Gaza 2009: This Is Not A War, It's A Massacre

“They stole my land, burnt my olive trees, destroyed my house, took my water, imprisoned my father, killed my mother, starved us all, humiliated us all. But I am to blame: I shot a rocket back. So they stole more of my land, burnt my olive trees, destroyed my house, took my water, bombed my country…”

Anonymous placard on display London Jan 3rd 2009.

There’s a story going about. It runs something like this: because Hamas have been lobbing rockets at unarmed civilians in Southern Israel, the Israeli government have been forced to attack them in Gaza. The death of ordinary Palestinians (including more than 400 children) is entirely due to Hamas, who use their own people as human shields. The Israelis use every means possible to minimise civilian casualties.

The story is told in this form in the National Post in Toronto by Lorne Gunter: “Suppose you lived in the Toronto suburb of Don Mills," he writes, "and people from the suburb of Scarborough – about 10 kilometres away – were firing as many as 100 rockets a day into your yard, your kid's school, the strip mall down the street and your dentist's office?”

Or again in this form in a letter to the Irish Times in Dublin by the Israeli Ambassador, Zion Evonry: “What would you do if Dublin were subjected to a bombardment of 8,000 rockets and mortars?"

The answer is implied in the question, of course. What would you do if you were being unjustifiably attacked in this way, by some irrational, brutal enemy, whose only purpose is to destroy you and all that you love?

This is the justification for the onslaught against Gaza which has been taking place since December 27th and which has now claimed in excess of 800 lives.

It’s a story, of course. Some stories are true. Some stories are not. This particular story has the advantage that it sounds like it could be true. Indeed, you can see the proof, there, in those spiralling smoke trails swarming into the sky, and in the scenes of devastated buildings and hysterical human beings that follow.

We all tell stories.

We construct the world in narrative form so that it fits in with the image we want to create.

This is as true of nations as it is of individuals.

The trouble with this story is that it seems to have taken hold in everyone’s mind, and that you hear it, in one form or another, over and over again, either implied, or openly stated, from BBC reporters and other journalists, or written between the lines of almost every newspaper article; not to speak from the mouths of your friends who, while shocked at the terrible images coming out of Gaza, at the scenes of horror and carnage that are being shown (most too horrific to be aired) nevertheless shrug with sadness and resignation at the end of their sentence and mention those rockets.

It always ends up with those rockets.

Almost no one asks the opposing question: what would you do as a captive and dispossessed people living in the 21st century equivalent of the Warsaw ghetto, whose border points and crossings were controlled by armed soldiers, living under a blockade with barely the minimum food and fuel to subsist upon, who are regularly subject to targeted assassination, to arbitrary arrest and violent attack, and now, it seems, to a full-scale military assault terrorising a whole population, slaughtering women and children and whole families in their beds?

How do a few home-made rockets compare to that?

Indeed there is a grotesque imbalance in the reporting of this on-going brutality, where scenes of dismembered Palestinian children held by blood-splattered parents screaming with horror and grief are shown next to scenes of an Israeli women crying because a rocket has landed nearby and disturbed her sleep.

So far, at the time of writing, 10 Israelis have been killed. Five of those were Israeli soldiers killed by their own side.

This in not a “conflict” in any recognisable sense of the word. It is not a battle. The language of war does not apply in this case. The fourth largest and second best equipped army in the world are facing a rag-tag militia armed with home-made rockets welded together in workshops usually reserved for car repairs.

It is often said that Hamas are targeting civilians. This is a philosophical absurdity. You cannot target those rockets. They are the equivalent of tin cans full of weed killer. Hamas are targeting no one. The most they can do is to point the rockets over the wall that imprisons them in the vague hope that they might hit something. We see pictures of scenes where a rocket has hit a car or a house or a yard. How many more of those rockets are landing harmlessly in fields? They make a big noise and they make people jump. They bring attention to the Palestinian cause. Occasionally they kill people. This is always to be regretted. But the degree of murder and mayhem, of terror, of violence, of bloodshed and carnage, of psychological trauma, on the one side, is entirely disproportionate to the level of provocation on the other.

The Israelis, on the other hand, say they do not target civilians. However, they know perfectly well that civilians will be killed, are being killed. They also know in what numbers they will continue to be killed. If a gang intending to commit a robbery take weapons with them and then “accidentally” kill the guards, they are not only guilty of the lesser crime of robbery, they are also guilty of murder. Committing a crime while in pursuit of some other goal is no less of a crime.

We’ve heard the story: now here are some facts. Hamas are the legitimate government of Gaza, having been elected in free and fair elections in 2006, making them the only democratic government in the Arab world. Many of the buildings destroyed in the first wave of Israeli attacks were government buildings, the necessary infrastructure of a nation. By destroying those buildings the Israelis are making it impossible for the people of Gaza to govern themselves, regardless of which party they choose. Also, many of the so-called legitimate targets killed in the first wave of bombings – those ones not counted amongst the civilian dead - were unarmed policemen and government bureaucrats, mere functionaries of government, not Hamas operatives or terrorist targets at all, just men and women employed to do a job. Again, it is clear that Israel are targeting the civilian infrastructure in order to make Gaza ungovernable.

So, having backed a coup against the elected government of Gaza, which was vigorously defeated by Hamas, the Israeli government then imposed a blockade, depriving the population of food and fuel and clean water. This is a form of collective punishment and is a crime under International Law. By sealing Gaza off from the rest of the world, by limiting its access to the basic necessities of life, Israel has turned this overpopulated land of refugees into a ghetto, the exact equivalent of the Warsaw ghetto of the earlier 20th century, a place where a whole population is imprisoned and punished merely because of their race.

But, you say, they should still not be firing those rockets. True. There was a ceasefire. It went into effect on June 19th 2008, and despite the fact that Israel never fully abided by the terms of the agreement, continuing to maintain a partial blockade despite international pressure, rocket fire from Gaza had virtually stopped, it being recognised by independent observers that Hamas was doing everything within its power to discipline and control other groups, such as Islamic Jihad, with access to weapons.

The ceasefire was broken on the 4th November 2008, not by Hamas, but by the Israeli Defence Force in an attack against a house in Gaza in which six members of Hamas's military wing were killed, including two commanders.

This is the background to the renewal of rocket attacks after this date, a fact that the Israeli government know full well, but which their spokesmen omit to mention whenever they talk about rocket attacks as the excuse for the current invasion.

Try looking at it the other way around, once more. Imagine if Hamas had managed to kill several high-ranking members of the Israeli Defence Force in a raid. Imagine what Israeli propagandists would have made of that, what news headlines there would be throughout the world. And it’s a measure of the blatant and unapologetic bias of our media industry that not only was this hardly noticed at the time, but it has been completely forgotten in all subsequent reports, which continue to proclaim, along with Israeli spokesmen and women, that the “cause” of the current conflict is Hamas rocket attacks on Israeli citizens, not Israeli attacks upon Hamas.

Since then, of course, it has been a horrifying tale of atrocity and murder. UN schools full of women and children targeted. Whole families slaughtered. Cousins, uncles, fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, sons and daughters killed. There is probably not a single family in Gaza now who hasn’t lost at least one member of their extended family. Ambulances and aid workers being shot at. Over 800 dead and several thousand wounded, a large percentage of them women and children. Dismembered bodies lying in the streets. Corpses tangled in the dust and rubble of collapsed buildings. Hospitals overwhelmed, the corridors running with blood. Children starving while their parents bodies rot. Shortages of food and medicine. Days without fuel. Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide. No shelters. No route out of the carnage. All the border crossings shut tight, penning in the entire population. Death in the streets and houses. People waving white flags being shot at. People shivering in their houses with all the windows open in the depths of winter because otherwise the boom of nearby shells would blow out the glass. The daily fear, the daily trauma, the living nightmare of existence, a whole generation of children who have only ever known this horror, this fear, the death that comes screaming from the sky. Imagine what this must do to a child’s mind.

Is there such a thing as hell? Of course there is. Hell is man-made. It is a war-zone, and it exists in Gaza right now.

So there are stories and there are stories. 1.5 million stories in Gaza. Stories of fear and injustice, of mutilation and dismemberment, of pain and grief and horror. But here is one story that sums it all up for me. It is the story of the extended Samouni family, sheltering in an building owned by one of their relatives, 70 people in all, who were directed into the building by the IDF, which was then subsequently attacked, killing 25 or more relatives, most of them children, and leaving many more wounded. One shell after another after another hit the building, the doors and the roof. Fathers and mothers gazing helplessly on at the sight of their children, brains lying splattered on the floor.

The Samouni family are not Hamas. They are farmers. They have taken no part in the resistance, and, indeed, are critical of Hamas. But the collective punishment of the Palestinian people includes the Samouni family too it seems. No Palestinian is innocent.

So, now, ask yourself does this make Israel more secure or less?

And if in five months or a year or five year’s time one member of the Samouni family, driven mad with grief, straps an explosive corset around their waist and walks into an Israeli mall and blows themselves up along with a number of innocent Israelis, will the news reports ever refer to what happened on the day an entire family were targetted?

Will they say, “It is a member of the Samouni clan, he saw his daughter’s brains being splattered onto the concrete, that is why he is mad, why his heart is so full of hate.”

Of course not.

