Is Michael Jordan the G.O.A.T. (Greatest Of All Times)

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   tHErEDpILLposted 12 years ago

   With the previous and recent speculation that Lebron James is overrated I figured, Let me ask THE question.  "King James" as some call him was coined as the "next Jordan" even before entering the league, but after several failed attempts to win an NBA championship as the 'Leading Man' on his team, he decides to slip into  the Scottie Pippen role.  But this is nothing new I can't even remember the names that have been thrown into the hat by sports casters and basketball fans alike, blasphemously  comparing them to Jordan.  The only one who has come close so far is Kobe, but he only has 2 rings under his "Leading Man" role.  The rest get credited to Shaq.  So when all is said and done, right now as we stand here starring at our screens tell me, is Micheal the best or not?  My answer is YES.  If your answer is no tell me why and also tell me who you think is.

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      Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Well I don't know if winning championships as "the man" should be the only basis to dictate who's the greatest player of all time is, as you'd have to go with Bill Russell by default if you go by that logic.  however,  having said that, I do think Michael Jordan is without a doubt the greatest player that ever played in the nba.  Not only did he dominate his opponents, you literally couldn't shut him down even when he lost games and playoff series.  Whereas Kobe and LeBron, you can name several series where they either got shut down by the other team in a loss, or when they were merely outplayed by another opponent.  Something that you'd never see happen to Michael Jordan. 
      
      Not only that, I think people have a tendency to forget how truly great he was in the nba during his prime, as most people seem to have down graded him a lot since he came back briefly to play for the Wizards.  However, if you look at his stats for the Bulls exclusively, he retired as the all time leader in field goal percentage, the second all time leader in steals, made several all star appearances, a defensive player of the year, one of the elite defenders in the league, averaged 38 points per game during a season (second only to wilt chamberlain's 50 point per game avg), once held the record for most 3 pointers made in the playoffs, five mvps, 6 finals mvps (a record by the way), and I remember hearing once that he was one of the few players in the league to average at least 20 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists in a season.  Something that only players like Oscar Robertson would do.
      
      I could probably go on, but I'd have to look it up, and you already gave me something to research that'll probably require a great deal of my time as it is.  lol. 
      
      As for LeBron, I do agree with you both that he's nowhere in Jordan's league at the moment.  However, LeBron has never played up to his full potential.  In fact, I think the scariest part of his game is he improves every single damn year, as it's almost scary to imagine how good he'll be once he peaks.  Whereas Wade, he's peaked.  He's not going to get any better than he is right now; whereas LeBron is still growing as a player.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying he should be in conversation to compare him to MJ, but you have to admit...we ain't seen s*** yet out of LeBron, as he's not even playing at the top of his game....and that's scary....

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         tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         More could be said but I am feeling this response from Steven!  Great stats on short notice!  Who has more to say?

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         LakeShow Tposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Replying here to Steven's assessments on Wade and LeBron:
         
         - One of the weaknesses in LeBron and Wade's games has been their jump shots. They have both improved their jump shots in every year and I expect them to continue to do so going forward, as many greats do as they get older.
         
         - Wade has been injury-prone at times in his career, which leads me to believe that he may not have many more years of being Dwayne "flash" Wade. Look at this year's finals. He's playing around 39 minutes per game compared to about 45 for LeBron. Clearly, the Heat see that this guy has some wear and tear on him. Then again, this guy is an ultimate competitor and those types of players tend to find a way to get it done.
         
         - As for LeBron, I do think his jump shot will continue to improve but will it ever be at the level of Jordan's or Kobe's? I doubt it.  With that in mind, he has never exhibited any kind of a post-up game. That's something he needs to add to his repertoire.  And let's face it, LeBron entered the NBA at 18 and has carried a TON on his shoulders. He has played a ton of minutes. I just wonder if all of this is going to catch up to him once he reaches 30. Not only does he have a lot of mileage, but he is also a VERY BIG guy. I am not sure he's going to have the same explosiveness for many more years. And unless he improves his post-up game and jump shot, he will not be much once he starts losing that athleticism and his ability to bulldoze his way to the basket and jump 44 inches in the air.
         
