Supernatural Experiences - Separating Mind From Body

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   couturepopcafeposted 13 years ago

   When the mind is separated from the body - the state known as transcorporeal - it has been reported that all coverings are removed from the Light.
   
   People who have had near death experiences report seeing a light.  What does it take to achieve such states intentionally?  Meditation?

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      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Its not actually separation that is occurring it just seems that way. It is more of an integration where the two, that we think are separate, arise as they are in its natural state, One.

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      Ruben Riveraposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      We already do this when we dream, no mystery there, why is it that the unknown brings so much fear, don't try this or you will be possessed, or don't go there or you'll fall off the edge of the earth.

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I agree Ruben.  Fear of the unknown is like playing with evil in some belief systems.  Not mine.  Putting awareness in all things is what awakening is all about.  The expansion of consciousness will only be for the adventurous pioneers.

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         pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Usually because the mind gets in the way. Get the mind out of the way and the fear dissipates.

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            couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I agree.  Memory is what keeps us from doing a lot of things.  Memories cling, habitual patterns of thought which cloud the mind not allowing it to experience something, now, for what it is.  Rather we hold on to impressions created from another experience and apply them to something future.

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               pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Yes agree.

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      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Any head injury that causes concussions or brain trauma will suffice because these are the conditions those who claim to see a light undergo.

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Glad I didn't have to endure a car accident to experience light!

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            Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            You don't have to experience a car accident, many forms of brain trauma can induce such visions as they are merely states of what the brain is doing to process the information coming from the eyes while undergoing the trauma.

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               couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Do you believe this is the same end by a different means? Or something altogether different.

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                  Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  If the brain is receiving signals from the eyes and those signals are affected by any form of trauma to the brain, the brain can interpret those signals as a "bright light". Depending on what area of the brain undergoes trauma and how the signals from the eyes are affected, there can be any number of 'visions' someone might experience; for example, a bright light is one vision while another may be seeing ones body float around the room. 

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                     Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I wonder how many of these experiences are via the third eye and not the physical eyes.  If in a state of trauma where the eyes are closed the physical eyes are not engaged.  How can one see 'bright lights'  with closed eyes?

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                        Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Sorry, but two eyes is the norm, no idea where you get the notion we have another eye.
                        
                        
                        
                        Those are the affected signals being transmitted to the brain. Even though the eyes are closed, the brain can receive signals affected by trauma.

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                        1. 81

                           Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           No apology necessary Beelzedad.  You've not heard of the third eye, the inner eye?   I'm sure even those imbued totally in the scientific community have heard of it.

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                              Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              Yes, I've heard of the new age philosophical claptrap regarding the third or inner eye, but I wasn't sure if that's what you were referring. The scientific community has found no evidence for that baloney sandwich.

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                                 Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                 Can you even say good morning without being insulting?
                                 
                                   I bet you are the life of the party everywhere you go.

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                                    Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                    It's interesting to note that nowhere in my post did I insult anyone, yet you felt it necessary to take the time to insult me personally.
                                    
                                    Good morning to you too, Jerami.
                                    
                                    For the record, I don't strive to be the life of the party.

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                                       Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                       Yes, I've heard of the new age philosophical claptrap regarding the third or inner eye, but I wasn't sure if that's what you were referring. The scientific community has found no evidence for that baloney sandwich.
                                       
                                       - - - - - - - - - - -
                                       
                                          Calling someones ideologies  "clap trap"   and a "baloney" sandwich, having nothing else to contribute to the conversation  is insulting according to my standards.
                                       
                                         And what the heck?  everyone can't be the life of the party.

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                                          Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                          Really? So, if I say the Communist system is 'garbage' or the Nazi party system is 'bullpucky' you'll be insulted?

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                                             Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                             That is a good come back ...   and it only took 4 1/2 days
                                             
                                                The answer to your question!   If I had just stated that I am a communist or Nazi   YEP.  I would.
                                               I would know that your only purpose was to insult me when you didn't contribute to a conversation with any kind of rebutal  statement, question, or any sign of inteligance other than
                                             ...  'bullpucky'

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                                                Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                                You still don't seem to understand. No one is being insulted when you criticize or insult an ideology, Jerami. Don't you get that?

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                              2. 81

                                 Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                 If it was only opinion I'd agree with you Beezeldad, but experience speaks louder than words. Brave are those that venture beyond conditioning and pioneer unchartered waters.  Except these waters have been chartered by many a scholar.