It will be made another excuse for the collective punishment of the whole Palestinian nation. And so the violence will continue.

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Comments 111 comments

Cris A profile image

Cris A 7 years ago from Manila, Philippines

This is some powerful stuff. Your insights into the supposed war are wrought with emotions that go beyond just informing or relaying news. Thank you for sharing your views on the matter. This is truly an eye-opener and now I am more enlightened.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Thank you Cris for your kind words. I only wish that our good intentions would make some difference and help stop the suffering of the Palestinian people.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

CJS- So far I thought it was due to the Hamas instigation that Israel retaliated. But this statement of yours is pretty disturbing: "The ceasefire was broken on the 4th November 2008, not by Hamas, but by the Israeli Defence Force in an attack against a house in Gaza"


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

CJ, You will find many people who will disagree with you very forcibly, but not me. I have had a smilar debate on another forum and been getting the most amazing flak for expressing views that are very similar to your own.

You mention the BBC's coverage of what is happening in Gaza. We are seeing pictures of bodies lying in the streets and hospitals full of badly wounded children. We are hearing eye-witness reports from a reporter inside Gaza and from people such as hospital doctors. From what I gather from American correspondents, they are getting none of this, only the biased reporting of the Israeli media. It is therefore not surprising that their reaction is very different.

There will never be a solution to the Palestinian question until the people are able to lead secure, meaningful lives, and that means not being oooped up in the desperate hell-hole that is Gaza.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

So now you know countrywoman. You have been subject to the best propaganda system in the world, which has so far managed to blame the victims for their own suffering, and, by the most astonishing twist of logic, has turned the murder of children into an act of defence.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Indexer, there are a number of links above, including one to Al Jazeera, which might help to inform our American friends of how much they have been misled.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

Well the moment you said BBC reported I started taking notice of this article. As I have a very high regard for their journalistic integrity. I guess I missed the BBC coverage in November. And only for the past two weeks I have been following this. Even yesterday in a forum thread Mike educated me(http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/10470?page=3) and today I read this article. I guess now I am getting a different picture of this whole tragedy.  But never the less I hope we do have a solution and it is time some other country besides US stepped in the ring to resolve this age old dispute.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Countrywoman, it is US backing for Israel which allows it to continue its atrocities. If you US said "no" Israel would have to stop. Where do you think they get their arms from? The violence would cease within days if the US stopped arming the Israelis. Let's hope Obama takes a different view, though somehow I doubt it.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

Of course, we Brits got it completely wrong in Northern Ireland. Instead of listening to both sides and getting them to see that there was a better way forward than violence and terrorism, we should have targeted the homes of known IRA members in West Belfast and dropped high explosive and phosphorous bombs on them. Those Israelis could clearly have taught us a thing or two!


tonymac04 profile image

tonymac04 7 years ago from South Africa

Thank you CJ for your insightful Hub. The propaganda from both sides is of course misleading, but the truth will out, and that is that Israel is the aggressor in this horrible massacre. You are so right to say it is not a war but a massacre, and a massacre of mostly women and children. It is a saddening thing that, like a woman seeking abusive relationships over and over, the Israelis do to the Palestinians precisely what was done to them in so many pogroms over the centuries, culminating in the unspeakable horror of the holocaust. So now they perpetrate a holocaust in the name of preventing it happening to Jews again.

The fact is that with this latest atrocity I think they have sealed the fate of Israel. I used to be an ardent supporter of Israel, but I think they have nowforfeited their right to support. This action is totally insupportable.

Love and peace,

Tony


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

CJS- I guess you understood that I meant that only US is active or interested in resolving this issue(which isn't my opinion). But my motive was that US is closely aligned with Israel and the Palestine (or most of the other countries) feel they may not be neutral like France/Germany/Russia/China/Japan/India/Brazil so many other countries need to take active part in the world stage. UK (to a certain extent even Australia) unfortunately is not seen by many to have independent stance from US most of the times (especially ever since the Iraq invasion). As there is an old Judicial Maxim which states that "Justice is not only done but should also seem to be done."


Mark Knowles profile image

Mark Knowles 7 years ago

Good hub. I must admit I have now got the the point where I automatically do not believe anything I am told by my government or the "main stream" media about anything.

The BBC coverage of this has been atrocious, and the suggestion that this is completely insigated by Hamas is just testament to the power of the machine we find running the entire world. :(


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

CJ, You can't blame the US alone for the arming of Israel. Our own Foreign Office has been increasing its arms sales to Israel, including sales of components for combat aircraft and aero engines, and helmet-mounted display equipment for pilots. UK arms sales to Israel in 2007 totalled £7.5m - in the first three months of 2008, nearly £19m. (Source - Private Eye 9-22 Jan 2009)


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Indexer, can you tell me which British companies are involved with the sale of arms to Israel?

I agree Mark, very little of the truth gets told in the media these days.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Indexer, can you tell me which British companies are involved with the sale of arms to Israel?

I agree Mark, very little of the truth gets told in the media these days.


rockinjoe profile image

rockinjoe 7 years ago from Standing right behind you!

I don't think I've ever enjoyed reading something as much as I've enjoyed this and disagreed with nearly everything you've said.

Nice writing.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Tonymac, I agree with you entirely: "they have now forfeited their right to support. This action is totally insupportable." As Fintan O'Toole of The Irish Times asks "When does the mandate of victimhood expire? At what point does the Nazi genocide of Europe's Jews cease to excuse the state of Israel from the demands of international law and of common humanity?"

Countrywoman, it is still the truth that if the US told Israel to desist, they would.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Oh well rockinjoe, at least I tried!


pgrundy 7 years ago

I agree with you but I don't know what to do about it. I heard on the news today that now Israel is using phosphorus bombs, which are unspeakably horrible and by general world consensus should not be used anywhere. I'm not sure why all this overkill--how much more horrible can they make this?

I also don't understand why it has to be THAT patch of land. This 'holy land' business is pure crap. I have to say I no longer respect a drop of that nonsense, and the Palestinians were there first after all--there is that.

Israel can have Detroit. Or Texas. Trust me, we are not doing anything worthwhile with either of those places, and I think there's more land in both of them than there is in Israel. I'm glad I'm getting old and I'm almost done--this world is too ugly and it just seems to get worse by the day.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

CJ, Not offhand, I can't - I'm just quoting from the latest edition of Private Eye, which doesn't mention any companies by name. It would be surprising if BAE Systems was not on the list, but I have no evidence one way or the other. As aero engine parts were mentioned, Rolls-Royce would be another good guess.


Storytellersrus profile image

Storytellersrus 7 years ago from Stepping past clutter

I hoped you were incorrect about the US supplying Israel with the majority of their bombs, but I found a site that supports your statement and in fact indicates that Bush has given Israel a parting gift:

http://legalinsurrection.blogspot.com/2009/01/us-i...

"The US Navy's Military Sealift Command is hiring a merchant ship to carry the arms on two separate journeys from the Greek port of Astakos to Israel in mid-to-late January, according to Reuters. A 'hazardous material" designation on the manifest mentions explosive substances and detonators, but no other details. One broker said that the size of a shipment of this kind has not been seen for years. DEBKAfile's military sources note that the Israel's air, ground, tank and sea offensive against Hamas in Gaza entered its 15th day Saturday, Jan. 10."

I have been horrified at the loss of children.  I had naively hoped that there could someday be an end to war but when a cousin watches his favorite uncle or playmate needlessly blown up and hears the stories his/her whole life about the goodness of this loved one, well, the anger and hate continues.  That's it.  The cycle never ends.  It sickens me.

Yesterday in Denver where I live, there were two rallys on either side of the street infront of our capital building.  One side was pro-Israeli and the other side was pro-Palestinian.  There was no violence, just signs and chants.  These are mostly relatives and friends of relatives in the region expressing their points of view. The US is an expansive land mass pulsing with opposing opinions.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

pgrundy, it may surprise you to learn that when the Zionist movement first started, in the late 19th century, serious thought was given to establishing the "national home of the Jews" in a mountainous region of what is now Uganda. However, it has always been the Jewish dream to return to their ancestral land of Palestine, and especially to the holy city of Jerusalem. They say that they have prior claim on the land, because they were there until the Romans kicked them out 2,000 years ago. The same logic, presumably, should ensure that all the American immigrants over the last 500 years should go to live in squalid refugee camps because the Cherokees, Blackfeet, and all the rest were there before them. Strangely enough, I don't see that happening, do you?

The Balfour Declaration of 1917 made it clear that the British Government favoured the Jewish state being established in Palestine, but what is often forgotten is that this intention was conditional, the rest of the original text being "it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country".

Those rights were clearly not respected, and the whole tragedy of the current situation boils down to that.


needful things profile image

needful things 7 years ago from Poland

Certainly sheds more light to the issue. True but not entirely. Thumbs Up!!!


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

Chris - I worked 20 years with the BBC and used to be the staunchest supporter of their journalistic integrity. But I agree with you that they have let themselves down attrociously over their coverage of this 'conflict'. I am now seeing, every day, the footage that even Al Jazeera does not put to air, as it is too horrific to unleash on the public. There are no words to describe the barbarity of Israel's attack on a people whom they have subjugated, imprisoned, starved and deprived of medicines and fuel, for more than 18 months. The blockade has killed far, far more people that the 18 or so killed by home-made rockets from Gaza.