         As Jordan's years got up there, he relied on his game in the post and his remarkable fadeaway jump-shot. Kobe Bryant has made a similar transition in the last 2-3 years. LeBron will have to work tirelessly if he is interested in being at an all-time level with those two. To me, it seems like LeBron may be more interested in making money and world domination than being a Michael Jordan.

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            Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

            This is exactly why I still say if LeBron would've been forced to go to college during his early years, then he might've developed a lot more as a player.  Not only in terms of leadership skills, but he would've learned early on in life that he has to earn things in order to be deemed the greatest this or that. 
            
            I remember writing a college research paper on Jordan once, and nobody ever thought Michael was going to become the superstar he did.  Sure, they expected him to play great but if you look at his scouting report coming out of the draft, many nba scouts doubted his ability to defend and shoot consistently.  However, since Jordan had an experience early on in high school where he didn't make the cut the first time he tried out, it inspired him to work on his game to a point where he didn't want to feel rejected again like that.  Hence, when he heard about his own scouting report, he decided to take it upon himself to make his own weaknesses his strengths.  Many people don't know this, but I know Jordan was a perfectionist when it came to basketball. and I know according to a few biographies, he was extremely hard on his own team mates too.  Demanding they play at the top of their games too whenever they took the court with him.
            
            Whereas LeBron, he showed a lot of athletic ability early on in high school, and he was just handed the title of being the next Michael Jordan without ever earning it like Michael did.  This is where I think college would've helped him; especially if he had played under a Dean Smith type or Coach K type, as they probably would've instilled in him early on that he has to earn things before being named the greatest anything.  However, it wasn't like that for LeBron.
            
            He was hyped up straight out of high school, and was named the king of the nba without ever earning anything.  However, I think he's beginning to learn that he has to improve his game every year, as I know he's tired of always falling on his face in the playoffs.  Sure, in the past he could always fall back on how the Cavaliers allegedly failed to bring in any talent around him, or that his coach was lousy.  This year, he really has no excuse.  He has a talented team around him now, and he has a helluva of a great coach too.  Therefore, he has no excuse to fail now.
            
            I think if LeBron was smart, he should keep his mouth shut until after he wins a few rings.  I know right now people are viewing the Heat as Wade's team; which it is.  However, as you alluded to, Wade does have a history of being injury prone, and it's only a matter of time before his game declines even more that forces LeBron to take over as the leader of that team.  Will he succeed once this happens?  I don't know.  It really depends on LeBron.  All I know is that after I saw his first game for the Cavaliers, and hearing him say he didn't care about personal stats but about winning the game, I truly believed back then that if anyone would surpass Jordan then it would be him someday.  Do I still feel that way now?
            
            Yes to an extent.  Yes, he has the talent to do so if he so pleases.  The only real question is who's the real LeBron James?  The egotistical moron that guaranteed 8 titles for Miami, and wants to be the center of attention without earning anything?  Or is he the guy that I thought he was during his first rookie game, a man that truly wants to win?  Only he can answer that.  Now that he has the tools around him, we'll see what he's made out of now, as he has no excuse to fail in Miami.

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               LakeShow Tposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Well-done on that post Steven. I also did a college research paper on Jordan, so you and I know that it's his will, drive, determination, and perseverance that made MJ untouchable in the ranks of NBA lore that will likely hold up for a very long time. Or at least it should. You never know nowadays with the media's influence and all of their hyperbole on everything and how that influences NBA fans going forward.
               
               Nowadays, there are more and more players coming into the NBA with incredible physical attributes and athleticism that could compare to Jordan's. LeBron's physical attributes and athleticism are greater than Jordan's. However, none of that does anything to begin to follow in Jordan's footsteps unless they have that drive and determination Jordan had. That goes with many facets of life for everyone in that work-ethic will always reign supreme to talent and/or physical gifts. Jordan had both. I just have a hard time believing anyone's going to put both together to the extent Jordan did, especially when it comes to obsessive work-ethic and competitiveness. Kobe Bryant has done a miraculous job in doing his best impression, but even that falls short by a decent margin.
               
               These NBA Finals have made me realize that LeBron likely does not have the desire to do what it takes to be a Michael Jordan. There's nothing wrong with that. Then again, how fair is it to compare LeBron to Jordan. Afterall, I always thought of LeBron as a more athletic version of Magic Johnson but perhaps with a poor man's version of some of Magic's intangible skills. There's nothing wrong with that. But yet, of course LeBron has a long way to go to go in his career to be considered near Magic in the all-time ranks.
               
