The God and the Goddess

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kittythedreamerposted 12 years ago
What does the god and the goddess do for you and your life? What type of connection do you have with the two of them, separately? Or together? Do they make you a better person, etc.
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  janesixposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Shiva and Shakti? they haven't done much for me at all
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Do you believe in Shiva and Shakti?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It would be GREAT IF those who don't believe in what is said just DON'T respond............
  
  Anyway, They help me through life, through the good and the bad. I have a huge connection with the Goddess. I see and FEEL her in, it seems like, everything. In just my every day life. When I go to bed at night I thank the Goddess and the God for everything they have done for me good or bad (because even the bad that happens gives you a learning experience so in reality it is actually good also cause you LEARN from it) and then when I wake in the morning I thank them for the day ahead and sometimes I just KNOW I'm gonna have a good day or vice versa it's a feeling I believe they give me.
  
  I'm a MUCH better person with them in my life.
  
  How about you?
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  jomineposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Why can't you just say, "I believe what I believe, without any logic or reason, and as I find it more enjoyable if more persons believe like me(as it justifies me), I come to the forums, and if you can't agree with me, just shut up"
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I personally enjoy the fact that people have their OWN beliefs. I do NOT think everyone should think or believe what I believe. And I do NOT think people who DO believe differently need to "shut up" as you put it.
  
  Everyone has a right to their OWN opinion. I just DON'T think its right for others to JUDGE others. That is NOT OUR right. No one has a right to judge another person OR to tell them that they are WRONG in their beliefs.
  
  Beliefs, spirituality, religion, etc is very PERSONAL and should be and FEEL PERSONAL to the person if it doesn't then it isn't right for you but that doesn't give anyone the right to decide what is RIGHT for someone else.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It would be GREAT IF those who don't believe in what is said just DON'T respond
  
  This comment was reffering to those who seem to ONLY want to ARGUE or PUSH THEIR beliefs on people. Believeing in the ONE AND ONLY God is a personal belief. It isn't FACT. That was MY point. I am VERY open to other beliefs. I have studied ALL world religions. I understand the gist of them ALL. They ALL have there rights and wrongs, there facts and fiction, etc. It is for your own personal reason what you do and don't believe.
  
  I can NOT and will NOT TELL someone they are WRONG or RIGHT in what they believe. How do I know?? I don't know how they personallly feel.
  
  And that offends me that you ASSUME you know what someone MEANS or is SAYING. You took my comment WAY out of context jomine. And you do NOT know me. You can read all posts in any forums I have posted in. I have never argued someones belifs. I have spoken of certain FACTS which can ALL be researched and found. But that is it.
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  jomineposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't assume anything Tlherald85, I exaggerated what you said.
  
  Belief is the confidence we have in some past event, or the statements of some person.
  The question of the op is fictitious, so what difference does it make?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  How is the topic fictitious??
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  jomineposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  "Believeing in the ONE AND ONLY God is a personal belief."
  You can "believe in" god(whatever that is) only if you know what he said.
  The op is about your relation with a mythical creature[(god and goddesses) may as well say, your personal relation with FSM, unicorn, sphinx, centaur].
  
  In a forum where you can only write,
  "don't respond" is same as "shut up" in normal talk.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Then the very first people ever on earth were wrong and stupid??
  
  That is what you are saying right now.
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  jomineposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It depends on what you consider stupid. For a computer savvy, somebody who do not know how to use a computer is stupid.
  So if you consider what we know now and what the ancient people know then, they are stupid. Eg: We now know thunder is harmless and the associated lightning is just electricity, is harmful. Ancients thought both as harmful and worshiped both.
  
  Now if it is about god, the first people never "believed" , they first feared and later worshiped what they didn't understand or is more powerful. They worshiped animals, thunder, sun river.... Are they stupid? With our present standards they are, but not if we apply ancient standards.
  Right and wrong too is subjective.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Stupid is NOT a personal opinion. No one is ACTUALLY stupid....... Just knowledgeable in different areas and un-knowledgeable in other areas.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Actually there are stupid people, the definition you gave is that of ignorant.
  
  (stupid people are people that lack an ability to learn, among other things. Which is the opposite of intelligent... if memory serves)
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  The definition of stupid from the dictionary. Exactly what I said. Lack of intelligence.
  
