Evolution of Religion
65
The Beginning
Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
The above verse of scripture implies that there was nothing except God in the very beginning. God was alone and besides Him there was nothing else. Many who are religious will believe that God was the beginning. After creating each animal, tree, grass, plant, etc. . . God created man. After speaking each and every other object into existence, God formed man with His own hands. Man loved God and obeyed Him.
God realized that He had created male and female of each animal but man had no female. So God created a woman from the rib of man. Man loved the woman and they were happy living in the place God had placed them.
One day a serpent started a conversation with the woman. He deceived her into doing one thing God told them not to do. He told her she would become as God if she ate the forbidden fruit. She ate the fruit and gave it to the man and he ate also. This is where the many different gods of the world began. Man died instantly spiritually when he disobeyed God and committed the sin of eating the forbidden fruit.
After being expelled from the garden of God, man continued in the way of God as best he could. As his children were born they began to move further away from God. Sin came into their hearts and God would always give them a chance, but they refused to accept the chance to make things right. This was the beginning of making oneself God.
After the Fall
After being expelled from the Garden, man became more and more sinful. Cain killed his brother Abel in a rage of jealousy. God gave him a chance to deal with the jealousy in his heart but Cain decided to murder his brother. This is the beginning of man trying to make himself God. Cain took it upon himself to decide the fate of Abel and also carried out the execution of his judgment.
Man continued to drift further away from God as time went on. Some tried to stay faithful to God but most decided they didn't want anything to do with God. God was sorry that He ever created man and decided the end of man had come. But then He looked at Noah. Noah loved God and God loved Noah. God told Noah to build an ark out of Gopher wood. He gave the plans and measurements to Noah and Noah built it. After one hundred years of preaching about the flood coming Noah entered the ark with two of each animal and God sealed the door shut.
After the Flood
Noah and his wife came out of the ark along with his three sons and their wives. This is the new beginning after the flood. Noah built an altar and made a sacrifice to God. All people alive today came through the lineage of Noah and his three sons. In every culture, to my knowledge, there is a story about the great flood. The stories vary somewhat, but all are still there.
As time went on and the earth became more populated, man tried to build a tower that would reach all the way to heaven. God watched as this all unfolded and at a certain time he confounded man's language. They were unable to communicate and therefore were unable to work together anymore.
This was an attempt by man to reach God in a way that God did not ordain. As time went on many different ways were tried to reach God. Many false gods were imagined and worshiped by many different cultures. Men were proclaimed to be God and were worshiped as such. Through all this there was and still is only one true God.
Need for a Savior
As time went on God tried many ways to get man's attention turned toward Him. Some recognized God but most did not and refused to listen to God even with the signs and wonders of miracles done before their eyes. The time was right for a Savior to be born.
Jesus was born to a virgin who had never been touched by a man. The Holy Ghost planted a seed in her and Jesus Christ was the result. Jesus, all through His ministry, did nothing but good, but He was much more than just a man. Many believed on Him but many did not. Some thought Him to be a prophet reincarnated. What they did not realize is that God walked among them in flesh as Jesus Christ.
It wasn't something God just decided to do in the moment. It had been planned out from the beginning. Jesus was the lamb slain for your sins and mine. He died a horrible death on the cross for you and me.
The New Age
The New Age religion as it is called by many is not really new. It is old and probably dates back to the days before the flood. It can be dated at least a few hundred years after the flood. It consists of worship of many gods and idols. It teaches self realization. Jesus always taught self denial. The two teachings are exact opposites of one another, just as Jesus and Satan are opposites. The New Age doesn't believe in Satan. It embraces every belief there is as being valid and right.
In the days of old people created many different gods. They would worship statues, totem poles, the earth, fire, water, air, etc. . . In the modern age, they worship the same gods and idols of old. What is amazing is how the modern New Age beliefs came about so suddenly.
The sixties era is the time of the sudden resurgence of the New Age. It was a time when drugs were glamorized, especially hallucinatory drugs like LSD. How did drugs get such wide use during the sixties?
In the 1930 Aldous Huxley, who authored a book titled Brave New World was sent to the US by the British. Huxley was the High Priest of Britain's opium war. He was also the coordinator of the 1960's introduction of psychedelic drugs to the youth of the US.
Isis Cults
Huxley was employed as a scriptwriter for MGM, Warner Brothers and Walt Disney studios along with Christopher Isherwood, While there he founded a nest of Isis cults in Southern California and San Francisco. LSD, along with Mescal and other hallucinogenic drugs were used in their ceremonies. Music was employed with rhythm and beating drums to help those who took the drugs to "receive visitations from God".
Huxley expanded his LSD, mescaline project recruiting many who had been pulled into the cult before. One of these was Alan Watts, a self styled guru of Zen Buddhism.
Huxley was appointed visiting professor at Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Boston during the fall of 1960. During his stay there He created a Harvard Circle similar to his west coast LSD cult. His seminar was actually a planning seesion for acid rock counterculture. He established contact during this period with the president of Sandoz who was working on a big CIA contract to produce large quantities of LSD and psilocybin.
The drugs were used as adjuvants to create trances and hallucinations, which were called visitations from god. The drugs were sacred and were only available to those who were initiated into the cult of Isis.
LSD Across the US
Allen Dulles is reported to have purchased over one million doses of LSD and most of it flooded the streets of the US. He was the longest serving director of the CIA and also the first civilian to ever hold the position.
Another member of the Harvard group was Timothy Leary. He also purchased a lot of drugs privately from Sandover. From the discussion during the Harvard seminar Leary wrote his book The Psychedelic Experience which was based on the Tibetan Book of the Dead.
LSD Films and Music
Some of the more notable music groups of the 60's who used LSD are The Grateful Dead and The Beatles.
The Grateful Dead were originally known as The Warlocks. They took part in a Ken Kersey's Acid Tests. They were supplied with a large quantity of illegal LSD and asked to record their performances over a 6 month period, which resulted in their first album (The Grateful Dead). They were cast into cult stardom.
The Beatles started using LSD in late 1965 and some of their songs were attributed to the use of it. Got to Get You Into My Life and She Said, She Said are both attributed to being written while under the influence of LSD.
When Ken Kersey started experimenting with LSD he wrote the book, One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. Another book which was the result of LSD use is, Last Round Up, (with Ken Babbs), published in 1994.
Conclusion
After researching and writing what I have found out, I come to the conclusion that the cults which have come about through time are the result of the use of hallucinogenic drugs. The 60's were a time in the US when LSD use was the cool thing to do and the visions were the result of that use. According to my findings the Resurgence of the new age religion is the direct result of drug use and is behind the evolution of religion.
In Genesis, Satan told Eve, "You will be as gods." Satan is always a liar and always has been since he was cast out of Heaven. He uses drugs and music to get people to worship him.
When drugs are used to create visions and trances a door opens through which Satan can possess the user. The user actually believes he got something from God, but in fact it is only Satan.
If you agree with my findings leave a comment. If you disagree with my findings leave a comment. Please just try and keep it as orderly as possible.
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Comments
If you recall I said the next one would be better than the last hub I posted. The new age beliefs actually started when sin entered in. I understand you don't worship fire or water anything like that. The essence of the new age belief is self realization, which says simply. you are god. This is itself is the teachings of Satan who is a liar.
I hope what I just wrote is clear to you. I seem to be confusing myself at times these days.
I must be off now to a baseball game. Will be back later tonight.
Thx, SirDent. I'm still a little confused, and perhaps it is my lack of understanding of scripture, but I thought 'we' are one with God.
You have the patience of a Saint with me!
We are one with God is another lie from Satan. How can you be one with God if you don't know God?
What I am trying to show in the hub is the fact that the New Age beliefs came about from halluniations of drug users. I also tried to show how the drugs came into popular use during the 60's.
I forgot to mention my son's team won the baseball game. :D
There is so much good history in this hub that people aren't told about...Good job doing the research!
Congrats on your son's winning game!
Yes, understood the drug thing you mentioned, though I had no part of all that.
You are a wonderful researcher and presenter, Sir.
Thanks Dutch for the comment. I appreciate it very much.
It isn't just about using drugs. It's about following what they saw, felt while under the influence of those drugs. The whole psychedelic age of the 60's was due to drugs. The loveins happened because of drugs, etc. . .
Sir Dent, another excellent hub on a difficult topic. I agree with you solidly. Scripture clearly teaches that until we as sinners are reconciled with God (only by accepting Jesus' atoning sacrifice), will we ever be seen as, or with, God. That is the truth. It is God's desire for our sanctification (the process of becoming like Christ through trial and conviction). But we can only embark on this road through obedience. I've mentioned in some of my hubs that Christianity is not a fluffy religion where we can hunt and peck for what we like and dislike. It's a complete and unalterable package. -- Satan is indeed the father of all lies and what better place for him to foster these deceptions by enticing us to "know" the truth when we really don't. -- In conlusion, if we don't know Christ, we CANNOT know God. For it is through Christ that we know God.
"Jesus said to him (Thomas), "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me. If you had known Me, you would have known the Father also; from now on you know Him, and have seen Him." John: 14: 6-7.
That just about says it all. Peace and blessings my friend.
Such a great comment Rob and I appreciate it very much. What you wrote is truth and many will not believe it, but it is there for those who will.
NOT BAD GOOD POST,,,BUT STILL WONDER WHERE DID GOD COME FROM BUT I KNOW WE WILL NEVER KNOW THAT.
Interesting! The story if Creation, as told by Christians, reads like fantasy. The falling away of people from the traditional Christian beliefs, might have more to do with how unbelievable the story is than to the influence of drugs.
Thanks for the comments Karen and Molly. Maybe one day God will enlighten us but until then we must believe that He is who He says He is.
Great hub!! Religion has always been man's attempt to reach up to God using his own resources.
By contrast, Christianity is God reaching down to man to form a relationship. There is a huge dirfference between the two. AS a fromer atheist, I struggled with, but like C.S. Lewis, I finally gave in to the Shepherd's calling. God really does know more than I do.
Thank you Jedgrey for the comment and the encouragement. I agree completely with what you wrote.
I agree there were some very trippy songs and books written in the sixties. I always admired how John Lodge of the Moody Blues remained a Christian and never experimented with drugs during that time period. I love Christian teachings and find great comfort in the words of Christ! Wonderful hub!
I disagree with you.
Drugs and music can be an analogy for anything that opens your mind to other ideas.
Are you saying that anything that opens my mind to other philosophies is the tool of the devil if that philosophy differs from yours?
Thank you Sweetie Pie for the comment. I read your hub about John Lodge and Bono once before and found it to be a good hub. It told me some things I never knew.
pfuller says:8 hours ago
I disagree with you.Drugs and music can be an analogy for anything that opens your mind to other ideas. Are you saying that anything that opens my mind to other philosophies is the tool of the devil if that philosophy differs from yours?