               To me, LeBron would have had a better legacy if he would have stayed with Cleveland because he would have done it as his team built from the bottom up like Jordan did and like Kobe did with the last two titles after the Lakers rebuilt. To me, 1 title in cleveland would have carried the weight of probably 3 titles in Miami. Ultimately, LeBron's not going to fail in Miami. No Way. That team is too loaded and many good veteran role players are going to want to join that team every year. Eventually, the Heat will win multiple titles even though I am a bit skeptical as to whether LeBron's athletically-driven game will translate into an elite game once he turns 30 or so. Unless he does adapt his game when he gets older and does in fact have the determination and fortitude Jordan and Kobe had, his accomplishments with the Heat will not carry much weight for me personally even though I know the media will make it out to be one of the NBA's greatest feats once LeBron does get them. Fact is, LeBron had to join a dream team and take the easy way out. and he has a ways to go to reach Wade's resume once Wade wins Finals MVP this year, provided the Heat win.

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                  tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Does Lebron have the will to win?

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               tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Steven, again I must say, couldn't have said it better myself.  You both make great points about Wades injury prone career, and yes eventually the leadership role will go to James.  What we are going to find out in the next couple of games and in the next couple of years if Lebron is a great player or an overrated waste of talent.  Only time will tell.

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            tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Great assessment Lake Show, I think I agree with everything you said pertaining to Dwade, Lebron, Jordan, and Kobe.  Couldn't have said it better myself.  I would like to add that Lebron, Wade, and even Dirk, have all been copying that fade away jumpshot that Jordan has made so popular.  Like I said earlier it's like all the dancers are still to this day copying moves that Michael Jackson innovated.  Where are the new innovations.  Watch tonights game and you will see th "Jordan Fade away" over and over again.  The move is so hard to guard and looks pretty, but in my opinion Jordan doesn't get the recognition that he should for a lot of the moves that he innovated.  Kobe and Dwade are carbon copies.  And this is not based strictly on their positions and scoring.  There is a video on youtube that uses a split screen with Kobe and Jordan.  It's like looking into a mirror.

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               LakeShow Tposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Well, LeBron does try the fadeaway shots from time to time but he has a LONG way to go with that. If you're an opposing defense, that's the shot you want him taking. The thing with LeBron is that his post-up game is so poor/raw that his version of a fadeaway is generally a mere running-off balanced shot while drifting away from the basket.
               
               Here's how I would rate the aforementioned players fadeaway jump shots on a scale of 1-10 (10 is best, 1 is worst)
               
               Michael Jordan - 10 (best fadeaway of all-time and nobody will ever match it)
               Kobe Bryant - 8
               Dirk Nowitzki - 7.5
               Dwayne Wade - 7
               LeBron James - 2.5

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2. STAFF

   Paul Edmondsonposted 12 years ago

   Have to go with Jordan.  Although, I'd rather have played with Magic.  Magic just made the other guys so much better around him.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I hear ya, but damn MJ(michael Jordan) is like MJ(MIchael Jackson).  You cannot find a superstar player or super star entertainer who does not model themselves after these two.  I might have to go out on a limb and say thet theres no room for innovation.  These guys set the bar too high.  It's like every action movie character is really James Bond when you break them down.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Like Lake said, I look at Lebron as a new aged Magic.  His passing is exceptional for a man of his size.

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   LakeShow Tposted 12 years ago

   This question in varying ways has been asked a lot here lately.LoL. Anyways, yes, Jordan is the greatest of all-time. I wasn't a fan of his, but I can say he is unequivocally the greatest because he deserves that respect for all of his accomplishments that Steven mentioned and his obsessive desire and sheer will to be the best every second of every game and every practice for that matter.
   
   Also, Jordan had zero weaknesses on the basketball court. There was nothing he could not do. He could dominate in the post, he had the best mid-range jump shot of all-time, he had the unguardable fadeaway, he could drive to the basket and jump out of the gym, he knew how to finish at the basket, he could get to the line at will and shoot a great percentage, he could pass and made teammates better in many different ways, he could rebound when he needed to, he was clutch and wanted the ball when everything was on the line, and he could defend at a super elite level.  No weaknesses.
   
