The 7 Great Lies of Network Marketing: The Controversy
83Was the '7 Lies of Network Marketing' Too Hard on the 'Old School' MLM Leadership?
The networking marketing industry and some of the high-income earning uplines are ticked off at Ann Sieg for her recent books.
Are they upset because their incomes are threatened as people move to a new -- and more personally financially rewarding -- business model?
Less people will go to the old-school upline's trainings on 'how to prospect friends and family' ... and less people are buying their CD's on 'how to develop the belief system' necessary to do so.
Their downlines, who once spent hundreds or thousands of dollars per year on old-school tools, are now learning Internet marketing instead... Ouch.
Or... Is Their Reaction Warrented?
Did Ann Sieg cross the line somewhere?
Is it unethical to highlight the negative side of old-school MLM to promote her Renegade e-book and its solutions with the new model?
We'll talk about this here in a 'discussion series' over the next several weeks.
Let us know how you feel by leaving your comments below.
Click here if you're not familiar with Sieg's report, The 7 Great Lies of Network Marketing.
Control-based Leadership Vs. Empowering Leadership...
There is a movement underway right now that is being headed up by some of the highest paid uplines around... they want to silence Ann Sieg... they are trying to influence the big networking companies to threaten to take away your associate position if you promote Ann Sieg's materials (and other materials that don't praise them) on your blog or web site...
This is highly unlikely as it violates 1st amendment rights and is reminiscent of Nazi Germany ...
Regardless, the hostility of this 'angry crusade' highlights the painful reality some uplines are experiencing as they watch times change. Their position as the 'guru' is slipping away.
I spent several hours today engaged in an eye-opening email exchange with one of the 'frightened uplines' who is in the $50,000+ per month range (or was). I don't think he works much anymore, but he does do an occasional 'training' where he gets pretty worked up... teaching why we should 'make' people buy our products even if they don't want to because they need it (he really teaches this... I was at his training last summer).
His Beef with Ann Sieg...
His argument is that Ann Sieg focuses too much on the negatives of the 'old school' model.
Now I have known this wealthy upline for quite a long time. I attended his 'trainings' and purchased many of his CDs and tapes over the course of 12 years... teaching the old model of 'chase 'em down' marketing.
What I find interesting about his argument is that he, more than anyone I personally know, used a similar "negative-marketing" stragegy to motivate us to buy his stuff, and to sell our company's products.
Negative marketing isn't uncommon. Most (if not all) industries use it as a part of their strategy.
If you're with a network marketing company, chances are you have seen plenty of negative marketing in your company's DVD's, CDs and at your events.
Negative Vs. Positively Charged Marketing...
As you go down the path of Internet attraction marketing (using the Internet to attract prospects into your business) you'll discover that some marketers use 'negatively charged' messages while others choose to focus their marketing on a 'positive message.'
Famous motivational speaker, Tony Robbins, shared an observation about human behavior that helps us understand why marketers do this.
He talked about the two things that drive human behavior in every decision we make... he called this 'pain vs. pleasure.'
Robbins made a strong case for the Pain Vs. Pleasure Theory...
Robbins said that every action a person takes (from eating a 2nd peice of cake, to smoking, or buying a car) can be explained by whether or not the person perceives the action or decision will cause pain or give pleasure.
People avoid pain and do what is pleasurable.... it's pretty straight-forward, but it's important to hold this in the front of your mind when you're marketing something... even if that includes "how to get your kids to brush their teeth and go to bed without a fuss."
Avoiding Pain is the Stronger Drive...
What's interesting is that avoiding pain is a stronger drive in human behavior than wanting more pleasure.
This explains why many marketers focus on a negative message before offering the solution... because marketers know that people are more 'moved' by their drive to avoid pain than by getting something pleasurable or rewarding.
This is why I explained to my 6-year-old what bacteria can do to her gums... and how they can make a mouth look really ugly if she doesn't brush her teeth.
But is Negative Marketing Harmful?
I don't think I harmed my daughter by getting her to start thinking about what those bacteria will do if she doesn't brush her teeth.
Because hey, if I didn't think about those bacteria I would NEVER floss. Would you floss if you didn't know your teeth might fall out if you don't?
It seems there are times to use negative marketing to motivate... but are there times marketers cross the line? I think 'yes.'
But where is that line?
In business and sales, you will find that marketers approach their strategy in one or both of these 2 ways:
- Focusing first on a person's pain so they can then offer a solution, vs.
- Focusing on what a person wants right away and then offering the 'best' solution.
Some people feel it is harmful to use negative marketing, and in some cases I agree with them. As with all things, there is a balance and a tact.