  Noun:
  
  A stupid person (often used as a term of address): "you're not a coward, stupid!".
  
  Adjective:
  
  Lacking intelligence or common sense.
  
  Synonyms:
  
  noun. fool - goof - tomfool - booby - dolt - imbecile
  
  adjective. foolish - dull - obtuse - dense - fatuous - idiotic
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Meaning they lack the intelligence in that specific thing. More over they could actually be smart in other fields. NO ONE in my opinion is outright stupid and it is just RUDE and DISRESPECTFUL to say that people are stupid. DO you have ANY manners at all??
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  No meaning they lack intelligence in general. They lack an ability to comprehend things they are not ignorant of.
  
  Uh...No. That would be an ignorant person. For example: I am ignorant about the Russian language, however I am fluent in both English and Italian. Therefore I am not stupid, I am merely ignorant of the Russian language.
  
  And since that is your opinion you are entitled to it.
  
  Ok Forest.
  
  More than you, obviously. However manners will not stop me from saying something exists when it does. It is not impolite to be accurate when defing the meanings of words. Nor is it impolite to state the obvious truth that there are stupid people in the world.
  
  Out of a sense of politness, I generally won't let them know that I know they are stupid, when possible. That's the best thing about stupid people, they don't know they're stupid.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That is the same logic the Bible thumpers keep spouting??? Are you secretly one of them?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  No I am not. I whole-heartedly believe religion, spirituality, beliefs, etc are personal and I do NOT believe ANYONE is WRONG in their beliefs. Where has a Christian in these forums EVER said that?? They always try to PUSH their religion which I have seen with a lot of people. I do NOT push MY religion on people nor will I ever. My beliefs are just that they are MINE. I am very open-minded Mikel. I believe everyone has a right to their opinion and their beliefs and that they shouldn't be judged for them.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It is okay to "spout" your beliefs as long as you do NOT say they are FACT. Beliefs can NOT typically be found as fact because they are just that BELIEFS. Ya know?? Why is there so much judging and arumenting on beliefs? I just don't understand it.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Personally I don't want beliefs that I follow simply because they make me feel good. I seek truth (even when I don't like the truth), which means I seek the facts. When I come across someone "spouting" a belief I can prove to be incorrect, I feel obliged to share with them the reality of the situation.
  
  So when you express your desire for people who disagree with what makes you feel good, to simply shut up and let you enjoy your high. I feel an obligation to point out what you are truly seeking, and saying. Pretending something is one thing when I can see it isn't is kinda the opposite of my nature.
  
  (For the record, when the Bible thumpers attempt this same thing, I tell them the same thing.)
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't say if you disagree to shut up. I said there is NO point in arguing or judging. If you want to calmly disagree then go right ahead. But stating someone is WRONG just because it isn't what you believe in is WRONG.
  
  I am very much into facts. I research anything and everything that someone says to find out if it is fact or just a belief. That was my only point. No one should JUDGE another or "spout" things as FACT if they are NOT.
  
  I do NOT just agree with things because they make me "feel good" That doesn't even make since. Why would someone just say "oh, this makes me feel good so its right and you are wrong"? That would be doing exactly what I just said isn't right.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Your exact post was>>>
  Tlherald85 wrote:
  
  It would be GREAT IF those who don't believe in what is said just DON'T respond............
  
  I understood "don't respond" to be the same as "shut up".
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  And did you read this post EXPLAINING that???? Since you and jomine have taken it OUT of context and started an argument.........
  
  It would be GREAT IF those who don't believe in what is said just DON'T respond
  
  This comment was reffering to those who seem to ONLY want to ARGUE or PUSH THEIR beliefs on people. Believeing in the ONE AND ONLY God is a personal belief. It isn't FACT. That was MY point. I am VERY open to other beliefs. I have studied ALL world religions. I understand the gist of them ALL. They ALL have there rights and wrongs, there facts and fiction, etc. It is for your own personal reason what you do and don't believe.
  
  I can NOT and will NOT TELL someone they are WRONG or RIGHT in what they believe. How do I know?? I don't know how they personallly feel.
  
