Jesus Prophet of God, Not Son of God
78Growing up, religion was our main focus. Unlike today's world which is all focused on worldly things. I was introduced to Issa(Jesus), through the Quran. His story touched me, and taught me alot about the world we live in. I viewed Issa to be the same as Mohamed, a prophet of Allah. I believed in his messages,his book, and the fact that he had no father.
We believe that Jesus (called 'Isa in Arabic) was the son of Mary, and was conceived without the intervention of a human father. The Qur'an describes that an angel appeared to Mary, to announce to her the "gift of a holy son" (19:19). She asked: "How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?" (19:20). When the angel explained to her that she had been chosen for the service of God, and that God had ordained the matter, she devoutly submitted herself to His will.
Years later, after my first understanding of the life of Jesus, I found out that to some, jesus was the "son of God". This idea, totally contradicts my previous teaching of Islam Monotheism. Not only that, but it also turns christianity into a polotheisic religion since there is more than one figure to worship.
I believe in the bible, but I don't believe Issa(Jesus), was son of God. Therefore, to avoid being biased, I researched the bible briefly. I was astonished to see the revelations that proof Issa to be no more than a prophet. "Thou shalt worship the lord,thy God; And him only shalt thou serve" Mathew 4:10. This shows that Issa wanted his people to worship none other than god, not in conjunction with the Son of God.
Based on the biblical term "Son of God, it refered to any god fearing righteous person. Both in the Old and New Testament. "Blessed are the peace-makers, for they shall be called the CHILDREN OF GOD" Mathew 5:9. In Mathew 5:45 --"That ye may be children of your Father which is in heaven. Even Issa himself warned his people of what in Islam is refered to as shirk(Polytheism.) He said in Mathew 7:21 "Not everyone that sayeth unto me (Jesus), Lord Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doeth the will of my father, which is in heaven"
Finaly, the term Father, is used for God numerous place in the bible. It is never used exclusively for Jesus. It wouldn't make sense that if Jesus was god or part of God, that he would pray. And he prayed to god. "And when he has sent the multitudes away, he went up into a mountain apart to pray..."
Again and Again, I find more reasons to believe the bible reveals Jesus as prophet, not son of god. In Mather 23:8 " And when the chief priests and pharisees had heard his parable, they perceived that he spoke of them. But when they sought to lay hands on him, they feared the multitude because they took him for a PROPHET"
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We are all children of God.
no its not real we are all the son of adam not god god dont have childrens he creat us and god who named ALLAH he is not married he dont have childrens he is the biggest 1 in the world
I wondered this myself, why people were saying that Jesus is God, when Jesus says all the time, to have no other God other than God the creator of Heaven and Earth (everything), I think that I read in the Qua'ran that, God will close the ears and eyes of many, and I guess I believe that because I don't understand why it is so clearly stated by Jesus, yet the understanding seems to go over their heads. But one time I told my brother, I said: Jesus isn't God, he said, yes he is, I said, but Jesus said he is not God. He said: Sandy, son of God, means soul of God.
So while Jesus is not God, I fully understand this, no question about it, but...Jesus, has the heart of God, the essense of God (Allah)'s mercy and forgiveness. With that in mind, I always say Thank you God (Allah) for Issa (Jesus). I am sorry I don't know much about Mohomad, but I am sure he came with the same message, either way, Glory be to God (Allah) (Elohim)(Yaweh)(Jahova) or any other way you say God.
This question is for everyone in here to seriously ponder. If you died tonight and God asked you: "Why should I let you into my heaven?".
What would your answer be?
Think about it
I clearly agree.
I believe that Jesus was a prohet. But he was not son of God. He can't be called " Son of God" because it is clearly stated in one of the ten commandments in the holy bible, "thou shall not have any other gods before me, thou shall not worship or pray to any other gods before me." This for me means that we should only be praying to God. I'm not saying that Jesus did not exist because I believe he did. But just like in the Koran and Muslim belief, Mohammed was an important prophet just like jesus is for the Christians. And Allah for the Muslims is their god. Just how Catholics believe in God. I think that we should be praying to God, or Allah, which ever you believe in. And we should just respect Jesus and Mohammed. But none Jesus or Mohammed are Gods themselves. They were and stilll are just important Prophets or Messiahs how ever you call them.
On the other hand, the Jewish religion they are still waiting for their Anoited one, for their Messiah. They do not consider Mohammed or Jesus as the messengers of God.
So i just believe that we should respect the Prohets, Messiahs, and only pray to one God.
Thanks for your input Franse! Am glad you understand where I am coming from...
I believe that this thought pattern is a contradiction. Just because some of the chief priests thought he was a prophet doesn't mean that they had any understanding of his truely divine sonship with the father.
I also find it hard to believe that anyone could think that he was a prophet of God and not the son of God. He either was a false prophet or he was the son of God. He was either the son of God or he was insane. There is no middle ground.
You say that you believe in the bible but ignore the fact that it is repleate with the message that Jesus is the Christ, The Messiah, the deliverer, the only begotten Son of God in the flesh, the prince of peace, the king of kings, the savior of the world, the great mediator and advocate with the father, the only name under heaven by which men are saved from death and hell; the light and the life, the bread of eternal glory, lord of the sabbath, the good shepard, the holy one of Israel, the mighty one of Jacob, King of the Jews, and the great Jehovah.
This and much more is professed in the bible concerning one Jesus Christ.
James, I disagree with you. And the reasons of my disagreement are mentioned above. You, disagree with me.....however your reasons are personal....not factuall. So, instead of wasting several paragraphs of repetitiveness...all you had to do was show me facts based on scriptures. There is no God, but allah, Mohamed,Jesus,Moses and Abraham are few of his messengers. God has no children, wife or any affilliation with his creations, other than for them to obey him. Jesus, the miracle son of Mariam was product of gods creation.....and also special messenger who will return one day, to rest all arguments in this sphere.
Do you believe in the Holy spirit?
Nope, I dont think there is a such thing. I only believe that GOD is one, and his messenger(i.e. Jesus,Mohamed), as great as they were, they were human beings, special human beings.....sent to address the rest of us. No holy spirit!
