Roman Catholic Church
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HISTORY OF CHRISTIANITY
This article is the 8th episode of a series on the History of Christianity. The first section was entitled Origin of Christianity 33 to 100 AD; and the episode before this one is History about Christianity 787 to 900 AD.
The Devil, always able to detect human weakness, attacked the leadership of the Roman Catholic Church with ferocity in the 10th Century. In 897, Pope Formosus was charged with perjury and covetousness—nine months after his death. His corpse was dug up, dressed in his papal uniform and seated on a throne by his successor, to face the charges. Found guilty, after exercising his right to silence, he was stripped and thrown into the Tiber River. His inquisitor, Pope Stephen VI, was soon strangled. The next pope was in power four months; and the next only twenty days. Soon there was Pope Sergius III, who murdered the other two popes to ascend to the papacy; and who fathered, by a 15-year-old girl, an illegitimate son—who later became Pope John XI.
ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH
In 924, Pope John X was suffocated with a pillow. In 954, the illegitimate son of Pope Alberic was made Pope John XII—and he was the worst of the lot. He opened a whorehouse in the papal palace; habitually hosted drunken orgies; committed incest; was an adulterer; and was known to sexually assault his visitors. It was he who started the practice of assuming a pseudonym once elected to the papacy.
Otto the Great (912-973) inherited the kingship of Germany in 936 and ascended to the throne of Holy Roman Empire in 962. Every subsequent king of Germany descended from Otto. When the illegitimate Pope Philagathos took the papacy in 997, Otto III descended on Rome to unseat him. For good measure, Otto III cut off his hands, ears, nose, and tongue; and gouged out his eyes.
CLUNY
The 10th Century was not all bad news for the Roman Catholic Church. Duke William of Aquitaine founded the venerable monastery at Cluny in 910, widely acknowledged as the exemplar of western monasticism. Cluny Abbot barred politics and elected as their leaders the most holy men they could find. They returned to a strict adherence to the Benedictine rulebook, which had been relaxed over the years. Cluny sparked a religious revival inside and outside its walls, as well as building the most important library in France. It created a network of 314 monasteries from Spain to Poland. The Cluny archives were burned and its buildings destroyed by the Atheists at the heart of the French Revolution in 1790.
DUNSTAN
A great Archbishop arose in England named Dunstan (909-980). Dunstan reformed the church and monasteries in England. Besides being an extraordinary Christian and theologian—who worked tirelessly for widows and orphans, restored churches and established schools—he was a marvelous craftsman of church bells and organs; an accomplished musician and painter; and a sought after jeweler. He is the patron saint of goldsmiths.
FEUDALISM
The feudal system was to leave a profound stamp on Western Civilization regarding speech; manners, property rights; the rule of law; emphasis on contracts; the balance between rights and responsibilities; the importance of mutual trust and keeping one's word; and the relationship between those who govern and those who are governed.
VLADIMIR THE GREAT
Meanwhile, Christianity continued to spread its message of Faith, Hope and Love to Central and Eastern Europe. Vladimir of Kiev converted in 988; dismissed 4 of his 5 wives and all 800 of his concubines; had his people baptized en masse; sent missionaries into the countryside to teach the new faith and demolish heathen shrines; and filled Ukraine and Russia with churches and monasteries. Henceforth, Ukraine and Russia would be powerful members of Christendom.
SYMEON THE NEW THEOLOGIAN
Over in Constantinople, an exceptionally brilliant theologian arose, later named Symeon the New Theologian (one qualified to talk about God). He did not consider it possible to rationally understand God but he had powerful mystical experiences of God that led to his writings espousing the view that human beings should experience God directly and personally. He criticized the prevalent view that simply being baptized would provide salvation if one was still living a sinful life. He insisted a person must be baptized in the Holy Spirit and transformed into the likeness of Christ. Symeon said, "Among tens of thousands you will hardly find one who is a Christian in both word and deed."
1000 AD
Thankfully, a century had come to an end that had been filled with bizarre deeds of amorality, greed, brutality, and murder among the leadership of the Roman Catholic Church. There were other problems extant including simony (paying money for church offices or worse—to buy the gift of the Holy Spirit); and the veneration of relics had made the market for the bones of saints so lucrative that there were more bones than saints. The Church would reform in the 11th Century, ushering in 300 years of good popes; but serious division was brewing between East and West regarding the use of leavened bread, celibacy among the clergy, and whether the Holy Spirit also proceeds from Jesus.
New Years Eve 999, many Europeans assumed the world would end that night. It didn't.
ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH
There was no flourishing of Christian scholarship in the 10th Century. But 900 to 1100 is considered the "monastic period" and in the monasteries Christianity was very strong and focused on Christ as the source of all good.