  And that offends me that you ASSUME you know what someone MEANS or is SAYING. You took my comment WAY out of context jomine. And you do NOT know me. You can read all posts in any forums I have posted in. I have never argued someones belifs. I have spoken of certain FACTS which can ALL be researched and found. But that is it.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  If I meant to say "shut up" that's what I would have said! Period.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Could you explain to me the difference? If I comply with your request to "not respond" I am silenced because I cannot respond, which is in effect the same or very similar to the statments: Be Silent, Shush, Be Quiet, Zip it and shut up.
  
  I do understand your point, you do not want to be disturbed by people whose opinions would cause you to be unable to bask in the glow of the good feelings the conversation your attempting to have, with like minded people, brings to you. That disturbance screws up your high, which is why you resent it. Completely understandable.
  
  That is the exact same "high" the Bible thumpers love... so again... I am obliged to ask... Are you sure you're not secretly one of them?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It is not my fault if YOU do NOT undertsnad the point of do NOT argue or PUSH beliefs on someone. To me it sounds like you need to google argue and push to find out what they mean.
  
  In the meantime there is no "high" as you call it. Or "good feelings".
  
  I believe what I believe because it speaks to me, enlightens me, encourages me, etc. I do NOT JUST "feel good" about it. As I said that makes NO since.
  
  I will NOT sit here and argue about something. That is ridiculous and I don't see the point in it.
  
  You are NOT even saying anything to do with the subject matter at hand. You are just singling me out for sake of an argument and I find that offensive and NO different than those that PUSH religion.
  
  It was a specific question directed at specific people. It has NOTHING at all to do with whether you believe or don't believe or etc.
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  Cresentmoon2007posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I seem to connect with both of them equally. The God has helped me out in many of ways as has the Goddess. I know that with them in my life I am able to heal more than I would with out them. They make me a stronger person. Altogether I am proud to connect with both of them.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I can't seem to connect as much with the God. I do, just not as much, if that makes since. I try very hard it just seems the Goddess answers or comes MORE often. Does that make since?? Any advice??
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  Cresentmoon2007posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That does make sense at first I seemed to connect more to the Goddess. I suggest you try to bring the God up more often your daily life and see if that helps. Include him more in your rituals. Think of him a little more often and you might be able to connect more. However sometimes people just connect more to one than the other. That just may be your case. But give it a shot.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That's what I have been doing and it still seems it's still more the Goddess so maybe that's just what it is. Only time will tell. Thank you for your advice.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  There is only ONE true Creator God; there are no spouses of Him.
  
  The persons called messengers prophets in all the regions of the world had direct connection with Him; and definitely they wre better human beings, morally and spiritually.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That is your opinion and you are welcome to it.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It is a truthful opinion.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
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  Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  No god or goddess required to be who I am nor does one need to exist for my life to have purpose and meaning.
  
  So your questions for me are moot.
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
I am God's psychiatrist.
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  wildernessposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Would that be for the Christian or Muslim God? Of all of them out there, those two seem to need the most help.
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  Paul Wingertposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Christians, Jews and Muslims worship the same god.
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knolyourselfposted 12 years ago
There is only only one god/goddess. And the universe is myriad, the earth being only one of the many headaches of ungratefulness.
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nasakeposted 12 years ago
Mikel: Personally I don't want beliefs that I follow simply because they make me feel good. I seek truth (even when I don't like the truth), which means I seek the facts. When I come across someone "spouting" a belief I can prove to be incorrect, I feel obliged to share with them the reality of the situation.

---

From a totally unbiased point of view, why don't you prove the fact that the God and Goddess don't exist. You cant and so you proved nothing, rendering that statement useless.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Actually I have scientifically proven the existence of the supreme being. (and yes I have a hub about it)
  
  The Goddess/God concept spoken of here is (to me) an expression of one of the many attempts humanity has undertaken to quantify and classify the entirety of God. What I mean by that is humanity loves to say "this and only this" is the supreme being.
  
  I believe the characteristics the Goddess/God concept are said to possess are simply incomplete understandings of the "actual" aspects of the supreme being. Many of the characteristics/aspects assigned to the Goddess/God concept are the same as many, if not all, of other religious organizations. They are merely expressed differently, like different flavors, or different languages.
  
  The 'High', the joining, the good feeling is definitely a very popular part of almost all of them.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Gods AND Goddess have been proven also. SO whose to say who is right and wrong??
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  ...Who is right and Who is wrong...
  
  That is what life boils down to for most of humanity. The ability to get to put someone in thier place. The chance to say I was right and they were wrong. The power to say "THIS AND ONLY THIS" is God/The Supreme Being/The Goddess-God and anyone who disagreed was wrong.
  