It seems to me that you only believe the parts of the bible that support the teachings of mohamed. So what of the commishioning of the apostles of Jesus? He gave them the authority to seal in heaven the things that are sealed on earth and to loose in heaven the things that are loosed on earth. He left with them the comforter. It isn't narrated by others, it is written by the apostles they were eye whitness accounts of the life of Jesus Christ unlike Mohamed, didn't he live long after the resurection of Christ?
WELL, WE ARE NOT DISAGREEING JOHN ON WHETHER YOUR CURRENT BIBLE SAYS THAT. THE BIBLE HAS BEEN RE-WRITTEN SO MANY TIMES, THAT I DONT EVEN BELIEVE THERE IS ANY PURITY. I COMPLETELY DISAGREE WITH THE BIBLE AT ITS CURRENT STATUS. I DONT DISAGREE WITH THE BOOK OF JESUS....AND I ALSO DONT BELIEVE THAT JESUS WAS RESURECTED. YES MOHAMED WAS AFTER JESUS...MOHAMED WAS THE LAST PROPHET SENT TO MANKIND.
How are you so certain that he was the last prophet ever? Don't you think that God would have spoken to his children since then?
God speaks to us all the time.,through his creations, miracles, disaster and all that good stuff. And am certain that he was the last holy prophet. messenger of god., because Jesus is just returning to finish his mission....therefore he is not the last prophet. He will however be the last prophet to have died upon his return and completion of his objective.
I believe that there have been more prophets, even those who have seen Jesus standing on the right hand of God. But the world always rejects a true prophet untill after his sojourn. the thing about the holy spirit I believe is, if a person saw a miracle they wouldn't know without that spirit, they would be left to wonder weather or not God spoke to them. And the bible truely testifies of this. You still believe in the bible right?
Issa Jesus is without a doubt the son of Mary, and a prprphet of god. God does not need a human figure that he created himself to conceive a human baby and call him his son. It's a no no.
Jesus never said he was God or part of God or part yet full God
I agree with you Joseph, He never said he was god, or part of god. Therefore, he can't be the "son-of god".
It does not appear from the gosples that Jesus frequently refered to himself as the son of God (but see Matthew 27:43, Luke 22:70, John 5:25; 9:35-37; 10:36; 11:4) Though we often find it used by others speaking to him (eg., Matt. 14:33; 16:16; Luke 4:41; John 1:49; 11:27) and of him (Mark 1;1; John 3:18; 20:31). But there is ample proof that he claimed to be the son of God that was true to him and of no one else (eg.,Matt 11:27 Luke 10:22; Mark 13:32) He speaks of himself as son of God and others as sons of God, but there is not a single passage in which the sonship of others is spoken of as being the same thing as his own. so too he speaks of "my father" and "your father", but never of "our father." (The lords prayer is no exception as it was intended for deciples use.) There is a consistancy in scripture, ancient and modern, that Jesus Christ is litteraly the son of God the father in the flesh.
Should I believe the Bible when it says that there will be no more prophets until Elijah? returns, which signals, basically, the end of the world. ? Should I take Mohamad as the person that will woo many people into following him in the end days?
Or should I not accept the apocalyptic book and take Mohamad as a prophet, a holy man?
My questions are:
What do I do about my nonbelief of anything written or verbal? I simply don't believe in the circular reasoning that people try to impose on you to believe the Bible nor the Koran. What do I base my search on then? I’m basing it off of my gut and mind, which, are both fallible. I guess the answer is pray for guidance.
Why couldn't Mohamed be a prophet? His behavior wasn’t exactly what I consider holy, to begin with, but let’s just say that one can argue that it was all in cultural and historical context, what other reasons are there?
Why is God more Jesus' father than mine?
Well, let me start first of all by thanking all of you, for giving your time and input on this discussion. Secondly, we all have believes(faiths).,opinions, thoughts etc.,and I value and respect. In the holly Quran koran, allah does not tell us to impose anything on anybody.,instead he tells us to agree on our disagreement.
Surah 109. The Disbelievers, Atheists
1. Say : O ye that reject Faith! 2. I worship not that which ye worship, 3. Nor will ye worship that which I worship. 4. And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship,5. Nor will ye worship that which I worship. 6. To you be your Way, and to me mine.
Therefore, to say that I, or anyone part of this discussion, is imposing their ideas on others, is a false statement. Secondly, I dont believe what the christians today call the "bible".,am not saying its not true....but distorted. The only reason that I had used the bible for this subject, was to avoid being biased. And if you really think you've got what it takes to see things from different perspective, then I suggest you explore around.
Finally, Mohamed(Peace Be Upon Him)., was a holly prophet and the last one sent by god. For someone with such a limited understanding of Islam, its easy for them bad mouth the prophet. See, its ok to differ from him....but to say "His behavior wasn’t exactly what I consider holy"., suggest that you know him well. But I doubt that you've read well enough.....perhaps you only read whats been written about him by others not even from the same faith as him. In which case you are chosing to be biased. Read the writtings(Hadith) of people who were around him(Desciples etc.), not something written hundreds of years later. And finally,believing in something is better than unthoughtfull questioning of all things. Dont ask me why are rocks in the mountains bigger than those in the valley?Ask me which one best suits your goal!
Let me clarify:
Firstly, about my distrust of anything written: I believe that there's spiritual truth in the bible, even if the bible has been adulterated. I read it all of the time looking for spiritual growth, and I do find myself closer to God bc I'm seeking Him and use the bible and what I learn about how He wants us to behave as my guide. And I know what it says about the end days.... but is that one of the books that I should believe? the apocalypse? I mean, knowing the history of the bible, I cannot always just agree with whatever I read in it.
Secondly, by no means am I an atheist. Actually, I want to be in the right way with God, so I'm looking. I'm reading. I'm struggling. I'm asking. I'm praying and it's been very difficult.
I don't want to be one of those people who believes in Mohamad, but doesn't know why, or who has a doubt because it conflicts with something they read in the bible. I want to be sure.
P.S. I didn't know about the Hadiths. I will look into those as well.
