciously ravage the general population; to destroy Chinese culture.  All of the schools were closed, western music was prohibited; intellectuals were taken, tortured, and killed.  These actions are in keeping with Socialist movements everywhere.  As their ideas fail to produce promised results, they find it necessary to become even more ruthless in the implementations of their policies, rather than admit their ideas are wrong.  

THE SOCIALISTS IN NORTH KOREA ALL USE THE SAME AMOUNT OF ELECTRICITY BUT THOSE IN CAPITALISTS SOUTH KOREA DISTRIBUTE ELECTRICITY UNEQUALLY
THE SOCIALISTS IN NORTH KOREA ALL USE THE SAME AMOUNT OF ELECTRICITY BUT THOSE IN CAPITALISTS SOUTH KOREA DISTRIBUTE ELECTRICITY UNEQUALLY
THE CAPITALISTS IN SOUTH KOREA BUILT THIS CITY
THE CAPITALISTS IN SOUTH KOREA BUILT THIS CITY

EXPERIMENT IN SOCIALISM ON THE KOREAN PEOPLE

The Soviets exported Socialism to North Korea. South Korea remained free. In case some defenders of socialism try to blame the failures of this system on the national character deficiencies of a certain people, which they do, this case of Korea—and of Germany (East and West) rebuts this with hard evidence. The Koreans, whether north or south, are one stock of people.

What have been the results in the Capitalist South and Socialist North? In the North, millions died of starvation during the 1990s alone, and millions of children continue to be born with malformations, deformities that are for the majority caused by the malnutrition of their mothers. Not a single person has starved in South Korea, and its infant mortality rate is 8 per 1,000 versus 88 in North Korea. Average life expectancy is 49 in the North and 70 in the South. GDP per capita is $13,700 in the South but only $900 in the North. Gee, could it be the system of Socialism at the heart of this disparity? Do you think?!

TALE OF TWO SOCIALISTS THE MURDERER CHE GUEVARA (DARLING OF THE AMERICAN LEFT) AND FIDEL CASTRO (DARLING OF HOLLYWOOD)
TALE OF TWO SOCIALISTS THE MURDERER CHE GUEVARA (DARLING OF THE AMERICAN LEFT) AND FIDEL CASTRO (DARLING OF HOLLYWOOD)
TWO FINE SOCIALISTS CASTRO AND KHRUSHCHEV
TWO FINE SOCIALISTS CASTRO AND KHRUSHCHEV
SOME CUBANS ODDLY ENOUGH WANTED TO LEAVE THE SOCIALIST PARADISE AND SAIL ACROSS SHARK INFESTED WATERS TO THAT EVIL CAPITALIST NATION CALLED AMERICA
SOME CUBANS ODDLY ENOUGH WANTED TO LEAVE THE SOCIALIST PARADISE AND SAIL ACROSS SHARK INFESTED WATERS TO THAT EVIL CAPITALIST NATION CALLED AMERICA

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM IN CUBA

Cuba once enjoyed the second-highest standard of living in Latin America, prior to the takeover by Castro.  Castro learned Marxist ideology from the murderer, much beloved by American Socialists, Che Guevara.  In 1960, Castro confiscated most of the land in Cuba, stole all businesses and industrial plants owned by foreigners, and forbid competing political parties.  He had lied to the Cuban people that he was going to restore democracy.  50 years later, they are still waiting for its restoration. 

In 1961, Castro proclaimed Cuba a “Socialist” country.  He urged the Soviets to launch a nuclear strike against America, and was fully prepared to sacrifice his entire nation for the triumph of “worldwide Socialism.”  The Soviets didn’t do it, but in appreciation they did give Castro ten billion dollars. 

By 1970, Castro had nationalized the entire economy of Cuba.  He also created his Revolutionary Tribunals and labor camps to punish speech and thought that he deemed Politically Incorrect.  When his policies made the Cuban people miserable, as Socialism always does, and living standards sharply declined, Castro blamed the United States.  The best educated and most enterprising of Cubans fled to the United States, apparently not believing his propaganda (there is no record of one person going back voluntarily). 

In 1992, Castro was able to boast the lowest rate of AIDS in the world, launching a wave of sex tourism.  What many American Leftists, who adore Castro, may not know is that he achieved this by compulsory HIV testing, and by placing all HIV-positive persons in lifelong quarantine—the old school method of combating infectious disease.  So, naturally, the disease did not spread in Cuba—saving millions of lives.  

ALLENDE THE SOCIALIST PROMISED HOPE AND CHANGE AND FREE HEALTH CARE FOR ALL IN CHILE MAKING HIM A MESSIAH FIGURE
ALLENDE THE SOCIALIST PROMISED HOPE AND CHANGE AND FREE HEALTH CARE FOR ALL IN CHILE MAKING HIM A MESSIAH FIGURE

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM IN CHILE

Chile actually elected a Socialist president, Salvador Allende, in 1970. Upon his election, Allende promptly nationalized the banking, mining, and manufacturing industries; his actions reduced the economy of that nation to a shambles.  The Soviets loaned him half a billion dollars, but it was not enough, so in order to pay for his ambitious social programs he simply kept printing money.  The amount of money in circulation increased by fifteen times during Allende’s three years in office, resulting in a 300% rate of inflation during each of those years. As a result, he collectivized agriculture; the outcome, food production dropped in half, followed by the predictable food shortage.  Allende planned a government –owned trucking company to compete with Chile’s independent truckers, who mounted dramatic protests.  Finally, the military had to take him out to save Chile from complete chaos and collapse.  

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM IN ETHIOPIA

In 1974, Socialists gained control in Ethiopia by force.  They seized all private wealth, nationalized the banks and insurance companies, outlawed private property, and declared Ethiopia a Socialist country.  Massacres soon followed, and after that famine caused by collectivization of agriculture.  One million Ethiopians died.  

THOSE WHO OPPOSED SOCIALISM WERE MADE INTO A PILE OF SKULLS (EQUAL OF COURSE)
THOSE WHO OPPOSED SOCIALISM WERE MADE INTO A PILE OF SKULLS (EQUAL OF COURSE)

PROS AND CONS OF SOCIALISM IN CAMBODIA

The purest experiment with Socialism was imposed in Cambodia (1975-1978).  The Socialist leaders, as is typical, would do anything to anybody to achieve their objective—the creation of a state where everybody truly had an equal outcome to their lives.  The mass annihilation of people proved to be no obstacle.  An intellectual elite guided by Marxist doctrine would completely reshape the lives of Cambodians through sheer violence.  The Socialist revolutionaries, the Khmer Rouge, trained their believers to “love killing.” 

The people of Cambodia welcomed the Khmer Rouge, because they promised non-violence and equality for all.  After taking power, they killed 26% of the population, including all government employees, military members, teachers, merchants, landowners, professionals, skilled workers, and monks. 

The Khmer Rouge would execute people who were late for work, complained about anything, or criticized their regime.  Their officials would rape a woman, and then ram a bayonet into her vagina.  Pregnant women were cut open, and their unborn babies yanked out.  Women would have their breasts cut off.  Western Socialists blamed the United States, as usual, this time on the theory that Americans had made the Khmer Rouge mad— mad enough to torture and exterminate their own people.  

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Comments 146 comments

James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

_cheryl_--- Thank you for being my first visitor! I appreciate the affirmation and your wise insights. You are surely welcome and thanks for standing with me for freedom and liberty.


Tom Whitworth profile image

Tom Whitworth 6 years ago from Moundsville, WV

James,

Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Hitler, Castro are all men who fundamentally transfomed their nations. After doing so they slaughtered millions.


msorensson profile image

msorensson 6 years ago

A great hub, once again, James. Well researched, well put together. Thank you for sharing your gifts.

It has been so many years since I read "We the Living" by Ayn Rand, James. I was 12 years old.

In my opinion, this book is better than Atlas Shrugged or Fountainhead as it is as raw as you can have Ayn Rand.

It was my only exposure to the harsh realities of government transitions.

The book touched me so deeply so I did not want to reexperience what the protagonists Leo, Kira and Andrei did, at any level.

I chose to ignore all the news that remotely touches on Socialism and Communism at real time.

However I did read Gulag Archipelago.

My son is a brilliant thinker and we discuss History and Philosophy at home. It is passion. I engage only to clarify his thoughts, nothing more.

