Dear President Obama: Please Stop Giving Money to the Banks!
79
Enough Already
I like to watch "Meet the Press" on Sunday mornings. Don't ask me why. I guess it's the masochist in me, some part of me that isn't really awake until I can get completely, head-to-toe consumed with impotent rage.(Plus, I am an Aries, though just barely.)
Coffee used to be enough. Now it's coffee and "Meet the Press."
This past Sunday the show featured Republican Congressperson Kay Bailey Hutchison and Democratic Senator John Kerry. They were kicking around the Congressional Stimulus Bill--you know the one--the "everything-except-the-kitchen-sink" (oh wait, there is a sink in there, I forgot) $900 billion plan to... um, what was that plan again?
I think the plan is something along the lines of, "We put up with your horrendous, evil Republicrap for eight long years and now we're going to pass everything we can think of that pisses you off in one fell swoop. Ha, ha, try to stop us you big losers you."
Something like that. It's hard to follow at this point, but that's what comes through for me about it. (I'm not a Republican, so I get it, I get the anger. But both sides are being predictably juvenile at this point.)
The standard assortment of financial talking heads was trotted out next, including financier and one-time independent candidate Steve Forbes.
Goody, I thought, now for the impotent rage that gets me goin' on Sundays!
They did not let me down.
The pundits were "disappointed" by the "unfortunate populist tone" that has recently taken hold of the country and the media. Specifically, people who don't understand finance---people like the President, working Americans, and anyone else in the country who doesn't already work in a bank and isn't in a coma---are saying really distasteful and ignorant things such as, well, such as maybe CEO bankers should stop paying themselves billions of dollars in bonuses at the same time that they are accepting billions in taxpayer bailout money. Right now the U.S. economy is waiting for a courtesy flush because of horrible things that they personally did. Iceland has already gone down the tubes. Australia and Britain don't look too good either. So, you know, ix-nay on onuses-bay for ow-nay, Okie-doh-kay?
The panel of pundits was pretending that their feelings were hurt by President Obama's recent strong words (spoken whist handing Wall Street and the banks yet another humongous sum of taxpayer money)--words suggesting that their salaries are "shameful."
They sniffed. They pouted. They lamented taxpayer ignorance.
Their feelings are hurt.
Who are they kidding?
We know they have no feelings.
Warning, 'Vent' in Progress
I voted for Obama and I still have great faith in him and like and respect him. If anyone can fix this mess, he can. The problem is, I'm no longer convinced anyone can fix this mess.
As Congress falls all over itself trying to construct something that ought to be pretty simple (fix the INFRASTRUCTURE, get people working--the entire state of Kentucky STILL doesn't have electricity you ding dongs!), while Congress flails around and Republicans keep quoting supply side economics and Obama keeps wagging his finger while handing out money anyway, I just want to list a few economic phrases I'm personally sick of.
Why not? Everybody else has something to say,most of it unhelpful.
So here are my latest unhelpful "Fall of the U.S. Empire" pet peeve phrases:
"Too Big to Fail" Clearly I'm no genius. If I were a genius, I wouldn't be sitting in my house in Michigan, without a job, tossing words into the bottomless well that is called the internets, or sometimes, the Googles (it's a series of tubes, guys). BUT (and here comes my big BUT)--BUT, if something is "too big to fail" then maybe--and this is just a thought from one of the great unwashed--maybe making it even BIGGER is not the best idea. Banks that are "too big to fail" are failing left and right, so the government has been brokering mergers and acquistions in the financial sector using taxpayer money, shoveling out funds to do this as fast as it can shovel, thus making the "too big to fail" banks even bigger. Someone please explain to me why this is a good idea.
"Unfortunate Populism" Look you guys, there is no such thing as a "fortunate populist." If you are born fortunate, or happen to have one of those six-figure jobs where your main task is to spend 18 hours a day doing things with other people's money that even you don't understand, just so that you can collect a million dollar bonus every quarter, then OF COURSE you're not going to be a populist. What would you possibly get out of that? No, the fact is, only desperate UNFORTUNATE poor people who see no hope for the future become populists, and the fact that you are hearing from these people more and more often, more and more loudly, ought to give you a half a clue, you big geniuses. So while you are busy trying to figure out what it all means on Press the Meet, could you at least refrain from using the vulgar, redundant, and incredibly snotty term "unfortunate populism"?
"Troubled Asset Relief Fund" From now on, the only TARP I really want to hear about is the one that Richard Fuld and Bernie Madoff and their friends have to live underneath--with all the other cockroaches. Hopefully that TARP leaks and is crawling with rats too. If you have anything else to say about TARP besides that, then seriously, I don't want to hear it.