Apocalypse is the book I'm having difficulties with: again, it says that there will be no more prophets until Elijah returns and that's the end of the world, basically. It also speaks of a person that will woo many people into following him, and that could very well be Mohamed, who knows? I don't remember the details about this person by the Apocalyptic account, I'm no expert/teacher, and you're right, I don't know much about Mohamed, but I'm just beginning my real search.
Again: Is the Apocolypse one of those books that I should pay any attention to? There's quite a few things wrong with the Bible, the way it was put together, etc. How strong is that book in the bible's canon? How strong is each verse in this book? Could the book be referring to Mohamed?
In response to Onusonus, the phrase 'son of God' as used and understood by Jesus (pbuh) and his disciples meant nothing more than God's servant. It has nothing to do with the latter day orthodox Trinitarian interpretation that saw it in a radically different theological light that was alien to Jesus' teachings.
Check out this scholarly work by Dr. Laurence B. Brown, ‘The First & Final Commandment: A Search for Truth in Revelation Within the Abrahamic Religion’ for further elucidation. Alternatively, you can also visit this website:
am not one to believe in the trinitarian view of Christ either, there is a distinct seperation of the two, where God is the supreme govenor of the universe and father of all mankind, he has a tangible body made of flesh and bone seperate from Christ, When one speaks of God it is generally the father who is refered to and all mankind are his childeren. The personage known as Jehova from Old Testament times and who is usually identified as lord in the OT, is the son who is also a God. Jesus works under the direction of the father and is in complete harmony with him. all mankind are brothers and sisters with him, Him being the olsdest of the spirit children of God
I have a wrench to throw into this discussion. Muslims believe Muhammad to have been the prophet like Moses that was raised up. Now we know from the Old Testament scriptures that Moses talked to God face to face. Muhammad receive his visions and words from an angel.
The two are not alike in any way shape or form.
If you would read the Bible and see in the spirit, you will see Jesus in the Garden of Eden as the tree of life. Jesus is God manifest in the flesh to "SHOW" the way to man. God doesn't just "TELL US" anything. He always "REVEALS."
Jesus did supernatural healings. He had the abiltity to read the thoughts of man. Muhammad had a way of organizing men and encouraging them to believe him. Not one man was healed by Muhammad. Not one eye opened. Not one thought read.
How absolutely interesting the symbolism of the tree of live Sir Dent, do you think then that the tree of knowledge of good and evil is a representation of the holy spirit?
I haven't really thought that far on it Onus. I believe it to have been knowledge fro sure. The Bible says "Knowledge puffs up." I will have to meditate and study on that for a bit really.
Sir Dent! I like how you have all your facts when it comes to Mose (pbuh) and Issa(pbuh), and they are true facts. Both of these extraordinary men possesed powers, one had the magic to heal, while the other surprised all those who practiced witchcraft. And so did Mohamed.,although Mohamed didnt directly communicate with Allah, he was extraordinary in his own ways. During Moses time, people practiced witchcraft in all its form....and thats why it was necessary for him to posses those powers in order to save them and show them the truth. Mohamed on the other hand.,arrived at a different coast, different circumstance. He came to a poetic society, who highly respected a piece of well crafted poem. Thus, if you look at quran, and you are able to understand arabic...you will be astonished by its poetic sense...it impossible for a human being to have such content together.,so one can conclude that it take a special person to deliver that message. Am talking verse for verse, chapter for chapter, down to the accents. Its the same reason why Quran is the only book thus far have not been distorted. I remember one story where an accent of a word was changed in a book, and left at some Madrasa.....and when one of the scholars decide to recite the book noticed of the change. Now am not saying that there isnt misinterpretation of the book...,but the content and understanding how it was delivered is miraculous. So yes, Mohamed(Peace Be Upon Him), was not only the last prophet but also uniquelly extraordinary man Just like Issa son of Mariam(pbuh) and Musa(pbuh).
Jesus in Matthew 13:57 addresses himself as a prophet "AND THEY WERE OFFENDED IN HIM. BUT JESUS SAID UNTO THEM, A PROPHET IS NOT WITHOUT HONOR, SAVE IN HIS OWN COUNTRY, AND IN HIS OWN HOUSE"
Thanks for the addition Ghani!
yea i do agree with all that the koran says..and the revelation to jesus was as authentic n passed on the same message tht god is one,he only should b worshiped n tht mohamad,jesus and the others r his messengers n prophets..no where its written tht jesus refers himself as son of god or god himself!moreover its the new scriptures of the bible which has been completely faked thus diverting it from its initial message which is the same as the koran only to prove tht priests n popes were right..factually it became the word of man n no more word of god..as a matter of fact older are scriptures of the bible,more authentic it is,thus closer to the koran..and the spirit is no one else then the angle gabriel in charge of delivering the message of god to the prophets..tht was his duty..he cannot b place as a figure of divity in no way..he was a creature of god
Wow, Ahmad, thanks for the link, I was on vacation and didn't bring my laptop so haven't been on the forum nor saw your email. Thanks, I think this is precisely what I'm looking for. Will write soon.
Thanks Ahmed! I've learned alot from the link you provided, and will urge anyone who still has questions to visit it.
Jesus Christ is God Incarnate
"...they shall call his name EMMANUEL, which being interpreted is, GOD WITH US."
--MATTHEW 1:23"...if ye believe not that I am he,ye shall die in your sins."--JESUS CHRIST, JOHN 8:24
Proofs from the word of God, The Authorized King James Bible of 1611
NOT NIV, NKJV, NASB, TLB, RSV, et al--they corrupt this precious truth.They are part of a ghastly array ofhundreds of Satanic modern-day Bibles.