SirDent: I am saying that anything that opens your mind to something that disagree with God or His Word is of the devil. In the 60's acid or LSD was in use by thousands of teenagers and adults. They had their hallucinations and told everyone they were visions from God. This is how the New Age resurgence came about in the 60's
If you were to check into it you will also find that in the early to mid 70's a lot of children who were born during that time were called "Indigo Children" who have special powers or auras.
It's OK to disagree with me. These are things are what I found out while researching for this hub. I found a lot of it out while researching another hub and that;s why this hub was written. You can go and read it if you want.
SirDent: I am saying that anything that opens your mind to something that disagree with God or His Word is of the devil
That is a convenient way of saying "if I do not agree with your philosophy"
I have never been attracted to "inclusive membership" clubs.
I could live a life with God helping others, but if I do not accept Christ as my saviour then I am doomed.
pfuller says:4 hours ago
SirDent: I am saying that anything that opens your mind to something that disagree with God or His Word is of the devilThat is a convenient way of saying "if I do not agree with your philosophy" I have never been attracted to "inclusive membership" clubs. I could live a life with God helping others, but if I do not accept Christ as my saviour then I am doomed.
SirDent: You call it convenient, I call it truth. If a person doesn't accept Jesus Christ then they cannot and will not accept God. They may as well have taken the drugs themselves if they think they can know God and not know Jesus.
So many think there are many different truths. The phrase in itself is a contradiction. How can many truth be when there is no absolute truth? If you think about it logically, you will know what I said to be true.
I have thought about it logically.
And logically speaking you are trapped in your logic by thinking that I cannot know God without also knowing Jesus.
In my philosophy all you have to do is try your best to be a good person. And God will always know what is in your heart.
And yet your philosophy dooms me, is there logic or truth in that?
Jesus said the only way to the Farther is thru him...this is true as all scripture is inspired of God and that is where that is found. However, drugs are but one thing and possibly the most effecticve tool used by satan. There are so many others however: nationalism, racism, wine&alcohol of other forms, sexual freedom etc that have existed long before widespread drug use we now see.
Yes God feels regret, don't you? We were made in his image andthus experience his emotions not ours. Read your bible and you'll learn a lot about God. Especially in the old testament
One thing I like to point out is many people come to Christianity because they do not found solace in other philosophies and religions. Today atheists would like you to think theirs is the only enligtened and good way. There is scientific research that shows the Bible is accurate and that there is a God and many of the best research hospitals in the world, such as Loma University Medical Center, are run by people who are Christians. Thus, the argument that science proves there is no God is very false when there are qualified doctors and scientists that show this is not the case. Science is not one hundred percent and the best scientists in the world will tell you not everything can be explained away, which is what the Bible says, many things God does are a mystery. Belief is what helps us to accept the things we do not understand and not everything is meant to be boiled down to a simple answer anyway. Faith in Christ is powerful and eye opening and many people the world around come to Christ when in need. Interestingly in Iran many people are converting from Islam to Christianity because they have learned that having a religion forced upon them feels wrong and they have found solace in the word of God. It is sad we have Hubbers that say all hubs about religion should be banned because I do not see they have the answers. Believing in a higher power lead us to a life of more peace and I think some are just envious of the peace of mind we find there. Why do you want to rob someone of that? Great hub SirDent!
Good post SweetPie.
You can only know God through faith. Science or theologians cannot prove or disprove the existence of God. Even if science proves certain events happened in the bible that still does not prove that God exists or the divinity of Christ. Personally I believe Christ existed.
Science can prove the workings of evolution but they cannot show how it all started. Which is how many scientists can believe in God.
My only problem with the thesis above is that if you apply the logic to anything that opens yourself to other ideas, beyond drugs or music, then they are all the work of the devil if those ideas do not fall within Christian thinking.
Essentially, all other religions are the work of the devil because they do not accept Christ.
pfuller says:5 hours ago
I have thought about it logically.And logically speaking you are trapped in your logic by thinking that I cannot know God without also knowing Jesus. In my philosophy all you have to do is try your best to be a good person. And God will always know what is in your heart.And yet your philosophy dooms me, is there logic or truth in that?
SirDent: Let me give you a scenario. You decide to build something. Lets say it a house. You draw the plans up yourself. You cut all the lumber, make up the cement and do every bit of the work by yourself. Nobody helps you with any of it at all. Here comes Peter telling everyone that he did it all. Then Steve comes along saying he did it with Peter's help. Eventually everyone helped to build this house except the one who really did it. Is there truth in what they would say when you are the one who actually did it?
In an earlier comment you mentioned an inclusive club. I apologize for not addressing that sooner. I was in a rush for time when I replied before. The inclusive club as you call it envelopes everyone. Jesus didn't die for just a few, but for all mankind. A gift is offered to you , but you must open the gift and put it to use or it is worthless.
pfuller says:5 hours ago
I have thought about it logically.And logically speaking you are trapped in your logic by thinking that I cannot know God without also knowing Jesus. In my philosophy all you have to do is try your best to be a good person. And God will always know what is in your heart.
SirDent: How does a person really know when they've done good? I agree that God does indeed know your heart and the heart of every man woman and child alive or dead.And yet your philosophy dooms me, is there logic or truth in that?
SirDent: My philosophy dooms no one. Those who do not believe and accept Christ doom themselves. It is a choice. Everyone must make the choice. I have to make it and you have to make it. God's Word cannot be changed by me, It can't be changed by you, God will not change His Word because it would mean that he is not perfect and is in fact unstable.
pfuller says:2 hours ago
Good post SweetPie.
You can only know God through faith. Science or theologians cannot prove or disprove the existence of God. Even if science proves certain events happened in the bible that still does not prove that God exists or the divinity of Christ. Personally I believe Christ existed.
Science can prove the workings of evolution but they cannot show how it all started. Which is how many scientists can believe in God.
My only problem with the thesis above is that if you apply the logic to anything that opens yourself to other ideas, beyond drugs or music, then they are all the work of the devil if those ideas do not fall within Christian thinking.
Essentially, all other religions are the work of the devil because they do not accept Christ.
SirDent: To my knowledge no scientist has ever stated that they had disproved the existence of God. That's for Sweetie Pie also.
You say you believe Christ existed. Let's start with that. Do you believe Christ to have been or to be the Son of God?
Actually the thesis above is about the resurgence of the new age religion. It isn't about all beliefs or religions. I am trying to tackle the religions or beliefs one at a time here on Hubpages.
I agree with your last statement. When the Son is removed from the beliefs then God will have no part with you or them.
I am not angry with you pfuller in case you may be wondering. Just trying to answer as honestly as I can.
Daldad8 I really appreciate your input here. I agree with your comment also. But the above hub is about the resurgence of the new age religion during the 60s.
SweetiePie it is always good to hear from you. You are such a wonderful person and very gentle in your comments.
I am not angry with you either. I have no doubt you are a good person so in my philosophy you do not have to make a choice of faith you just have to make a choice of conduct.
You are absolutely right that science cannot disprove the existence of God. Likewise no one can prove the existence of God, you must have faith.
I realize your thesis above was about the resurgence of the new age religion. But the logic used clearly can be applied to anything that causes people to be influenced by other ideas that do not include the acceptance of Christ. Drugs and music are just examples of tools.
Your conclusion was based on the assumption that drugs and music caused young people to look outside of Christianity. Your assumption does not matter if it is correct or wrong, it does not even matter if your thesis is correct, what matters is that you concluded that if tools exist that opens someone to other philosophies than Christianity, then those tools are the work of the devil.
Once you accept your logic used, then you have to accept that all religions other that Christianity are the work of the devil.
In fact free thought is the work of the devil under your thesis.
Which I do not agree with.
New Age religion is an umbrella term that casts a wide net over many, many "religions," cults and sects. Any meaningful reasearch into them will discover that a large portion of them today are very shabby attempts at reclaiming old religions that have been crushed under the bootheels of dynastic dogma-machines around the globe. Many "New Age" "religions" practice an ecclectic collection of traditions borrowed from numerous native American peoples as well as African and Pagan Europe's history. So called "New Age" religion is only NEW in that modern media has swelled the ranks of some of these cults with people searching for holistic answers that the victors of the world's religious wars of the last two millenia just can't provide .
The pagan faiths of old Europe and farther east were consumed by the religions that stemmed from Abraham just as the old religions that spawned stories of Gilgamesh and others even more ambiguous were put to death by Greek and Roman dieties, their valuable parts incorporated and the rest cast off as sin or heresy.
Catholic, Puritan and later assorted Victorian ideology (all Christian wrought) came to the Americas and decimated belief systems that had existed there for thousands and thousands of years before Christ was born, and both Christiany and Islam have done much to finish off any lingering ancient beliefs that the sub-sarahan African's might have held.
So, my point is that New Age religion doesn't really describe anything. The old pagan faiths of Europe, Africa and the Native Americans have struggled to survive despite being under Christian and Islamic seige. Many of them still do. Just because a few late comers have decided to selectively conscript some of the hypnotic rituals from these ancient, time-honored traditions and cobble them together for some modern facsimile deemed "New Age" does not undo the relevance or possible "truth" of faiths that date back for periods as long as ten thousand years, back when many people around the Earth believed that Divinity spoke to all people without discriminating and selecting just a few. My point is to make sure that people understand there is a difference.
No problem.
Your hub interested because of the logic used in your argument.
I realize we will not agree when it comes to Christianity since I believe there are many roads to God, not just one.
I agree with pfuller
SirDent,
"The New Age religion...teaches self realization. Jesus always taught self denial....The New Age doesn't believe in Satan. It embraces every belief there is as being valid and right." That is perfect. I loved it. Good hub.As a product of the 60's, an original Woodstock Pop festival attendee. I have seen it from both sides. I knew about the CIA-LSD connection, which is now, well documented. The rest of the modern history was mostly new to me.It is kind of funny, I used to think alot like pfuller. I thought that no one kwew for sure until they were six feet under. Jesus Christ was revealed to me, after I had given up on Christianity.Good hub.TomJust wanted to add one more thing, this painting was made to illustrate a Biblical event and it is not porn. There is no comparison there. I was laughing my head off at that remark. Just wanted to let you know.
Thank you for your comment Moefry. I'm sure many believe what Pfuller had to say.
Thank you also Talford for your comment and insight. It;s good to hear from someone who had been there done that.
Sweetie Pie you sneaked in while I was replying to the other two comments. Thank you so much for clarifying the picture. I wasn't worried about it at all myself. ;)
Hello talford!
So you use to think like I do :)
It may be sad for me because I do not believe in one path. There are many things in the Christian faith that I do appreciate.
But there is one thing that I do not think I could ever change my mind about. God made us intelligent, to be able to think for ourselves. Only men try to narrow those choices, not God. Many philosophies show the weakness of the men who wrote them.
u said god made everything... so who made the so called god?
god is an atheist.. coz he does not belive in any gods above him
All I can say is man is man and God is God....man cannot exist without God, who is an all Powerful and merciful Being. That means, as far as I am concerned God has nothing to do with religion because it is only for man.
