Honor Killings in India

Bridal Henna
Bridal Henna

A few days ago, a national daily newspaper reported the heinous murder of a newlywed couple who had been working in a software company and, evidently, had a bright future ahead. The couple had got married under police protection, anticipating trouble from their families (apparently different communities). It turned out that police protection wasn’t good enough to save the lives of two lovers who were, eventually, killed for having dared to marry out of caste. As shameful and as horrific it sounds, this gruesome killing (not the first of its kind though) took place in the capital city of India, Delhi.

Honor Killings

That’s what they call it in India when a young couple is brutally murdered on the pretext of saving the honor of their respective families. The crime for which they are punished (rather executed) is for loving and marrying someone who hails from a different community / caste. Ironic as it sounds, India is being viewed as a new face emerging on the global platform as a country that offers tremendous growth and business opportunities as of today. Perhaps, lagging behind all these years has turned out to be a blessing after all. Reminds me of the conventional hare and tortoise story. Slow and steady wins the race! As they say even the most potent political systems / governments / social systems have their own set of pitfalls, the downside in the Indian system is, most certainly, its entire social structure which, so blatantly and brazenly, shows in its dogmatic views, its hideous and heinous approach in dealing with problems of youth, its fanaticism, its gruesome attempt to curb the individuality of the younger generation and its intolerance and unacceptability of the changes which have crept in, due to intermingling of various cultures, in the wake of globalization.

Backdrop of Caste System – Ancient India

In olden times, Indian society was a victim of various evils, one of which was caste system. It is said that the caste system was designed with an intention of dividing the society into four distinct groups depending on the kind of work they were involved in. So to say, it was an easier way to assign different occupational roles to people; the motive was to ensure smooth running of the entire economic system. However, the division of society on the basis of caste system turned out to be the most horrifying milestone in the history of India as it lead to downgrading people on account of the families they were born in and the menial jobs they earned their living from. Simply put, the dignity of labor was lost and that reflects in the modern society as well. For decades, the poor belonging to lowest in the hierarchy (Braham-priest, Kshatriya-warriors, Vaishya-traders and Shudras-the laborers or the untouchables), were treated as despicable out-castes and were, mostly compelled to live on the outskirts of the village so that they couldn’t drink the water from the same well as ones from the higher castes did . Sounds terrible but that’s where the present society evolved from. No doubt, the caste system was abolished long time ago as a result of relentless and selfless efforts of countless social workers including a renowned Indian jurist and a political leader, Dr. Ambedkar (architect of Indian constitution) who spent his whole fighting against the social discrimination and caste system existing in India. Perhaps it was preordained that the man who would be responsible for eradicating one of the major evils in the society would be born in a family of untouchables . That's who Ambedkar was, by birth. All for a reason!

Modern India –Caste System

One would wonder if things have significantly changed in India post independence, which was about six decades ago. Well, my friends and family keep drawing my attention towards scientific, economic, technological and infrastructural advancements the country has shown over the years. Alas, the package doesn’t sound interesting, especially, after knowing fully well ‘what lies beneath’. (Reminds me of a woman who loves wearing expensive make-up on her face without realizing that she needs to pay more attention to her decaying internal organs if she wants to stay healthy and naturally beautiful).

Is marriage is union of souls now?Courtesy Firelady40.com
Is marriage is union of souls now?Courtesy Firelady40.com

It’s sad to see that nothing much has changed socially; in fact, decades back, society was divided only on the basis of caste but today multiple factors are responsible for the social disparity. In modern India, it’s hard to find a person who would see himself only as an ‘Indian’. What has emerged after all those years of hard work, sacrifices and bloodshed during pre-independence era, is a totally chaotic modern society where people discriminate on the basis of race, color, culture, gender, states, religion and economic standards. I think it’s worse than being divided only on the basis of caste. What kind of a society permits the elders or so-called self-proclaimed leaders of a particular community to have a proprietary interest in the marriage of a young girl and a boy who dare to fall in love and dream of having a life together? I believe that a decision to spend the rest of life with someone should be purely personal (to bride and groom) and no one (not even parents beyond a certain extent) should be allowed to interfere in such important and sensitive issues. People who think that such cases are reported only in the Muslim community, have to pay closer attention to other parts of the world where such things do not appear to be predominant and remain hidden beneath the surface. For a ready reference I’m sharing this LINK with you and remember….this is only a tip of the iceberg.

Honor Killings in India

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Comments 83 comments

VioletSun profile image

VioletSun 6 years ago from Oregon/ Name: Marie

Anjali: I was aware of the caste system in India but didn't know how strict the culture is in not allowing a couple from different backgrounds to marry, to the point of murder. I believe we chose our roles in life, and perhaps this young couple were spiritual beings who chose to be the sacrifical lambs and who will bring global awareness of what is going on and change will take place. India is an awesome spiritual culture, so rich, so I am sorry to hear this! Its very sad.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts honestly.

Hugs,

Marie


sabu singh profile image

sabu singh 6 years ago

Thank you for this timely Hub Anjali.

All right-thinking people would strongly denounce the taking of innocent lives in the name of family honour. Nothing justifies the taking of life.