How Negative Marketing is Commonly Used...
The Wellness Industry
In the wellness or nutritional industry you'll often see negative marketing used on brochures, DVDs or in seminars to shock people into seeing that the modern health care system can be dangerous.
Here are just some examples of negative-focused marketing used in the Wellness industry:
- Health Care is the 4th leading cause of death in the U.S
- Cancer rates are rising
- Over use of vaccination and use of antibiotics are causing permanent illness and death in children
- Showing a picture of a person's 'abused' colon to make the case for using a cleansing product
- Discussing all the toxins in the air that are harming your cells to then make the case for taking supplements
- Hormones in our food is causing pre-mature puberty in kids
- Doctors are over-prescribing medications because they get kick backs from the drug companies
- Your food is harming you... you must supplement!
You get the idea.
Now here are some examples of a positive message the Wellness industry may use in marketing:
- Feel better
- Have more energy
- Sleep better and wake up feeling refreshed
- Live a longer and healthier life
- Be lean and fit
- Have beautiful glowing skin
- Have stronger nails
- Have more endurance (sports products)
- Feel and look younger
Which List Hits You Harder?
If you look over those two lists you'll see right away WHY marketers often focus on people's pain first... or why they might focus on the negative things people would want to avoid before offering the solution.
The first list above grabs your attention and makes you think 'maybe I better do something.' Then, the solution is presented and you act!
Is this wrong to do?
Is it unethical or harmful to focus on the problems (negative aspects) first before offering a solution?
This will be the subject of our next article.
In the next article we'll be discussing a subject that has created an emotionally charged debate in the network marketing industry.
Ann Sieg and Her 'The 7 Great Lies of Network Marketing' E-book
Coming Up Next...
In the next article, we'll discuss how Ann Sieg has used a "negative-focused" marketing approach much like we've seen marketers and companies do in the wellness industry, and other industries.
We'll discuss the ethics of this approach.
Is it harmful?
Where should we draw the line?
We'll also discuss why Ann Sieg has created such a controversy in the MLM industry, particularly from high income earning uplines.
Join in the discussion or let us hear your opinion. Share your comments with us below.
Become a member here at Hub Pages, and then become a fan so you can follow this discussion. You'll be notified when the next article is available.
Quick Message After Reading Through all the Commnets Below
Well, this turned out to be quite a discussion!
I was hoping to hear from the disgruntled millionaire old-schooler who inspired me to create this Hub.
This article here was born out of an eye-opening (and jaw dropping) email dialogue that all started when I had emailed my list of contacts a video review on Sieg's Renegade (which is below).
I believe he's on my list, or someone forwarded him my email... because I received a very emotionally charged threat in response to my email and video... something about me losing my position in my company because I promoted Ann Sieg's book.
Now I took this as an absurd idea, and so I asked a question (after defusing my emotional charge) and out of curiosity more than anything I sought to understand where he was coming from.
20 or so email exchanges later I realized I was dealing with something that was not logic-based but that was at such an emotional level there was really no way to have a conversation with him.
But after a lot of threats and personal attacks I finally got 'some' concrete answers about why Ann Sieg's book is such a problem for him... and I encouraged him to write those issues down in here.
He said he would. I don't know if that will actually happen but it would be interesting.
In the next article here I'll take some excerpts from that email exchange I had and try to explain his point of view, as objectively as I can (not easy) to see if anyone here thinks there may be any weight to what he was trying to say.
Why is this topic important?
I feel it's important for people in the networking industry to think about this discussion in order to communicate to your prospects and team what the real issue is when they run into someone successful in the industry who is emotionally upset by Sieg's message.
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Comments
I actually agree with you on this. There are quite a few of them learning new skills and changing with the times. In fact, my friend Bob Anderson who is a six-figure income earner for years has made the switch 100%...
I think it's those who have gotten really used to not having to learn new skills that are feeling uncomfortable by all this. I don't mean that in a hurtful way... it's just human nature to resist change. The bottom line, it's going to happen!
I was signing in to publish my first hub when marketingmerge caught my eye. People will be leaving old school network marketing companies in droves if they don't join the 21st century. The more they try to contain us the more we will resist. The whole idea is to be an independent business owner. The secret of the rich is leverage and the biggest tool available to all of us for leverage is the internet.
Well Said, Coach!
Thanks for this. It has amazed me that so many of the 'gurus' of network marketing seem to make most of their money from the training they give (in person, CDs DVDs etc) rather than from their primary MLM business. At least it seems so if you consider the cost of the info they provide. And so many of their 'free' trainings are thinly veiled plugs for their 'system'.
