Cougars? May-December? Does Age Matter When You're Dating?
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Pre-Conceived Notions
When I was 27, I dated a 57 year old man
Are you having that knee-jerk 30 year age difference ewwww-reaction?
I was old enough to make informed decisions. I didn’t want to have kids, I had solid career goals and I was well on my way to making them realities.
He was well educated and very well traveled. He knew things in a warm and worldly way, and he shared those things with me. He was younger looking than his years, and I was very attracted to him. Think Stephen Tyler circa 1986. Many people commented that we looked pretty cool together.
He was fascinated by my writing. He was encouraging. He taught me about wine, and hedge funds. I taught him about art and literature. We shared quite a few interests which ranged from poetry readings to hockey to concerts. We had a great time together. We each brought something to the relationship. I felt strong, and desirable. And I hope he felt the same.
It wasn’t a long relationship. Neither of us was interested in a long term thing at the time. After a 7 or 8 month friendship and romance, he moved back to Europe and we wished each other happy lives. It’s something I look back on with fondness.
What’s Important
Who is the right person for you to date?
Obviously the answer is different for everyone. But there are some things I think we can all agree with. You should date someone that respects you. You should date someone that makes you feel strong, and beautiful, and smart, and loved. You should be with someone that listens to you and believes in you. You should be with someone that sees you for the person you are: not as just a sex object, or a project, or a meal ticket, or someone easily controlled and manipulated.
If you want to be in a long term relationship, then someone who doesn't is probably not the right person for you to date. If you don't want kids, then someone who does is probably not right for you. But age doesn't necessarily mean same values, same desires or the same future.
The wrong person can come in all shapes and sizes. And ages.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with two consenting adults deciding to get together. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with two adults deciding to enjoy a safe sexual relationship together. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong with two people that care about each other pursuing a real and deep relationship.
You can be used, degraded, and taken for granted by people of any age. It isn’t an age specific thing.
The Cougar
People say, what could an older woman possibly want with a younger guy other than sex?
I think it’s quite an insult to assume the guy is immature. I’ve dated guys my age that were too immature for me. Hell, I’ve dated guys much older than me that weren’t even close to mature enough for me. But I’ve had relationships with people of all ages. I’ve taken everyone on an individual basis, and tried not to make assumptions based on age.My husband is 7 years younger than I am. He remains the most emotionally mature man I’ve ever met in my life. Just think, if I had been closed off to dating a younger man I would have missed out on meeting the love of my life.
Men Vs Women
It’s been said that girls mature faster than boys. It’s been accepted by society that a man can date a woman younger than he is. But people have strong reactions of judgment when they see a real May-December age difference.
I have found that women tend to be more judging about age-difference dating then men are. I didn’t conduct a research experiment, I’m just making a general observation based on my experiences. I will give you two examples.
I remember attending a New Year’s gathering some years ago when the subject of Anna Nicole Smith and her marriage to J. Howard Marshall came up. The women at the party were quite vocal with their disgust
The men on the other hand made comments to the effect that the old man was their hero.
I remember several water-cooler conversations at a corporation where I used to work. The vice president, an attractive woman in her 40’s, had a boyfriend who was 22. Again, the women in the office were quick to voice judgment, saying things like how it must be just sex, and isn’t that pathetic. The guys on the other hand said things like, “Damn, where was she when I was 22.”
Whether or not Anna or my former boss were in healthy relationships for the right reasons, is not my business or concern. It’s not for me to say. But isn’t it interesting that most of the guys were non-judging, and most of the women were?
Oh I’m sure some women were jealous, and judging because that’s the way they are. But I’m going to defend at least some of the women by offering this conclusion: Women are nuturers.
Whether they were projecting a protective daughterly view of old J Howard Marshall, or a protective motherly view of the young man living with the VP, I think what motivates women to show their concern and leap to judgments is their natural protective nature. Women don’t want to see an innocent party harmed. They don’t want to think anyone took advantage of someone that needed protecting. Women have an innate ability to nurture.
I’m not saying men don’t care who gets hurt. I’m just saying, it’s not the first thing they think of. It’s not the forefront of thought when they look at an age-difference couple.
In General
If you were to ask a woman in her 40’s if she’d be interested to date a 26 year old, she might say no. Tell her it’s Prince William she might change her mind. Ask that same woman if she would date a 66 year old guy, she might say no. Tell her it’s Harrison Ford, and she may rethink her answer.
