Is astrology a science? Relation between astrology and astronomy.
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This Hub is an Answer to Jyoti's Posted Request
Astrology and palmistry are not sciences, they are methods of storytelling. The purpose of astrological storytelling (and palmistry) is for the reader to place the person being read within the context of the natural world in a creative way. Through the relationship between reader and client a story is told in which the client is the star and the astrologer is the narrator. That story places the client in the center of the Universe, just like those signs at the mall that say:
- You are here
Astronomy is a 'hard' science, meaning it is one of the original sciences. It uses observation, reductionism, math, and presumptions about physical causes and their effects in order to learn about planets and stars and their physical nature and movements. It is a very ancient science.
To participate in the science of astronomy one must accept the role of an objective observer; that is, an observer who is separate and detached from the universe being observed. To participate in the mythic tradition of astrology or palmistry, one accepts the interconnectedness of all things and the impossibility of detached observation of anything.
Both astronomy and astrology require extensive training.
To be a good astronomer you need to be logical, patient, and have very good skills at math and physics. An advanced degree in astronomy is required from an accredited university. Science is fiercely competitive, so to do astronomy professionally you have to be very good at it and very persistent.
To be a good astrologer it helps to be intuitive and a natural storyteller, but you also have to have a good memory and know some basic geometry. Much study is involved, but most accredited colleges have no astrology courses and certainly no astrology degrees. You can learn astrology through reading and/or from a mentor, and also from years of practice at creating charts and readings.
The Indian form of astrology, Vedic Astrology, is even older than the science of astronomy and does have formal programs you can enter if you wish to learn and practice it. You have to be Hindu. Ususally you will have a mentor or guru who guides you through the formal instruction and practice.
Having said these things about the differences between astronomy and astrology, I do want to say that I don't think the two disciplines address the same issues at all, and so they are not really at odds with each other even though they are always presented as being opposites. Astronomers tend to be embarassed that astrology even still exists, and so they take pains to separate themselves from astrologers and to discredit everything connected to astrology. Astrology is not a science! Astrology is bogus! Yada yada yada.
Well, no of course astrology isn't a science, who is really saying that it is? I don't think most astrologers would even say that.
So What's the Big Fight All About?
It's a philosophical thing.
Astrology has roots in alchemy, a medieval science that concerned itself with turning gross metals into gold, but also employed a complex network of psychological symbols and formulas that described inner, not outer, life. Alchemy was very much a form of magical practice, which for awhile enjoyed the status of being a legitimate science.
After Descartes (Mr. I Think Therefore I Am) that whole alchemy business became damned embarrassing. Alchemy was discredited to make way for a science (astronomy) that was based on the Cogito or, that is, on the idea of human consciousness as a detached observer of the material world.
Ever since then, scientists have been very touchy and hyper-reactive to anything that smacks of magic, alchemy, or ritual storytelling.
In my view, these scientists should just calm down and knock it off. I mean they won, right? So Jesus Christ almighty calm down and just do your astronomy and relax, you know? But no, they're still all upset about it. I guess you could say that scientists are poor winners.
I hope this answers your question, Jyoti.
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Comments
wow. Thank you for very interesting hub!
As always, I am amazed at the breadth of your knowledge. I quite agree with your take on the non-relational aspect of the science and the art. One has nothing to do with the other and both are useful in their own way. Peaceful co-existence should not be a problem.
I agree about the storytelling angle. My line about astrology (and tarot and palmistry etc) is that they are "hooks to hang your thoughts on". Mind you what astrology and astronomy share is an awareness of the stars and their positions, and astronomy DOES still use some astrological mapping terms, such as the signs of the zodiac.
Thank you everyone, for reading this! It was one of those posted hub requestions, so I jumped into it.
CJ I like that "hooks to hand your thoughts on," that's very good. And yes, you are right, I did forget the bit about astronomy using some the mapping terms while damning the source. So touchy they are/
Glycodoc, thank you for your comment, I think yours is the conventional view of the topic. All I want to point out here in this hub is that making facts more valuable than stories is a judgment, not a statement of what is real. That judgment is so deeply ingrained in our culture that we never question or think of it as a choice that should be questioned. For instance, the opposite of 'a fact' is not 'a lie'. It simply is not the case that anything that is not a fact, or is not based on facts, is an untruth. Poetry is not factual but no one disputes its value, for example.
