Your thoughts please on gay relationship and/or gay marriages.
62Gay & Lesbian Just As Equal With God & U.S.A.
Gay & Lesbian's V.S. God... The Truth
Tell me in the bible where God tells "us" His people to condemn lesbians or gays, or anyone for that matter. I want scripture proof where it says it. I pledge $777 to the person who proves it from the bible right here on my hub! I promise!
Now that i've set the limits... it's time I back up what I'm saying. God tells us to love everyone including our enemies. He says that we shouldn't be involved in same sex sexual instances, however, He doesn't say anything about what "we" His people are to do about it! He simply tells us to love everyone no matter what just as He would and does. Remember this when your condemning people for being gay or lesbian. Remember how God loved the world so much that He gave His son to die on the cross for our sins. Including the gays and lesbians! Remember that!
Next. About the whole laws and stuff. They should have the same right to marriage and everything because they are american. The constitution isn't written for everyone but them. It's written for every american. It has no outs for anyone what so ever. Your american, your free! It's that simple. You have every right to everything every other American does. It says nothing about Gay or Lesbian Marriage anywhere in the Marriage Laws when the Constitution was written and adding it would be a change to the whole thing and completely illegal! Any comments Please send now! I'd love to prove where I'm coming from.
I am a strong Christain and beleive in God with all of my heart and will not stand and let false people who say they beleive in God say lies about what God doesn't and does allow in His world. We are to love everyone and let God work in their lives how He wishes and not worry about whether they are wrong or right with God. After all it's not you who died on the cross for our sins it was Jesus!
Have an aweosme day.
Espian~
Gay's Getting Married
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I don't want to know about anybody's marriage or relationships, I got my own to worry about.
I can see why the three of us are here. It must have been another hub that was rappin' on the same subject only different on views. I am a certified girl in all aspect so I have no say in this.
this one is more of a straightforward approach, or should we call it gayforward?
i think gayleaning is more apt :D
I can't believe it, I'm really becoming an on line junkie. Let's talk somewhere else. We can mess around on Cris hub again just please not here. Or we can rap with goldentoad on the same subject.
I agree with you completely, Espian. I too am a christian, and also appauled at how christians treat gays.
I live in California and the state recently passed (by a very small margin) proposition 8 to repeal the laws that made gay marriage legal just a short time ago.
I was shocked and offended to hear my wonderful Pastor telling the congregation to make sure and vote, especially on prop 8. He even made it clear they should vote "YES" on prop 8 because it was worded tricky. He wanted to be sure everyone knew they should vote to take marriage away from gays.
This proposition even got my best friend to the polls. I don't think she's ever voted in her life, knows nothing about politics, and yet felt so strongly about abolishing gay marriage that she registered and voted this year.
I, however, agree with you. God loves EVERYONE, not everyone except the gays. In my opinion banning gays from being legally married is akin to racism. Just like the days when laws in this country said Americans could vote, but ONLY if they were white.
Yeah, I agree also Espy!
Blue lotus, I stopped going to church for that reason. When the pastor started talking all sorts of crazy (hateful in my eyes) talk about gay people and God's laws and changing who they are etc...I had enough. We even got into an arguement about it during Bible study.
It is a shame, I also live in California and can't believe that the gay marriage ruling was overturned. I really can't believe that America is still full of people who expect to be treated as decent human beings, to have their freedoms especially in the love department, but turn around and take away the rights of others because thier lives do not agree with (thier rightous and holy lives -my ass!) their lives.
Its just ridiculous!
I don't know what the religious groups were thinking when they fought so hard against Prop 8, if it failed its not like it was going to make the gay population go away, they only made it stronger.
To treat gays as decent human beings is one thing. To allow them the full protection of the law as other citizens is good.
What many gays have problems with is the fact that homosexiuality is a sin. Before you go ballistic on me, let me explain. Lying is a sin. Stealing is a sin. Homosexuality is a sin. Murder is a sin. It is all in the Word of God. Is one worse or better than another? In the eyes of man, yes, but in the eys of God, NO.
Christians are not commanded to condemn anyone, but we are commanded to judge right from wrong. Even as God loved the world and gave His only begotten son, the world is condemned already.
Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Joh 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
I know Goldentoad, it was my arguement with the church. The pastor insisted that gay people cause hate crimes towards the chuch while I insisted that they are to acceptable and loved and given the same rights as us and that the hate crimes were coming from the church people not the gay community.
How do you figure SirDent? Jesus was pretty specific about not judging others because we are all "sinners". As a matter of fact, I also think Jesus was pretty specific about not even judging ourselves.
People make them liars, being gay is not a sin and when one causes another to sin, well that sin is on you.
Read 1 Corintians 13 and also Isaiah 45. Everything was made for a purpose and God made them all and not Satan. It says so in Isaiah 45.
Honestly why do people care if gays get married? I know many conservatives get upset with talk on banning guns or higher taxes because they claim the government is way too involved in our lives. However, on the other hand conservatives want abortion to be illegal and to treat all gays like second class citizens. In this many conservatives contradict themselves because they claim to want less government, but only on issues that meet their moral approval. I voted no on prop eight and was a little sad to see people actually voted for it, but not completely surprised because of the evangelical movement here in the US. Back in the eighties my relatives never talked about going to church or God, but then a few years ago they "found" religion. It seems as if this new breed of fundamentalism is very vigilante and likes to call everyone out of their behavior. Let people get married, it does not concern you. I live my own life and cannot imagine how people have the time or the energy to determine who and who should not get married, etc.
I say this SirDent, I think buttplugging sounds like a punishment for me but I am not going to worry about what other people like to do. If God wants to punish them, that's his business, not mine. I tend to believe we can only judge what is right or wrong for ourselves, not others. I also say, if the world is condemned already, I'm going to screw as much as possible because I heard theres none of that in either heaven or hell.
Everyone has the right to choose the life they wish to lead. The pursuit of happiness is a right.
I believe same sex relationships and marriages should be as equal as traditional relationships and marriages. With all equality recognized and respected...But I am 100% pro-choice. Everyone desreves fair and equal treatment. It is time this world ends all discrimination and dark ages thinking.
Joh 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
The Bible states that men with men is abomination to God. To read more about judging I wrote a hub a few weeks ago when everyone was tossing around the judge not lest you be judged phrase.
http://hubpages.com/hub/JudgeNotLestYeBeJudged
Now, I don't see what the big deal is. Sin is sin no matter who does it. We have all fallen short. Me, you, all gays, every man, woman, and child that was ever born.
Do you have any other references, or is the Bible it?
Twitst them scriptures all you want! That is what you are taught to do. No where in the Bible does it mention Homosexual. What does it mean exactly when it says man should not lay with a man---does it say sex or intercourse exactly?
When you use a single verse out of context and then when the whole paragraph is posted you then turn that into a history lesson that says that so and so was talking to so and so---history is history and all this calims to be for the edification of the jews and not the general public--so taking veres out of context and using them as swords is just empty. Not one of us was there to know exactly what and how it was said and in what context it was said--if said at all.
Try talking people to people and not using empty verses from a Bible. Listen to what is in your very own heart and not what is told to you that you should seek from some man who claims to know what you are listening too.
This hub was written asking for opinions and asking for someone to show where the Bible says for believers to condemn gays. I answered and even said believers are not to condemn gays. Maybe you should get hold of your anger and read the comment again.
Its tough for us sinners to always play by the rules. Gotta go get some breakfast now, you kids do anything you want, just don't burn down the house.
Sir Dent, anytime that I have a different opionon then he "establishment" it is said that I am angry. That is empty too. Yes it said that it wanted opinions and I posted mine---so you just do what you always do and cut me down and insinnuate that I have no opinion or that I cannot speak mine.
I think you should look in the mirror and se you own anger.
Any religion that teaches unconditional love, then puts conditions on love is a religion I would never subscribe too. Which is probably why I don't put much faith in "organized" religion.
Maybe Ghandi said it best, "I love your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Because they don't act like your Christ."
I have to agree with you on "organized" religion St. James.
I agree with you too St. James.
Lady Guinevere says:52 minutes ago
Sir Dent, anytime that I have a different opionon then he "establishment" it is said that I am angry. That is empty too. Yes it said that it wanted opinions and I posted mine---so you just do what you always do and cut me down and insinnuate that I have no opinion or that I cannot speak mine.
I think you should look in the mirror and se you own anger.