For people with limited knowledge of India, it must be said that there is a modern India struggling to find its rightful place in the comity of nations. There is also an ancient Bharat struggling to maintain what it views are rightful traditions, even if it entails the murder and blood-letting of close relatives. These social evils include the practice of sati, the caste system, curtailment of women's rights and others which continue to prevail, if in muted form in rural areas as well as urban.

Some time in the future, the modern must overcome the ancient. When that time will come is anyone's guess.


jayb23 profile image

jayb23 6 years ago from India

Anjali, i read that story and I was shocked, inspite of all the progress we have made, we still have a mentality of 15th century. Caste is one thing I can never fathom. Good that u shared this hub. Keep it coming.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Hi Marie! I would've called them sacrificial lambs if this had been a rare occurrence but interestingly, such killings have been on the rise, despite the advancement the country shows in other aspects. I'm not sure if I can call it a spiritual country as its hard to say if they know the difference between religion and spirituality, in the first place. Thx so much for your lovely presence.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Sabu Singh:

You're absolutely right. We can see that desperation to find its 'rightful' place in the comity of nations but as you said, there is nothing that justifies 'taking life'. No one can comprehend killing ones own children merely for the reason that they chose to marry out of caste. What era are we living in? Well, there are less cruel /less restrictive means to denounce an action / inaction of the younger generation. The parents, can, disown them, if they feel so offended. What ends are met with by murdering two young people who don't deserve to die. I guess, in India, there are no longer 4 phases of human life (as designed by Manu...Brahamcharya etc etc). On the contrary there seems to be just 3 stages of life...pre-marriage, marriage and post-marriage as everything seems to revolve around marriage there. It certainly is a serious issue in the Indian family system. One can imagine how much more progress people would have made if they had learned to focus on constructive things. Thx very much for sharing your valuable insight. Its always nice to see you stop by. :)


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Hi Jay!

We need more of young people like you who can show some strength to fight the age-old dogmas of the society and build a better future for the country which it so well deserves. Thx very much for being a part of this hub.


SEO Expert Kerala profile image

SEO Expert Kerala 6 years ago from KERALA

The honour killings increasing in uneducated states like Uttar Pradesh, Punjab and Rajasthan. Law and Government should take preventive measures against the social evil.

we are indian by traditions& customs and bound by certain principles, norms to marry or make a relation. i suggest govts shld come with alegislation after consltations with appro before any rot or damage to our culture


Tatjana-Mihaela profile image

Tatjana-Mihaela 6 years ago from Zadar, CROATIA

I also did not know that caste system is so dogmatic and so rigid.

For years I was blessed to live in very liberal socialistic country (when Croatia was part of Yugoslavia), where people really did not know much about discrimination because of any of above mentioned reasons...(although some of people wanted to be "more equal" then the others so this nice but not perfect system crushed down and now we have chaos and overall discrimination as almost everyone else).

It is so sad to read about "honor killing". In this early morning my eyes are full of tears.

Honor killing speak about brutal slavery: families obviously treat their members as their property - otherwise they would not kill them just because of marrying somebody who is not from the same caste.

Thank you for speaking openly about this problem. I`ve learned a lot from your Hub.

Blessings, Anjali.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

SEO Expert:

You're right regarding the states where such occurrences are reportedly more in number but the incident I referred to, took place in Delhi. What do you say to that!! Shockingly, such killings have alarmingly increased in the metro cities of India as well. So I'm not sure if its happening due to illiteracy or because the society has shown a steep decline in human values. Thx very much for showing up after a very long time.

Hi Tatjana!

I agree with what you say, especially, with 'families treating their members like property'. I don't think there can be a better explanation. Parents / elders think that they own their children just because they invested so much time, effort and money on them. Sounds like investing money in the Bank and expecting huge returns when the time ripens. Like I said in the earlier post that the society is showing significant decline in human values which is extremely shameful. Thx so much for your wonderful comments.


Nancy's Niche profile image

Nancy's Niche 6 years ago from USA

It’s hard to believe that such horrible practices still exist in today’s world. The family’s action is wrong on so many levels. How can they associate the term “honor” with killing? There is nothing honorable in taking a life to save face…


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Nancy's Niche:

Its truly unimaginable. That's why I always say that children born in the West should count their blessings. Well, there are pitfalls everywhere like I said in the hub but if they weigh their blessings against the odds, they would like to thank God for so many things which they are not aware of. Thx very much for your sincere and genuine words. I really appreciate.


Shalini Kagal profile image

Shalini Kagal 6 years ago from India

I sometimes wonder if we're regressing Anjali. This - in the 21st century! Sad and absolutely shameful. The only bright spot I see in this whole thing is a free press that goes after these monsters. Oh yes, some do get away but many get what they deserve only because it's been reported.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Hi Shalini!

Yes, 'being reported' are the key words here as 90% of crimes go unreported. I too wonder sometimes what could've been the scenario if 'freedom of press' didn't exist. Media is the only thing which law-makers, law-enforcers and law-breakers are scared of. It tends to put a leash on the barbaric activities, which otherwise, could've been rampant in every nook and corner of the country(at least it has a minimizing effect).I'm so glad you stopped by. As I've mentioned many times, your presence adds value to my modest hubs. Take care.