   Although, I have Kobe Bryant at #5 on my all-time rankings, Kobe is the closest to exhibiting all of those skills without weaknesses. He just falls short because MJ exhibited all of those skills and characteristics a little better and because Kobe has given up a couple times in his career when he realized he would not get any help from his supporting cast.
   
   And by the way, Kobe should not be discredited for those first three championships just because ShaQ was the most dominant player in the NBA at that time. Kobe still averaged 23-29ppg, as a kid mind you, and was the closer in the 4th qtr. At times the Lakers would not even have ShaQ in the game or give him the ball because the opposing teams would just Hack-a-ShaQ. ShaQ would dominate the first 3 quarters of the game and Kobe would control the 4th quarters. Kobe's 5 Championships are 5 championships. Just because ShaQ was so dominant back then does not mean Kobe was taking a backseat like LeBron James is right now, for example.

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      Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah, that's true.  you bring up a very valid point about Kobe.  Although I can't say I like the guy, but you have to admit he's always been the lakers closer since they've started winning their titles recently in the Kobe era.  Sure, people may have focused all their attention to shaq when he was playing for LA but when the games were close, Kobe was often the guy that was known to be their primary closer when it mattered.  Sure, they had other guys like Fisher, Horry and others too, but Kobe was the best out of all of them.  Therefore, I don't know if you can fully discredit Kobe, as I thought the titles they won were more of both Kobe and Shaq being equals on the team rather than one guy being Batman, while the other plays robin.  I tend to agree with Mark Jackson about what he said about the Lakers when they had both Shaq and Kobe at their primes.  It wasn't a tag team of Batman and Robin...it was more of a alliance between Superman and Batman...if that makes sense.

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         LakeShow Tposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         That's a great analogy. Kobe's supreme confidence in his abilities would not allow him to take a back seat even though he was so young and had the most dominant player in the game on his team. It's that kind of confidence that guys like Kobe and Jordan possess that separates the "super great caliber" from the "all-time greatest caliber"
         
         Also, remember the 2008 Olympics. The USA vs. Spain in the Gold Medal game. Kobe not only sent a message when he knocked Pau Gasol on his butt, but he also took the game over when it looked like Spain was taking all of the momentum and was about to steal it with a few minutes left in the 4th qtr. The rest of team USA was wilting and every looked like a deer in headlights; everyone except Kobe Bryant. He took that game over and won the US the Gold medal. Without him, they would not have won that game. That speaks to his mentality and that of those like Jordan and the other very top players of all-time.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with you guys, and I respect his titles with Shaq, they caanot be denied.  But as far as comparing him to Jordan goes, when the subject comes to championships, he will lose points from me if it comes down to him ending up with more than Jordan's six.  Sorry.  Mike didn't have the most dominating center in the game when he played.  Shaq was simply unstoppable.  And as for Kobe "finishing" the forth quarter after shaq carried the team the other three, think about this.  If shaq doesn't carry the team through 3 quarters would there have even been an opportunity to close in the 4th of those games?  NO.  Don''t get me wrong, I highly respect Kobe's game, and I think  he is probably the closest thing we will ever get to Jordan again.  I just think when you are comparing the two you have to look at many things.  One other thing about the two is the public persona comparison.  Even though it is kind of common knowledge now that Jordan had gambling problems and cheated on his wife, he kept himself away from negative media.  He could have said he hated Jews and I still think people would have loved him.  On the other hand Kobe gets in trouble with tho hotel maid then rats on Shaq's infidelities.  Great basketball player, not as good at protecting his brand like Jordan.

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   rLcasaLmeposted 12 years ago

   jordan taught kobe how to do the fade away shot during a team mate is having a free throw. there are many moves that kobe copied from jordan. Jordan does not claim to have invented a move anyway, so anyone can just apply them. Jordan said in an interview that he did not practice any moves that we have seen, it was all based from what the defense dictates at that moment. To know who is the GOAT is to look at his legacy, to look at his contribution to the game. Jordan changed the way basketball is to be played. Watching Jordan play in his prime during his era would make you feel different than watching any of the players nowadays. Not to mention that defense back then is tougher than these days.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      This is incorrect.  Jordan relied heavily on that fade away late in his career and it had nothing to do with the defense.  It was because it was it was hard to guard and for him it was a high percentage shot.  Please let me know what interview that was when Jordan says he didn't practice any shots.  If he said this he is lying(sorry Mike).  That shot in particular must be continuously practiced in order for it to become automatic like it was for Jordan.  It doesn't even make sense to think otherwise.