  We don't and can't understand the totality of the supreme being. Since we can't quantify everything there is to know about the supreme being we will never be able to say "This and only this" is the supreme being.
  
  So nobody gets to say who is right and who is wrong. But we all get to say "I feel a better connection to, a closer affinty with, the supreme being when I imagine that supreme being is The Goddess/God concept, or the Christian God concept, or the Muslin God concept, or in my case the Benignly-neutral Supreme Being concept." All of which will be incomplete concepts do to humanities inability to understand the true 'total' concept that the supreme being really is.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I agree completely with this nasake..
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Cresentmoon2007posted 12 years ago
Very true nasake, it is impossible to disprove the existence of the God and Goddess. Thank you for standing up for your beliefs! Two thumbs up.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Very true nasake, We are right and they are wrong. Thank You for standing up for your beliefs! Two thumbs up.
  
  It's what people want, power over others and the ability to get those others to conform with the way they see things, with the way they believe things should be. We don't conform unless forced to because God/the supreme being/the Goddess-God(or any other way you want to name the 'supreme example of life') wants Infinite Diversity.
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  Cresentmoon2007posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I did not say that.. Everyone has their right to believe in or think whatever they will. I see not why people have to argue over such stupid things. Is there not enough problems in life as it is? And I would really like it if you don't put words in my mouth that is very disrespectful.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  That is very disrespectful. And you are so right cresentmoon, there is SO many MORE important things in life so why constantly argue about what others believe??? It makes NO since. I despise it.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  As I've said a MILLION times and will CONTINUE to say NO human being has the right to dictate to someone else that what they believe is RIGHT OR WRONG.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Isn't telling someone when and how they can speak(or not speak) about something they believe in dictating to someone else what they think is right and wrong?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I have nothing further to say to you since all you want to do is ARGUE...... I have MANY more important things in my life than arguing with someone so closed-minded and determined to hurt people.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sorry you feel that way.
  
  thanks for playing.
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  jomineposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Thats Good, if i can't have my way, you are arguing, so I'm going:)
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  No I have No problem Jomine with an argument on maybe the difference in our beliefs. But this Mikel has NOT answered the OP's question, has said nothing of his beliefs, he just wants to argue about stupid mundane things that have nothing to do with the question even asked here. I am NOT trying to be a rude person and just sit an argue. That is not me. I do not like it. there is no point in it. I have 3 children, a disabled father-in-law and a job I think alll of that is more important than this argument over the word stupid and what I actually MEANT to say. SO I wrote it wrong MY BAD. I just find this completely ridiculous. To ruin someones forum so they can't even get the answers they want and were NOT EVEN SPEAKING OF ANY BELIEFS!!!! It's ridiculous. And I'm DONE. Want to ask me or argue with me about my beliefs I will do it ALL day long I will protect and defend my beliefs bu I'm not arguing anymore with someone who seems to want to argue literally for the sake of argument. My life is not boring, no where near boring enough, for me to just argue for the FUN of it. I don't think its very fun personally.
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Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years ago
I guess our dictionaries are different:

From Dictionary .com:
stu·pid [stoo-pid, styoo‐] Show IPA adjective, -er, -est, noun

adjective
1.lacking ordinary quickness and keenness of mind; dull.
2.characterized by or proceeding from mental dullness; foolish; senseless: a stupid question.
3.tediously dull, especially due to lack of meaning or sense; inane; pointless: a stupid party.
4.annoying or irritating; troublesome: Turn off that stupid radio.
5.in a state of stupor; stupefied: stupid from fatigue.

From Merriam-Webster

Definition of STUPID

1 a: slow of mind : obtuse b: given to unintelligent decisions or acts : acting in an unintelligent or careless manner c: lacking intelligence or reason : brutish
2: dulled in feeling or sensation : torpid <still stupid from the sedative>
3: marked by or resulting from unreasoned thinking or acting : senseless <a stupid decision>
4 a: lacking interest or point <a stupid event> b: vexatious, exasperating <the stupid car won't start>

From Google

ig·no·rant/ˈignərənt/
Adjective:
1.Lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated.
2.Lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about something in particular: "ignorant of astronomy".