The penitential system of the Church was developing at this time, with penance as a way to make satisfaction to the Lord, required as a consequence of human sin.
Critics of the Church, especially the Jews, accused Christians of idolatry for adoring the cross. The defenders of the faith responded that they were not adoring the cross itself or the material of the cross, but the Lord's body that was placed on the cross. The sign of the cross was an essential part of the liturgy of the Mass and at baptism. Demons and lusts were driven away by the sign of the cross. The cross was the instrument of victory by Christ over the devil. God sent his Son to conquer Satan. This requires taking seriously the role of the devil as a third party to the transaction that took place between God and man in the redemption of humankind. Together with the cross, it was the name of Jesus that became the object of mystical contemplation.
Christian thought continued to be refined in consideration of the paradox of free will and predestination; the nature of God; the redemptive work on the cross; and examination of how the relation of mankind to God and to the devil was changed by the death of Christ.
REMIGIUS
I will give some examples of the theology of the times.
The Gospels are the most important of all the things that are said in the Mass. The Mass began with songs and prayers, whose sweetness and pleasantness would first soften the hearts of the hearers, so that the people, after hearing the melody of a pleasant song and having had their attention focused on spiritual things through the repentance of their minds, will take up the saving words of the Gospel with ardent interest. (Remigius 841-908)
ODO OF CLUNY
The judgments and mercies of God are too profound for the human mind to plumb. His goodness cannot be exhausted, His mercy not consumed, His knowledge not incomplete, His power cannot fail. Christ was the lover of humanity. Man did not need only to be redeemed but also to be instructed about how he ought to live after redemption. Acceptance of such instruction is the hallmark of true discipleship. The one resource that could preserve the equanimity of the wise man amid all the troubles of this world was meditation on the Scripture, which contains everything that there was to know about God and about the self. Since it is the purpose of all Scripture to act as a restraint against the evils of the present life, it addressed itself to the human condition in two ways; either by consoling us or by warning us. We are truly worthy of Christ if we, like Him, had grounds for pride and attained the height of power, but nevertheless remained humble. He was the model of how to bear the contempt of men. He had become a man so that human beings could not dismiss His virtues as something beyond the realm of possibility. The eyes of the faithful are to be intent on Him. The three monastic vows—poverty, chastity, and obedience—were clearly present in the specific ways in which Christ served as example. The ideal of chastity is part of following the example of Christ, who taught that one who takes up His cross has never made provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires. Those who refuse to acknowledge Christ on Earth will suffer an endless hell. The Lord of history will establish a new Earth on which the resurrected saints will dwell. (Odo of Cluny 878-942)
RATHERIUS
What is better news than the things that are said in the Gospel about the incarnation of the Son of God, about His miracles, His preaching, His resurrection, and His ascension? To be truly a disciple of Jesus and one to whom Jesus speaks, one must truly love the discipline of Jesus. The discipline of Jesus included the total span of human experience as this was to be brought into conformity with the divine will that had been revealed through the incarnation of the Son of God in a fully human life, all of which was pertinent to the human lives that it was intended to redeem and renew. The fundamental definition of a Christian is one who obeys the will of Christ; reads the Bible; wishes to be with God always; prays frequently. Although the crucifixion was sometimes viewed as the victory of Christ over the devil and other enemies—and the descent into hell and the resurrection even more—the ascension was especially suited to this theme. (Ratherius 890-974)
OTHLO
Jesus was the high priest of humanity who was free from sin and therefore an acceptable sacrifice to atone for the sins of humankind. God is a being which can subsist without any other; but nothing can exist at any time or in any place without the presence of God. God transcends the law of nature and nature is the very will of God. All who are saved are saved by the kindness of His grace alone, which transcends human comprehension. Christ should be imitated in all respects. If we claim to abide in Him, we must walk as He walked. (Othlo 1010-1072)
ANSELM
People should be in awe of the presence of their infinite Creator. There is no escape from His justice and His will. Humanity had dishonored God when it denied Him the honor that was due Him. In requiring restoration of that honor, God was not acting in a bloodthirsty manner, as some have charged, but in a manner appropriate to His nature and consistent with His justice. The justice of God had been violated by the failure of man to render to God what he owed Him. The Justice of God also made it impossible for God to forgive this sin by mere fiat, for this would have been a violation of the very order of the universe that God had to uphold to be consistent with Himself and with His justice. God did not need to suffer on the cross but man needed to be reconciled through such suffering. God is free of any necessity. What the justice of God demanded, the mercy of God supplied, because the sinner has nothing with which to make satisfaction. If Jesus had been only God and not also a man, He would not have been able to achieve salvation through satisfaction since the divine nature was incapable of suffering or humiliation, not to speak of dying. If he would not have been God but merely a man, his obedience would have availed for himself alone. Because Christ did not have to die unless He willed to do so and because He was free of all sin, His voluntary acceptance of death and of the punishment that men had deserved was the means by which salvation was accomplished. Christ was motivated not by any debt but by the honor of the Father and the plight of humankind. It was the intention of this Just God in the act of creation to make a just and blessed rational creature that would enjoy Him. The task of the Christian message is to induce in the hearer an accurate self-knowledge; for through the knowledge of self one comes to the knowledge of God. Man can be saved through the mystery of the Incarnation of Christ or not at all. The natural free will always assists the gift of divine grace in salvation. Nevertheless, grace receives the credit, for without it free will could not attain to salvation. The union of the divine and human natures in Christ made the atonement and satisfaction possible, in that whatever was necessary to be done for the restoration of men, the divine nature did it if the human nature could not, and the human nature did it if it was not fitting for the divine. In His association with them He was teaching them by word how they ought to live, and would provide Himself as an example for them. Satan was a proud spirit in relation to God—and always malevolent in relation to us—who believed it was better to reign in hell than serve in heaven. He successfully tempted man to share in his fate. Man had permitted himself to be so easily vanquished by him through sinning. (Anselm 1033-1109).