Ask a guy in his early 20’s if he’s interested to date a 40 year old, he may decline. Tell him it’s Traci Lords, he may reconsider.
This HUB is about adults. Consenting adults. Not children. Not teenagers. The things you want to be wary of when you’re dating are not restricted to age.
And in general in life, in all your relationships, you will do well if you don’t make assumptions about anyone based on outward appearance, age, sex, race, or any other bias. You’ll do well if you can take each person as they are, for who they are, and know them before you judge.
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Comments
Me too, Darlin'. 41 and fabulous.
Glad you liked this. Thanks!
Fun hub...intriguing too!
From my female friends my age (40s/50s) I constantly hear that men our age are boring, too set in their ways, and closed off. From male friends my age, I constantly hear that women our age expect too much from the men they date, are too selfish, and too involved in their careers. From the 30ish men I date, I just hear "thank you!"
Thanks dessert blondie, I'm glad you found it intriguing.
cubemonkey4, excellent bit of info there. Thanks for sharing it!
Back in 1977 when I was 27 I dated a 43 year woman for just over a year. We had a blast. Both of us were responsible adults, not interested in a permanent thing, but didn't want the one night thing either. Looking back at the temporary and not so temporary relationships it was the most emotionally satisfying, honest, delightful relationship during my single years.
However, in all honesty, I believe that was due to the personalities and character of each of us rather than our ages. My wife, of 25 years, is 5 years younger than me (just a babe) and it truly has been an exceptional relationship that continues to grow with the excitement of new horizons or a regular basis.
All that to say, I enjoyed your hub and perspective - thanks for sharing it.
Jason
Excellent and so true! It's all about personality. If you expect to have any kind of relationship, you will eventually have to have a conversation with that "gorgeous man or woman." If there is no connection other than physical, believe it or not - that gets old pretty fast! The reverse is true too. How many people do you find attractive only after getting to know them?
Jason,
I have similar experiences to yours. And you hit the whole point of the article. Good partners come in all ages, and it was meaningful for this topic to demonstrate that with examples of cougars and real May-December mutually-satisfying symbiotic relationships. Thanks so much for commenting.
Goodwitch - Thanks for your comment!
well... I must have read these backwards..Here again..my relationship of 33 yrs. was with a man 18 years my younger..and it is true that everyone said it wouldn't last...that it was so wrong...but he is and will always be my soulmate...
We had a wonderful caring,loving relationship...till I hurt my knee and had surgery....then to Him I got old..true it was a hard time...and sex was limited....and He couldn't go without..so as in your other hub..a place he stopped for coffee everyday..a younger woman and he got to be friends...then better firends..then lovers...
Had I seen it coming I might have taken it better....but after 33 years I wasn't even concerned..never even entered my mind.....for all those previous years we were (I thought) just as we both had wished for and agreed upon...He hurt so many that loved him (and still do) grandchildren...family members...all so shocked at his behavior...and maybe even himself....Forgiven...but never forgotten...
You are a dear...and age was never an issue to us...??? till then..Thank You for letting me release these words.....G-Ma :o) hugs
G-MA,
That is a powerful thing to add here. Of course, I do think it's the caliber of a man, not his age, that leads him to infidelity. But you make some truly painful and excellent points about what happened once you went through your surgery. Again, I'm sorry for what you've been through. It is amazing how your experience so closely snaps into my last two hubs here. Your comments are really meaninful.
Best to you G-ma, XOXOXOX
I never before thought about a woman's judgment of these relationships being influenced by protectiveness and nurturing. That's quite an insight, and now I need to go back and re-think my long-held, gut, knee-jerk reactions and opinions.
I've always been a fan of women dating younger men, but not the other way around. Thanks for a very provoking article, Veronica!
Sally-
I love that something I wrote made you think. Thanks for letting me know. You are of course welcome to your own opinion, but it means alot to me that you considered mine as well.
I received an email on this, a long time male reader, that said he sees that female-nurturing reaction in other aspects of how men and women do things differently. I wish he'd post his observations here in comments (HINT!) I think you'd find them interesting.
Thanks so much for commenting.
