Do you believe we are in a depression? Why or why not?
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A few weeks ago I discussed this in a Hub entitled Recession: what is it and how did we get there. As the situation has changed somewhat, I'm happy to update it.
The bad news is bugled everywhere. The U.S. is in a massive recession, the worst since the Great Depression. House prices around the nation are in freefall. Industrial production is plummeting. Unemployment is rising. The dollar is falling against every currency out there.
As a friend of mine likes to say, it's enough to make you run with scissors.
But what's the real picture? Let's take a look at some data and misconceptions, and try to sort this out.
This is the worst economic situation since the Great Depression. This little minor downturn isn't even in the same order of magnitude as the Great Depression of 1929-1933, when the U.S. economy as measured by gross domestic product shrank by 30% and unemployment surged to 25%. To put this in perspective, consider that when annual U.S. gross domestic product (GDP) growth turned negative in 1974 it was only by -0.50%, 1975 (-0.20%), 1980 (-0.2%), 1982 (-1.9%), and 1991 (-0.2%).
So what does that mean in real life? During the Great Depression, the U.S. economy shrank in massive doses. Businesses and factories laid off workers, cut production, finally shut their doors and gates because there was no market for their goods and services. Each year the Depression lasted, the economy as a whole shrank further: -8.6% in 1930, -6.4% in 1931, -13.0% in 1932, -1.3% in 1933. These are horrifying figures. To put this in personal terms, imagine you had to take a 30% reduction in pay over a period of four years. Would your way of life be affected? You'd better believe it.
Now let's look at the 1970s. In 1974 and 1975 combined, the U.S. economy shrank by -0.7%. Inflation ran at 9-10%, unemployment spiked to 8.7%, the Federal funds rate approached 13%, and the so-called "misery index" was announced every night on the TV news. Is this bad? Yes. Is it horrifying in the sense of the Great Depression? Nowhere near.
Now let's look at our current economic picture. In the first quarter of this year, the economy as measured by GDP growth has been finalized at +1.0% from an initial estimate of +0.6%. Inflation is around 4%, unemployment is 5.5%, and reporters and investors are calling this the worst since the Great Depression?
Investors and the media need to get real and quit exaggerating.
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DMX THE GREAT DEPRESSION {PA}
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1930 Financial newspaper GREAT DEPRESSION Stock Market
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Housing prices are in freefall. According to the Case-Schiller Home Price Index for April 2008, the most recent release to date (as of 2 July 2008), home prices in Las Vegas, Los Angeles, Miami, Phoenix, San Diego, San Francisco, and Tampa have all fallen by over 20% since April 2007. Is this bad? Yes. Is it surprising? Not for anyone who's been paying attention. These areas have been experiencing a housing "bubble," where prices rose without any basis for the increased price in the actual value of the asset in question. Crude oil is doing something very similar right now. Technological stocks did it during the 1990s only to explode in the dotcom recession. The most famous example is the tulip mania in the 1630s, where a single bulb could fetch six or seven times a worker's annual salary. It's nothing new or exceptional, but it hurts when the mania, and the value of people's assets, collapse in consequence.
To put these house prices in perspective, take a look at Housing Tracker. This is a table that compares what percentage of a family's income is required to purchase a house in various cities around the nation. Worst on the list is Los Angeles, where the mortgage payment for a typical single-family home requires 63.5% of the median monthly income. A close second is San Francisco at 58.2%. Las Vegas is at 30% (not too bad), Miami 46.8%, and San Diego 51.8%. Compare that with Houston at 16.6%, Atlanta 15.9%, and the champion of the list, Detroit at 11.4%.
When 63.5% of a family's monthly income is required just to make the mortgage payment, there's not a lot of discretionary income nor is there a financial cushion should there be a shock to the economy. With gasoline rising toward $5 per gallon, well, something had to go, and for a lot of people, what went was the house. After the value of the home fell by roughly 25%, there wasn't a lot of sense in continuing to make mortgage payments in any case. Keep in mind that fully a quarter of all the foreclosures currently taking place are against "house flippers," who purchased a house intending to slap a coat of paint on it, maybe plant a few flowers in the yard, then resell it for a hefty profit. With an inventory of houses for sale that should last the better part of 2008 and more than halfway through 2009 even if nobody else joins the list, a lot of them wound up being stuck with houses they couldn't flip and the lender stepped in.
All that being said, the Case-Schiller Index is a flawed measurement. It only measures the difference between reported sales prices of homes that have been sold more than once in a given period of time, and only in certain cities around the nation. It only records sales of single-family detached homes, so if there really is a flight of suburban employees back into the city proper, Case-Schiller only records the home that's out in the burbs waiting to be sold and not the purchase of the condo or townhouse in town. (However, no other statistics I've seen seem to be reflecting such a trend, either.)