Re: drugs and alcohol - anything that takes us away from God, that is, stands between us and our relationship with God, cannot be tolerated. We must stop using and abusing if we are to truly find peace and feel the love of God.
New Day
What if drugs brought some people closer to God?
What stands between you and God is personal, but somehow we all like to blame other things.
I have nothing to say to your comment maverick, except God believes in Himself and His power.
Thishumilitiy I appreciate your comment very much. You are right in what you said.
NewDay you speak truth also. I appreciate your taking the time to comment here.
Pfuller, do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? "Drugs brings other closer to God" A drug induced hallucination is exactly a hallucination.
The definition of hallucination is: A hallucination is the brain's reception of a false sensory input. This essentially means that the person having a hallucination is experiencing an event through one of their senses that is not occurring in the real world. This is according to http://www.mental-health-matters.com/articles/arti
Something that is unreal.
The reason you think it is rediculous is that you restricted your research to fit your thesis.
I personally know people who in university would smoke pot and discuss philosophy which included Christianity. Some are devout Christians to this day and one still tells the story of how they discovered Christ.
You can quote definitions all you want. What you experience is real to you no matter what the cause. What you learn from that experience may cause you to be closer or farther away from God.
A truly devout Christian would never smoke pot. There are many who will discuss Christianity. Atheists do it all the time in forums and such. What they don;t realize is that they discuss something they don't really know about. They hear about such things. They read about them. They think about them. They don;t know about them.
For my article I used many different resources. I didn't go to one site and read it alone. It took me about a week to write this article. I spent a lot of time researching it out from different sites.
I direct you once again to this hub. I am not sure if you read it or not, but realize that I'm not saying you have to read it.
http://hubpages.com/hub/Maitreya-Ascended-Master--
If you read it you will realize that what the Bible says is true. I will wait for another response before I reply anymore.
"Research" can be like "stastics" in that what is omitted or ignored often reveals more about an article, argument or opinion than that which is put in. I think bandying about words like "truth" rather than "personal truth" makes a good discussion begin to unravel. Personal truth is powerful and amazing, but in the name of good communication, as this article seems to aspire to (albeit on a subject where sides are usually too entrenched to really communicate anyway) the term "personal truth" should be parced from "truth" the broader term to facilitate truly open dialogue.
The term "Truth" is more likely to be held by the masses at large as that which is verifiable by the largest body of discerning minds willing to examine an idea, such as: It is truth that bees have stingers. Anyone who has doubts about that can go make sure that the claim is true. "Personal truth" is different in that regard. To assert that one person or one ancient collection of book holds the only thing that can be true when discussing something that by its very nature requires "faith" is to disembowel any hope of actually discussing that idea at all - assuming the point of the discussion is not just preaching to the choir. Using "truth" in place of "personal truth" becomes a rhetorical device that, while cementing the appreciation of your points by those who already share you views, brings up the defenses of those to whom you may be wishing to communicate your beliefs.
Spiritually and philosophically, I'm still too humbled by the universe to pretend I know what the "actual truth" is. However, I do love to follow good discourse on it and like to see the various factions truly grapple with all the unknowable possibilies.
The thing about personal truth you stated Shadebreath shows just how ignorant man has become. If everyone had a different truth then how could their even remotely possibly be any truth? Can you see the contradiction?
I do not mean to say that you are ignorant. It is a generalization eveloping all mankind.
One can know the truth. I don't claim to know all the truth and I never will know all the truth in this life. I do happen to know the One who knows all of the truth.
I am also bound to spread the truth. Not my personal truth, not your personal truth, for there is no such thing. One thing I could never understand is how so many will read what Socrates said or Homer or Plato. But they refuse to listen to what Jesus said.
The mind of man is totally against God already. The drugs used during the 60's, and earlier, put man ever further from God.
Have you heard of Aleister Crowley?
Pardon me for not reading all the comments. It is stated in the Bible right from Jesus Christ that we are all Gods and that we are part of God--so how can that be from the Devil? New Age didn't come from drug use--i don't use drugs, never have and never will. Controlling of people is said to be of the Devil too. If he can lie like that then why can't he lie about everything--is there no end to his lying and how about the church? They tist worlds and meanings and they will tell you what to think about what the Bible says. They will also take things out of context to make it mean something totally different. There are alot of differences between and across the two testaments and what they have to say about GOD--Jesus has one aspect of God and then there are two other ones in the Old Testament. One is that God is all merciful and loving and kind and then you have the same God as being ruthless and killing and jealous. Which is he? He is supposed to be all loving--whose words do the New and Old Testaments use--they can't be God's because they would be consistent in his very own naure and personality. The thing is the churches and those who put together the books of the Bible only gave us part of the whole and not the whole because parts have not been in their entirety--as in parts of the manuscripts they took some from are mising so they guessed at what it said--and meanins and words got construed to mean something totally different. The laws as Jesus stated int eh Bible is written in the hearts and minds of men--so we already know the laws from birth. I don't think Jesus was on drugs either.
I think you mean a real Christian would never smoke pot :)
They no longer smoke pot, but they did, and they all became devout Christians later, and like I said, one still tells the story how it opened her mind to Christ
Your research is limited, are there no new age followers who did not take drugs, did everyone who took drugs become a follower of the philosophy etc etc
LG it will take me some time to go through your comment and reply to it. I appreciate your input and thank you for stoppin by.
Pfuller, My mistake on the pot smoking cxomment you made earlier. I misunderstood what you were saying.
What I wrote in the hub is that those who follow New Age religion follow the hallucinations of those that took LSD. Now maybe I didn't make it clear enough in my hub. I also wonder if you read all of the hub.
Did you ever read Aldoux Huxley's book, A Brave New World? It is interesting and I can see many references that could be used today.
Oh, btw, SirDent --Thanks for inviting me here. I have lots of things to write on about Contractors in remodeling and the "hell" we went through. Come by my hubs in about a week or so and at least one should be up.
Per your thesis: According to my findings the Resurgence of the new age religion is the direct result of drug use and is behind the evolution of religion.
Seems clear to me.
It is the classic logic mistake.
I can tell you that I had given up on "religion" too. All I was looking for was a free meal, the night God revealed to me that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Pfuller, before I received Christ into my heart, I would drop Acid and talk "religion", including Jesus Christ all night long. I was searching for the truth, but at the same time did not think "truth" was attainable.
Anyway, I don't want to turn this into a blog. The fact that it has gotten such a reaction must mean it's a good hub.
Come visit me if you like.
The Secret Place of the Most High God, a message.
Jesus Christ as revealed by Moses in the book of Leviticus
A true chistian would never smoke pot ? That seems like an outragous statement.
Fantastic comments here. Man created the lines on this earth. (borders) And only through thoughtful, and respectful discussion will those lines be erased.
Blessings to each and everyone that comments on this hub.
Sometimes, creating discussion alone is growth in the knowledge of Christ.
Well, rather than bandy about pejoratives and judgments like "ignorance" and the like, I chose to employ "personal truth" because I was being respectful to your beliefs. It is a term I have heard many polite Christians use when discussing beliefs with others to separate secular fact from religious fact, as obviously that is the whole nature of the ontological debate on God. I was being polite when I chose that term as it retained the "truth" elment that you so assiduously claim for your opinion, but made way for other opions by adding the "personal" to give room for other possibilities. I was merely being civil. The fact of the matter is that "personal truth" is a euphemism for the term "belief" which is what large portion of the "facts" presented here ultimately are.
I think equating hallucinogenics with the machinations of Satan is going to be tough to do in fact, unless you are honestly going to say that "Yes, the Native Americans, ancient Europeans, various Asian cultures and many African peoples all fell victim to Satan thousands and thousands of years before God decided to give a few guys in the Middle East the insight to escape damnation and Divine wrath."
I'm curious to see if that is what you are willing to commit to. You credit drugs in the sixties with being spawned of Satan for the use of halucingenics, but you dodged my point earlier that those same rituals have been around since long before (and I excused the modern variations as insignificant for now). Were these venerable ancient traditions not satanic before, and only became satanic forty odd years ago, or were they satanic for the whole of the last ten thousand years?
(And yes, I know who Aleister Crowley is. A real statistical outlier that one. Interesting character though, clever freak show.)
LG this is what Jesus actually said. Read it in context and remember who He is speaking to.
Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
See how He says it is about those to whom the Word of God came? This is the prophets and judges of the Old Testament He is talking about.
You talk a lot about how the church deceives and such, but yet in the New Age Beliefs there is no such thing as deceit. Everything is accepted as truth for someone so how can there be any deceit?
Talford as always I appreciate oyur input here. I don't mind the comments of anyone here and hope to keep it going as long as possible.
Shadesbreath, have you heard of peace pipes? Did you also know that back in the ancient times in Egypt that Isis was worshiped the same way as they flower children of the 60's worshiped it?
I will commit that drugs were used in Europe and by the American Indians.
Aleister Crowley was also a drug user and he is also connected to those mentioned in the hub above. He called himself "The Beast".
Drug use and abuse has always been satanic. It opens a door that allows satan to come into a person.
Jesus says many times that ye are gods----we are all part of that same God or the same Universe. Jesus and God will show themselves as the indvidual person can understand them-not as others understand them. It is personal for each and everyone of us--not as a group or a whole. Drugs, my friend also have a good sides to them and not all of those drugs that you mention are all and totally bad things--if God didn't want man to use them then he would not have put them here in the first place. God made Satan--did he not? Satan is beautiful beyond compare--and he is also attributed to women and that whole messed up thing. Messed up as in Women are the evil sex and men are so righteous and they control women and that women are deceivers.
You just took one sentence out of the Bible and not the whole context--------hmmm seems to me that you learn to do that and it means nothing to you. Post the whole paragraph not just the sentence and post all the paragraphs on that subject.
I got this froma website:
You are a god, the creator of your self, and it's not a new age fantasy or belief, you are a god. Sounds like blasphemy doesn't it? Well they said the same thing in my day and tried to stone me to death for making the statement . . . just as today many cry blasphemy and turn against whomever says they are a god. Reading John 10:33-34, The Jews answered me, saying, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; because thou, being a man, maketh thyself God. I answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
And sure enough, if you turn to and read Psalms 82:6, you read, I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
You see, this follows my teaching of the Father, the individualized god part of yourself. We are all gods. Here on earth there is the Son of man, which becomes born again as the Son of god - ONE with your Father god who art in heaven.
