What Do Women Think Men Really Want?

What is it that men are looking for in women? What do men value above all else or is his lascivious and outward gawking to be percieved as true and credible evidence in the choosing of a mate.

What do women think men are looking for and how do women accommodate and encourage that perception?

It may well be argued that a great personality will sustain a man long after beauty and youth have had their day, but, does a great personality, grip the interest of the great Neanderthal?

Ever have someone try and hook you up? Men are wary of the proverbial, “she has a great personality”. Such a tantalizing endorsement is an instant death sentence to miss congeniality. Obviously, woman agrees with the hunter gatherer's great genius for esteeming the beauty of her parts above the sustainability of a her "great personality" for she has gone to great expense in order to encourage his gawking.

In the United States alone, there were 351,000 surgeries for breast augmentation in 2007. Another 105,000 breast lift and 107,000 breast reductions. There were 149,000 tummy tucks and 4400 butt improvements. There were 9,000 lower body lifts, 14,000 upper arms lifts 43,000 forehead lifts, 8900 thigh lifts and 2600 lip lifts, 118,000 face lifts and zero, not one, personality lift, no personality augmentations, no personality injections and no personality enhancements. Apparently, "a great personality" just isn't on the list of desired attributes appreciated by the great Neanderthal.

What might one conclude from the implications of these salacious and whispering statistics?

1) Obviously, as a nation we are obsessed with lifting, which begs the question, how did obesity become such a problem with all this lifting going on?

2) Evidently, as a nation we are obsessed with lifting breast more than personality, which again begs the question, who or what are men really talking to?


In 2007 there were 4,625,000 botox injections, none of which were directly or indirectly targeted at personality improvements. Apparently, such injections are intended to persuade his ears to respond to where the sound is actually coming from without his eyes being inadvertently diverted. These attempts have been grossly unsuccessful for the improvements to one's breast solicit his attention considerably more than a robot face.

Because man has failed to escape the evolutionary conduct imprisoned by his prehistoric appetite should not be held against him. Rather, he should be excused as one who is simply following the bait put before him or heralded as one who simply appreciates the provocative silence of southern belles, rather than the promised charm of a "a great personality". It has become painfully clear that “a great personality” is an ambiguous notion or at the very least, the hunter/gatherer is better equipped to gather from what he sees more than from what he hears. Such conclusion lends evidence to the notion that his appetite is indeed, his first and primary concern.

Sometimes, under the weight of her invisible personality, woman can barely stand erect. The roving eyes of the great Neanderthal sacrifice themselves in expected appreciation of what she is obviously, demanding. He is after all, by instinct, predisposed to the gathering of what ever nourishment is offered to his senses. He is visually brought to attention. If by chance our neanderthal can not see, not to worry! There is always the strategically appointed, perfumed dab, aromatically drawing his nose from the tower of Babel to the cavern of conspiracy.

Apparently, if man should inadvertently catch her eye instead, she simply leads his ignorance via "the lean" which without intent, reveals her non intent, intentionally.

That we, as a society, place so little esteem on “the great personality” is not by any means, the intentional fault of man. It is certainly not his rising interest in the economic vitality of plastic, silicone and petroleum products. It is woman who has directed his interest from intellect or charm or personality, to ever increasing mounds of frivolity, which in turn, simply fortify and insure his prehistoric bondage.

In a culture where the majority of our deepest conversation is stimulated by the inflated ego of Double D Cups, it is easy to understand why we men remain Neanderthals. By the number of breast augmentations, butt lifts and botox injections, I'm convinced that women don't want us Neanderthals to change at all. Why would man look for a personality when women go to such expense to insure that his primitive intellect does not rise above a primordial attachment to things that "go bump in the night"?

If woman would sincerely like to be appreciated for her mind and personality, perhaps she would do well to appreciate such elegance within herself first. To elicit self esteem proportionate to the size of any cup, seems in itself, a bit Neanderthal. If she herself desires more attention be directed to personality and intellect, then why does she labor and manipulate his attention in the direction of such an inflated curriculum? After all, the Neanderthal has served notice countless times that his indiscriminate appetite will revel in whatever is heaped upon his empty plate. Over half a million breast surgeries a year indicates that someone isn't serving him from the four major food groups.

We Neanderthals are rummaging around at the bottom of the food chain and someone is spending a lot of money to keep us there. To add to the absurdity of such manipulation, the offense is compounded by redirecting the fault upon his simple mind.

" Is that all you think about" they ask?

Women stimulate the U.S. economy to the tune of 4 billion dollars a year to make sure we think exactly how they want us to think.

"The great personality" is in more jeopardy today than ever. It is near extinction and I suspect, soon to be place on the endangered species list. It is being submerged beneath mounds of primordial gel and suffocating beneath the weight of plastic mastodons.

If the great Neanderthal is to evolve from the primordial soup then intellect and personality should be respected, prized and flaunted more than the leans and mounds demanding our primitive attention.

Admittedly, beauty does illicit an immediate notice and admittedly it fuels the requisite attraction necessary to stimulate his barbaric interest, but, it should remain simply that: a means to introduction. Somewhere along the way, the Neanderthal is going to realize that the gelatin zombies contribute little to meaningful conversation, at which point, the absence or presence of great personality will determine the possibility of meaningful relationship. Beauty may well accommodate a provocative means, but, in the end, the great Neanderthal will prove that he is less Neanderthal than anyone suspected.

Comments 77 comments

cheaptrick profile image

cheaptrick 4 years ago from the bridge of sighs

What an original and cool hub!I laughed,I cried,I almost UGH!

Sorry,She just jerked my leash....I have to go admire her lovely well shaped set of personality enhancers,Ha!

To funny dude,and sooo true.

Dean


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Yikes! Does this mean I've been doing it all wrong all these years? The only parts I've acquired & not original (though I've lost a few that were!) - are crowns on my teeth and a cataract-correcting lens in one eye. (Feeling around to see if I've missed any; - nope, everything else is in place & original issue, perhaps a little worse for wear and tear, but not too bad considering the LQ = longevity quotient. Hey, I kinda like that one; - does it count for personality points at least?)