You know you should be a professional writer. I could just read your stuff all day. I like that above about stories and facts. It's obviously something that you've really thought about, one of those truths that, once you hear it, you wonder why you didn't know it all along. I'm looking forward to your "evolution of religion" hub when you get back from your sister's in Indiana.
Good run at this request Pgrundy. That stuff about Vedic astrology was particularly cool. Only thing I would toss at you is that part about needing a degree to do astronomy. You only need to read and be able to do the math (and have a good telescope obviously). A degree might get you access to the fancier equipment is all, and even then, if you can make some new observations and get them published and peer reviewed, you might not need one at that.
As always, fantastically written. You do write well.
Shadesbreath, that is so true about amateur astronomy--I didn't think of it when writing this but clearly you are quite right. Thank you!
CJStone, thank you, that means a lot coming from you. Yes, I have spent a large part of my life thinking about unusual things, but that's kind of a drawback too. I mean, for every person like you who thinks what I have to say is interesting there are 8 or 9 who seem to think I'm the spawn of Satan.
Still, I would love to be able to write on these topics more and actually get paid for it. Most of my paid work is on finance and marketing (yawn). Sometimes I get to write about athlete's foot or something like that for money. I am looking forward to starting the religion hub too--I'm so tired of fundamentalist bullies who lie about history. My sister is doing better by the way--I drove down this afternoon, just got back. What a scare. It looks now like she will pull through.
Having studied astrology and tarot they are storytelling in a since you get out of them what suits you.
Thanks for answering my request and giving a different angle but there is a connection between astronomy and astrology. All astrologers in India calculates positions of celestial bodies as per astronomy and then predict the future or present status.
Thanx,
jyoti
Very well written hub and interesting as well; you should check out this site although it might shock you a bit at first:) http://www.goroadachi.com/etemenanki/
Hi again, I am writing a sci fi novel, thankyou for giving me a better understanding of this subject.
Pam, I missed this one (could be the whole time zone thing and the way I do hubpages). But I have to interject to a degree. There is a major link between the two that is never discussed, firstly because astronomers have no idea how to, and astrologers have no idea they should know. Know what? A good astrologer must never separate their craft from what is above their heads - ie the night sky. This is why allot of astrologers are not taken seriously. Astrology is an ancient craft and in ancient times - Plato and Aristotle, there was a more sentient knowledge. The energies of the astral world (stars) were tangible, ie felt and the seers of the day knew how to interpret from the energies they felt and studied. This I understand is the first understanding of the connection between astrological influence on the psyche - psychology in todays language. I must write a hub on this myself. Secondly astronomers have no interest in a sentient knowledge, a feeling knowledge. It is all math and vision (hard science). The art of being able to sense the energies is not thought of, let alone considered to be possible. This knowledge of and ability to feel what is emitted tangibly is also lost on modern day astrologers. Shame the astrologer who has no understanding of astronomy.
Hi Jewels--I wrote this so long ago, I think it was one of my earliest hubs. It was an answer to a posted question. I agree with what you say here, but rereading the hub I see I don't really say what you say explicitly though I think it is implied. I would love it if you wrote a hub on what you say here!
I am always struck by how defensive hard science is, and I am a fan of science, I'm not one of those people who thinks evil science is ruining the world. I do think scientific knowledge is only one form of knowledge though, and when it comes to astronomy and astrology they operate in different realms in many ways, though on the surface they seem to both be about planets and stars.
Storytelling used to be a sacred practice. Today it is a form of entertainment. Like all the old ways that dealt with energy and transformation directly, storytelling has been degraded and trivialized. It's a great loss and has thrown the world badly out of whack, IMO. Thanks for your insightful commentary. :)
Hard science is very defensive, and like you I love the fact that science is in our lives, but to overrule everything is not in our best interests. Similarly, to live in myths and legends does no real service to a progressive mind and a transformative existence. Bridging the two in this era though is quite difficult. Can understand why cultures are hanging on for grim death to their 'dream time' story telling, there is the core of great knowledge and wisdom in them.
Hi Jewels--Yes, it's like we've become unmoored or something, everything is in runaway mode now.
glycodoc says:
18 months ago
Interesting hub - I think that the BIG difference between Astronomy and Astrology is that Astronomy is based on facts and Astrology is not.