He did point to a very specific area, which I have missed or have chosen to ignore, and that is, a select few, an ambitious group coming from the middle class ranks benefit from such transitions.

The masses are easily led.

All you need is a great propaganda, a cause that will impact the basic needs:food, clothing and shelter, and they will follow, blindly.

I do not condone the acts of the leaders but the leaders are entities surrounded by a group of people.

None of them could have done what they did had they not duped the masses first.


Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 6 years ago from London, UK

Thank you, James, for such a great research and putting this into a great hub. If this is not an eye-opener I don't what would make their eyes open. One point I would like to add, which always baffled me, the very fact that they would not and will not anybody get out of the country. Doesn't that tell you something? People literally risk their life to escape. You don't do this easily. Living in West Germany we had on the news every week one or two people trying to escape and where shot. One young man, shot by the East Germans, was lying bleeding to death in no-mans-land between the two rows of barb wires, calling for two hours, and they wouldn't let the West Germans to get him, nor would they get him. He died an agonizing death. The last and for me the worst was. The little boy whose mother died escaping from Cuba. I will never understand why Clinton authorized the capture and sending him back. Are they that desperate to demand this? A little boy who had the memory of seeing his mother drowning and then the horrifying experience of police, black masks, black uniform bursting in the middle of the night and taking him. They really must be desperate.


Hxprof 6 years ago from Clearwater, Florida

It's clear you put a great deal of work into this. So much of what you said has implications for America's near future. I could fill a page with comment-I'll spare you and everyone else.

Instead I'll comment on just one item. Recall when the second Bush was in office that he tried to initiate a 'snitch' program. The idea behind it was to increase vigilance against terrorist activity. While I empathize with that goal, I can't condone the method. We've seen in many countries how snitch programs work, particularly during times of crisis. We'll see it here in America-mark it down.


partisan patriot 6 years ago

James

Fantastic hub; how ironic that you should publish it on such a historic day. Today America seems on the verge of joining the aforementioned socialist regimes. How tragic we have come to such a perilous place in our history.

I'm on my way to church to pray for America!


caretakerray 6 years ago

James A Watkins:

Truer words were never spoken. Hard to understand how some people can't seem to understand socialism just does,t work!

Great hub as usual. thanx :)

caretakerray


drbj profile image

drbj 6 years ago from south Florida

James, this is a brilliant hub which admirably reflects your writing and research skills.

The content, for me, emphasizes how we, as human beings, time and time again fail to learn from the mistakes of the past. Twas ever thus.


amillar profile image

amillar 6 years ago from Scotland, UK

"The more things change, the more they stay the same."


cameciob profile image

cameciob 6 years ago

Hi James, this article is a great overview of socialism and its dictatorial form, communism. There are many comments that came to my mind while reading it. I’ll just point one of them. I tried to understand why would people obey such systems. Living in communism I came to the conclusion that, in order to exploit so many people, the governments need to create a climate for hate, fear and corruption. And the greatest tool of all is ignorance, so people would not question socialist propaganda. That’s why I think is good to be reminded about the dangers of such politics.


Tom Cornett profile image

Tom Cornett 6 years ago from Ohio

Great hub James....A Jewish friend of mine's grandparents escaped torture and murder by fleeing Russia. He told me of horrific things that they were doing to Jews...I can't bring myself to write them down.

Socialism seems to always lead to "Our way or the grave."

The opposite of freedom.....is there a better word than socialism?


H P Roychoudhury profile image

H P Roychoudhury 6 years ago from Guwahati, India

Yes, socialism is bad for maintaining true equality. It destroys the individual’s capability. But absolute capitalism is not good either in the sense that it creates inequality to such a degree that a class becomes very wealthy and another class becomes very poor as I do believe and learnt from the history. Yes, in the span of last almost hundred years, it has been proved beyond doubt that the mother of Socialist country Soviet Russia could not survive the unity of its States. The economy shattered and mighty Soviet Russia collapsed. The administration require a system where there should be incentive, the talent must be rewarded. But at the same time, the poor, the weak, the less talent should not be pushed to die. Everyone requires protection. It demands some binding in the accumulation of wealth in few hands. A balance state of affaires is the solution. I am an Indian, I do not know, is it the reason for which Indian Union became a Democratic as well as a Socialistic country. Thanks for a beautiful analysis of socialistic world.


Pamela99 profile image

Pamela99 6 years ago from United States

James, This hub obviously took a lot of time and research because it is excellent and covers the major socialist and communist regimes of the last hundred years. My son is a missionary and has such a heart for the Cambodian people as the orphaned children of that era are now in their 30's and many are Christians. They are a wounded group and my son has been there many times holding pastor seminars where they travel from around the country to attend, and he teaches in the churches as well. Socialism with hatred and no regard for the sanctity of life creates wounds that only God can heal.

Now, today through underhanded, immoral and probably illegal deals reached behind closed doors it appears the USA is taking a giant step in the direction of socialism. It is a sad day for American. Thank you for writing such a wonderfully, thorough hub of the evil of mankind.


greatAmerican profile image

greatAmerican 6 years ago

James, it should be obvious that more people are interested in the history of March Madness, than in history of destructive politics. In spite of the fact that we are once again repeating Lenin, Mao, and Hitler it will take years before most people will see the lies, deceit and realize they have lost their freedom.. What fools we mortals be...


sheila b. profile image

sheila b. 6 years ago

Socialism, communism, marxism, so many isms. Yet when we take a good look at all of them, there's one conclusion - they all aspire to enslave people. I met people living in a former Soviet country who had been 'assigned' their lifelong jobs. One is a waitress. That's not what she wanted to do with her life, but it's what she was told to do. Her daughter, after the country gained independence, went to college and had the second highest grades in the country. As I said, the isms are all slavery. And here we are now, in the precarious position of having our African American President lead us into slavery!


lctodd1947 profile image

lctodd1947 6 years ago from USA

This is very much needed history that eveyone in America needs to read. It is being said that we are headed in the same direction. I pray for our Country to wake up and realize what is going on. It is scary and this needs to be printed in the Wall Street Journal!!! Thanks for presenting this as you have. It is wonderful work.

Linda


advisor4qb profile image

advisor4qb 6 years ago from On New Footing

Glad to be an American. SO glad I did not grow up in any of these other places.

How horrible it must have been for those poor people of those countries!


GusTheRedneck profile image

GusTheRedneck 6 years ago from USA

Hi James - Well said and well documented as to the ways of the dictatorial know-it-alls. Our country's current problems have been exacerbated by there being socialist-aiming autocrats in federal office, like our "Won," Obama. Hitler and those others of whom you write scarcely hold a candle to our president and his pals. What a mess!

Gus :-O


stars439 profile image

stars439 6 years ago from Louisiana, The Magnolia and Pelican State.

Very formidable hub. I was not born then, but such a misfortune for those who were in Europe. Such pain and anguish, death and hunger. Life and times are still hard in some countries, but to me it seems life is much different than back then. I love America because I feel we are a country that has a heart. God Bless You.


aguasilver profile image

aguasilver 6 years ago from Malaga, Spain

"Socialists want to break all ties to the past, getting rid of the traditions and customs of a people, to prepare the way for totalitarianism. These Socialists are sincere idealists and often men of considerable intellectual distinction. They are relativists, not believing in objective truth, who would make morality a function of politics. They would use media to mass-produce mass opinion."

Stunning observation, especially if you apply this filter to modern politicians currently in power.

Socialism still has it's goals, it's just changed it's name.

Great hub James, I voted it upwards...

John


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Tom Whitworth--- You are so right, Brother. They surely did fundamentally transform their nations. And kill millions of people. Thank you for your insights.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

msorensson--- You are welcome and I thank you for the kind compliments. :)

I don't believe I have read "We the living" though I did read "Atlas Shrugged" and "The Fountainhead." I'll have to check that out since you make it sound like a profound work. Thanks for telling me about it.

You are right on that a duping of the masses is required to implement such systems. I appreciate you for sharing your insights with us here.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Hello, hello,--- You are surely welcome. Thank you for reading my essay and leaving your excellent remarks. For instance, you wrote:

"they would not and will not let anybody get out of the country. Doesn't that tell you something? People literally risk their life to escape."

That tells you everything you need to know. The rest of my essay is simply reinforcements.