AEvans profile image

AEvans 6 years ago from SomeWhere Out There

That was horrific for the newlywed couple, one would think that we are in 2010 , it is very disheartening to learn that these things still exist in Inida. Thank you so much for sharing this information many of us did not have any idea this was still going on today. :(


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

AEvans: Its shameful indeed. Unfortunately, people like us can't do anything except condemning it. Its up to the law enforcement to take action but, apparently, they are worse than mute spectators in that country. Blame it on the corrupt system! Such incidents bring shame and disrepute to a country which is, ironically, known all over the globe for being peace loving and tolerant. Thx very much for your loving presence. :)


vrbmft profile image

vrbmft 6 years ago from Yucaipa, California

Thanks for an informative hub. One of the way change occurs is by exposure, so to speak. Also, it is easy for us to look at countries like India and be shocked, but similar prejudices exist even in America. Perhaps, we do not outright shoot the bride and groom, but we do our best to kill the otherwise wonderment of their wedding day. I don't have a lot of clients with this story, but enuf, to know, it exists, and it is amazing how many families do not approve who the person is marrying and then the way one or both families go out of their way to destroy the joy of the wedding day. The pain and the wound can last for decades and it's as crazy, in my mind, as the honor killing in the caste society.

Even in our society, there are still forms of prearranged marriages, and I outline them in my book.

There is also a film, Waters, which I really like and am using as a training film for foster parents. Maybe you are familiar with it. If not, check it out.

So again, thanks for shedding light on something most of us probably don't hear about.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Vrbmft:

I completely agree. Certainly, there are other cruel ways to kill without shedding blood. I've seen it too. The scars, as you said, can last for a whole lifetime. I think its worse than killing a person once for all. At least the victim doesn't have to live that moment over and over again in his mind, once he is dead. How complicated and difficult we humans have made this life!! Thanks a ton for sharing your valuable insight. I'll check out that movie you mentioned.


@MagicBoy profile image

@MagicBoy 6 years ago from Qatar


boyjyoti profile image

boyjyoti 6 years ago

Hi Anjali. Thanks for raising this issue here. There is one more angle to this tragedy. This evil system has been rejected tooth and nail by vast majority of educated mass but a few 'hardened' minds who 'inherit' these thoughts inculcated in their minds right since childhood do carry these traditions 'blindfolded'. These people in fact are needed to be put under 'psychiatrist supervision'. I cannot repeat the entire story here that I had written on my website newsjyoti.com a few days back. So please don't mind that I put a link as this is the related story http://newsjyoti.com/2010/honorpsychos.aspx


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

boyjyoti: Its a pleasure to read thoughts of like minded people. I would surely go to your website tomorrow... being a Sunday. :) Thx for joining in.


bhagwad profile image

bhagwad 6 years ago from Chennai, India

These Khaps also have the nerve to justify their barbaric acts. They say "Killing is wrong, but these men and women shouldn't have run away in the first place!"

Implying what? That it's their fault? Kind of like blaming a rape victim for wearing "provocative clothing" no?


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

bhagwad: That was quite an apt example. Its very frustrating but no one seems to do anything about it. What else do I say!!! You probably know more than I do about the conditions prevailing there. Thx for sharing you views


bhagwad profile image

bhagwad 6 years ago from Chennai, India

For the past few days, I've been having an interesting discussion in the comment section with a guy who supports khap panchayats and their views: http://incognitocomments.wordpress.com/2010/05/30/...

I don't know if you have the time, but I can guarantee you that it provides a good insight into the mind of some people :)


@MagicBoy profile image

@MagicBoy 6 years ago from Qatar

Hey Anjali, this is a very interesting and informative hub..I appreciate your style of writing and the way you depict your thoughts and share your knowledge...take care...


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

@MagicBoy: Thanks very much for your wonderful words. Its really encouraging. :)


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 6 years ago from Chicago

This is a fascinating post. I suppose some change comes slowly. Not technological change—it comes swiftly and seems to be accelerating. Thanks for a good read.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Hi James! I try to write about issues that corrode the roots of our social system. Thx for appreciating this humble effort of mine. :)


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

Thanks to anjalichugh for highlighting a social evil in Indian society. No one thinks it good. But that does not happen all over India, which is a vast country having 1.15 billion population. Only in remote pockets, that practice happens, and the perpetrators commit it without the knowledge of even their neighbours. They know they are committing a murder and try to hush it up. But those affected somehow leaks the facts to the police.

It need not be taken as a scale to evaluate Indian society. There are 1000+ good things. Why not we look at them? Especially, you, Anjali, an Indian, should not bring disrepute to our nation from a foreign land.

Every teacher expects that his/her students should be obedient, intelligent and efficient. Every parent shall expect the same from their children. If and when those students/ children go on the wrong way, a way which cant be retracted, their anger crosses the limit and come to a conclusion. The court in the hearts of parents awards death sentence to the erring ones. And they are psychologically ready to face the consequences.