GodJesusGod never changes.Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
Jesus never changes.Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
God is the only Saviour."I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour." Isaiah 43:11
To the only wise God our Saviour... Jude 1:12
God our Saviour. Titus 2:10
...we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour. I Timothy 4:10
God my Saviour. Luke 1:47
Jesus is the only Saviour....the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. 1 John 4:14
...our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. II Peter 3:18
...God and our Saviour Jesus Christ. II Peter 1:1
...the Christ, the Saviour of the world. John 4:42
...the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour. Titus 1:4
a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. Luke 2:11
Neither is there salvation in any other (than Jesus): for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. --Acts 4:12
...salvation... is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. --2 Timothy 2:10
...captain of their salvation [Jesus] perfect through sufferings. -- Heb 2:10
[Jesus]...author of eternal salvation... -- Heb 5:9
GodJesusGod created the universe and earth by Himself.I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself. Isaiah 44:24
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1
Jesus Christ created the universe and the earth.[U]nto the Son he saith...Thou, LORD, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands. Hebrews 1:10
[B]y him (Jesus) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth...all things were created by him, and for him. Colossians 1:16
All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made. John 1:3
GodJesusGod is the Word.In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God John 1:1
Jesus is the Word....the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us...John 1:14
GodJesusGod is the first and the last.
I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he. Isaiah 41:4
Jesus is the first and the last.
Jesus said, "Fear not; I am the first and the last:" Revelation 1:17
God JesusGod forgives sins.[T]he Lord..forgiveth all thine iniquities... Psalm 103:2-3
"[W]ho can forgive sins but God only?" Mark 2:7
Jesus forgives sins.Jesus...said..."Son, thy sins be forgiven thee." Mark 2:5
GodJesusGod is our redeemer.[T]hou, O LORD, art our father, our redeemer.. Isaiah 63:16
Jesus redeemed us.[T]the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ...gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity.. Titus 2:13-14
GodJesusGod is one.
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD. Deuteronomy 6:4
Jesus and God are one.
I and my Father are one. John 10:30
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...All things were made by him...He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not...And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us John 1:1, 3, 10, 14
Jesus saith...he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? John 14:9
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 1 John 5:7
God has a Son.
[T]he LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. Psalms 2:7
Jesus is God's Son.
... [Jesus] said also that God was his Father... John 5:18
God JesusGod is the Holy OnePsalms 71:22 I will also praise thee with the psaltery, even thy truth,O my God: unto thee will I sing with the harp, O thou Holy One of Israel.
Psalms 78:41 Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.
Psalms 89:18 For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.
Isaiah 10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, in truth.
Psalms 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (Messianic Psalm)
Jesus is the Holy One.Acts 2:27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
3:13-14 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
13:34-35 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption, he said on this wise, I will give you the sure mercies of David. Wherefore he saith also in another psalm, Thou shalt not suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
God JesusOnly God is worshipped.... Then saith Jesus unto him... Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. Matthew 4:10
Jesus is worshipped.While [Jesus] spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him... Matthew 9:18
And again, when [God] bringeth in the firstbegotten [Jesus] into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him. Hebrews 1:6
And Thomas answered and said unto [Jesus], My Lord and my God. John 20:28
GodJesusGod is Messiah....unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder...and his name shall be called... The mighty God, The everlasting Father... Isaiah 9:6
Jesus is Messiah.The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he. John 4:25-26
GodJesusGod is from everlasting.
The LORD reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the LORD is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved. Thy throne is established of old: thou art from everlasting. Psalms 93:1-2
Messiah Yeshua (Jesus) is from everlasting.
But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah...out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. Micah 5:2
God JesusOnly God is glorified.I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another... Isaiah 42:8
God glorified Jesus.And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. John 17:5
[A]ll men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. John 5:23
But unto the Son he [God] saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Hebrews 1:8
GodJesusGod is 'I am'.And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. Exodus 3:14
Jesus is 'I am'.Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. John 8:58
God hMr.Christ Follower.....Thanks for your research. However, you are yet to convince me that Jesus is the son of god. All your quotation show that "Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. John 8:58" Therefore proofing the point that Jesus is the prophet.,just like Abraham, Moses, etc before him were. "[W]ho can forgive sins but God only?" Mark 2:7 I mean, what does this show you?
Jesus’ name means God is Savior, Immanuel-God with us as our Savior. Mohammed's name means praised one Born about 4 BC. in Bethlehem Born of the Virgin Mary Isa.7:14 had no earthly father Mt.1 Born of Aminah In 570 A.D. in Mecca Raised by Mary His mother and Joseph, His adopted father . Raised by his mother, Halima the nurse, then his uncle and grandfather Prophesied by more than 300 scriptures for his first coming, fulfilled them all including Deut.18:15 Muslims believe Mohammed is prophesied as the Comforter. And the prophet of Deut.18:15 Labored as a carpenter like his stepfather in Nazareth His father was named Abd Allah after Allah. Started as a shepherd then became a camel-caravan leader Spoke in Hebrew, Aramaic, and probably Greek Spoke only Arabic, Muslims say he was illiterate Was literate, but wrote no books. He directly commissioned his dedicated followers to write and preach his message Was literate; and wrote the Quran or as some say others heard his sayings and wrote them down as well. Attracted multitudes by His teaching of God affirming the OT. Taught openly to multitudes as one having authority Attracted multitudes by his teaching and by the sword forcefully overthrowing the worship of multiple Gods. Miracles and healing’s were given freely, he healed all kinds of diseases. The Koran is his miracle. Did no miracles of healing or delivering people from demons. Moved to Capernaum because of rejection by His townspeople and brothers and sisters Had to move to Medina because of rejection by his townspeople Was never married Married to at least fifteen wives one of which was only 9 years old at the time. Lived a sinless life, never once prayed for forgiveness like other sinners, he forgave others. Prayed often for forgiveness of his sins as did all the prophets in the OT and NT. Waged no war, said his kingdom was not of this world so his followers should not fight Was a warrior who waged war by fighting or leading in sixty-six battles to spread his message of monotheism Ordered the death of no one but instead died in place of the guilty. Ordered the death of many men and women (the first was a poetess) to promote the message of monotheism Established a religion of truth, mercy and love even for enemies, invites all to come to him. Established a monotheistic belief system,an earthly empire teaching all must obey the teachings of the Koran. Established a relationship with God and a spiritual kingdom not of this world that will last forever with him as the ruler. Established a religion of God being compassionate and merciful to the obedient but there are no guarantees for anyone. Died by crucifixion for others in Jerusalem at age 33 being innocent of any crime. Died in Medina due to effects of pneumonia at age 62 Arose from the dead the third day just like he predicted, emptying His tomb, promises to raise everyone else and judge them. Still lingers in his grave awaiting the Day of Judgment by Jesus Jesus is mentioned in the Quran 97 times Mohammed is mentioned in the Quran 25 times Old Testament predicts His 2nd coming in more Scriptures than his first Mohammed had only self fulfilling prophecy, nothing in the Old Testament predicted his coming. Over 1,500,000,000 claim to be His followers are known for their dedication, love, and caring for others. Building hospitals feeding the poor and helping to educate people all over the world showing the compassion of God. 1 billion are followers who are dedicated, zealous and still use force if necessary against non Muslims in their land where Islam is the countries religion. Christ prophesied of the end of the age and what it would be like when he comes again. The Old and New Testament will be fulfilled by his 2nd coming. There is no teaching on Mohammed coming back again to rule or reign.
