We are Stardust! Forget this Jesus!

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   qwarkposted 13 years ago

   The Big Bang created only hydrogen, helium, and small amounts of lithium.  All other elements were created in the cores of stars, and in supernovas when some stars exploded.  Our solar system was formed out of the remnants of supernovas.  We are formed out of our solar system.  We are stardust. The stars died so that we could be here today."

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      Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      quark, you may be stardust. I am not.

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Oh I know Woman:
         You are "special."
         You exist outside the realm of science.
         I understand you intoto.....:-)

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            Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Thank you, everyone is special. God is the reason science exist. How can I exist outside the realm of it?

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               qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               ..you cannot!  :-)

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         pisean282311posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         @woc what qwark is saying is not to contradict any one's faith..what he is saying applies to every species and you or me or anyone can't be out of it...what he is saying is plain fact...like one falls due to gravity..one cannot debate on that woc...your statement is like you inhale oxygen but i dont...how is that possible?...

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            Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Hi pisean, I believe in the word of God. It is written in Genesis 2:7- The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul. God's word never stated that we are stardust, therefore I have no reason to believe that. I agree we all inhale oxygen, if not I would not be alive. If I said to someone: We are planets, it wouldn't be true. I understand everyone does not believe in God, but I do, and he is the only who can define who I am. I don't mean any harm and I am not trying to start arguments, I simply speaking from my belief.

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               Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               So, I guess you don't define who you are? By your statement above, all you are is a puppet to be played with.
               
               Good to know.

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                  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Casil, Why are you guessing? My post clearly stated GOD  defines who I am. I am allowing God to use me for his glory, and my heart is filled with joy. Thanks for the nice comment.

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               spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               "God's word never stated that we are stardust, therefore I have no reason to believe that."
               
               Accprding to that reasoning, you can't believe the earth is round, because it's not stated in the bible.

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                  Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  spookyfox, Actually, I have every reason to believe the earth is round. Isaiah 40:22. It is stated in the bible. Thanks for your mockery. Have a nice day!

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                     spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Ok, I've read Isaiah 40:22. Do you know the difference between a circle and a sphere?

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                     LeslieAdrienneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     We do, but they did not....

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                        Woman Of Courageposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Agreed.

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         couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Sorry, guys.  Qwark is right.  We're all made of the same electrons and energy.  Stardust might be a bit simplistic but the fact remains.  This does not negate any living or perceived deity, religion, or faith.  But knowledge of what you are physically made up of should make you more concious of a divinity factor, not lessen it.  The mind is the frontier to finding out why we are here - not as in we are here because God decided one day to create a planet full of people so he could watch them fail then try to prove their love for him against all modernity.
         
         Once humanity 'gets' that we are one huge mass of energy in objective form, we may indeed 'see' God in all the glorious light from which we came.
         
         Digest that for a while.  I'll be back.

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Couture:
            Pls define this "god" thing you speak of.
            I can't consider your comment until I know what "it" is you refer to.
            Thanks......:-)

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            Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Couture, That's a good comment. I'd like to frame that and put it on my wall. Fully digested, it doesn't even upset my stomach. Unfortunately, those who would benefit most from your words are too busy patting themselves on the back for being so much smarter than those of us who have glimpsed apocalypse and know the truth.

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      Ruben Riveraposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      So why don't you forget Jesus and let others believe what they want.  Very simple.

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Ruben:
         Forget who? Neither you or I know this jesus guy...:-)

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      Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      A while back, my son when he was was about 6y came home from school (had a wee bit of religious ed) and said, "do you believe in God".  I said, "I used to, but I don't see how God has ever helped me".  He said matter-of-factly, "I don't believe in God.  I believe we are made from star-dust (he had been reading books about the solar system at that time).  My mother would have been horrified, but I am so proud of him being an independent thinker at such a young age

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         BAiley" Standing ovation to your son!

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            Baileybearposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            he's a very bright boy - he's a thinker - has Asperger's like me - he's very matter of fact about it all.  Very mature

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               qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               BAiley  and yer proud of him as you well should be!!!

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               DrMikeFitzpatrickposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               the truth IS supposed to set one free.....

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      vox vocisposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      And who created the stars, the universe?

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         ...that is such a trite question that I won't respond.

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            hanging outposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            always a stumper LOL

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               pisean282311posted 13 years agoin reply to this

               well question has three different answers

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      Disappearingheadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Qwark Why do you think that stating we are made of stardust precludes Jesus? The two are not mutually exclusive. What makes you think that all believers see the creation account as being literall? Why can't you accept that much of the church endorses the big bang, planetary ecretion, primordial soup and dinosaurs? Many in the church think young Earth creationists are talking complete nonsense.