"The U.S. Financial System is in Crisis" No, the U.S. financial system is completely screwed and about to fail in a major way. So why is our government shoveling money at it as fast as it possibly can? That money could be put to better use. For instance, people in Kentucky, who are currently bracing for another winter storm even though they still haven't gotten their electricity back from the last winter storm, could burn all that money instead of kerosene so they don't freeze to death. Then, instead of cutting taxes, Congress could put something in the stimulus bill about building a working electrical grid for Kentucky--oh yeah, and for most of the rest of the us too--so that in the future, the "who-could-have-ever-anticipated-it" SEASON OF WINTER (hint: it comes every year about this time) doesn't knock out power in entire multi-state segments of the U.S.for weeks and weeks.
"At the End of the Day" For some reason, politicians and pundits love to say, "at the end of the day." Is this because every day lately they wake up and immediately think to themselves, "Oh God, please make this day be over fast"? The trouble is, the phrase doesn't really mean anything, it just fills up air, and it's used so relentlessly that, at the end of the day, it's really starting to get on my nerves.
"Bipartisan Cooperation" Another oxymoron. Apparently what this means is that Obama is supposed to be really, really nice to the three or four bad-tempered Republicans who remain in federal government and invite them to cocktail parties and have meetings with them, and ask for their opinions on everything even though they just gutted the whole country financially, and then, in return, these few bad-tempered Republicans get to say they think he's a great guy but even so he still can go screw himself--No offense. What is the point of that? Someone explain to me what the point of that is.High school boyfriends are nicer than these guys.
"It's Very Complex" No it isn't. It's simple. We trusted you with our money, and you screwed it up really, really bad. Now you're trying to steal as much of what's left of it as you can. If any particular bend in the road that leads to that outcome looks complex or convoluted, it's because YOU made it that way. But the gist of it is not that hard to understand, so quit talking to the general public as though we are a bunch of hapless morons.
OK, I guess I'm done.
I'm not looking for a Pulitzer Prize for this hub, it's a rant, I know that. It's just that our government, such as it is, is really getting to me lately. I'm not even turning on the TV or radio today, I can't freakin' stand it anymore. I personally feel we should not give one more dime to these banks. They are about to go down no matter what we do. The average household is already in big trouble in the U.S.Every day thousands more lose their jobs and their homes.
What will the survival of these huge banks do for us exactly? Will they loan us money? Not if we don't have jobs they won't. Will they give us jobs? No they're laying people off by the thousands. Will they keep our money safe for us? No, not if we don't have money left to be kept anywhere--not in a jar, not in a bank, not in our old broken unused gold jewelry. If our money has become irrelevant, we don't need bankers to store it. Will they invest our money for us? No, because the companies we might normally invest in are going belly up faster than alewives in Lake Michigan in June. So why are we giving THEM the money we don't even have for ourselves right now?
Could it be so they can save their own butts while we don't even get a life raft?
We're rearranging deck chairs at this point. If someone in government really wants to be helpful, they'll order the band to start playing something nice.
How about, "Happy Days Are Here Again?"
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Comments
phew! I'm exhausted just reading this! Fabulous rant, though. And the more I learn about how the financial world "works" (I'm wogeously ignorant) the less sense I see in bailing out the banks, and I wonder about the need to protect the big institutions' concept of themselves as being some juggernaut of financial stability.
I just noticed today's Dictionary.Com word-of-the-day is "defalcate." Timely coincidence, or political commentary?
I agree with both comments above - fabulous rant.
Banking seems to have acquired a brilliant double act, socialised losses, privatised profits....
Hi pgrundy,
Excellent hub. I don't understand why they keep wanting to give so much money to these banks and whoever else when they already proved that they can't handle it anyway.
" Too Big To Fail" The bigger they are the harder they fall. And when they fall they squash all of us and the implications from that are devasting.
Everyday in the news you hear about all these banks that are getting taken over by the feds because of decisions they are making. I saw on CNN the other morning where the gov't had to step in on Citibank or some bank like that and stop them from purchasing a airline that was going down the tubes. They said that with all these banks begging for money that this particular bank was making a poor choice.
I wish my rants were as coherent as yours! It's better for me to read yours and just nod so I don't embarass myself :) You put this overwhelming situation into exactly the right words. Thanks for continuing to lay it on the table!
Pam, thank you for another excellent article.
For all that republicans like to make a scapegoat of social services as an example of Big Government waste, people who actually need the money (students, young single moms, the unemployed) have to document every aspect of their existance on a regular basis to get money from the government. And debt to the government by the common man can never be "forgiven" through bankruptcy (irs, student loans).