People have long been desperate to escape from Socialism--even those who thought it was what they wanted. Socialism is the art of false promises to grab absolute power and then oppress people. Every time it has been tried, this has been the result.


eovery profile image

eovery 6 years ago from MIddle of the Boondocks of Iowa

This all looks so familiar. This is a great hub, and people need to read it. And then think twice about what is happening here in the Ole U.S. of A.

Keep on hubbing!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Hxprof--- Thank you for visiting and commenting. You know that you are welcome to write any and all thoughs you may have here. It is a feature of all Socialist societies that people snitch on each other. The state apparatus needs this to keep the people under subjugation.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

partisan patriot--- Thank you for the laudations. And I greatly appreciate you going to pray for our nation, too. What a day this is. The slow creep of Socialism continues to strangle liberty.


Lee B profile image

Lee B 6 years ago from New Mexico

James, your facts are correct, your writing style is persuasive, but your overall conclusions are incorrect. Socialism was not the cause of the suffering, but the actions of unscrupulous and power-mad dictators. I just can't believe that a health care system that is moving toward coverage for all citizens can be a bad thing for our country. Yes, it smacks of socialism to make sure that the poor, the unemployed, and the chronically ill are cared for, but our system of unregulated, solely profit motivated capitalism has also cased suffering for millions. The governments in countries like Norway and Sweden don't appear to be oppressive regimes, yet are able to provide humane health care for their citizens.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

caretakerray--- Many people can't see through the BS. For instance, I had several replies to my last Hub from Socialists who claimed that Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao--none of these people were "really" Socialists. Funny, that is what they called themselves and that is the ideology they followed. Thank you and you're welcome.

James


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

drbj--- Thank you very much for your accolades. I like what you wrote:

"human beings, time and time again fail to learn from the mistakes of the past."

Ain't it the truth.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

amillar--- Amen! Thank you for the pithy yet profound comment.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

cameciob--- Thank you for coming. I appreciate your wise words and kind comments. I know that you have been there and therefore have had a birdseye view of such an evil system.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Tom Cornett--- Thank you, brother. Those people such as your friend who have seen the horrors of Socialism up close and personal surely know better than ignorant bleeding hearts who just can't let go of the idealism of it all. I appreciate you for sharing that story, and I enjoyed reading all of your words.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

H P Roychoudhury--- You are welcome and I thank you for your thoughtful analysis. You made many good points, H P. You wrote:

"It demands some binding in the accumulation of wealth in few hands."

I agree. In the United States, an ownership society, wealth is not and has never been in a "few hands." On the contrary, 63% of the homes in America are owned; a hundred million people own stock in corporations; thirty million people own their own businesses.

"talent must be rewarded. But at the same time, the poor, the weak, the less talent should not be pushed to die."

I certainly agree with you.

"capitalism is not good either in the sense that it creates inequality to such a degree that a class becomes very wealthy and another class becomes very poor"

I cannot speak to how things are in India, but in the United States the vast majority of people are neither rich nor poor. They are in the middle--by American standards (but all are well off compared to those in the third world).


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Pamela99--- You are surely welcome, my dear. Thank you for your kind compliments. You wrote:

"Socialism with hatred and no regard for the sanctity of life creates wounds that only God can heal."

I surely agree with you. And yes--this is a sad day for America.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

greatAmerican--- Hello my patriot. Your comments are awesome. Allow me to repeat some of your words:

"more people are interested in the history of March Madness, than in history of destructive politics. In spite of the fact that we are once again repeating Lenin, Mao, and Hitler it will take years before most people will see the lies, deceit and realize they have lost their freedom"


JannyC profile image

JannyC 6 years ago

Powerful hub. Great job and detail.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

sheila b.--- You wrote:

"Socialism, communism, marxism, . . . when we take a good look at all of them, there's one conclusion - they all aspire to enslave people."

Yes, they do. Thank you so much for your learned assessment. I appreciate your wise words.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Ictodd1947--- Well, spread the word, sister.

Thank you, Linda, for your laudatory remarks. And you are welcome.

James


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

advisor4qb--- It was horrible beyond the imagination. And yet, many today so desire to live off of others on a government teet, that they will surrender their freedom.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

GusTheRedneck--- Thank you, Gus, for the compliments and your excellent analysis. I appreciate you coming by to visit and leaving your words for us to ponder.

james


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

stars439--- I surely enjoyed reading your great comments. You have a big heart, my friend. God Bless You!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

aguasilver--- Thank you, John, for your kind compliments. I truly appreciate your affirmation. I'm glad that you came to visit.

James


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

eovery--- Thank you for your compliments, brother. I'll keep on as long as I can keep on. :D


BDazzler profile image

BDazzler 6 years ago from Gulf Coast, USA

I know I usually expound on a particularly good point or something, but this one... all I can say is Wow, James, GREAT job.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Lee B--- Excuse me for the delay. I stopped to watch the destruction of our nation.

This bill is not about health care. It is about the centralization of power and control. Half of the uninsured are young, healthy people who don't want insurance. The other half get free health care now. The reduction of $550 billion worth of medicare/medicaid fraud that supposedly pays for this bill is a joke. It that could be done, why hasn't it been done? Interstate competition of insurance companies and tort reform would have been better. Any increase in government power has a correclating decrease in freedom and liberty.

Norway and Sweden are vastly different societies, with homogenous populations that go back for centuries. America has health care problems because we are extremely unhealthy in our diets and lifestyles.

But I thank you for your comments. You have a good heart.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

JannyC--- Thank you very much for your compliments and encouragement.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

BDazzler--- Well, thank you for your laudations. This is gratifying to read. :D


parrster profile image

parrster 6 years ago from Oz

Nice job, interesting read, love your good use of humour within an otherwise depressing subject.


billyaustindillon profile image

billyaustindillon 6 years ago

James are very timely and well delivered articles. My ancestors are from Estonia and know too well the dangers of socialism. Estonia lost 25% of it's population in the second world war - Estonia fought both Hitler and Stalin - a little known fact given there are only 1,300,000 Esstis and Estos in the world. Nevertheless a very proud group of people who have fought for freedom seemingly forever - first with 800 years of slavery under Sweden then the brutal Russification model of the Soviets. They never lost their perspective and identity and humanity. Estonians are the oldest people in Europe - another little known fact - the reason I look so proudly is the never say attitude to freedom and the wariness to corruption and communist/socialism/fascism. People so easily forget and so so easily moved by a manipulated brand of populism. Lets hope America never forgets - I am sure we all have ancestors that have been through plenty and of what we can be proud. I always shudder when I see Russification - Putin scares me - the key to this article I picked up is government control NOT giving people what they would expect. The healthcare debate in the US lost perspective a long time ago as far as health treatment goes and became nothing more than a huge government controlling agenda IMHO.


dohn121 profile image

dohn121 6 years ago from Hudson Valley, New York

I think that the one good thing Socialism and Communism did for me is that it inadvertently brought me to the U.S. My family and I fled Communist Laos shortly after the Fall of Saigon and was able to find sponsorship while living in a Thai Refugee Camp. My first novel details all of this and one day, it will be published. It's merely a matter of time.

If this article doesn't wake individuals up to the atrocities of Socialism, I really don't know what will (better yet, check for a pulse). Excellent expose, James. Thank you for exploiting Socialism for what it is.

Dohn


Lisa Petrarca profile image

Lisa Petrarca 6 years ago

Great, informative and eye opening article. So many people only get to hear the so called "positive" sides to this reform. But the pages & pages of true information isn't explained to the general public.

I've attached a link to this article on my Facebook.

Thanks again for posting this article...we can only pray that this is not America's future!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

parrster--- Thank you very much for taking the time to read my article and leave your warm words. Welcome to the Hub Pages Community!


Cathi Sutton profile image

Cathi Sutton 6 years ago

This is a great history lesson!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

billyaustindillon--- Thank you very much for this priceless addition to our conversation. It does seem like I read in some history book a while back that the Estonians were the oldest national group in Europe. They have been through hell, that's for sure. I appreciate your great insights.


Allan McGregor profile image

Allan McGregor 6 years ago from South Lanarkshire

I am content with the wisdom of Solomon in Ecclesiastes 1:9 - 'That which has been, it is that which shall be. And that which has been done, it is that which will be done. And there is no new thing under the sun.'