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                                    Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                    And, hard evidence speaks volumes over and above so-called "experiences."

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                                       Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                       How is experience not evidence?

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                                          Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                          Experiences are evidence, and when studied and analyzed are found to be indistinguishable from known mental disorders.

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      2. 60

         Ruben Riveraposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yeah this is the hard way, remember smarter not harder.

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   4. 51

      paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      It depends on what you consider as "mind"; is it the brain or the heart or something else? If you separate brain or heart from the body the person will be sure dead.
      
      If mind is neither brain nor heart and it is something else; please name it.

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         pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Energy

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            paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            !

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         couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         paars - yes the body will be without life but mind is energy, not strictly intangible, but as yet, beyond our understanding in terms of the objective form of energy it takes.

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            paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Energy in the dead?!

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Energy is a nebulous term.  Try consciousness which traverses many states, many levels and does not require anatomy to exist.  However, we do require a body of some dimension to have a human experience and to recognize the human standpoint of consciousness.

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   5. 0

      Twenty One Daysposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      It is not necessary to "separate" the mind from the body, but rather "unite" the spirit with the body. The mind then is no longer in control and returns to its proper place --a transmitter of intangible to tangible. It takes much meditation.
      
      Remember: the mind fashions reality based on the  illuminated, the tangible. Else, it would be powerless and it doesn't want to be powerless...

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         Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I,m gone for a bit,  but wanted to say 
         
           Ya might be right.  We are trilogy, mind spirit and body.
         
           Maybe ??? When this achieved,  we are not separating ourselves from body but from mind???
           Maybe we are more in contact with our spirit when our mind is in less control.
         
            I'm sure that isn't right, but something like that, maybe ??

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2. 67

   goldenpathposted 13 years ago

   It cannot be done.  That "covering" is devinely enacted over the minds of all mortals for a specific reason.  Any "apparent" collapse of that covering can only be from an adverse source.  Yes, great things can come of meditation as long as the intentions are on personal physical and mental well-being and not to "float" into the unknown mysteries of the universe. 
   
   Be leary of such activity.  Such nature does not lead to positive affects on life but rather brings one down to a level of diminished true enlightenment and dark avenues of choice.

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      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Its not floating any where. Not always positive no. The mind is a powerful thing.

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         "Such nature does not lead to positive affects on life"  That's definitely not the case.  Ignorance is what brings one down to a level of the inability of enlightenment.  True spiritual seekers have been pursuing these avenues of spiritual experiences since the dawn of time.
         
         the only way to expand consciousness is to traverse the dark corners of the mind.  The perils lie in ones own inability to open to the adversities in life.  We conquer our fears by facing them not hiding or avoiding them.

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            pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Yes agree and your point to address me in your post was?

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               Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Apologies!  I was addressing Goldenpath.

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                  pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Oh thanks. I wondered if that was the case.

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3. 81

   Jewelsposted 13 years ago

   It takes meditation and discipline to separate body from mind.  There is not a complete separation until death.  Until then there is the ability to separate the body, as in have an out of body experience where consciousness is clearly seen and experienced separate from the physical organic body.  To do this requires leaving the body from a deep space of involution.  In the Hindu teachings Yoga Nidra is one way of doing this.  Then the ability to retain consciousness when 'lifting out' of the body is for many achieved after a lot of practice.  This phase of lifting out is usually where most people fall asleep.  In many cases the descent back into the body can be harsh and is a deterrent.
   
   Every night we separate from the body.  It's how our physical body gets the rest it needs.  In essence we just loose consciousness and don't realize we have separated.  The art of astral traveling is to retain consciousness during sleep and to be aware at will of our nightly experiences.

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      couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Jewels - this bit about astral travel and the retention of consciousness during sleep is interesting.  There have been times when I have been 'conscious' during dreams, knowing in my dream that if I close my eyes, I will wake up.  I have done this many times but can't always choose the dreams in which I can do this.
      
      I've been studying the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali of late.   In the Contemplations, he states there are 5-fold thought streams, right knowledge, wrong knowledge, fancy, sleep, and memory.  Right knowledge is inference, tradition and genuine cognition.  Wrong knowledge is false, illusory, erroneous beliefs or notions.  Fancy is following after word knowledge empty of substance.  Deep sleep is the modification of the mind which has for its substratum nothingness.  Memory is not allowing mental impressions to escape.
      