SirDent: My comment about anger was not directed at you. In fact your comment wasn't showing until after I posted mine, although yours came before it. It was directed at Goldentoadand his comment. (goldentoad says:67 minutes ago
I say this SirDent, I think buttplugging sounds like a punishment for me but I am not going to worry about what other people like to do. If God wants to punish them, that's his business, not mine. I tend to believe we can only judge what is right or wrong for ourselves, not others. I also say, if the world is condemned already, I'm going to screw as much as possible because I heard theres none of that in either heaven or hell.)
___________________________________________________________
Unconditional love is just that. It puts no conditions on the person or object being loved. You can love someone who is dead just as much as you can someone who is alive.
What unconditional love does not do is justify bad behavior, nor does it erase it. if God allowed man to go into heaven full of sin, then heaven is nothing more than the earth as it is right now. Atonement for sin was made by Jesus when he died on the cross and was resurected on the third day. A person must make the choice to follow Jesus and believe in Him.
God says believe it or don't believe it. It is that simple.
St. James in the hizouse!
Are my comments moderated now or was it a site glitch??
??????????
I posted a comment earlier that is showing unapproved. Must have been a glitch on the site. That last one was to test and see what was going on.
I don't care. Everyone should be entitled to adult, consensual relationships in my view, homosexual or hetrosexual, monogamous or open. Each to his own, and I'll leave the details to the individuals concerned.
:D
Funny but it's only now I realized that Espian only answered a request and did not edit the title - though in hindsight, had he edited the title it still wouldn't have prevented us from imposing our thoughts on the subject on one another! or would it? hmmm....
The laws are made by PEOPLE and imposed by PEOPLE. The PEOPLE who make the laws are elected by PEOPLE to represent the PEOPLE'S wishes for government, including what laws will be imposed and upon whom and in what way.
For that reason, until more PEOPLE accept gays and lesbians as their own EQUALS, there will be discrimination. It seems to me that rational PEOPLE understand and believe that all of us are EQUAL -- there should be no difference based on sex, race, creed, nationality or sexual orientation. However, the PEOPLE who have the huge problem with it hide behind some vague references supposedly in the Bible that say homosexuality is a "sin."
Sins should be dealt with in church. Laws that affect people's status as citizens are dealt with by lawmakers. Separation of church and state, anyone?
BTW, homosexuality is just one variation on the human race. We are ALL God's creatures and God loves ALL OF US UNCONDITIONALLY. I really like that Ghandi quote, St. James. Right (and left, and rainbow and everything else) on!!!
I want to thank everyone for all of their comments! Thanks so much! If your not a fan please be one. Thanks.
Dear Mighty Mom,
I want to respond to your comment about how the Church and State are separated. That is true, however, the church is just the body of beleivers. So therefore. It doesn't really apply. This is because every american has the right to vote. Either athiest, Christian, Catholic, Lutheran, etc. So when you use separation of church and state in this sense for "Voting" it doesn't count. As you said before the people vote. And Christians are People Voting For or Against. So There For the Body of Chirst "Church" are voting and have the right. I'm still saying that they SHOULD have the same rights as everyone else. This isn't a matter of who can vote or not or who should vote, but instead Which should be allowed. Whether from a legal position or Religious, either one applies to Voting so therefore they both are important and equally accepted here. I just want your opinions of Gay and Lesbian Marriages. I appreciate them. Thanks.
Espian~
I just wanted to say, that I fully support gay marriage. Live long, be happy, and as long as nobody gets hurt, I think any lifestyle is fine.
SirDent,
The issue of gays has been a sensitive one world over but I agree with your opinion.
No man has the right to condemn others in what they believe or practice but if we believe the Bible, then we have to accept the fact that God condemns man to man, and woman to woman relationship.
Kindly take a look at Romans 1:17-32 but precisely verses 26 and 27, Genesis 19:1-5.
The truth is that even people who believe that homosexuality is sinful do not do so because they love to but because they have to believe God's word.
The idea to isolate such people is absolutely wrong as every form of judgement on values and opinions would be done by God who created man.
I believe that it is a matter of the carnal mind, everyone is tested with this factor in todays world. Not just for homosexuals but for most men there is a constant bombardment of pronographic, or erotic images spread across the internet, television, even in public we see scandily clad men and women in the summer time on a daily basis.
