jump to last post 1-7 of 7 discussions (23 posts)

Senate Vote Makes Strategic Defaults on Credit Cards Moral

  1. bgamall profile image85
    bgamallposted 6 years ago

    I just wrote a hub on this, but what I want is to have a discussion here. This is the issue: the senate voted on 5/19 to forbid the states from setting caps on interest rates for credit cards. The injustice of this is that the state in which the credit cards are issued, namely South Dakota and Delaware, control the rates of cards. Those states have no usury protection at all.

    I have always felt that people have the moral right to walk away from credit cards, because there is no usury protection. I still feel this way. And now that the senate has affirmed the approval of usury by voting down the amendment, I feel even more strongly that it is not immoral to strategically default on credit cards.

    I say all this as a protest, but some will not be able to default at this time because of credit score issues, and I understand that. But in protest, I advocate that anyone who can, should fight this peaceful guerrilla war by walking away!

    1. leeberttea profile image60
      leebertteaposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      So you think it's morally okay to borrow money from someone and agree to pay it back at some interest rate and then walk away without paying back a single penny because you suddenly feel the terms you agreed to are no longer fair?

      I think that is reprehensible! All you're doing is shifting the cost your selfish greed onto responsible parties. Do you think people should have a right to borrow and others should be forced to lend?

      1. bgamall profile image85
        bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        The terms change on the part of the credit card companies. The government has a responsibility to protect the consumer from usury. If it is usurious you can walk away. Absolutely.

        If you are a responsible party taking it in the shorts you are stupid.

        1. leeberttea profile image60
          leebertteaposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          The terms don't change, they are spelled out to begin with. It's up to you to read and understand them. If you pay late or go over your limit the credit card companies can charge you more. This was all worked out in advance between the administration and the card companies so no one should be surprised. The card companies said the new legislation would lead to higher interest rates and tighter credit and that is exactly what happened. The administration knew this and pushed the law through. This is all a result of the democrats legislating so be sure to thank them come election day.

          1. bgamall profile image85
            bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            If credit card companies want the loyalty of their customers, then they need government to set usury caps. Failure to do so mean that every man if for himself. They cannot make you pay a dime if government abdicates historical responsibility. It now becomes just a business decision.

  2. profile image0
    Will Bensonposted 6 years ago

    bgamall posted:
    This is the issue: the senate voted on 5/19 to forbid the states from setting caps on interest rates for credit cards.


    If there were any doubts that the finance industry wouldn't have the hutzpah to screw the country just because we bailed them out, the issue is now clear. They leaned on congress and congress caved - there will be no usary protection in the new finance bill.

    True, you cannot protect people from their own excesses, but my point is that the election results show that voters are onto them and hopefully, the voters will remember this in every election from now on.

    We're in charge.

    1. bgamall profile image85
      bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Good point, we bailed their sorry asses out. And what do we get in return? Massive usury.

  3. bgamall profile image85
    bgamallposted 6 years ago

    One more point, usury is stealing. The government has essentially given a free pass to credit card companies to steal. Therefore, only the citizens are left to police the credit card companies by walking away from the debt.

    1. wilderness profile image95
      wildernessposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      How do you figure usury is stealing?  You agreed to the terms with your eyes open.  You were not forced to take a credit card - it was YOUR choice whether to take it or not.  If you decide to walk away from the debt that you agreed to pay, YOU are the one stealing, not the credit company.

      1. bgamall profile image85
        bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        No, you are wrong. Excess interest should be stopped by the government. It is stealing. Period. They chose to raise rates. I chose to not pay for their theft.

        1. wilderness profile image95
          wildernessposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          But they cannot arbitrarily raise the rates.  It MUST be with your approval - your agreement.  And only then do you choose not to pay them as you agreed to.  Stealing, all right, but not by the company.

          1. bgamall profile image85
            bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Wow, what planet requires your approval? Certainly not the one that contains the United States!

  4. Milla Mahno profile image63
    Milla Mahnoposted 6 years ago

    Two wrongs don't make right, my mom always told me...

    1. bgamall profile image85
      bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      On the contrary, it isn't wrong to be a vigilante. Vigilantes can help society and fix the abuses against others. I am proud to be a credit card vigilante.

  5. wilderness profile image95
    wildernessposted 6 years ago

    Whatever happened to personal responsibility?  If you don't want to pay the costs of the loan, don't agree to do so.  If you ARE willing to pay the costs, then by all means take the loan but uphold your end of it and pay the costs.

    When you agree to pay the costs and then decide you don't want to after all that's worse than anything the credit card companies do.  You are stealing from them.

    We are not a nation of children, to be told by government what we should pay or not pay for any product.  Take responsibility for your own actions!