Since DVD/CD production costs are so low now, it would seem to me to be more sense for them to 'give' them away. Now I know that we tend not to value that which costs us nothing.
So how about a system where Information is provided at 'cost' with an undertaking that a receiver would pay more when they have achieved levels of success which the training says it will enable one to achieve? To my way of thinking, I'd attach a lot more credibility to this type of training! This might be so far out that no-one would ever consider it - but it's what I'd like to do when I reach the level of financial success I'm told can be mine!
I've actually been a little fearful that my upline is going to get wind that I'm in Renegade U. and try to shut me down. Now that's a helluva note, isn't it. I could potentially make THEM a ton of money by MORE EFFECTIVELY recruiting prospects. Cheers to you Mike. I'm in this 100%.
Hi Craig,
That is an amazing situation isn't it. It's such a striking example of the two styles of leadership -- do it my way or its the highway (very disempowering), or "find your way and I'll support you the best I can in that process" - (empowering).
Ann said it best to me once - the change is going to happen at the grass roots level... it certainly is!
Mike,
You're right on. If the old school mlm system worked, more than 3% of mlm'ers would be successful. I can't endorse anything with a 97% failure rate with a clear conscience.
It seems to me those old schooler's have ego problems. They probably pad their self esteem by succeeding in a field where few are successful. If the numbers of successful mlm'ers increase, they aren't so special anymore, huh?
And one more though. Change is never embraced by the established old school! So you can interpret the resistance as going down the right path. Keep fighting the good fight!
Pam
If more network marketers learn attraction marketing the uplines will stand to make more income! It's hard to understand how they could oppose that. Change and fear of loss are always a bit uncomfortable due to the unknown. Personally, my upline has not been the most supportive since I've been a "renegade".
The old methods of network marketing were not very empowering to build a sustainable business using the principles of niche marketing, providing value and good service, etc.. This is probably why the majority of networkers fail miserably. In my own experience, once I ran out of warm market all my upline could say were things like "put a new picture on your dream board", "do daily affirmations". The "How to" was missing. All the things we've learned make so much sense.
I now can leave my house without feeling the pressure of prospecting in grocery stores, while being on vacation, etc. My family is happy about that, especially my teenage daughter! Though not as much as I am. : )
Dianne
Hi Mike,
I just introduced my top upline leader to The Renegade University and to The Renegade Network Marketer on Monday. He was very interested as he had tried internet marketing before and had mixed results. He is a very successful networker in my current company using the old school methods so, he was turned off by the negativity of the 7 Great Lies ebook. I partially agreed with him and feel much of the material could be presented with less old school bashing but I really agreed with the frustration Ann was giving voice to in terms of my own experiences.
I emphasized the real gold of the marketing information and the inherent truths therein and he is very willing to learn about it and perhaps recommend it to the troops. My upline understands that network marketing is a number's game and he's all for finding ways to win that game for our entire team.
So, some uplines will, some won't, so what? How's that for a unique twist to our old school philosophy of playing the number's game! LOL
I say, if your upline doesn't support you or at least listen with an open mind and heart, it's time to find a different company and leader.
Lisa
Mike,
Change is always difficult even when it is for the better. Maybe the negative sounding title "7 Lies" is shocking - but let's face it, that's what makes people curious enough to check it out. When they do, you can almost hear the collective sigh of relief as they react, "That's exactly what I've been dealing with!"
What you have done for people like me and the people I work with has been nothing but positive. And bless Ann Sieg for being brave and smart enough to hold us all accountable as to how we conduct our businesses!
Barbara
Hi Mike,
I have been in network marketing off and on for 20 years and living in a small community have never had any real results. When I read Ann's ebook the 7 lies I could really relate to what she said.
What comes to mind about these gurus, the truth hurts especially when they have been dishing out lies for so many years. They have been making a ton of money all these years on lies and now Ann comes along and she is saying "hey these guys are lying to you" they are scared that they're losing credibility. With more and more people turning to attraction marketing they are probably even losing downline members because of it. I'd have to say the only smart thing for them to do is suck up there pride and get on the bandwagon before they get left behind.
I'm in 100%!
Thanks Mike,
John Enns
Hello Mike,
Looks like you have stirred up a hornets nest. If your not rattling someones cage your are not making progress it seems. Stay the course Mike. I have enjoyed everything you have put together and I have made several million dollars from MLM in the past 10 years the old way. I want to move with the times and make a lot more with more effective methods. Thanks again.. Regards Rod.
Hi Mike,
I'm in 100%. I'm glad that I came across your Renegade University because I believe in working smarter and not harder. I know how Ann Seig feels. I told my upline about Renegade University and she was skeptical at first. I just kept on going because I know I came across something that was true and is a break through for many. My up-line learned her upline made the transition from old school to new school now she is a little open with me. Maybe she will come along in the near future.