I recently read in a magazine a comparison of womens faces, the question was; is she a porno star or a news castor? You couldn't tell the difference. The world want's to prove that marriage means nothing, that dodging comitment is considered smart, and sacrifice is foolish.
What is wrong with the human body? Absolutely nothing. It is what is what is in the minds that is the problem, not the hman body.
exactly the mind sees the erotic immages and indulges in fantacies which destroy spirituality. The soul crushing, family destroying, images which remain steadfast, and locked into the human imagination. One thing is for certain; the brain will not vomet back filth.
Just how many can look at the naked body and just see it for what it is--a machine that does wonderous things. See I am not like most people out there, I don't fantasize that way. I only see what the body is and isn't and the way it works. I only see what is the soul or spirit of a person and I see a color accossiated with that person. Sure I can look at porn, but I don't really get aroused tha way, well sometimes. That isn't bad in itself if you keep it in the right aspect. There are reasons for everything--even some porn. The ones who go overboard are the ones that make this body not so beautiful.
i have to disagree with you about that, Pornography in all of it's forms is detrimental to the soul, no matter how soft or hard it is, one is fooled into thinking that it is harmless is to refuse to see evil as it truely is.
I qwould say that all men who are in a state of nature or a carnal state are in the gall of bitterness, and the bonds of iniquity, they are without God in the world and have gone contrary to the nature of God; therefore they areb in a state contrary to the nature of happiness.
off to work.
I would have to disagree with you on that porn thing. Case in point--those who find it hard to have an erection or have a problem with arousal and are married---some of those people need some kind of stimulus. Is it porn if it is within the confines of a marriage and both know about it and conscent to it? If it is to strengthen a marriage then it is not porn but a tool in which they both can achieve a better relationhip with each other.
What presumtions do you place on God? If he made everythign and everythign is good then there is no bad--including the human body that he made exlusively for us to enjoy. You don't think God put in the right mechanisms if we fail to use it as he wished us too? You belittle his directive and his power? God is in control of everything and he knows what we need and when we need it..
I agree with LondonGirl - Each to their own as we move into the 21st century. Recognition of gay relationships and marriage is long overdue.
I think it is a very loving thing to tell someone that what they are doing is not good/right/beneficial. We all applaud a parent who warns a child about the danger of putting their hand on a hot stove. We commend them for telling their child not to do it. We are thankful that they grab their hand and pull it away as the child slowly moves it to be burned by the electric coils. That is love.
If you think that homosexuality is not good for the individuals that practice it and causes them real and actual emotional, physical, psychological, and spiritual harm - I think you do well to speak and to vote as your concious dictates.
I make no judgments. I do know what the Bible says about it. And I stand firm on the belief that everyone should keep his sex life private. Period.
Romans 1:26-27 - For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another ; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving it within themselves . . .
It goes on to say; who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
Leviticus 18:22 - Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
Corinthians 6:9 lists homosexuals among those who will not inherit the earth. Genesis 19:1-13 is the story of Sodom and Gomorrah where Lot told the homosexuals of the city seeking the male angel visitors: "Don't do this wicked thing."
Now that depends on the version of the Bible that you read, because in the Young's literal translantion there is not mention of the word homosexual at all.
Lay with another man---you just got to read the Jimmy Swaggart and Homosexuality hub that I wrote and my thoughts are in the commetns. To much to copy over here.
One cannot just take one verse and surmize that it is the whole thing and the whole of the meaning. One needs to read the whole paragraph to understand what it is conveying.
Hey thanks for all the comments. Please join my fanclub if you haven't already. Thanks. Oh and check out my latest hub on Teen's Being Ancored. Have an awesome night.
Espian~
Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Only God most High has authority to condem. Many alwas say christians are condeming or judging when we speak what the word of God says about same sex marriage.
Lev. 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Abomination
Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. Read all of Romans Chapter 1 vs 30 says inventors of evil things.
Genesis2:24
Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
Matthew 19:4
And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
Matthew 19:5
And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
God wishes that no one to perish in their sins but come to repentance. Please surrender your life to Jesus Christ the one who will set you free.
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Cris A says:
12 months ago
I don't give much thought on things that don't bother me. That said, I think sometimes having a conviction weighs more than what the conviction is. Thanks for speaking you're mind out. Soldier on! :D