There is only one other "god" reference made in this way which has been recorded in the Bible, and that is in Acts 17:18 where Paul was teaching in Athens, reading, ... and some said, What will this babbler say? others said, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods ...
http://www.jesusteachings.com/gods.htmlHave you ever heard of the Law of Attraction? Do you know what it is? There is no Satan--only the individual bring to themselves what they put out--if one puts out bad thoughts, those will come back to them in bad things. Drugs don't make a person evil or good--the person makes that. In the course of history and telling of the Bible it was once said that it wasn't te Apple that was evil or the thing that Satan got Eve to eat but the Tomatoe. Now I don't know where I got that from becasue it has been a long time since I heard or read that, but what do you think of that misconception and is it still the Tomatoe or is it the Apple? Apples were not as prevalent way back then and there weren't as many varieties as there is now.
Read this as it is too long to post here:
http://reluctant-messenger.com/eden_1.htm
See what Satan and God had in mind for us humans.
What stated out as a thesis turns into a sermon :)
There are so many problems with drugs and how they destroy lives, so it is an easy target.
But what attracted me to this hub was the flawed logic used and how that flawed logic could be applied to anything, even things that do not necessarily appear evil.
That is that danger of trying to use research, or misuse research, either intentially or not, to back up a preconceived notion.
I think we can all agree on how certain drugs are absolutely distructive. The same can be said of anything that is abused.
However, the danger of this thesis is the conclusion that anything that does not support the Christian philosophy is evil, the work of the devil.
Of course the flawed logic has nothing to do with philosophy.
If A and B occur at relatively the same time, then A must have caused B.
Also, if A causes B and B causes C then A must also cause C
These are flaws in logic that result in wrong conclusions. But they are used to support a biased viewpoint.
LG. you say I used one sentence but I believe it was you who used only one sentence. I supported your sentence with another that Jesu sspoke right after and in fact is a part of the whole sentence. I will post the whol chapter next and you can read what it actually says.
Joh 10:1 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
Joh 10:2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
Joh 10:3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
Joh 10:4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
Joh 10:5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
Joh 10:6 This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.
Joh 10:7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.
Joh 10:8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.
Joh 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
Joh 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
Joh 10:11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
Joh 10:12 But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.
Joh 10:13 The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.
Joh 10:14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.
Joh 10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
Joh 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
Joh 10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
Joh 10:19 There was a division therefore again among the Jews for these sayings.
Joh 10:20 And many of them said, He hath a devil, and is mad; why hear ye him?
Joh 10:21 Others said, These are not the words of him that hath a devil. Can a devil open the eyes of the blind?
Joh 10:22 And it was at Jerusalem the feast of the dedication, and it was winter.
Joh 10:23 And Jesus walked in the temple in Solomon's porch.
Joh 10:24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.
Joh 10:25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
Joh 10:30 I and my Father are one.
Joh 10:31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
Joh 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
Joh 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
Joh 10:37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.
Joh 10:38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.
Joh 10:39 Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand,
Joh 10:40 And went away again beyond Jordan into the place where John at first baptized; and there he abode.
Joh 10:41 And many resorted unto him, and said, John did no miracle: but all things that John spake of this man were true.
Joh 10:42 And many believed on him there.
The whole chapter is what's needed to get the full message of what He said.Lady Guinevere says:71 minutes ago
I got this froma website:
You are a god, the creator of your self, and it's not a new age fantasy or belief, you are a god. Sounds like blasphemy doesn't it? Well they said the same thing in my day and tried to stone me to death for making the statement . . . just as today many cry blasphemy and turn against whomever says they are a god. Reading John 10:33-34, The Jews answered me, saying, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; because thou, being a man, maketh thyself God. I answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
And sure enough, if you turn to and read Psalms 82:6, you read, I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
SirDent: Do you know who Asaph is writing about in that passage?
Psa 82:1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
Psa 82:2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
Psa 82:3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
Psa 82:4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
Psa 82:5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
Psa 82:6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
Psa 82:7 But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
Psa 82:8 Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations.
He is talking to the judges and prophets of Israel. Read the whole chapter. It will give you a better insight.
Lady Guinevere says:64 minutes ago
Have you ever heard of the Law of Attraction? Do you know what it is? There is no Satan--only the individual bring to themselves what they put out--if one puts out bad thoughts, those will come back to them in bad things. Drugs don't make a person evil or good--the person makes that. In the course of history and telling of the Bible it was once said that it wasn't te Apple that was evil or the thing that Satan got Eve to eat but the Tomatoe. Now I don't know where I got that from becasue it has been a long time since I heard or read that, but what do you think of that misconception and is it still the Tomatoe or is it the Apple? Apples were not as prevalent way back then and there weren't as many varieties as there is now.
SirDent: The Bible says nothing about the fruit except the knowledge of good and evil. Before Eve then Adam ate that fruit there was no sin in them at all. It wasn't a fruit like an apple or an orange that they ate. It was pride that raised up in them and caused them to sin.
Lady Guinevere says:60 minutes ago
Read this as it is too long to post here:
http://reluctant-messenger.com/eden_1.htm
See what Satan and God had in mind for us humans.
SirDent; Jesus Himself stated what Satan wants to do. He showed Satan's true colors. Satan is a liar and the father of lies. He seeks to steal kill and destroy. I suggest you read one of my other hubs which I linked up above in the comments section here. Yo will be able to see the difference in teachings of Jesus and a man who claims to be the Christ.
pfuller says:24 minutes ago
What stated out as a thesis turns into a sermon :)
SirDent: That's how it goes when comments are usually made. Things get turned around and before you know it it is snowballing.
There are so many problems with drugs and how they destroy lives, so it is an easy target.
But what attracted me to this hub was the flawed logic used and how that flawed logic could be applied to anything, even things that do not necessarily appear evil.
That is that danger of trying to use research, or misuse research, either intentially or not, to back up a preconceived notion.
SirDent: I had no preconcieved notion on this subject. I found out something when researching for another hub. That is why and how this hub came to be published.
I think we can all agree on how certain drugs are absolutely distructive. The same can be said of anything that is abused.
However, the danger of this thesis is the conclusion that anything that does not support the Christian philosophy is evil, the work of the devil.
SirDent: Christianity is not a philosphy. It is a way of life. It is for anyone who iwll recieve it. ANything that goes against my teaching might be right, but anything that goes against God will always be wrong. You seem to point the finger at me a lot. I didn't use my word but God's Word for this article.
Of course the flawed logic has nothing to do with philosophy.
If A and B occur at relatively the same time, then A must have caused B.
Also, if A causes B and B causes C then A must also cause C
These are flaws in logic that result in wrong conclusions. But they are used to support a biased viewpoint.
SirDent: Flaws in logic or not make no difference to me really. God is always right and always will be right no matter how iilogical it may seem to me or you.
For everyone, I really do appreciate all the comments. All feedback is welcome. :)
LOL I don't know what else to say if you're actually going to commit to native American rituals as Satanic, Egyptian rituals... and the rest. I'll shake your hand respectfully and leave you to the choir.
Shadesbreath says:1 minute ago
LOL I don't know what else to say if you're actually going to commit to native American rituals as Satanic, Egyptian rituals... and the rest. I'll shake your hand respectfully and leave you to the choir.
SirDent: Have you checked into ti to see the things they used to do? Do you have any idea what was in the peace pipses they smoked? There are also mushrooms which cause hallucinations among other items also.
So lets just say that everything in a single person's idea that doesn't mak sense to that single person is of Satan just because they had an awful experience of it.
Now with the above site--just who is spreading lies--Religious persons or Satan in regards to the mis conceptions of weed?
Here is some truth about Peyote--Amarican Indian's put this in their Peace Pipes and more:
http://www.erowid.org/plants/peyote/peyote_faq.sht
I think maybe you shoud have done your reaserch on the drugs that are illicit instead of what others tell you about them. Oh and w do you know that God ctually gave the wriiten word to ma--ust becasue it says it in the Bible someplace? What happened between the Old and New Testaments--I mean the many, many, many years that are not ever mentioned. I believe the Bible and Jesus talks of things are all to be taken in moderation and he didn't leave anything out--or did he or was it those who transcribed those books--did they leave anything out because they didn't know what the word was or in what context it was originally written in?
http://www.well.com/user/woa/fspot.htm
What is marijuana?Marijuana (grass, pot, weed) is the common name for a crude drug made from the plant Cannabis sativa. The main mind-altering (psychoactive) ingredient in marijuana is THC (delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol), but more than 400 other chemicals also are in the plant.
SirDent: You should read the whole page.
http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/concern/peyote.html
While peyote produced rich visual hallucinations that were important to the native peyote cults, the full spectrum of effects served as a chemically induced model of mental illness.
SirDent: Now tell me why would God in all His power and glory need to use hallucinogenic drugs to give man a vision?
or why would God have these plants at all in the cosmos of things if he didn't intend for us to use them? I don't and have never taken any unprescribed drugs. Heck I don't even like the prescribed ones for that matter. What I am saying is that we cannot contol everyone when we cannot even control ourselves. If God made all things good--then it behooves us to say that anything--even the ones that give bad trips-is a bad thng and was made by God. Everything was good in God's eyes and mind. Satan is just a figment of your imagination--or could he be of a bad trip that God had while on the very same drugs? Or ishe on one now or is it us that are on a bad trip? Whose to say what is truth for one is the same truth for all. Why would we think as God does--why or how can we ever put human emotions and personality traits to this God if he isn't human but something much igger than we are or will ever be. So we are Gods, so says Jesus. We are part of that God-the whole-the Universal--therefore we can say what and how God thinks... We must stop blaming others for what we have thought and done and take responsibility for our own actions and thoughts and deeds.
well written. Good
Very interesting article, good research. I do have to make this comment though. Not everything God created is "good" as is the proof that he created all the angels, even Satan who is a fallen angel. God created the angels and man to be intellegent beings who can make decisions for themselves about good and evil. We are given the choice to decide if we believe in religion, drug use or to join a cult. I don't think music can be evil in itself - how you use the music may be. Angels play harps, or so it is said, and that isn't considered evil. I really believe that the choices you make in life, and how you live your life is the greatest testiment to your "religion" whether you believe in God or not.
good hub good thinking
Huxley was a great man. You do him a disservice with your caricature. Also you can't claim this hub is the result of "research" since you already have your mind made up. Rather you have scoured the internet for information in order to "prove" what you have already decided is the "truth". You say there is only one truth, but I ask you this: how many ways are there to Glasgow? In other words (think about it) there may be only one truth, but there are an infinite number of ways of getting there.
sirdent posted; What is marijuana?Marijuana (grass, pot, weed) is the common name for a crude drug made from the plant Cannabis sativa.
Moefry; marijuana is not made from a plant, it is the plant. There is no manufacturing involved. Just so you will know.
