Let me start off with roolllff!  Everytime I look at a bill I get sick, everytime I need to bust out a credit card just to make it to the next month I wanna puke.  Trying to get along in a busting economy is making me sick. 

I do need advise,  good advise in a couple of areas, 1.  how to not feel sick when doing what I have to do to survive, and
2. how to stop the cycle without consolodation or more credit cards
3. when oh when does it end!

Sandy, sorry for answering with a question, but do you hate rich people?

Misha wrote:

Sandy, sorry for answering with a question, but do you hate rich people?

no, I dont hate rich people, but I do think it is wrong to rip off the poor people when they are already poor to keep wealthy.  Plus a lot of rich people earned thier riches because they worked hard for it and a lot of them share thier riches with less fortunate people.  but things I do hate:  when I can't be included in friends celebrations on accounts (no pun intended) that I cant afford it, not that my friends exclude me, but I dont take want to take advantage of thier generosity either.  Why did you ask?

Well, I am working on a similar problem myself. While I don't have any debt, my income so far lags my expenses. I'm living on saved money for the last couple of years.

Point is, I found that I have a set of beliefs about rich people that literally hold me in place. I just sabotage my own efforts to make a good living. After I realized that, and started to work on changing my beliefs in this area, my finances started to get much better

Misha wrote:

Well, I am working on a similar problem myself. While I don't have any debt, my income so far lags my expenses. I'm living on saved money for the last couple of years.

Point is, I found that I have a set of beliefs about rich people that literally hold me in place. I just sabotage my own efforts to make a good living. After I realized that, and started to work on changing my beliefs in this area, my finances started to get much better

well can you share what you did, maybe it will make sense and I can use it too.

Your new avatar is probably a step in the right direction

Well, I hope it is not going to be blind leading blind, and hope Jenny will correct me if I go dead wrong I never really tried to put this on paper before, so bear with me

In communist Russia hating riches and hating money in general was ingrained into almost everyone's mind much like Christians ingrain Satan and Hell into their kids' minds. I was not an exception in any way. My parents, especially father, still hate rich people and blame on them any misfortune of their own, and since they don't have much misfortune lately -  any misfortune of the country, real or imaginary...

To my surprise by the way, I saw a lot of that same mentality when I moved to the US, which is supposed to be the exact opposite... Talking about the unity of opposites

Anyway, the problem I was facing (and still face to some extent) was the belief that spiritually good people can't be rich. Or, rather, that rich people cannot be spiritual. That money (in any quantities) kill spirituality. While I see quite a few examples to the contrary, this belief sits on the subconscious level and rules. Since I do think of myself as a spiritual person (which may be not true, but I still prefer to think this way - asking for a compliment ), this belief presents a real problem to me.

I understand on the conscious level that this is plain not true, and many rich people are way more spiritual than quite a few poor ones, and many poor people are not spiritual at all and just care about snack and f*** - but my subconscious is still there sabotaging me...

And to tell you the truth - I did not find an efficient way to deal with it. I don't know, things like NLP and hypnosis may work - but I hate letting anybody to mess with my mind, and I stay away from them. There is not much left then. Basically, I can think of two methods. First is registering every fact about rich people being good and spiritual that comes my way. Not letting it slip away, but thinking about it and trying to let it sink in, down (or up?) to unconscious. Second is meditating on phrases like "rich people are good" or "money do not affect spirituality".

Such methods do not give me an immediate effect, but over time I think I am starting to feel better and allow myself to make more

wow, Misha, I couldn't imagine growing up in a communist country that taught people to hate the rich.  Glad you are smarter than that.  not that I am even close to rich or anything.  I guess everyone has thier problems, different but similar eehh?

Misha wrote:

Your new avatar is probably a step in the right direction

Well, I hope it is not going to be blind leading blind, and hope Jenny will correct me if I go dead wrong I never really tried to put this on paper before, so bear with me

In communist Russia hating riches and hating money in general was ingrained into almost everyone's mind much like Christians ingrain Satan and Hell into their kids' minds. I was not an exception in any way. My parents, especially father, still hate rich people and blame on them any misfortune of their own, and since they don't have much misfortune lately -  any misfortune of the country, real or imaginary...