My upine too, who earns a huge cheque each month, plus he got a car bonus (that the company offers) plus free holidays.... argued with my partner and myself - stating that he does not believe that what we are doing is going to work. He still thinks that the 'old style' marketing is the ONLY way to go. In fact, I did a search on the internet, and my upline is nowhere to be found. My only question is HOW does he still manage to attract prospects to him .. and lots of them, believe me... by 'making' them join?
WOW - This IS a Hot topic with me!
I love the NM Model - but hate the old school approach and have spent way too much time and money on that song and dance routine. I totally support Ann and I really believe that the potential impact of internet technology methods have not even begun to impact the NM industry - but it will, and its going to bring the playing field where it belongs. All of this is still a personal choice, yet I'm blown away of how many people just don’t get it. I've had heated discussions with die hard traditionalists who bash anyone trying to do NM any other way.
Here is the Real Truth about the NM Industry - The whole thing is a money making opportunities from start to finish. From the moment you start thinking about getting in, While your in, and even AFTER you get out. Here's just a brief example: You are a target for money making opportunist who capitalize off your every move - especially if your a failure because they always have yet another system or coaching program just waiting for you to get sucked into.
Lets face it folks - even the big mouthed fancy coaches and seminar leaders make money off of your failure - If you were successful, you wouldn’t need them, so they string you along with hypnotic marketing techniques to keep you drooling for more - they never want your flame to got out. I believe the goal is to keep people stuck in the 97% failure area - product users and that’s all.
Here's my prediction - The hard working technology users will out produce any of the big mouth old fashioned meeting blabbers. The internet reaches a multitude of prospects while meetings attract only half of who said they would make it.
Right now - I'm using the internet for businesses that have people emailing me continually, not the other way around - I never have to prospect when they come looking for me!
Ann is one of the boldest people in the industry to do what she has done - but its still a choice, isn’t it - and your going to allow yourself to do only what fits you. The threat to the NM industry is in your head - between your ears. As long as you are compliant with respect to the product representation of your company there is no way they can remove you. We are all independent business people - so lets work our business and support Ann with what ever she produces.
The internet is an ever changing science – but the key is “Success Leaves Clues”, you just need to know where to look. Ann is helping you, she has the vision - Follow The Leader if you arent one already!
Finally free at last!
It is about time the truth came out at last.I really thought that someting was
actually wrong with me.It is time for the NM industry to be revolutionized with
new and innovative effective marketing.This is the #1 reason why 50% of
new recruits leave network marketing companies after just 90 days in these
companies.90% leave after 6 mos.or a year later.The old traditional played
out worn out marketing model is never going to work today.It's not 1988
or 1992.We are living in technology times.Not a time warp.LOL.....
The analogy of positive marketing vs negative marketing was great! I too like to focus on the positive. But creating negative headlines that intrigue people works!
I do agree that Ann's book exposes the negatives of the old school "prospecting and closing", "telling and selling" style. But It is all true for her and many others in the NM industry. Also I've spoken about it with some of those same family members I used to chase to become customers and reps and the reaction is amazing.
Apparently they thought that the old school, traditional ways were unprofessional, bothersome and tacky too. Which is why they wouldn't give me there business even though they were already consumers of the products I sell AND they would really save money with me! It's that funny?
So it's not just the NM who have converted to InterNetwork Marketers tat are happy, our friends and family who are now forever "off the hook" are excited too...
I had an in depth conversation with my father, who was never a fan of the old schools methods because it always seemed like you were begging for a hand out, and his main question was, :why didn't you do this sooner?"
I was on a training call a few weeks ago and my upline distinctly said, "if it looks different it is different, and in order for us to be successful as a team, we must ALL follow the same system."
There was acknowledgement that other systems "out there" that worked but we must move as a unit...blah, blah, blah...I just stopped getting on the calls.
I am so happy being part of Renegade University and meet such a fresh new line. Congratulation to Anna to tell her opinion so frankly. I think there are more who are glad to hear it than less. I have a lot of problem on business line, though maybe I am not just that type, but somewhowe I,ve dropped into it and it is a difficult way for me to get on, have lost a lot of money, was listening to everybody and I think it will be need a lot of energy to get on with it well.
Thank you to take part on debate.
Malika, this is a very good point. The new model diffuses a lot of the resistance we would run into previously--it's just evaporated in the new model.
In the old model I used to have DAILY morning 'mindset' conference calls to teach how to approach their cold call leads or friend and family with the right 'posture' so that the associate would 'feel' good about the process and create an environment whereby the prospect would feel attracted to the idea.