Let's remember - Gaza (now) measures only 38 by 8 miles and is home to 1.5 million people. It is one of the most densely populated places on Earth. Israel is armed to the teeth with conventional, chemical and nuclear warheads. As you say, this is not a war or even a battle. It is butchery.

BTW, we have been discussing this on the Politics forum for a long time. Why not join in?


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Hi Pam, there's a couple of useful links above (helpfully entitled "Useful links") which might help. Me: I intend not only to boycott Israeli goods, but to set up pickets outside every shop where they sell Israeli goods. That should make them listen.

Storytellersrus thanks for the information.

needful things: I'd like to hear where you think I might be wrong.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Hi Paraglider, so that's where all the information about the situation in Gaza is being aired, in the politics forum. I kept looking expecting to see a hub about it, and when no one else wrote anything decided it was up to me. But I will certainly pop over and have a look.


Amanda Severn profile image

Amanda Severn 7 years ago from UK

Hi Chris,

This is powerful stuff. Oh to be able to wave a hand and have this murder and mayhem just vanish. I become increasingly more pacifist with every passing year, and I can see no purpose to this violence whatsoever. All this for a patch of turf under a starry sky.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

CJS- I did post the forum link earlier for you to go through. Yes you are right US can pull the plug but if it doesn't then what else can be done is the question we have to deal with now. That's why my earlier comment was addressed to look at the alternative and not depend on one country(US) to bring peace in the middle east.


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

CW - US can't pull the plug on this massacre. Israel has enough firepower stockpiled to continue for a very long time without US support. And, sadly, the US are so misinformed (by their media) about this disaster that there is no substantial public or political pressure on the Executive to change their position.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

Paraglider- When I meant plug I meant not just material support but also moral/diplomatic support. If the US takes a strong stand(Stop the violence against Gaza) then it would certainly mean something to Israel. But meanwhile what about rest of the world. Why nobody else has enough stake in the Peace process or do the rest feel that unless US gives them the mandate they shouldn't get involved. I am not aware of the international politics but again UN also has a peace keeping force why that doesn't go into this scenario. Why the world only talks and doesn't do anything in areas like Gaza or Darfur where so many people are getting killed.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

I don't understand why some people are saying that the BBC's coverage of the conflict is "atrocious". I would have thought the most appropriate word to use would be "brilliant" or "superb".  The British are getting a far more balanced view of the conflict than are the American public, including footage of the devastation being caused in Gaza.

Well done, the BBC - please keep up the good work.


goldentoad profile image

goldentoad 7 years ago from Free and running....

This is all a very sad scar in human history.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

Indexer- Maybe the last bastion of hope(BBC) for Journalistic Integrity when they also don't show who initiated this conflict then we have no hope left. Till I read this hub I was under the impression Hamas started the instigation which the BBC hasn't clarified or rather has suggested that Israel retaliated. I don't know about others but I have always believed in BBC but even I feel a little let down on two counts: 1) Who started it (was it Hamas or Israel. 2) Clarify once and for all whether White phosporus is being used Israel.

On both these fronts I watch the BBC America it has not informed me and rather have been informed through hub pages. Thanks to CJS and Mike( http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/10470?page=3)

In fact they are carrying information from official Israeli spokesperson on their website: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7823078.stm


crazyhorsesghost profile image

crazyhorsesghost 7 years ago from East Coast , United States

"There is no such thing as a Palestinian Arab nation . . . Palestine is a name the Romans gave to Eretz Yisrael with the express purpose of infuriating the Jews . . . . Why should we use the spiteful name meant to humiliate us?

The British chose to call the land they mandated Palestine, and the Arabs picked it up as their nation's supposed ancient name, though they couldn't even pronounce it correctly and turned it into Falastin a fictional entity." — Golda Meir quoted by Sarah Honig, Jerusalem Post, 25 November 1995

 

Palestine has never existed . . . as an autonomous entity. There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc.

Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of one percent of the landmass. But that's too much for the Arabs. They want it all. And that is ultimately what the fighting in Israel is about today . . . No matter how many land concessions the Israelis make, it will never be enough. — from "Myths of the Middle East", Joseph Farah, Arab-American editor and journalist, WorldNetDaily, 11 October 2000

 

From the end of the Jewish state in antiquity to the beginning of British rule, the area now designated by the name Palestine was not a country and had no frontiers, only administrative boundaries . . . . — Professor Bernard Lewis, Commentary Magazine, January 1975Israel has every right to defend its self.

If Mexico started launching rockets into California do you not think the USA would attack Mexico. I have been there to Israel and other countries in the region and the Arabs hate Israel and everything it stands for. Israel has a right to exist.


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

The Indexer - it is true that the BBC is showing more of what is happening in Gaza that, for example CNN or Fox. But it is also, in commentary and interviews, trying to 'balance' the unbalanceable. They will interview one Hamas spokesman and one Israeli spokesman, giving the impression that there is some sort of equality in the situation. There is not. The fact is that one of the world's strongest militaries is systematically killing one of the world's weakest countries. There is a time to speak out, as, for example, the BBC has spoken out against Mugabe's regime. The coyness in criticising Israel's actions is disappointing, to say the least.

And CHG - none of that is relevant. The situation on the ground is as Chris has described. A massacre is taking place. Golda Meir's bellyachings don't change that. Israel is engaged in an atrocity.


crazyhorsesghost profile image

crazyhorsesghost 7 years ago from East Coast , United States

Paraglider do you not think it is a atrocity for children to lay in their beds at night and not know if a rocket is going to land on their house. Or for a suicide bomber to walk onto a bus and blow his or her self up. I saw a suicide bombing on a bus when I was there.

There is no perfect answer. Israel is a very small part of the region I think around 10 percent and the Arabs intend to destroy Israel. That is exactly what they are up to. Hamas is a terrorist organazation that historicaly refused to regonize that Israel does exist. They use women and children as human shields and then scream to the world when they get these people killed. It is what they have always done.


SiddSingh profile image

SiddSingh 7 years ago

I guess I couldn't put my reaction in any better words than rockinjoe. I read your hub with interest, and disagreed with most of it.

Fact of the matter is, Hamas is a terrorist organization, with an avowed purpose of "Annihilation of Israel". That it has the popular vote in Palestine, and is actually seated in the government there, is very unfortunate. I can understand the predicament of a government which is forced to negotiate with terrorists, because they are the ones in power, or at least control the strings of the government.

Yes, agreed that those rockets are harmless. But it is not because Hamas is holding itself back, or is restrained. It is using everything it has access to. It is using those rockets because it has little else to use. What if it had access to better missiles, of the guided variety?


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

crazyhorsesghost, you are either sadly misinformed or a racist. You've also clearly not read the hub you are commenting on. Why not have a read. Plus there are some interesting links up there which might help you to reconsider your views.  As for this line: "do you not think it is an atrocity for children to lay in their beds at night and not know if a rocket is going to land on their house" - who is more likely to have a rocket land on their house now, a Palestinian child or an Israeli?

SiddSingh, the Israelis are not killing Hamas, they are killing women and children. Since when did the murder of women and children secure the safety of Israeli citizens. You wonder why Hamas are fanatical? Take a look at what Israel is doing.


crazyhorsesghost profile image

crazyhorsesghost 7 years ago from East Coast , United States

Sorry but I am not a racist I am a American Indian. I did read the Hub. And Hamas is the reason for the attacks. They and other Arab terrorist organizations have traditionaly used women and children for human shields and then scream look look when they get them killed. It is really sad for any women or children to be killed but Israel has a right to defend themselves. Your missing the point that the goal of Hamas is to wipe Israel off the map. To drive them into the sea. And it has always been the goal of Hamas. Hamas is supported by Iran.

So you see I do know the whole story. Israel built the security fence to stop the suicide bombers. So then Hamas starts shooting rockets. If they were throwing stones Israel would still have a right to defend its self.


LondonGirl profile image

LondonGirl 7 years ago from London

"Countrywoman, it is still the truth that if the US told Israel to desist, they would."

I don't think that they would, from the Israelis I know. But I could be wrong.

I think the whole situation is a tragedy. Interesting hub, and thank you for writing it.


countrywomen profile image

countrywomen 7 years ago from Washington, USA

LondonGirl- Thanks for replying to my comment. I sincerely ask this question to everyone if there is a Plan B if the Plan A fails (US is unable stop or doesn't want to stop this tragedy)then what. I have mentioned in couple of comments my questions but they are getting buried in other comments. We have all done to a certain extent Problem Identification now let us see if we have any Alternate solutions(both short/long term).


SiddSingh profile image

SiddSingh 7 years ago

CJS, I cannot but agree that killing of the innocent civilians is the most reprehensible aspect of this tragedy.

But I disagree that the reason for Hamas's fanatacism is Israeli "atrocities" on Palestinian people. One can only wish it was that innocent and pure of purpose. Its charter is full of anti-semitic and hateful gibberish. Hamas leaders have repeatedly used phrases like 'bloodbath on the streets' and 'chopping of heads' Its very basis since it was found in 1987 is the complete destruction of Israel. 


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

crazyhorsesghost, then you know the history of genocide and the theft of land.