We who were born in the 20th Century tend to take a very 20th Century view of world history, but most of the depredations you speak of were seen in abundance in the nation that gave America the Statue of Liberty, from her roots in Revolutionary France which imposed 'The Terror' (1793-1794) which became the model of Socialist Revolution thereafter.

Interestingly, the generally accepted 'Father of the French Revolution' was one Jean-Jacques Rousseau, a self-regarding sexual libertine who fathered several illegitimate children whom he declined to support personally, considering that task the duty of others...very much a Socialist at heart, and redolent of that persistent Socialist mantra "Something should be done about it!" - which generally means 'Someone else should be paying for what I want'.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

dohn121--- Now here is a man who has lived it. Mark me down for a copy of your novel when it is finished. I am sure it will be great for you surely are a fine writer, Dohn. I guess the moral of your story is that sometimes good comes out of bad. This has been true for me many times--but never on the scale to which you refer. Thank you, brother, for adding your comments to our discussion.

James


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Lisa Petrarca--- You are welcome. Thank you for your warm compliments and I greatly appreciate the link from your FB page. :D


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Cathi Sutton--- I thank you for expressing your enthusiastic response to my article. :-)


"Quill" 6 years ago

Great hub James as always...as I was reading I reflect at some of the things you have written of as they have been in my time.

What is upsetting is we see it being played out on a daily basis and people are still buying into it rather than stepping out in faith and trusting our Lord...

Blessings


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Allan McGregor--- I wholeheartedly agree with you about the implications of the French Revolution. It is the father of all Godless political systems. Some equate the French and American revolutions but they mean far different things, as you know. In America, God gives human beings rights, which the state should honor. In France, the state gives the rights. What the state giveth, the state may take away.


BDazzler profile image

BDazzler 6 years ago from Gulf Coast, USA

"In America, God gives human beings rights, which the state should honor. " ... I like that phrasing, clear, concise, accurate. Is that yours or did you quote it?


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

"Quill"--- Thank you, brother. I agree with your assessment. God Bless You! I always look forward to hearing from you.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

BDazzler--- Thank you! :) I paraphrased the Declaration of Independence there.


Williamjordan profile image

Williamjordan 6 years ago from Houston TX

Great Hub exposing SOCIALISM


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Williamjordan--- Thank you! It is great to see you again. You were one of my very first readers on HubPages.


Hello, hello, profile image

Hello, hello, 6 years ago from London, UK

Wow, James, you had your job cut out. I am glad people responded so well. Hopefully, you hub will do some good. Thank you for your excellent reply to my comment.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Hello, hello,--- I think the responses have been excellent. I have enjoyed the engagement here. You are welcome. Your comment is outstanding.


John B 6 years ago

A very timely hub, Jim, and well done. This is precisely the content that won't make it into our public school textbooks. Anything regarding any of these failed societies will be spun in the opposite direction.

I'd like it noted that those of us that love "March Madness" don't necessarily do so at the expense of moral/ ethical direction.


BDazzler profile image

BDazzler 6 years ago from Gulf Coast, USA

Dang, James, (slaps self on forehead) I just figured out why China is suddenly starting to kick our butts economically. Mao's reign should have (and did) devastate them economically. They now get the profits from Hong Kong. They get their own little capitalist peninsula (which is astoundingly capitalist, BTW!) ... An article on Google pulling out of mainland china says: "Although now part of China, the handover agreement from British rule allows [Hong Kong] to operate as a semi-autonomous region until 2047 -- the "one country, two systems" approach. The city has a free press and tolerates political dissent."

Hong Kong's prosperity has given an injection of CAPITAL to bolster a socialist system.


John B 6 years ago

The Republic of China's hatred of Google's info for all is

similar to their reasons for supporting Iran's regime as well as North Korea. They want no notions about democracy reaching their population by internet, surrounding regions or from anywhere. Period! They have so many people under their boot that it's almost inconceivable they're able to maintain. Gordon Chang has many good writings about Eastern oppression.


Scott Carmichael 6 years ago

One more point about Norway and Sweden... these 2 countries are only the size of a medium sized state... so a centralized government there, is still by our standards, only a local government... And with a population of only 9 million there's no doubt that administering their brand of socialism will go smoother...

But even in the most civilized European socialist models, there may not now be the sort of bloodshed that we've seen throughout the history of socialism... But there is still the tragedy of untapped human potential... Freedom, liberty and self determination have unleashed human potential more than any system in history. I'm not surprised that the first system ever to proclaim the sovereignty of the individual, has prospered to the benefit of so many.

James I loved your article and I will share it often...

excellent job....


Robert 6 years ago

James,

Nice follow up to the previous Hub on Socialism. It is hard not enjoy even those who may see things differently because for me it means they are paying attention and that is what really good government needs, people paying attention. This bill is not about health care for the poor it is about centralizing power and that is why Immigration and Cap and Trade are next on his list. We are an unhealthy society and it is unreasonal for anyone to think the rest should be pay for the folly of another. As for those who are literally unable to afford medical treatment for any reason we could fund them easily if we reduced the amount of government size and interference. There are people laying around purposefully having their entire life funded by the people of this country. Lets put the boot to them and help those who are willing to make an effort. Our time is short, shorter than most will be willing to admit. I hope they are ready to get what they asked for this last election.


Dog On A Mission 6 years ago

Very detailed thread James. Good work.

No mention of socialism in the west though?

Central banking is the principle mechanism for implementing western style corporate warfare-welfare state.


gatorgrad2001 profile image

gatorgrad2001 6 years ago

The author is sadly misinformed and I have no doubt that he has very little formal education past the compulsory 12 years required by law, if that. Every modern industrial nation has an economic and political system that is a hybrid of capitalism and socialism. The democrats such as Obama are actually to the RIGHT of the conservatives in Europe. So, you have every right to your opinion but you don't have the right to your own facts. Get your facts straight before you go ranting about something you're misinformed about. We are not, nor ever will be, a Socialist country. In fact quite the opposite. The corporations have far too much power to even allow us to be called a true representative democracy. Fear mongering and propaganda does not improve anything for anyone.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

John B.--- Welcome back my friend to the show that never ends. Ha! You'll get no complaint about March Madness from me, Brother.

Yea, the spin is in. They tell kids the system was good but bad people ran it. In all 12 countries where it was tried. This is called not seeing the forest for the trees.

Thank you for your excellent comments. Great to hear from you.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

BDazzler--- I believe Hong Kong was both the richest place in the world, and the most Capitalistic. Imagine that! You know, China is going the opposite direction. They are headed to freedom and free markets, while we are headed to bondage and a centrally planned economy. Maybe so the New World Order can meet in the middle?


AdsenseStrategies profile image

AdsenseStrategies 6 years ago from CONTACT ME at Adsensibilities@gmail.com

Hi James. Your assessment of Mao and of the Soviet Union seem right. But I really don't agree that the Nazis were anti-capitalist. Mmmm. Have to think about that one. In any event, Hitler was EXTREMELY anti-Communist himself. Many of the victims of the Holocaust were (non-Jewish) Socialists of various sorts. Anyway, I thought I'd comment... Best wishes


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

John B.--- Yes, one would think that American leftists would see a lesson in China's censorship. Then again, Political Correctness is also censorship and they approve of that. So maybe not. Thanks for coming back with the fine add-on.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Scott Charmichael--- Thank you very much for visiting my Hub and leaving your fine comments.

Your first paragraph articulates what I wanted to say but I couldn't find the handle.

Wow! Scott, your second paragraph is even better! I agree with you wholeheartedly.

I am so pleased that you loved the article and I am grateful that you will pass it around. Thank you for the compliment as well.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Robert--- Welcome, my old friend. You know we have similar views. You wrote:

"This bill is not about health care for the poor it is about centralizing power and that is why Immigration and Cap and Trade are next on his list."

Amen!

I thought it was something to see Ms. Pelosi prancing around, grinning like a shit eating cat, talking up the Founding Fathers--of all people--while her personal approval rating is 11%. I'm sure George Washington must be rolling in his grave. A "right" to free doctors? Not in his lifetime. He would say that would be up to the doctors, or up to private charity--surely no business of the government.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Dog On A Mission--- Thank you very much for visiting my Hub and for your fine comments. I didn't mention the West--yet. This Hub ran to 3400 words so I kept it to that. I will publishing a separate article on Socialism in the West soon. It is already written. I'll kick it out this weekend, after this one dies down some.


itakins profile image

itakins 6 years ago from Irl

Interesting-scarily so.