Interestingly, Houston, the fourth-largest city by population and with a sound and still thriving housing market, is not one of those cities measured by Case-Schiller. This is despite the fact that the population of Texas is growing faster than 47 other states in the union, behind only Florida and Arizona. The demographics of the United States are shifting, with the median center of population moving south and west by several hundred miles per year as people move out of densely-populated Northeastern and Rustbelt states for warmer (and less tax-burdened) climates. The states that are losing population (read tax revenue and political clout) include Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Massachusetts, Ohio, Louisiana (due to Hurricane Katrina), New Jersey, Illinois, California (interesting fact, that one), and New York. That's in descending order of population loss, by the way, which means people are leaving California and New York in droves. (Although you might not be able to tell by the traffic congestion.)
After the 2000 census, New York and Pennsylvania each lost two seats in the House of Representatives. After the 1990 census, New York lost three and Pennsylvania lost two. Other states losing seats during these years include Ohio, Illinois, Michigan, Massachusetts, New Jersey, Connecticut, and Indiana. They're forecast to lose even more following the 2010 census. And this time, so is California, for the first time in a long time. This population shift will also effect electoral college votes, by the way.
So let's put all this together. People are moving out of many of the cities on the Case-Schiller House Price Index list, including Los Angeles, New York City, San Diego, San Francisco, Cleveland, and Boston. Their houses are staying behind, and they're buying new homes in southern and western states that aren't as well represented on the Case-Schiller Index, such as Texas, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Wyoming, where there never was a housing bubble to burst and where it costs a smaller percentage of the family's monthly income to purchase a probably larger home. You'd better believe the Case-Schiller is reporting a housing market collapse--but it's only telling a small part of the whole story.
Not only people are moving to different parts of the country; so are jobs. Between 1996 and 2006, jobs growth was strongest in Nevada, Arizona, Idaho, Florida, Utah, Wyoming, Texas, New Mexico, Colorado, and Montana. It was weakest in Michigan, Louisiana (Katrina again), Ohio, Illinois, Indiana, Mississippi, Connecticut, Massachusetts, Missouri, West Virginia, Pennsylvania, and New York.
When Wyoming state development officials realized they had more jobs than people to fill them, they advertised in Michigan, which was the only state in the union to actually have negative jobs growth in those ten years.
Industrial production is plummeting. This is blatantly not true.
One of the most respected economic indicators is the Institute for Supply Management (ISM) index. This is a monthly survey of professionals in the manufacturing sector, designed to calculate whether this field is experiencing expansion, contraction, or merely holding its own. The data are compiled on national as well as regional levels, and the measurement is reported on a scale of 1 to 100, with 50 being the break-even point, anything below that level indicating contraction, and anything above it indicating expansion. The further from that break-even 50 the number becomes, the stronger it gets, with 40 being a horrifying result and 60 exhilerating.
For much of 2008, the ISM Index registered contraction, falling to 48.3 in February and rising slowly to 49.6 in May. But something funny happened in June: the ISM rose to 50.2, signaling that the manufacturing sector is no longer contracting.
ISM also measures non-manufacturing (service-related fields) data, and the picture there is the same. In January the non-manufacturing index fell to 44.6, which is where a lot of people began talking recession. But in February it rose to 49.3, and continued rising to cross back to 52.0 in April and 51.7 in May. The June data hasn't been released as of this date (2 July).
To be fair, the regional readings are spottier, with Boston reporting 41.4 and Detroit at 46.6, while Western Washington state reports 58.6 and Houston at 60.6. Most of the other regional readings are hovering either just below or just above the break-even 50, including Austin at 49.5, Buffalo at 52.6, Chicago at 49.1, Georgia at 48.8, and New York City at 50.4.
That doesn't sound as if industrial production is plummeting to me.
Unemployment is rising. The national unemployment level as measured by the U.S. Department of Labor rose from 5.0% of the available workforce in April to 5.5% in May. That is an ugly jump, and it's forecast to rise even higher, to 6.0%, by the end of 2008.
Again, to put this in perspective, it's not all that bad. In past recessions the unemployment rate rose much higher, including 1975 (8.5%), 1976 (7.7%), 1982 (9.7%), 1983 (9.6%), and 1992 (7.5%). Of course, this is not consoling to those people who have lost their jobs and are facing the loss of their homes, their cars, and other assets purchased on time payments.
