Who Framed Jesus

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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
I watched a program last night on History channel called who framed Jesus.
Did anyone else watch it; If so what is your take on it.
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  dogluver1posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I saw that too! lol
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  Justine76posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I saw a commerciall for it. My take on the commercial was..nobody framed Jesus.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well it went through the diffrent scenerio about Judus, Pilot, The high priest etc talking about what each of them were suposed to have said and done, discussed why each might have and might have done what is told that they did.
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  Justine76posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  it was all prophicied.
  they did what they were supposed to do? I thought.
  what if Judas hadnt done his thing?
  would we all NOT be saved? would Jesus still be here, on earth all..
  but? but? Im supposed to be back in heaven by now?
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  Hokeyposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Paradox warning.
  
  How can something be prophecy and man have free will. To say it is prophecy is to say it is destined. That negates free will.
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  Justine76posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Im just saying according to the bible it was prophicied he would die, innocent. so OBVIOSLY he had to be framed so I didnt get the point of making a movie?
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hi Justine! We have a Buddhist Thread now. Wanna come and visit?
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  Dim Flaxenwickposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You are so right , Justine. The bible prophesy told the jews that a Messiah would come and die for them. It doesn't "negate free-will" Just means that Jesus died willingly for us. The whole thing is far too interesting and complicated to be sorted out on this forum. I don't know why people gewt in such a tizzy over other people's opinions. Sheesh !!!!
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  (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Based on what? The bible?
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You're late (Q) The OP is at work, and we ran it all down. It is about a History Channel program of the same name. No real debate.
  
  Ironically, later down the page you will find we came to the decision world hunger is a more reasonable subject for debate. As one of your two hubs is on that subject perhaps we are all on the same page after all.
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  samboiamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  My grandmother framed Jesus. She had him in an 8x10. lol
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  Justine76posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  holy cow. that is funny!!!!!
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  adrienne2posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Now that is funny love it!!
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  skyfireposted 14 years agoin reply to this
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  Cly Walshposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Considering there isn't a shred of evidence he existed as a mortal or otherwise I'll take Potent Potables for 200.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Really? Are you absolutely positive about that?
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  Cly Walshposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hmm, on second thoughts I'll take Anal Bum Cover for 600.
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  AEvansposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I watched it to and I have to agree Judas possibly framed Jesus I love the history channel.
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Dim Flaxenwickposted 14 years ago
I didn't see the programme, Who framed Jesus? but I can read.! There's no room for doubt in the gospels that the Pharisees and other religious leaders framed him for blasphemy. Heck, they even tried to kill Lazarus after Jesus had resurrected him .!!!! Worst case of trying to destroy the evidence I've ever read.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  the point that stuck out in my mind was how the three stories in the Gospels progressively exalt the inocence of the Roman Governments involvment. According to the storyline in the show this was not likely.
  The Rome Empire was COMPLETELY inocent according to the scripture that the Roman Catholic Church chose to put in their cannon. This was my take on the story.
  I believe in the God of Abraham though I have doubts as to the accuracy of the NT.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You hit the nail on the head there Jerami. The church gives us what we have of these letters that were over time copied by monks, scribes.
  
  The reality is, and many argue, The Christ (whichever incarnation you choose to believe him to be, Horus, Mithra, All the rest) Was predicted to die, so he had to die. The stories all hold one common thread, he told Judas to "do what you must do"
  
  That being said, the story should be that he had himself betrayed because without his death there would be no resurrection, no fulfillment of prophecy, he betrayed himself.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Ha Faybe leave the computer and as soon as ya bo someons says ha...
  The show was intresting giving diffrent views as to what is written on diffrent things. The non I mentioned above realy stuck out for me. And the Judus thing also. Jesus said" Go do what you must do" Like a command.
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  But you believe the show???
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I watch the diffrent views concerning why diffrent people might or might not instigate the killing.
  Thought about which story made sence in my beliefs.
  As I said "MY beliefs"
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, I can read..
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  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You don't buy the trinity Deborah?
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No..not the way Christians believe it. My Spiritual tool which is the Kabbalah..is based on Psychology...Jung was a Mystic too...
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Wasn't repeating for your benefit.
  Was waiting for someone else to say "can you prove that"
  And to tell the truth I can not even prove that I believe anything. HUMM
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
Zealots are big into killing each other, it's a biblical thing.
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tantrumposted 14 years ago
Who framed Jesus ?