It was very hard to teach this and I know realize this was because the entire situation of approaching people to look at some information or buy something immediately and automatically turns people off... so it's an uphill battle (for your mindset and belief system) and for the sell.
In this new model, as you're talking about, it immediate removed that major pitfall completely, without 'working on changing beliefs' or learning how to 'posture oneself' with a prospects. This just happens automatically as you set things up so people initiate the connection with you (from visiting your blog, to joining your email list, or even contacting you first, which will happen a lot once all your marketing components are in place). This is what other businesses have known that the MLM industry had gotten away from. The Internet has really, for the first time, allowed the average person to use their network marketing business as a part of a REAL business model. Refreshing!
This has been a great discussion.... a lot of insightful posts!
The negatives need to be out there. I like the direction Ann is going. I have been looking for a way to grow my MLM without going to meetings and driving my freinds crazy if not running the other way.
The Old School way is dead but because there are still many old school uplines who are making substantial incomes, they perceive "change" as a threat to what they have built. It's understandable to a degree, they don't want anyone rocking the boat BUT, and this is a big BUT, ALL industries change and there is NOTHING you can do to stop that. Resisting change is ultimately futile and in the end by not adapting, you kill yourself in business. There's no other way... Network Marketing is growing up folks and for me personally, I say bring it on! The old ways stunk anyway....
I have never seen anything like this before. I have wasted some money and lots of time over the past three or nfour years.
I am just finishing Ann Sieg's Renegade Networkas far as I can see this is a classic edition that I will always refer to in the future.
Sincerly,
Jim Murphy Jr
Very nice job for an 8 day old page! Good luck and you really nailed a great spot on Google. Did you pay for that or did you just design a great page? Good luck to you and I will visit again!!!
Ann definitely crossed the line she went to far in her book. She should know better than to chastise what works and reinvent the wheel. What’s wrong with conformity, people follow leaders and leaders have to have sovereignty.
The cold fact about leadership is that you have to be ahead of the game. Ann has delivered the tool of reason and unleashed free thinking in the ranks of numerous down lines. The magnitude of business owners that were driving their business and bank accounts into oblivion are empowered to embrace ingenuity. The “leaders” that have been lounging on their loins have been broadsided and in fact are intimidated by the unknown. They can’t really convert without contradicting their philosophy, which only fuels the fires as they watch on the sidelines.
Ann’s book is the digital audio for the networking industry. Times have changed and they can lead, follow, or get out of the way.
Hi Jonica,
I noticed this page landed on the front page of Google, which is one of the things we actually teach how to do at Marketing Merge (with Renegade Professional training). Note, however, that in my experience it will be off and on Google's front page before it settles in.
This page here though really isn't for any direct marketing of anything--what I'd like to do is really bring some clarity to the controversy Ann Sieg's books started so that network marketers understand the emotional element at work when their uplines resist her message so fearfully.
There are many uplines who don't resist it... but there's a large number who are very uncomfortable by the success Ann has had in getting the word out about 'the new way' of marketing. We'll have a few more articles and some videos on this topic, not just to create a big frenzy here, but to (also) create more awareness for networkers who have had close relationships with uplines who are controlling in nature.
It's important that all network marketers realize they are in business for themselves. Nobody should be allowed to tell you what you can and cannot do in your business, particulary when it concerns sharing information or following a certain business strategy. These are the topics we really wanted to uncover here over the next few weeks.
Thanks everyone for sharing.
I've received a few more emails from some wealthy MLM uplines who oppose Sieg's strategies for marketing.
I'll spend a little time sharing their concerns here to really bring more clarity to all of this.
My personally feeling is that people's feelings have been hurt, perhaps more than them fearing losing their downlines, etc... I think some uplines just feel personally attacked.
Some people are more sensitive than others and this may be part of the negative reaction as well.
Yes Ann Sieg has opened a new arena for Network Marketing. Truth is that Networking as we did know it was a person to person event. Prehaps that is why we find companies and upline leaders not supporting Ann's theories. My personal business experience has all been in the sales of insurance products. Many direct sales companies have been successful but usually with very simple products, or products that just provide coverage on a limited basis.
My concern is will we be able to get that relationship built to successfully bring these propects, the new clicking friends, into our primary business opportunity. Of course, at this point in the Renegade University we haven't spent much time on marketing. I'm sure that will be a vitial part of our success. Can't hardly wait.
One more comment, can you see your company attempting to provide the training that Mike is offering. It wouldn't be pretty, I'm thinking.
So, it's onward and upward, let's show the industry what they have been missing.