But here we have these failing fat cats who are getting billions of the common man's money with no accountability whatsoever. And the more they fail the more we give them. As a student, I had to maintain a certain GPA and actually enroll in a full course load, not just claim that as my intention. I had to actually purchase a home with the money lent to me by my mortgage broker. If I didn't follow through with these plans, the amount would have been due in full, immediately.
Why do we expect so much less from an industry who wrote the book on accountability? Why are there no records of where the money has gone in an industry that relies so heavily on accounting?
Meet the Press? Is that still on? I think my dad watched that. I'm glad you;re helping to vent the nation of frustrated Americans. I have to admit, my favorite quote of the whole article was when you wrote "Right now the U.S. economy is waiting for a courtesy flush" ha ha. You kill me.
I sent the URL for this article to President Obama via the Whitehouse.gov web form. This is a great hub.
Hi guys, whew! Thank you for letting me vent here and thank you for all your comments. Now I have to get busy and write my foot powder articles for the day so I can pay my bills.
RJ--I'm old enough to BE your father. (I'm not him though.) :o)
Tom Rubenoff--Uh oh. No more talkin' in the cell phone fer Pam! lol!
Pam - really there's no need to worry. After all, there are plenty of hubbers who KNOW how to fix the financial crisis - usually along the lines of: deregulate completely and let the nice altruistic market sort everything out by itself...
Very well put and factual---keep up the good work. I was listening to CNN this morning and all the Republicans could do was throw barbs at the Democrats for their Stimulus plan. Dare I say that the Republicans and Bush/Chaney had complete control of our government over the past eight years...We are living their legacy now of protecting the rich, the lobbyist, and any others who could line their pockets...
I, like you, believe that Obama is our best chance for getting this country back on its feet both economically and financially. The realism of this is he cannot clean this mess up in a matter of weeks or months. It will take time and our support. Regardless of what your party affiliation is, we are all in this together and that is how we must stand---TOGETHER! So, I say to the Republicans, "get over your power trip and work towards a better and once again, prosperous America." To the Democrats I say, "Your thoughts are in the right direction but pull in that spending bill. Fill it with meaningful proposals to heal our economy and forget the pet projects for now, they can wait."
Here's my two-bits:
1. They need to get rid of the IRS and re-establish the national sales tax...That's billions we would save there in $$$$$ and everyone will be paying their fair share including businesses.
2. Government---keep your hands out of the Social Security fund---it belongs to the workers of this country and you and the president have no right dipping into the surplus as a general fund and to pay for pet projects...Yes folks, they do that all the time...
There's my rant added to yours!
Great Hub, PG. ANd a great rant. But you hit the nail on the head. In a kind of collusion between the folks who got us into this mess, and the media who told us there was no mess, until a couple of days after the Dow started tanking, we now get the same "pundits" telling us why the mess happened, and what we should do to fix it. Jeez Loueeze!
Hazel Henderson, a very wise woman who consults for the Southern (S.A. and Asian) countries spent a long time studying economics so she could understand the big-wigs when they'd put her off by saying, "It's economics, Dearie. You wouldn't understand."
Her conclusion: Economics is a form of brain damage.
I agree. It's not like any other field, grounded in reality. It's all theories and speculations. They try to make out as if it were a science, but if science worked like economics did, periodically, without warning, all the airplanes would fall out of the air. Oops! A correction!
I can't remember who said, "Kill all the lawyers," but I truly do think that we'd be better off economically and ecologically (the "eco" in each relates to our earth household, and caring for it) if we took out all the economists, and shot them.
If nothing else came of it, it'd at least be fodder for a great hub from Rockin' Joe. Eh?
I was burning my bra in the 70's. The 80's were spent working and the 90's were spent raising kids. Where is the line I get into behind you when we march. I don't have little kids anymore and I can still walk. Open the flood doors.You're very smat and a great writer Pam.
Amen to every word.
I hear and concur with all you've said! My boyfriend sets the alarm to watch Meet the Press!! Myself, I take a "news fast" at least once a week. I wonder why it hasn't occured to those in charge that perhaps the best economic fix of all would be to throw some of those billions and billions of dollars directly to us, the tax payers, rather than the token "stimulous" checks that we used last time to pay bills or buy our medication rather than to blow it shopping?
Hi guys. Thanks for your comments!
I like Bruce's shoot the economists idea. Except for Paul Krugman who has a sort of a boyish charm thing going on that works on me just a little bit. (Hey, I'm only human. I never claimed to be a saint.)
I read somewhere that so far, the amount of money just pissed away on the banks alone would have paid off every bad mortgage in the U.S.
Imagine that.