Haha - This is a good one, Alan. Good to see you're back in stride!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hello cheaptrick and thanks for reading. A dinner conversation sparked this write. go figure.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hi butterfly. Personality was defined in you Nellieanna. Elegance awakened, embraced and esteemed, most importantly, by you yourself. Perhaps, why it is so easily found in you by others. I am delighted to hear that all is in place. Such originality reveals so much about ourselves. If we aren't enamored with who we are, why would anyone else?


xstatic profile image

xstatic 4 years ago from Eugene, Oregon

As one old Neanderthal to another, Alan, I'd say that you have clubbed the crux of the matter here. I loved Nellieana's comment. That dinner converstion must have been interesting to generate such an essay as this. No one would question your personality.

It is nice to have lived long enough to have learned to look women in the eye when conversing.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hey Jim! Nellieanna has never lacked the personality or intellect to grace any conversation and our dinner conversations around here have sparked some liveley discussion lately. Living long enough, is for a Neanderthal, an accomplishment in and of itself. Our clubs are the last semblance of self respect any Neanderthal has left. Guard it well my friend.


ImKarn23 profile image

ImKarn23 4 years ago

'Personality lifts' are available - just not at the corner plastic surgeon!

They take actual sweat and effort - and no amount of money can buy one!

Being an athlete when i was young - a gymnast yet - i had/have very little body fat - and guess what that means? NO BOOBAGES! lol..

My mammaries may be smaller - but - it has never affected the length (or breadth) of my dance card - and my mind is DDD SEXY (at least in my own mind...lol)

i've always believed that one does their best with what's on the outside - and works hard on what's on the inside - because when the outside is old, wrinkled, and gray - the inside can still be interested, interesting and yes - even sexy!

ps. an ex bf had hair implants AND a boob reduction - so - it's not just the female of the species no more, no more..


cat on a soapbox profile image

cat on a soapbox 4 years ago from Los Angeles

Well, I guess if good humor and interesting conversation can't keep the date afloat, it can be saved with a well-inflated vest! Can't fault men for their attraction to women's curves and decolletage. I appreciate genuine admiration too. It disturbs me though that the efforts of the 1970's women's movement to get away from being regarded as sex objects has been undone by a new feminist agenda to make men feel useless , then purposely taunt them with the power of sexuality. If women opt for surgical enhancements and choose to wear revealing clothes, more power to them, but don't act offended if men leer. Obviously men will look!

Besides, are women really meant to look so "perky" in their 80s ? I'd rather be remembered for my brain, kindness, and accomplishments rather than my nice set!

Thank you, Arb, for a very amusing hub and your male perspective.

-cat :)


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Dear Alan - All I can say is that if you and Jim are typical Neanderthals, bring on the Neanderthals! Such good old-fashioned masculine manners! Whoo-hoo!

Alan, I think you've nailed it. Being attractive begins with liking oneself. Everyone is unique, so there's no reason or way to 'be' like someone else. Who one is is who one is.

On the other hand, while I don't completely agree with the philosophy behind it because I believe one must derive his/her own true self image from self, still - it's hard to argue with Eliza Doolittle in "My Fair Lady" when she mentions that what makes a lady, a lady, is how she is treated. I realize that 'lady' and 'vamp-with-boobs' aren't synonymous terms for women generally, but in both cases, it's some of what men are looking for, which is the question asked in the title of your hub, after all, even if it is mostly tongue-in-cheek (or wherever). Nobody sez a woman can't be a bit of both! heh heh.

And that goes for your statement, as well, Cat on Soapbox - one CAN be 'perky' in her 80s AND have a brain, compassion and talents. ;-) Ahem! I rest my case.

PS - I think men and women are looking for genuine appreciation and comfortable compatibility on all mutual levels more than looks or most anything else, - in friends, mates or lovers. May not be what sparks 'first impressions' but it's what maintains lasting ones and keeps the flame alive. I think of my parents who were so different in many ways but when all was said and done, he said that he was never bored with her! wow. It worked!


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

PPS - Mother had this advise for her daughters when they were getting married: "Every man wants a harem. BE one!"

Silicone and Botox {Botulinum toxin - a protein & neurotoxin produced by the bacterium Clostridium botulinum. Botulinum toxin can cause botulism, a serious and life-threatening illness in humans and animals} hadn't even yet been dreamed of when she said it.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hi Karn! I've found through the years, despite an attachment to my Neanderthal spirit, that attraction is greatly influenced by personality and that sexy has much more to do with whats behind the mind than whats behind the lace. Obviously, our cultures preoccupation with plastic surgery indicates either, an ignorance of where sexy originates, grows and manefest itself, or, we are getting too many tummy tucks and breast lifts instead of lobotomies. That your mind is triple D sexy would indicate that the rest of you must follow where it leads. Your sense of humor flaunts your personality and the poor Neanderthal is drawn to the bait. It is the head that launches lasting curiousity and lifelong seduction.


ImKarn23 profile image

ImKarn23 4 years ago

Arb - i couldn't have said it better myself - and i can't agree more! It IS the head(ONLY) where seduction can last forever!

I used to tell men that my interest lies in 'great head' first and foremost.

As you can imagine - that would get 'em excited...lol...except - i meant the BIG head!

Another good line was/IS: Open the mind - the legs are sure to follow...

tmi? o, well - it's early...my filters are sleeping..

haha..