PETER ABELARD
God had been urged by His love to descend to Earth, and He who is consubstantial with the Father has through His love deigned to come to us. We are justified by His blood. The only Son of God became incarnate to liberate us from the servitude of sin and the yoke of the devil, and thus by His death to open the door for us to eternal life. (Peter Abelard 1079-1142)
SAINT BERNARD OF CLAIRVAUX
On Earth, we are in the school of Christ. Christ must have used his human feelings and sense experiences as a means of access to the human condition, becoming compassionate through personal acquaintance with the misery and weakness of man. A principle cause of the incarnation was the need of man to have, in concrete historical form, the embodiment of the invisible God in the real events of a human life. These events collected from all the anxieties and bitter experiences of the life of Christ, were a source of instruction and of consolation to the believer, who was sustained by the example of our Savior in His sufferings and in His life. Each event had a special message: His virgin birth was a disclosure of purity; His life revealed the sinlessness of His character, His teaching conveyed the unalloyed truth. Christ was proof of divine love. There is no greater compassion than this, that one should lay down his life for those who had been sentenced and condemned. The effect of redemption is that men learned to love. Some are drawn to Christ by their desire for wisdom, some by their need for forgiveness, some by the example of His life. But for each of these groups and for all levels of men, it was the crucifixion that served as the revelation of the way and the will of God, even for those who were not able to penetrate the mysteries of that will. Take away free will and there is nothing that needs to be saved. Take away grace and there is no way to save it. The godless were giving themselves over to consumption and enjoyment; what was waiting for them was consummation and judgment. Only because Christ was both Judge and Savior, both just and merciful, could He be truly either one. Mercy without justice would make the sinner presumptuous; justice without mercy would make him despondent. (Bernard of Clairvaux 1090-1153)
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Comments
Thank you for putting this good resource together.
ArchDynamics— Thank you, my Brother, for being my first visitor. Your kind compliments give me hope and encouragement. I did not know there was an Anselmo in Nebraska. How about that! I continue to bless all those around me. :D
RTalloni— You are welcome. I so appreciate your visit.
Great hub. Very informative. Reading and Studying the history of the Church, most Church, shows all too true how mankind corrupts anything and everything where power and wealth are to be had. Being a home assembly we focus on spirit-led devotion, no power structure, no tithes, nothing to infiltrate and abuse. It exists for the moment it is and nothing more. It is not a kingdom on earth but rather a temporary assembling of brothers and sisters from another world who want to remind themselves of where they come from and whom they truly serve.
With some much wealth and power tied up into organized religion, respect of persons all too often influences the direction and teachings of the churches. This is why there are so many schisms, so many differences and agendas constantly be worked out, paid for, and lobbyed.
James 2:2-4 'For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile rainment: And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool: Are ye not then partial in yourselves, and are become judges of evil thoughts?'
I'm not saying there are not good people in the denominations but I tend to believe that most churches, especially the leadership in them, would have a difficult time accepting the disciples or even Christ Himself, if they walked into their buildings today. Much like the Pharisees and Saducees, I don't think they would be open to listening to them or hearing them. The image of righteousness has surpassed the revelation of the truth.
Good Job James, I enjoyed reading this.
A M Werner— I find it remarkable that as horrifying as the Church was, the theology I presented above is solid, particularly considering these are human beings living 1000 years ago in brutish times who we should not judge according to what we know now. So there were redeeming qualities there. And dare I say, deeper thoughts than some I hear espoused today.