If a girl chooses a person who turns out to be a terrorist, criminal, a national traitor or uncompatible for her society after their marriage, how will she face the consequences. Logically, honour killing is good. But legally not.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal Sivagna: I'm not here to bring disrepute to the country and nor am I exaggerating facts. This particular issue was reported by almost all leading newspapers across the globe. I always say that everyone is different. Perhaps you can justify the killing of young children on the pretext of social norms....I cannot and I'm not sorry for not conforming with your ideology. Thx for your insightful comments.


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

You have not reported even a small portion of facts and so I wont say that you are exaggerating. Nor do I ask you to conform to my ideology. I have stated there that it is illegal and I don't conform to that ideology either. Something would have went wrong and it is the responsibility of parents to bring their children with good character. Killing them after they differ is an uncivilised act. But it will take another century to clear all these social evils.

I am a devout rationalist, in the path of South Indian reformer, E.V.R.Periyar, who has struggled all his life for the betterment of women and removal of social evils. So, you cant expect that I will support honour killings. But it is not the place to discuss social evils of India. It is a local social issue.

(If killing the erring children is a social evil, the children choosing a wrong pair is also a social evil. It is better to obey the elders for their future safety. This is my opinion as father of three grown up well educated children)


weblog profile image

weblog 6 years ago from 1India

Venu sir, you said, "Logically, honour killing is good. But legally not."

How can you even call it 'good' and what's the logic when you say logically??


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal Sivagna: I am a mother too but I never impose my opinion on my child. The only thing a parent can do is to bring up a child in a way that helps the child in understanding the difference between right and wrong..the rest is up to God. In any case, upholding the social / local issue like killing children is nothing less than barbarism. It reminds me of stories I used to read in my early childhood about animals who eat their babies as soon as they are born. I believe humans are supposed to be different and much more evolved than such animals. However, you don't have to agree to with me. All of us, as I said, are on different levels of understanding / consciousness so we are bound to think differently. Thx .

Weblog: Thanks for taking time to read and contemplate. Your comments are always welcome. Feel free to come back. You might even get an answer to your question from Mr. Venugopal.:)


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

Web: Do you think children agitating against their own parents and going differently that too in a sensitive issue like marriage which affects our family prestige, is good? There are several ways of punishing the guilty, but uncivilised people only select the big crime. I have time and again said that honour killing is uncivilised, but law takes its own course and punish the killers. That is all. Think of arguing these things with those concerned with honour killings before they commit the crime. No one can control their anger at that point of time. They think that is the only way to save their tradition. Do we have any other alternative way... to save their tradition and honour?

Ms.Anjali, you live in America, but please dont lose your Indianness. You should, you must teach your children about our heritage, culture and civilisation. They should feel proud to be born to an Indian mother. You need not wait till they understand right and wrong; and later don't blame the god. (Let him rest in peace) I agree with your "barbarism" comment. It applies only to those who do it.

Even now, in a particular area of India, there are primitive tribes, who are cannibals, eating human flesh. What can you do with them? Can they understand your logic? They are also god's children like us. Which law prevent them?

Our logics should be applied wherever it will be honoured. Those who cannot even understand these logics should not be taken into consideration.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal: "Ms.Anjali, you live in America, but please don't lose your Indianness. You should, you must teach your children about our heritage, culture and civilization."

Among other things that my parents taught me was to respect elders which is why I'm not confronting you any more. I respect you for your age (but, unfortunately, not for your views on this subject). Speaking for Indianness...you hardly know anything about me but I know lot about India for having spent 2/3rds of my life in that (miserable) environment. So, let's not lay aspersions on each other without having a slightest idea of our individual (past) experiences. Also, my child knows what he should know. Thx for taking interest in this hub.


Shil1978 profile image

Shil1978 6 years ago

Well done Anjali in keeping your poise in the face of insinuations from the previous poster. I'd like to believe that this has nothing to do with "Indianness," so the other poster is certainly missing the point here.

I hope most Indians can unequivocally condemn such practices. I'd like to believe that most don't support things such as these, but if there are even a few of them who support this, hopefully better sense and wisdom would dawn on them!!

Let's hope for a better future for India in general and in respect to this practice in particular!!


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Hi Shil: Its a great feeling to read your posts. There are few wonderful people here on HP with whom I feel so connected and... you are one of them. I have faced a lot of criticism on some of my hubs but I've tried to maintain my stand no matter what. I could hold on to my views because I strongly believe in what I say or write about. Thx for understanding and believing in me. In case you want to have some fun time reading the comments on some controversial stuff I wrote long time back, here are the quick links:

http://hubpages.com/relationships/anjalichugh1

http://hubpages.com/religion-philosophy/oshophilos

Happy reading !!!


panda.nibedita profile image

panda.nibedita 6 years ago from Pune, India

The article poses a question and forces us to think on such issues.Yes there are cases. But there are also families who accept such marriages with a happy heart. People and society are slowly changing.Lets hope for a better tommorow for our country.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

panda.nibedita: Yes, lets hope for the best. I appreciate your thoughtful comments. Feel free to come back. :)


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

In the name of preventing honour killings, no one should encourage indiscipline in the society. If a killing takes place, law takes its own course and no one is spared. No one supports it. Even the government treats it as a murder case and the perpetrators are taken to justice.