The dollar is falling. The value of a nation's currency, as set by the foreign exchange (forex) trading market, is a complicated subject and deserves a Hub of its own. For now, just understand that many factors go into determining a currency's value, including the state of its economy, its level of governmental debt or surplus, how it earns money on the world market (commodity or manufactured goods exports, providing services worldwide, going door to door with an empty bowl), and--one of the most important factors--the "official" interest rate, which determines the national money supply and influences the level of foreign and domestic investment within that country. Again, that's a complicated subject and I won't go into a lot of detail here.
To stimulate the U.S. economy, the Federal Reserve Chairman, Ben Bernanke, slashed the official rate from 5.25% in September 2007 to 2.00% currently. That's a huge reduction, and it's made investing in the U.S. not the most attractive option for big money holders. After all, they can earn 8.25% in New Zealand (although that will start to decrease later this year), 7.25% in Australia, and 5.00% in the U.K. Of course, they'll get only 0.50% in Japan, which is as awful as it gets.
To put this in real perspective, the U.S. is now a favorite funding currency for investors who dabble in what's called the carry trade, where money is borrowed in a country with a low interest rate and then invested in one with a higher rate. For those investors who are currently scared of the fluctuating stock market but don't trust the commodities bubble, they borrow money at 2.00% in the U.S. and invest it in Australia at 7.25%, earning 5.25%. (The danger in this maneuver is that volatile exchange rates could eat away their profits, which happened big time last year in July when the subprime crisis hit. I've inserted a chart below of the exchange rate between the Australian dollar and the Japanese yen, and that big red drop in the middle is money running out of investors' wallets.) This puts further downward pressure on the value of the U.S. dollar.
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Remember, most commodities are priced in U.S. dollars, including crude oil. When the value of the dollar goes down, the price of commodities will rise to compensate. It's estimated that around $25 per barrel of that record crude oil price is due to the low dollar.
So, is the U.S. dollar declining in value against other currencies around the world? Against the major ones and even some of the minor ones, yes. Will this continue? No, not for long. IMHO, it's pretty near the bottom and should start rising in value around September or October. It may strengthen even sooner if Bernanke, President Jean-Claude Trichet of the European Central Bank, and Governor Mervyn King of the Bank of England get really sick of high commodities prices and decide to raise the value of the dollar by intervening in the forex market. It's been done before, not only for the dollar but also for the Euro and other currencies, although the strategy is not always effective.
Okay, everybody, that's my July 2008 update on the U.S. economic scenario. Feel free to ask questions and I'll answer as best I can. And thanks, renigma, for making the request.
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Comments
funnebone, shhh . . . let's keep reason out of it. Don't want to scare anybody off.
Thanks for the kind words. Gotta love that pat on the back, or wherever.
Good hub, Cheryl....But I DO believe we are in a depression. Mutual funds have been falling for 3/4 of a year now. Food prices are astronomical. When 3 bananas cost $5.00, that's a depression. When we're getting bilked in order for cows to get milked, so we can drink some, that's a depression. When 12 eggs are close to $3.00, that's a depression. I could go on and on. People can't make ends meet (if we can see those ends, they're that far apart). The stock market these days is reflective of what's going on, and very little is going up.
As the double-talking comedian, Professor Irwin Corey used to say: "The stock market FLUCTUATES. Sometimes it flucks down. And sometimes it flucks up!" I believe it's doing the latter right now. -regards, Helen (a.k.a. Creativita)
Very interesting Hub. But The USA can become a unitary economy not needing the rest of the world. The fed is printing money and decreasing interest rates to stimulate the economy. the US govt did a big tax refund to stimulate the economy. There is a world wide food shortage and many US farmers are no longer farming for food but rather for biofuels which will excacerbate the food shortage in the rest of the world. The Euro economy (strong against the dollar) also has a fuel price crisis, with workers striking due to the high price of fuel. We, In the RSA also have a fuel price crisis and our currency tends to be stronger against the dollar. Our interest rates are rising and you can get 10.5% for your money so invest here. China and India are becoming net resource consumers and put pressure on and compete for resources which are becoming scarcer. The Yuan (China) is a managed currency which is not allowed to float on the free market if this was to be allowed to float it could have major impact on the US dollar.
My head is spinning, but I do feel consoled. I have to agree that there are still many, many simple areas where we could all cut back and find that the pressure will ease a lot. We have been buying into the belief that we need certain things we actually only want, and we have been buying into it for a really long time.
And yet again I'm late coming into the discussion. Let's deal with this comments one at a time.