From merriam-Webster

Definition of IGNORANT

1 a: destitute of knowledge or education <an ignorant society>; also: lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified <parents ignorant of modern mathematics> b: resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence <ignorant errors>
2: unaware, uninformed

But if you want to believe they mean the same thing, by all means.
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janesixposted 12 years ago
Tlherald85,

"It would be GREAT IF those who don't believe in what is said just DON'T respond............"

Were you referring to me?

How the heck do you know what I believe, from my simple statement?

I answered the question. How is it any of YOUR business what I answered to the OP?

How are Shiva and Shakti not a God and a Goddess?

If you must know, I was NOT being fascicious.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I was not referring to you Janesix. Not at all. You did just answer the question. I was referring to the God's psychiatrist and the One and ONLY Creator is God comments. I'm sorry if you thought I was referring to you. I was NOT.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Goodness, people! Not that I care if random muggles reply to this forum post, but I was hoping to have a conversation specifically with the God and Goddess believers. Thanks to Nasake, Tlherald85, and cresentmoon, as well as janesix, we can have a conversation of the god and goddess and what they mean to us...we can start another thread elsewhere with a less conspicuous name...what do you say?
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Sounds good to me.......
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Cresentmoon2007posted 12 years ago
Sounds good to me kittythedreamer
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I'll message you both privately to tell you where the new forum post is.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Secret meetings in public forums, a true testament to the times we live in.
  
  "If your belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes you have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Nope...just to escape criticism and persecution...just as the Christians did in the Roman Empire days before Constantine...so does that mean that Christianity wasn't worthy of belief?
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  By the way...didn't you say this in your profile:
  
  "God LOVES diversity."?
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  Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  And his definition of a "god" isn't probably the same as yours. Shouldn't you ask first what his definition of the word "god" is before you jump to an assumption.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed...I was just trying to prove a point though. The whole hypocrisy thing, you know?
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  As if you're the first person to try that. I have been around this field a million times with the followers of the Christian and the Atheist Religions.
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  Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I understand your position. But jumping to an assumption that his definition of god is the same as yours, would put you in the same boat at him. He seems to think that his definition is absolute, because he has supposedly proven without a shadow of doubt that a god exists. The irony that you both don't see things that same is my point.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Anyways....on to a different thread.
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  Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I'm sure. Avoidance is the first step for anyone religious in any manner. Good luck though.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Yes I did.
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  Cagsilposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Christianity isn't actually worthy of belief. It's a religion that was originally created to control people. Before the book was ever written, it's contents were manipulated by other people who didn't agree with certain aspects and wrote their own version.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Agreed...but either way, I could care less how people define their own "God" or version of "god"...I just hate it when people argue with me about mine and try to convince me otherwise.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  "If your belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes you have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
  
  and I'll rewrite it to make it clearer...
  
  "If Christianity's belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes you have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
  
  "If the Muslim belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes you have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
  
  "If the Jewish belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes you have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
  
  "If My belief system(concept of God) is so full of holes, that in order to not see the holes I have to meet in the dark... It's probably a belief system unworthy of belief."
  
  Truth is usually simple, clear, consise and simply makes sense. It can easily stand in the light of day for all to see and won't have any holes to hide.
  
  If your belief system can stand under the scrunity of humanity in general (that includes the people not part of your belief system), in the open, in the light of day and no one can find any holes in it. It is probably a pretty good belief system.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  What holes do you see? Please mention.
  
  Please quote from Quran the root source of Muslims.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  1) If your religion is about "Peace, Love and Harmony" Why must you KILL people for it?
  
  The answer is because it isn't about Peace, Love and Harmony...it is being used as a means to have power and wealth over other people.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  There is no teaching for killing in Quran; Quran respect freedom of everybody.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  JIHAD
  1: a holy war waged on behalf of Islam as a religious duty; also: a personal struggle in devotion to Islam especially involving spiritual discipline
  
  2: a crusade for a principle or belief
  
  War is a tool of Governemnts to enforce authority, Religious "Holy Wars" are an oxymoron and an abomination to God.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Please quote from Quran with the context.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  2) Requiring doubters to be more knowledgable than lifelong followers when expressing doubts, so the life long follower can avoid answering a question whose answer proves implicitly a fundemental flaw in the belief system.
  