Thank you for reading and leaving your wise insights. I love what you are doing with your home church. There were surely good people by the millions in those days among the regular folk—like us today. But the story amazes me of how it all came down. That's why I am compelled to write about it.
Thank you, James, for so much information. Well they really done it in full measure. That is why I am so against the church, not the religion, because nothing has changed. Look at it in the last 50 years. I wish Jesus would come and sweep them all out again as he did in the temple. That certainly needs doing. Also the whole pomp. Also most of the congregation. I makes me mad when I saw them, on their knees, praying their heads off, coming out and doing right the opposite. That is not what religion is all about and definitely Jesus didn't preach that.
Interesting article!
Glad to see a few of the good men got a mention-good hub.Many changes have taken place within the R/C church from the top down,especially in recent years.For most of us Christ-His Word-and the Holy Eucharist are what is important.We have had and still have some great and holy people-and great and holy priests.
James-what do you think needs to be done to unite all Christians-I have noticed since I came on hubpages that there are thousands of separate Christian 'sects' in the U.S.-why?Do individuals feel miffed with some rule or other and walk off and set up another new church(of God!).
Interestingly,many Anglicans are now coming back into the R/C fold because so many anti-Christian practises are being accepted in the Anglican church(not my judgement).
God Bless-and He is Merciful above all
Another amazing article! Your knowledge, research, attention to detail and ability to bring it all together never fails. Thank you - again and again.
James,
I have to continue reading but I have to make this observation while it's fresh in my mind. The corpse of Pope Formosus made a very strategic defence mistake by maintaining his right to silence.
I've read a little further and I'm seeing a pattern. There should have been a warning lable on the job of Pope similar to cigarette warnings.
The remaining theolocical discourse is interesting I think that I agree with the views of Symeon.
Thanks for the info, God bless you brother.
Incredible amount of research. Sign of an author devoted to his craft.
Hello,hello,— It may be information overload! :) I just can't help myself when I get on this subject, plus I know I'm not coming back. I'll do a couple nice, short Hubs next. I'm not against the Church, but they sure had some rascals back then. There are certainly hypocrites in church throughout the ages. I think the pomp is supposed to glorify God. It is surely a bit off from the Apostolic Church. Thanks so much for your patience and your comments. I appreciate it.
carolina muscle— Thank you! I appreciate you coming by and letting me know you did.
itakins— Thank you. I'm very impressed by the current pope and his predecessor. I have read quite a bit of their words and they are sound. The Anglican Church is an apostate church. I'll be explicating the spread of all these denominations in later chapters of this story. It started with the first Protestants protesting the selling of salvation for cash, rampant corruption in the Church, and persecution and killing of people who simply wanted to read the Bible for themselves—which was forbidden under penalty up to death.
I would love to see the Body of Christ reunified and I believe it will happen someday. I think all that Mary stuff will have to go first, and praying to dead people and the likes of that, for it to happen. Papal infallibility won't make the cut. A synthesis of the great parts of the past of the RC along with some Evangelical fervor.
Thank you for your excellent comments. I appreciate you coming by.
The Rope— Thank you so much for the laudations! I am uplifted. You are most welcome. I appreciate you coming by to visit.
Tom Whitworth— I think he needed a better lawyer.
Ha! Your funny. It was a dangerous job for a while.
I found Symeon very interesting, too, because he seemed to be teaching sort of a modern Evangelicalism 1000 years ago. He is one of only three men to ever be named an official theologian by the Eastern Orthodox Church, and one of the others was the Apostle John. That puts him in some pretty good company. (The other was Gregory of Nazianzus, I believe.)
You are welcome. Thank you, Tom, for coming to see me. I always enjoy your comments.
DiamondRN— Thank you for your appreciation. It's nice to hear from you and know you were here.
Great Historical Hub, James. I learn a lot from reading you. Do you know if your family is related at all to any of these Popes? I'm related to the great Scottish emancipator, Donald De Bruce, who defeated King Edward II at Bannocburn in 1320. He's my 20th grandfather. He was a knight of the English court, but secretly supported Robert Wallace and in the end after Wallace was tortured to death, his body parts separated from each other and hung on a pole. At one time Bruce was the largest landowner in England and Scotland and risked his life, his health, and his fortune in leading the Scots to victory and independence. Some day I'll go to Edinburgh, Scotland where stands a large statue King Bruce riding his horse in full armor. Love your writing. Don White
James
Alive in Christ-it's the souls we ask to intercede for us -not dead bodies.
I'm a bit like a broken record-but this is how we see it.We are all a part of the Communion of saints-even baptised non-Catholics(as we see it)
I'm afraid I agree with Heloo Hello's comments but I cannot fault the work you have put into this Hub James
dusanotes— Thank you, Don. I don't think so. I am largely Welsh and they haven't had any Welsh popes! :)
I know you guys have got genealogy down pat. I should do a background search on my ancestors. I am fairly well familiar with deBruce. That's a nice lineage. Big hero. Braveheart is one of my all time top five films. I have seen that statue. I should do a Hub about my visit to Scotland, if I can find my photos around here someplace.