What do you have to say about the books of the Bible that were left out of the cannon? You know about Lilith and all that? The Bible itself tells us not to subtract or add anything to it so how is it that so many books were deleted and forgotten about? What about the books that speak of Jesus as a child? He raised a childhood friend from the dead so that he himself could clear Jesus of his murder. He also blinded a man for critisizing Josephs work and turned clay pigeons into real ones that flew away. Not many people know these things because they were left out of the Bible. There is also no word for eternity in the original language that these texts were writen in so how can our souls be burnt in Hell eternity if that word didn't exist. The King James Version of the Holy Bible has the word version right in it's title so how can you base your whole belief system on a version of a story. Besides the story of Jesus mirrors the story of Osiris. Osiris is an Egyptian God that pre-dates Jesus by a long shot and if you don't believe me look it up. Very well writen hub though and you did do a lot of research that I must aplaude you for. I hope that you don't get offended by my comment for that isn't my intention. I just think the message of the Bible is more important than the storys that it contains. Love your neighbor as you do yourself, forgive as you wish to be forgiven, and try not to mess up to much. Those are the things that matter. I'm not God so maybe He gave diffrent storys to diffrent groups of people so that they could better understand the message. I could be wrong but I won't know that until I die and the sad thing is neither will you or anyone else for that matter.
CJStone says:6 hours ago
Huxley was a great man. You do him a disservice with your caricature. Also you can't claim this hub is the result of "research" since you already have your mind made up. Rather you have scoured the internet for information in order to "prove" what you have already decided is the "truth". You say there is only one truth, but I ask you this: how many ways are there to Glasgow? In other words (think about it) there may be only one truth, but there are an infinite number of ways of getting there.
SirDent: What exactly did Huxley that was so great?
What does many roads to Glasgow have to do with God? The roads are manmade rods. The way back to God was made by God Himself. It is one way and only one way.
Agro Donkey says:4 hours ago
What do you have to say about the books of the Bible that were left out of the cannon? You know about Lilith and all that? The Bible itself tells us not to subtract or add anything to it so how is it that so many books were deleted and forgotten about? What about the books that speak of Jesus as a child? He raised a childhood friend from the dead so that he himself could clear Jesus of his murder. He also blinded a man for critisizing Josephs work and turned clay pigeons into real ones that flew away. Not many people know these things because they were left out of the Bible. There is also no word for eternity in the original language that these texts were writen in so how can our souls be burnt in Hell eternity if that word didn't exist. The King James Version of the Holy Bible has the word version right in it's title so how can you base your whole belief system on a version of a story. Besides the story of Jesus mirrors the story of Osiris. Osiris is an Egyptian God that pre-dates Jesus by a long shot and if you don't believe me look it up. Very well writen hub though and you did do a lot of research that I must aplaude you for. I hope that you don't get offended by my comment for that isn't my intention. I just think the message of the Bible is more important than the storys that it contains. Love your neighbor as you do yourself, forgive as you wish to be forgiven, and try not to mess up to much. Those are the things that matter. I'm not God so maybe He gave diffrent storys to diffrent groups of people so that they could better understand the message. I could be wrong but I won't know that until I die and the sad thing is neither will you or anyone else for that matter.
SirDent: I don't really know anything about Lillith. I do know about some of the other books you mentioned. They are gnostic. Did you know the book of Enoch was written around 200 BC? Thousands of years after he was translated into heaven.
Now about Jesus commitiing murder. The Bible clearly states there was no sin in Him. He never harmed anyone. He didn't kill a child, because if He had done that, He would have sin in Him.
There is a way to know right now. I published this article today maybe you could go and read it. http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-follow-Jesus
No Jesus was playing on the roof top with his friend when his friend fell off of the rooftop and died. Everyone blamed Jesus for pushing the child to his death. Jesus then brought the boy back to life so that he himself could tell them that he had fallen and not been pushed by Jesus as they had claimed. Jesus did however blind a man for critizising Josephs work as a carpenter.
Agro, I haven't heard those stories before. Kind of funny the one about Jesus blinding a man for critisizng Joeseph's work. I think you should check out the hub I linked above.
I believe that I will. Those are all stories from the books of the Bible that they left out. Judas also wrote a book of his own that was left out. He said that God and Jesus both came to him and told him that he must turn Jesus over to the Jewish priests.
So much about this hub is troubling that I barely know where to start. Perhaps I will write one of my own "The History of Religion: Some Other Perspectives." I have a very different take on the topic, and while I have no desire to get into one of those idiotic scripture-quoting battles, I'm also really, really weary of Christians who bully and intimidate others by whacking them over the head with the 'good' book. I get this at work all the time--kids half my age who know it all because they read it in the Bible and their pastors told them everyone else is wrong. What a tiny, constricted, suffocating little world that is.
My sister in Indiana is very ill, so I may not be around for a few days, but when I get back, I will write a better hub than this one, I promise you that.
I cannot thank you, I'm too irritated.
I do wish you well.
Sir, Huxley was a great writer, a great thinker, a truth-seeker, whose books bear tesimony to his enduring vision, none of which I can say about you. Here's the little trick you play. You say there is only one way to God. But I'm not hearing God on this page: I'm hearing you. In other words, you've hooked your fortunes to a small and petty notion of God, and condemned the rest of us in your own mind for our failure to comprehend this.
I have done a lot of research on religions around the world. A common theme exists and is told very similar to the story of Christianity. Some are nearly identical. If Christianity is nearly the same as several other religions then who is to say the Christianity is the right religion? Based on your conclusion of drugs being the cause I would say; to other religions it may look as though Christianity is drug induced. I find it hard to believe that the world religions evolved from drug induced states as not everyone has used drugs to experience God and religion. What of children who upon birth, not knowing Christianity, accomplish great miracles? Spawn of Satan perhaps or messenger of God? I would point out that God decides how to let others find him not Christianity or other religions. Perhaps, the similarities of Christianity to other world religions is God’s way of saying… Hey wake up! I’m everywhere don’t get trapped by one belief system and experience me entirely? I would argue that Jesus himself taught and warned of the dangers of “Religion”. I believe in the teachings of Jesus regardless if they take me to a Christian church or a new age spiritualist. I also believe in the teachings of other great teachers.
pgrundy says:2 hours ago
So much about this hub is troubling that I barely know where to start. Perhaps I will write one of my own "The History of Religion: Some Other Perspectives." I have a very different take on the topic, and while I have no desire to get into one of those idiotic scripture-quoting battles, I'm also really, really weary of Christians who bully and intimidate others by whacking them over the head with the 'good' book. I get this at work all the time--kids half my age who know it all because they read it in the Bible and their pastors told them everyone else is wrong. What a tiny, constricted, suffocating little world that is.
My sister in Indiana is very ill, so I may not be around for a few days, but when I get back, I will write a better hub than this one, I promise you that.
I cannot thank you, I'm too irritated.
I do wish you well.
SirDent: I have no idea what you mean about whacking people over the head with the good book. This hub is about how religion went from being pure to being something totally different. You have every right to write you own hub better than mine or not. When you write it let me know and I'll read it for sure.
CJStone says:2 hours ago
Sir, Huxley was a great writer, a great thinker, a truth-seeker, whose books bear tesimony to his enduring vision, none of which I can say about you. Here's the little trick you play. You say there is only one way to God. But I'm not hearing God on this page: I'm hearing you. In other words, you've hooked your fortunes to a small and petty notion of God, and condemned the rest of us in your own mind for our failure to comprehend this.
SirDent: Huxley was a drug addict and wanted eveyone else to join him in his addiction. Here is an exceprt from his book; "If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution-then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise."ALDOUS HUXLEY
How great a man can he be if he is a drug addict and a pusher of drugs?
Adam York says:29 minutes ago
I have done a lot of research on religions around the world. A common theme exists and is told very similar to the story of Christianity. Some are nearly identical. If Christianity is nearly the same as several other religions then who is to say the Christianity is the right religion? Based on your conclusion of drugs being the cause I would say; to other religions it may look as though Christianity is drug induced. I find it hard to believe that the world religions evolved from drug induced states as not everyone has used drugs to experience God and religion. What of children who upon birth, not knowing Christianity, accomplish great miracles? Spawn of Satan perhaps or messenger of God? I would point out that God decides how to let others find him not Christianity or other religions. Perhaps, the similarities of Christianity to other world religions is God’s way of saying… Hey wake up! I’m everywhere don’t get trapped by one belief system and experience me entirely? I would argue that Jesus himself taught and warned of the dangers of “Religion”. I believe in the teachings of Jesus regardless if they take me to a Christian church or a new age spiritualist. I also believe in the teachings of other great teachers.
SirDent: With all due respect to you and the research you have done, have you tried Christianity? To say that other cultures or religions cannot immitate or be close to Christianity would be a foolish thing to say. At one time all believed in one God and only one. All cultures came from those who believed, just as the flood story. At one time there were 8 people alone who survived the flood, and each of those people had a story to tell.
Now, God has His own Word. God has kept His Word through all time. His Word will never pass away. Man's words will always fall short.
Drugs weren't the cause of the fall of man. Drugs were the cause of the resurgence of the New Age religion in the 60s.
God certainly is everywhere, but not everyone is in God.
You say you believe in the teachings of Jesus. Do you believe that He is the light and the truth? Do you believe that no one can come to the Father but by Him? There is much more that Jesus taught, one teaching that we must be righteous and holy. How can a man be righteous and holy?
Yes, I have tried Christianity and it is why I did much research. Yes, I believe Jesus is the light and truth. People will get to God through Jesus but Jesus is not the only path God created for humanity. Other Great Teachers were put here to also reach God. Why wouldn't God create more than one path for man after he created many paths after Babylon? Unless, of course, Jesus speaks all languages and taught to the entire peoples of the world causing the similarity of stories and religious content like the Flood. As for righteous versus holy, that is a tough question because it really depends on how the two terms are defined. This really is a tough topic which you wrote a good hub about. (-:
Drugs in that day and age in the 60's were a way to deal with the War and Political Playayrd. They really had very little to do with NEWAGE stuff. Newage also covers Astrlogy and the like and being yourself not someone else idea of who you should be.
The Bible and the books were put togeher and dicipherd by Catholic Priests--not a Peer Group that they should have had in the first place--they were very Biased in the assumptions that they made in the wordings of those manuscripts. As far as Gnostic goes and why those were not included in the books--well Jesus was a Gnostic--so how do you explain that and why HIS religion or belief structue was left out and all the Jewish things were left in and some things were just screwed up in the explanations. What do you think of the Pillar of Salt that Lot's Wife was turned into for looking back? Back then they didn't know what it was and so made up something that they could understand. No we know what it is and understand the science of it--Valcanic Ash--Fire and As will look like that and Fires and burning does occur when there is an Eruption of a Volcano. It has been scientifically proven that it happened right where that story occored. Another thing that was proven to be a natural cuse was the Walls of Jericho. Saying that this all never occurred doesn't mean that it didn't. Ignorance is not bliss!
Adam York says:3 hours ago
Yes, I have tried Christianity and it is why I did much research. Yes, I believe Jesus is the light and truth. People will get to God through Jesus but Jesus is not the only path God created for humanity. Other Great Teachers were put here to also reach God. Why wouldn't God create more than one path for man after he created many paths after Babylon? Unless, of course, Jesus speaks all languages and taught to the entire peoples of the world causing the similarity of stories and religious content like the Flood. As for righteous versus holy, that is a tough question because it really depends on how the two terms are defined. This really is a tough topic which you wrote a good hub about. (-:
SirDent: Maybe my question should have been, "Have you tried Jesus Christ?"