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hi cat! The power of sexuality will never be found at a plastic surgeon. It is an attitude, a personality, a thought process unleashed within the mind. Men, nor women, can feel useless without their own consent. Taunting originates in thought and the great Neanderthal responds, but to what? The thought that teases his primitive mind. Leering is a prehistoric art trying to adjust to modern rules of civility. I think, however, that sexuality is rooted where we think. Looking is often confused with thinking. It may evoke a spontaneous attraction, but all men, suffer Attention Deficit Disorder. How and what she thinks is the ultimate seduction and what will, in and of itself, foster the ultimate attraction. A good mind will keep safe, any set, but, air in the head will accelerate his ADD. BTW, Perkiness is in the eye of the beholder. The great Neanderthal can't really think in two places at once. What he sees is what you whisper!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Good morning butterfly! Being a Neanderthal does not make me wallow in pride, but, neither do I wallow in shame, from what drives me by design. I am what I am and it is what it is. I agree that a woman can be a bit of both, however and this is a huge however. If she believes she is and carries herself in such a way, the great neanderthal believes what she projects. One of the ugliest meals my wife ever made, moved everyone at the table to stare and play with their forks before trying it. Now it is still a favorite, 30 years later. Getting beneath the surface, often times, unleashes surprises never invisioned on the surface. I think a lady becomes all things when she comes to terms with, "I am as I think I am". That is the ultimate attraction. The one which neither fades nor ever needs superficial surgery.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Your mother was a wise woman! The irony is, the great Neanderthal is content knowing he has a harem. Somehow, just having treasure diminishes the need of counting it every day. Yes, Neanderthals can count!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Karn, The great Neanderthal has always struggled when trying to figure out where his head was at. That woman is complicit in perpetuating his penchant for always getting lost is a testement to the power of suggestion. Asking him daily "is that all you ever think about"? obviously misdirects his sincere search for the source of his thought. Suggesting that his head is somewhere other than where it is, confuses his yet, evolving mind and leaves him conversing endlessly with an idiot.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

I'm not thoroughly convinced of the Neanderthal premise, though I've heard of "the lizard brain" as self-description by males, too. Perhaps we have to take their word for these ideas, but they do provide handy excuses for some questionable behavior. hehe. Or have these self-recriminations been fostered by misdirected training? I dunno. I'm female.

Not wallowing in either pride nor shame & recognizing the rightness of one's natural design, (all the more if one has faith), seems a healthy evolutionary step, in any case. Nothing is more honorable than a truly honorable man.

Most of us buy what we perceive that others honestly project about themselves, unless we're paranoid and see deceit at every point.

I love the example of the 'ugly' meal that became a family favorite. That's beautiful.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Aha! - "Getting beneath the surface, often times, unleashes surprises never invisioned on the surface."

Isn't that the essence of capturing human interest & delight, whether on intellectual, gastronomic, sexual, personal, scientific, religious or philosophical levels? We crave that kind of stimulation, exploration and discovery, - and all the more to validate the values and respect which we've extended to our own choices & to regenerate the satisfaction we need for happy ongoing commitment to them, - perhaps even, - to personally evolve on schedule.

Seems that we're geared to need to be surprised, so as to defray & redirect an onslaught of what would become grim, tired boredom which leads to a fierce kind of somnolent empty sense of isolation that is nearly unbearable to the human spirit. Even those of us who are OK with being alone, need to be surprised.

In fact, it's the practical basis for the use of solitary confinement in prisons & brainwashing to get cooperation. Why? Because it IS excruciatingly unbearable. Other examples come to mind. Monks govern themselves by forcibly sacrificing interaction with others, thinking to prove their dedication. Parents & teachers can even effectively bring unruly children to 'toe' by sending them to their room for a period of unbearable solitary confinement; provided their rooms aren't their most interesting places! Equipped with cell phones, video games, TVs, music & computers, they're far from being solitary confinement. :-)

So we're drawn to that which promises & delivers surprise and the more subcutaneous the promise, the more interesting & authentic its appeal, because if we knowingly go seeking, expecting, even paying - to be surprised, - at best, it loses its luster. It changes from surprise to a form of titillation, which can even dull the ability to be genuinely surprised by what it natural. Amazingly, a little genuine surprise goes a long way toward keeping things sparkling.

But is it any wonder that too many marriages crash or crumble when the element of surprise is exhausted & not replenished by the partners?

We may sincerely love someone for the things we know, respect & value about him/her, but we're re-attracted to him/her by those un-envisioned spontaneous surprises that are unleashed from time to time, especially when sparkling from a wellspring of personality which is actually alive, so that it emits its sparks of that life into the valuable relationship.

Apparently, if the element of surprise is lagging or lacking, couples may attempt to manufacture it, (according to some TV ads), by setting up little 'games'. Maybe just that willingness to set up games is enough 'surprise' to suffice if the lack of natural surprise is deep and painful enough. Who's to judge?


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

I am a Neanderthal only by accusation. That I am greatly influenced by primordial testosterone is hardly any fault of my own. I have the sense that much of the opposite gender today, has concluded that such influence is the consequence of a mind which simply likes to frolic in the juvenile slime of prehistoric yesterday. I defend myself and my fellow Neanderthals who simply acquiesce to divine design and take opportunity to assign increasing complicity to the softer gender. That we are Neanderthals (mostly by accusation) is a strategic, but, empty indictment meant to foster the absurd supposition that we would know more of love, were we to behave as women. I prefer to succumb to the title and there-by, shift the fault of my loathsome behavior to an excuse women are more willing to forgive. All this thinking has stired my want of "the ugly meal!"


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Isolation is the slow dying of ourselves from the inside out. I have seen many relationships perish in isolation, all the while projecting the illusion of togetherness. It is ultimately the union of minds and thought which arouse, stimulate and seduce the inner us. It is the mind that surprises. The physical simply responds to the music writen and dances in response. What an utterly ingenious design!


cat on a soapbox profile image

cat on a soapbox 4 years ago from Los Angeles

Hi Arb, A great hub starts lively discussion as we see here! I think we all agree that attractiveness and sex appeal come from confidence (feeling comfortable in your own skin) and a good brain that is clever, intuitive, and sensitive. Good communication, icluding picking up subtle signals, is a big part of flirting and seduction. Karn said it so well! I also loved the advice given by Nelianna's mom to all her daughters.