To my surprise by the way, I saw a lot of that same mentality when I moved to the US, which is supposed to be the exact opposite... Talking about the unity of opposites

Anyway, the problem I was facing (and still face to some extent) was the belief that spiritually good people can't be rich. Or, rather, that rich people cannot be spiritual. That money (in any quantities) kill spirituality. While I see quite a few examples to the contrary, this belief sits on the subconscious level and rules. Since I do think of myself as a spiritual person (which may be not true, but I still prefer to think this way - asking for a compliment ), this belief presents a real problem to me.

I understand on the conscious level that this is plain not true, and many rich people are way more spiritual than quite a few poor ones, and many poor people are not spiritual at all and just care about snack and f*** - but my subconscious is still there sabotaging me...

And to tell you the truth - I did not find an efficient way to deal with it. I don't know, things like NLP and hypnosis may work - but I hate letting anybody to mess with my mind, and I stay away from them. There is not much left then. Basically, I can think of two methods. First is registering every fact about rich people being good and spiritual that comes my way. Not letting it slip away, but thinking about it and trying to let it sink in, down (or up?) to unconscious. Second is meditating on phrases like "rich people are good" or "money do not affect spirituality".

Such methods do not give me an immediate effect, but over time I think I am starting to feel better and allow myself to make more

This is exactly my problem also. I did not grow up in a Communist country, but I think I must have been a monk in a past life as I have had this strong belief since childhood that I have to live in poverty in order to follow a spiritual path. Lol.

This belief has caused my finances to suffer. Now I try to focus on how much good I could do in this world if I had money. How many more people I could help if I was financially well off.
I envision being wealthy so I can change the lives of all the people I see around me.

This is the only way I know to combat my 'poverty beliefs'. Right now I'm still in debt but there has been a definite shift in my life and career lately that I feel is a direct result of my change in attitude.
I'll let you know if the money follows!

I think that too, if I had money I would use it for good reasons as well.  But I still give wherever I can.  Usually not money cause I never have any, but I love giving stuff away even though sometimes my friends call me insane.  I say, well it makes me feel good,  you can exchange things and money, but a genuine smile is priceless.

sandra rinck wrote:

I think that too, if I had money I would use it for good reasons as well.  But I still give wherever I can.  Usually not money cause I never have any, but I love giving stuff away even though sometimes my friends call me insane.  I say, well it makes me feel good,  you can exchange things and money, but a genuine smile is priceless. 

That's such a great attitude!

sandra rinck wrote:

Let me start off with roolllff!  Everytime I look at a bill I get sick, everytime I need to bust out a credit card just to make it to the next month I wanna puke.  Trying to get along in a busting economy is making me sick. 
I have a lot of Friends that were in your Situation until I Intrduce them to the Power of Gifting.Check it out @ http://www.nevercashout.com
I do need advise,  good advise in a couple of areas, 1.  how to not feel sick when doing what I have to do to survive, and
2. how to stop the cycle without consolodation or more credit cards
3. when oh when does it end!

sandra rinck wrote:

I do need advise,  good advise in a couple of areas, 1.  how to not feel sick when doing what I have to do to survive, and
2. how to stop the cycle without consolodation or more credit cards
3. when oh when does it end!

#1 when you have your spending under control
#2 stop spending
#3 when your income is less than your outgoings

Im not being sarcastic - it really is a a pretty simple equation.  You say you don't have money to give away but you do give away things - where did the things come from - you spent money on them obviously.  I wrote more about it here http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-get-out- … save-money

Lissie wrote:

sandra rinck wrote:

I do need advise,  good advise in a couple of areas, 1.  how to not feel sick when doing what I have to do to survive, and
2. how to stop the cycle without consolodation or more credit cards
3. when oh when does it end!

#1 when you have your spending under control
#2 stop spending
#3 when your income is less than your outgoings

Im not being sarcastic - it really is a a pretty simple equation.  You say you don't have money to give away but you do give away things - where did the things come from - you spent money on them obviously.  I wrote more about it here http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-get-out- … save-money

oh yeah, I know, I get what you are saying.  I was actually refering to the trend in the economy and what I am suddenly (seemingly) paying out in bills like electricity, gas, water, trash, etc. 