      So during a deep sleep, with practice, we could potentially raise our consciousness.  But how does one practice during sleep?  How does one prepare for the sleep?  Cognitive meditation  - preceded by faith in possible - is for we who are not advanced or merged in unitive consciousness.  I know the world is the cause of blockage and barrier to formlessness.

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Preparing for sleep is done by a systematic letting go of the body parts and also like a counting down until you hit the interface between waking and sleeping.  (Not easy!)  Have a look at my hub on Relaxation for Health It's an Art which has the script for a night practice (derived from Yoga Nidra).  Also in the free downloadable book Awakening the Third Eye you will get heaps of info on the preparation for consciousness during sleep.  It is a path for some spiritual initiates who not only enjoy the sport of astral traveling, but it's a preparation for death.  Death and Sleep are a similar space, just in sleep you come back!  When mapping consciousness you can really see the similarities.
         
         I personally am not an adept, but trying of course - the mantra of my teacher is Practice Practice Practice! 
         
         Also there are several books by Robert Munroe on the topic of astral traveling and leaving the body and retaining consciousness.

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      klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I've done it several times without meaning to. Then I practiced a few meditation techniques that have allowed me to do it intentionally, but it doesn't last long. I stopped trying to achieve it since it's not necessary to the body or soul. It's an experience like no other when you begin to see through your closed eyelids and begin to float out of your body consciously.

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4. 60

   illeagleposted 13 years ago

   We are neither mind nor body. Unless you are referring to the universal consciousness that permeates the ALL as 'mind' and the ALL as 'body', I believe that you are making an error by identifying 'your' existence with mind and body. 'Our' individual existences are more like cells in a giant organism that some like to call 'God','Christ', 'Light', or whatever.
   
   I think what happens is when one of the cells surrenders its individuality to the 'whole', then this state of coming into the 'Light' is experienced. I've had glimpses of it, but have yet to fully surrender. Damned ego!!!

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      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Haha ego has much to answer for.

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      couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      illeagle - hmmm.  I understand universal consciousness vs individual consciousness.  The concept of identifying existence as either attachment to non-eternal with the desire to cling to life (mind/body), or as liberation as a result of dissassociation of the seer from the seen.  So what you're saying is by surrendering through non-attachment comes communion in the form most desired or admired, the light of pure consciousness. 
      
      I have a theory that this is what Jesus became when he was seen by Mary Magdelene in the light.  His consciousness had risen to a level of pure light and the message he came to give us is that we all have the potential to be this.

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         Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Universal consciousness?  Is that what we call that which we cannot fathom?  Expansion of consciousness beyond the ordinary mind (chitta) is traversing states of consciousness and tapping into universal consciousness.
         
         Pure consciousness - is that The Absolute?  Pure consciousness is not being in duality and complete Union. Not sure of the Hindu Term for this.

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            couturepopcafeposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Jewels - yes, I think so - pure consciousness is not being in duality but universal consciousness is complete union, or at the very least the collective consciousness of the many, those of like mindedness but with focused intensity.  At least that's the way I understand it.  Yes, tapping in but moreso, more like intentionally seeking and finding the path and breaking through partly by being drawn in by those of like mind.

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               Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               We can only taste a mere morsel of universal consciousness.  To retain pure consciousness and not be in duality = not being in human existence but way beyond the grossness of the physical body.  It's a state of higher consciousness. 
               
               A good reference for states of consciousness is "A Language to Map Consciousness" which also uses sanskrit references.  It helps to differentiate between different states.

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5. 57

   Jeramiposted 13 years ago

   couturepopcafe wrote:
   When the mind is separated from the body
   - - - - - -
   
   ME ...
     Just curious.    And rambling .. thinking out loud again!
   
     Is the mind ever really separated from body?  or have we become so accustomed to being closed up in our physical awareness  that being other focused only seems to create a feeling of separation.
   
     Poor analogy .. but .. here we go anyway.
    
     Something like a dog chained to his dog house.
     To remove the chain seems to separate the dog from his house, Is he really any more separated from his house than he already was? 
   Suppose that The dog is content to remain close to his house.
   Is he separated from it?
       Then he ventures down the street. This could be dangerous! But that isn't the question.
   