Great hub, Veronica. You make excellent points... I hope people read this and really take it to heart. I'm quite young and in a going-on-three-years relationship with a man who's 7 years older than I am, and age is so unrelated to our relationship anymore that it's strange to me when people have any reaction to it at all. I always point out that, if we're in a forever relationship like we think we are, then 7 years will become less and less of a gap as we get older.
Helenthegreat - thanks for the comment! I am 7 years older than my husband, same age difference as you're dealing with. It is never an issue, and like you I am surprised if someone has a reaction to it. Best to you and your beau!
Seems like Dr. Phil was about this subject one day this week. I wasn't watching it, just heard a snippet from the other room, but I believe I heard him say that statiscially, relationships between individuals of vastly different ages are less likley to last long term. Regardless, my own attitude is each to his/her own. I would like to point out though that you give the guys too much credit for "not judging." Their approval is a judgement, just a positive judgement, and likely based on their own bias. The comments you quoted (for example, where was she when I was 22) imply that they too think it's all about sex - they just don't mind if it's all about sex :-) All in all, good, thought-provoking hub!
dineane - thanks for the comment! I agree, the guys I was referring to were probably sex-based in thier thinking. That's why I didnt think it was giving them too much credit, the way you took it. I thought it was a little slam to them, lol. Oh well. Truth is, I wasn't slamming anyone, I was really just trying to express what I observed, and why I thought the it was happening.
Thanks!
Veronica, This hub is wonderful. Quite frankly it's high time the sexual scale gets tipped in our direction. It seems to me that men get far too much leeway and women get far too little. Men are not criticized for dating extremely young women, having excessive amounts of sex, and being bachelors until their ninety. This hub is just one more win in the sexual revolution.
jones64, thanks so much!
Great Hub. I first married a man over 17 years older than me and we were very happy right up until he suddenly died of bowel cancer at the age of 48, (I was 31 and we had been together nearly 8 years, three of which we were married). Some time later I met a very old flame who was about 18 years older than me, and my experience was the complete opposite. We moved to Tenerife together, and he quickly showed he had no real love or respect for me, and never made me feel cherished or loved, (see my Hub "Living with a Control Freak"). In fact in the relationship he made me feel like I should be grateful to be with him, and said that people only spoke to me because I was with him, (although these people told me later it was actually the other way around). It just shows, age gaps can work, and sometimes they won't, but each case is different. Luckily for me I got out of the latter relationship after three years, and not a moment too soon, but I still have very fond memories of my 1st Husband, and am only saddened that he died in the way that he did. Now, I am fortunate enough to be with a lovely man who truly respects me and loves me dearly. In this case he is only a couple of years older than me, but this is unusual for me, as I always preferred older men in the past.
Misty - thanks for sharing your experiences. I'm sorry about yoru first husband, it sounds like it was a great marriage. I'm glad you got away from that second guy. It really does all go to show age doesnt matter - sometimes a person is great, sometimes they aren't, and their age really has nothing to do with that fact.
Congrats on your current relationship. Best to you.
My last relationship of 7 years was with a man 13 years older, who is wealthy, has Paul Newman good looks, works for a very well known celebrity, all external things, as on the inside this man was troubled, and was emotionally and verbally abusive to me and who suppressed my spirit and expression. Thank God, I woke up and realized I didn't need to continue this type of relationship or ever get into another one like that, as I deserved love and kindness, as I am loving and kind.
I am currently in a relationship with a man my age, who loves me, encourages me, treats me with respect, even says thank you when I cook a meal he enjoys. We even skip over speed bumps in the park, and neither of us try to change the other, so it makes our union a harmonious one.
Thanks for writing this hub, gets one thinking.
Thumbs up! :)
I'm still a young man, I can feel the old death creeping in a little. I jumped on a trampoline last week and damn near broke my neck doing a back flip. It still hurts as I write this. I was drunk, I'll give myself that, but that's the last trampoline I'm going to jump on...I'm getting too old for this crazy business, pushing 30 now.
That said, Only just a year ago I realized I was looking at 45 year old women and thinking 'looking good, I'd get naked and roll around in the vast and open tundra with that lady'...Then realizing, later, that she was a much older woman.
whatever floats your boat people. Some like it hot, some like it big and fluffy and some prefer the wrinkles.
great hub
I'm a 55-year-old man and the title of your hub caught my eye. I enjoyed reading it. I have more or less given up hope on finding anyone of any age having been single for several years and had very bad luck with past relationships. I usually tend to think that younger women wouldn't want a relationship with me now because I am older so leave it at that and perhaps I have missed out with this attitude.