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         rLcasaLmeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         my bad. it wasn't the fade away shot that he didn't practice. It was those fancy moves.

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5. STAFF

   Paul Edmondsonposted 12 years ago

   Lebron is a good passer, strong and a great athlete, but I'm not sure he has the winning drive of Jordan or Magic.  Those two were the best players on teams that won multiple championships.  Lebron may be second to Wade on this Heat team.

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   enomakosposted 12 years ago

   micheal jordan is to basketball what mohammed ali is to boxing

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Good analogy...very good.

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7. 0

   klarawieckposted 12 years ago

   Oh, stop it you people! You hate Lebron so much... why you keep talking about him?!
   
   

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Well for me its because he passed on my Knicks!  Bet he might be kicking himself in the butt when we get Chris Paul or Dwight Howard.  Or both!!

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         Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Dwight Howard even said he wants to stay in Orlando.  As for Chris Paul, I doubt it.  The Knicks are over rated, and can't play defense.  Plus if rumors are true that Isiah Thomas is coming back to the organization, then Chris Paul would be a damn fool for even considering the Knicks with both James Dolan and Isiah Thomas running the show again together, as they're both idiots.

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            tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            1. Thomas ain't coming back.  Rumors are putting him in Detroit to coach.
            2. Chris Paul already said he wants to play in NY
            3. You never know where anyone will go, so do not count Howard out.
            4. Phil Jackson is rumored to want to coach the team he won a chip with...THE KNICKS!  Forgot about that huh?
            5. Although your right about defense, The Knicks are not overrated.  If so prove it.  As far as I know people are still saying they suck, so where is the overrating there.
            6. I am an avid Knicks fan and I will battle anything you say about them that is not a fact to the bitter end.

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               Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Well defense wins titles.  as long as the Knicks don't play defense, then they will never win a title period; hence they're over rated.

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               Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

               And they'd be damned fools to hire him as said coach.  I think the only reason why he's even being considered for the job is because of his playing days for Detroit but in reality, I'd be surprised if they hired him over Bill Laimbeer.  He's already proven to be a great coach in the WNBA, so I think they'd be smart to go with him instead.
               
               
               He also said he wants to play in Orlando too.  Personally, if I was him, and I knew Dwight Howard was staying in Orlando, then I'd go to Orlando instead.  No offense to the Knicks, but lets be honest. 
               
               The Knicks gave away too many key players to get Carmelo Anthony on that team.  Not only that, but Amare Stoudemire doesn't exactly have a long history of being healthy.  If anything, you never know when his knees might give out on him since he's already had surgery on both those knees.  Therefore, how do you know his knees won't give out on him next season?  If that happens, then I wouldn't sign with the Knicks; especially when you can sign in Orlando with a big man that's not only healthy but who happens to be the best center in the nba today.  Just saying.
               
               
               You're right.  However, I do know he was quoted on ESPN.com that his first choice is to stay with Orlando, as long as they put a championship team around him.  Who's to say that if Chris Paul decides to go to Orlando, then Dwight will stay.  After all, all Orlando really needs is a great passing point guard to get them over the hump.  Don't even bring up Jameer Nelson, as he's more of a shoot first, pass second type point guard, who's style isn't right for that team...at least as a starter.
               
               
               
               
               Yes but as you mentioned with the Isiah rumor...it's just a rumor.  Plus, if you look at Phil's track record, he never goes to teams that aren't already title contenders.  Sure, you can bring up all you want about how he came back to coach the Lakers after they lost ShaQ, and had to rebuild.  However, he was also dating the owner's daughter at the time, remember?  You don't think she didn't have some influence over Phil to change his usual stance of only taking over teams that already look poised to win a title? 
               
               Besides, if memory serves me correctly, he's still dating her too, and they're quite serious.  Add in the fact that Phil has health issues, then I doubt he'd coach again.  I think this truly was his last year.  If he does, then he'll more than likely take a year off to decide, but I doubt it.  His health issues aren't going to get better in a year, and I can't imagine him coaching another team while still dating the Laker owner's daughter, as I can imagine that would be a conflict of interest if you know what I mean.
               