I have to wonder too why we didn't just do THAT. Presto, problem half-solved. Here we are getting in deeper and deeper with nothing to show for the $1 trillion we already spent, working on shoving another trillion out the door. It's so insane.
It is insane - brain damage and greed. The money's going to someone -- bankers, consultants, economists. Perish the thought! People are taking to the streets in Europe and Mexico. That gets downplayed in Canadian and US news sources. Viva la revolucion!
I'm really shocked no one is taking to the streets here yet. That is my biggest fear lately--that violence will break out and it will get so much uglier fast. I'm sure if it does break out it will be suppressed by the media. Already they don't give an honest picture of how bad it really is. It's all about Wall Street and the banks. We don't hear about how badly it is hitting ordinary people. Here, there was a front page article of where people can get a box of food for $30 no questions asked--this because the food banks are running out of stuff. We don't hear this.
I'll gladly listen to any of your rants anyday, they are always so well put. I keep thinking that the global tsunami that follows along with in the wake of our sinking Titanic -- Bruce is right it's swallowing up parts of the world and most are hearing nothing about it. Can't help but wonder if we all of our life boats are tied together and what danger might be in that?
Then, it might be my own banking woes when they (our bank) suddenly decided without notice that U.S. treasury direct monthly deposits can be held an extra day when the 1st falls on a weekend -- and change their rules to limit your daily limit at the ATM to $300 in a day (down from $1000). From here on out, I'll drive to the main branch (some 47 miles) and cash out our retirement checks, leaving just enough to keep the account open till the next month. At least then we won't be at the mercy of a troubled bank.
Well put! I choose to stand by ignorantly to this financial fiasco. I can't change policy, so I can't bring myself to worry. I just have to keep recycling, spending locally and finish school--doing my part.
Hahaha Titanic!
Great Rant, Pam! I never really trusted them fat cats with my money either but what am I supposed to do with it, keep it in a sock and earn zero while inflation meanwhile makes it worth less & less? And I was agin' the bank bailout too, I thought it was throwing good money after bad. it's shameful what they did and I'm no genius either but I agree with put it in the infrastructure that's broken (public transport for starters) because I (stupid populist bitch that I am) can understand the short term benefit of that (jobs for more of my kind) and also the long term benefit which is less traffic jams less dependency on fossil fuel and so the vast vast vast majority of us who are not in bed with the Arab oil empire can tell those women hating rich saudi royalty to shove their damn oil.
PGrundy, Agreed. Let's not give the banks more money. Printing too much money is what causes inflation. So let's not print any more at all. Oh, and burning money to keep warm? I like that idea.
Hot Dorkage, I think that we will soon be rid of traffic jams as people who have no jobs leave the cities and disperse into the countryside, where fruit, not money, grows on trees.
We already have protests here in Britain, Pam. You may have seen it in the press. Job cuts are everywhere, and British workers are striking and protesting against foreign labour being brought in to fulfill certain contracts. There have also been marches and protests reported in France, Greece and Russia in the last week or so. These are just the ones I've read about, and the problems are only in their infancy so far as I can see.
This is the first stage. Relatively peaceful protest where people say things like 'keep jobs local' or 'keep jobs open.' The second stage might be angrier and the message more emotive, with demands for food aid and social welfare. The third stage is the ugly stage where violence starts, and people start physically taking what they need.
By nature I'm an optimist, and I like to think that things won't get that bad. Even at this late stage the tide could turn if someone turns some of those fatcats upside down and shakes the loose change out of their pockets. It's obscene that Banking bosses are still mainlining the taxpayers cash, and even attempting to justify the unjustifiable. They are digging the foundations out from under their own feet, and can't even see it. The era of 'me,me,me' has to come to an end if we are to see change.
Hi Pam! I know this is no laughing matter, still... I had a monumental laugh on account of your peeves. I don't feel so proud of that, because the damn problems are very real, but geez, the way you phrase it, I just couldn't help myself! The rant is priceless!
About giving money to banks –it needs to stop, absolutely, UNLESS that money starts promptly, as in NOW, reverting back to loans to people who need them, that's the only way this could maybe pan out --many of the companies that are failing/closing are doing so on account on debt, lack of sales is just one of the problems, lack of credit is the major one.
There are big screams and shouts round here about this, about what the f**k are the banks doing with the money they got, since they certainly aren't loaning to anybody. Last week, the PM here had some words for the banks in a press conference, and he called the reps to a meeting to discuss precisely that last Monday. I don't know how it went, but at least the money guys got a big public slap in the wrist. Our PM is a gutsy fellow – I think he may have been able to plant the seed of a change in behavior for the big banks.