  3) Which direction would you have to face to pray to God, if you were an alien from another planet traveling in space? God is the "Universal Creator" right? Or does God only care about one tiny little speck of dirt amongst a billion Galaxies full of billions of stars supporting possible life forms(all created by God) on billions and billions of planets.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  So, it was that what you were given to understand; but you cannot quote from Quran; as there is no such teaching in Quran.
  
  Please rectify your misunderstanding; and you have not yourselves studied Quran.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  
  Jihad appears 41 times in the Quran and frequently in the idiomatic expression "striving in the way of God (al-jihad fi sabil Allah)"
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Just quote one verse with the verses in the context where Quran gives teachings to kill the peaceful human beings. You cannot quote as there is none there.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Mohammed said, “Whoever changes his Islamic religion, kill him.” (Hadith Al Buhkari vol. 9:57) This command is practiced in almost all Islamic Fundamentalist countries today.
  
  Sura3 3:64: “Verily Allah has cursed the Unbelievers (whom he defined as Christians in the 5th surah “Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends.) and has prepared for them a Blazing Fire to dwell in forever. No protector will they find, nor savior. That Day their faces will be turned upside down in the Fire. They will say: ‘Woe to us! We should have obeyed Allah and obeyed the Messenger!’ ‘Our Lord! Give them double torment and curse them with a very great Curse!’”
  
  Peace and Love? or Obey or Die...
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I give below verse 3:64 of which you mentioned with the verses in the context:
  
  [3:61] This is the truth from thy Lord, so be thou not of those who doubt.
  [3:62] Now whoso disputes with thee concerning him, after what has come to thee of knowledge, say to him, ‘Come, let us call our sons and your sons, and our women and your women, and our people and your people; then let us pray fervently and invoke the curse of Allah on those who lie.’
  [3:63] This certainly is the true account. There is none worthy of worship save Allah; and surely, it is Allah Who is the Mighty, the Wise.
  [3:64] But if they turn away, then remember that Allah knows the mischief-makers well.
  [3:65] Say, ‘O People of the Book! come to a word equal between us and you — that we worship none but Allah, and that we associate no partner with Him, and that some of us take not others for Lords beside Allah.’ But if they turn away, then say, ‘Bear witness that we have submitted to God.’
  [3:66] O People of the Book! why do you dispute concerning Abraham, when the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Will you not then understand?
  [3:67] Behold! you are those who disputed about that whereof you had knowledge. Why then do you now dispute about that whereof you have no knowledge at all? Allah knows, and you know not.
  [3:68] Abraham was neither a Jew nor a Christian, but he was ever inclined to God and obedient to Him, and he was not of those who associate gods with God.
  [3:69] Surely, the nearest of men to Abraham are those who followed him, and this Prophet and those who believe; and Allah is the friend of believers.
  
  http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/sh … p;verse=68
  
  it is not there;plese give a correct quote; and read Quran yourself.
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Tlherald85posted 12 years ago
What holes??? You haven't even spoke of any beliefs in this forum.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I think he talks of the Christian belief of Trinity; which is full of holes. It is based on Jesus dieing on the Cross whereas he never died on the Cross.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Exactly. Thanks, paarsurrey.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  He said MY beliefs had holes. I'm not Christian so the whole trinity thing wouldn't apply. I asked what holes are in my beliefs?? He doesn't even know what I believe.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  As has been pointed out repeatedly this thread wasn't about my beliefs it was about the OP's. I came seeking an understanding. I came to ask questions and to better understand other people's beliefs.
  
  I was promptly told to shut up. I was called names, berated, called more names including hypocrite, told I had no manners, and was generally judged as unworthy to have, let alone express, an opinion.
  
  But hey I had fun... want to do again sometime???
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  You may yourself start a thread with any questions you have; it will be most welcome.
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  Tlherald85posted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Mikel, I'm sorry if you felt or thought I meant "shut-up:. I wrote it wrong. I only meant, which I should have written better and spelled it out I guess, That those who want to PUSh another religion on someone or just spout nonsense should keep it to themselves. I did NOT mean if you have different beliefs just shut up just that if you have different beliefs don't tell someone else their beliefs are WRONG just cause they aren't the same. I am truly sorry for both of us misunderstanding each other.
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earnestshubposted 12 years ago
You often see the same sort of love in the bible as the quoran, but both are equaly psychotic.

All Paara can say is the same as the bible bashers.