Yes, it's a tragedy LondonGirl, even more of a tragedy when you hear people attempting to justify it.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

I think we have proved between us that this is a very complex situation with rights and wrongs on all sides.

One of the "intractables" in this debate is the avowed intention of Hamas to destroy Israel. This is seen by many as a "bedrock" argument - they are evil and must be defeated because they have this aim.

However, if you understand the historical background to all this you will, I hope, start to understand where this attitude comes from and start to see things from their perspective. I do not expect people to agree with their aim, only to understand why they have it.

I agree, there never was a country called "Palestine". However, the original 1947 plan was for the land that was then designated as Palestine to be divided between the two communities. Neither side was happy with that solution, and in the war that followed the Israelis were able to occupy all the land, as they had always intended to do. The people we now refer to as Palestinians are the descendants of the 700,000 Arabs who were living in that area before the state of Israel was created.

I cannot understand why the rights of the Israeils must always be seen (by America in particular) as having priority over those of the Arabs. How would you feel if a load of foreigners turned up and demanded your farm and your home? The fact that the Arabs had no established nation state is neither here nor there - they had a life that was taken away from them - that is why they are so angry, even today (that, and the appalling treatment they have suffered ever since).


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

Indexer - that is quite correct. What is also true is that in any 'dispute' there can be no solution without mediated bilateral talks about Now. There is no chance of settling anything by appealing to the past and to old scores, far less to biblical prophesy (as some seem to want to do). Unfortunately, there seems very little will from Israel or Hamas to have such talks. And the US is singularly unhelpful in siding completely with Israel.


Amanda Severn profile image

Amanda Severn 7 years ago from UK

There will certainly be no progress until the two parties start to talk. Violence begets more violence, tit for tat, ad nauseum. What if Hamas were to surrender? Would the Israelis stop the bombardment, or would they find a new excuse to continue?


kasparu profile image

kasparu 7 years ago

Nice Hub, and totally agree, Israel should be burned down, I mean this, hate spawn hate and so on blah blah blah. I'm not against jews, I'm against the state of Israel, there have been nothing but trouble since they stole land a 3000 year old fairy tale told were theirs. The whole world is against Israel, their imprison of a people, blockades, harassments and no future, if I lived in Gaza you bet I would be firering rockets too. But have read some aticles on the subject, and it seems it's the old zealots in the government making all the trouble, and a big youth movement is underway in Israel, let's just hope it will be for the bets, how hard can it be to share that god forgotten desert with the rest of the people there.

It's sad to see a people that went throught the holocaust doing the same things the nazi did to them, to another people, they of all should know something about giving space to minorities.


Make  Money profile image

Make Money 7 years ago from Ontario

I congratulate you CJStone for writing this informative Hub.  You are telling a story that the world needs to hear.  It is shameful that the US government supports these zionist war crimes with billions of American tax payer's dollars.  Out of all the countries in the world the American population should be more irate with these war crimes than any nation on earth.  But they are not because the truth is being kept from them.

We have had a discussion for the last 3 months on the ongoing Palestinian/Israeli conflict at this Hub forum thread http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/8290 and now another one that just started 5 days ago here http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/10470

This Hub forum thread refutes the zionist's Biblical claim to the land completely http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/8543?page=2

Keep up the good work my friend

Mike


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 7 years ago from New York

The point is not who started it or who retaliated...the point is who's going to end it and when. This is not happening with Hamas or Israelis alone; such callousness is being witnessed all over the world. We all seem to be sitting on a heap of gunpowder which can explode anytime. Speaking of wars / terrorism, I've always seen innocents getting killed in the process. Afghanistan, Darfur, Pakistan, India and many other places have seen bloodshed of innocents who had nothing to do with it. Leaving aside the instigators of war or terrorism for a while, I have horrifying instances to quote where the army and the security forces (who were deployed to save the people and get them evacuated) indulged in stripping the women naked and raping them in front of their children and other onlookers. Bottom line...I don't see this coming to an end until there is even a single 'power hungry' official left to survive on this planet.


justmesuzanne profile image

justmesuzanne 7 years ago from Texas

Thank you for providing some insight on this subject. Journalism has become a joke in the last decade. Thanks for sticking with the old standards of honest delivery of the facts that allows the reader to make informed choices.


marisuewrites profile image

marisuewrites 7 years ago from USA

I could not condone slaughter, no matter the reason or religion. This is sickening, and you are right to bring it to the surface, why must the US always assume Israel is right? I do not claim to know much about the middle east, and found the comments here educational and enlightening.

Common sense does not prevail in this religious masacre, how will it end?

It makes me feel guilty for enjoying the day. I want to do something, but what? What even should Obama do? Where does one nation begin?

thanks, cj, this is indeed a horror of untold description.


Make  Money profile image

Make Money 7 years ago from Ontario

I would just like to add a quote from the late Israeli General Moshe Dayan:

“The declaration of the State of Israel in 1948 was at the expense of ethnically cleansing 513 Palestinian villages, creating over 700,000 Palestinian refugees and expropriating their lands, homes and businesses in 78% of Palestine … There is not one single place built in this country that did not have a former (Palestinian) population.”

These zionist war crimes are not just committed against Muslims but Christians also as we can see from this list http://www.jerusalemites.org/crimes/crimes_against...


crazyhorsesghost profile image

crazyhorsesghost 7 years ago from East Coast , United States

And yes CJ did a very good job with this hub. Full of great information. It is just I have a real problem with Hamas or any terrorist organization. I see Custers last stand from a different point of view than other people.

I also saw the bus that was bombed by a suicide bomber when I was in Israel. I saw the  men , women , and children blown apart. And there were many suicide bombers during that time frame. People do not realize how low Hamas and other Arab terrorist organizations will stoop to get their way. They use women and children as human shields. That's a fact. They always have and will continue to do so. They hate both people from the USA and Israel. Think about all the crimes against humanity that Hamas and others like them have committed. The Twin Towers should jump to mind. I remember those planes flying into the twin towers that morning. I will never forget.

Hamas preaches and engages in violence and terror in order to destroy the state of Israel and replace it with an Islamic state. Its virulent hatred of Jews and Judaism is deeply rooted in the anti-Semitic writings of Muslim Brotherhood theologians.

Hamas issued its covenant laying down its ideological principles and goals. Replete with anti-Semitism, it echoes the notorious Protocols of the Elders of Zion and charges Jews with an international conspiracy to gain control of the world. In Hamas' worldview, Islamic precepts forbid a Jewish state in the area known as Palestine, the Jewish people have no legitimate connection to the land of Israel and Yasir Arafat is a traitor to the Islamic Palestinian cause. As its covenant proclaims, "The land of Palestine is an Islamic trust... It is forbidden to anyone to yield or concede any part of it... Israel will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it..."

 


marisuewrites profile image

marisuewrites 7 years ago from USA

In the US we have always sided with Israel, who I was taught to believe wanted peace. I agree it is a complicated position, and I would try very hard to be informed enough not to fall for terrorists point of view as they bury themselves within the innocent.

still death is death, on either side, and innocent families and people pay the ultimate price. I don't know the answer, it's buried in history, I fear.


JamaGenee profile image

JamaGenee 7 years ago from Central Oklahoma

All the pros and cons in the previous comments are a perfect example of how this nightmare came about.  Hamas vowed to destroy Israel, Israel said "Think again". Neither side is willing to acknowledge the right of the other to exist.  No, innocent women and children shouldn't die or be maimed for life because the "leaders" on both sides have too much testosterone and too-easily-dented egos. But this has been the case in war since time immemorial.  Sadly, the nightmare won't end until one side eradicates the other. 

But thank you, Chris, for such an in-depth hub from both sides.  We certainly don't get such unbiased reports from U.S. "journalists".


Smarticus profile image

Smarticus 7 years ago from North Carolina

CJ,

I am a fan and always enjoy your writing. As a historian and anthropologist, with a strong background in Middle Eastern history. I have to say I am with Crazyhorseghost on this one and could not disagree with some of your conclusions more stringently.

While I think anyone would agree that the deaths of civilains and innocents is a terrible thing, I do not believe that you can legitimately make any sort of claim that Hamas is the victim at any level.

Hamas (the Islamic Resistance Movement) is a terrorist organization with the avowed purpose as part of their charter and constitution, to remove the State of Israel from the land. They say Israel has no place. Khaled Mashal, the head of Hamas has stated that he wants to see a map hanging in his home that does not show Israel because it no longer exists.

According to Mashal, he is interested in a 10 year truce, or hudna, with Israel because he believes in that 10 years Hamas can grow strong enough to destroy Israel completely.

In nearly November when Israel 'violated the ceasefire' it was to aprehend criminals, Hamas 'officials and party leaders' who were responsible for planning numerous attacks against Israelis, and were in the act of planning additional attacks when they were apprehended.

You say that Hamas is the only 'democratically elected' government in the region. Hamas is about as democratically elected as Egypt's president. In Egypt you can technically elect the president, it is just that it is illegal to vote for anyone but Hosni Mubarek. Many foreign observers were quick to report that the election of Hamas was accomplished under intimidation and threats of violence by the members of Hamas toward other Palestinians.

On several occasions Hamas has cried foul when Israel took preemptive action to stop Hamas from violating ceasefire agreements. In 2005 Hamas decried Israel's military movements toward them- after Israel intercepted massive weapons stores being smuggled into Gaza. I wonder what those weapons were for?