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Disappear:
         Jesus? Jesus who?
         If there was a jesus, he was nothing more than just another who came before us, made of the same stardust.
         I have never met a monotheist who accepted any of the subjects you mentioned, who hasn't ended by saying but "god" is responsible for it all...lol
         By the way, there is no scripture in any monotheistic tome that defines this "god thing" in any manner but opinion and conjecture.
         What the hell is "it?"  hmmm?

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      Rochelle Frankposted 13 years agoin reply to this

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         "Cosmologists (scientists who study the origin of the universe) believe the universe began as an infinitely dense, hot fireball. They call this single point that contained all the matter in the universe a singularity. Time began at the moment this fireball exploded, stretching space as it expanded rapidly. (Space into which the fireball exploded did not exist separately, but was a part of the fireball at the beginning.) The universe, at first no bigger than the size of a proton, expanded within a microsecond to the size of a basketball. Gravity came into being, and subatomic particles flooded the universe, slamming into one another, forming protons and neutrons (elementary particles that form atoms).
         
         Three minutes after the big bang, the temperature of the universe had cooled to 500,000,000°F (277,777,760°C). Protons and neutrons began to combine to form the nuclei of the simple chemical elements hydrogen, helium, and lithium. Five hundred thousand years later, atoms formed."
         
         This is why it's called a theory.
         No person alive today can answer your question as an absolute.

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            spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Actually, many (if not most) cosmologists today believe there was a time before the big bang. I didn't know this until I saw the dcumentary I mentioned earlier, What happened before the Big Bang from BBC Horizon.

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   Daniel Carterposted 13 years ago

   Maybe this preacher should live with the believers. Seems he is as adamant as all of them.
   
   Just sayin'....

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Dan:
      What preacher is that?
      All that I posted is based upon the theory of the "big bang" and what followed.

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         exorterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         qwart you posted ["All that I posted is based upon the theory of the "big bang" and what followed"]
         Your words BASED ON THEORY
         that does not sound like science to me, a lot of people come up with theory, that does not make it fact

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Exorter: I Can't disagree with ya...:-)

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   Disturbiaposted 13 years ago

   We are stardust, we are golden,
   We are billion year old carbon,
   And we got to get ourselves back to the garden. -- Joni Mitchell

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Hi Disturbia:
      What "garden?"

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         Disturbiaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         LOL, I don't know qwark... but you just can't say the words "we are star dust" to anyone from my generation and not expect it to immediately conjure up memories of Woodstock.  The song was performed by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young and played over the radio about a hundred times a day.  But I would guess the "garden" is whatever someone might want it to be.  I'm sure we all have our own personal garden.  You could always ask Joni Mitchell, she wrote the song. 
         
         
         WOODSTOCK
         I came upon a child of god
         He was walking along the road
         And I asked him, where are you going
         And this he told me
         I’m going on down to yasgur’s farm
         I’m going to join in a rock ’n’ roll band
         I’m going to camp out on the land
         I’m going to try an’ get my soul free
         
         We are stardust
         We are golden
         And we’ve got to get ourselves
         Back to the garden
         
         Then can I walk beside you
         I have come here to lose the smog
         And I feel to be a cog in something turning
         Well maybe it is just the time of year
         Or maybe it’s the time of man
         I don’t know who l am
         But you know life is for learning
         
         We are stardust
         We are golden
         And we’ve got to get ourselves
         Back to the garden
         
         By the time we got to woodstock
         We were half a million strong
         And everywhere there was song and celebration
         And I dreamed I saw the bombers
         Riding shotgun in the sky
         And they were turning into butterflies
         Above our nation
         
         We are stardust
         Billion year old carbon
         We are golden
         Caught in the devil’s bargain
         And we’ve got to get ourselves
         Back to the garden

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Disturbia:
            I'll pass...lol    :-)

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            hanging outposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            garden of eden
            6,000yrs, how quickly we forget lol
            

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            AKA Winstonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Actually, it was performed at Woodstock by Crosby, Stills, and Nash.  Neil Young was not part of the original group that performed.

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            couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Disturbia - I guess you had to be there.  I was.  I get it.  Loved being a damn hippie.  Born and raised in north Jersey, only a few hours drive from Yasgur's farm.  Bands being flown in because roads were jammed for 100 miles in all directions.  Who knew?  We thought we were going to change the world.  We changed it alright.  For the better?  Don't know.  Does anything ever really change?  Don't know.
            