I love you loving my writing. Thanks for coming.
itakins— I surely mean no offense. I should have taken more time and worded that better. It came off a bit crude. I understand the concept. I meant to say that the Protestants would probably rejoin the Catholic Church if these things were not part of it. They only pray to the Father, based on Jesus example in the Lord's Prayer. And they won't go for purgatory, either. But I think these hurdles will be overcome, someday. And I thank you for the clarification. I have several books by both of the last two popes so I am not anti-Catholic by any means.
Extremely intersesting historical compilation James!
A couple of things I have always disagreed-with (respectfull) in regard to Roman Catholic views of history (not literal history as you have written but "their view") is that Jesus Christ founded catholicism and that he appointed Peter as the first Pope.
The scriptures do nor bear-out that any denominations whatsoever existed in the early years of Christianity. Peter referred to himself as an "apostle" in his epistles and history says he was crufified upside down for his testimony as a follower of Jesus Christ. He not only made the mistakes before Jesus resurrection of denying Christ three times before men (and directly forgiven by Christ for it) but was also rebuked by the apostle Paul for incorrectly compelling gentile men to be circumcised as they received salvation through Christ (Gal 2:14).
Despite-this, he was a greater man than I will ever aspire to being but the point is, that he and all men that followed him are simply men (at times inspired by the Holy Ghost to pen the scriptures) and our only mediator is Jesus Christ.
"For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;" I-Tim 2:5
While I know many popes have been appointed and the Roman Catholic Church has a rich history, I personally do not believe God has ever appointed mediators because we have the one and only - Jesus Christ. Men are appointed to be witnesses for Christ and ministers/teachers of his Word.
Whoops! - I rattled a bit (sorry about that).
Regardless, I believe it is a very interesting study to look at the history of Christian offshoots and events (including the inquistion) because many things can be learned retrospectively.
ethel smith— Thank you very much for your visit and comments. Always a pleasure to hear from you. I'll be getting to Becket before long.
JimLow— Thank you! :)
You are correct there was no such thing as a Catholic Church in the beginning. In the 2nd Century, the word "katholikos" started to be used to describe the Body of Christ, simply meaning it was to be universal, according to the Great Commission—for everybody. The word "orthodoxos" began to be used a lot in the 3rd Century to describe generally accepted doctrines. The first mention I can find in history of the term "Roman Catholic Church" is in the 5th Century, the same time when the word Pope began to be used to describe the Bishop of Rome in particular, as it is today. That word was used here and there by various bishops of the Holy Sees in 5 or even 7 cities with a small "p", which has carried on today with calling priests father, which is what pope means.
I appreciate your thoughtful and insghtful commentary. Thanks for coming!
No offence taken -James-Thank you.
itakins— Thank you and you are welcome. :)
Just for interest, I wanted to add that I'm a direct decendent of St. Lawrence (sometimes cited: Laurent & Laurencia - later changed to "Lowrance" by the branch that migrated to America). He was one of the deacons of the Roman Church, martyred along with Pope Sixtus II during the persecution of Valerian in 258 (he's one of the most honoured martyrs of the Roman Church). The feast day of St. Lawrence is 10 August.
He was recognized as a Saint to the poor according to my family history/geneology and is my understanding that he was French.
I should probably have done more research. I'm "protestant" so have done little background on it but is fascinating to me from a historical perspective.
JimLow— Wow! That's a fine lineage, too! I think I'm descended from southern sharecroppers. :)
That is a fascinating story. I know the name but didn't know anything about him. I going to read up on him a bit now that I know one of his relatives. Thanks for that info.
You're very welcome!
You'll likely find a lot more than I've ever known about him and hopefully it will all be good. I will look for anything you have on that you might publish in the future.
I also have ancestors who were the "hugonauts" but also know little about them.
Sorry - correct spelling is "huguenots".
The Huguenots were French Protestants I believe who were famous for withstanding much persecution. I have a feeling I'll be writing about them soon. But next up is the Great Schism between the East and West branches of the Church; then its on to the Crusades!
Very interesting read. A lot of stuff I didn't know about the R/C church. Thanks James!
Tammy Lochmann— Thank you. I enjoy imparting knowledge, one of my favorite things. You're welcome! :)
James, wonderful, fact filled hub as always! Symeon speaks the truth, "Among tens of thousands you will hardly find one who is a Christian in both word and deed." Thank God for giving us the Lamb of God, Jesus! We are such imperfect people!