MJ
Hi Mike, it's interesting to see top earners being so worried and giving you a thousand words. I can only imagine it's because the truth does indeed hurt. I can remember first reading the the 7 Great Lies and feeling so angry and cheated because I could relate to everything Ann wrote. What I don't understand is why this guy you have been exchanging emails with has a problem, because it can only help him, not harm him. My first reaction was to start doing business the new way as soon as I could. I think sometimes the saying is true..... you can't teach an old dog new tricks... no offense to older folk, I'm not so young myself.
keep up the excellent effort Mike, you have more people for you than against I'm sure
Everyone was just caught offguard.But if the top earners want a fight,they already lost it even before the bell gets ringing.When i read the Renegade Network marketer, i felt like i have just gotten to earth.I havent read an online marketing book with such simplicity. It was awesome,thats all i can say.
Interesting dialogue.
We use offline AND online marketing to promote our network marketing business. And it's working.
In my opinion, where people seem to go awry is in thinking it needs to be one or the other. It does not. all the top earners in our company do online and offline. Maybe I'm lucky this is the case, apparently this isn't the case in all companies...
I'm glad that we are discussing this. I am VERY careful what I tell my upline. I find that I get into arguments with one of them every time I attend a business training meeting.
What I see is this: a number of people who want to believe that because they achieved success using a particular model or process, this process is the highest value they offer us. In their mind it is something that is duplicatable. They are threatened by anyone who suggests that there might be more than One Way. If they admit there are other paths to success and other skill sets needed by new NMers, they admit they can't show others the way to make it. I'm sure I would be at a loss myself if my skills turned out to be "behind the times" and inadequate for training successful business recruits.
So, this is my approach: experiment, put Attraction Marketing and online marketing into practice, make it work for my business and my team, and lead by example.
Did Ann Sieg cross the line? I don't know--but I do know that if you are so bold and lead with a controversial and somewhat accusatory headline e.g. Lies it shouldn't shock us that some people feel that she has pointed a finger at them and screamed "Liars! You are liars!" Defensiveness should not be surprising in this situation.
Should Ann Sieg have "called the process" and noticed out loud that the Emperor has no clothes? Of course she should have. Moving on, I suggest we deal with defensiveness as compassionately as possible and keep on keeping on. Lead by example and reach out with our success to show others "how to".
I always look at things a little differently, I like to look from a higher standpoint.
I think what we se happening here, is what we see happening all over the world right now.
a paradigm shift.
In the old paradigm only few were in power, in the new paradigm power is shared equally, resources are shared equally and a consciousness of enough for everyone is being born.
When ever such a transformation takes places, a lot of resistance can be seen, because the old way does not yet know what the new way will look like, and it fears that it has to die.
Ann is serving as a catalyst.
She is doing all of us a huge service, by putting herself out there and speaking her truth.
And just to use the analogy of the caterpillar and the butterfly, Ann is the cocoon.
She enables us all to grow wings.
This is what I think.
Hi Mike
My dinosaur of an Upline tried to get me kicked out of our MLM accusing me of promoting another MLM biz, namely, the Renegade system! Clearly a case of not checking the facts before acting. Thankfully our Compliance Dept DID and recognised that I was promoting a Lead Generation System.
Now this all started when one of my downline decided to promote the 7 Lies e-book!
So my advice is to take care in how how you promote the Renegade system, recognise that many of the highly successful upline built their businesses before most folk even heard of the Internet!
And the best revenge to get back on an ignorant dinosaur is to use the Renegade system and build a big business!
Expect success!
Bob
You know when I came into NM, I believed my up-line. I fell for the hype, hook, line, and sinker. I bought all the books, tapes, attended meetings, I knew my fortune was in the next "Pep Rally". Well 4 years later, the car is not in my driveway and I am $25,000 in debt.
I have to take a look at what has happened over those past 4 years. I have been on and off my game, humilated, degraded, embarrised, shunned, made to feel small, ignored...... Now it seems to me I was in the process of regrouping to find the next sucker. I keep waiting for my big fish to hit the hook and real me to the gold mine. Or so that is what I was told, "Just find the 4", I am sure we have all been exposed to that building block.
Now we are facing some serious challenges in the country I live in, as well as my mlm company . I have seen a major decline in purchases and I will bet you this, if this Internet Marketing makes the bucks, ($$$), and it will, here is it next step. MlM companies will be running to their corporate attornies looking for a way to promote Ann's book at the next Rah, Rah, meeting.
Here is a tip, I just had cards made specifically for the next big convention, I have nothing on them about my mlm company everything is about internet marketing.