But we should find a suitable mechanism to prevent inexperienced children going on their own way which usually ends up in divorce. The marriages should be registered only with the parents' consent and not by passers-by. Temple priests should perform marriages only when the parents are present there. Otherwise, it should be treated as illegal/ immoral.

The newly enacted laws in India states that no son or daughter can refuse to look after their parents, which means children should take full responsibility on their parents. Vice-versa, parents are bound to take full responsibility over their children's affairs.

I am pained to see women, who should uphold traditions and our culture are arguing like this. Are the tides going against the sea?


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal Sivagna:

" But we should find a suitable mechanism to prevent inexperienced children going on their own way which usually ends up in divorce..."

I'm sure that by 'suitable mechanism' you don't imply that they should be killed. If that's not the intention, then we are on the same page. Speaking of ending in divorce....you've seen this world more than I have (presumably) and as such we both know that arranged marriages too end in divorce. Also, the % of such divorces are not less than those cases where marriages are performed against the wishes of parents.

Besides, you're missing the point. This hub focuses on 'brutal killings' rather than 'rebellious marriages' or their consequences. I'm glad you felt prompted to come back. Thx for the wisdom you share on HP.


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

"you are missing the point"...

You are missing the point I am stressing. There is no statistics for divorces. Just for argument, you cannot say all are going to court. In traditional families, only arranged marriages works even now. Rebellious marriages ends up in divorce or otherwise, including honor killings. Throughout my life, I saw two marriages, ending up in divorce; one for groom's impotence and other for lack of accommodative approach between mother-in-law and the bride. They are "arranged divorces".

Here, we are discussing rebellious marriages, ignoring customs, tradition, family prestige, etc., which arouse the passion of other family members on bothsides, who go to the extent of "arranged honor killings". My contention is both sides are at fault in these cases. Even if we cannot implement the customs, tradition, etc., we should morally support them.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal Sivagna:

" Even if we cannot implement the customs, tradition, etc., we should morally support them.."

You're free to hold the flag (of traditions etc), sir but you cannot impose your opinion on others. Everyone has a right of free speech and free thought. Besides, it seems like you are so desperate in making me agree with you (which is not going to happen). I can only say..."we both have said enough...so let it go." It was nice knowing you.


Akhila 6 years ago

Dear Anjali,

good to see some strong woman in this field like you. first let us atleast not call them as 'honor killings' as they bring an unpardonable shame to the Gandhian-Lohiate-Ambedkar's ...land i.e., our India. they are ... you can fill a most dangerous/worst word in the blank.

next about Venugopal...'s view, though there are 1000 good things in India there are more bad things than that. just to name few, female infanticide, bride burning (10-15 thousand in a year), children/infants are being raped, untouchabality still practiced, wife (along with children) desertion, bigamy, wife beating, eve teasing, rapes and murders etc., not to forget communal clashes. I think Venu ji can think about these honorable practices of our India. Dear Venu ji, please read and try to internalize YOUR NATION'S Gandhi-Lohia's ideas and principles who said only the intercaste marriages and "sahapankti bhojanas" can destroy the caste based discriminations.

there were many community in Bharatha where in girl and boy choose their mates and live with them till they are comfortable together may be even life long. its a natural activity. In the name of tradition and custome people like you sopiled those age old parctices and made the life complicated. and for your kind information the arranged marriages are equally coming up for divorces, more than than most of the time wife will be killed, wife and children commit suicide, or they are deserted. even the maternal families cant invite them back as they had spend lot of money on dowry in those arranged marriages. very few are successful and married without dowry. please please be open minded. you don't have to lable a person in the name of caste or religion. instead you can see them as just a human by being humane.

And dear anjali sorry for taking it directly. I wish you all the best to bring awareness in the minds of people.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Akhila! I have to thank you for your upfront comments. Mr. Venugopal (just like u pointed out) feels that there are good things about India which people like me (living outside India)should highlight instead of exposing the worst. I wanted to ask him to name a few things which he feels is commendable about India, but then I decided against it. I'm sure he reads newspapers ...what's happening in the wake of commonwealth games is proving to be the last nail in the coffin...one of the most derogatory things for India on the global front. Anyways! It seems that he is trying to give vent to his feelings in a public forum which is acceptable to me, as everyone has freedom of expression. Who knows...he may have had to face similar issues in his family. His anger clearly shows in his words. We all have to learn to deal with situations but in no case, killing is the answer. Thanks very much Akhila for being a part of this hub. Feel free to come back.


VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA profile image

VENUGOPAL SIVAGNA 6 years ago from India.

Ms.Akila, thanks for commenting on my comments. No one's views will fully fit the views of others. I know this world from 1948, when I saw with my own eyes, a mother bearing a child in her hand and crying for "atleast water" for the child. She then will cry whether any one was willing to "buy that child as she could not protect it from hunger." Have we not advanced more than 1000 times from that era?