I say hide and watch, it is going to get worse Amanda, a lot worse. Guess the bright side will be when there is no place left to go but up.
Hi everybody. :o)
Thank you for all your thoughts and for humoring me in my ranting.
Elena--glad it gave you a laugh! We might as well laugh.
There's an interesting article in this week's New Yorker magazine called "The Dystopians," about all these social theorists who think we are on the verge of a collapse similar to the Dark Ages--I mean a long period of really unpleasant primitive living. Most of them feel it could happen really fast and at any time. Look how fast Iceland went down. If someone told you Iceland would go bankrupt and have a coup by the end of 2008 six months ago, you'd probably have laughed. I would have. But now look how it is.
I'm not saying I believe all that, but it's an interesting article. I probably will do a hub on it because some of these guys are interesting even if they're wrong--James Howard Kunstler, Dmitri Orloff--crazy but interesting, and who knows? They may end up being right. I hope not.
LOL -- great rant. It occurs to me that with the fall of big banks, a lot of people who do still have some savings are going to lose what they have. At least Obama is starting to step on them for wasting it on CEO bonuses for successfully giving bailout money to themselves and stockholders instead of paying people or keeping jobs.
You gave me a great laugh with "Unfortunate Populism." No kidding! I'll bet it's unfortunate that people are wising up. The whole Crisis is that people are on average spending 1.5% less of what disposable income they have and saving a little more. Which may be why the banks can't be left to drown, it might cost the government more to have to pay out on the FDIC insurance for the vast majority of people who have money in them.
There is a way to deal with things that are too large. Break them up into smaller companies so that they're not too big to fall.
I have a lot of hope Obama is going to steer the country through this massive and important change, because I don't think the days of brainless consumerism will ever reach what they were or that ripoffs will ever be as easy as they used to be since the 80s. It got ludicrous for a while but this had to come at some point.
Good points about Kentucky's electrical grid too.
ROCK $%#^@# ON PAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Excellent treatise. I think our government is doomed personally. Along with the large corporations, my hubs talk on that nuff said, and at least down here in Florida we wont freeze to death too soon (near freezing tonight though cold front). Look on the bright side, when all the nations collapse, Peak Oil wont be such a large issue, nor will Global Warming. Now if only I owned a firearm already, shame I do not.
But seriously, I honestly think that the government and businesses will not pull it out of the fire. Only people left are us common folk to soldier on, ignore the rest of these jerks and life will hopefully go on.
In the mean time I know how to make soap, anyone got something to trade for it, and time to plant that Victory Garden as well.
Pam,
I love it when you rant!!! What is interesting to me is that even the Republican-thinking CNBC can't believe that these bozos who received TART money are being so stupid as to not tone it down a bit! Good lord, if it's YOUR money and your shareholders are deaf, dumb and blind, (no, I don't mean to put you good sightless folks into this pot with the banking dumb-asses) then write yourself as big a check as you want. The board should shoot you down, but, whatever, if I don't own the stock in your company, I really don't much care.
BUT, if you take TART money, at least PRETEND to be humbled by the fact that your company is in the toto and you still see yourself as deserving of an abnormally huge salary! Either these guys are so removed from reality that they have no clue, or, they are just looking the system in the eye and saying "F YOU."
Here's the important thing, Pam; I highly recommend that you watch CMT country music videos on Sunday mornings; this will lower your blood pressure and make you laugh! You'll start your week in a good mood! I love it and we all need to be entertained by something other than the clowns in Washington! Love you!!! Fabulous writing, as usual,
Madison
Pam: You remind me in some ways of Andy Rodney, (in wit, not looks, hehe) his rants are funny but make pretty good points. I have faith in Obama but of course, don't expect him to be a super hero and solve the mess in four years. And OMG, someone sent your hub to the President via the gov't website! :)
Great hub!
Pam,
I guess you and Kentucky didn't get the Memo. The Grid was sold to Warren buffet. It was the Enron thing privatize Utilities. Anyway, that guy makes me laugh he squeezes obscene profits off of the Electricity there. Making close to 50 percent profit by making people pay artificially high prices for electricity only he can provide. Then, talks about how terrible the tax system is. The tax system hasn't screwed anyone as bad as his utilities.
There that is my rant, I would like to courtesy flush Warren and give all of his money to the bottom 1/2 percent and call it a day.
TMG
Pam I really enjoyed the skillful way you put this together. As you know from reading my hubs we are in screaming agreement on everything you have stated here. I am still for taking all the bailout money back!
G'day Pam what a great rant I read it all the way through.lol!
I would agree with what earn say's about taking the money back, but I believe that they will not be able to find it?