Israel did bomb in civilian areas, but you left out the fact that they made thousands of calls to Palestinian phones in the areas hit, hours before the strikes, urging Palestinians to leave houses that might be used to stockpile weapons and explaining what was about to happen.

You said that Israel blamed Hamas for attacks by other Palestinians groups, and Hamas tried to control the actions of Islamic Jihad and the like. However, Khaled Mashal stated in 2006 that even if Israel agreed to the 10 year truce Hamas would not interfere with, or ever try and curtail the activities of other Palestianian "resistance groups".

You point out that Hamas is not well armed and their attacks on Israel are lesser than Israel's attacks on them. You gave a description of a woman crying over the death of her child, as opposed to an Israeli woman upset because a Hamas rocket had disturbed her sleep. Yet, you should never forget that Hamas was not trying to disturb her sleep. Their sole intent was to kill her. Period. Not upset her, not make a political statement or change her politics. They wanted her dead simply because she is Israeli, and their avowed reason for existence is that Israel must be destroyed and replaced by an Islamic state. Nothing else will satisfy them.

Israel has shown restraint in the past. They have the technology to try and defeat terrorists and minimize civilian loss of life. Hamas has no compunctions about murdering civilians as they have shown through their actions, and using their own people as human shields so that when they die, as Hamas intended them to, they can point at Israelis and cry out that they are monsters.

You point out that Israel refuses to recognize the Palestinian government, but fail to point out that none of their Arab brothers and neighbors do either.

It appears to me you are villifying the victims.


LondonGirl profile image

LondonGirl 7 years ago from London

"It's sad to see a people that went throught the holocaust doing the same things the nazi did to them, to another people, they of all should know something about giving space to minorities."

I think Jews (and Israelis, not the same at all) learned a different lesson. Not, "be nice to minorities" but "get them, before they get you".


SweetiePie profile image

SweetiePie 7 years ago from Southern California, USA

I feel sad to say this, but the feeling is many Americans see Arabs as the warmongers and Israel as the peace maker. Many keep saying Arabs hate Israel, but you know I have heard many Jews say similar things about Arabs. Many Israeli policies are not exactly about promoting peace, but neither is Hamas. There are warmongers on both sides, which makes it hard for those who want to sit down and have true peace talks. I agree with those who have objectively pointed out the US needs to take more a neutral role in helping Israel make peace with its neighbors. In the end that is up to Israel and Hamas, but I think during the days of Yitzhak Rabin Israel was on a better road to making peace. Hopefully Israel can have a more objective leader such as Rabin in the near future, and Hamas will also relent too. It is sad people are being hurt on both sides, and all I can say is I would never want to visit Israel or Gaza after all of this.


The Indexer profile image

The Indexer 7 years ago from UK

Although I am largely in agreement with CJ, the points made by Smarticus are important and well made. At least he has not resorted to the ignorant ranting that has characterised the debate in other places - not here, I'm glad to say, because HubPages regulars seem to be able to keep things at a civilized level!

In any dispute between ideologies, there will be people who fight their cause with different levels of intensity. Within the worlds of both Judaism and Islam there are spectra that run from mild protest through to violent hatred. It is unfortunate that the loudest voices will always tend to drown out the quieter, more reasoned ones, and the outside world gets the impression that the extremists represent all those who agree with their basic position, which is not true.

Another factor is that the deeds of those at the extreme tarnish their cause in the eyes of neutrals. I have long held the view that the 9/11 incidents were a huge mistake on the part of the Islamists because the consequence was so horrific that the only result was going to be a united front of opposition to whatever cause they were promulgating. Even in the unsavoury business of threat and blackmail, you only do your worst as a last resort, not the first. I am particularly horrifed by the incidents of suicide bombers being recruited from the ranks of children and the mentally ill. When you strap explosives to the body of a 16-year-old Downs girl, send her into a crowded marketplace and detonate the bomb by remote control, I do not care what your motive is - you have damaged your cause in my eyes, however just it may have been in the first place.

That said, I still believe that it is the injustices committed by the people of Israel that have led to so much hatred being directed at them, and also at the United States who are far too uncritical of Israeli actions. Had the original Jewish immigrants been willing to live alongside their Arab neigbours, and not seek to dominate them, much of the anger would would been avoided. But no, they insisted on their rights overriding those of everyone else, and, post-Holocaust, the World largely took their side. The alienation grew, and the extremists were boosted as a result.

I can only see one ultimate solution, and that is for the experiment of the "National Home for the Jews in Palestine" to be declared a failure and for the Jewish communities to return from whence they came. Of course, that is never going to happen, and that is why there will always be tension and warfare in the region. The lesson of history is that repression always comes back to haunt you. Behave badly to one generation and the next will rise up to oppose you. Destroy Hamas and "son of Hamas" will come along soon enough.

In the meantime, the short-term solution lies in Israeli hands. Behave in a more decent fashion towards your neighbours and you will gradually defuse the situation. Of course there will be violent incidents caused by the hotheads, but don't over-react when these occur. Stop playing the martyr and start accepting that other people have rights as well. Extremists like nothing better than strong opposition - it justifies them in their extremism. Every bomb dropping on Gaza is a recruiting sergeant for Hamas, so stop taking actions that are not in your own long-term interest.


NDBEES profile image

NDBEES 7 years ago from DEVON

Propaganda. It will be the death of us all.


I William profile image

I William 7 years ago from United States

Interesting hub. Good to see different perspectives. Perhaps resolution cannot be achieved unless all are willing to see the same issue from the others perspective. Unfortunately though, resolution is not an option if either side desires extinction.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Smarticus: what a strange topsy-turvy world the Israeli propaganda merchants have managed to create. It's an astonishing achievment. Israel kills 900 Palestinians, including nearly 300 children, but Israelis are the victims. Israel breaks the ceasefire, but it was Hamas' fault. I've just been watching Professor Avi Shlaim on the Channel 4 news stating categorically that the ceasefire was working and was broken by Israel. Just stop and listen to yourself for a second. Imagine a legal system run on the basis of Israeli treatment of the Palestinian question. Hamas members are presumed criminals and on that basis Israel can break international law and their own ceasefire agreements to summarily execute the Hamas leadership. Imagine if it was the other way around. Then it would be descibed as an act of terrorism. But, of course, Israel is a terrorist state. It routinely uses terror as it's preferred method of diplomacy. What is it doing now but terrorising the population of Gaza? I urge you to watch the video above, and to ask yourself what it must feel like to be a child growing up in Gaza, and I would suggest, that contrary to your expectations, and to Israel's justifications, Hamas will actually come out of this conflict as a stronger force, even more closely identified with the population than it currently is. Israel is committing war crimes in Gaza. There has to be an independent investigation. Let's see if Israel will be willing to allow this or not.



corneilius profile image

corneilius 7 years ago

Great article Simon! Critical thinking, elegant structure, precise prose. And you reveal the truth of the situation as the Palestinians must sense it.

I'd liketo add this :

Alice Miller wrote a book "The Roots of Violence in Child-rearing Practices : For your own good!

The basic premise is that a child who is harmed by their parents. be it intentional or not, conscious or not, leads to an adult who will do the same to their own child. Miller looked at the way our culture treats children.

She saw clearly the relationship between state violence (Hitler) and dysfunctional families where abuse, isolation and fear cause much harm.

Her work was finally understood when neuroscience was able to start mapping the development of the brain, along with a deeper understanding bio-chemistry and further investigation into how children grow and learn.

The fact that 6 million Jews perished in Hitlers hell comes down to the willing denial of reality by millions of Germans, many who simply put their heds down and ignored the reality, many more who being well conditioned, worked in the system and accepted the dehumanisation process. Buildings were built and tested. Trains loaded and unloaded. Clothes and Shoes confiscated. Houses re-occupied by new German tenants. All of this was recorded by a vast bureaucracy.

And then there was the hard-core. The 'wet' workers. Blood was their currency. And still is. Today we call them 'Mercanaries' or 'Operational Combat Troops', men trained to kill, every time.

And last of all the psycho-paths. Pain was their currency. As it still is. Abu Ghraib, anyone?

All of these people shared a common child-rearing practice, one that Miller traced back to the elites, back to the concepts of empire, of mastery of the other.

And she warned that unless we change our child-rearing practices, that further wars were inevitable, and that the holocaust would be repeated, again and again.

In essence it is this - if and when we manipulate all our children for our own wants and needs, this disrupts their natural growth, undermines their sense of identity, leaving in place a confused, angry and depressive personality, a shadow of the real child. The adult that child grows into will have a propensity towards state sanctioned violence, for it allows him or her to void their unexpressed rage, temporarily, by controlling or harming another.

State sanctioned violence is always preced by a campaign of demonisation, a de-humanising process that renders the intended victim defenceless.

And that campaign is utterly dependent upon the predictability of the people it is aimed at. Who knows better that predictability than those who engineered and actualised the conditioning process - schooling is about making sure the vbast majority of peoples behaviour is predictable because bureaucracies also depend on this, and the state is a bureaucracy.

That is why the conditioning, and that is why propagand works and that is why critical thinking is rare, rather than common, in the mainstream.