Then no one will beat, hurt or harm a woman if she keeps quiet. Coordination between husband and wife is a must if the family has to roll on. Due to illiteracy, and greed, women will not cooperate and men will beat the wife. Let us not go into that deeply. Ground situation may warrant such things.

One more last (I think) news for Smt.Anjali: Two days back, on 27-9-2010, an Indian tv channel telecast a footage shown in Saudi Tv. Some talibans catch a woman, beat her for going with an unknown man, and pulled her down. Then she was killed by throwing stones by he taliban men. That woman's last movements.... The scene was so unbearable that I shut down my eyes. Does this happen in our land? We are far better and civilised than those people. So be content with this dispensation.

I don't need to make you accept my views, because even my two daughters never accept my views. I am sure, when they mature, they will come to earth and accept my views.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Venugopal Sivagna:

" The scene was so unbearable that I shut down my eyes. Does this happen in our land? We are far better and civilised than those people. So be content with this dispensation.."

Your words remind me of a conversation between an Indian wife and her husband. This happened a year ago. Wife was venting out her greivances and husband was yelling back at her saying, "99% of women in India live suffocated lives...why can't you live like them? You think you're someone special and deserve a better treatment. If that's what you think, you're living in a fool's paradise. If you want to live in my house, you have to live the kind of life I give you. Take it or leave it."

Mr. Sivagna there is a word in English called 'assault' and I believe you know that assault can be physical as well as mental. Both are equally tormenting and life sucking but I guess, according to you (just like in the example mentioned above) women in India are supposed to be happy for not being stoned to death at least.

Thank you very much, once again, for your wise words.


Cheeky Girl profile image

Cheeky Girl 6 years ago from UK and Nerujenia

Honor killings are legally wrong and logically wrong. Caste in India is a controversial subject. My partner is part Indian and suffers from having a low opinion of India due to certain things, many of which have surfaced in this Hub. I am sure there are things worth liking too. India is a country I do not know much about. But I appreciate this hub for enlightening me as to some of the "new ways" and the "old Ways" and how they can not reconcile their differences.

Sadly, there is no hiding the issues facing India. But from what I hear - private enterprise in India is the main reason India is such a thriving country. According to the media in the west, it is Indian Govt that does not work as well as private industry. India has a long way to go, but it is taking the steps. It will take a long time.

The best ways to deal with problems like honor killings is to always make sure the issue is exposed and dragged kicking and screaming out into the broad daylight. Which is just what you have done here. This is a great hub, and the comments above also tell us a lot too.

India has to become a society where people can live and not be afraid of confronting thorny subjects like these mentioned above. And veiled threats made in comments about women knowing their place is just plain silly. That crap was so last century! Great hub, anjalichugh. Never be afraid to call it what it is. You won a fan with me today.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Cheeky girl: I genuinely appreciate your intelligent comments. India is certainly creating ripples on the global front, especially, in the wake of Commonwealth games being hosted there. There are some good things about that country like food, music, culture, rising Sensex :) etc but the whole splendor gets somewhat overshadowed by the crumbling social system. In my opinion, survival becomes next to impossible when the key element (social set-up) is rotten. Again its my personal opinion and no one has to agree with it. Thanks a lot for taking time to read.


elayne001 profile image

elayne001 6 years ago from Rocky Mountains

So sad to read about what some couples go through because of their love for each other. They lose everything. I hope it will change soon, but traditions are very difficult to overcome. Wishing you well.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Elayne: Yes it is sad. Lets hope things change. Thanks so much for stopping by.


pradeep ch 6 years ago

I did not read article...

i suppose u not in support of honor killers ..//

I wuld say the opposite..

The girl's parents being in upper caste seem to be the most common situation these things happen...

If a girl marries some one of lower caste.., what happens.., all girl's family..kit and kin..sort of have to heed to the main family of the groom.

how would girls family move around the same caste extended family happily.. At times., the girl's family will not be provided monetary loans etc if they needed..

the girls family will loose little importance in the family circles ...

which is a total break of the highness they have so far...

how to regain highness again.. just discarding the weeds that's causing lowness...

I am not against honor killing.., it is natural reaction by these parents.. The parents r not gods for heaven's sake..

thanks,


christiansister profile image

christiansister 6 years ago

anjalichugh, Thank you for the hub. You are a very strong person to realize these things and are not afraid to speak out (or to speak out in the face of fear.) You are beautiful and your courage and life are making an impact. God will always see us through. Even death cannot hold us captive. :) That being said, it is so sad that the world rages blindly, all think they are justified in their actions :(


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 6 years ago from New York Author

Pradeep Ch: I don't intend speaking about caste system and its evils. This hub only focuses on the brutal killings and that's all. As I said in one of my earlier posts...nothing justifies killing. Parents can, at worst, disown their children if they don't approve of their actions. When you say that 'parents are not God for heavens sake', I'm sure you didn't mean that they get the right to kill their children. Thx for being a part of this hub.