When I referred to being "perky" at 80, I was referring to implants that withstand gravity and get out of sync with the rest of the body. I prefer to stay in shape naturally w/ exercise/diet and attuned to my husband- hoping that the next 20 years are good to me!

btw: Neanderthals are like the hungry who need to learn a few table manners; afterall, devouring is satisfying but savoring prolongs the pleasure.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

I can understand your preference for the Neanderthal accusation rather than attempts to being feminized, dear Arb. Never do that!

I certainly wouldn't prefer to be masculinized, either and so will tolerate various chauvinistic assignments of traits which are as foreign to me as the woman I am as a trait of primitive bestiality is to an evolved man.

Ignorance, and lack of perception, like turtles, have their own shells of protection, I suppose. One can only pity them for what they miss behind their armor, of the finest things in life. But the bliss of ignorance is in its own ignorance.

As to capacity for love, I'm awed when I behold the purity of a man's ability to love deeply and fully when he does truly love. By comparison with it, even the finest love of a woman seems a little too conditional and practical. This is something I've observed over a lifetime, not just at this point of my life. It is not always the degree to which everyman rises, but when he does, it's awesome in the truest sense of the word.

But it is a bit childish even to feel a need to assign complicity to anyone or anything BUT the divine design for a healthy acceptance of your own strong nature OR to even jokingly refer to it as loathsome behavior! However, not being in your size shoes or hormones, who am I to either praise, condemn or forgive that of which I'm incapable of experiencing first-hand? (and vice versa!) The battle of the genders really seems absurd to me, frankly. It always amazes me to witness it, from either side of that divide - and there is a difference, to be sure. :-)


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Cat, I also prefer to stay in shape naturally with diet, exercise - - and plenty of 'basting' with natural moisturizers (!!) so that the next 20 years will take me to my plan to reach the century mark!

Being attuned to my situation is also on my health and beauty regimen, though now it's being attuned to widowhood. I fully appreciate your appreciation for being attuned to your husband as part of yours! That's probably the best health & beauty routines available, when it is available! I'm truly glad for you. I'm sure you don't need to be told to cherish it!

Thank you for the reply to my comment to your comment! I can think of nothing less desireable than anything foreign being placed inside or under my skin; and your very good observation of how out of sync it would be, especially as that body's own center of gravity changes with the years!! Yegads! Even younger women look strange with sudden mounds of obviously unnatural 'fixed' silicone appearing on their otherwise fairly normal silhouettes. But the bigger mis-match in anyone's choice of that seems to be something in their heads which propels them to want it for themselves and to imagine that it's the same as or better than 'the real' things!


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Alan - to comment on this would detract from its beauty and wisdom, so I'll just quote it:

"Isolation is the slow dying of ourselves from the inside out. I have seen many relationships perish in isolation, all the while projecting the illusion of togetherness. It is ultimately the union of minds and thought which arouse, stimulate and seduce the inner us. It is the mind that surprises. The physical simply responds to the music writen and dances in response. What an utterly ingenious design!"

Nothing Neanderthal about it; - - simply an outpouring of a beautiful mind. Wondrous.


aquarius 4 years ago

An afterthought - -- I neglected to respond to your earlier comment about a wife being the harem. I'd imagine that actual harems of multiple members vary in their quality, and surely the quality of a lone member being a harem would vary with that one woman's ability to keep her man alert and aware of her presence, despite the man's tendency to take for granted what he's sure of.being there at his beck and call.

But there surely are differences in each woman's abilities in that regard. I'm certain that my Dad never took Mother for granted. He once admitted that the women in our family all shared a characteristic he called 'elusive'. Maybe that was what kept mother exciting to him.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

I resorted to my old Dell upstairs for that afterthought! haha


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Well said cat! It struck me after reading this, that you have perhaps uncovered something. At what point do we quit flirting with our partners? Flirting is kind of an adult playground where the mind takes opportunity to reveal the source of sensuality. The well appointed smile, is I think, the most provocative means of seduction given to women. It certainly teases, stirs the mysterious and conceals just enough mischief to engage the imagination. It also, inherently provides safe escape if should circumstances suddenly warrant a change in direction.

Perhaps, the Neanderthal would adopt better table manners, if he knew when the next meal was coming. I suppose a fully loaded refrigerator in his meager cave, might tempt his appetite to sample vavious delectibles and expand his otherwise limited menue. On the other hand, if he's getting ground terradactyl every other Tuesday night at seven, then dinner, I imagine, is a competition between starvation and an eventual boredom with terradactyl.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Apparently, all things are won or loss in the mind, including love. The gender battle is simply an extention of the battle we wage within ourselves, to like ourselves, to accept ourselves and to settle the differences within ourselves. If we learn to embrace the differences rather than make effort to manipulate, change or control them, we will bask in the glorious liberty of just being who we are. Two people just being who they are and being loved for who they are, makes the bond inseparable. Trying to make someone love you as you are, through any means, is eventual futility and worse, you add complicity to their opinion. One mans blindness is another mans treasure. We simply need to find people with 20/20 vision. Instead we try and change what they see.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

It always comes back to the head!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

What ever spills from such a mind, ilicited by another wondrous mind.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

The value of elusive is dependent on its intended course. If it is part of the minds strategic plan to preserve an interest in the quarry, then it is in reality, a means to ultimate seduction. Such cleverness reveals an intellect worthy of the chase!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Was wondering who aquarius was?


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

BTW, I've noticed the absence of ads placed in this hub. Have I been censored? Have I expanded the constraints of my imposed boundaries, Good for me! I will pprobably lose 50 cents for such a dastardly deed. That was an expensive lesson.


cat on a soapbox profile image

cat on a soapbox 4 years ago from Los Angeles

Ha Ha, Arb :) Oh no, not teradactyl AGAIN!!!

I've always felt that there is a HUGE connection between food and sex, and too much predictability is indeed boring! As much as it may surprise some, lack of satisfaction with either one usually leads to overindulgence. Perhaps a contributing factor to our obesity epidemic is that more people are too stressed too tired, or to self-absorbed for real intimacy and satisfying sex.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

I think obesity has always been epidemic. Caused from a lack of exercise in the head. A 5 million dollar yacht under the diminished capacity of a 12 year old will run a-ground. I suppose the inflatable vest will come in handy.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

I think it's virtually impossible to make anyone do anything, really. Any seeming compliance is some form of disguised rebellion which will boomerang.