Knowing that I oppose the Governments right to violence, I avoid contributing in any way to that system, and I work daily to deepen my understanding of this dynamaic and to prefect my ability to articulate this, so that more and more people realise the con-job thay have been sold. WHat they do with that info will be there choice.

I sense that most will get angry, very angry; angry enough to simply withdraw support for this system, to dis-engage and for some to actively hasten it's demise. Whatever it will be free will, the free will of free children, whose sensory acuity and innate creative intelligence being intact, and noursihed, that will ultimately resolve these issues.


shannogh 7 years ago

If crazthorsesghost is and "american indian" (is that how a native american would describe themselves?) then I'm a hippy!

Keep up ther good work CJ

Nice to see you doing what you do best with reason, facts and passion.


ColdWarBaby 7 years ago

CJ, you're 200% spot on. Facts and reality can not compete with willful ignorance; don’t waste your time.

To countrywomen and any who hope that amerika might make a difference, let’s not forget that Obama has already made it very clear that israel can still do no wrong and will continue to enjoy the unconditional support of the fascist corporatocracy.

It has become clear that the “governments” of the “first” world will do nothing of significance to alter the course we are on. So be it. Gaia, nature, will take the necessary steps to restore balance to the ecosystem, which includes us and everything have done or will do. We have initiated a sequence of events that is totally beyond our control. It has become something we would refer to as a “natural disaster”. All we can do is prepare to the best of our ability and hope to ride it out. Those with enough sense to realize that cooperation among people for the common good is the means to insure survival for humanity may live on to create a real civilization. Or not. Maybe this extinction event is to be the final chapter of the human race.

In either case, there will be no palestinians, israelis, jews, and christians, americans or germans. If any survive they will be only people who must depend upon each other for survival.       


G-Ma Johnson profile image

G-Ma Johnson 7 years ago from NW in the land of the Free

ColdWarBaby...AMEN...YOU SAID IT ALL...Thanks..G-Ma :o) Hugs & Peace


Geeda-11 profile image

Geeda-11 7 years ago

CJ, I wanna thank you for what u doing.

but i want to say that unfortunately the american government and the european uonio are partner of all this, and no one can say a thing even the Civil society organizations


nadim313 profile image

nadim313 7 years ago from Kuala Lumpur

why is the u.s. still giving face to israel? its a clear cut that israel is the criminal in this picture.

and what we can do?????? nothing

i am very unhappy


Smarticus profile image

Smarticus 7 years ago from North Carolina

CJ: I listened to the interview with Schlaim this morning as well. Avi Schlaim disappointed me when he began to spin his own facts during the interview.

Recall that, just prior to the ceasefire, Hamas forces had been firing an average of 179 rockets PER DAY into southern Israel, and the Israelis did not react militarily in hopes that the ceasefire would work. Schlaim implied that it was a conspiracy of Israel's creation that caused the coalition government of the Fatah and Hamas parties to collapse. In reality the alliance was fragile and fractious from the beginning, and infighting only intensefied as Israel, the US, and the EU backed off to see if the coalition government could control the violence themselves. Hamas would not let that happen.

The six Hamas members killed were all known terrorists who had participated in the planning and execution of terrorist operations that have killed or maimed dozens of innocent Israelis, including children.

Schlaim also admitted that Hamas is a terrorist organization and they have not changed their charter. He pointed out that they pragmatically offered a truce for twenty or thirty years. Of course they did! Again, Khaled Mashal publicly stated that he was okay with a truce of 10 or more years, because he was certain that, in that amount of time, Hamas would be able to amass enough military power to eradicate Israel.

Schlaim pointed out that Israel was cruelly choking off supply convoys, but did not mention that a number of those convoys were found to be smuggling illicit weapons to the Hamas forces.

I ask you what country, please choose one, could responsibly allow an openly hostile terrorist organization to amass stockpiles of weapons on their border, and accept a truce in which the stated purpose is to allow your nemesis a chance to equip more completely so as to better kill you in the near future?

Next, I am certain, I will hear that the United States was in the wrong for trying to track down Osama bin Laden.

I am absolutely flabbergasted at the number of people who condemn Israel's actions in protecting their people from a hostile terrorist organization bent on their utter destruction. The purpose and aims of Hamas have, by their own leadership's acclamations, never changed.

I'll tell you what. Let us analyze this with a bit of logic. You want to afix blame. Let us do so. Why is Israel so militant in combating Hamas? Plainly, it is because Hamas has avowed and demonstrated time after time that they are, in fact, a threat.

What would Israel do if Hamas were not attacking them, or admittedly planning to attack them relentessly?

By logical deduction who is causing the attacks on the Palestinian people?

Hamas is. If they would willingly abandon their murderous terrorist activities, and renounce their plans to destroy Israel, then all that is happening in Gaza right not would not be happening.

Place the blame where it rightly lies. Hamas. The terrorists.


barryrutherford profile image

barryrutherford 7 years ago from Queensland Australia

CJ Stone My sentiments are with you entirely. Smarticus, It is interesting how conveniently the word terrorist was quickly adopted by Israel(to describle Palestinians) following 9/11. Right now the young polulation in Gaza are locked in with no escape route are are bombarded by US Made helicopted gunships during the night if that is not "terrorism" I dont know what is...


Chandira 7 years ago

THis is a hard one for me Chris, being married to a Jew who has lots of relatives in Israel. I'm not saying what Israel did is right at all, I think it's horriffic, but we can't hold the entire state of Israel at fault for it. A lot of people do.

Most Israelis I know are also horrified at what their government has done, and are deeply ashamed, and want to stop the fighting. There are also outbreaks of Peace in Israel, which never get reported on. THere are a lot of Jewish people here in the States that are very active in the Peace scene, and that needs to be heard as well.

It is only the minority there, just like it is here, I can't also be held responsible for the war in Iraq, because I now live in America. I want to give a voice to the many, many peaceful Israelis who are deeply concerned, and want to end the idiocy and horror of this war.

And it's hard for a people who have lived with SO much fear, for so many years, to drop that need for defensiveness and suspicion, it takes the working together of a great many people, to get through conflicts like this.

Perhaps you could put your great skills as a writer and researcher to use in writing something about the Israeli peace movement? The places where all the Israelis and Palestinians come together to mend wounds, rather than create them? I'd love to read that. :-)


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Hi Chandira, yes, I will do that. It's a good idea. I know a lot of Israelis are horrified at the current situation, and many Jews throughout the world. There are one or two links in the hub to Jewish groups opposed to the massacre, including one called True Torah Jews Against Zionism, which makes it clear that it is the religious duty for Jews in any country to live in peace with their neighbours, as Jews did in Palestine and throughout the Middle East for many centuries before the creation of the state of Israel. Here is a link to one of the Israeli peace groups: http://december18th.org/


LondonGirl profile image

LondonGirl 7 years ago from London

Israel is, at least, a free country - citizens can hold and propound different views. That's a real plus, as is the free press.


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

Smarticus - {{Next, I am certain, I will hear that the United States was in the wrong for trying to track down Osama bin Laden.}}

You have some evidence that the US has made a serious attempt to find this guy?


Chandira 7 years ago

Thanks Chris! That's so much appreciated! :-) We need a little 'positive spin' in the media, who always want to report the worst, but never the best, about humanity, and I think that's part of the problem, personally.We can only ever really go by what we read, or, at least, too many people do, and never question things.

Which is why, as you know, I love your writing! Provoking thought is a hard thing to do in some quarters.. ;-)


dave one 7 years ago

excellent article Chris.

It's strange how those going on about Hamas being a terrorist organisation forget that years back when it was relatively insignificant Israel actually supported Hamas as a religious counterweight to the secular Al Fatah on the divide-and-rule principle. Now they have destroyed Fatah, more or less, or the leadership of Fatah has destroyed itself by corruption and collaboration with the CIA and Mossad, and Hamas is the only game in town. Where would you go if you were a Palestinian in Gaza?


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

True Dave, both literally and metaphorically. Where can any person in Gaza go? It's the largest open-air prison on the planet.


elqalatawy profile image

elqalatawy 7 years ago from Egypt

Hi Chris,

I was surprised by the high standards of information and thoughts in your hub, so I thought to add some more information to expand its perspectives.

It is the deterrence strategy that the Israelis adopt in the area of the middle east, so that they terrify all its inhabitants to be careful when just mentioning the word "Israel". Examples of dterrence acts:

- Dare Yaseen massacre in 1948: All the inhabitants of a small village were slaughtered except a few of them, who were released to tell the other villages what they already had witnessed.

- Bahr El-Baqar school massacre in 1970: An israeli raid on an Egyptian primary school, killed 46 children and over 50 left maimed for life. The school itself was completely demolished.

- Qana massacre 1996 : An Israeli artillary hit the area of UN compound near Qana, where 800 Libanese civilians had taken refuge in the compound to escape fighting. 106 Libanese were killed (more than half were children)

- Beirut 2006: The same thing as happening now in Gaza.

The question now, did they succeed? From ignorant farmers and bedwins to trained fighters in Egypt and Syria, to Fatah, to Hezbollah, to Hamas... to?

Is their mission, teaching the Arabs how to fight the most sophisticated way?   


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

An interesting thesis elqalatawy. I agree. I think they want the world to see how far they will go, to make sure we don't mess with them. This a a psychopathic nation on a rampage.