Bard of Ely,
I want you to know I choked up a little when I read your comment. Especially the line "perhaps I have missed out because of this attitude."
I don't know what happened with your past "very bad luck" relationships. I don't know anything about you really, other than that which I've read in your hubs. (I like Van Morrison a lot, too.) I do read your hubs. You strike me as so articulate, and interesting, and as having such a rich and in-tune worldly life, from incredible cliffs all the way down to pretty butterflies. I think your Gandolf-meets-Sam-Elliot looks are attractive, and I think your writing is worth reading. I'm absolutely shocked that you've been single for years, if that wasn't your intent.
55? Not so old. Sting is 57. I can list off a bunch of sexy interesting men that are older than you are, Van Morrison included. I really don't think age matters. I dated a man 57 when I was 27 and had an absolute blast with him. I'm not saying the woman for you is 27. I'm just saying, if you want not to be single, make it so.
Make it so.
XOXO,
Veronica
Thank you very much for all you've said there! Maybe I will find someone after all?
The really strange thing about it all is that despite my unconventional ideas and appearance I am a monogamous guy who started out long ago in my teens thinking I would fall in love and get married. But it's never worked out for me that way and whatever relationships I have had have ended leaving me very depressed at the time and often for a long time after. Most of the time I have been single and as I have got older I have been even more unsuccessful at even starting a new relationship. Before I moved over here I was going out as friends with a woman who was gay and that was good and bad for me because it was good to have a girlfriend but not good because I fancied her but knew we could never be a couple.
It isn't that I don't get on with women because I have very many very good friends who are women, which makes the situation even more crazy!
For the last year or so I seem to have got so I am not even making any efforts to go out with any single women I meet. I have always been very shy and it has got to the point I have been saying to myself that I am too old now and that finding a partner was something I have failed at. I realise it is me that is not making any efforts now but I have often read or been told that if you don't try to find someone then they will come your way in the course of your life. That doesn't appear to be correct for me either. I often wonder what it is you need to find love and happiness,so cannot advise others on these matters at all. I also have quite a few single friends of both sexes who do not like being that way and I cannot see why they are in the same situation as me, especially when they are a lot younger. Although at the same time I can see that the age thing is not necessarily anything to do with it because I was mostly on my own when I was lot younger.
I know there are an awful lot of single and lonely people in the world!
And I admit I can't say I am totally happy being on my own so it is probably something I need to change!
When I was twenty I dated a 41 year old woman who worked as a lingerie and clothing model for a department store chain. Age has nothing to do with beauty. She was hot.
And I agree with someone up above me here in the comments about the guys in your article being less judgmental. I don't think it's so much that they aren't judgmental, they just respond initially from the perspective of the sex. I bet if any of them were pressed to reflect on the issues any further, they would come to the same conclusions that the women initially did. Men are nurturing too, they just think sex is more fun.
Exactly what I'm saying.
Thaks, Shadesbreath!
Great Hub...... To me it is about attitude and values (between the dating pair) as well as the degree of love each has the ability to share. Love is not only about common interests, it is about sharing love in equal amounts. To get a bigger drift of what I am saying I hope you don't mind me pointing to my hub "Four Levels of Love."
Most of my true buddies are 20 years younger than I am - how could I be happy with a woman my age unless she has the same youthful mind set?
Good Hub - Thanks!
I don't mind, Neil.
It's an interesting hub. For anyone who's interested, here's the link:
This is a very though provoking Hub. Relationships are more about how you relate not really about age. I think the intellectual match and then the Physical match are perhaps how things should be. Not neccessarily how they are. People eventually grow apart over time therefore there must be more to sustain a relationship. My discourse on how I beat cancer and lost 34 years of marriage perhaps illustrates this point a bit. Thanks for sharing with us how people tick and click. It is a sad fact that 2 out 3 marraiges in the western (first) world end in divorce and I dont think that has too much to do with age.
Great Hub great writing
for me age is really an issue, what's important is compatibility and respect with each other.
I think you miss out on great friendships/relationships when you only mix with people in a certain age range.
Waw your story impressed me! at least I will have chance to date when I will reach 57
Nice Hub - I have found that they are some of the smartest, sexiest, funniest, and most down to earth women I have ever meet.