I would like to add to this discussion. In neither of the four books of the Gospel (Matthew, Mark, Luke or John) does Jesus (PBUH) ever utter that he is God However, as for the term “son of god”, it is interesting to note that the term "son of God" is used in other parts of the Bible to refer to Adam (Bible: Luke 3:38), Israel (Bible: Exodus 4:22) and David (Bible: Psalms 2:7 as well. The creatures of God are usually referred to in the Bible as children of God.Furthermore, Matthew 27:46 tells us that about the ninth hour Jesus (PBUH) cried with a loud voice, saying, My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? (On a side note he says , “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” – Eli is pretty close to Allah, which is what the all Prophets called God.”) Anyway, for the person on the cross to utter these words, shows that there is a questioning of God and his action? There are two points to be had here.
· First, if Jesus is God, then why would he question himself aloud.
· Second if the man on the cross is Jesus, then as a messenger of God he should understand that God has destined things for us. And a questioning of the destiny is tantamount to disbelief. (Muslims don’t believe Jesus died.)
It is not that Muslims don’t accept the earlier revelations, it is that the written form of the Old and New Testament is authored by man with numerous changes, errors and contradictions. In fact the Gospel according to Luke starts out as follows: “Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us, 2 Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; 3 It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus.” This statement is basically saying that since others have written about the subject of Jesus (PBUH), than I to will write about Jesus (PBUH) as I believe I understand things correctly. This despite never meeting him. Thus, Luke is writing based on what he learned for others. But who did he learn from?Early Christian views varied with some tending to believe in Jesus’ divinity while others seeing him a prophet of God. It wasn’t until the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD that the concept of the Trinity was identified as God in the fullest sense, literally 'of the same substance, essence or being', hence in the further wording of the Creed. Some early followers of Jesus (PBUH), who authored the Gospel of Q, starting 50 CE, don’t appear to be aware of the resurrection of Jesus (PBUH). They did not mention the event in their writings. Furthermore, the Gnostics believe that prior to crucifixion Jesus (PBUH) swapped bodies with someone else. They write about this in the “The Acts of John” (circa 50 CE.) These writings were followed by many early Christian groups in the early years of the Christian church. The document was later suppressed by the church in the 8th century CE. In the writing, the disciple John flees from the execution to a mountain top and is amazed to meet Jesus (PBUH) on the mountain top while the crucifixion is going on. The author writes, "...we were like men amazed or fast asleep, and we fled this way and that. And so I saw him suffer, and did not wait by his suffering, but fled...and wept at what had come to pass. And when he was hung upon the cross...there came a darkness over the whole earth. And my Lord stood in the middle of the cave and gave light to it and said, 'John, for the people below in Jerusalem I am being crucified and pierced with lances and reeds and given vinegar and gall to drink. But to you I am speaking...I put into your mind to come up to this mountain so that you may hear what a disciple should learn from his teacher and a man from God." The notion of Jesus as son of God is something that was established under the influence of Paul of Tarsus (originally named Saul). Paul never met Jesus. In fact he was called Saul the persecutor and was an enemy, but later became a disciple, after the departure of Jesus (PBUH). Later, however, he initiated a number of changes into early Christian teachings. Paul is considered by a number of Christian scholars to be the father of Christianity due to his additions of the following ideas: o that Jesus is the son of God, o the concept of Atonement, o the renunciation of the Law of the Torah. Paul did these things in hopes of winning over the Gentiles (non-Jewish people). His letters are another of the primary sources of information on Jesus according to the Christian tradition. In Acts there are accounts of Peter opposing Paul on some of these topics. Nevertheless, Paul changed the law despite the following from Matthew 5:17-19 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.” My point is that there was much confusion in the early years of Christianity. Thus, I wonder which belief influenced Luke’s writings as well as the other writers of the Gospel. Since the Bible is written by man it is fallible with many mistakes and contradictions. One such contradiction is in Numbers 23:19 says “God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?”, yet someone still consider Jesus as the son of God? and then in John 3:16 speak of a begotten son. Another point of confusion is the different accounts of Judas’ death in Matthew and the Acts of the Apostles. There are many more that I could list. On the other hand I would like to share with you some info on the Quran. I got this from an article written Yusef Estes (A devout Christian parishioner who accepted Islam as the way of life)The Quran contains clear statements from Almighty God (Allah) and it is Him speaking to all of us in the first person. He tells of us our own creation, the creation of all that is the universe and what has happened to those before us and what is to become of us if we do not take heed of the warnings clearly spelled out in His Revelation. He speaks also to Muhammad, peace be upon him, to show that Muhammad, peace be upon him, is not making this up himself and even chastises Muhammad, peace be upon him, for making human assumptions rather than waiting for revelation in matters (i.e.; surah At-Tahreem and surah Abasa). Quran Mentions Itself The Quran refers to itself as "The Quran" (The Recitation) and mentions that it is to all mankind and jinn (another creation of Allah, similar to humans in that they could make choices as to whether or not they would obey God's Commandments, and they existed before humans). Quran Describes God's Nature Exactly The Quran is clear on who God is and who He is not. There is no room left for doubt after reading the Quran in the Arabic language: God is One. He is the only Creator, Sustainer and Owner of the Universe. He has no partners. He has no relatives; wives, childrREST OF PREVIOUS POST