His Father. Who else ?
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You got that right. But who got framed for killing him?
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Nobody.
  there's no record.
  all the guilt falls on his Father.
  
  God.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The only records that are avaliable on this issue is the bible that Rome put together. So of course the Jews proclamed that they accept the blame and The governor that ordered it be done is inocent.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Even the Bible does not blame the Jews, I'm gonna have to go look it up now.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You might be right. That might be one of those things that is interpretater or jist made up that I learned from watching TV. laying dormate in the back of my mind. I think it is in there??
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  John from 19:12 and Luke 23:20 thru 24
  seeming to say that Pilot wanted to let him go but the Jews insisted. I was thinking that the Jews said that they accept any blame but I'm not sure if it is actually written in the bible.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  No I will find it.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Faybe Bay,
  
  You don't have to find it. It's already know how and why Jesus had to die. The question is how many people know the truth and can actually take from the bible what's need and vacate the mythology of most of it's parts?
  
  Usually, it is done by ministers, scholars and the educated elite, per se.
  
  The average person is left to figure it out for themselves, so much of the translation or understanding of the bible itself and it's significance is misleading.
  
  It's unfortunate, but does happen when people are corrupted.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  This is true Cagsil. as I have said, the problem is people view the Bible as one of two things, A History Book (it is not) and a Fairy Tale( it is not)
  
  The Book is a compilation of "Inspired Writing" if people know what it is, it might make it easier to decipher what it says.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Okay, stop here for a just a second.
  
  The bible is exactly as stated- a historical book with mythology mixed in.
  The Bible is NOT "inspired writing" of any stretch of the imagination. There are plenty of things that are inspired works by many different people. The bible is part of religion.
  
  Religion is a business based on a specific code of ethics(reinforced by a certain philosophy), and it's bound to a higher cause(GOD) other than self.
  
  It's a billion dollar a year business that allows cheaters to usurp power, wealth and influence over the masses who follow it.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry to bother, and not seriously wishing any debate with you my friend. When I say inspired, it is with the meaning that no work, whether it word or deed is ever done without inspiration. Some inspiration is not pretty, like the inspiration it took to cause you to spar with me.
  
  Writing, painting drawing dancing all are arts. War and hatred, are arts, math is an art. Medicine is an art, science is an art. Without inspiration there is no art. Love is an art, sex is an art, without these arts Cagsil, you would not exist. Art is inspiration, to the point of creation, even destruction is inspired, inspired to express the feelings within.
  
  Tell me again, this book is not inspired, then it does not exist, nor do you or I or Hub Pages, or this debate.
  
  Sorry, I am Irish. Look up inspired. it is related to Aspired, I aspired to end a debate with you, and you inspired me to continue.
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The Bible is about Archetypes in the human psyche.
  It shows how the perfect mind became filled with EGO and how we can separate the true self from the EGO...
  
  The ego is the true Satan..the enemy..the idol.
  The EGO is what separates us from all other animals.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you Deborah, for that. I am sorry my EGO often gets the better of me.
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  Dim Flaxenwickposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Dear Faybebay, The bible DOES blame the jews for killing Jesus, just not All of them Many jews became Jesus' followers. But if you check out John chapter 11 from verse 44 onwards, you'll see how some of the jews who'd witnessed the resurrection of Lazarus went straight to the Pharisees, (also jews) verse 53 "Therefore from that day on they took counsel to kill him"
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yes and As I said, this thread was started about the history channel show "Who framed Jesus."
  Pharisees are priests of a sect, so are sadducees, but who had the greatest to gain by killing him? The royalty, they just didn't want his blood on their hands. The church and state were co-existent. The Temples doubled as banks. Lending sacrifices for later pay. They did not want this to end, and the King did not want a revolution. The Leaders conspired, and then "moved the crowd" to ask for Barrabas and crucify Christ.
  