I still have to pay my bills,  I would love to stop spending my money there.
my income use to be in balance with my outgoings, then the bills and rent started creeping slowly over the last couple of years, 2-3. 

I'd love to say I live a life of luxery, but I hardly live a life of modesty.  Most everything I have, I bargain for and I don't have much, but I still find it good to give things when I have them.  It works in circles for me, at least in my life. 

I sorta thought your comment was a nasty assumption, but whateva.

Credit and debt...ukkk!  I piled up a bit of debt on credit cards raising my children, giving them lessons and a few material things that they needed to feel better and do better for themselves. So now I am paying all that off now that the kids are out of the house. I put what debt I could into a consolidation program, and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel now. Main thing that bothered my was dealing with them and getting bills constantly. So all that has been cut off or at least cut down with this consolidation.
So I have been working on my abundance attitude, too. I bless my money each day as a gift from the universe that I deserve and have worked for. Money is power, keep it clean, neat, joyful, wisely spent and wisely earned and wisely handled (working on these things). I have written affirmations that I read daily, and created visualizations of abundance to focus on...all with a clean and worthy consciousness.
I went through the same cycle of monk hood that you have to be poor to be spiritual, but it has run its course. I tithe with money and/or time offered to others in volunteer work. The whole concept of tithing has helped me a lot, too.
The two most powerful things for me are thinking that money is blessed and to keep moving forward (spend a bit on things that are moving you forward...its like priming the pump..to keep the abundance flowing) and it keeps me joyful too. I give myself a least one special treat each week...use to do the same for the kids too, I didn't want them to feel the pinch as negative, but as a nudge to do better because we deserve it. Sometimes it was a simple a treat as a Large ice cream cone! yummm:) Treat your soul and you'll stay whole!

SparklingJewel wrote:

Credit and debt...ukkk!  I piled up a bit of debt on credit cards raising my children, giving them lessons and a few material things that they needed to feel better and do better for themselves. So now I am paying all that off now that the kids are out of the house. I put what debt I could into a consolidation program, and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel now. Main thing that bothered my was dealing with them and getting bills constantly. So all that has been cut off or at least cut down with this consolidation.
So I have been working on my abundance attitude, too. I bless my money each day as a gift from the universe that I deserve and have worked for. Money is power, keep it clean, neat, joyful, wisely spent and wisely earned and wisely handled (working on these things). I have written affirmations that I read daily, and created visualizations of abundance to focus on...all with a clean and worthy consciousness.
I went through the same cycle of monk hood that you have to be poor to be spiritual, but it has run its course. I tithe with money and/or time offered to others in volunteer work. The whole concept of tithing has helped me a lot, too.
The two most powerful things for me are thinking that money is blessed and to keep moving forward (spend a bit on things that are moving you forward...its like priming the pump..to keep the abundance flowing) and it keeps me joyful too. I give myself a least one special treat each week...use to do the same for the kids too, I didn't want them to feel the pinch as negative, but as a nudge to do better because we deserve it. Sometimes it was a simple a treat as a Large ice cream cone! yummm:) Treat your soul and you'll stay whole!

Thanks Jewel,

I see some light at the end of the tunnel as well,  it's called when I get my car paid off.  Geeessszzeeee, just. a. couple. more. years. to. go.

I have been handling my credit card debt using the "snowball method". I pay as much extra as I can on the card with the highest interest, then, when that one is paid off, I move on to next, until they are all paid off. This month I will be able to pay off both of my department store credit cards (Kohls & Macys), and I have paid down one of the my two major credit cards by about $2000. I have one other card--a Mastercard-- that I have still been using for emergencies.

I started this about six months ago, and I'm really amazed at how quickly it goes. Here's a great link on how to do it, plus some other good ideas, at Motley Fool:

http://www.fool.com/personal-finance/cr … -debt.aspx

As to the hating rich people part and equating poverty to spirituality, there are lots of great books on how to get past that. Most of them rely heavily on creative visualization, which sounds really hokey and New Age-y, except it works! Honestly, try it, it really does work.