When it comes to forcing fine-tuning as in being loved for who one is, it is as you say - "futility and worse" to attempt it. Obstacles to its success are so basic: - either the other person is incapable of comprehending and perceiving who & what one IS (which turns out to be am empty disappointment), - or they do comprehend but don't really like it enough (which turns out to be a disaster!)

So perhaps more significant than whether forcing it can be done, is - who of sound mind would WANT love that had been coerced, or forced, or was either impossible for the other person to grasp or was simply rejected by him/her & was possibly being used for ulterior purposes?

Then there's the real matter that the only way to know if it's the real thing is to let it unfold naturally; and if it fails to, to be genuinely glad to know the truth before investing oneself in futile hopelessness, possibly for all concerned.

But - oh! - the wonderful reward when and if it does happen that "two people just being who they are and being loved for who they are, . . . makes the bonds inseparable." Then they're silken bonds of love, not chains.

I've written much poetry on those principles. They're so basic to my personal philosophy.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

I think Mother and my sisters - even I - had/have no consciousness of being elusive if we are; so it lacks an intentional course or purpose. Daddy's saying it caused me to think about it, but it was like - 'so?' If I've had or have that quality, I'm unaware of what it even is. I just feel myself being 'all of a piece', not in fragments, though some of the piece has various characteristics, I guess.

Surely what 'elusive' was or is, was actually in Daddy's perception of Mother. If he saw it in the rest of us, he was probably just expecting us to 'take after her'. I'm sure Mother was too involved in living and too non-self-conscious to plan and plot snares or traps. That would be the antithesis of who she was and she was so fully who she was & had been so since childhood. She was like a light wherever she went; - a little zany at times but always so bright, compassionate and FUN. Dad used to tell her 'no wonder the kids love you so, - you're one of them!' But she was at ease with and 'one of' with anyone - or by herself.

So if this 'elusiveness' quality is a means to ultimate seduction, any cleverness or 'intellect involved is surely just in 'doing what comes natcherly" and must be guide by the 'intelligence of the whole being',S which is no small part of complete intelligence of a person.

It's that kind of 'intelligence' which allows the Samarai to sense, without conscious thought, exactly where an opponent's blow is originating as it's in motion and to know the exact response to block it; - all within seconds without having to put it through the more ponderous brain's slower filters & processing, which would have resulted in his death, had he waited for that.

It may be what makes little infant girls such teases and flirts. They don't plan to, but probably sense a likely candidate for it without consciously thinking about it, and know just how to reel him in! hehe.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Oh my! I was really mixed up when I appeared as 'aquarius' on your comment thread, and didn't realize I wasn't logged on! I was desperately fishing around for some word that would let me comment.

I had to change my password as a result.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Ah, yes - to ad or not to ad.

I've been deliberately eliminating ads in my latest hubs. It's simple to remove them or to permit them again. Just click 'settings' on the right among the other edit stuff in the open hub in edit mode. Set it 'none' for the "Ad level" and uncheck "this hub may be considered commercial". That's it.

Ads always get placed right in the places I've planned for elements or spaces of my hub design and require me to either revise, working around the ads - or to just let 'em mess up my artwork, which I really resist doing.

I don't collect any $$ from my hubs, nor want to, so it doesn't matter to me. In fact, I'd pay for the freedom to create my way. Your 'sad- glad' story strengthens my happiness with giving up ads.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

You are, as much as anyone I know, in touch with who you are and dedicated to preserving that treasure. What a blessing to know and like, exactly who you are. I read once that the treasury investigators in the counterfit division, do not spend much time acquainting themselves with counterfits, they become so familiar with the real thing that a counterfit is recognized instantly. If we were to know ourselves in such a way, perhaps those who tell or treat us otherwise, would be recognized instantly as counterfit!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Elusiveness is in one's spirit, planted and nurtured by one's intellect. A clever gardener knows when to water, when to weed and when to harvest.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

I could care less about the ads, although my pay pal account is up to $50 after two years. I'm letting it accumulate so that I can offset the cost of a future computer. I should have enough in another 20 years if we have 0 inflation.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 4 years ago from TEXAS

Dear Alan, You're wise & kind & I appreciate both. It's something of a lifetime work to get to know oneself honestly and realize that it's that uniqueness which one IS which has & is one's essential value. Trying to 'put on' something else is superficial & doesn't add to the value, though 'putting INTO' things of value (such as education) enhances & lastingly expands the real self. It's a difference in acquiring what's been internalized into one's being or, conversely, just veneering oneself, which inevitably reveals the fake it is.

I discovered that being me and doing things the way I do them WORKS for me, while trying to fit into unfitting others' expectations & demands doesn't and, at best, leads only to a shabby, unfounded imitation. At worst, it could lead to virtually losing oneself. Yes, with knowing oneself, one's eyes are opened, not only to the self-knowledge but also to ability to recognize those who try to treat us other-than as the counterfeits they are! One must pity their lack.

Becoming and being oneself is an ongoing 'do-it-yourself' project! Happily, it's a relief to (most) others when one is clearly one's own "put-together" person & therefore, not their burden or responsibility!

________________

I love the metaphor of the gardener. It fits, if the gardener is an intuitive gardener as well as an intelligent one. Knowing the conditions for growth as facts, as well as having the sense of when and how to supply them. Good one, Alan.

________________

I just love the fun/irony in your semi-serious dismissal of the value of the 'pay' for writing on HP. First of all, - the pay offered is not for the actual writing's value, but for its ability to attract customers for other products. It's a joke, as any measurement of one's writing's value, and makes sense only if it's one's own goal & measurement of productivity. It's commercial writing at heart.