Christiansister: I'm not sure if my life is making an impact but I try everyday to make it useful. You're absolutely right...everyone thinks that he is justified in his actions. We all go through bad / worse phases in life but does anything justify killing children and that too over the issue which I brought out in the hub? Doesn't seem right to me! I'm so glad that you stopped by and took time to share your views. I really appreciate. Keep coming.


pradeep ch 5 years ago

thank u


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 5 years ago from New York Author

Pradeep ch: You're welcome. :)


maheshpatwal profile image

maheshpatwal 5 years ago from MUMBAI

Thank you Anjali for writing this hub and bring this issue to the notice of all hubbers.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 5 years ago from New York Author

Maheshpatwal: Thank you for reading this and for appreciating the effort. :)


saket71 profile image

saket71 5 years ago from Delhi, India

Anjalichugh, this is a great hub that you have written, and while Mr Sivagna has been his intimidating best, with an equally confounding argument, love your steadfast defense as a father to the two year old daughter. I do hope the learning of today stay with me in future. She, who is right now sleeping in my lap, will one day grow up and take at times, position contrary to mine, some time due to more knowledge than mine, sometime due to less than mine (I would always believe it would be latter), I hope and pray that I will always remember while incidents of disagreements may happen of and on, the little lady in my lap will remain the same person who brought to me the promise of tomorrow. God bless and keep writing.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 5 years ago from New York Author

Saket71: I should be grateful to you for having shared such wise words in this hub. Very few people know how to convey a message and be polite at the same time. Thank you.

I can understand your concern as I, too, am a parent but there's not much we can do except making them capable enough to understand the difference between right and wrong. I want to share with you some amazing words of a very wise man (Khalil Gibran) and I'm sure they befit the scenario.

" Your children are not your children.

They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.

They come through you but not from you,

And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,

For they have their own thoughts.

You may house their bodies but not their souls,

For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,

which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.

You may strive to be like them,

but seek not to make them like you.

For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday."

Saket..You're wise enough to see the context. Thanks a lot for being a part of this hub. Keep coming back.


safiq ali patel profile image

safiq ali patel 5 years ago from United States Of America

Your hub leaves many questions about honour killings and the caste system unaswered.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 5 years ago from New York Author

Safiq: May be. I couldn't possibly include everything due to space constraints. Thanks for stopping by.


sonali 5 years ago

such a shameful incident


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 5 years ago from New York Author

Sonali: Yes it is. Thank you for stopping by.


Sam 4 years ago

You are ill/mis-informed about the issue and particularly biased about the issue.


Baisl Pereira 3 years ago

Very horrible incidents are happening under the banner of honor Killing which are to be viewed seriously in the cause of life saving.


rachna 3 years ago

hey miss i am very happy to read your comments regarding honor killing.

i like that very much and i am agree with you completely.

it is a small step by you to stop the honor killing but a small change can make a big change in our society.

honor killing is a very shameful and disgusting.

it is a stain on our culture.


Deborah Sexton 2 years ago

This is so sad Anjlichugh. It's horrible to think someone can put themselves as a judge whether someone can live or not. They actually don't see that their sin is the greatest.


anjalichugh profile image

anjalichugh 2 years ago from New York Author

@Deborah: Yes it is a sin...greatest ever. I don't know if the human race can ever evolve to the extent that it becomes at par with God energy. Its going to take another million earth years perhaps. Thanks for your comments dear.


suhaani 2 years ago

“Never be afraid to raise your voice for honesty and truth and compassion against injustice and lying and greed. If people all over the world…would do this, it would change the earth.”


suhaani 2 years ago

Inter caste marriage should be encourage..bcoz if people take this step then castesim and religion based discrimination should be stop itself..we all are human being..God never created any caste and religion..even God dnt has any caste and religion…did you know that God belong to which caste and religion..then keep shut your mouth about this stupid varan system and caste system okh.. In ancient times, caste system had the seeds of liberalism. It provided the right and opportunity to get to the top from the humblest origin and earn the respect of the whole society. For example, Vashishtha, the principal of the conservative school of Brahmanism, was the son of Uravshi, a prostitute. Vishwamitra, the maker of the very Gayatri Mantra, the quintessence of the Vedic Brahmanism, was a Kshatriya. Aitreya, after whom the sacramental part of Rig-Veda is named as Aitreya Brahamana, was the son from a non-Aryan wife of a Brahman sage. Vyasa of Mahabharata fame was the son of a fish-woman and he was not ashamed of his origin. Balmiki, an untouchable according to present standards, the original author of Ramayana, is highly respected all over India..And only you can make it good or bad this inter caste marriage. Depends upon how much importance u give to these meaningless and stupid values. And how much importance u give to other people who value these meaningless things. U have to see how much u urself r attached to other people opinions. And since u r asking for opinion, it means u r attached to these meaningless things.


suhaani 2 years ago

All Hindu communities in the country follow the varnashram system of Aryans and have divided the society in four castes – Kshatryas, Brahmins, Vaishyas and Shudras. Sindhis do not have such division in their society. They never followed a rigid caste system. That is why Sindhis are considered to be only businessmen. All members of the society inter-mingle with one another without any consideration of four castes of Aryans. There are no untouchables in Sindhis…..These religion and caste set up by mad and stupid people to control others not by god…who are still mentally sick they are following this castesim blindly..i must say be like all sindhi..leave these castesim and make only one hindu religion like sindhi religion don't create any caste,community and class…bcs its only give you tension and create problems for your own self..