               Besides, would YOU want to coach against your girlfriend's team?
               
               
               I didn't say they sucked.  I just said they're over rated.  There's a difference.  To imply that they suck would mean that they're one of the worst teams in the league.  Which they're not, as they were in the playoffs this year. 
               
               As for how to prove their over rated, well as long as they don't play defense, then they will never win a title.  You and I both know that defense wins championships, as there's been no NBA team in history to win a title based purely on offense alone.
               
               
               
               Good to know you're a die hard Knick fan, and it's good that you're going to stick by them until the bitter end.  However, I wouldn't be so dismissive about Isiah Thomas not pulling the strings still over there on some capacity.  As I know Yahoo sports and ESPN reported once that Knicks owner James Dolan tried to lobby to bring back Isiah as a GM for the Knicks again.  However, it was unsuccessful due to Knicks' President, Donnie Walsh, lobbying against it adamantly.  Now, he's no longer there to stop Dolan from doing it again.  And sure Isiah may be telling the media that he has no interest in the Knicks, but we both know that Dolan values his opinion severely.  Hell, he even tried to violate nba rules for him to be an active consultant for the team, while Thomas still coached in college.  However, the only reason it never happened was because Stern didn't allow it.  Therefore, lets not be kidding ourselves that Isiah isn't pulling the strings behind the Knicks on some capacity, as it seems Dolan is head over heels in love with the guy for whatever reasons.

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                  tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  If they bring that Idiot Thomas back I am going to the Garden to protest!!!  He screwed up everything and Donnie Walsh came back and did a pretty good job of cleaning it up, as best he could.  As for the Carmelo deal, IDK...everyone one says we gave up too much but I still see, Dougalas, Fields, and Shawn Williams(great 3 point shooter, who needs more minutes).  And let's not forget Billups.  If he can stay healthy well...you already saw what a 38yr. old Kidd could do, and Billups already has two rings.  The moves Walsh made were just the beginning, it was not the end all.  But at the end of the day everyone is right, if they don't learn to play D they ain't going anywhere.

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                     Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     That may be true.  However, Billups has always been a shoot first, pass second type point guard.  Which is fine if you run a half court offense like the Pistons used to when they won their 2008 title.  However, if you're looking for a guard to run D' Antoni's up tempo run and gun offense, then you need a pass first point guard; something that D'Antoni had the luxury of having with Steve Nash back in Phoenix.  Therefore, he's not the right guard for that system.  Sure, Felton was developing into that type of point guard, and it was generating moderate success for the Knicks.  However, you'll notice once he was traded along with the other energy players that the Knicks had, then you'll notice that the Knicks declined drastically due to chemistry issues.
                     
                     The problem with D'Antoni's system is that not only does it encourage little defense, it also needs a pass first point guard to run it.  Something that Billups has never been throughout his career, as you can tell by his stats that he's never been a 10 plus assists per game guy.  Therefore, if you want you're knicks to really improve, then they need to get a pass first point guard like Chris Paul or Derron Williams, as that's the only way I can see it working in New York.

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   klarawieckposted 12 years ago

   Watch there will be more Superteams in the making soon. It's going to get as crazy as European soccer, bringing big stars from all over the world.

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      Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That's only if the NBA owners don't get their way with a hard salary cap and a huge reduction in said cap space.  then there's a possibility that even Miami won't be able to afford keeping their super team around for long.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That would be fine, because as we all saw last night...super teams do not automatically equal championships!  Bring on more!!!

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   optimus grimlockposted 12 years ago

   paul never said he wanted to play for the nicks. I thiunk since he's a fa everyone assumes hes comin to there team. I'll take him in orlando, dwight cp3 jamer terk. not to bad.

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      tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5401230
      
      You guys gotta stop questioning me I only say things I can back up!!!  Grrrrrrrr....

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    Stevennix2001posted 12 years ago

    Okay.  never mind. I didn't realize until today that Dwight Howard changed his mind, and said he would test free agency out after all.  Therefore, you're New York theory could be correct, but I still say if Thomas and Dolan end up running the show there again, then he'd be an idiot for going there....

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       tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Yea NO THOMAS!!!  And I don't want to see any fake Knicks fans popping up when we get the REAL big three or BIG 4?  Hmmm...