            Bottom line - the song is about the search for man's soul, getting back to the garden is a reference to getting back to innocence, clarity, love.  Being in touch with the essence of our humanity - whatever you believe that to be.
            
            Drugs or not, CSN&Y had it going on in the lyrics department.

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   Daniel Carterposted 13 years ago

   Now worries, qwark. It's all good.
   It's probably just me in a snit.

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   spookyfoxposted 13 years ago

   "The Cosmos is also within us, we're made of star stuff"
   Carl Sagan

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Amen Spooky!

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   Zenofsongposted 13 years ago

   Qwark. You're trying to explain the origins of the universe to primates. My suggestion is wrapping the truth in a delicious banana!

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Hahaha...I love it.
      I was eating a banana when I created this question.
      We "simians" do love our fruits and veggies.
      Great reply Zeno!    :-)

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   aka-djposted 13 years ago

   Dear quark.
   It's so sad that you can only fall back to a now defunct theory. It is not a universally accepted theory. And csertainly not fact.
   As for me, I'm happy to back, before this "Big Bang" event, and worship Him, who made all things including the stardust.
   
   What tiny bit of woth you place on precious human beings.
   Someone calculated the total physical makeup of our bodies, and calculated that all the chemicals that make us, is worth less than $100 (US, I bet)
   Perhaps stardust is a little more.

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Aka-j: is English your native language? if it isn't, I'll forgive you for offering a comment with so many spelling and grammatical mistakes.
      If English is your native language, arent you embarrassed by the many mistakes you made?
      Whew. I could never post something like that. Too much pride I guess.
      Tch tch .

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         aka-djposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Good reply.
         Not a word of a response to the content I so badly spellled.
         I guess I hit a raw nerve.
         
         I'll brush up on my gramma tooo.
         T hanks.

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      spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Another Sagan quote:
      
      "The beauty of a living thing is not the atoms that go into it, but the way those atoms are put together."

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      spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      There's been a recent documentary from the BBC Horizon series about that, called What happened before the big bang. It states the flaws with the theories and what's being done to try to fill in the gaps.

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   Zenofsongposted 13 years ago

   Who is this him that created everything?

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   hanging outposted 13 years ago

   Perhaps the contents of expired stars is similar to what God used to create us. As humans we get the deceiving opportunity to look at everything after the fact. It is easy to mix N match and assemble pieces together, but how accurate is that?
   
   Biologists look at the eye of a human and say wow, evolution knows how to make an eye! But really, what told evolution that the human being needed such an evolved eye? Was it a good guess? Was it 'keen insight', some strange foreknowledge? or random development, while the poor flatworm only got a optic spot which we would have had if it had not been for intelligent design of God.

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      pisean282311posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      well what religion calls god and what science can call god are not much different at nano level..except that religious god is more human like while science god is more machine like... religious god can feel , can judge , can become happy ..those are human like trait ..may be so scriptures state god made human in its own image..while atheist say it is other way round
      
      coming to larger point ...science's god is forces and hero is gravitational force...without which universe wont be possible...now naturally comes a question who put this forces at place?..science cannot answer convincingly out here...religion comes with absolute called god...when asked what created god...that is not convincingly answered by religion too..
      
      so i guess human species would need much more time to reach to logically conclusive answers to the questions...

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Pisean:
         The human species exists at a level of infancy.
         Man is still groping for "truths."

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            pisean282311posted 13 years agoin reply to this

            agreed..

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            fatfistposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            
            
            
            Never mind that.....I was groped in Church last Sunday!
            

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               qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Fatfist:
               Did'ya catch his name?   :-)

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                  fatfistposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  
                  
                  Yes, his name is Ted Haggard.
                  He later offered to psychologically counsel me in private at his residence.....as long as I don't report the incident to the authorities. 

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                     qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Hahaha...the truth is stranger than fiction...lol

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               wyanjenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               
               
               Congrats on your HP anniversary

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      AKA Winstonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      "Perhaps the contents of expired stars is similar to what God used to create us."
      
      So you are saying that matter has always existed and therefore there was no need for creation of matter.  O.K.  I agree.  But for God to create us he would have to be something, not nothing.  So he, too, would have to be made of matter.
      
      So you are saying that God is simply a word that is used to describe all matter that has eternally existed and occasionally bumps into each other causing changes which we define as creation - because the existing matter has been reaarranged into a different combination and looks different?
      
      That means that we are all part of God as God is all matter, and therefore we are all eternal.  Good theory.  I accept. 
      