  Now that I have defended that point of view, if you read down the page you will see the question is really why did Rome want to make everyone believe that it was the Jewish Multitude who crucified Jesus?
  
  Debate has ended, Jerami is at work, and his wounds have been eased.
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  Dim Flaxenwickposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  OK. Seems fair to me.
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  Brenda Durhamposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Actually it does.
  Acts 4: 10 specifically names the Israelites as Jesus's crucifiers.
  But Paul's accusation was also an accusation to ALL non-believers, in effect. He's telling all the people that Jesus died for them, and testifying to the fact that it's because of Jesus that he himself (Paul) is standing before them.
  And I will add that it's not so much a "blame-placing" (since Jesus willingly gave up His life) as it is that Paul is trying to get them to understand the magnitude of what had happened----that Jesus was the ONE who died to save them from their sins.
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Those are only suppositions.
  And if Jesus is God's son, as you Christians believe,He died for our sins by God's orders. So the only one to blame in this story is God.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I'm just saying what it said.
  Didn't say I agree with it.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Here, try this Matthew 27 :15-26 It is the priests in every case, who are angered. and in each scenario "move the people" to request the release of Barrabbas. Another reason I do not follow "religions".
  I each gospel if you back up a few verses, it is the priests, not the Jewish people.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I went to a few churches for a while a couple of times.
  Quit going when I noticed that no one liked my asking the tough questions. Wasn't trying to be a trouble maker just wanted an answer and when they wouldn't answer I had to tell um what I thought the answer must be. And I was going to keep that concept till they could give me a better one.
  Like I said They don't like me no matter how much they said they loved me.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That was it Matt 27:25 "..His blood be on us and all of our childre".
  Can you imagine they realy said that?
  I think that this might have been added in this book for political reasons.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  You have already seen what I believe Jerami, I told you, you are mathematically advanced of me. That being said, I will discuss further with you the sins of the father.
  
  It is this. The sins are not "Paid for" by the children, They are not "suffered for" by the children.
  It means that children see what their fathers do, and mimic that. It takes ten generations for a child to finally say "Hey, my daddy was wrong and so was his daddy and his before him... This is right."
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I could not agree more.
  Was just sayin what this verse says. I don't believe they said it.
  There are old testament verses concerning that issue about the children not taking on the sins of the father concerning redemption that agrees with you.
  There are other verses about the sins being carried on for a number of generations. I think those are refering to the results of the sins of the father being carried through generations.
  I can't remember where these verses are .
  As Earnist will testify..I cain't find my car keys with out Gods help.
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  Andrew0208posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The issue of sacrifice has to be totally understood, we should ask what was the essence of His death to mankind? We ought to understand spiritually why His blood was sacrificed for reconciliation of man with God. In fact Jesus was framed by God's Word to fulfill this great purpose. It's beyond the comprehension of self, religion and science.
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The Jews say this ..Huh???
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I didn't say they did..
  I am saying the bible says they did.
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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
I reckon it was wodger wabbit!
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I was going to say Roger Rabbit..but he was framed too..was it maybe....Jessica?
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quicksandposted 14 years ago
Reminds me of a scene from "Asterix The Gaul!" The pirates' ship has been smashed to smithereens and each of them is hanging on to a piece of wood from the debris which helps them to stay afloat. The leader exclaims, "We've been framed, by Jericho!"

An asterisk at the end of that statement points to an explanatory note at the bottom which says, "Jericho - An ancient Gaulish artist."

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earnestshubposted 14 years ago
Yep! God killed himself!
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  tantrumposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That's why he's nowhere to be seen !!
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That is kinda what the story says.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Suicide by God proxy.
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  Deborah Sextonposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Christ was not and is not God..maybe you should stop watching TV to learn about your religion...
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
I rote a comment the other day about getting up early one morning, knowing that it had snowed all night,
I got up went rabit hunting in the new snow.
Followed the rabit tracks for hours never to see that little rascle Wabbit. Even though I never saw it, I am sure that it exists.