I got a laugh out of your initial irony when you first mentioned it and now, again when replying to my rather serious reply to the first one, which was focusing on the that ads weren't showing up on your hubs all of a sudden, since I've recently elected not to have them on mine & though the process might somehow fit your case. I much prefer your fun with it, but you know how I am with stuff! :-) Big ole hugs.


QudsiaP1 profile image

QudsiaP1 4 years ago

What an excellent hub arb; I had no idea the plastics were that high in the US.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

If they are cheaper in Pakistan, you could increase tourism considerably! Ha ha


Justsilvie 4 years ago

Another great Hub! Iran has some of the best plastic surgeons in the world and the people there are just as addicted to it as we are... We have a common ground here, maybe something to build on.


Neil Sperling profile image

Neil Sperling 4 years ago from Port Dover Ontario Canada

Great hub -- nothinG sexier than one who is comfortable in their own skin (without modifications). An aura of quiet confidence is a real turn on.... I like your humorous with a message style.

Oh - that capital G in nothing was to help people find their own G spot.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

OMG! something more to build on.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Thanks neil. Appreciate the comment.


epigramman profile image

epigramman 4 years ago

Too bad there are not more decent gentlemen like you around for all of these nice ladies in lonely Hubland - because you talk the talk and walk the walk with a keen and perceptive eye and a rapier wit.

You speak the truth and yet you are open minded as well which makes you Sir Arb - a man's man that we all want to grow up to be and also a ladies' man who listens and knows how to communicate - hubbravo to you and I will send a royal legion of lovely ladies your way for this one by sharing at hubpages facebook page and sending a few surprise guests at lake erie time ontario canada 4:20pm


Amy Becherer profile image

Amy Becherer 4 years ago from St. Louis, MO

I believe that men and women are designed to do many things, but at the top of the long grocery list, is procreate. As an engineer, our maker doesn't make mistakes. Hormones rule. Within our brains are the neurons that quickly assess, upon first sight, whether a man or woman is a healthy specimen, capable of producing healthy offspring. In the majority of circles, health and beauty co-exist. Hence, eye-balling each other.

Every culture has pre-requisites for assessing beauty. Even babies will look at a face that possesses symmetry, ie; classical beauty within the culture. Looks do matter. They are the first thing we notice about each other and the basis for initial attraction. Without satisfying whatever the individual deems attractive, there is often a lack of interest. Of course, knowing someone well growing up or going to the same school can preclude some of what Hollywood lives and couples for, but for the majority of our fast-paced lives, most relationships begin with that initial glance.

I think that the question as to what do women think men are looking for is very difficult to answer. I like to think men want someone they like, respect, have fun with and can discuss anything with, which makes them feel attracted to the woman. I've been told by the two men I've married and divorced that I am smart, funny, interesting and talented. Yet, it seemed they forgot how to listen to me and found me only interesting in bed. They were both well educated, intelligent men that were successful in exciting long-term careers. Yet, they were Neanderthals at heart. Men talk out of both sides of their mouths when they approach women with lofty verbiage yet insist on Victoria's Secret or Playboy playmates as the epitome of womanhood. And, why the popularity of online pornography if the interesting woman they are involved with or committed to is enough?

I do not believe that many women are obsessed with the shape and size of their body parts or aging because they are inherently neurotic. Women are bombarded with a sense of competition on the TV, in movies and the pages of magazines with a stylized, air-brushed, made- up illusion of perfection, a dichotomy; an angelic wildcat, who looks hot, speaks softly, works hard, and is forever turned on by her caveman. I believe men want it all, and then, if they find her, they fear they won't measure up themselves. Cavemen are their own worst enemies. Truly...


Amy Becherer profile image

Amy Becherer 4 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Former head of the C.I.A., David Patraeus is a good example of what I'm talking about.

BTW, your piece is awesome, provocative, well-written and interesting food for thought. Thank you, Arb.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hello epigramman. It is an honor to have you visit. Even more for the gracious comment! Perhaps 43 years of marriage has simply broken through my impervious mind and the years have revealed some truths to me. In any case, attraction alone does not sustain a relationship.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hello Amy! Wow. What a response. I'm glad that you got this off your chest (no pun intended). Your response is well writen, intelligent, logical and well presented. None the less, speaking as a man, I am not sure I agree with your total assessment. It is somewhat like seeing the symptoms and missing the disease. Attraction comes in many colors and although physical attraction is the proverbial magnet, initially, it wanes without regret ao reluctance. I have observe through life, the deepest and most lasting attraction is the product of her head and it spreads across the rest of her like sun light chasing shadow from an exposed crevice. That we as men are instinctively drawn to what we and our respective cultures hold sexually alluring, is not what keeps the great neanderthal indefinetly enslaved to the genesis of his attraction. Less I be misunderstood, let me be clear. Sexual attraction will always be on the menu. Although the plate may get his attention, it is the the cooking that keeps him coming back and the cooking is always done in the head. I think such truth applies as much to men.

I agree that there is a cultural blitz in America, which sells an imitation of love and real sexuality. I would submit that we have been complicit in lending credibility to such fantasy. The human race by nature, regardless of gender, wants it all. Our failings along way will enlighten us and we will embrace all the tighter the things that matter. I did find her many years ago, but, I've little fear that I won't measure up. Her love does not require such absurdity from me. I fail everyday, but my sucesses, make it easier for her to forget them. Perhaps, women as well as men, choose mates where great personality is an afterthought. They say nice guys finish last, I suspect the same is true of nice girls. Well Amy, there is much truth in what you say but I assure you, it is not the whole truth. There is some neanderthal in all us men, but, like women; there is much, much more. We just need to go down and get it.


phdast7 profile image

phdast7 4 years ago from Atlanta, Georgia

First, what an absolutely wonderful phrase - "salacious whispering statistics." I also really like "cavern of whatever language she is speaking."