On the other hand I would like to share with you some info on the Quran. I got this from an article written Yusef Estes (A devout Christian parishioner who accepted Islam as the way of life)The Quran contains clear statements from Almighty God (Allah) and it is Him speaking to all of us in the first person. He tells of us our own creation, the creation of all that is the universe and what has happened to those before us and what is to become of us if we do not take heed of the warnings clearly spelled out in His Revelation. He speaks also to Muhammad, peace be upon him, to show that Muhammad, peace be upon him, is not making this up himself and even chastises Muhammad, peace be upon him, for making human assumptions rather than waiting for revelation in matters (i.e.; surah At-Tahreem and surah Abasa). Quran Mentions Itself The Quran refers to itself as "The Quran" (The Recitation) and mentions that it is to all mankind and jinn (another creation of Allah, similar to humans in that they could make choices as to whether or not they would obey God's Commandments, and they existed before humans). Quran Describes God's Nature Exactly The Quran is clear on who God is and who He is not. There is no room left for doubt after reading the Quran in the Arabic language: God is One. He is the only Creator, Sustainer and Owner of the Universe. He has no partners. He has no relatives; wives, children or offspring. He is not like His creation and He does not need it for His existence, while all the time the creation is totally dependent on Him. His attributes are clearly spelled out as the epitome of each and every one. He is for instance, the All-Knowing; the All-Hearing; the All-Seeing; the All-Forgiving; the All- Loving; the All-Merciful; the Only One God. There is never a contradiction to this found anywhere in the Quran. Quran Challenges Readers The Quran makes the clear challenge, that if you are in doubt about it - then bring a book like it. Also, to bring ten chapters like it and then finally, to bring one single chapter like it. 1,400 years - and no one has been able to duplicate it's beauty, recitation, miracles and ease of memorization. Another challenge for the unbelievers to consider; "If this (Quran) were from other than Allah, you would find within it many contradictions." And yet, another challenge offered by Allah in the Quran is for the unbelievers to look around for evidences. Allah says He will show them His signs within themselves and on the farthest horizons. Scientific Miracles in Quran The scientific miracles of the Quran could not have been understood at that time, yet today we take for granted the many things included in the revelation of the Quran. Some include mentioning: The formation of embryo in the womb of the mother (surah 98); deep seas partitions; waters that do not mix; clouds and how they make rain and how lightning is caused by ice crystals; formation of the earth's mountains deep underground; orbits of planets and stars and moons - and even the mention of space travel (surah 55:33)."Predicted in over 300 scriptures".,which all were re-edited version of the bible...whether its the old or new testament. Now listen, am not trying to compare Mohamed and Issa(peace be upon them). They both were great prophets of god.,each with their own experience, especial powers etc. The subject of the matter is, whether Jesus was a prophet or son. Thus far all evidence are pointing towards him being prophet. If you have a proof and can clearly(without being biased) be stated, then please enlighten me. However, going off subject, or confusing the subject for the sake of being argumentative wont accomplish nothing.
Jesus is not son of GOD.he is a messenger of GOD.normally it was happent like this because messenger came to the world becase GOD want guide them to truth but after Messenger die they people are calling GOD.There is only one GOD...GOD is super power not like...weekness..sleep and eat..or do...think about yourself.God given sense to think not like Animal.
i cannot belive the christians because issa was not the son of god but he was the prophet of Allah (S.A.W) HE NEVER HAD A MOTHER NEITHER A WIFE ,FATHER OR A CHILD.THE CHRISTIANS BELIVE THAT HE WAS THE SON OF GOD BUT THEY ARE WRONG.
I read a lot about God not having a wife throughout these comments. I have yet another question. Does your God need a wife in order to produce a son?
Mine doesn't need a wife for anything. He just has to say the word and a son is born to Him. The same power also allows God to be able to pour Himself into a body of flesh and live as men do, while yet maintaining His position in heaven. God can do anything, but fail.
SIR ,
Thanks for your time and input. Now, you are right. God doesnt need a wife. Neither does he need a son, daughter uncle or any by blood relationship. Now, see your god is my god. And our god makes things happen simply, therefore he doesnt need to live as his creation.
"The same power also allows God to be able to pour Himself into a body of flesh and live as men do, while yet maintaining His position in heaven. "
Now, I hold the same level of respect for your faith as I do for mine. But the idea that he has to pretend to be one of his own creation, doesnt sound theologically speaking sound.
*"God can do anything, but fail."- Sir Dent.
Amen! I 100% agree with you.
"Blessed are those who do not see but yet believe.."
The mystery of God, Son, and The Holy Spirit as three divine persons but one being is to complex for man's comprehension.
Try to comprehend this, "How can God Create something out of nothing" or How can we say that "God has NO Beginning and NO end"
In the world we live in, everything has a beginning, and everything has an end.
Have you seen God? Face to Face? Do you believe that we are created in his image and likeness? You haven't seen God but you believe that he exists.
I believe that God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are three divine persons but one being. That is part of God's mystery, part of His Greatness, part of Him being God.
With God nothing is impossible. You don't need to question if God can be in two places at the same time( Jesus here on earth while God in heaven), God is everywhere, even if it doesn't sound theologically right for you doesn't mean its impossible for God to do? He is The Almighty, and He understands that we can not comprehend everything that He can do. You search for proof that Jesus and God are one, but don't you get it? the fact that you can't find any proof is because nothing can prove They are One and The Same. Nothing in our world. Not even science.
You still ask me why I believe? and not question if Jesus is a prophet or God?
I don't need to doubt or question God. Who am I to do that?
I believe that there are 3 Divine Persons in One God because I have something called
FAITH...
u blokes there is nothing hard about this topic, Jesus is definitely is the Son of God, even God Jehovah says he is my only begotten son. But Jesus is not god at all and he never claims to be god or equal to god. Jesus mention so many times in the Bible that he is sent by he's father to do his will. Nothing so hard about this subject. But finally, Jesus is but the way to the truth, "I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the father except through me". U blokes, u just need to read your scriptures more carefully and with the power of the HOLY SPIRIT. The Bible is the word of god and not the Quean.
kindly read the intro of the gospel of John. thanks!