Why wouldn't God make many different paths? TO be honest with you, I don't know why He didn't. I can only speculate as to the why.
To make many different paths God would have to be imperfect. It would mean He is unable to make only one true path. It also would cause confusion, because who would know for sure which path was theirs? As I said, this is only speculation on my part.
Lady Guinevere says:3 hours ago
Drugs in that day and age in the 60's were a way to deal with the War and Political Playayrd. They really had very little to do with NEWAGE stuff. Newage also covers Astrlogy and the like and being yourself not someone else idea of who you should be.
The Bible and the books were put togeher and dicipherd by Catholic Priests--not a Peer Group that they should have had in the first place--they were very Biased in the assumptions that they made in the wordings of those manuscripts. As far as Gnostic goes and why those were not included in the books--well Jesus was a Gnostic--so how do you explain that and why HIS religion or belief structue was left out and all the Jewish things were left in and some things were just screwed up in the explanations. What do you think of the Pillar of Salt that Lot's Wife was turned into for looking back? Back then they didn't know what it was and so made up something that they could understand. No we know what it is and understand the science of it--Valcanic Ash--Fire and As will look like that and Fires and burning does occur when there is an Eruption of a Volcano. It has been scientifically proven that it happened right where that story occored. Another thing that was proven to be a natural cuse was the Walls of Jericho. Saying that this all never occurred doesn't mean that it didn't. Ignorance is not bliss!
SirDent: The time of the 60's were indeed a time of rebellion. So teens decided to fry their own minds and brains on drugs to rebell against the leadership and the Vietnam war? I put the question mark because I wasn't old enough back then to know what else may have been going on.
The thing about it is this, The actual use of the drugs started back in the 40s. Aldous Huxley was one of those responsible for making them so popular. There were others also who were in on it.
As far as the Bible and the books go, there were many written parchemnts gathered together and copied by less than 100 years after Jesus was crucified. Many were written leter than that by gnostics, which are the ones being called the lost books of the Bible. They weren't lost at all. They actually don't belong there.
As far as the Old Testament goes, Jesus Himself taught from it. He had quoted many scriptures from the Old Testament. It was around when Jesus was born and even before.
In an earlier comment I stated that the book of Enoch was written around 200 BC. Enoch lived around 5000 years before that time. That in itself shows that the book is a forgery and a fraud.
How can you say that Jesus was a gnostic? I don't understand that. To me it's like saying God is an atheist. Jesus always talked of the Father and how the Father sent Him. I just don't understand how this conclusion could even come about.
and he also talked of his mother and how to pray to her in that very same prayer of the Lord's Prayer. If you weren;t around back then I don't see how you could make such assumptions at all. I was around back then and I did not take drugs. I didn't smoke ot do alcohol either. Seems to me that what I recall is that those who were on drugs got their messages from the music not from books or authors. Again, have you ever read Huxley's book "Brave New World"? If you choose to not do so just because YOU think that he is just an addict--then so be it, but then that would make you look biased in your research. There are alot of Addicts that you have no knowledge of and are outstanding citizens. My husband is an addictions counselor and he would know. Like I said before--YOU and only You are responsible for what you learn or don't learn and the mistakes or lessons you choose to learn and not Satan. Brings up something from the 60's era once again--There was a show on TV called "The Flip Wilson Show" and he coined the phrase "The Devil made me do it". BTW he was Black. Research all about the 60's and the early 70's more....
LG, I am having trouble following you. Not once did I say that all people took drugs in the 60s. Flip Wilson is someone I do remember. I remember the phrase, "The devil made me do it!" The phrase is wrong in itself. The devil can't make you do anything. You do it because you want to do it.
Why would Jesus pray to his mother when she was alive at the time? Where do you get your info is the next question?
Huxley wasn't a drug addict or a pusher of drugs. I think you need to to some actual research. Much of the above is plain disinformation. He experimented with LSD at the end of his life. He was one of the world's greatest minds. People wanted to find out what he thought about it. He wrote a number of book on the subject which are worth reading. He thought that these particular kinds of drugs could be of benefit to society, and there is still evidence that there are a number of illnesses they could cure. But he wasn't for just giving it away to anyone. He though it should be used in controlled circumstances, with a proper therapeutic guide.
CJ, I have yet to find a site which says Huxley wasn't who or what I stated in the above article. I used many different sites for my research. If you know of a few site which states differently than what I wrote please link them here for me.
I cannot click every site which is listed under his name. As you can see here. Results 1 - 10 of about 3,230,000 for Aldous Huxley
Did god create man or man created god? Good topic. Thankyou
Actually God created man in His own image. Satan came along and deceived the man causing his image to actually change to something less that what God made to start with.
After Satan deceived man as was cast down with the other fallen angels did his powers become more limited once earth bound? Meaning, it is harder to deceive man because of his knowledge and the results of the physical on satan? You know the physics of it all?
I don't know if I can truly answer your question. I will write what I know. Satan is a deceiver. There is no truth in him at all. Jesus stated that Himself. As far as deceiving man, Those who are under the influence of satan will keep being deceived. Not because God doesn't try to get their attention, but because they choose that way.
God is a gentleman. He will not force anyone to accept His Son Jesus.
Not sure if this answers your question or not, but it's what I know for a fact myself.
why would god make man in such as way that it falls prey to satan easily.
Interesting hub and well written. The main flaw I see in your logic is that you are working off the assumption that the Bible is infalliable and utterly truthful.
How do you account for centuries of men -- human men -- altering and revising the text? Men with political agendas and personal biases? Their various influences are obvious in the differing writing styles and tonalities within the text.
The bible was written by men, for men. To assume that the bible is completely truthful and unbiased is to assume that these men were entirely without with guilt or sin -- which is contradictory to the Christian faith, as Jesus is the only perfect human to ever walk the earth.
I don't mean to attack, I'm genuinely curious. This particular fact has been a major stumbling block in me even being willing to accept the bible as anything other than a rich literary work with an incredible historical impact on human history. I have asked many of my Christian friends to explain this discrepency, but they cannot -- at least not without relying on circular, presumptive logic.
I have been told that God is perfect, and God would not allow His works to be tainted. However, we learned of God through these works, and must trust these works to be relaying that truth. From my point of view, the works are inherently flawed, and we cannot know who or what God truly is.
If you believe in God as given to you by the bible, then you believe in the bible. If you cannot trust the bible, you cannot believe in the Christian God.
.....and where was God during the dinosaur age? There was no man either. No man, no God, no God no man! Get it?
Rudra says:5 hours ago
why would god make man in such as way that it falls prey to satan easily.
SirDent: Man made a choice to eat what he wasn't supposed to eat. Just as you and I make choices every day. We choose what clothes we are going to wear, shoes etc. . .
PaulieWalnuts says:13 minutes ago
.....and where was God during the dinosaur age? There was no man either. No man, no God, no God no man! Get it?
SirDent: I think this is a little too intelligent a question for a "backwoods miscreant" to answer. But I'll try and answer it. God is the same place He always has been. He has never moved away nor has He moved in recently.
Thatonegirl, it will take me some time to answer all of your questions, but first can you enlighten me as to why you said that the text has been altered by men over the centuries. I am not sure what you mean by that.
The bible was originally written in the native languages of those ancient authors. Over time, it was translated to English. The reality and necessity of translation means that certain key points may have been lost in the switch to a new tongue.
In addition, over the centuries, the bible has been copied by various scribes into books for those who could afford them. I find it hard to believe that every single scribe could have copied it exactly as it came to them. Some may have accidentally dropped words or paragraphs, some may have intentionally added or dropped information.
The most widely accepted and read form of the bible, so far as I know, is the King James Translation, which was commissioned by King James so that there would be a uniform text of God's word for the civilized world. Politics being politics, I find it extremely hard to countenance that none of King James' political agenda crept into the book.
Finally, even in modern times, the bible is being renovated and revised. The mormon version of the bible has "notes" from Joseph Smith included in the margins. Catholics read a text that has books missing from the King James version. Many youth are picking up copies of "Contemporary" bibles, that have brought the language "up to date", thereby losing the traditional wording and some of the original meaning of the text.
The bible is not an infalliable, unchanging document. It has grown and changed throughout the years, and all of the change effected to it was done by man.
Sheech! It's hard to keep up.
Lady Guinevere says: "Drugs in that day and age in the 60's were a way to deal with the War and Political Playayrd. They really had very little to do with NEWAGE stuff. Newage also covers Astrlogy and the like and being yourself not someone else idea of who you should be."
I can tell you from my experience that the vast majority of kids taking drugs in the 60's was to have a good time. Not escape or make a political statement. Unfortunately some paid dearly in pain, anguish, and even death.
I don't know much about Huxley but I do know about Jesus Christ. I can tell you for certain that indeed he is the Son of God and that he not only died but has risen from the dead!
The difference between religion and salvation is that salvation is a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ his Son. If you posess it you know it. It transends head knowledge.
that one girl says:2 hours ago
The bible was originally written in the native languages of those ancient authors. Over time, it was translated to English. The reality and necessity of translation means that certain key points may have been lost in the switch to a new tongue. In addition, over the centuries, the bible has been copied by various scribes into books for those who could afford them. I find it hard to believe that every single scribe could have copied it exactly as it came to them. Some may have accidentally dropped words or paragraphs, some may have intentionally added or dropped information. The most widely accepted and read form of the bible, so far as I know, is the King James Translation, which was commissioned by King James so that there would be a uniform text of God's word for the civilized world. Politics being politics, I find it extremely hard to countenance that none of King James' political agenda crept into the book.Finally, even in modern times, the bible is being renovated and revised. The mormon version of the bible has "notes" from Joseph Smith included in the margins. Catholics read a text that has books missing from the King James version. Many youth are picking up copies of "Contemporary" bibles, that have brought the language "up to date", thereby losing the traditional wording and some of the original meaning of the text.The bible is not an infalliable, unchanging document. It has grown and changed throughout the years, and all of the change effected to it was done by man.
SirDent: I understand more what you were asking before now. for the record I read and use the king James Version of the Bible. When it was translated, the scholar who did it did it word for word letter for letter. Have you seen an original of the KJV? I will post one verse toi show you what it looks like.
Joh 14:6 Iesus saith vnto him, I am the Way, the Trueth, and the Life: no man commeth vnto the Father but by mee.
Can you see how this reads? Each letter was painstakingly translated. At the time of this translation there was no such thing as the letter J. Also the U and the V were the same letter in the Hebrew language.
As far as those men who wrote it orgiinally being perfect there is no man perfect. What you seem to miss is the fact that God can be perfect even when manifesting Himself through an imperfect man.