Snitching was encouraged by insurance companies here a few years ago-possibly still is.

I may be repeating myself here,but a few weeks ago I had three of my kids studying-from 1st year university down to middle secondary school- all three were doing something related to Marx and his antics!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

gatorgrad2001--- Do they know you talk this way up in Gainesville?

Just kidding. I have a lot of friends who are Gators.

Thank you for coming by to visit and offering up your fine opinions. And you are surely correct about one thing: I not only never had more than a 12th grade education; I only had an 11th grade education!

Gee, I didn't even address America in this Hub. I truly hope I was not fear-mongering and issuing propaganda. I agree that we have more and more of a hybrid each year here. But I don't see Obama to the right of anybody except avowed Communists. Is this article a rant? I didn't think so. If it is I apologize. I do have a rant coming soon to a theatre near you.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

AdsenseStrategies--- Every time I see that word "Strategies" I think of my favorite game, Stratego. I think my record is 1283-3. :D

I appreciate your comments. Thank you for coming by to visit.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

itakins--- I hope they were debunking Marx, though for some reason I doubt it. I appreciate your comments. Thank you for the visitation. Always great to hear your voice.


prettydarkhorse profile image

prettydarkhorse 6 years ago from US

I think socialism itself is built on the premise of dictatorship, basically men are free thinking individuals, they think differently, mold differently by the kinds of economy, family, education etc that they have, in short the ideas and idealism of socialism is breaking the basic premises that we are equal, we can never be equal because some people are just born different, and we are mold by the society in which we live in -- and equal sharing is a myth, To each according to his abilty-- but be compassionate.

Maybe we are equal only by opportunities? I doubt it.

by traits -no characteristics -no? still no?

Dictators and socilaist like Lenin etc have good ideals but have poor and sadistic impelementation. thats it in socialism, you will be forced to become a dictator because you will need everybody to agree with you, which defies humans capacity to reason.


billyaustindillon profile image

billyaustindillon 6 years ago

A great hub and great to see the discussion about people like Stalin and Lenin - and yes there is hope through it all, As you said Estonia has been through hell but they have come out with their dignity and strong - dignity is something you can never lose. Sometimes you never have it viz. Madame Pelosi!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

prettydarkhorse— Thank you for your wise words. You are a keen observer of human life. In theory, Socialism may not be about dictatorships but in practice this is where it leads every time. How else can it be enforced? You wrote:

"To each according to his ability-- but be compassionate."

I totally agree.

"in socialism, you will be forced to become a dictator because you will need everybody to agree with you, which defies humans capacity to reason."

You are spot on in your analysis. You have a great mind, Maita.

James


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

billyaustindillon— Thank you for your kind words. I am not a big fan of that space cadet, Madame Pelosi. She really makes me wonder about her constituents.


gatorgrad2001 profile image

gatorgrad2001 6 years ago

My apology; you didn't delete my comment. Thank you for observing a democratic forum.


chefaija profile image

chefaija 6 years ago

Being of Latvian descent which was one of the Baltic states taken over by Stalin during World War II I agree with your very informative hub


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

gatorgrad2001— No worries. You are welcome. I have never deleted a comment, and I've had well over 15,000 of them of all stripes.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

chefaija— Well then, who would know better than you what it's all about? Thank you for expressing yourself here. I appreciate your thoughts.


franslovak profile image

franslovak 6 years ago from New Jersey, US

For 21 years of my life in my native Slovakia I have witnessed the "hope and change" and with it the tyranny and descent into a virtual hell. I ran away in 1968 when the Soviet tanks suppressed a peaceful transition to a more human society. Thank you for your contribution and I hope that the American people will wake up and restore this country to its glory of being the unique free society. God Bless the USA.


proud Khmai 6 years ago

"The people of Cambodia welcomed the Khmer Rouge, because they promised non-violence and equality for all."

ignorant post. Did not even mention Pol Pot. I am Cambodian and my mother has told me stories you wouldn't believe. Before you spit more misinformation, do some research or at least be a but more sensitive. The "Khmer Rouge" is something you simple minded westerners who get spoon fed history. Throughout the ENTIRE Cambodian culture, we know them as "Khmai Kahawm" which roughly translate into "Red Cambodians."

And please. All you dumb westerner who think you are cultured, it is not "Khmer". We are Khmai. "Khmer" are what the Surin and Thai call us. The term stuck because Thai culture dominates southeast asia and you fools don't bother to get it right. Dare to pronounce someone's name incorrectly for 40 years and you'd be bitter too.


KeithTax profile image

KeithTax 6 years ago from Wisconsin

An interesting look at history. Most people don't understand how tenuous our freedoms are and the suffering involved if freedom fails.

The lessons of history must be heeded or we risk repeating the failures of the past. You point this out in the myriad societies that suffered repression.

Excellent reading.


Kebennett1 profile image

Kebennett1 6 years ago from San Bernardino County, California

Hi James, I know I have been a ghost lately! Just can't seem to get back in the groove. I love the article. You are right on with your information, as always. People need to open their eyes, ears, and mouths! The United States is on its way to a whole new lifestyle. One we don't want.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

franslovak— Thank you for your fantastic comments. You have lived it therefore you know exactly what I am driving at. One of my dear friends escaped from Prague in 1968 and is now the Czech Consul for Florida. He has educated me as to much of what goes on in a Socialist country. Welcome to the Hub Pages Community.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

proud Khmai— I am sorry I did not write the name of your group correctly. I got the name from several western history books and had no idea it was wrong. And you are right that I should have mentioned Pol Pot by name. I don't know how I missed that. It was all about Pol Pot. Thank you for taking me to task.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Keith Tax— Thank you for coming by and offering your views on this subject. Your comments are wise and excellent.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

Kebennett1— Well, there you are! I am well pleased to hear from you again. Thank you for coming by and leaving your words for me to read.


tdarby profile image

tdarby 6 years ago

Thank you! Easily the best hub I have read in months.


hardinflash profile image

hardinflash 6 years ago from Montana

Boo socialism, Yay capitalism. When you think about it the entire world really runs on capitalism. I don't think there's anyway socialism would ever work for the entire world unless there was

enough food for absolutely everyone and everything

great housing for everyone

good jobs for everyone

equal healthcare for everyone

pretty much enough of everything to go to everyone without anyone having to really work for it. The people that work hardest are always going to want to pull away from the pack and do their own thing because they see that the lazy are benefiting from their efforts as well.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

tdarby— You're welcome. Thank you for making my day with your laudations! :D


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago Author

hardinflash— I appreciate your keen insights. I think you are absolutely correct. Thanks for posting your comments here. And welcome to the Hub Pages Community.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

James, the Nazis may have started out as a socialist party but that all changed when Hitler took over. Hitler's bully-boys fought supporters of communism in the streets of Berlin and other cities while Hitler was worming his way into political power. The threat of communism made Hitler and the Nazis more appealing to the Industrialists of Germany. They thought they could control him and they were wrong.

Stalin was a tyrant. End of story there. Marx would not have approved or even understood how he could be connected to such a man.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago Author

Rod Marsden— You are right, Rod, that Hitler opposed the German communists—because they were mostly Jews who wanted to merge all countries under the Soviet banner. This would never do.

I do appreciate your thoughtful comments. Marx might not have approved of the murder of one hundred million people persay. But he did promote an Atheistic state and the demolition of family and church as obstacles to total state power. He promoted the idea that the state was all important, not any individual person. This is the opposite of the American idea, which has proved most successful.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

James, Hitler THOUGHT Communists were Jews. Marx was born a German Jew therefore there was the notion that all Jews are communists and all communists support the Jews. This in nonsense.

Communists don't believe in religion. Marx wrote that religion is the opiate of the people. He wasn't just referring to Christianity. He was referring to all religions including the one he was born into.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago Author

Hitler was not the only one who thought so. In 1920, Winston Churchill wrote:

"There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews."

In pre-WW1 Germany the Socialist Party, the SPD, was founded by the Jew Ferdinand Lasalle. The Jews Eduard Bernstein and Otto Landsberg were prominent leaders, its leading journalists were Jews as were its Socialist theorists Adolf Braun and Simon Katzenstein.

It was not only in Germany that the association of Jews with Communism was made: all over the world Jews became associated with radical political movements.