Dann,
Thanks for your input. I respect your opinion, however who wrote the gospel? When wast it written? How many years appart since Jesus' ? Basically, what I am trying to say is that the bible today I dont believe in. Everyone from the Romans to the Greeks have tampered with it to accomplish their own political outcomes. I have even seen that famous pastor on CNN with his new version of the bible. So its still being tampered with. You want the truth, read the Quran. It will tell you about all the prophets and oneness of Allah, the most mercifull the most forgiving. It will. Dont get me wrong, I do believe in the book given to Issa(Jesus).,but not the current one.
Lloyd!
Thanks too for taking the time to read my writting. The above answer goes to you too. I will however kindly read the gospel of John. But I ask you to read the holy book of Quran, kindly. Its not a challenge, and you dont have too.
DEQ,
No worries. To each his own. I'm not trying to convert anyone here and I long accepted the fact that people have different beliefs and religions.
My point is this, it doesn't matter what you believe in, or what religion you have or faith, as long as it makes us a better person, as long as we do no harm to our neighbor, as long as we respect and love one another whether they are jewish, muslim, christians, my God and your Allah would be proud of us.
You believe Jesus is a Prophet, I believe Jesus is one and the same as God the father. No problem. We all work for a common goal. And that is to the will of your Allah and me to do the will of God.
So to each his own. :) Peace!
I agree with you Lloyd! Lets agree to disagree. There is a whole Sura in the Quran dedicated to that.
I was able to find it and its translation. So, with all due respect My apology for sounding as if I was recruiting a convert. Remember, I approached the whole subject from the bible point of view which I hold highly, eventhough am Muslim. This topic if anything, creates a bridge between all sides and angles .,thus atleast we agree in God. So, please dont take this as anymore than an open intellectuall discussion. Am not a religious scholar, but I have opinions and believes and so do you. So, with Love, Peace and Understanding.....here is the verse. Ignore the ?? marks, the arabic writing isnt showing here.
???? ????????????? ??????????????
Say (O Prophet): O ye who reject faith! (1)
??? ???????? ??? ???????????
I worship not that which ye worship; (2)
????? ??????? ??????????? ??? ????????
Nor worship ye that which I worship. (3)
????? ?????? ???????? ???? ??????????
And I shall not worship that which ye worship. (4)
????? ??????? ??????????? ??? ????????
Nor will ye worship that which I worship. (5)
?????? ????????? ?????? ?????
Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion. (6)
I believe that Jesus is our brother.....we are the sons and daughters of God....Jesus said,"Call no man Father but the Father in heaven." The Father is the power...the Father is the eternal.....concerning perfect love and truth....we are all a part of God...God is a part of us.
Jesus taught us how to be sons and daughters of God. I believe his message was to be kind and love one another. Is that not what all fathers want for their children?
Tom: I believe exactly what you stated, as you are quoting the trinity, which is the father, the son and the holy ghost.
Here are also a couple of passages from the Holy Bible that referencing Jesus as the Son of God.
YHWH(I am ) Exodus 3:14 , Isiah 43:10
Jesus: John 8:24 Romans 9:5 all of the reference and cross reference that Jesus is the Son of God.
I Cor. 8:6 says , "There is one God." you can also go to
www.rim.org/muslim/jesusisGod.htm this again will give you multiple passages to cross reference and proof that Jesus is the Son of God. :)
TOM!
Bingo....Our great grandfather(Adam) and Grandma Eve, will certainly also smile to see us love and care for all humanity, without any regards to any divisive issue.
TOM!
Bingo....Our great grandfather(Adam) and Grandma Eve, will certainly also smile to see us love and care for all humanity, without any regards to any divisive issue.
TOM!
Bingo....Our great grandfather(Adam) and Grandma Eve, will certainly also smile to see us love and care for all humanity, without any regards to any divisive issue.
TOM!
Bingo....Our great grandfather(Adam) and Grandma Eve, will certainly also smile to see us love and care for all humanity, without any regards to any divisive issue.
Aevans!,
I Cor. 8:6 says , "There is one God."
Now that quote you provided contradicts your statement. God is One and only!
One scripture settles it all. John14:6 Jesus said:
I AM THE WAY, THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE. NO MAN COMETH UNTO THE FATHER BUT BY ME.
He is the only Redeemer! One must take it or leave it to enter into eternal life.
Unto us a child is born unto us a Son is given. God (Jehova) gave us His Son, Jesus. He was with the the Father before the world began. He was not created and then called a son.
In the beginnig was the Word ...and the Word was God (John 1:1) and the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father), full of grace and truth.
God was manifested in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the nations, belived on in the world,recieved up into glory (I timothey 3:16) No man has seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has declared him (john 1:18)
OK.,NICE QUOTATION! For the sake of the discussion.,where are you going with this. Please make your point and translate the verses that you are quoting.
brothers it is mentioned in many places in the bible that jesus is a prophet
Luke 24:19 What things?" he asked. "About Jesus of Nazareth," they replied. "He was a prophet, powerful in word and deed before God and all the people,
Mathew 21:11And the crowds were saying, "This is the prophet Jesus, from Nazareth in Galilee."
Each prophet was the saviour and light for his people during that time Moses was the saviour for his people during his time likewise prohet Noah for his people,the verse I and my father are one is for one purpose ,if you read John 10:21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me, which clearly states this. and if brother you still say that jesus and God are one in actual unity then Jesus further says in John10:23 to his disciples iam in thee and you are in me so does it mean that there are fourteen Gods no brothers .Jesus was a prophet and he was a great prophet
Thanks for thaking the time F18! I agree as well, Jesus(pbuh) was great, gifted, chosen prophet
A lot of comments have been talked about concerning Jesus the Son of God. Jesus was not only the Prophet of God, the Son of God, and God in flesh.
For all those who do not beleive Jesus is the Son of God, there is one way to prove that Jesus is the Son of God is to ask God in Jesus name to come into your heart and prove Himself. The Holy Spirit will come in and abide in you, and the Power of God will be forgiving in your lack of ignorance.