Thank you for your response. I did not miss that assertation of God being perfect, as I have heard it before. It is the circular logic that I previously referred to.
Circular logic in the article?
"I have been told that God is perfect, and God would not allow His works to be tainted.
"However, we learned of God through these works, and must trust these works to be relaying that truth. From my point of view, the works are inherently flawed, and we cannot know who or what God truly is."If you believe in God as given to you by the bible, then you believe in the bible. If you cannot trust the bible, you cannot believe in the Christian God."
- As stated in my previous comment.
As well, each version of the bible was translated by multiple scribes and scholars, generally going through an approval committee before publication, as noted here: http://www.av1611.org/kjv/kjvhist.html , as well as in other sources.
Thank you, however, for your time and effort. I appreciate the attempt at edification.
that one girl, I have written then truth here. It is the idea of man that God can't keep His own Word intact. It is also the idea of man that all books claiming to be of God are of God, but they are not all of God.
Every person alive has a spotr in their heart that can only be filled by the one true God. God has made THE WAY for man to be reconciled back to him. It is so easy to believe that psychics are always right. It is easy to believe that all other beliefs are right, but why is it so hard to beleive what I wrote?
There is a scripture where Jesus Himself spoke a message or teaching. It is written "Mat 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel."
I don't know what else to say here.
Thank you Talford once again for the comment and help.
Sir Dent, it's not just you. I think I may not believe in anything when I cannot confirm the scientific validity of it. I hope and dream for the possibility of more, but despite being raised in an extremely religious family, I can only question and find flaws in all I am told. I am not cut out for blind faith, I'm afraid.
Thatonegirl, there are many like you who need to feel, smell, taste, see, hear with the five senses of the flesh before they will believe something. I cannot prove to you that anything I wrote is true and real. If you want to find fault in anything at all, you will find fault.
Until God reveals Himself to you, which I'm sure He has done before just as He did to me before also, I can only write truth. As far as flaws go, I have many flaws. I will have flaws until the day I die but God loves me in spite of those flaws. I think this is where most people get turned around.
They think God loves them so there will be no punishment ever for anyone. In this day and time it is hard to punish a child for wrongdoing without getting into trouble but a parent must raise their children right even if it means going against what others would rather do. therefore, God will punish those who refuse to do His will and do what's right.
I seem to have gotten off topic a little here. I don't know why but God knows.
First I commend the fact that you are reaching out trying to find answers. Have you tried sincere and serious pryaer? Ask God and He will answer your questions. Secind it was when Eve was told that her eyes would be opened and that she'd be able to decide what was good or bad that was when man first tried to place himself at God's level. Third, I suggest you contact someone spiritually sound in their reasoning for discussion. I don't know what is at the true root of your obvious hatred for drug use(andprobable drug users) But Satan has used MUCH more than that for a very long time.
Daledad, you misunderstand what was written in this hub. It has nothing to do with hatred toward anyone. It has to do with the hallucinatory visions of those who used drugs during the 60s and how it in effect caused a great resurgence of an old belief.
Further I stated the fact that many today still follow those same hallucinations that were drug induced to being with.
Even in the original worship of Isis drugs were used to "enhance" the experience. God doesn't need a man to take drugs to give him a vision. I suggest you go back and read the whole article once more and read it slowly.
In response to that one girl and her honest struggle with concrete knowledge or scientific fact and the blessing of knowing God and following His will, I must resoundly agree. I am a spiritual person. I am also a voracious consumer of scientific knowledge. The most dificult thing I have done is my life is to try and strike a balance between the two. Many offer answers but it really is quite difficult. I have been thinking about this lately and oft time it is downright impossible to reconcile biblical events with current scientific knowledge. I retain my spirituality whoeheartedly but hunger for more concrete explanations as well. I believe that perhaps i have been able to do this by basing my interpretation of the Bible on human-aided fact. Maybe the seven days it took for God to create the Hevens and the Earth was not what we consider to be a calender week, but seven eons of time. I have found great insight in both yours and pgrundy's Hubs and believe you have each simply taken alternate approaches. All of us are so varied in countless ways, I really feel to try and procliam that there is one EXACT way toi be fathful is a fallacy.
again, your disdain for drugs is obvious. False worship goes back much further than that. It has nothing to do with hallucinations or drugs. Read your bible which is MUCH better a resouirce than the books that you've been reading which merely set forth man's opinions. On the other hand, "All scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for reproof and setting things aright. That the man of God may be fully equipped..."I recommend that you devote a greater portion of your reading time to that tried and proven true book.
Matthew, I appreciate your comment here.
Daledad, I have no idea who you are talking or why you are saying what you're saying.
good work mate.
You do know that you can have also have those very same hallucinations without using any drugs at all. The mirage is something a person has when he has a severe lack of essential things --like water or food. Now I must bring this into view--if Jesus -as stated in that Bible--went without food or water for 40 days--wouldn't that bring about hallucinations as well and how does that get translated? Yes you say he was God's Son, but he was also in a Physical Human (lower than Angels and such) Body same as you and me.
Thanks, Googlecashmoney for the comment.
LG I understand what you're saying or trying to say. Many would rather believe that Jesus was a lunatic or a drug addict. SO many call him a great teacher, but yet refuse what He taught.
God is indeed able to give visions to someone without the use of drugs. A mirage is actually an optical illusion. It is seeing soemthing that really isn't there.
What Jesus did when He was without food for 40 days and nights is called fasting. Now maybe you think He was hallucinatiing afterward. Maybe you think LSD is the greatest thing to ever come along. Still doesn't prove what I wrote wrong.
LSD is a dangerous drug. Any drugs of that sort are dangerous. What I don;t understand is if they are such great drugs, why don't people give them to their children? Is it because the law says it is not right? The law says it is illegal for you to use those drugs. Understand what I'm trying to say? If you do let me know cause I think I just confused myself.
Lady says: Wait a minute there SirDent. I never said LSD was a good thing.
Sirdent said: LSD is a dangerous drug. Any drugs of that sort are dangerous. What I don;t understand is if they are such great drugs, why don't people give them to their children?
Lady says: Well for one there are many other drugs that are just as dangerous and they were given to children and pregnant women only to find out years later what horrendous effects it had on them, like Bendictine and some others. Don't forget about DDT and it's widespread use and it's widespred horror too.
Sirdent said: rather believe that Jesus was a lunatic or a drug addict.
Lady says: Did I say he was a drug addict? Not even close to that one! What I was saying and I think you missed my point is that Fasting does give one hallucinations-----NOT JUST JESUS. Everyone who fasts for that amount of days will certainly have visions and hallucinations---no matter what term you use....optical Illusion, Mirage, Halucination or whatever.
You are right, you didn;t say He is or was a lunatic or drug addict. You did equate Him by impl;ication with a drug addict.
There are many different drugs which are very dangerous, many even more dangerous than LSD. Fasting originated in the Bible as a way to crucify the flesh and bring it under submission to the spirit.
How I read what you stated implied to me that the hallucinations or visions are the same whether it be by taking drugs or fasting.
I apologize if I have missed the mark.
No problem there--now you see how written words can be one meaning to someone and a different meaning to someone else--same goes for translations of the Bible. Fasting might have been in the Bible and in your meaning but what I get of fasting from that Bible is it cleanses the body of toxins and build-up of things the body tends to accumulate. I believe it was called or equated with driving out demons or sin. Another example of mis-translation. The Bible is full of Control-mechanisms, mostly fear tactics. There are loving things in there too, but the religions tend to over do the fear and not let the love shine through.
How many drugs were used by people's in the Bible? Where they good or were they bad and does it say that there were Drugs used by Satan or any other entity?
First let's start once more at the beginning. Everything that God created, God saw that it was good. Now at the beginning of this hub I stated that when Adam ate the fruit that they changed. Nature also changed. Man had dominion over the earth until Adam ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
God then cursed the earth causing thorns and thistles to grow in the garden.
What Adam actually did when he ate the fruit was he gave dominion over the earth to the serpent (Satan).
Satan now has dominion over the earth. He actually give men what they want as far as sinfulness goes. In an earlier comment I made here I quoted scripture which stated that iniquity was found in Satan. Iniquity isn't sin, but it is what's inside a person that tries to make them sin.
Running out of time at the moment and will have to finish this later. Should be able to later tonight.
SirDent said:
What Adam actually did when he ate the fruit was he gave dominion over the earth to the serpent (Satan).
Lady says: Where does it say that and in what translation? Does it say it exactly as you said it or is it just what someone TOLD you that it means that?
Satan was not a serpent in the beginning and if God or Adam (since now you are missing out that God Made Adam and so therefore God is Adam just as Jesus is God) gave Satan the Earth and dominion over all--then that must mean all earthly beings are Satan's and he can do as he pleases. Then if that is so--where is God now that Satan has his earth and his creations. What it appears that you are saying is that Humans gave Satan something that God owned. Humans don't have anything that God owns or God never gave us anything to own--dominion as to take care of, but not own outright. Wasn't it that when Satan fell he was sent to have all the control of the Earth--way before Man was even thought up?
What is sin?
SIn is everythything that is against God. It requries action.
God did not create Himself in Adam. God made man from the dust of the earth. God gave Adam dominion over the earth.
When Adam ate the forbidden fruit, he gave dominon over to another. This other was who caused the serpent to decieve them. All through the Bible Satan is referred to as the serpent, the dragon, etc. . . He is a liar and the father of lies. In other words he invented the first lie.
God has indeed gave man something that he must possess or lit will be lost. Each person owns their own soul.
Satan didn't just fall. He was cast out of heaven. It's like a bouncer physically tossing someone out of a bar.
Many seem to want to believe that Satan isn't the bad guy. They want to believe that he is a good guy. They have every right to believe that if they want. It doesn't prevent me from believing what I know to be true.
Not pointing any fingers at anyone but just stating facts.
Sir Dent said: All through the Bible Satan is referred to as the serpent, the dragon, etc. . . He is a liar and the father of lies. In other words he invented the first lie.
Lady says: Do dragons exist or where there ever dragons? Scientist say there isn't or wasn't. In the very beginning of the Bible Satan was one of God's top Angel (VERY Beautiful_ (now who would know that to write it down ina book or story) and not a dragon or serpent at all----it does state that in the Bible--so who started by saying that Satan was a dragon or serpent----what were there motives. Dragons are not all bad just as anything else in this world. There is a duality to everything and same goes with those in the Bible and also with the definitions of what and who God is--also duality in the Bible and with Satan too--so who devised this thought and appearance? It wasn't God or Satan--but Man in his feeble attempts AT THE TIME when they were writing THEIR OWN thoughts and understandings of things in the way they could understand them. I am in the process of writing another hub from MY standpoint in the horrific storm we experienced this last weekend. I got some things jotted down but in no order yet and you can read and ponder some questions I also bring up there in that.