Sufidreamer profile image

Sufidreamer 7 years ago from Sparti, Greece

I remember a theory in New Scientist magazine, a few years ago, that much of the conflict is about water.

Living in a part of the world where vendettas over water rights have been known to last for hundreds of years, I could believe that this contributes to the land-grabbing.


Chandira 7 years ago

You might find this interesting! :-)

http://www.globalonenessproject.org/videos/rabbifr...


ColdWarBaby 7 years ago

@ corneilius - thanks for the info re Alice Miller! That's excellent stuff. I'm looking for that book online. I'll probably be able to find it in PDF as a torrent.


Smarticus profile image

Smarticus 7 years ago from North Carolina

I do want to make it perfectly clear that I am neither anti-Muslim, nor anti-Palestinian. I do agree that it is a tragedy what the Palestinian people have had to endure. My primary point of contention with CJ’s conclusions lies in the culprit culpable for this suffering, and who should be blamed and prosecuted for it.

Israel is a sovereign nation trying to protect itself now, and for the future. Hamas is a terrorist organization with the sole avowed purpose of the utter destruction of Israel. I believe that, without question, the blame for the plight of the Palestinian people must be placed squarely where it belongs- on the heads of the leaders of Hamas.

barryrutherford

CJ Stone My sentiments are with you entirely. Smarticus, It is interesting how conveniently the word terrorist was quickly adopted by Israel(to describle Palestinians) following 9/11. Right now the young polulation in Gaza are locked in with no escape route are are bombarded by US Made helicopted gunships during the night if that is not "terrorism" I dont know what is...

Barry, Hamas’ identification as terrorist is neither convenient, nor quick. Hamas has been identified as a terrorist organization by every major Western government, and police agency since its inception in 1987. Please recall that by anyone’s definition of terrorism Hamas is a terrorist organization.

Paraglider says:

Smarticus - {{Next, I am certain, I will hear that the United States was in the wrong for trying to track down Osama bin Laden.}}

You have some evidence that the US has made a serious attempt to find this guy?

20+ thousand US Special Forces and Marine operators in Afghanistan for eight years. A couple of those guys, Army Rangers, I have spoken to about what they were doing there. The efforts in that country have been heavily covered and reported in most major media outlets, including Newsweek, CNN, NBC News, ABC News, CBS News, BBC News, and more. Many programs have been produced by the likes of The History Channel, The Military Channel, and others from interviews done the military personnel who have been there.

dave one says:

excellent article Chris.

It's strange how those going on about Hamas being a terrorist organisation forget that years back when it was relatively insignificant Israel actually supported Hamas as a religious counterweight to the secular Al Fatah on the divide-and-rule principle. Now they have destroyed Fatah, more or less, or the leadership of Fatah has destroyed itself by corruption and collaboration with the CIA and Mossad, and Hamas is the only game in town. Where would you go if you were a Palestinian in Gaza?

Dave, I was not aware that anyone had forgotten anything of the kind. In the late 1980’s and early 1990’s Israel’s Shin Bet did publicly support Hamas, at least in a luke warm fashion. They have admitted since that it was a calculated political campaign to weaken and divide al-Fatah, and the Palestinian Liberation Organization who were the powers at the time.

Corruption in Fatah played a large roll in its continuing slide from power, that is true, but most knowledgeable observers of the political situation among the Palestinians more accurately attribute the slide to a mixture of Fatah’s corruption, and the rising success of the violent Hamas party. Since its recent political wins Hamas has come out on top in its fractious relationship with Fatah.

Where can the Palestinian people turn to? Hmmmm, perhaps it is time for them to form a government responsible to and for their own people rather than allow themselves to be led around by greedy thugs, or terrorists bent on the murder and destruction of an entire country.

I, for one, would support any movement that helped them to do that.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

Smarticus, where can the Israeli people turn to? Perhaps it is time for them to form a government responsible to and for their own people rather than allow themselves to be lead around by greedy thugs or terrorists bent on the murder and destruction of an entire people. It works both ways. Israel is an apartheid state. You can read Archbishop Desmond Tutu on that. The right to resist occupation is enshrined in international law. Israel has created the conditions in which Hamas will thrive, and - more than that - I'm certain that it knows this too. Israel has consistently rejected all attempts at a peaceful solution, because it is dedicated to war, and to the total subjegation of the Palestinian people. Many anti-Zionist Jews and Rabbis agree. Here are my two latest.

http://hubpages.com/politics/Witness-to-a-Massacre

http://hubpages.com/politics/Anti-Zionism-Is-Not-A...


LondonGirl profile image

LondonGirl 7 years ago from London

" Israel is an apartheid state."

It is not. Israeli Arabs are in no way separated by law, as in apartheid.


Paraglider profile image

Paraglider 7 years ago from Kyle, Scotland

Smarticus - {{20+ thousand US Special Forces and Marine operators in Afghanistan for eight years. A couple of those guys, Army Rangers, I have spoken to about what they were doing there. The efforts in that country have been heavily covered and reported in most major media outlets, including Newsweek, CNN, NBC News, ABC News, CBS News, BBC News, and more. Many programs have been produced by the likes of The History Channel, The Military Channel, and others from interviews done the military personnel who have been there.}}

Special Forces and Marines are not the way to track someone down. The US presence in Afghanistan has caused the great increase in Taliban numbers and most of their efforts are now spent fighting an unnecessary war, not seeking ObL.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

It is LondonGirl, the Palestinians of the occupied terrirories are separated by law, and treated with horrific disdain, as the recent atrocities show. Read Archbishop Desmond Tutu's comments in my last hub, Anti-Zionism is not Anti-Semitism, who I believe is qualified to know what he is talking about.


My Inner Jew profile image

My Inner Jew 7 years ago

I can't even finish the rest of your hub...you sir have obviously not lived in that country among those people. You sir have obviously not done much of your histroy research.

The jews BOUGHT the land from the Palestinians up till 1948 when the PALESTINIANS started a war with the Israelis with their constant terrorist acts and the israelis WON with HOMEMADE guns.

In 1967 JORDAN attacked israel and Israel won, even the U.N. says that Jordan started the war. So misplaced? well then if war is not good enough we should all leave the countries we live in because they were eventaully won through war.

Now to the Palestinians...haha they are not innocent bystanders. I have lived with them...on average 17 terrorist attacks are foiled in israel, there have been times i had to leave a street and go into hiding because there is a palestinian boy with enough ammunition in his backpack to blow up two whole streets. So who is the bystander? who is innocent. Who experienced the onslaught of bus bombings and hotel bombings for years? Oh yes, must have been the innocent palestinians.

You sir live in the safety of your home in the UK...only when you walk in the shoes of an Israeli will you understand. A people who put their own women and children before them to protect them...it is sick.

Israel doesn't want the deaths of innocents, but it is unavoidalbe...no one wants the deaths of innocents. You have to protect your country from the acts of terrorism.


Truly Different profile image

Truly Different 7 years ago from Israel.

Oh yeah, it's OK for haters to strap their bodies with bombs and walk into cafes and people-oriented places and blow up innocent people, with no regard for children.

The world wouldn't say a thing of loud disapproval or show any sympathy to Jews. But if Israel reacts, the whole world is in uproar, condemning the act. What a double standard!

What is worse, unsophisticated people (people who don't study the facts) buy into this "bad" world view of Israel.


renepauldelavarre profile image

renepauldelavarre 7 years ago from Chapel Hill, NC

I want to address one of the great deceptions being promoted by the LIBERAL FASCIST bRITISH, American Left, and government bureaucrats like Secretary. Hillary Clinton, Middle East Envoy George Mitchell.

Secretary Clinton states that, “Israel must make concessions.” “For Israel to get the support it’s looking for visa-a-vis Iran, it can’t stand on the sidelines with respect to the Palestinians and the peace efforts, and should halt settlement activity now—they go hand in hand.” They do not.

Many of the settlements in question consist of mobile homes on barren hilltops, which is not a threat to peace; Iran launching ballistic missiles while enriching uranium most certainly is. George Mitchell’s naïve analysis of Jewish settlements as a hindrance to peace is also misguided. Rather, continued expansion will show the PA leadership that Israel will no longer cave into false promises and dashed hopes for peace

The Left uses the term “linkage.” Sen. Dianne Feinstein is quoted: “If Israel wants the U.S. help to deter Iran from nuclear weapons, then Israel must stop building settlements.” We need to un-link this link immediately for there is no connection.

Why is Israel held to such high standards? The Left Wing condemns Israel every chance it gets, while they conveniently overlook the actions of Hamas, Hezbollah, Syria. They appeal for human rights; civil liberties, feminism and gay rights, yet Israel is the only country in the Middle East to honor civil rights, freedom of speech, religion, feminism, and gay rights. Gay rights is codified in Israeli law, and they serve openly in the military, which is in stark contrast to Hamas where being gay is a capital offense. Left Wing is silent.

The Left Wing refer Israel to as an “apartheid state,” yet Arab citizens of Israel hold office in the Knesset; they have the right to vote, and to criticize the government. In Gaza, political opponents of Hamas are systematically rounded up and tortured, killed, and harassed. Israel has even rescued black refugees from the Sudan. The Left remains silent.