I am promoting me, I own real estate on the web and you know I am doing nothing unethical or deceptive. This is my business, Ann has shown a world how to promote our business in an way that follows the guidelines of our MLM companies. The fact that we can earn a little marketing cash along the way is no different that purchasing our marketing material from our companies all the while making them some extra buck for their marketing. I have chosen to redirect my marketing $$$'s.
I have confidence now, when I go to the grocery market, I am acually going to buy groceries and not prospect. I have my marketing material on the WWW, it is working for me.
I praise Ann and her willingness to challenge an industry that is stuck in the stone age. Also, I could not leave without praising Mike. You have started a new frontier, click by click, for us baby boomers. I could not be putting this together without the both of you.
Thanks
Nanny Patty
"My way. . . or the Highway," huh? I'm so grateful that The Renegade System isn't tied to a particular product.
I'm still trying mightily to get my system up and running . . . very slow when you're only able to do it part-time . . . but am pluggin' away at it!
Note of caution, however. My company just sent out a blanket email saying that using any of their materials, without preapproval, would be cause for termination. Can't blame them, considering copyright laws, etc., etc. So . . . PARAPHRASE, REGURGITATE, RESTATE . . . BUT DON'T VIOLATE COPYRIGHT LAWS!! (It's not only potential cause for termination, but against the law!
Hi Viking Seller,
There is no reason to use any of your companies materials on your site. You are branding you. Once you have attracted people to you via your lead capture page and have built a relationship with your prospect then and only then would you introduce your company. When you follow the teachings of Ann Sieg and Mike Klingler you learn all sorts of ways to monetize along the way.
Irene
After I read Ann's e-book, I was relieved. I did what my upline suggested but did not see huge results. I firmly believe that my upline was not trying to deceive. They were teaching the only method they knew that worked for them. I want to thank Ann for being bold enough to share her experience and give the rest of us hope. Let's fact it, Ann's e-book goes against the business model that leaders have used for years to build their MLM businesses. These leaders, however, should not be upset by Ann's e-book. They should be thanking her for giving hope to their distributors who have not succeeded. Ann's e-book should be looked upon as an opportunity to help the struggling distirbutors succeed. My point of view about network marketing is when you help others succeed, your success becomes automatic.
I was also originally trained in the "old school" ways when I first became involved with NM in the early eighties. Fortunately, I am in a compnay that teaches "new school" marketing using the internet so I am truly blessed.
I think probably the biggest reaction to Ann's book is the fact that many feel they are being called liers. That would pretty much offend most people. I don't feel that MLM/NM successors have lied altogether. The old ways did work and there is no denying that for many people. The fact is that times change and we now have more ways of communicating with people than there was in the beginning of MLM.
If that is embraced, it can be a benefit to all. However, many people who are already making six figures are proof that their system is working, so therefore, they will be harder to convince that a change is needed for the "newbies" that haven't already built their empire. I believe that in time, most companies will begin to see that change is necessary. Will some wait too late? Probably so. But I think for the most part, it will happen and the companies will begin to embrace the change. I am grateful that I am with a company that lets you decide what you are more comfortable with for your business rather than trying to force their business strategies down your throat in an effort to make you believe it is best for you.
Bonnie
Thanks for a very interesting hub, you have obviously struck the nerve.
I was in involved in MLM some 20 years ago.
I have never heard of Ann Sieg or her book. May be because after three years with a down line of over 10,000. I walked away.
Great information look forward to much more
Ann Sieg and Her 'The 7 Great Lies of Network Marketing' E-book
I know my upline didnt like it when i showed him the rengade e book
Personally I have a real (negative) issue with this kind of marketing... period.
I think marketers actually focus on negatives to gain trust... they give try to make the reader believe they are on their side, when in actual fact they just want to rob them.
I have absolutely zero faith in or time for ebooks, especially when titled:
"The 7 Great Lies of Network Marketing"
My only thought is "what are you gonna do, add numbers 8 - 14".
thanks for sharing this stuff to all of us...
It really is beyond me. I don't understand what the big fear is with these uplines.
The larger their downline becomes thru attraction marketing the larger their check becomes. In my 20 plus years in and out of different companies the attrition rate is inevitable with the old model. Its their wake up call! People are sick and tired.
Ann Sieg is my hero : )
2ken said: Now I know that we tend not to value that which costs us nothing.
That's just an excuse your upline/company uses to justify the cost of their training / joining fee :-)
The statement may or may not be true but it is an example of something that is just blindly accepted without question.
My own view is if something is valuable people will value it. Free or otherwise.
Thanks for the info. Its pretty interesting stuff. There may not be the need for all of the negativity, but I wonder if its really possible to only do "Attraction Marketing?"