      At the same time, your irreducibly complex eyeball theory is just dumb, as it assumes only one type of eye has evolved, which is simply inaccurate, and it also assumes maximum vision is necessary to be a benefit, a non-sequitor.

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         fatfistposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         
         
         God is completely powerless to the formidable power of the matter comprising your pinkie finger! God can be made to move at the will of any object in the Universe via gravitational pull. Just by the mere motion of your pinkie, God shakes, vibrates, and dances like a puppet!
         
         The moment God decided to declare His authority over the Universe, He was instantly stripped of all His superpowers by space & matter, and instantly stripped of His “free will” by gravity.
         
         God is only a Super Megalomaniac and an Arrogant Tormentor in the conceptual realm; within the “controlled” environment of the mythological Bibles His followers author. Out here, in reality, things work much differently. Matter recognizes NO authorities. Matter necessarily FORCES the God of the Bible to bow down before it; whether He likes it or not; no matter how much He protests, and no matter how many death threats He makes.
         
         Even the motion of an amoeba instantly turns God into its own personal "hand puppet"

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Fatfist:
            Wow! Well thought out and presented!
            Standing ovation!!!!   :-)

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               Druid Dudeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Good to see some music fans here. Don't know what illegal substance fatfist ingested, but without GOD(Energy) matter would not exist PERIOD, or i'll even accept that matter is a by product of said energy. But matter is not King of the universe. No one of the "nonbelievers" seem able to grasp the concept that the sum total of all energy could be conscious, which puts the big "G" firmly in control of not just your incomplete concepts but also Stephen Hawking's.

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                  qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Druid:
                  Energy is your defintion of this biblical god thing?
                  Or, are you just saying that you are using the term "god" to replace the word energy? Energy/god same subject?
                  Ok, NP, I'll refer to energy as, lets see,..uhhh...spinach. Ok with you?
                  Now lets see how your comment reads:
                  "... but without Spinach(Energy) matter would not exist PERIOD."
                  " which puts the big "S" firmly in control of not just your incomplete concepts but also Stephen Hawking's."
                  Do I have it right?
                  Makes sense to me...damn! I never quite thought of it that way.
                  Enlightenment comes when ya least expect it!
                  TY sir!!!      :-)

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                     AKA Winstonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Now you understand Popeye's secret of Spinach!

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                        qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Hahaha..  yep AKA..sensical as hell...lolol...:-)

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                  fatfistposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  
                  
                  Druid,
                  
                  “Don't know what illegal substance fatfist ingested”
                  
                  The same one that Ted Haggard was ingesting while he was calling me “a luscious, sweet, and tender boy”. You see, I made the mistake of accepting his offer for private spiritual counselling.
                  
                  
                  “But matter is not King of the universe”
                  
                  You would be dead wrong. But I welcome you to EDUCATE me in my hub: “Creation is Impossible”. Not a single person in the history of humanity has been able to rationally explain that Creation is even a REMOTE possibility.......the key word being REMOTE!
                  
                  But yet, YOU know what you are talking about. So let’s have an honest to goodness discussion in my hub......ME and YOU. Or if you like, bring some Creationist friends to teach me a thing or two.
                  
                  See you there. And if you don’t show up, the audience will know that you were flaunting your ignorance all along! Don’t be scared....I don’t bite....like Ted Haggard does.

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                  AKA Winstonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  (but without GOD(Energy) matter would not exist PERIOD)
                  
                  DD,
                  
                  The default position is that matter is.  I think we can all pretty much agree on the natural phenomena that matter is here in the present.  It is real.
                  
                  Now, because "it is" is the default position, anyone who wishes to explain how this matter came to be has the responsibility to explain in a rational manner how that occured.  Otherwise, matter must be eternal.  If matter has not always been, from what was it created and what was the step-by-step process that transpired to create matter?
                  
                  Keep in mind, assertions such as "without God matter would not exist" is not a rational explanation but an irrational one, simply an unverifiable claim, as unverifiable as saying matter was made by the Easter Bunny or by Puff the Magic Dragon from directions found on a Peter, Paul, and Mary record played backwards.
                  
                  Rational minds do not accept irrational explantions such as the Easter Bunny or backward-played records.  Please explain in detail the processes God used to turn nothing into matter so I can copy that process and hopefully learn to turn lead into gold.
                  
                  Thanks.

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    Eco_Aliposted 13 years ago

    Couture: I thought we got caught in bumper to bumper traffic that day and decided to turn around and go to Seaside?? LOL!!
    