Creativita, high prices do not make a recession. High prices make for inflation, whereas recession (depression) is a downturn in economic growth, usually as measured by GDP. They are actually opposites, and the current world situation is a historically unprecedented combination of slower growth (recession) PLUS higher prices (inflation).
Also, mutual funds, hedge funds, the stock market, and all other investments are cyclical, a point I meant to make in this Hub but never got around to. Yes, they've been losing value since approximately February 2007. However, the U.S. dollar has been on a downtrend since about April 2001. It will reverse, the same way the housing market will reverse, and recover strength over the next few years.
Whether or not people can make ends meet depends upon what percentage of their income goes toward housing and transportation, and how much remains available for other needs. New York City, your listed place of residence, is among the most expensive locales in the union.
sixtyorso, a lot of investors ARE putting their money into South Africa right now, with that luscious 10.5% interest rate. But international economics is a whole different Hub than the domestic one! So is globalization, but I will comment that the integration of the global economy has reached the point that neither the U.S. nor any other "developed" nation can go into reverse and back out now. World trade is here to stay.
I guess I should do a Hub on the U.S. farming situation. That's also a rather complicated subject. Same with the non-floating yuan.
Serenity Live, it's always good to hear from you. Anchor your head and stick around!
I think that the biggest threat right now is actually stagflation. The Fed is in a very tough spot right now. No depression now, although it certainly could happen again despite the fact that many people think it never could. The economy has been pretty strong considering all the negatives out there. Interesting post!
Stagflation is always a possibility, 02SmithA, particularly if a shortage of crude oil is added to its already high prices. I'm starting to think the intervention scenario may play out, even if it's only at a verbal (e.g., rhetorical) level. We're already hearing a lot of talk from Trichet, Bernanke, Paulson, Lagrande, etc.
Very nice, you present a fairly complete update.
I mostly look at equity and commodity markets (Bud's Market Observations) as indications of where we collectively are in the economic spheres. Thus, I have a somewhat different perspective. From my viewpoint, I see no current depression but the US$'s purchasing power is shrinking at an alarming rate. Thus I remain apprehensive because of that and of what appear to be very short term economic and monetary policies. But what else is new? - short term policies are endemic of democratic governments.
Your posted photo of the tent & auto home brings memories of the great depression. Similarly, right now, there are people living in their autos. I know that near the Ontario (California) airport there is a big area where "auto homes" can be observed. For those folks, there is a depression.
Excellent hub and thank you for setting out the facts and figures! This is worth coming back to again and again. Boy, things were just terrible in the Great Depression, comparitively. Time to tighten the belt and, as funnebone observed, cut out some of the frivolous purchases. :-) Steph
budwood, I watch commodities and equities but only as a backdrop to currencies and the economy in general. I also watch the economies of other nations as part of this backdrop, so I can say that in relative terms, the dollar has settled into a low trading range, but it's not sinking further. As the economies of other nations are also beginning to slow, their currencies, especially the Euro, the yen, and the Swiss franc, will all weaken against USD and that purchasing power will strengthen again in consequence. In particular, investors hedging against USD in commodities, especially crude oil, will start to move their money over to take advantage of the resulting climb, lowering the prices of commodities and raising the strength of USD further.
I feel for people living in their autos or on the street. Economics is often called "the dismal science" because when it goes wrong, people really suffer, but their suffering is measured in cold-blooded statistics and numbers, not in pain.
stephhicks68, it's always good to hear from you. The turnaround is predicted to begin toward September-October or slightly later and will take time to get up steam. You and funnebone are right--this is a time to hang tough and watch the spending. And I guess I should update this Hub, or add another chapter, every month or so.
The Tough Life of Today is leading to all the stress and depression... Several other reasons are there (as Explained by You)..But these 2 are the main. I appreciate this Hub. Good.
You nailed it, guidebaba. Stress and depression can ruin people's lives and unfortunately aren't measured by any economic indicators, which focus only on numbers and not on quality of life. Thanks for weighing in.
I, like everyone else, have heard about how terrible things are getting, but regarding rising food prices, the oddest thing happened today; I went buy my local Winco after work to pick up just a few things. Coffee, which I buy by the pound and grind them at store, was $3 cheaper per pound than just last week. Cheez-its (a must with sandwiches) were half their typical price. These were not sale items, and not the only dramatic price reductions I noticed.
I was amazed, and perplexed. "Where's the rising food costs?" I asked myself on the way home.
Fantastic hub, CherylTheWriter. It's interesting that you say that the turnaround is expected around September-October. If GDP turns around, does that mean inflation will ease as well?
That's fascinating, Constant Walker. You eat Cheez-Its rather than chips?