Great hub which sparked several very interesting conversations. I want to say more, but I just looked at my watch and in a little over an hour I need to be standing in front of students. :) Your writing causes me to lose all sense of time. :)

In case I don't make it back any time soon, I hope you have a wonderful and family-filled Thanksgiving. Blessings! ~~Theresa


Amy Becherer profile image

Amy Becherer 4 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Thank you for your thoughtfully magnificent response, arb, which addressed some of my misgivings after I hit "post" with my statement.

Most of the anger that my comment relays is self-directed. It was the Neanderthal in me, as a young person, that bought into the Hollywood concept of relationships between men and women. Most human beings appreciate aesthetics. God gave us the gift of sight, after all. I want to be beautiful, but I let the quest define me. Hence, I attracted men who put beauty first and foremost. In retrospect, the blame laid with me as much as they. I am no longer an accomplice. The beautiful way you describe attraction and enduring love is the poetry every woman wants to know with a man. Thank you, arb, for taking the time to explain your experience. You validate what I'd hoped and know, deep in my heart, is at the the soul of enduring love. You are a magnificent writer with the power to express yourself in a way few can, with truth, intellect, heart and soul and a dollop of magic. Thank you


azure_sky profile image

azure_sky 4 years ago from Somewhere on the Beach, if I am lucky :)

Definitely food for thought here, with a lot crumbs to nibble on while I read through all of your comments!! Thought-filled, but funny as hell too! Thanks, arb...... and keep it rolling!!


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hi Theresa. Thanks for the read and comments. Been without my computer for the past 8 days. A malicious virus that locked up my computer. Anyway, I have some catching up to do. Be well.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Sorry for the late response Amy. My computer left me for a fling with a handsome virus and I've been alone for a week. She has returned to me this day, free of his influence and filled with renewed attraction for all that swirls in my busy head.

I suppose we all have chased the superficial at one time or another. It is part of growing up. Love must grow up just like the rest of us. I am happy that you have come to a place where only you, is worthy of defining you. I am looking forward now to reading your hubs. Your comments reveal a writer worth reading and person worth knowing.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

Hello azure_sky! Its been a while and it is a delight to hear from you. I think my sense of humor passes unoticed at times. My goal was to be funny and simply leave a question to consider. I love to stir the thinking in readers but, while they laugh. Thanks for reading.


coffeegginmyrice profile image

coffeegginmyrice 4 years ago from Toronto, Ontario

I am seeing lots of breasts and I am a woman, LOL! "Personality" that is. A woman who can make a man laugh, cry and pretend to listen his blabbing on a hockey game on TV. A woman who pretends she could play a computer game he thus loves playing and accidentally knowing the functions of a game controller. A woman who praises man for ALL that matters to him and where advice is welcome. A woman who can cook and fills his hungry stomach. A woman who can clean up and pick up after his frequent shedding of clothes on the floor (a moulting partner), ha! A woman who religiously listens with her sleepy head of his boring non-stop conversations about politics and learns to enjoy equally watching Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert shows. A woman who doubts trusting him (you know what I mean) but cries silently without confrontation, and more...

So funny, useful and interesting hub, arb! Fake breasts don't get my admiration either.


arb profile image

arb 4 years ago from oregon Author

coffeeggsinmyrice, Thanks for reading and commenting. We are the strangest of all collaborations we men and women. Laughing, crying and everything in between. I'm sure, given the chance, we would both do some rewriring if we could.


Edlira profile image

Edlira 3 years ago

Hey there, had missed reading your hubs :). Interesting piece of writing. I might have an answer or two to what men or women want from each-other, but if I voiced them you would think I am just bitter and cynical ;). All I know is, the biggest problem seems to be that most men and most women do not know themselves what they want and logically if you walk in the dark, sooner or later you are bound to hit your head and get hurt. In the "instant satisfaction" ( dare I say ) global community we seem to have evolved into(or maybe regressed) , which is driven by fear and self-doubt, very few bother wait for "long-term benefits". So big boobs, and whatever the sexual appealing category entails will leave "great personality" far behind.


arb profile image

arb 3 years ago from oregon Author

It is so good to hear from you Eldira. I think part of growing up is learning that we are not the center of the world. Living entails bumping in to things, whether it is dark or light. My satire on sexual appeal simply reflects the value we place upon ourselves. We have some responsibility in conveying to others what we value in ourselves. No one diminishes us without our own consent. If women are waiting for men to make them feel beautiful then they will find much disappointment. If she finds the beauty in herself, it is easier to show to others.


phdast7 profile image

phdast7 3 years ago from Atlanta, Georgia

Good Afternoon Alan - I remember reading this some time ago, but can't remember why I didn't leave a comment then. An interesting take and explication on the concerns and problems of "Neanderthalism." (I love coining new words.)

The varied array of comments were also a pleasurable read. It is a sad commentary (at least speaking for America) that we spend so much time and money trying to perfect the outside and so little trying to improve the inside.

I am always impressed by actresses (and actors) who have made peace with themselves and with growing older. They know who they are and what they are worth and they are worth much more than firm curves and a tight chin. They should be our examples. Thank you for reminding us.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 3 years ago from TEXAS

Hi Theresa - what an excellent comment. You've brought a word to my attention I really like: explication. Thank you! ( Just happened to check out this hub of Alan's again myself.)


phdast7 profile image

phdast7 3 years ago from Atlanta, Georgia

Hi Nellieanna - It is one of my favorite words and yet it seems to be seldom used. I guess most people opt for the more common (but not quite the same) word "explanation." :)

Seems like I will never get caught up reading what my friend's have written. Got back from DC and after a very busy week of classes, I cam down with bronchitis and laryngitiis. Knocked me out for a week and the doctors were afraid it would become pneumonia (not sure why, I guess as you approach 60, garden variety infections - bronchitis - become potentially more ominous).