    1. OwnThought profile image60
      OwnThoughtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Personal responsibility ended when the taxpayers were forced by that same government to bail out these predatory vermin.

      My tax dollars, your tax dollars, our children's and grandchildren's tax dollars - ad nauseum - are now obligated to pay this monstrous, fabricated debt - upon which interest is charged in phenomenal amounts.

      THEY are stealing from US!

  6. TMMason profile image73
    TMMasonposted 6 years ago

    So Don't pay your debts, then the banks come, you cry and refuse to pay it because the banks had to take a bailout to stay afloat, because you wouldn't pay them thier money to begin with.

    Yup...

    I wouldn't loan anyone, anymore money either, if I were them.

    People cheat and lie all over the apps for mortgages and cards then get mad, when they don't pay and the Co's do what has been agree to already.

    Those people are called cheats and dead-beats where I come from.

    1. bgamall profile image85
      bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Good, let them not loan. Then there won't be any reason for them. We win. Others will come in to take their place with other types of loans and more reasonable loans.

      Payday loans are usury as well. I don't use them but I would not hesitate to tell a person to walk away from them.

      We bailed them out with taxpayer money. They borrow at 1/2 percent or less from the government and we can't get that rate. And instead of lowering their interest rates, they increase them. And this is because they are afraid to be stuck with them. Well, if they are afraid of bad underwriting maybe they shouldn't be in business.

      The only thing that keeps them in business is their greed.

  7. Uninvited Writer profile image82
    Uninvited Writerposted 6 years ago

    Many credit card companies hook people with introductory low rates and then raise them to almost double, sometimes triple. They know exactly what they are doing and definitely should be held partly reponsible.

    1. bgamall profile image85
      bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      True about that. Also, the ponzi scam that caused the credit crisis was set up in 1997 at Basel 2 where the banks allowed off balance sheet banking, meaning they made it legal to hide crap loans.

      The TBTF banks are guilty, guilty, guilty and they deserve to be dismantled and chewed up. But the international banster cabal of central banks will never allow that.

      How many of you even know that the Federal Reserve is a private central banks that prints money and charges the taxpayer interest for doing so. While they return most of the interest to the treasury they don't return all of it. And they allowed lax underwriting because they were at Basel 2!!!

      Americans are so asleep. We need a peaceful movement of bank vigilantes willing to walk away from every kind of loan.

      1. OwnThought profile image60
        OwnThoughtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Absolutely we are asleep, and resentful of any attempt to be awakened. Bgamall, I found your page a week or so ago and have been periodically perusing your posts. I am curious to know if you yourself have strategically defaulted? Not to be too nosy, I hope...

        1. bgamall profile image85
          bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Ha, Own Thought. Let me put it this way. I have paid extra on credit cards, attempted to get those cards fixed to a lower interest rate because of a good payment history. I was ignored, even though I had a pretty good credit score at the time. I know what these companies are up to and it is no good. They rob with excessive interest and they know that people cannot sustain payments at interest rates that are too high.

          Credit card companies, and you can study this, make a massive amount of money even with the defaults. It makes you wonder why they are not willing to extend much credit? Maybe they think things could get worse.

          I actually was upside down in a mortgage, and this was way back in 1999. I was scheduled to move out of state, and I was forced to default. It was not a strategic default by definition but it was close. Had I stayed in the house, I could have had a large appreciation in the bubble period, but things worked out anyway.

          As it is, I purchased a manufactured home in a nice park and paid cash. I am now out of cash, but at least I live within my humble means now. I noticed your picture. It looks like the Truckee River. If you are in California, you can walk away with no recourse. In other words, if the company takes back the house they cannot also sue you for the loan.

          If you are in Nevada, you probably will not get sued, although if you do a short sale, you could be sued for the difference. You could be sued but then what can they do to you? Not much.

          1. OwnThought profile image60
            OwnThoughtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Thanks for your response. I am actually in Idaho - that is Sun Valley, we took a day trip a few weeks ago. :-)

            I am not a home owner, so don't have anything to lose there. But I already had a bankruptcy experience due to job loss for a very extended period of time 7 years ago. It was extremely unpleasant, but I lived through it. I don't need to read up on credit card rackets, because I had a fair bit of knowledge before finding you, not only from the bankruptcy, but also from investigating the NWO.

            Obviously, I didn't figure out how to live well enough within my means because I am now saddled with crushing debt again. Two paycuts over the past two years and $15K in medical bills haven't helped either. But at least I am  employed, for which I am grateful. My credit score is quite good, though, and my son is about to enter college, so I am terrified of losing the ability to help him because we have no money saved and he will need a loan co-signer even if he works. Which starts a vicious cycle for him, too, I suppose...

            This trap sucks!

 
working