I do not mean to show disrespect to your new President, but I did see his interview where he said something to the effect that the bonuses were "shameful". Well that was the most P... weak statement I have ever heard , I have used stronger words with my 6 year old grand daughter . Mr Obama will have to toughen up or he is over before he starts! He will be trampled in the Banks stampede to get the money.
Hi everyone--agvulpes, my better half had the exact same reaction to Obama shaming the bank CEOs over pay. That WAS piss weak. Last night on the news he said that today he was going to announce salary caps for banks that take TARP money--that he was going to do annouce that today. There is talk that any bank that takes federal money will not be able to pay anyone there more than $400K, which is what the President of the US is paid. I'm looking forward to hearing that--plus Representative Bernie Sanders of Vermont is heading an investigation into the banks to see if criminal charges can be filed against some of these guys. It's a start. It would be more fun to line them up and shoot them though.
Madison--Yeah these guys are so cluelss. It's clear they feel invincible. Thank you for your comments and all your supportive words!
Money Guy--Indiana (where I come from) did that too--privatized their HIGHWAY system! It's owned by Australia, I sh#t you not. No I didn't get the memo though. Just for the record, I haven't gotten the memo in years!
earnest, violet, robert, TKIMWRVC, t.keeley, thanks for reading this. Thank everyone. :o)
pgrundy great rant -do love a good rant!!
I think that at the "end of the day" good money is being thrown after bad when it is given to banks who are meant to serve the people not swindle the people - and also used to bolster salaries that are so big the company presidents could buy a small country with their payouts...........no one human is worth that obscene amount of money - no one!!
" re the following from one the comments above " the best economic fix of all would be to throw some of those billions and billions of dollars directly to us, the tax payers, rather than the token "stimulous" checks" that is what our new Prime Minister is trying to do at the moment although Liberal is fighting him.... it seems that the stimulus package given out before just before Christmas helped get the ecomony over a hump or two so he wishes to do it again....
great news that Australia actually owns something in the USA, even if is just a privatised highway (we have a lot of those here with tolls and cameras etc) - as far as i can see the big owners of things Australian are the UK., the US., and Japan....
go well - maybe Mr Obama will read this with his weet bix and give you a call...cheers
I didn't get the memo either, I just poked my nose where it wasn't welcome.
:-)
That was a beautiful rant. I didn't know that Australia owned Indiana highways (that's where I'm from, too). Excellent stuff.
Hi ajcor--Thank you for your thoughts on this! I think Australia could buy the whole state of California right now if you guys weren't broke too. California is paying it's bills now with IOUs--it's completely out of money.
Hey Money Guy--That would be one way to raise money though--just start selling off utilities and offices and highways and so on. I'm gonna sent that idea to Gov Grandholm. Maybe we could put the unemployment office up on Ebay. :o)
Meg--Yes, it's true. Apparently other states are following suit. Craziness. Thanks for your comment.
This whole deal has become such a joke that even Larry Flint asked for a bail out...I was wondering do you know where I can get my bailout? please send my paperwork ASAP.
Hi webjunkie. Actually I wish they'd do that. Just give the money directly to us. I just read somewhere that it works out to about $9,000 for every man, woman, and child in the U.S. I'm thinking $9,000 would stimulate SOMETHING if you gave it to ordinary people. That'll never happen though. Just because it's OUR MONEY doesn't mean we get to have any of it.
Obama should forget about coddling Republicans and do what's right for the country. Not only should lobbyists be banned, (after all, isn't lobbying just legalizedbribery?) pork should be required to have each project's own separate bill.
Pam, my sentiments are with you all the way. You are not ranting at all. You are speaking the absolute truth. The government is using out money(taxpayer) to bail out banks who are not lending or very little. On top of that large and small businesses are failing, therefore heavy job losses everywhere. Ordinary folks need help from everything to stopping foreclosures to creation of jobs. That's the bottom line and where the economy needs help to get it working the way it should. I better stop now and save some for a related Hub to yours. Once again an excellent Hub.
Great hub and excellent point. In my opinion, if the banking system remains "as is" after this disaster, then nothing will change and another equally disastrous crash will happen again. Hopefully I won't be around by then.
Hi jkfrancis, laringo & reagu--It may pass by midnight tonight. I hope so. I feel like Republicans had their chance and now they can just go pout about it. I don't know if it will work, but I do believe it's their best shot and Obama is doing his best on this.
laringo--I'll be looking forward to that hub of yours! Maybe it'll give me a rest! lol!
I love how you compared this situation to the Titanic!
is there an American equivalent of the British simile, "like re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic", meaning doing something totally fruitless?