Kebennett1— Thank you so much! That Symeon was onto something way back then. Yes. Thank you God for Jesus. Our Lord and Saviour. Amen!
Great read. I studied Italian History in College as something fun and interesting. I enjoyed your piece immensely.
drcrischasse— Thank you. I am pleased that you enjoyed it so. I appreciate the visit.
I agree with other commentators that the institutional church leaves a lot to be desired that is troubling to the spirit to say the least.
Nevertheless, I believe that even in the midst of the church's imperfections, God does His redemptive work. Jesus reminds us that wheat and weeds will grow together until the harvest. We understand though, that God is not mocked; weeds, even in the church, do not go unnoticed. God knows where they all are. At harvest time, the wheat will be separated from the weeds. Until then, we trust in God, perform our divine work assignments as best we can and wait for the Great Harvest.
Another great hub James and thank you.
Love and hugs,
Another great hub, James, full of insightful gems.
Like several contributors I have serious misgivings on several aspects of RC doctrine, but like you I admire a lot that has been said and done by the last two popes.
As I once remarked to another hubber, when I was at school we were taught 'vulgar fractions' which are expressed as 'numerator over denominator'. In other words, 'denominators' are the 'dividing factor', and so it is in Christianity with denominations.
We can all be one in the Spirit yet differ in doctrine unless these depart from the absolute essentials which, as you say, some denominations now have. I consider and describe myself as a 'non-denominational believer in the Lord Jesus Christ', because I actually regard those who call themselves 'Protestants' per se as 'Reformed Catholics'. If you attend any presbyterian Church of Scotland christening today you will hear the minister say something like: 'I baptize thee, [child's name] into the holy apostolic and catholic church'.
What makes Roman Catholicism distinctive is not how catholic it is (which, as you rightly say, simply means 'universal') but how Roman; something I mean to tackle soon in an upcoming hub on that most misrepresented subject: the Separation of Church and State.
RevLady— You are so right. And I may have gotten caught up in the history while neglecting the fact that billions of people have been changed for the better and found salvation in the Christian Church; and millions have in every generation, regardless of the problems in the institution. Thank you for making that excellent point here. That needed to be said.
I'm not out to bash the Church or any part of it. We have enough outsiders to do that for us. I am explicating how we got from there to here by trying to make the story understandable.
Harvest time is a comin'. Do our work assignments. You have a great attitude. I sure enjoy reading your comments and your Hubs.
Allan McGregor— Thank you, Brother.
'non-denominational believer in the Lord Jesus Christ'
That is a perfect statement about how I would define myself, also.
Thank you ever much for your always intelligent insights into my articles. I look forward to your comments. And I look forward to the Hub you mentioned above.
James A. Watkins, This has been an interesting informative hub, Professor! You have an excellent collection of history that one needs to ponder…
There is much much conflict and rivalry within the organized Church that on many occassions divided God’s People. This is actually why we have so many denominations! This is also why it is important to know that God’s Church is not the brick and mortar building no matter now large or small. There are many Wonderful and beautiful places of worship throughout the world where His Church can congregate, come together to WORSHIP, PRAISE and fellowship! But a lot of time this time has been used to instead divide and reinforce man made doctrines… The Spirit of the Lord encompasses diversity and unity. Not conformity. As a matter of fact we are not to conform but to be “transformed by the renewing of your mind.” Jeusu Christ truly is able to Save and transform one's life!
There is a multiplicity of political dynamics to discredit one if you do not go along simply for the sake of not “rocking the boat” It is evident throughout the history of God’s Church. This is not because of God it is because of man’s insatiable desire to dominate and control. To suppress TRUTH and embrace the ways of the world! Rather than allow the Spirit of God to have its way! One must really build an ongoing personal and intimate relationship with the LORD. It is to the Lord I pledge my life as His minister of the on TRUE GOSPEL of JESUS CHRIST! To know Him and know that your body is the Temple of the living God! Discernment is a precious gift from God.
We are living in a time when “evil is called good and good evil” Lord help us! It is good to know that those who are truly a part of His CHURCH!; when Jesus Christ returns we will be “Caught up to meet Him in the air” !!!
The wonderful thing about God’s Word is its ALL TRUE. "Jesus is the WAY the TRUTH and the life..." The way to heaven is through Him! “The gates of hades shall not prevail against it” PRAISE GOD from whom ALL BLESSINGS flow….. Thank you for sharing In HIS Love & service Blessings!!!
DeBorrah K. Ogans— You said it: God does not live in a building of brick and mortar. The Holy Spirit lives in our bodies. Amen.
That said, I agree that worship, praise and fellowship are good. Transformation is the key. Yes.
I have never minded rocking the boat a bit. :)
"an ongoing personal and intimate relationship with the LORD" Absolutely!