"You quoted that out of context"
Two amusing things about that are that both accuse each other of being out of context whenever anything they don't like is quoted from the other book.
And both overlook the psychosis in the "holy words" regardless of context.

This displays a pathetic inability to reason from both believers in these same god/ different messenger books.

About Those Annoying Non-Believers (Infidels, Pagans, Jews, Christians, etc.)

Qur’an 9:123 “murder them and treat them harshly”
Qur’an 3.28 Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully; and Allah makes you cautious of (retribution from) Himself; and to Allah is the eventual coming.
NOTE: By ‘guarding carefully’, a Muslim should deceive the infidel. Acting as a friend is fine as long as it is to benefit the Muslim and protect Islam.

Qur’an 3:56 “As for those disbelieving infidels, I will punish them with a terrible agony in this world and the next. They have no one to help or save them.”

Qur’an 4.89 They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.

Qur’an 5:51 “Muslims, do not make friends with any but your own people.”

Qur’an 5:72 “They are surely infidels who say; ‘God is the Christ, the Messiah, the son of Mary.”

Qur’an 8:12 cp. 8:60 “Instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers”; “smite above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them”

Qur’an 2:191 “...kill the disbelievers wherever we find them”

Qur’an 9.33 He it is Who sent His Apostle with guidance and the religion of truth, that He might cause it to prevail over all religions.

Qur’an 2:193 “And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah”

Qur’an 8:71 And if they intend to act unfaithfully towards you, so indeed they acted unfaithfully towards Allah before, but He GAVE YOU MASTERY OVER THEM

Qur’an 8:55 Surely the vilest of animals in Allah’s sight are those who disbelieve.
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  paarsurreyposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  All without the context; let Mikel G Roberts choose one from the above and let him quote with the context; he might understand that which you cannot understand.
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  kittythedreamerposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  UGHHH...again, my intentions weren't to start a forum post that would invoke an argument between Christians and Muslims or people who don't believe in either. My intention for this hub was to acquire Pagan and other god and goddess followers of their connection with the Divine. Oh well...it seems every time I start a forum thread it always turns to "My god is better than yours! You're dumb and I'm smart...you're right and I'm wrong" instead of just encouraging each others' spiritual journeys and differences.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Nicely stated
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  I understand both the bible and quoran very well thank you.
  
  Both are the psychotic ramblings of sexist old men.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Waring Warlords/Tribal Chieftans using the name of God to further thier own ambitions and power over primitive people. and they did a good job, Because Ceasar repeated what they did about 300 years after Jesus died and that one lasted 1,200 years...until another guy figured the system out (a King this time) and wrote some more versions of it to suit his needs (Give him a break he had to get rid of that wife of his...Jeez)
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  Put it in or out of any context you like, say it backwards, write it in crayon, it will still be abusive neurotic crud.
  
  You can't deny the words are those of a murderous psychopath no matter what "context" they are in and one would need to be deaf blind and illiterate to believe otherwise in my view.
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  A Troubled Manposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  LOL! As if context is going to explain away the command, "kill non-believers".
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  earnestshubposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  It is a pretty uncompromising statement isn't it?
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  brotheryochananposted 12 years agoin reply to this
  uncompromising. Thats an interesting word to use here.
  God does not compromise.
  It's his game and his standards, this is the way he rolls.
  Death penalty for breaking rules
  Nations went to war when God needed to shake them up
  Nothing has changed.
  People will go to the lake of fire
  Tribulation will appear upon the earth
  Yah i would say uncompromising.
  BUT
  Do i argue with it? Do i get mad at God for handling things this way? Do i deny He exists because i don't 'get' the economy or protectionism or deterrent abilities and quite probably other reasons I can't understand about all the intricacies involved in this type of situation. Do I worry about the content of a dispensation that is over with 2,000 yrs ago? - that would be pretty stupid
  In the things (works and actions) of God i have to admit, I do not know more than Him nor do i understand better than Him. When dealing with people and trying to produce a nation that actually works I cannot claim this to be a simple task. Just seeing people on the surface and knowing them in a superficial way, makes me a lesser candidate and puts me in certainly no position to criticize - that would just be ego talking.
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earnestshubposted 12 years ago
No, what would be ego talking is claiming to have an invisible friend that others should be afraid of.

Now that is ego talking big time!
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