In the first government of Communist Russia there were only 13 ethnic Russian Commissars and more than 300 Jewish Commissars out of a total of 384 Commissars. The billionaire New York Jew Jacob Schiff was the revolution's chief financier. Jews were 1.7% of the population of Russia.

Of the 6 members of Lenin's first Politburo, three were Jews, Trotsky, Kamenev and Zinoviev.

In 1919 when a Communist government was established in Hungary four of the five members of the directorate were Jews.

Of the Communist conspirators in the US government during the 1930s-1950s only one was not a Jew: Alger Hiss. (Well, Whitaker Chambers was in at first but got out and testified against the others).

The fact is Marx—an Atheist Jew—wanted to destroy Christianity.

In his 1920 book, British veteran journalist Robert Wilton offered a similarly harsh assessment:

"The whole record of Bolshevism in Russia is indelibly impressed with the stamp of alien invasion. The murder of the Tsar, deliberately planned by the Jew Sverdlov (who came to Russia as a paid agent of Germany) and carried out by the Jews Goloshchekin, Syromolotov, Safarov, Voikov and Yurovsky, is the act not of the Russian people, but of this hostile invader."

Philip Mendes, in his book THE NEW LEFT, THE JEWS AND THE VIETNAM WAR, writes:

"Modern political history indicates a clear connection between being Jewish and being radical, Both as individual theorists and activists of the stature of Marx, Luxemburg, Trotsky and Emma Goldman, and as organized mass labour movements in, for example, revolutionary Russia and early 20th century Britain and the USA, Jews have made a disproportionate contribution to the Left."

As Vladimir Ilich Lenin wrote:

"There the great world-progressive features of Jewish culture stand clearly revealed: its internationalism, its identification with the advanced movements of the epoch (the percentage of Jews in the proletarian movements is everywhere higher than the percentage of Jews among the population)."


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

Churchill could be wrong. Certainly he made serious mistakes that cost a lot of lives during WW1. The Gallipoli mess was his biggest blunder. He did well in WW2 but only for the British.

Marx was born a Jew. He became an atheist. It is wrong to think that he was both Jew and atheist. Can you imagine a Christian who is also an atheist? You would consider that to not only be ridiculous but impossible.

There is too often confusion about Socialism and Communism. One is not the same as the other. You can be a Jew and a Socialist at the same time. You could also be a Christian and a Socialist at the same time. You cannot be a Jew and a Communist and you cannot be a Christian and a Communist.

There was a radical movement among Jews in the 19th Century for those of the Hebrew faith to secure a homeland for themselves. It took on real weight just before and after WW1 when Britain and France were deciding what should be done with the middle east. The Jewish push for a homeland they could call their own became an imperative due to what happened to many Jews during WW2. This was not a Communist movement. If anything it was a religious movement.

Hitler made the Jews into a race rather than a religion. If you were born into a Jewish household, according to the Nazis, you were a Jew for the rest of your life no matter what you thought or felt about the Jewish religion or religion in general. This has to be kept in mind. To Hitler there could be no former Jews.

Marx wanted to see an end to all religion. He wanted to see an end to Christianity but also to the religion he was born into.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago Author

Rod Marsden— Surely I do not attest to the infallibility of Winston Churchill. After all, he was just a man.

Socialism and Communism are siblings. Socialism is attenuated Marxism, while Communism is full blown Marxism. Most Marxists see Socialism as the stepping stone to their aim of Communism.

I agree with you there is no such thing as a Christian Atheist. But most Jews today are Atheists.

Jewish atheism is practiced by atheists who are ethnically, and to some extent culturally, Jewish. Because Jewishness encompasses ethnic as well as religious components, the term "Jewish atheism" does not necessarily imply any kind of contradiction. Based on Jewish law's emphasis on matrilineal descent, Orthodox Jewish authorities would accept as fully Jewish an atheist born to a Jewish mother. If you are born into a Jewish family, you are a Jew, regardless of your contempt for Judaism.

Not only to Hitler but to Jews themselves there are no former Jews. I have written about the founding of Israel:

http://hubpages.com/education/History-of-Israel


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

James, Australian soldiers were involved in that Gallipoli mess so we know what Churchill was like back then. He was better during WW2 but he still made the occasional bad decision that cost lives.

Marx himself saw Socialism as a stepping stone to Communism but he also saw the journey to communism from where the world was when he first wrote on the subject as being rather long, taking generations. He thought in 1840 there would soon be an uprising against the English government and the monarchy. This could have happened but it didn't. The warning signs were there and they were heeded in time.

All Jews today, James, are Jews. Atheists, whatever their family background, are atheists. You either believe in God or you do not. An Agnostic believes in God but does not believe in any particular institution in which to funnel such a belief. When people are persecuted because of their cultural and/or religious backgrounds they tend to close ranks. This I can understand.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago Author

Rod Marsden— Yes, I agree that Churchill made horrendous mistakes in regard to Gallipoli.

I admit the question "Who is a Jew" is a perplexing one. I didn't make up the definition. But by all accounts, even an Atheist born into a Jewish family is still a Jew—even in America where they face no discrimination whatsoever. The word Jew has transcended Judaism and become an ethnicity—according to Jews themselves. In fact the vast majority of American Jews do not believe in Judaism. Look at the ACLU: Mostly Jews but they hate all sign of religion, even Judaism.


wba108@yahoo.com profile image

wba108@yahoo.com 4 years ago from upstate, NY

This is an extrordinary collection of the history of collectivism! These are great examples of how criminals and con men cleverly expliot the character flaws and weaknesses of people to gain power over them. They seem to employ different tactic's to fit the country and culture of those who would be their victims.

It was interesting that in Germany, the NAZI's used a fear of the communist's to empower themselves and then turned around and did exactly what the communists did, to enslave the people. The hope and change slogan in Chile, along with the promise of free health care reminds us of someone we both know!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

wba108@yahoo.com— I am glad you enjoyed this Hub. These are horrific stories. The deaths, the tortures, the surveillence, the fear, the prohibition of worship, the lack of hope . . . staggers my mind.

These regimes reduced people to something less than fully human. Everywhere socialism is implemented it produces the same result. But a recent poll shows than 25% of Americans in their twenties think Socialism is just as good as Free Enterprise! Brainwashing indeed!

Thank you very much for your kind words. I always enjoy your comments. As usual, I sincerely appreciate the visitation. :)


Reco12 4 years ago

The Jewish virtual Library exposes this fool as a liar:

"The point is that industrial behavior under Nazism cannot be reduced to simple structural explanations. Even within the context of a dictatorship that demanded high levels of production for war, industrialists made choices as individuals. They approached the SS for cheap labor; they decided whether to buy a Jewish company at a fraction of its value; they determined how forced and slave laborers would be treated in their factories. "

"The Jewish doctrine of Marxism rejects the aristocratic principle of Nature and replaces the eternal privilege of power and strength by the mass of numbers and their dead weight. Thus it denies the value of personality in man, contests the significance of nationality and race, and thereby withdraws from humanity the premise of its existence and its culture. As a foundation of the universe, this doctrine would bring about the end of any order intellectually conceivable to man. And as, in this greatest of all recognizable organisms, the result of an application of such a law could only be chaos, on earth it could only be destruction for the inhabitants of this planet."

You are a blatant liar and a fool!

Hitler DID support GERMAN private enterprise: read up on KRupp, Flick, IG Farben etc.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— I love the second quote you posted. And Hitler told private business what to do 100%—what to make, how much of it, what would be done with it, and how much would be paid for it. That is Socialist Fascism.

I have no idea why you decided to call me names. I am not a liar or a fool. What do you propose I lied about? By what measure am I foolish?

Anyway, I appreciate the visit from you. Thank you for your comments.

James


Reco12 4 years ago

The Soviets backed Hitler: Is that why Hitler invaded the soviet union with 3 million troops?

"It was a fight against the capitalistic order"

The National socialists coined the word privatization and implemented it on a wide scale. They even privatized banks!

As evidence gathered on the Jewish virtual library suggests, the Nazis were not anti capitalist but pro capitalist.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— The Soviets backed Hitler by allowing him to produce and test his weapons on their soil; they also provided the Nazis with food and metal. This is absolute fact and well known to historians of all stripes. It is true that Hilter invaded Russia. But it also true that Stalin considered this a shocking betrayal because they were allies until that moment.