"Discernment is a precious gift from God" Surely this is so and YOU have it in spades, I might add.
"We are living in a time when “'evil is called good and good evil'” I think one or both of us should write an entire HUB on that line right there, because you are spot on and it is of paramount importance that people understand this.
I see a bit of doxology there. I love to sing that around the house.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom with my readers. And you are welcome. :-)
Wow! What a great history lesson. For me, my religion is the way I live and treat other people. Grew up "Katholikos", but was one of the unfortunate abuse victims. Several years ago my husband and I stepped up our sharing of our good lives with those less fortunate. This to me is living a Christian life.
MrsMoe— It is an honor to receive you here on this Page. Thank you for the compliment. I agree wholeheartedly with your ideas about a Christian life. I am sorry you had such a terrible experience with the Church.
James ,
How very interesting. I never learned all this history in catechisim. The article is very informative and precise. I did find it abit funny that the dead pope who was dug up was dumped after taking his right to remain silent...LOL. Thanks for joining my fan club. I appreciate it. I know the articles are somewhat controversial but I believe thats what makes them good, the different opinions and views. By the way how did you decide to study Theology??
Regards, Christal
christalluna1124— Thank you. That was one witty pope, alright. :-)
I look forward to reading much of your work. I have bookmarked your home page to remind me to do so. I write and I read other Hubs in spurts. I am on a writing phase right now, which will end Sunday night after I publish my 100th Hub.
I have been studying Theology since I was a boy simply out of an intense interest in the metaphysical.
I appreciate this visit and your insights.
Faithfully yours,
James
Very informative & historic. Thank you for sharing.
H P Roychoudhury— As soon as I publish my 100th Hub later tonight, I am taking a break to catch up on my reading. I have three of your Hubs bookmarked. Thank you for your comments and you are most welcome, my friend.
Very interesting reading. You put a lot of research in that article. Thanks much.
James,
Great job on presenting history, but unfortunately for me I came away with the feeling that it proves the church is human. While centuries came and went the appearance from God has waned to a complete standstill today.
Your history lesson enforces my idea that the church has no viable connection to God, at least any more so than any single person.
There is a similarity between the bibles and the US Constitution in relation to faith and belief. These documents were created by man for man. None of these documents has remained intact as they have been interpreted differently by different people to conform to their ideas and not those of the author.
After the passage of time and many interpretations the original documents are no longer valid. What is valid is how they are currently interpreted.
The US Constitution we know was created by man but it has changed over time by other men. This was forseen in its creation but the bible has been changed in a similar way, but it was to have been the work of God. The work of God shouldn't be allowed to be changed by man. The fact that the bibles have been changed through human interpretation and these changes have been accepted by people indicates that the bibles were not the work of God.
GRivers— I appreciate your recognition. Thanks for coming by to visit and you are welcome.
opinion duck— Technically, you are correct. The church, as in buildings, hierarchies, etc., is human. A human attempt at properly worshiping and reverencing God. The Church, however, is properly viewed as the Body of Christ, meaning, the entire group of true believers. Some in the church building may not actually be in that group; and some who do not attend services in a building may be in that group.
I do not agree with your assertion—a very common one among the misinformed—that the meaning of the Bible has been changed by men. On the contrary, the oldest documents extant mean exactly the same thing as modern Bibles do. This is a confusion that can be traced to Christians themselves, unfortunately. As new translations come out, there are always Christians who want to stick with the old ones, and criticize the new ones—people being resistant to change—and just as we are warned in the New Testament: arguing amongst ourselves provides fodder for unbelievers.
The Bible has been translated into 2,000 languages. The King James Version is, of course, Elizabethan or Shakespearean English. I had an old man tell me one day he will read no other because "I want to read the words just like Jesus said them." Well, this is simply a misunderstanding. I have maybe ten different translations here and I can find no substantial differences in meaning.
Furthermore, reading the writings of the oldest Apostolic Fathers (100-200) or Church Fathers (200-430) shows that these words could easily be written by a Christian today. I provided many quotes from them in other Hubs. The message has not changed. God's message is timeless.
This is a really great hub! Thanks for providing this important information! It's such a well-written, well-organized, polished hub with great photos, too. Wow.
I learned a lot more about the history of the Catholic Church from this hub. Thank you so much!
I like Symeon! I'm for direct mystical experiences with Jesus, being filled with a powerful love, and communing with God via Holy Spirit. It is not enough to just know factual truth, we must experience God and feel God. I'm most closely aligned with the Evangelicals through the TBN ministries because they believe in experiencing the anointing and in things like being given special gifts and powers from God to help ourselves and other people (like laying on of hands, receiving visions and prophecies from God, and the like). I like TBN because they provide so many fantastic interviews and amazing testimonials of miracles people are experiencing through Christianity. I get so inspired by testimonies and personal stories! They have only one Catholic minister, but he is such a sweet, loving spirit, and I absolutely love to watch him. Even if he wasn't saying anything interesting (although he always does say something interesting), I would watch him anyway just to be able to bask in his loving, sweet presence. He exemplifies what Jesus taught us to be like. (I'm referring to Father Michael Manning. He's in northern California, I believe).