Seriously, I can't answer that one, unless perhaps the store has noticed lower sales and reduced prices to attract more buyers (low cost pressure vs high cost pressure of inflation). As coffee commodity prices have risen from $50 per trading lot in 2002 to $150 per trading lot in 2008, that's the only explanation I can offer. Hey, if it makes anybody's grocery bill more affordable, I'm all for it.
Marlene_OnTheWall, the unfortunate fact is that GDP and inflation aren't really related. GDP measures growth while inflation measures price. The only method for lowering inflationary pressure is increasing supply or lowering demand for the item being purchased. Crude oil, for example, is being pushed higher by increasing global demand for fuel, decreasing global supply because of political problems, and speculators purchasing crude oil contracts to hedge their stock market and currency losses, which is another form of demand.
The most descriptive way to comment on the hope that the US dollar's purchasing power will strengthen is my chart for the 20th century (at my US Dollar Purchasing Power hub). I wish it wasn't wasn't so, but all fiat currencies debase.
Sure, the dollar may strengthen as related to other fiat currencies, and even some prices may decline here and there, but overall those evaluations are like measuring lengths with a rubber tape measure.
we're not in a depression till people are shacking up in central park again!
i commented somewhere else that we've just stoped the steady increase in our way of living that we have bet our lives on. things have become slower in means of growth and many Americans put so much on the line under what seemed like gaurunteed success that this slowdown has hurt many of them. I say there are a few lessons to be learnt, and some better practices by consumers. do you really need a bag for your dog....or a dog the size of a rat for that matter?
as for funnebone up there at the top......i say an iphone is necessary to human survival! obviously i have not learnt from these previously mentioned lessons yet.
curdman, necessities must be defined by individuals. Just as there are people who can't survive without an iPhone, there are others who require a dog the size of a rat (yes, with a bag) and others of us who require career independence. You can shoot me before I'll become employed again, no matter how low our family income falls.
Besides, at this point, everybody's had to cut back SOMEWHERE . . . just not in the same spot! I'll be shacking up in Houston's Memorial Park before long!
just consider it a camping expedition!
And i guess my point was we need to start reorganizing our necessitites, to many things have fallen into that category that really are extras in life.
YES! Another voice of reason crying in the wilderness!
Now we only need a few million more . . . thanks, curdman!
During these times of reorganizing priorities, alot of good can be gained. What would be so bad about going back to simpler times when keeping up with the Joneses were non-existant? People might actually begin to get to know one another based on integrity instead of the toys they owned.
Exactly! On the one hand, you've got Al Gore's Tennessee mansion, heated by natural gas at a cost of around $2,400 per month, more than 20 times the national average. On the other, you've got President Bush's home in Texas, architecturally designed to use every green feature out there from recycling grey and black water to geothermal heating, and using no fossil fuels at all. Now there's an "inconvenient truth" for an environmentalist!
Reorganizing priorities is becoming ever more important, isn't it?
woow am loving the intelligent discussion going on here. What a long hub and well written. I enjoyed it, and as for the economy, my take is wait and see, but expect the best!
Depression is a state of mind. Yes this country is probably hurting but I feel we are doing it to ourselves. It will be better when the politicians get off the air and get back to work. In fact everybody who is capable needs to get back to work. We are spoiled rotten and all this depression noise is negative thought processes taking hold. It is almost EVIL. People need to individually count their blessings and stop buying in to the negative. Cut back, slow down, speed up, whatever it takes to make your own life a better place to live. A lot of energy is being wasted on worry and things we could live without. Have some faith, do something positive and create your own little tide of positive energy flow. It is contagious, so it would be wise to spread some positive energy and set a positive example for everyone you know. C.S.
mmm. I have been saying if for a long time and it is getting worse I would have to say a depression, but the government likes to call it another term.:)
Finally, someone who can just tell it like it is without sugar coating or exagerating the down side.
Hey Cheryl, are you still at HubPages? I got two nastygrams from the new owners of Amateur Econ and I was wondering if you stayed on with them or not. Shoot me an email if you're still around. And Happy Thanksgiving! (o:
Thanks for sharing this info :)


























funnebone says:
17 months ago
Wow...that was fantastic. A voice of reason!....Being from Pa I can attest to the housing prices falling but it is because of the ridiculous buying spree of a few years ago.
When I hear people boohoo about the economy I point out to the silly spending habits of consumers. Gas can go as high as it wants but nobody will cut back on cable tv, iphones, playstation games ect, rather they will call for the governement to step in and tax somebody for something.