That's British? I thought the Titanic was an American ship! When I saw the movie the first time I cried like a baby through the whole second half, but then I saw it years later and it had no effect on me--I thought, geez, what was my problem? But I remember that the first time I saw it, part of what made me cry was the connection to the U.S. as this big hulking arrogant ship about to go down horribly. At the time we had no inkling of this financial crisis. I think sometimes filmmakers just stumble onto the right metaphors accidently--or maybe its the Zeitgeist or something. Anyway I think that right now, yes, we've hit the iceberg, the band is playing, and Congress is busy with the deck chairs.
G'day Pam, just caught the CBS? news. Your time Friday night I think?
One item says that Jan unemployment down 500K+ (its awful when we start putting letters after the unemployment).
Next item Pres. O being interviewed and saying "it doesn't get any worse than this"
did I hear right, was he quoted out of context or doesn't he get IT?
Hmmm, hard to say what that news bit was. Usually 500K is a dollar amount--It means $500,000--half a million dollars. January unemployment here hit 7.6% (that's the official figure--it's always higher than the official figure because they only count people who file for unemployment for the first time and don't count all the people out of work who don't qualify or whose unemployment has run out). In January of the 2009 over 600,000 new claims were filed in a single month. It's the worst single month since 1931 and it's getting worse fast. I saw economist Paul Voelker speak yesterday--Obama appointed him to a team of economic advisors--and he said that even if the stimulus bill passes soon and everything goes as well as it can, Americans should prepare for 2010 at this time to be much worse than now. Kind of grim.
I think Obama totally gets it. What I'm not looking forward to is Monday, when his Treasury Secretary announces the biggest bank bail-out yet. It's supposed to be huge, and it's totally separate from the stimulus package. I strongly, strongly feel they are just wasting money bailing out these banks. It would be more productive to burn the money than give another penny to the banks. I think most people feel the same here, and if they come out and say, "Well, OK we know you're mad but we have to give the banks another gazillion dollars or the world will end"--If they say that, I think there will be violence here. I think people are very close already, and that will push them over the edge.
I've heard that they got the Bill through, is that correct?
And Bank CEO's will not get paid more than $500k per year.?
Do they think they will get the right sort of person for that sort of money to take on such a huge job?
Hi agvulpes--They have the 60 votes they need to prevent a filibuster, but they can't take the actual vote until Monday because of some rule. Now the House wants stuff put back in though, so I don't know. I like you idea about the lot of them taking a 10% pay cut, only I think it should be more like and 80% pay cut.
I don't think pay has anything to do with the quality of any CEO. Look at the crop of losers they have after paying out billions. They paid them like spoiled rockstars and that's how they behaved. They were paid billions and they took it and ruined their companies. So they don't have good people now. I have financial experience--I'll work for half a million if no one else will take the jobs, lol! Hey I'll ruin their company at a FRACTION of what those guys charged!
$500k seems like quite a bit of money, really. About 10 times the average UK wage.
Great hub, pgrundy! I'm totally with you. There's just too much greed going around in our financial system, so I say let those banks that cannot survive fail. Not that it will completely eliminate greed, but there will be less of it. :)
There will be less of these greedy banks extending credit to those who are not even credit-worthy. It may seem helpful for the banks to do so, but charging at exorbitant interest rates, they were only setting up these individuals for failure. As a result, the mortgage mess.
The banks brought the problems upon themselves and they should be left alone to learn how to deal with it.
I read the hub, and felt that, it is pertinent to comment, that People must have faith in Banks, for without them, we would have the old "Money under the Lemon tree mentality, its happening in my country now. I personally don't think the Depression is any more than media hype.
There will always be people worse off than others. Why? Who knows but I'm damned sure it aint the banks fault.
Some are down to circumstances (unfortunate) but a great deal more need help in the money management field.Less booze
Less drugs, less gambling and more commonsense.
Governments are all giving money to Banks, Insurance Companies, in an attempt to keep them bouyant. So what, Its the way it has always been. The last thing needed, is a panic of Banks going under, because people panic and grab out their funds, when there is no need.
Personally and I know this won't be popular I would rathergive money to a Bank that employed people, was useful, in good times by giving to community charities, as they do. Than hand out money, hand over fist to a bunch of losers, such as we have here, that basically live too high.
I also think that anyone that takes out an excessive mortgage is plain moronic, and basically set themselves up to fail
Again not entirely the Banks fault. You always know your own limitations, many people greedy to live in a flash home, give Banks incorrect information re their finances.
Good Hub Just disagree. with some aspects.