About four months ago I was so sick of my call center job I wanted to shoot myself (six years in call centers now, even though I have two degrees and once ran a successful landscape design business). I resorted to the visualization stuff, which I have used before, and now I have so much paid writing work I am working all the time--I'm not exaggerating.

Now I'm thinking, hey! That could be a good hub! Anyway at this point I need to visualize "health insurance." I still work half time at the call center for the health insurance. It's like being held hostage for insurance. Anyone have any ideas on how to get insured in this marvelous ruined US of A?

I forgot to mention--i cut up ALL MY CARDS except one when I started to pay them down, and it really does help. I can't tell you how many times I reached for one and remembered I cut it up already.

I left one major card intact because after all, we are living in the US under George Bush. But as soon as it is the only one left, I will freeze it in a block of ice and pay it off too.

This happened to me 5 years ago..After accumulating some credit card debts over a period of 6 months, i tried very hard to pay them off by putting all my cards on cold turkey. First, I transfered all the credit cards debts to a single account that had a 50% lower interest rates on my bills. Next, I canceled all but 1 card which had the lowest interest rates. Then I apportion a amount of my pay to paying off my bills and used only cash to pay for all my expenses.

This was a difficult phase and I took about 9 months to complete paying off all my bills. Since then, i have become apprehensive about whipping out my card...I am more of a cash kinda guy unless I am traveling.

Most importantly about getting out of such mess, is to be discipline about not accumulating any more debts on your cards while you try to pay off everything. I know that this may not apply to everyone..so at least you should search for a card that has a low interest plan.

One more thing, i love to call customer service and "threaten" to cancel my card so as to get them to waiver my late payment or interest charges...often it works!

I used to work as a bankruptcy attorney, so I have some knowledge in this area.

First, call all of your companies and see what they will do to lower your interest rate under threat of losing you as a customer. Just getting the rate reduced can sometimes be a life saver. Also, if you must pay a yearly fee to maintain a card, cancel it. There are plenty of companies that will give you credit without an annual fee.

Second, as previously suggested here, cut up your cards, saving only one for actual emergencies and items that must be purchased with credit (rental cars, hotel reservations, etc.). Do not use your one card unless you must. Do not use it for expenses like groceries, gas, clothing, or other purchases that you can pay for in cash, check, or debit card.

In fact, the best thing you can do for yourself is to sit down and make out a budget. What expenses must you pay for each month? Mortgage? Food? Gas? Car payment? Credit cards? Sit down and figure out how much you must pay. Then do not make any purchases that are not in your budget. Whatever money is left over, use it to pay down your cards. This is the hardest part for a lot of people, but there are ways to pare down expenses. Buy food on sale. Buy clothing at thrift stores. Try Blockbuster video for free rather than splurge for a night at the movies. Little by litte you will see that you have more cash at the end of each month.

Third, take as much money as you can afford to pay off your biggest balances while maintaining minimum payments on the smallest balances. Once you get your biggest balances down to the amount of your smaller ones, spread your surplus cash evenly among all balances to pay them all down. Again, you must try very hard not to make any purchases that are not in your budget. Obviously, if you have an emergency like your car breaking down, you will have no choice and will need to put it on that last card. But new clothing, eating out, trips to the movies and the like -- they are all off the table until you get your cards paid off.

Just realize that if you only pay your minimum balances each month, you will never get out of debt. That's why it's so important to throw as much money as you can afford at your largest balances.

The only way to use credit wisely is to pay off the balance in full each month. That way you do not incur interest or fees. It is the interest and fees that will eat you up alive, not the charges themsleves.

Best of luck to you.

CherylT2 wrote:

Third, take as much money as you can afford to pay off your biggest balances while maintaining minimum payments on the smallest balances. Once you get your biggest balances down to the amount of your smaller ones, spread your surplus cash evenly among all balances to pay them all down.

I think more efficient approach is to pay off the highest interest balance first, not the biggest one. And then repeat until all balances are paid off. Other than that, I totally agree