Interesting Hub! I have been involved in MLM in the past but never had any great success. People do become very successful in MLM with the OLD SCHOOL methods. I think that what Ann Sieg said about the 7 lies of MLM may be true in some cases but not all. There are good opportunities, with good products and good training systems out there, and those that want to make it bad enough more often than not, do become successful in those systems. But it is not for everybody. Attraction Marketing is a great alternative. I have found that this works better for me.
The thing I always find funny about network marketing people is the whole "fake it till you make it" philosophy. It seems like it's always a bunch of broke people who make zero money (or close to zero money) ranting and raving about how they unlocked the secret riches.
Reminds me of one of my favorite quotes (can't remember who said it), which is:
"Beware the naked man who tries to sell you his shirt"
There are a whole LOT more than SEVEN measely LIES! wow ! I have been working online for over a decade! This is the tiny tip of the ice berg.
Well, this turned out to be quite a discussion!
I was hoping to hear from the disgruntled millionaire old-schooler who inspired me to create this Hub.
This article here was born out of an eye-opening (and jaw dropping) email dialogue that all started when I had emailed my list of contacts a video review on Sieg's Renegade (which is below).
I believe he's on my list, or someone forwarded him my email... because I received a very emotionally charged threat in response to my email and video... something about me losing my position in my company because I promoted Ann Sieg's book.
Now I took this as an absurd idea, and so I asked a question (after defusing my emotional charge) and out of curiosity more than anything I sought to understand where he was coming from.
20 or so email exchanges later I realized I was dealing with something that was not logic-based but that was at such an emotional level there was really no way to have a conversation with him.
But after a lot of threats and personal attacks I finally got 'some' concrete answers about why Ann Sieg's book is such a problem for him... and I encouraged him to write those issues down in here.
He said he would. I don't know if that will actually happen but it would be interesting.
In the next article here I'll take some excerpts from that email exchange I had and try to explain his point of view, as objectively as I can (not easy) to see if anyone here thinks there may be any weight to what he was trying to say.
Why is this topic important?
I feel it's important for people in the networking industry to think about this discussion in order to communicate to your prospects and team what the real issue is when they run into someone successful in the industry who is emotionally upset by Sieg's message.
As is usually the case in life, most of the hostility surrounding this issue is based on a lack of clarity and understanding. This is not as black-and-white as it may seem at first glance, and it will only be through empathy and a willingness to embrace what truly works that we will all be able to move forward in an effort to improve this industry.
As other people have noted already, traditional NWM'ers are not an evil, conniving group. Of course, there will always be opportunists in any industry, but I truly believe that most of the successful people in Network Marketing have a sincere desire to help others succeed as they have. When someone seems to be pointing the finger at them, claiming they have been succeeding at the EXPENSE of others, their defensiveness is understandable. They see this new system as an attempt to discredit everything they have based their careers on, and so they retaliate by attacking back before they really understand what it is based on.
One clear example of this is a statement I have seen several times from my personal upline. It points out that Network Marketing is a business of relationships, and that you can't build it using something as impersonal as the internet. This is a very important statement, because it reveals a clear misunderstanding of the basic principles of the attraction marketing model. Anyone who has educated themselves at even a rudimentary level on this subject should understand that attraction marketing is not an attempt to automate the relationships that MUST be cultivated in order to build a successful business.
What attraction marketing DOES do is match up interested prospects with qualified sponsors in a much more efficient manner than has been traditionally done. It simply filters out those people that are NOT a good match for the business opportunity, which allows the potential sponsor to focus on establishing connections with those people that appear to be a good fit. Once that connection has been made, it's up to the sponsor to cultivate that relationship with each person they make contact with. This is where the experience of traditional network marketers can pay off, because they have developed real skills in cultivating relationships. Once they understand this about attraction marketing, I feel they will be much more likely to embrace it as another tool to add to their belt.
With any new paradigm shift, there is always some resistance. For an industry to survive and thrive, though, it MUST be able to adapt and change according to new conditions in the environment. I think the following quote sums this up quite nicely:
"Only in growth, reform and change, paradoxically enough, is true security to be found." - Anne Morrow Lindbergh
Lane
H
Of course Ann Sieg crossed the line the line of insanity to sanity! A. Enstein is quoted as having said that doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results is insanity. He also said that if you have never made a mistake then you haven't tried something new!
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Airsled says:
6 weeks ago
I really don't 'get' why these uplines that make huge amounts of money evey month are upset. Don't they realize that if they changed over and learned Attraction Marketing their income would grow. Not to mention what will happen to their income if all the people in their downline used Attraction Marketing. Wouldn't their income just explode in their faces? HELLO!