"Knowledge in not given; it is earned."

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   J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years ago

   This quote is philosophical. In my personal experience, acquiring knowledge was not just handed over, it was a goal to be worked towards by way of learning life's lessons, reasoning out what's right and last but not least personal experience (what life has taught me). Feel free to express your own insights and opinions.
   

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      mark abdelmessihposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      i like that

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         J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         I am quite content that you like my philosophical statement. My life experiences have taught me to believe in that quote.

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      oceansnsunsetsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Very interesting!  I agree that knowledge is not just handed over.  It is a goal to be worked towards, and as they say, some of the best things in life aren't easy!  So work is involved, and that would or could include how we respond to life's lessons and our personal experience.  You bring out a good point of reasoning out what is right.  I agree we need to do that.
      
      This next part comes through my personal view of the world.  I think knowledge and all it encompasses is much bigger than humanity alone.  Whatever is the cause for our existence in this universe, I think has the keys to all possible knowledge.  I think its therefore, its a worthy endeavor to seek the source of all knowledge, and see if its revealed itself to us through what we observe in our reality in our world and history, nature, etc.  I personally believe it has.
      
      So I agree with you, and just add that extra bit about the source of it all.  I think its much bigger than us, for we can't begin to replicate the things we see with the most powerful beings or minds assigned to any such task, yet we can ponder all these things.  Much more than meets the eye is indeed a part, and many keys lie within.  We may not begin to have the faintest grasp right now of all there is possible to begin to know.

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         J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         You see and I see the same point. We share the same if not a similar view when it pertains to "Knowledge is not given; it is earned". You brought to my attention the "building blocks" that lead to the attainment of knowledge. A wise consideration on your behalf because it illustrated how knowledge is learned by rote and personal experience.

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   HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years ago

   I think you're exactly right. In fact, I think that's the whole purpose of existence. Because knowledge and wisdom cannot be given. They must be earned through experience. Life is setup like a series of tests. Lessons that give us wisdom and knowledge and challenge us to be better and to rise to whatever we face.

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      wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      And yet...knowledge remained relatively static (compared to the explosion we see today) until writing was invented and became common, allowing knowledge to be transmitted to many people at once without the benefit of personal experience.  "Those that do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it" has much truth to it.  We learn not only from personal experience but from the experience and work of others.

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         HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         But gaining knowledge through reading about it isn't quite the same, is it? Take the recent decision by Sony to pull "The Interview" from theatrical release. What children who are alive today are being taught is that the correct response when threatened with violence is to give in. Yet, these same people all know the stories of early America where violence was a very real threat, yet they stood up in the face of it and carried on. It's one thing to read about it. It's quite another to experience is personally. Besides, just reading about something, you have to have the experiences to be able to really, truly relate to what you're reading. Words alone do not suffice.

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            wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            True, but I was thinking more along the lines of "what is the gravitational pull of the earth" or "what are genes or chromosomes".
            
            Of the two differing "types" of knowledge there is probably far more of what we individually know that comes from books, just as the majority of what we know, and use everyday, comes from experience.

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               HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               True, writing gives us accumulative knowledge. But all writing can really give us is static information. The mind still does most of the work when reading. Every word we read or character we perceive is associated in our minds with memories and experiences. The ideas formed by the words we read are formed in the familiar experiences we have cataloged throughout our lives. Without the proper level of context through life experience, writing can only convey so much.
               
               Rather than saying "Knowledge in not given; it is earned.", as the OP does, I'd say "'wisdom' is not given; it is earned". Knowledge can be given. You can be told, or read, the distance to the sun. Then you have that knowledge. But wisdom, that must be earned through experience.

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                  wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  But what experience applies to understanding genetic drift (the gene end, not the macro)?  The interior reaction of a star?  How, when and where an electron moves? 
                  
                  No, I'll stick with most information comes straight from books, with no experience necessary.  While most information in daily life comes from experience, not books, or possibly a combination.