Pgrundy - Great Rant - Unfortunately I did not vote this past presidential election because I am really tired of empty promises, and frankly, both candidates were very weak. McCain switches sides more than anyone I know in politics, and Obama had NO EXPERIENCE in any executive position prior to this. Obama got elected, and he talked a good talk about straightening out the country and going in a new direction. But he appointed Hillary Clinton as secretary of state after he said that she had no experience in foreign policy, while running against her in the primaries. And he appointed Geittner as the treasury secretary after he failed to pay income taxes in prior years. The scariest irony is that the secretary of the treasury is in charge of the IRS.
Also, I agree with president Obama's stiff stand against CEO's who run their company's into the ground. They should definitely not receive any bonus money. But I haven't heard him so much as hint at punishing the CEO's at FannieMae and FreddieMac. They were responsible for the subprime mortgage problems that was partially responsible for causing banks to fail.
Finally pgrundy I totally agree with your Title but I would change it a bit to : Dear President Obama - Please Stop Giving Bailout Money to any Large Corporation!
Thanks you for information.
Great Hub, I wish President OBAMA to read this hub.
I agree with the other Hubbers, Pam rant on. I am just about breathless after reading your opinions about the whole economic mess. Happy to know you gave Kudos to Mr. President. Great relevance with the photo of what looked like the Titanic sinking. I think that the yacht won't be necessary. Contine to vent and I will continue to read though I rarely write in the first person except for comments. Write on!
Thanks Linda!
Pam: I am numb about everything that is happening, I believe in Obama as well however I do ask myself the same question are we ever going to get out of this mess? I understand they have forzen foreclosures for many through March, however what about those who have already lost their homes? Unemployment is still high and states are still broke, ours is one of them so who will be reimbursing the people if money is due back to them? I know we will get through all of this however it is going to take a long time to clean up the mess that our country is in.:(
Hi AEvans--Yes I think it will be several long hard years for most of us. I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel yet. Maybe there is one, but it sure isn't visible from Michigan. It's pretty scary.
PGrundy, I have a new hub which tries to quantify your concerns. I believe that, while it is unlikely that FDIC will fail, it could fail. It could be that the credit rating of the US will so drop, that the government will lose the will to protect the 4.5 trillion dollars in deposits.
pg
The other day when President Obama came to Orange County California, I thought why is he coming to a one time Republican dominated county. Why wasn't he going to Detroit where the Democrats campaign for votes and promised Detroit and Michigan help. The Democrats own California and the Western seaboard, why is the number Democrat coming here. I can't figure it out, other than he is afraid to show his face in Detroit after Congress wouldn't give the auto industry any bailout money?
I thought you might have an answer.
Hi issues,
He did the same thing when he went to Elkhart IN to drum up support for the stimulus package. Elkhart is heavily Republican and redneck--they didn't vote for him, he's not their favorite guy.
I think he's trying to get some important stuff passed and he wants consensus. The people who elected him are already behind him. He's hitting venues where people who aren't behind him can ask him direct questions. I think it's a very confident strategy. Remember Bush's hand picked audiences? It's refreshing to have a President who will wade into unfriendly territory and say, "Ask me anything" and mean it. We never get that.
Pam, great to hear a PGrundy rant. While I am against the bank bail out, and it really agravates me because I voted for Obama (even went to the inaugeration), I think the money could have been spent better. It's funny but the banking folks who got the $$$ are all probably Repubnics. What really annoys me is that I am agreeing with Republicans.
LOL! I know what you mean! I guess hard times make strange bedfellows. :)
I think we are in for a long hard time. But it will probably be good for us as a country. The banks though, ugh. It's sickening. Thanks for your comments!
do you realize the federal government could have given every american over the age of 18 back in january 200,000 tax free, and within 24 hours the us economy would have made a huge turn a round. now today we are giving gm another 30 billion? come on i support american workers, but the idea that is you put the money at the top and watch it work it's way down hasn't and isn't working the government needs to start withe the american worker. we are the ones who built this great country. i could go on and on, but the bottom line is, they need to help the middle and lower classes., and stop helping big business.
why give the banks any money they are not listening to the president the or still charging over limit fees which he said to stop the economy is still propally going to tank because the banks have been loan sharking all of america the last two years and it is getting no better Mr. President the banks have no listen to you let the rich banks go under the top employers don't care there multi millionaires allready they will only get scared when they or put in a scandal when it is found that they illegally paid there top executive illegal millions most of America is tired of living in poverty which these individuals thrive with loan sharking which anymore is a huge understatement
countrywomen says:
10 months ago
Pam- WOW!! You said a lot over there. I am not sure if Obama would hear your voice(but he did caution some top executives not to give out hefty bonuses from bail out money). Btw look what our tax money is (mis)used for $35000 toilet bowl :-(
Link:http://current.com/items/89748166/greg_palast_on_t