The reason Hitler hated Communism was he saw it as a Jewish Movement (which it largely was) and so branded his movement Socialist.

Hitler, both in public and in private, expressed strong disdain for capitalism. He opposed free-market capitalism's profit-seeking impulses.

The platform of Adolf Hitler's National Socialist Workers Party (NAZI) includes 25 points and among them are:

11.) That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished (interest from loans, dividends on investments, etc.)and punishable by death.

13. We demand the nationalization of all trusts (not privatization).

14. We demand profit-sharing [with the government] in large industries.

17. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land.

20. The State must assume the responsibility of organizing thoroughly the entire cultural system of the people, including the curricula of all educational establishments .

25. In order to carry out this program we demand the creation of a strong central authority in the State, the unconditional authority by the political central parliament of the whole State and all its organizations.


Reco12 4 years ago

Hitler had the person responsible for the economic parts of the 1920 program removed from his position once he became Furher of the German nation.

None of the contemporary economic analyses of privatization takes into account an earlier and important experience: the privatization policy applied by the Germany’s National Socialist Party (Nazi Party). The lack of reference to this early privatization experience in the modern literature on privatization is consistent with its invisibility in either the recent literature on the Germany economy in the twentieth century (e.g. Braun, 2003) or the history of Germany’s publicly owned enterprise (e.g. Wengenroth, 2000). Occasionally, some authors mention the re-privatization of banks with no additional comment or analysis (e.g. Barkai, 1990, p. 216; James, 1995, p. 291). Other works, like Hardach (1980, p. 66) and Buchheim and Scherner (2005, p. 17), mention the sale of state ownership in Nazi Germany only to support the idea that the Nazi government opposed widespread state ownership of firms. However, they do not carry out any analysis of these privatizations.

. . .

VII. Conclusions Although modern economic literature usually fails to notice it, the Nazi government in 1930s Germany undertook a wide scale privatization policy. The government sold public ownership in several state-owned firms in different sectors. In addition to this, delivery of some public services previously produced by the public sector was transferred to the private sector

Against the Mainstream: Nazi Privatization in 1930s Germany, by Germa Bel

Hitler supported GERMAN capitalism. Again look up Krupp, Flick Hugo Boss etc.

If you call Nazi Germany socialist: South Korea would be a socialist state: five year plans, price controls in PEACE TIME!

Hitler was an anti-communist for the same reason General Pinochet and Reagan were anti communists. Disdain for Marxism.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— While I appreciate your comments, any comparison between Nazi Germany and South Korea is utterly ridiculous. South Korea is a free country built on free enterprise. North Korea is closer to Nazi Germany in ideology. Nazi Germany was not free by any measure. Just because some capitalists were allowed to continue to run their businesses ONLY IF they were allied with the Nazi ideology and made what Hitler told them to make and distributed it according to his orders (far from free enterprise by any measure) and that only because Hitler looked around and didn't think he had any other men capable (bureaucrats) of running those businesses as well to continue to produce goods required to make war on the world, does not by any means make Nazism resemble South Korea.

There is no comparison to be made between Ronald Reagan, the greatest president in the history of the United States (save Washington) and Adolf Hitler. Reagan saw Communism for the evil that it is by seeing what you should be able to see: the 100 million dead souls killed by that satanic ideology. Hitler only disdained it because its author was a Jew, just as he would have disdained Milton Friedman's economic concepts. Had Marx been an Aryan Hitler would have been a Communist because totalitarian control over the populace is what he wanted and what all communist atheists want.


Reco12 4 years ago

"Nazi Germany and South Korea is utterly ridiculous. "

Their economic system was exactly the SAME!(except South Korea nationalized its commercial banks while Nazi Germany privatized them).

Park at first arrested fifty-one Chaebols on the charge of “illicit profiteering,” and confiscated their property. But Park Chung-hee realized that it would need the help of the entrepreneurs of the government's ambitious plans. These leading Chaebols were

released on only after they had signed an agreement stating: “I will donate allmy property when the government requires it for nation construction.” Most Korean Chaebols were placed on parole and their freedom depended strictly on their business performance and cooperation with government.

Source: Park Chung-hee’s Industrialization Policy pg:

and its Lessons for Developing Countries

A Paper for the World Congress for Korean Studies-2007

While the Nazis encouraged illicit profiteering(especially in the east) of their capitalists, South Korea had the Committee for the Prosecution of Illicit Profiteering which punished capitalists.

Built on free enterprise? Bah!

Leon Degrelle, Nazi and ardent anti communist from Belgium, favorable compared Reagan to Hitler:

"Since Hitler, only Ronald Reagan has seemed to understand this. As President, he realized that to restore prosperity in the United States meant boldly stimulating the economy with credits and a drastic reduction in taxes, instead of waiting for the country to emerge from economic stagnation on its own."


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— I am sorry but I cannot buy into any of your crazy notions. The fact is that the Left of the political spectrum includes Nazis, Socialists, Communists, Fascists, and so-called Progressives. What defines the Left is its fondness for huge governments and rule by experts and distaste for individual freedom and economic freedom. I am aware that some scholars conspired after WWII to put Hitler on the Right and I don't blame them—nobody wants all of history's mass murderers at the head of their own ideology. But during his lifetime Hitler was well known as a radical leftist who wanted the government to decide everything about everything—the Socialist's dream.


Reco12 4 years ago

"What defines the Left is its fondness for huge governments and rule by experts and distaste for individual freedom and economic freedom."

Not true, in the Spanish civil war for example the anarchists were left wing and actually established a society. The Right were represented by Franco, Hitler and Mussolini!

Also in Chile, Pinochet was far more dictatorial than his socialist opponent Salvador Allende.

If Hitler is a great socialist, than South Korea is a SOCIALIST NATION and so is Japan. When south Korea had free market polices(1950s) it was poorer than the north. When Park Chun Hee followed a fascist economic system and openly admired imperial Japan and Nazi Germany. South Korea owes more the economic model of Nazi Germany than it does to the US.


wba108@yahoo.com profile image

wba108@yahoo.com 4 years ago from upstate, NY

James-- It seems that many on the left look at Hitlers persecution of the communists as proof that fascism is right wing but their reasoning suffers from the fallacy of false cause.

Often family quarrels are the nastiest, Hitler murdered and blackballed many of his fellow Nazi's. Stalin slandered and murdered his fellow communist leader, leon Trotsky and accused him of being a fascist! Sound familiar! The left likes to throw around the term fascist to label anyone who disagree's with them, even their fellow lefties who fail to tow the party line as they see it.


Reco12 4 years ago

Hitler's capitalist economy and friendship with the Right shows that he was indeed a rightwinger.


wba108@yahoo.com profile image

wba108@yahoo.com 4 years ago from upstate, NY

Hitler had no capitalist society, any descretion that was afforded business owners was for the purpose of enhancing his own power and that of the Nazi war machine. You might refer to this arrangement as state capitalism which is a synonym for socialism.

Hitler was no friend of the free market but he would use anyone if it served his ends.


Reco12 4 years ago

State capitalism is not socialism. It is state directed capitalism where capitalists still have a lot of power(profits) etc. Hugo Boss made his fortune under Hitler whilst samsung became a huge company under the dictatorship of Park Chun Hee.

Indeed, after the war many Nazis fled to west Germany.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— The proper political scale of Left to Right would be massive government on the farthest Left and NO government on the farthest Right. In other words, Anarchists would sit on the farthest Right because they want no government at all. Who would be next to them? Libertarians, of course, who want the bare minimum of government. Then who? Various shades of Conservatives, who put a high premium of minimal government interference with the Free Market (Laissez-faire for example), individual rights, freedom, liberty, Federalism (authority in local, county, state, and regional autonomy), anti-bureaucratic, etc.

On the farthest Left are those who absolute government control over every aspect on human life, the Totalitarians, who are nearly always Communists and Atheists. They do not want the Individual, the Family, or the Church to stand in the way of their utopian schemes. Next to them come Authoritarians, generally always Socialists and Fascists. They are willing to share power with those who agree with them but there is hell to pay for those who don't. Next to them would be various shades of Progressives, usually anti-Christ ideologues who don't have the power to implement Totalitarianism or Authoritarianism, but they do all they can through Courts and Bureaucracies by which they can subvert Democratic Republicanism, bypass the legislative process, and twist the Rule of Law to pick winners in advance.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

wba108@yahoo.com— Thank you very much for coming by to check out my article. It is always a pleasure to hear from you. Your comments are right on. Well said.