I have very little time at the moment. I will try and give a more thorough comments toy your comment later today. Indeed there is a duality to everything in this world. God is only one God though. He is not a duality.
Satan is indeed the father of lies and Jesus Himself said, "The truth is not in him."
Get your thoughts together and in order and post them here when you can. I am glad you're able to get back on site here.
Happy hubbing. ;)
Sirdent said:
God is only one God though. He is not a duality.
Lady says: I am not so sure and possitive about that. You see there is this God in teh Bible that is all forgiving and loving and peaceful and all-knowing and merciful. Then you also have this God and Vengeful and Jealous and hateful and war-like and tells the people the it is OK to kill each other in his name. This is confusing becasue even in God's own words and commandments Jealousy, war and murder and killing are not OK at anytime! So you see there is a duality. Whi is the real God? Just looking at this then one can see that it is MAN who wrote those books as they were very confused themselves. Is God all righteous or is he vengeful and a leader of killers and murderers? Or was it that one of these God's is Satan pretending to be God or the other way around? Then back to the Drug issue--do the drugs cause you to see Satan or God in is fullness or do they cuase the total opposite. Woe are WE to say what it right and what is wrong for another person. Hesus said that the word is written in the minds and in the hearts of everyone====so wouldn't we already know what is the law by God? If Jesus said this then it must be true for everyone---as in every single person. When you do something and you get a bad feeling inside your gut--isn't that the law that Jesus was talking about and isn't it God's Law?
Thanks for welcoming me back--I had to go through lots of hoops to get back on here in my account and same with gmail! Oy vey!
Have read that book by Aldoux Jusley yet? Brave New World. Oh and a good movie for ya to watch: "Logan's Run"
I posted my new hub--The Wrath of God.
"If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution-then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise."
ALDOUS HUXLEY
You seem to be refusing to read his book--are you afraid that it might tell you something or you might learn or THINK sbout something for yourself? Who is telling you not to read it and why are they telling you such things... BTW I read that in college way long ago.
I can't believe you don't understand what the man is saying in my last comment. LOL I don't know what else to say here.
That might be what he said but it has nothing to do with his book Brave New World. you are prejudging something before you even open the cover of it.
There is FEAR written all over your posts about this one man--he is dead, I think, so how can he or hos words hurt you....
Just a piece of what this book is about:
In Brave New World, Huxley contrives to exploit the anxieties of his bourgeois audience about both Soviet Communism and Fordist American capitalism. He taps into, and then feeds, our revulsion at Pavlovian-style behavioural conditioning and eugenics. Worse, it is suggested that the price of universal happiness will be the sacrifice of the most hallowed shibboleths of our culture: "motherhood", "home", "family", "freedom", even "love". The exchange yields an insipid happiness that's unworthy of the name. Its evocation arouses our unease and distaste.
Something else you should watch if you haven't already--Logun's Run. Excellent movie.
There is no fear in me except fear of the Lord. Are you saying the quote I posted above isn't from his book?
I did watch Logan's Run many years ago. Can't really remember anything of it. Maybe I need to try and find it and watch it again.
I didn't say that. Fear the lord? In the beginning we are not to fear the lord. I don't fear someone or something that loves me and I certainly don't instill or wnat to instill fear into those who love me and so on and so forth.
Like I stated above--God was all merciful and loving and not to be FEARED and then all of a sudden--Oh MY--He becomed Vengeful and Jealous. Isn't Jeaoulsy one of God's own commandments that goes against His Own Commandments? Why would God wnat to put forth that example when it is the opposite he is trying to convey. Tow Different Gods--two different personalities--Whi si God and Who Is Satan and can YOU tell who the differences are-byt this God's Duality?
What made those who worte the bible change from all loving to healous and bengeful? It had to be MAN"S thoughts, not that of God.
I do NOT Fear God or The Lord or Jesus Christ or anyone--except one that is to harm me.
So Huxleu wants a world without pain-----doesn't everyone? What makes him different or so special except that he, as you state, wants to make everyone do the same thing--just like religions. Control the people and no one will have too think for themselves. Do you know about Jim Jones and the horrific events that led to many peopl's death. Don't look up to man, but to your God and don't FEAR him either. Don't FEAR anything becasue that will always come back to you.
Do you know or have you seen the documovie "The Secret"? What have you heard of it?
Do you understand the Power of Suggestion---many religious leaders use it to their advantage.
Do you think when you die that God asks you what teligion you practiced while alive? God is all knowing--correct--then he already knows what and who you are way before you are even born.
Documentaries and movies and no fear of anything. It seems this discussion has stopped and turned into something else.
Name me some preachers who use the "power of suggestion"
It seem you think I am weak minded. Maybe I'm wrong, but could you clarify that for me?
God already knows what religion you practice. You practice the religion that everything is God and God is everything (at least that's how I see it). What I don't understand is how if everything is in God and God in everything why is there so much hurt and evil in the world today?
Yeah I noticed that no one else is responding too. I came across this today in my e-mail and thought that you might like to read it:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080702/od_nm/mushroom
Sir Dent said: What I don't understand is how if everything is in God and God in everything why is there so much hurt and evil in the world today?
Lady says: Becaue there is this thing tht most religions don't pay much attention too and that is FREE WILL and The Law of Attraction----"The Secret".
I don't think that you are weak minded. What did I say to point to that?
You are correct that God is everything and everything is god---including us humans, and Jesus says so and I keep pointing tht out. It is how YOU as an individual understand tht not what someone else understand that and tells you that is how YOU should understand that.
So even if a rapist rapes because of freewill he is still in God? That would make God a rapist. I just can't buy it sorry.
Yopu didn't say I was weak minded. That's just how I read some of your comments. As I stated above, it just seemed that way to me but maybe I was wrong.
Anyway "SirDent chest bumps LG"
LOL to the chest bump!!!
The Law of Attraction is what is working on the Rapist. Forgiveness is what God wants --yes this is taking on a new direction, I see.
You can't have all good and no bad--it doesn't work that way and whose to say anythingis bad and anything is good. If that rapist got the person to be stronger becasue of it then whose to say that the rape was totally bad. If the event got the person who was being raped to awaken--how can that be all bad. Sorry I now what I am talking about with this rape thing. God is IN the Rapist --the Rapist isn't IN God!
So is the the EVOLUTION of Religion?...coming to knowing what FREE WULL is and what it isn't Can religion evolve? I think it has too and people need to accept that--Time and events do not allow us to go backwards.....we can only go forward.
You have one thing right. God does indeed want to forgive. God does have a requirement for forgiveness though. One must accept it the way that He intends it to be.
Only going forward doesn't make sense to me either. There are always hills and valleys. Sometimes the hills get slick and we slide back down them.
"SirDent wrestles with LG"
I just went thru many of the older posts. Are you trying to say that the 60s heralded in sin? Are you for real???? By the way, drugs and drink have been a part of most cultures in the world - both for healing and for pleasure. Ah well, guess you'll call all that sin too!
"Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye."
Good post Trixie.
To Sir Dent:
In the Bible Jesus tells us that ye are gods and to live as such. How can we live like Gods and then not at the same time--doesn't make sense. God wants to fogive but we must forgive ourselves for him to do that because we are part of him not apart from him. We can never be apart from him--ever. That is what the whole thing with the ressurection was about. Jesus came to tell us that we are part of the whole and we can never not be part of that whole and therefore whatever each part does becomes part of that whole. He said it very plainly in Corinthians when he was telling everyone that all the members, whaterver they may be, are part of one--God or the Universe--or even the Genie in Aladdin's Lamp. Drugs and drink and everything else he also goes to say is OK if one does it in Moderation. It is the person whom takes advantage and goes beyond his self is when it becomes not OK. There is no Satan or Devil that does this--it is the person's responsibility for himself--period. It is all in the Law of Attraction.
Trixie, did you read the article first? If not you should. What I wrote in the article was about the big resurgence of the New Age Religion during the 60s. Drugs played a key role in that.
LG, what that says is simply, ye are judges.
SirDent said: LG, what that says is simply, ye are judges.
LG Says:
Exactly we are the judges of our selves--our own actions play in the role of what we bring back to ourselves. Judge not lest you jusge yourself!
Yes SirDent, I did read your post. J
For centuries, drugs and drink lived in peaceful co-existence with mankind. As long as there is moderation, life goes on as it should, in perfect balance and harmony. Anything in excess however, brings about a tilt in that balance and that’s what sets off the alarm bells in every facet of our existence. I do not believe in excesses – not drink, not drugs, not so called religion. The only excess I feel the Universe looks kindly on is LOVE. I wonder how many Christians practice that. Isn’t that why Christ came into the world? Are we so busy looking to see who has erred that we turn our back on love for our fellowmen and indulge in the excesses of judgmental condemnation and searing hatred for our fellow beings? Who gives us the right to put ourselves above others?
The evolution of religion should, necessarily and logically have gone from the dark ages of the Inquisition and the Crusades to the light of the 20th and the 21st centuries. To a time when there were no schisms and divides – when we stopped seeing through a glass darkly and unleashed the power of love not just on the world but on the universe. This was what the great writers of the world envisaged, Huxley included. Whether it was a Utopia, an Atlantis, a Shangri-La, what people who rose above the pettiness of the world were dreaming about was a land of love and peace. Yes, it looks like that will happen only with the Second Coming. How many of us are prepared for the life of love beyond? Love, like everything else, needs practice, wouldn’t you say?
PS: You said, “A truly devout Christian would never smoke pot.” By the same token, shouldn’t he be saying No to tea and coffee as well? J
Sir Dent,
I enjoy your research and deep subjects. They really get everyone thinking and involved. It is sad that so many people want proof that God exists. If you look hard enough, you can see Him everywhere. By the air we breath, the trees and flowers we see, the tiny insects, so many different birds .... from Hummingbird's (the tiniest bird) to the soaring Eagle, each different animal, cows, horses, dogs, cats, and on and on it goes. No way can one explosion create all of the living creatures on this earth with their many different intelligences. Anyway, I can go on and on but will end this by saying .... great job explaining The Beginning.
God bless you always, Laurie
Thanks you Laurie for your comment. I appreciate the encouragement you gave me here.
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Shirley Anderson says:
18 months ago
Sir Dent - well written, but I hope I can make a couple of comments, and ask a question or two.
I did not know that God ever felt regret. I had to read that twice because it surprised me. It's thrown me off a little, actually, because I thought God was perfection. You have given me something to think about with that.
You know I love you, but I don't worship fire or poles, or anything remotely like that. Was that the ancient beginnings of New Age? Although, "New Age" seems to cover a very wide spectrum of definition.
Another question: is self-realization the polar opposite of self-denial? Perhaps I'm not understand your meaning (very possible!). My take is getting to know yourself is in direct opposition to denying yourself, I assume of earthly or material pleasures? Like I said, that was what first struck me, but perhaps I'm not in the right context.
You have certainly made me curious, SirDent. Good job!