Back in school last week with my voice popping in and out. I can't imagine how stressful it must be for people who are professional singers -- every little sniffle or cough would make me crazy. :)

Anyway, hope you are well. :)


arb profile image

arb 3 years ago from oregon Author

Hello dear Theresa, I am struck by the outward obsession to garner the male attention in contrast to what it is women really want, but, I suppose all women want to feel beautiful. What does one do however if they do not meet a cultures criteria for beauty. My experience reveals that personality offsets almost any physical deficiency. Not all men will attain the athleticism they want nor the physical stature sought by women. There is however, a confusion between sexy, sensual and beauty. Personally, I think sexy and sensual are behaviors which do not flow from beauty but flow from personality and provacation. A sort of intelligent tease. Beauty on the other hand is both inward and outward and any deficiency in one area must find a way to draw attention to the other. Unfortunately, sexual attention (attraction) becomes the means rather than the fruit. But, what do I know. I am afterall a neanderthal!


arb profile image

arb 3 years ago from oregon Author

Well ladies, I confess; I did not what explication was. Had to look it up. I was convinced the neanderthal was being teased.


arb profile image

arb 3 years ago from oregon Author

I am so sorry theresa that you have been under the weather. I have been fortunate so far, but, much is going around. I am sitting here this afternoon listening to Matador de sa pena over and over. Randy tells me such behavior is indicative of a mental affliction.

I ask her why it is necessary to make reference to the obvious. If I can manage such condition with music what business does the world have with me. I've always wanted to write something while in the trance that falls over my empty head when it plays, yet all I do is close my eyes and move as though it were speaking directly to my soul. Such tranquility should afflict us all!


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 3 years ago from TEXAS

Well - I'll be using it now, Theresa! I love fine differences in words which 'get at' one's meaning more explicitly! The problem with that is always that the ears upon which they fall may not only miss the subtleties, but the entire category of meanings! haha But the differences between explication and explanation are so useful! Explicit, detailed for explication; and clarifying, justifying for explanation; the one, more fine-tuned and the other more blanketing. These, anyway, are my residual perceptions of the two words, - so probably how I'll mean them when used!

I'm really sorry to hear of your coming down with serious bronchitis & laryngitis. I know of several people close to me who've been struck with the same bugs. Working as you do with people exposes you to such things circulating.

I suppose that these areas of your infections - throat and bronchia - being on the pathway to the lungs, where pneumonia is generated by similar infections, caused them to bear watching by the doctors, don't you think?

I had bronchial pneumonia when I was was 17 & in college. Got it during final week of my sophomore year when staying up all night cramming & then spent a miserable summer at home in HOT San Angelo getting over it after missing the finals. Had to take the tests by proxy toward the end of the summer, in order to go back to school in the fall. I was barely recovered and the information was even dimmer, so I didn't do terribly well on them and my GPA suffered. Taught me a valuable lesson: to not wait till final week to cram in an entire semester for the tests, though I still have to discipline myself to not stay up all hours doing projects I want to do - not always successfully!

Anyway, - I'm so glad you avoided pneumonia, which is not fun to have and is surely more dangerous when one is older. Take care of yourself and try to not push it too hard till you're fully recovered. It sounds as if you've still symptoms of the laryngitis. But that's a vulnerable area of the respiratory system, as well as the others!

Oh, yes; - it must be horrid for singers and professional speakers, to have to be always vigilant with their health, especially in those areas which get the most stress from their work anyway!

Thank you! - Yes, I'm well and have just survived my 81st birthday with flying colors! This means I'm now moving into my 82nd year! :-)


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 3 years ago from TEXAS

I apologize for sidetracking your comment thread, Alan. Guilty I. Forgive me, please.

OH, my goodness, Alan. This is spooky. I didn't recognize "Matador de Pena" in your comment to Theresa, so of course, I looked it up; and was shaken when I heard it, because it's the Adagio from Concierto de Aranjuez by Joaguin Rodrigo, which has entranced me since I first heard it 40 or so years ago. It's the most haunting music I know and I've let it engulf me too - and have been lost in it. It is most certainly a "tranquility which should afflict us all" - well put. Seems almost inevitable that it would - if all heard it!

This is a link to the Concierto de Aranjuez Adagio . . . - please see if it's not the same melody as Matado de Pena: http://youtu.be/e9RS4biqyAc


arb profile image

arb 3 years ago from oregon Author

Good morning butterfly! They are indeed the same and I have the cd by Rodrigo in my truck. I should not be surprised that you were familiar with such music. I have a small eighteen foot boat with a cd player. Some of my favorite ,memories are sitting alone in the middle of a high lake. Just me and Adagio and fish civil enough to wait till it was over before biting! Ha Ha.


phdast7 profile image

phdast7 3 years ago from Atlanta, Georgia

Matador de sa pena has now been added to my music collection. I was unfamiliar with it and it is indeed tranquil, heavenly, and quite wonderful. Thank you both for introducing me to this fine composition. I shall listen to it before attempting any particularly arduous or difficult written exchange with a superior. :) I may not be the victor in the discussion, but my blood pressure will remain where it should and my soul be much less agitated. Not a small feat at all for a piece of music.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 3 years ago from TEXAS

Ah! 'Tis a good one :-) highlighted by lovely imagery. . . you, Adagio and civil fish in a boat on a high lake, at early morning or pre-twilight, perhaps.


Nellieanna profile image

Nellieanna 3 years ago from TEXAS

That's wonderful, Theres! A more memorable addition to your collection is unimaginable!

Perhaps it's where one counts and measures victories which define where one's heart is. Healthy blood pressure and serene heart, mind and soul are no small victories!


superfly47 profile image

superfly47 3 years ago from Canada

Say you have a man who values personality over looks.

If he sees four women will he approach the one with the best personality? No, because he can't know who she is.

So, who will he approach? The more appealing one to his eye, if he finds her personality is wanting he'll go to the next one. When he finds one he enjoy he'll keep talking to her and wont' approach the remaining ones. One of those very well could have the best personality.

As the ratio of women to men who graduate college increases, this puts more pressure on college women due to supply and demand. Women are much more attracted to a guy with a job than an unemployed one and one with a low paying job.

College educated men with well paying jobs are much fewer and thus more in demand, so they can be picker. This puts more pressure on women to stand out, so their is a fair bit of rationality on improving looks.

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