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                     HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                     I don't think you're giving proper consideration to how the mind works. It catalogs and categorizes information gained through the senses throughout life experience. Before you can understand the interior reaction of a star, even if explained to you by a book, you first have to understand what matter is, what particles are, that they're the building blocks of what you know to be objects. You have to know what the sun is. What heat is. You have to understand space to understand something speaking of an electron moving. Writing can only convey ideas by arranging words and characters in such a way that they make proper associations in the brains of others. For those others to have the base knowledge to comprehend, they have to have a life-long forged catalog of information through experience.
                     
                     At the very least, it's a combination. In fact I'd say it's more like 90% experience, 10% writing.

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         J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         Yes the printing press had caused a "revolution" in terms that "book learning" was widely available to those who can read. That was another example of how human beings learned through one of their senses.

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      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      What are we gaining? In what way are we getting better? better than what?
      When you look at your lifeline on your hand do you see it getting stronger as you get older? Are we destined for personal power?
      To what end?
      Is personal strength/wisdom the glory of life?
      
      Some knowledge is accepted. Whether knowledge is worked for, or accepted when freely offered… its benefit has to do with how much one values the knowledge and why. In other words, the knowledge must be relevant to one's goals, hopes and ambitions. I have found that those with high IQs are those who have strong wills and want things very intensely.

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         HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         We're gaining wisdom and knowledge. I believe ultimately it all feeds into a collective knowledge. Our life experiences are etched into the material of our brains. Ultimately the purpose of life is to be what it needs to be to allow free will to exist. Free will in eternity. Free will requires wisdom.

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            Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Why do you suppose God grants Free Will? (Or self guided will?)

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               HeadlyvonNogginposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               Without free will love is merely conditioning. Free will means having others around, with their own minds and wills. Companionship. Creativity. Free will means someone who chooses to love and spend their life with you is meaningful.

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      J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Exactly. Life is a school of learning, whether formal or informal. We learn through our five senses; in other words learning by experience. Book learning is only one way to learn and that is through our sense of sight. If a person is blind then he/she will read through their sense of touch.

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   wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years ago

   According to the teaching of Jesus, the correct response is to not react to violence with violence. There is nothing to be proud of in the history of America. All of the violent wars  over the last 500 years have only led to more violent war and conflict. A violent nature  has also led to violence in the streets across America, and in the homes where wives are beaten and raped by their husbands, and where children are abused as well.
   
   Apparently, a majority of Americans have not learned the lessons of the past, and they still believe the foolish notion that violence can bring peace. My knowledge is superior because I have accepted the authority of Jesus over man. Even to save my own mortal life, a violent act would be a foolish thing to do since I am immortal.The flesh cannot destroy life, but only the flesh, and so it serves no good purpose to set in motion a chain of violence that could span millennia. The knowledge that I have presented here can be seen by many, but only understood by a few. And such is the way of God.

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      Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Are wives and children allowed to hit back? If a child learns karate, can he use it to defend himself against bullies who have him up against a wall? Can you look at a thief who is holding a gun to your chest demanding your wallet with enough love in your heart that the thief drops his gun and runs?
      America needs to get tough. Defense is a responsibility and a necessary skill. A required skill...when loving and ignoring are just are not cutting it. Someday we'll accurately identify who/what the enemy is. In my mind it is any force which aspires to invade our country. Meanwhile, who is concerned in the least about our borders?
      The President? 
      
        "There is nothing to be proud of in the history of America."
      
      If this is true, there nothing to be proud of ever in the history of mankind. No one should ever be proud of anything because for every positive there is a negative which cancels it out.
      
      In other words, there is  N O T H I N G  for anyone to be proud of. Not personally not impersonally, not individually, not universally. In fact, I would say we should, in all actuality and for all intents and purposes, make  P R I D E  absolutely, completely and utterly  T A B O O.
      