Thanks Doug for taking the time to comment. If you read through out the comments, people quoted their scriptures to show why they have such stand(based on their book). This is a discussion.,debate or argument(call it whatever). Which is based on theological reasoning.,not emotional. Am sure you believe what you are saying.,and its great! But if you gonna show me why you believe it.,you better do more than telling me what's in your heart rather than why?
We are all ignorant...untill we have got it all figured. Seeking an answer and questioning , however does not constitute to IGNORANCE. If anything, you aregaining. Am sure Jesus, did not go around labeling the thief, thief, the prostitute prostitute.....So how could you call anyone Ignorant, when your actions contradict YOUR EMOTIONAL OUT CRY (not biblical)?
A blind man who heard these verses that I quoted understood them perfectly and came away converted and believed with out a doubt that Jesus is God and the Son of God. Jesus said if you have seen me you have seen the father, I and the Father are one. (one God not two) I know it is hard for you to rap your mind around. It is not a mind thing but a faith thing. You have to believe it by faith.
Am sorry to sound so Ignorant! But If a blind man was simply converted by you saying, then I guess he can be easily converted to do anything really.
Now, back to logicall reasoning. We are man, human beings....not animals! So ofcourse we need to use our brain, not emotional outburst. Faith derives from having questioned something, and without doubt got the answer that totally make sense to you(not common sense). Therefore, to have faith, you must use your brains. Otherwise, you can continue to convert those that dont question(i.e. children, stupid, crazy, psycho and all those that even god wont hold anything against them).
For now, thanks for taking the time to comment! But I truelly wished we could have logical debate rather than argue on baseless emotional retoric. By the way, my agenda here is to have a discussion am not trying to convert anyone. I Just want to understand everyone,and debate...that about it!
Something I have always wondered, and Muslims have confirmed this is true, Why would God throw a man around a cave and press him against a wall? The things we hear of today that do these things are Poltergeist and demons. So why don't I beleive mohammed - simply because he was possed by the devil. Its in the Quran.
I have looked at the Quran and the biggest thing that stands out for me is this. Jews where first, then Christians then Muslims. Lets keep it basic - Jews believed in God and then Jesus came and Expanded the Old Testiment to bring the New Testiment. income the Christians, some remaind Jews. Then a few hundered years later some guy throw around a cave tells us this
Sura 1 - Al-Fatiha (MAKKA) : Verse 7
not (the way) of those who earned Your Anger (such as the Jews), nor of those who went astray (such as the Christians).
So Jews where there first and loved by God otherwise you would not have a muslim religion at all!!! as Islam is a Arbahmic Religion and comes from the Jews - Who apparently God was angry with and also the Christians - yet for some reason they where the ones that went astray - How can they been the ones to stray when they where there first??
And Christians are muslims and believe in Islam - for Islam is to Submit to God (most religions do that) and a Muslim is "one who submits to God". So Mohammeds Religion as I like to call it, is fake and is false. I beleive that some Muslims are really good people and My friend Niyaz is an amazing guy, so full of peace, But to belive there words of a ranting mad man over the words of Jesus is just stupidity!
I was also told that MOhammed was a great General in the army and won many battles and killed many people. This is a Muslim telling me this. I am sure Killing is wrong? Did Jesus ever kill anyone? no infact he died himself so that we may be saved!
The Quran wants you to worship Mohammed - which I beleive most you you do.
I beleive the Religion of Mohammed is one of Evil.
I can listen to Mohammedists and they have some reasoning, but then they go and read the Qoran. So I say that Mohammedists are the ones who have gone astray.
I am entitled to my view - although if I voiced my view in a Mohammedist country then I think the Quran would say 2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them!
I will keep my Religion of Peace thanks.
John 3:16
"For God so loved the world that he gave his ONE and ONLY Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
Think this answers the debate
Peace
Andy! Thanks for taking the time and participate in this discussion/debate etc...
To respond to your rethoric, I agree with you that Mohamed was indeed after Jesus, Abraham, Moses etc. Matterfact, you can include in that list, Jacob, Noah, and so on. However to say that it was Judaism first, Then Christianity, and Then some possed caveman religion called Islam, its your believe. As a Muslim, we believe all the way down to Adam and eve, they were Muslims. So was Jesus, Abraham, Moses, Noah etc. Mohamed was the last of all, and just like his predecessors carried the same message of the Oneness of God.
As far as your sweet insults, towards a man of god! May the lord you believe in behold your tongue. I know no church or sengog or mosque going person that will have disrespect for the other. But on all sides there are those that misrepresents their own belief system. I hope you are not one my brother!
GreyFox!
Thanks as well for you quote.
Thanks to google....knowledge is a click a way. Here's my own quote for Wikipedia.com
Raymond E. Brown summarizes a prevalent theory regarding the development of this gospel.[17]:363-364 He identifies three layers of text in the Fourth Gospel (a situation that is paralleled by the synoptic gospels):
An initial version Brown considers based on personal experience of Jesus;
A structured literary creation by the evangelist which draws upon additional sources;
The edited version that readers know today.
Still different theories of authorship have been advanced by other notable theologians. Chapman University scholar of religion contends the author of John’s Gospel was Mary Magdalene.[18]
Among scholars, Ephesus in Asia Minor is a popular suggestion for the gospel's origin.[3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_John
Jesus isn't the Father/Allah.But he is The King in The Kingdom of Heaven as The chief priest. Everyone who live in heaven kingdom is The Son of God. It means that many people who is going to live in the heaven kingdom is sons of God as Jesus. Why Jesus is the Son of God? Because he came from there and to return with the lost sheeps at the end of world.
Biblic Morality
Christians consider it to be the "Word of God" Numbers, Chapter 31, verses 17? and 18
God command "kill every woman who has known man by lying with him,but all the female children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
so that the soldiers could have these young girls "for themselves" (Pervert Bible God).
the above verses are note mentioned in Sunday school it proves the God of the Bible is a Pervert
JESpose08 says:
2 years ago
Interesting facts, you've forced me to question my own understandings.