Even though I am not a Catholic, I seem to be very interested in and drawn to the Catholic Church, as well. I get a deep feeling of love and peace when I go to a mass or just sit in a Catholic church and pray. This does not mean, however that I won't listen to ministers of other faiths, too. I can listen to various Christian denominational ministers and get something good out of all of their sermons (although there are some I don't like very much due to personal preferences).
I realize that there are problems within the Catholic Church, such as priests molesting children (which means the dark ones are posing as priests, pretending to believe in church doctrine but are really following the Devil and trying to pull down the church); but we cannot just stop believing in the Catholic Church because of this (this is what the Devil wants!). I liked the fact that the one commenter said she is still a Christian, in spite of the fact that she was abused in the Catholic Church. This is good, that she stuck with her faith in spite of the Devil's attempts to get her to toss it out the window!
I think that there are good people and bad people everywhere, even in organized churches of any kind. There are also many people who are growing in their faith and in their walk and they are really trying to be good people. The Catholic Church went through a lot of spiritual growth and still does.
I was particularly interested when you talked about the pope who suddenly got rid of his concubines and became a lot more spiritual (I forget which pope that was at the moment).
Those early evil times in the Catholic church were just the Devil trying to get people to not believe in Christ's teachings by putting his evil henchmen in positions of power in the Church. We can see through this history that eventually God turned a lot of it around and placed some spiritual popes in power. God always turns things around, but before he does, he allows a lot of people to go through their growth via dealing with the dark forces.
Regarding the various Bible versions, I have mixed feelings about this. I tend to want to stick to the King James version, even though it is a lot harder to read and understand because of the language -- because it is the original version of what was said, and I think that's important. On the other hand, the newer Bible versions are designed to make the Bible easier to read and to understand; however, I remember recently reading someone's hub wherein it was pointed out that in rewriting the Bible passages in newer versions, even slightly, that the meaning of those verses became subtly changed to where someone might be misled into some false beliefs. This scares me, truthfully. God can cause us to see the true meanings within the Bible passages, even if we are having trouble with the original language used.
I found it interesting what one commenter said about not having learned any of this history in catechisms. Hmmm. I guess the church doesn't want people to know their history. Perhaps they are too embarrassed about the earlier popes' serious flaws and evils!
I don't think we really need any intercessors when we pray, as praying to God and calling on Jesus should be enough, why wouldn't it be enough? Although intellectually I don't really see any harm in praying to intercessors like Mother Mary and passed over saints, my gut feelings tell me not to do this and to pray directly to God.
I will be reading more of your hubs soon. I need the history lessons!
The corruption in the Catholic church has always been there. Remember the Roman Empire built up this religious institute and they were the most ruthless rulers of all time. I could add so much more to this hub but I wouldn't want to spoil James work here which is commendable and very well presented.
Maraiya,
If you want to find out more, especially recent and earlier events in the Catholic church I can send you more information if you like via email. Let me know if you are interested!!!!
Maraiya Storm— Thank you very much for the laudations! And you are most welcome, too.
I like Symeon, too. Your commentary is outstanding! My, you are a fine, expressive writer. I just now bookmarked your profile page so I can come over and read your work later. You have an intriguing mind.
I am a big church visitor. I have attended services in all of the main Christian denominations and I enjoy all of them—from Catholic Mass to Holy Rollers—in different ways. I love to see how people worship and to worship with them.
The problems with child molestation in the Catholic Church in America was the direct result of Social Liberals recruiting gay priests. 99% of the molestations were of little boys but this fact has been obfuscated by the media in their gay-friendly political correctness.
I have a lot of different translations of the Bible and I do not agree that the message is changed in any of them. The message is the same whether expressed in modern English, Russian or Japanese. The thing about the King James Version is the art of the beautiful language of Shakespeare's times.
TheAllSeeingEye— Thank you for your insights. I appreciate your visit and comments.
ArchDynamics says:
2 weeks ago
King James:
Another exquisite and insightful article, Although, truth be told, a bit scary in the early days of Christendom.
I was especially tickled to see the word 'Anselm', as I am from a tiny town of 180 people in central Nebraska called 'Anselmo'.
Imagine my surprise at seeing the word (for the first time in my life) and finding out my little town was named after Anselm of Canterbury. And I thought it was an old Indian name. Go figure.
See? You're teaching us new and wonderful things on a daily basis!