      F u r t h e r m o r e, I would say that anyone with the slightest amount of PRIDE or the slightest LACK of humility should be utterly and completely shunned and ignored.
      
      Yes, the Humble should shun, run and hide from the Prideful at all times.
      Because, Yikes!

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         wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         
         Jesus cursed the fig tree, and it withered and died. A true Christian is a very powerful entity, and is feared among evil men who possess a certain knowledge. Many of the miracles that Jesus performed were only examples of our own capabilities. Here you have asked the wrong questions. You have posed questions that are designed to vindicate your argument, while making my assertions appear foolish and irrational.
         
         The beauty of the wisdom of Jesus is that a society that places love above all other things is even more infectious than the present evil: a virulent strain that has long ago spread across the world like a cancerous tumor. A world infected with love will become as a barren woman, being unable to conceive and give birth to avarice, malice, and indifference. When evil nations that have mocked and defiled the image of God are folded back into the Earth, that will be the time for pride and celebration, until then, such feelings and behavior only speak of vanity. It is well known that the farmer does not celebrate the harvest until it has been gathered from the fields.

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            Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            <"Many of the miracles that Jesus performed were only examples of our own capabilities.">
            
            How do you recommend we become like Jesus?
            Did Jesus leave us the necessary instructions to the fullest extent... I mean to be able resist or spiritually "wither" a force such as Extreme Islam… or even a non-producing Fig Tree?
            Furthermore, the NT recommends that we are to become perfect as God is perfect…
            How?
            I ask!  (There is some Knowledge to earn for you! )

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            J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Here we are getting off on a "branch" instead of staying on the "trunk of the tree". Religion plays a role in the many lives of human beings. Concentrate on the "building blocks" of the human learning experience, both positive and negative, and how we shape our opinions and common sense knowledge through our five senses.

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   J - R - Fr13m9nposted 9 years ago

   I find it quite interesting and varied the responses that all of you have expressed. In regards to my statement as an afterthought, I will insert COMMON SENSE. I feel that COMMON SENSE is another way of learning and applying what we have learned. I am not ruling out EDUCATION because EDUCATION is also essential. Feel free to continue "speaking your minds" regarding this subject.

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   wrenchBiscuitposted 9 years ago

   The New Testament is a good place to start. But when you read any book of knowledge, you must read it with humility, and an open heart, otherwise you will only see the words, and the superficial meanings the human mind has given them. You will not see the "image" that is outlined by the words and phrases. The Christian Bible, like  other texts found throughout the world, is cryptographic.
   
   The command of a particular human language alone is not enough to reveal the deeper meanings. It is the condition of a man's heart which acts as a key, or cipher to unlock many biblical secrets. Yes, I am not only speaking of the philosophical aspects of the teachings of Jesus, but I am speaking of the practical application here in the material world.

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      PhoenixVposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      This is really thoughtful and thought provoking.

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years ago

   <"Yes, I am not only speaking of the philosophical aspects of the teachings of Jesus, but I m speaking of the practical application here in the material world.">
   I agree.
   
   Other meandering questions:
   
   But, how do we wither a fig tree?
   How long will it take mankind to master life and the material world and become like Jesus?
   How will we in present day / near future defeat a force as evil and prolific as the extremists in the world?
   
   Somehow related questions: Didn't the pilgrims and religiously persecuted others come to America to study the teachings of Jesus? Yet, you are so angry at us for being on this continent and displacing those who knew nothing of Jesus' teachings.
   
   How were the original people of this continent supposed to gain the knowledge of becoming as Perfect as God? Or did they have it already from some other (ancient?) source.  If they did, they certainly didn't use their knowledge against their invaders. In fact, without the help of the Indians, the original settlers wouldn't have even survived here.
   
   One more random question:
   You mentioned the New Testament as a good place to *start*. What other sources would you recommend? Or is our own heart the next best place to go.

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