"We need death panels."

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   JSChamsposted 11 years ago

   http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government … ath-Panels
   
   Interesting choice of language by a former adviser but very telling.

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      Ralph Deedsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Steve Rattner is correct. Health care cost increases are unsustainable. A high percentage of total costs are incurred in the final months of life. A way must be found to reduce futile and costly procedures in the final months of life. No one is suggesting that they be prohibited but rather that provision be made for honest discussions with the individual's physician and his or her family regarding treatment options. There is evidence that most people will choose hospice care rather than undergo costly and frequently painful "hail Mary" end of life procedures. In the end, Medicare may eventually come to refusing to pay for such procedures. Of course the individual or his family would be free to proceed with whatever treatment at their own cost. One source of the problem is that hospitals and doctors have a financial incentive to encourage patients and families to authorize costly and ineffective end of life procedures.
      
      Often the wishes of the family aren't consulted or are ignored by medical care providers. In my own family, care givers went ahead with brain surgery on my uncle following a severe stroke AGAINST the wishes of my aunt. He lived another year hospitalized in a coma without speaking a word or displaying any sign of recognition of my aunt. The doctors brushed aside the living will my uncle had executed and his wife's wishes.

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         JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Well I think that is sad.
         Of course I am not certain that things always go that direction and that doctors making money is what was inspiring the dialogue of the person talking about this.

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      Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      We already have death panels. The insurance companies run them, when a person is for example on life support and that support costs more than their insurance limit the insurance company will decide whether to continue treatment or not (almost always not) at which point the government gets to catch the massive cost at which point after someone has been kept alive for years with no chance of ever recovering at the costs of millions someone needs to make a decision on whether the cost is justified or if more people could be saved with those funds.
      
      The good news is Obamacare will enormously reduce the number of people who will ever have to face that assessment, since Obamacare makes the insurance cost limit 750 000 yearly until 2014 and then infinite after that it will cease to be such an issue. So if you are against death panels you are surely a big fan of the law that will reduce the incidence where such a decision is necessary by an estimated nine tenths.... wait for it.... Obamacare. Glad you like it.

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         JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Oh I keep forgetting it's not his doing in any way.

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            Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            What isn't? 
            
            The point is simple as this, we already have death panels and have had for many years, Obamacare will reduce the need for them by an estimated nine tenths.

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               JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               I really doubt that.

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                  Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Well that's your choice but the logic is impeccable, anyone who has insurance is now guaranteed never to have to face a death panel and since the vast majority of people will now have insurance (with the exception of those who choose to pay the fine/tax instead)  that means very few people who can face a death panel under any circumstances.
                  
                  Just another one of the good things about Obamacare.
                  
                  Those are the facts JSC

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                     JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Just the elderly....it's ok.

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                        Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        Nope not the elderly either.

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               JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               After all at that point we will be talking tax money. That is of course sacrosanct.

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                  Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  What are you referring to? None of that affects tax money.

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                     JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Josak what do you think is going to fund Obamacare. They have already had to admit it's a tax so don't go there.

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                        Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        That doesn't come out of Obamacare funds it comes out of the insurance company.

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                           JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           Josak,
                           
                           Our taxes are going to go up. That's well known. Way up.

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                              Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              Even if that's true it's totally irrelevant to this discussion.

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                                 JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 What?
                                 
                                 C'mon man you aren't that young and foolish. If the government levies a tax, which they are, there is going to be a portion of that which will go somewhere else. Always has and always will. You know that too.

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                                    Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    The money that pays for that comes directly from the insurance companies, tax payer money has nothing to do with it ever. Understand?

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                                       JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       Josak.......
                                       
                                       Do you know what the IRS is? What they do? Why they exist?

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                                          Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Yes and it is completely irrelevant to this discussion. The reduction in death panels will be due to the Obamacare legislation and comes directly from the pocket of the insurance companies.

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   JSChamsposted 11 years ago

   I can't believe that scorn and ridicule and the name Palin hasn't surfaced yet.
   What a difference a perceived in the bag election makes.

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   Cody Hodge5posted 11 years ago

   I think the title of this thread needs to be changed to "We need conservatives to stop crying wolf all the time."

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      JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      We shall see what we shall see. And by the way this thread is based on the comments from a Democrat.

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