Great hub! When I was 19, I dated a man who was 32.
And like I read in your hub;The wrong person can come in all shapes and sizes. And ages. If there is no respect, no relationship will work.
Lazur - thanks! I'm glad you were able to relate to the hub so directly.
another fantastic hub Veronica.. i too dated then lived with a guy who was 30 years older.. i guess there are exceptions in every case.. i didnt mind the age difference.. but it eventually became a problem for him.. esp when he overheard my mechanic calling him my dad... he became self conscious and wouldnt publically show affection so easily anymore like holding hands.. nevertheless to say we lasted 4 years together before breaking up.. would i date another older man?.. hell no.. they are too controlling.. dating someone younger on the other hand seems very appealing.. they usually have alot of respect for you and are very affectionate and loving.. like i said there are exceptions in each case.. i have yet to date a younger man thou.. but do have a few younger guy friends.. all my bf's have been older than me.. and you are right women are usually jealous of older woman/younger guy relationships.. i definately am one of them.. only because i would love to be in her shoes!! i really enjoyed your hub.. looking forward to reading more.. :)
I am now fabulous 50 and still get plenty of flirts even though I am not available. Age should not be a factor for anyone 18 and above in the USA; however, the International community has different age standards that applies to the age of adulthood. Ladies, I have the link to "Men" that are considered well-off if you got game, join my community and contact me http://jazlive.flux.com/profile/JazLive
hi Veronica,
Great hub! When I started my job, I had the privelege of working with men of all ages. One in particular was 19 going on 20 when I was hired. I found him to be very outgoing, very funny, and very knowledgeable in our work. He tended to hang around with another male coworker, and the two of them interacting was magic. Not only were they good at what they did, they made me laugh every day. I used to tease them that they reminded me of the chemistry between say, Abbot and Costello. Anyway, the 19 yr old became my mentor. Our work relationship grew every day, which then expanded to taking lunch together. The conversations always included work, but expanded into other things, such as life in general. Probably a year or so into our relationship, we became intimate.
I found him to be very mature, even at the tender age of 19. He is very intelligent and showed maturity beyond his years, which I believe had a lot to do with my looking at/considering a relationship with him other than work-related. The attraction for me was his mind. Intellect can be a very powerful attraction. We could talk about anything, share our opinions on life, love, and the universe in general. He believes in me, has always been my number one fan, and has encouraged me through all the years we've known each other. He is now 37, and I am 59, and we still share a very special friendship, even though we were never a 'couple'. We knew back then we never would be, in the traditional sense, and that is fine. He has his life, and I have mine. I have to say we both feel our lives are richer for having this wonderful communication.
PS: Bard of Ely, I find you to be very attractive. Hang in there! :)
Thanks for sharing!
Trish
i would hit it
i really enjoyed this hub and learned a thing or two as well :) you bring up so many good points and one of them is almost life-changing: you said that bit about giving women the benefit of the doubt. well, i am one of those girls who gets along with guys better than other women. (though lately i've been far more receptive and open to female friendships.) i tend to brush off judgmental women as just that, rather than thinking of them as the nurturing kind that doesnt want to see any party get hurt. that is a beautiful point u made and it made me think a great deal. thank you for such a wonderful blog!
Yup, I also just wrote an article on this. It's especially tough for older women because men our age want women in their twenties so we shouldn't we try for the same? Whatever works and whatever makes you truly (and legally) happy - Amen, I say!
I dont think age matters or what others say,if there is love,let there be love
I'm currently 38 and dating a 70 year old man.
I was married to someone just a couple of years older than me for 12 years. He left for someone 14 years younger than him. I dated men my own age, and those relationships ended badly.
I'm with someone I respect tremendously, who respects me. We're good for each other in so many ways and we are attracted to each other physically. We both acknowledge that it's an unusual situation, but we're also both certainly old enough and wise enough to know what we're doing.
Even my mom said, "Well age is just a number!" Though she did add, "But 70 is a pretty big number." lol We're so happy together. I don't know how long it will last, but at least I have the knowledge and trust that it won't end badly. He's the most incredibly wonderful man I've ever known. We both think we're the luckiest people in the world.
As a co-cougar, I wholeheartedly enjoyed your hub. Great job.
spryte says:
17 months ago
Thumbs up! Enjoyed this hub immensely...but then again, I'm pretty much cougar-aged... ;)
spryte