Found out later that at first light them little rascles will run in circles many times to cover it's scent before it returns to its burrow. Probably watched me all along...getting ready to catch it.
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Cagsilposted 14 years ago
At the time of Jesus, the Religious Educated Elite were in rule. This was associated with "religious teachings", which Jesus refused to teach.

With Jesus' refusal, it was him signing his own death warrant. The religious leaders found him a threat to their religious teachings and had him executed for NO CRIME at all.

It wasn't blasphemy, because Jesus was speaking the truth. The Truth was that Religion's "GOD" didn't exist and accused their actions as being evil.

The only damn reason people even think about 'sin' is because of Religious teachings, for which, you are not suppose to follow, under any circumstances. Religion's "GOD" and it's "Will" is nothing but a hoax.

Hidden away in Religious teachings is Jesus' work, only because after his execution....to incorporate the masses, they add his work, and came up with Christianity.

Jesus' last name wasn't Christ.
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  (Q)posted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe Jesus wasn't his first name, either.
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Rochelle Frankposted 14 years ago
After all this time, why are people still pointing fingers and trying to find someone to blame? Didn't Jesus preach forgiveness?
If He was OK with the result, why aren't we?
Let it go, whether you believe it or not.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  The question isn't who dun it..
  
  But why was the story leaning in the direction that it leans.
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  Rochelle Frankposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Meaning what...?
  That it blames someone?
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I just think that the way in which the story is told was told the way that it was for political purposes.
  I think that the basic story as told is true.
  But the spin doctors edited the new testament.
  And There was much more that should have been included.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Rochelle, it goes back to why "people" think the Jews killed Jesus. It is just the age old debate, but now this History channel thing brought up some of the conclusions. Jerami, wants to know if it was a political/religious assassination of the Jews.
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  Rochelle Frankposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Well I still don't think it matters-- because it is not supposed to be about group blame or guilt. Forgiveness is the message.
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
I'm going to roll out of bed in about six hours so

Good night yaul
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karlscabinposted 14 years ago
I know EXACTLY who framed Jesus. Leonardo Da Vinci did, right after he painted the last supper.
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  Rochelle Frankposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That's not in a frame-- It's on a wall of Milan's Church of Santa Maria delle Grazie.
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Pearldiverposted 14 years ago
I thought he got nailed after the last supper??
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terrowhiteposted 14 years ago
No one can frame Jesus! its Almighty! people come and go but jesus watches and stays forever.. even on the doomsday it will be there.. its a human but came from teh etarnal world..
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
Every one is correct with what they said above
. In truth it was not the Jewish people, their priests, nor the blame of Judas.

My question is why does scripture tell the story the way it does. Why does it place the blame every place but The Roman Government.
For over 250 years the Romans attempted to do away with Christianity and could not do it. If christianity could not be destroyed they had to at least get a handle on it.
When Constantine established the Universal Church, He was the supreme authority over this Church.
History was re written at that time
The books that were included in the canon was stratigicly selected and called the inspired of God. From that day forward Christianity started going a diffrent path.
It seems we see the facts that we want to see.
And understand them the way we want to. Close our eyes to that that we do not want to see.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I understand your frustration Jerami. It is an age old debate. People have spent more time working out what should or should not be in the Bible, and what it is all supposed to mean, than they have on solving the problem of poverty.
  
  Imagine, taking the number of scholars it has taken over the years, to compile, translate and print this compilation of ancient writings; add to that the work and rework done each time it has been translated into other languages; add to this the number of translations in the English language alone. Now, count the names and the years and imagine those same numbers working out a solution to world hunger and poverty.
  
  Words written and translated thousands of years ago, and people are still starving in our world. How many hours, Jerami, will you agonize over something that happened before any of us were born.
  
  This is why I do not debate words written by people I never met. It is not productive.
  
  You are a brilliant writer, you have a gift I could never hope to achieve myself, interpretation and math, together in one mind. Use your brilliance, let go of the past mistakes of people we never met.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I am humbled by your words.. And you are correct that we should live in the present and take care of our problems of today.
  