      Is he any less connected to the house than when he was  just hanging around it (?);  as long as he goes back home to sleep.
   
      Which imposes another question.
      Is he asleep while in his house   or    is he asleep when he is out and about?
   
       I know I didn't phrase that quite the way I was thinking it!

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      Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      A Sleeper in spiritual terms is one that makes his reference only the physical body and does not venture beyond the consciousness contained by physical references - ie the 5 senses.  A Sleeper is also one who has no idea he is the sum total of his conditioned upbringing.  An Awakened person is one who can separate himself from the conditioning and find his/her true self underneath it.
      
      As with separating the mind from the body - when referring to altered states of consciousness (also know that this a non-drug induced state of altered consciousness), there is a clear separation of the two.  However, standpoint is something that needs to be factored into the scenario.  While we are in a physical body having the human physical experience we will continue to have a sense of our physical sensations and fathoming the 'unknown' will always be derived from the human ability to cognize.  This may sound paradoxical, it is.  It is argued that one who is awake when out and about while asleep, is truly alive.
      
      Having said this there are clear repeatable experiences of leaving the doghouse, knowing the doghouse has been left and sensing the clear freedom of not having the denseness of the doghouse as an anchor in 'out of body' experiences.
      
      In my honest opinion venturing down the road is more an act of will and an act of pioneering.  Not something to be feared but something to put awareness into to broaden perspective and Life (capital L).

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      1. 57

         Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Thanks for this reply.. 
         Kinda what I was thinking but NOT.  Ya added a bunch to what I was thinking.
           Thanks.
         
           What little bit that I do know comes from what little bit that I have experienced without even trying to.
         
            Just enough to know that whatever is over there is real.
         Probably more real than this that we allow ourselves to experience over here.  ???

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            Jewelsposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Jerami, you are understanding more than you think! 
            
            I'm into my last 7 days of a 7 week segment of intense practices.  Hard to get online hence the delay in responding.  Very fruitful.

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      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      How about using the analogy of the ocean?
      
      The ocean and its depths. An ocean has waves. The tip of the wave our waking conscious and awareness of the body etc. Subconscious part of the mind is the part of the wave that is closer to the surface of the vastness of the ocean. When the wave subsides fully,that which was body, mind and soul if you like becomes one with the ocean. Death if you like.   Even though it wasn't really separate. 
      
      When we are sleeping or separating mind from body as it is described sometimes. This tip of the wave is subsiding but only to just before the surface of the ocean. Then rises again before immersing itself deep into the ocean.

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         Jeramiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I think that I can understand this.
         Hope you don't mind if I eddit ?? just a little ??
         
            I'd think that the wave, that part being touched by the air is our consciousness. 
            And everything just below the surface that we can see and touch would be out dream state.
         
         
            When we learn how to breath under the surface, there is much to discover.
         
              I'm guessing ????

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            pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I like it! Learning to breathe underwater brings to mind the difficulty one experiences in the beginning, when learning to adjust~! Cool thanks!

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   C.V.Rajanposted 13 years ago

   Very many Hindu saints have experienced this state. Almost in most of the very authentic biographies/ auto biographies of many Hindu saints, we can find their having experienced this "out of body travel" and "appearing in form elsewhere". I have read such encounters in the life histories of Ramakrishna Paramahamsa, Sarada Devi, Ramana Maharshi, Satya Sai, Mata Amritanandamayi and so on.

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      paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Did they experience out of body experiences while they were dead, as one poster here states; or they experienced them when they were alive?

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         C.V.Rajanposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         When they were alive.

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      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Sai Baba too apparently! His was bi-location though!

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7. 57

   Jeramiposted 13 years ago

   With closed minds we will never know the unknown.
   
     Our struggles are within ourselves, few people have learned to not cast our problems outwardly at everyone around us.
     Doing this takes our mind off of our problems; but accomplishes nothing; ...  except creating more problems than we had before.
   
       I'm outa here for a while.  sunny day outside.

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8. 51

   paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

   Supernatural Experiences - Separating Mind From Body
   
   One dreams; so one travels in known and unknown places while one's body is on one's bed.

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   1. 79

      pennyofheavenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Perhaps that is because the known and unknown places are not outside oneself. It just appears that way in waking consciousness.

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