Hitler hated Communists only because he hated Jews and he correctly perceived that Communism was a Jewish movement. Socialism is also, more or less, but at least for it Hitler could cite some non-Jewish German and French philosophers who were also in on the ground floor of that insidious ideology.


danielabram 4 years ago

Socialism seems to be working in the UK, Sweden, Norway, and other Western European countries.


Reco12 4 years ago

"The proper political scale of Left to Right would be massive government on the farthest Left and NO government on the farthest Right."

The only anarchists have been the leftwing anarchists in spain who fought against the right wing totalitarianism of Franco and his two allies Hitler and Mussolini.

South Korea adopted the capitalist planed economy(fascism) from Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany(Park Chun Hee had been an officer in the Japanese army and an admirer of Adolf Hitler).

Indeed, you justify totalitarianism in your part about Chile saying that "Finally, the military had to take him out to save Chile from complete chaos and collapse. ". Did you forget to mention the 17 years of the brutal fascist dictatorship that followed.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— No, Hitler was not on the Right of the political spectrum. He believed that the sole purpose of industry was to serve the interests of his government and that is always a Leftist position. The Right stands for Freedom, individualism, Free Enterprise, and Christianity—all things the Left abhors as did Adolf Hitler. Hitler was an occultist and neopagan and there are none of these on the Right.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

wba108@yahoo.com— Thank you very much for your brilliant comments! I always enjoy reading your sensible opinions. Well said! Thanks again.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— Park was a dictator. However he is credited with playing a pivotal role in the development of South Korea's free market economy by shifting its focus to export-oriented industrialization—not at all what Hitler did or had in mind.

When Park came to power in 1961, South Korea's per capita income was only US$ 72.00. North Korea was the greater economic and military power on the peninsula due to the North's legacy of Japanese-built facilities such as the power and chemical plants, and also the large amounts of economic, technical and financial aid it received from other communist bloc countries.

If you truly want to see the difference between socialism and a free market economy take a look at South Korea and North Korea today—especially at night. North Korea had your system—the worst blight ever visited upon the human race.

South Korea is a presidential republic that has a very high standard of living because it has a market economy which ranks 14th in the world by nominal GDP.

In 2011 North Korea had the lowest Democracy Index of any nation on earth, which is perfectly natural for a Socialist country. North Korea is one of only two states (along with Cuba) with an almost entirely government-planned, state-owned economy. The Central Planning Committee prepares, supervises and implements economic plans, while a General Bureau of Provincial Industry in each region is responsible for the management of local manufacturing facilities, production, resource allocation and sales. That IS Socialism in its pure form. The average official salary in 2011 was equivalent to $2 per month while the actual monthly income seems to be around $15 because most North Koreans earn money in illegal small businesses. That is the system you love. Multiple international human rights organizations accuse North Korea of having one of the worst human rights records of any nation: the desired outcome of Socialism.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

danielabram— Welcome to the HubPages Community! I appreciate the visit and your comments.

You write: "Socialism seems to be working in the UK, Sweden, Norway, and other Western European countries"

But none of those countries is Socialist. They are each and every one countries built on Capitalism and still operating under principles of Free Market Economics. Socialist countries are more like the USSR, Nazi Germany, Red China, North Korea, Cuba, Cambodia, and all the nations that were once imprisoned behind the Iron Curtain. All of these claimed to be Socialist and most had the word "Socialist" in the name of their country.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— All Totalitarian governments have been Leftists for it is the Left that seeks to sunjugate all individuals under the thumb of the almighty State. That is why Socialists are always anti-Christ and anti-Family—they brook no competition for absolute power and sovereignty.


Reco 4 years ago

South Korea was in mass poverty under the disastrous free market system they had! It was only when they replaced with the COMMAND ECONOMY south Korea started to grow massively and overtake the north. South Korea Owes nothing to the free market system(unless you count those who starved to death in the 50s).

INdeed, South Korea actually proves the failure of free market economics. It was in deserate poverty but was lifted out of poverty by Park Chun Hee;s command economy

Nazi Germany also had a capitalist command economy and did Imperial Japan.

Capitalists built the crematoriums(topf and sons) , had privately owned factories at the death camps, used slave labor to boost profits etc.: The fact that you deny it tells me alot about you!

South Korea's owes more to their economic models than it does to the failed free market system.


Reco12 4 years ago

Park was a dictator. However he is credited with playing a pivotal role in the development of South Korea's free market economy

Wrong Wrong and WRONG!

Park NEVER planed to end the planed economy, Hitler did(as albert Speer recounts):

it would reassure his audience immensely if he were to speak about "a free economy after the war and a fundamental rejection of nationalized industry." Hitler made this speech and, by and large, took up these points.

"inside the third Reich":

books.google.com.auAlbert Speer - 1971 - 734 pages

Park Chun Hee, Chang Kai shek etc had were proponents of fascist economics.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— You obviously do not know what a planned economy is. My dictionary only gives one example: the USSR. South Korea in no way resembles the USSR but the USSR model can be found in North Korea.

Any fool can see that South Korea is a MARKET ECONOMY that ranks 15th in the world while North Korea, using your economic model, is one of the poorest. I don't know if you are insane or a liar but South Korea has a market economy and an annual per person income of about $32,000 while North Korea has your system—COMMAND ECONOMY—and has an annual per person income of $1,800. How you can call South Korea a "failed free market system" is beyond the pale of anyone with a sound mind.

Thank you for your comments.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— I appreciate your visits and remarks. I do understand that before Park Chun Hee South Korea was plagued by rampant corruption but you can't blame that on Free Markets. The most free market countries have historically been the least corrupt of all countries. Perhaps a strong man was required to rid the country of old habits.

On the World Map of individual freedom South Korea is with the best countries and North Korea with the worst. On almost any scale of human development North Korea is at the bottom and South Korea comes out very well among nations.

http://hubpages.com/education/First-World-Second-W...


Reco12 4 years ago

South Korea had a command economy which was modeled on the Japanese Imperial economy and the Economy of National Socialist Germany.

Historians state: "If anything, his rule in both style and deed recalled Hitler's Germany or Tojo's Japan, minus the military adventurism."

Park Chun Hee hated the free market and especially the free market capitalists: He believed that the state should direct the economy.


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 4 years ago from Chicago Author

Reco12— What historians are you quoting there?


Mike McDade UK 3 years ago

Very scholarly. Very American. Very biased. Very capitalist.

First truth - The implementers of all these regimes hijacked socialist ideology and used it as a veneer to hide their collective objectives - power of the few over power of the many. This is just another form of capitalism. The ideology of true socialism is not to blame.

Second truth - The implementers of all so-called "Christian" political regimes have hijacked true Christianity and used it as a veneer to hide their collective objectives - power of the few over power of the many. This is a form of capitalism. The ideology of true Christianity is not to blame.

Third truth - True Christianity preaches relief from suffering by means of a theocratic rulership kingdom. It encourages a waiting attitude. True Socialism preaches relief from suffering by means of a truly democratic movement. Neither are currently administered effectively in society.

Fourth truth - capitalism as a system is seriously flawed as it is unfair. Simply reforming it or patching it up will not make things better - that is just like polishing dog mess. MANY THOUSANDS DIE DAILY ON THE ALTAR OF CAPITALISM.

Humans collectively can eradicate the unnecessary suffering caused by political inequity if they act collectively against oppression from a self-imposed ruling class. Perhaps then, if theocratic order does materialise, our creator won't have quite so many people to resurrect.


Dane 3 years ago

The problem here is that none of these individuals or countries ever actually put Socialism or Communism. In all instances, the State seized power through manipulative and violent means and then imposed a totalitarian and oppressive regime. The fact that the masses were manipulated by the promises of Socialism and Communism does not make either one of those doctrines culpable. Many political and religious doctrines have been used to manipulate the masses into doing what the few in power want them to do.

You cannot invalidate Socialism or Communism because of the acts of evil men that used those ideas merely as a pretext to something more devious. If you want to invalidate either idea than you have to do so on the merits of the idea itself and not do not based on how someone manipulated the idea for personal gain.


sally 14 months ago

god theres alot of comments

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