  Before I go to fix a hole in somebody elses sheetrock.
  (gotta make a living) I want to share some of grandpas wisdom.
  If ya want to fix what is wrong in your life ya gotta figure out what ya did wrong ta get ya to where you'r at. Stop doing whatever that is and life will soon get back like it is suposed to be.
  Religion in my opinion took a wrong turn someplace. Or it wouldn't be in the condition it is in.
  Instead of fighting about where we are and the stuff that is going on; we should figure out how to get back to where we are suposed to be.
  
  Any way .. sigh,.. Yaul have a great day .. while I go slaveing around the neighborhood.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Good luck Jerami, and yes we have much to fix. But it has to be started one on one, a single person at a time. Taking on a system never works. History will show I am right. In every revolution the purpose was lost. One person at a time will work globally. I am looking for some quotes, have a great day at work.
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theirishobserver.posted 14 years ago
Roger Rabbit
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KeithTaxposted 14 years ago
I think the same guy that framed Roger Rabbit, framed Jesus.
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
Hay Hay...
hello Mr Hokey

Hockey
Paradox warning.
How can something be prophecy and man have free will. To say it is prophecy is to say it is destined. That negates free will.

To answer the question ... It's kinda like getting on a cruse ship.. Ya might say that it is propesied that you are going to Jamica You have free will... play shuffelboard, poker at the bar, swim in the pool chase girls , whatever ya want to;... You have free will...
BUT you'r goin to Jamica.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Nice! I like that. We may have to start a new thread. This one has been up and down all day. I have been trying to act as bouncer.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  That's an interesting role to accept.....
  
  And, depending on what frame of mind one is in it could be very, very interesting.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe I should have said Peacemaker...
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Naw....that doesn't work any better, but I'm sure you probably would look good in Military clothing wear? Hmmmm.....
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Are you sprouting wings now?
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Now, what in the world would make you say that?
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  I saw that.. You'r a good friend...
  
  I think this is a good subject that has a lot of potential to bridge a number of Intresting issues when we really think about it.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah, about that. We have a Buddhist thread for Cagsils and non-Cagsils, with no arguing. It's peaceful.
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  Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  
  Interesting?
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Don't get a swelled head.
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  Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  Goina check it out. Back in a few
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
If we realy think about it ??? Ya stop and think about if political propiganda entered into the New testament concerning this issue I ask myself What does this mean? How ? and why? And how deep did this go? All kind of questions come to mind.
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  Faybe Bayposted 14 years agoin reply to this
  It was about money. It is always about money.
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
My computer is running slower than molasses in January.
And kicking me off of HP . Bet it needs to be hospitalized.
Lost sp ck a couple of days ago. can ya tell?
Goinna shut down and reboot. That is about all I know how to do. cleared cookies yeaterday. Maybe it's mad.
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Jeramiposted 14 years ago
There were hundreds if not thousands of writtings that were written after the crucifixion and before the establishment of the Universal church in 326 AD. I find it intresting that those writtings that were accepted into the canon were mostly favorable to Rome? The persicution of Christians biblicaly speaking were mostly carried out by the Jewish religious leaders.

It is through other historical records that we understand the extent of Roman persicution towards Christians .

Most people forget that for almost 300 years the Roman Empire attemped to exterminate Christians.
And then all of a sudden a Roman Emperor desides to gather all the Church leaders together and gets them to agree with a particular doctrine having him (Constantine) as the ultimate authority over the Universal Church.
No wonder that the selection of writtings selected as scripture will show Rome in the most favorable light as ispossible.
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Google Maps	Some articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google Charts	This is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host API	This service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
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Maven	This supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)

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Google AdSense	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClick	Google provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index Exchange	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
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Facebook Ads	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad Marketplace	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexus	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Openx	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon Project	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLift	This is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say Media	We partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing Pixels	We may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking Pixels	We may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.

Statistics
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Comscore	ComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking Pixel	Some articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)
Clicksco	This is a data management platform studying reader behavior (Privacy Policy)

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