The very act of evicting Jews for the purpose of creating another Arab state is in itself an act of apartheid. No country in the world has ever given up land conquered in a purely defensive war. Incredibly, the Left Wing is aligned with these martyrs who launch thousands of rockets at Israel from Lebanon and Gaza, long after Israel left Lebanon and Gaza.

The Arab-Israeli conflict is not about land, it’s about legitimacy. The Arabs have never accepted another religious entity in the region other than Arab or Islam. If territorial compromise had been the key, peace would have been achieved sixty-two years ago.

The Left has made a mockery of the concept of human rights, and has been exposed for the hypocrites that they are.

The liberal British are full of hate towards Israel. Keep in mind, video can be easily doctored, and as been before!


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

South African Archbishop Desmond Tutu has accused Israel of practising apartheid in its policies towards the Palestinians.

The Nobel peace laureate said he was "very deeply distressed" by a visit to the Holy Land, adding that "it reminded me so much of what happened to us black people in South Africa".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1957644.st...


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

"And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?" Matthew 7:3-4.


sneakorocksolid 7 years ago

CJ true to form you are also a coward and can't take being challenged. You have presented a huge lie(very liberal of you)and can't take being called on it. Wow, well here's one for you, "Thou shall not bear false witness." Thats one of the big ten. CJ you and your cohorts are pathetic!


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

sneakorocksolid, you are free to put up your comment again if you want, even though it was little more than a collection of insults. My central point is that it was Israel that broke the ceasefire, or do you deny this too? Read this for confirmation: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article21...


renepauldelavarre profile image

renepauldelavarre 7 years ago from Chapel Hill, NC

tutus is racist communist, so who cares what he says. Apartheid has nothing to do with Israel at all! For godsakes, arabs are in the Israeli government, free to critize,and all rights of other citizens. YOu're sources are lame at best.

Palestine was never ARAB LAND. Never.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

"tutus is racist communist, so who cares what he says". This seems to be about the level of commentary I'm getting on this hub now: unverified insult. The comparison is with Gaza and the West Bank as Bantustans. My sources are sound. Obviously some pro-Israeli lobby group have discovered this hub and decided to attack. I'm happy to deal with legitimate debate, but this is becoming tedious. If this continues I will close this hub for comments.


sneakorocksolid 7 years ago

CJ, honestly how many times has the arabs, especially arafat, broken truces, walked away from the peace talks, and just plain lied? Too many to count! Look the arabs hate Israel and the US. Do you know how much aid the US provides the countries in need including the arab countries? Pick any country you think is a better friend to humanity and their contributions to the welfare of the world will always pale incomparison!

When the US forces were after sadam and he was sending the scud missiles into Israel, the US asked Israel to hold off, they did. They are a true allie and a true friend, they didn't just say they were our friends their deeds spoke for themselves.

Now lets keep it simple: If you pull the tigers tale and you get mauled, whose fault is it? Yours for pulling its tale or its for mauling you?

I'll repeat something I said previously: If the arabs are as peace loving as you propose and Hamas is at fault. All they have to do is round them up,and they know who they are, and hand the bad actors over. They won't do it for their children, their families or their future. The arabs have demonstrated how low they will go, the truth means nothing to them. They are a people with no honor, no morals and no credibility.

Well I left out the "insults", but what the hell is wrong with you! We aren't perfect and Israel isn't perfect but we're light years ahead of the arabs. You've forgotten which side your breads buttered on! Peace.


sneakorocksolid 7 years ago

CJ, just so you know Im not a spokesperson for anything just a workerbee that visits the Hubs for some company. You're a good writer and you're easy to read. We don't have to agree to be friends and on this issue we don't. I would hate to see you pull a Hub because of something I said. Peace.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

sneakorocksolid, I wasn't intending to pull the hub, just block comments. I wrote this many months ago in the heat of passion at the sight of children being killed, at the sight of distraught parents holding the bodies of their children, at the devastation being inflicted upon a mainly civilian population by a cynical government exploiting the gap between presidents in order to run an election campaign, violating every international law and every measure of common decency you can name. You saw less of it in the US than we did in Europe. You should watch Al Jezeera some time if you want to know what was really happening back then. I'll put in a link, and then maybe you'll see what we all saw. http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/war_on_gaza/

Do Arabs hate Israel and America? It would be a surprise if they didn't. But actually this isn't about individual people, it's about states and international law: the laws of war laid down by the Geneva conventions and by the Nuremburg trials, which have been consistently violated by Israel. Again, you don't hear this because you have a complicit media. Israel violated the ceasefire and are engaged in collective punishment of a population, a war crime no less.

This is my view: the Palestinians are the Jews of the 21st century, and Gaza is the Warsaw ghetto. Are they collectively insane? You bet your life they are. They have been driven mad by the conditions in which they have to live. Nazi Germany were very good at covering up their crimes so that at the time many people in Europe and the United States did not know what was going on, and it is only with the benefit of hindsight that we are able to see the full extent of the crime. The same applies to Gaza now. How you stand in relation to this gravest of crimes is a measure of your humanity. Once you know the truth you can no longer be silent.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

"According to a joint Tel Aviv University-European University study, Israeli violence has been responsible for ending 79 per cent of all lulls in violence since the outbreak of the second intifada, compared with only 8 per cent for Hamas and other Palestinian factions...."

http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/war_on_gaza/200...


sneakorocksolid 7 years ago

Hey CJ, Thanks for your polite presentation I should learn to bite my tongue.(really) I hate war with all my heart because the innocent are the ones that suffer the most. I think violence should always be the last result. In my time here on earth I've learned that when people fight it's never one party is 100% right and the other 100% wrong. Theres plenty of wrong to go around and there are no knights in shining armour.

As long as the arab community ,as a whole, have it in for Israel there will never be peace. So I don't know what the answer is, but I have to support Israel because they've been there for us. I just don't trust the arabs motivation due to some of the things they believe.

You write with alot of passion and I like that. I'm not much for flakey people that go whatever way the wind blows. The violence felt by the children, any children, breaks my heart. Thanks for your Hub CJ! And you just wait till next time Pal, I'll tear you apart! Peace.


Mordechai 7 years ago

Another anti-semitic propaganda... It is wrongfully sad that Palestinian terroristic and barbaric agendas get western attention support.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 7 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

The Palestinians are Semites, therefore the most anti-semitic nation on the planet is Israel.


Tackle This profile image

Tackle This 7 years ago

You write well -- for the most part and your picture is nice -- almost editorial, in one sense. (Great) Please allow for me to quote you. "Hamas are targeting no one. The most they can do is to point the rockets over the wall that imprisons them in the vague hope that they might hit something." The aforementioned argument is unable to contain water, oil or anything else for that matter, except for the residue it leaves behind, something smells awry. Your suggestion wreaks of ludicrous hypocrisy. *Although, I've yet to perfect the trajectory of my "weapon" I can launch it at will into any given population and since I'm not quite sure where it's going to end up that, somehow makes it okay.

The Muslim world, containeth much territory. If they had their way, All Jews would be residing on dingies in neighboring seas. If anyone deserves a homeland, Israel does. The great Muslim founder when not accepted by the Jews decided to move. (They wouldn't have him cuz he was strange anyway)

He chose to move and history has it that a man by the name of Abraham was more than obligatory when he gave the proverbial red-headed stepchild a choice: "You" go West and we'll go East or "you" go East and we'll go West.


ReuVera profile image

ReuVera 6 years ago from USA

Just thought I'd post it here....

Col. Richard Kemp Testifies at U.N. Emergency Session

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX6vyT8RzMo[/url]


John Waters 6 years ago

Here check out this bozo who thinks that the blockade on Gaza and that the boarding of ships in International waters are both legal under International Law. Someone please put this fool right:

http://hubpages.com/politics/The-Rachel-Corrie-is-...


cajunrooster profile image

cajunrooster 6 years ago from San Antonio, Texas

Tell Hamas to keep on lobbing those rockets and I bet Israel will keep on keeping on with what they do. Your hub is drivel and your mind is mush.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 6 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

I bet Israel will keep doing what it does whether Hamas lobs rockets or not. There was a ceasefire. Israel broke it. Now they are engaging in acts of piracy in international waters. Is there no end to this violence?


gareth pawan 5 years ago

Just read this article and it made me weep. I can remember the news coverage where children were being brought into hospital with wounds that were still smoking from phosphorus bomb shrapnel. They were literally being burned alive but slowly. I will never understand why human beings are so tribal and lacking in compassion to those perceived to be different or lesser in some way. My daughter and grandson live in Israel. They are Jewish and they are potential targets of a rocket from Gaza. Yet what Israel does is appalling and beyond any sort of justification. Some times I think the National Socialists succeeded - but in a way,no one would have predicted or would have believed possible.

In the present day to be born Palestinian in Gaza or the wesr bank is to be born cursed. Like being born Jewish once used to be. It is to live and experience a form of hell on earth on an almost daily basis.

I just pray that there are many, many Israeli's - and I think there are, who are like my daughter. Just ordinary people who would never condone or support what is done in their name.


CJStone profile image

CJStone 5 years ago from Whitstable, UK Author

I agree with what you say Gareth: the Palestinians are the Jews of the 21st Century, and Gaza is the Warsaw ghetto. Where will it all end?

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