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          Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

            If you were a true fan of the nba, then you'd realize that we don't even know if having another big 3 anywhere is going to last that long if the collective bargaining favors the owners.  Besides, I've always been a die hard Bulls fan, so why would i suddenly abandon them to root for one of their long time rivals from the nineties?  hmm...

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             tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

             I never said I was an NBA fan.  Come on Steven you have to pay attention.  I swear, you constantly fail to prevent yourself from making assumptions about me that end up being totally wrong.  Where did I say I was a basketball fan?  I am a Knicks fan and a Yankees fan.  I don't watch all basketball...I watch the Knicks.  I don't watch all Baseball...I watch The Yankees.  Although I did watch the finals just to see Lebron lose(he should have came to NY, now look at him).  I stopped being a "NBA fan" when Jordan left and Stern didn't know what to do.  Are we clear now?  Your constant effort to belittle me often ends up backfiring on you, I would have figured you 'd stop by now.  I guess not.  Oh well keep it up.  One day your bound to catch me slipping. 

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                Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

                Belittle you?  Red pill, I've been nothing but respectable to you throughout this entire conversation, so I fail to see what I said that would be found offensive.  I truly believe it's you jumping to conclusions about my statements, and reading into them more than what I actually said. 
                
                If you don't like people disagreeing with you, then perhaps you shouldn't debate with people if you can't take criticism.  I'm just saying, as I have said nothing to offend you in this conversation, as that's all in your own mind.

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                   tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                   you said:   " If you were a true fan of the nba, then you'd realize that we don't even know if having another big 3 anywhere is going to last that long if the collective bargaining favors the owners."
                   
                   Look at the smiley face and read that to yourself.  Almost every time you post in my forums your comments are condescending, which I could care less about, I'm strictly pointing it out.  You may be blind to this but if you read your post over again you will see it. And I don't mind criticism, in fact I encourage it.  But you are not criticizing...the way you speak (write) is filled with blatant sarcasm that seems like its aimed at making me look less intelligent than you but after the smoke clears it is clear that you just make empty assumptions.  Now, answer my question and tell me when I said I was a basketball fan?

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                      Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

                      Well to be fair, you did say this remark: 
                      
                      
                      
                      When you said a statement like that, I was under the impression you were joking around trying to imply that I would become one of these wannabe Knick fans you speak of when you said that.  Therefore, the whole smiley face icon was my little way of saying whatever to that implication.  If I'm wrong, then I do apologize if it came out offensive.  However, I can assure you that I never try to go out and insult anyone in forums, as you can ask anyone that knows me best. 
                      
                      However, I thought you were joking around when you said that remark. 
                      
                      
                      
                      
                      Okay, I'll tell you what.  How about we just bury the hatchet so to speak, and start over.  As I told you before, we may have our differences, but I do respect your view points on a lot of things, as our views are really not that dissimilar.  Therefore, what do say we agree to put this whole mess behind us?  Is that cool with you?
                      
                      
                      You know, I never would've thought I'd live to see the day that just calling someone a basketball fan would be deemed an insult.  However believe it or not, you are a basketball fan since you stated you were a fan of the Knicks.  Sure, you're not a die hard of regular fan that watches every single preseason and regular season game.  However, you do watch the Knicks play leisurally yes?  Or follow them once in a while?  If so, then that makes you a casual fan of the nba.  Because in some form, you do follow it in your free time.  Not that there's anything wrong with it, as I'm a casual viewer too.  Sure, I may throw out a lot of observations and statistics, but I usually get those from reading sites like ESPN or watching sportscenter.  Like you, I don't really watch the nba as religiously as i did when Jordan was still playing.
                      
                      However, if you view that as insult for whatever reasons, then I do apologize to you again.  I'll make a mental note to never joke with you in forums again, as I wouldn't want to risk offending you again by accident.  My bad.  Anyways, are we cool?

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                         tHErEDpILLposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                         Of course were cool, your one of the most active people in my forums.  Whether you agree with mean on issues or not, it's good to see someone with an opinion letting his voice be heard.

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                            Stevennix2001posted 12 years agoin reply to this

                            I'll say.  I remember hearing that supposedly this season set record ratings on tv, so it's a shame that a lockout could undo all the new found popularity for the nba.

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