    Please forgive me, I'm new here but I must contribute my thoughts. There is no evidence, no “normal science” to say that God, the Supreme Being and universal energy source did not project divine thought and set in motion the laws of thermodynamics that governed the creation of the universe, the function and structure of DNA and the evolution of life on earth.  The scientific community, bound by their shared and non-negotiable paradigms, themselves, takes a leap of faith when forced to accept a scientific revolution. 
    
    Perhaps God is the final answer that sits forebodingly on the tip of the tongue of science, disturbing their logic and putting their science in crisis.  Surely there is some connection to the phenomena of the physical world and our greater extended spiritual family.  Somewhere, somehow beyond our limited capacities, there is a force that transcends the neutron, proton, and electron, the amino acids and nucleotides and manifests itself in a fraction of a nano second as the inanimate becomes the animate and then again the inanimate and so on... oscillating through a higher power of realms than we have already been privilege to perceive. 
    
    Perhaps God created the universe, the earth and all its creatures in His mind and then spoke it into existence....but what are the boundaries and parameters of the mind of God?  And what is the force of His breath?  What is beyond the universe? The only hermeneutics allowed at this stage is what Faith will bring and what the limited laws of physics and thermodynamics will allow.

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       spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps. Isn't that the beauty of this subject? The grand perhaps. And you want to take it away, kill it.
       
       The problem with your argument is that we've been there before. Do you not realize that people have used the 'then who did this if not god' argument to explain pretty much everything that wasn't obvious? Do you not know that the movements of the planets and spheres "around the Earth", as was once thought, was explained by bringing up god, so were thunders and rain.
       
       There is no evidence that god didn't create the Universe you say. Well, there is no evidence that Zeus didn't do it either, or a dog with a top hat. There is no reason to prove a negative. What would be the point in actually setting as a goal proving that the inside of black holes is not made of marshmellows? If it is, let us find out when the time comes. But what we do know certainly, is that there is no evidence in Nature itself of a divine plan, inherent to it, independent from the human emotions you could attach to it.
       
       As science progresses the room left for god is getting smaller. Every natural disaster used to be the wrath of god, now we know it's due to temperature changes and natural Earth processes. If everyone thought like you did, there'd be no progress, because that reasoning is precisely what's wrong with religion: if you use god to fill every gap of ignorance instead of actually trying to learn how Nature works, you'll remain ignorant, thinking you have all the answers.

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    Eco_Aliposted 13 years ago

    I dug out a pond in my back yard and lined it with a variety of wetland plants, submerged and emergent varieties I've used time and time again in other landscapes I've designed. I then stacked small granite boulders fashioning them into what appeared to be a springfed cascading waterfall. Then I bought some koi and a few tadpoles and stocked my pond with wildlife to enjoy my creation.  Later in the season those tadpoles lost their tails, grew legs and for every year after, there appeared bullfrogs that would sit on the rocks croaking away and sunning themselves much to my delight. I pondered the thoughts of these frogs, what were they thinking as they sat on these rocks. Did they know where they came from? Did they have any idea at all of what was beyond my fenced in back yard? And I had to ask myself how arrogant would I be if I pretended to understand those mysteries of time, space and life myself. Relatively speaking of course, how am I, as I ponder my universe, so much different than those frogs??

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       Troy C.posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Stardust 1. a mass of distant stars appeariing as tiny particles of dust. No I don't think I'm stardust. I'll stick to, "child of God." Saved by the grace of God through the sacrifice of his Son, Jesus Christ.
       
                                         God Bless, Troy C.

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          qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          ..but Troy:
          You don't know anything about this jesus and yer only guessing about this "god thing."
          You haven't done yer homework have  ya?
          Tell ya what, I like to help.
          Go to the Google site and study all those things that the ancients never even considered..ok? Eventually, you'll have an enlightening epiphany. I promise.
          Now go for it! Study will clear it all up for ya..Ok?

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12. 60

    ediggityposted 13 years ago

    I completely agree about the dust:
    
    Genesis 2:7
    
    God formed man [of] the dust of the ground, and breathed
    into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living
    soul.

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13. 60

    qwarkposted 13 years ago

    You see? monotheists will agree to evolution and all the "truisms" offered by non-believers, but they end a comment with: "but god is responsible for it all." lol
    The pope agreed with Hawking and had to have the last word: " I agree but god is responsible for it all."

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    1. 59

       spookyfoxposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       That's what religion is being reduced to, a comment at the end of a statement, an overall feeling of unity and purpose, an emotional cushion in which to fall, no longer an explanation at all, but a nice ribbon to wrap it all up and feel content.

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       1. 60

          qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          Agreed! but god tells 'em to do it...lol

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