suhaani 2 years ago

who divided society in caste line……only stupid and mentally sick hindu..first change your thinking that all people as a human being so the system ll be change itself understood..be like sindhi religion, make one religion and killed the bloody varan system n caste system…you ll b more happiest person in this world if you all mad hindu change ur narrow minded thinking about these caste n class…Because “I believe in recognizing every human being as a human being–neither white, black, brown, or red; and when you are dealing with humanity as a family there’s no question of integration or intermarriage. It’s just one human being marrying another human being or one human being living around and with another human being.”


suhaani 2 years ago

My this comment to katar hindu and coward brahmin who haven't gut to fight for their own love but strange thing is they easily fell in love with other caste girls but don't have got for fight back..

What you are doing now is not fair.You are not giving any importance to your gal’s feelings.How can you avoid a gal whom you loved for past 4 years at this stage of your life where you need to take serious decisions?If you lack the courage to introduce the matter before your parents,then i can say you are a coward.If you are that much concerned about your parents,you could have think it earlier before you started your love.At least that gal is saved from you.But you gave her all hope,she loved you sincerely as her man and now you want your parents only.

I am not making you sad.I know that parents are important and they are like God.But this is not at a good solution.You are keeping things hidden from everyone.You are the only son of your parents – that means their only asset for future.So cant they understand your feelings towards that gal?Initially they may be against.But you can convince them slowly.How can you close your true affair even without a single try?Go man,get ready to take some risk for your loved one.Pls don't ignore her.Its like killing her.She made her family ready for you,its your turn now.I hope things will be fine at last.


suhaani 2 years ago

All human-beings are equal in the eyes of God.The human-beings have only created the caste system.There are good and bad people in both high caste as well as low caste.Ultimately,what matters to God is, whether one is a good person or striving to become one, or not..

One who thinks himself to be of a high caste is actually low. While one who thinks himself/herself to be of low caste is said to be high caste.As per the scriptures, people are known by their nature and the quality of work they perform..

You cannot put people in high and low rank the basis of religious belief and caste. But those people do this who has a problem in their mind..

God doesn’t need Brahmin priest, god isn’t so narrow minded. god accept everyone. actually Brahmin priest needs god to make money.


suhaani 2 years ago

The brahmin community has been one of the dirty communities which has planned strategically to fool people in the name of god by generating the highest donations in the temple, doing business to fool and loot money in the name of puja, death, marriage, new home… For any occasion, there’s one puja. They charge very high prices and take away all the items after the puja. They have created prostitution in the name of devadasis. They suppress jobs and employment and welfare and equality are destroyed. they have destroyed the Indian medical system. They have killed Indian medical science like siddha vaidhyam and created ayurveda and carnatic music by destroying dravidian music. Even today they have the temples under their control. They say they don’t like untouchables, but they have always been sexually harassing low caste women.


suhaani 2 years ago

Some stupid people living in India that's why this country cant be develop anymore as the other countries are well developed. Bcoz indian people live in caste-ism and egoist by nature especially who belong to upper class which is created by themselves not created by God.God only created human being..He didn't put any human in high and low category..This cheap things only created by some mad people itself who live in India..and they be proud by called themselves hindu..I am also hindu but I feel bad when every person who proudly said they are hindu but their thinking is so narrow minded..now its depend on human what they want to become Devil or Angel..Nobody is lower and higher by caste or religion..they become high and low by their behavior..Reservation should be stop itself when you all leave this stupid casteism..Say no caste and no community..All are hindu who live in hindustaan understood..


suhaani 2 years ago

insaan apne guno se upar uthta hai unche staan pr baith jane se nhi..caste n community created by mad people jin logo ko khud ko dusro se shreshth batane ke liye apne aapko ek high community mein rakh liya or dusro ko niche dikhane ke liye lower community mein rakh diya gaya bina unki marzi jane...i want to tell to all mad hindu people community ye decide nhi kregi ki tum kitne high or low ho...tumhare karam tumhe upar or niche girane wale hai...arre god ne insaan banaye hai caste nhi...n listen aisa hota toh christan or muslim mein bhi aise hi char community hoti bt tum log unko as all christan n as all muslim hi bolte ho...tum katar hindu logo ne khudh hi apne bando ko khudh se alag kr diya...char community hai hindu mein let me explain it to very well ok...hindu ko as a body lo us body ke char hisse tum stupid logo ne char hiso mein describe kiya ..1st brahmin jisko sir ka staan diya or kshatriye ko bhuja or vaishya ko pait ka or tum sabki favorite community shudr jisko per ka staan diya....ab batao agr per kat doge toh kya apni manzil ki taraf tunde ho ke jayoge tum sb apahiz ho yaad rkhna..agr hmari body ka ek part bhi kat jaye toh hum apahiz kehlate hai toh tum stupid hindu khudh apahiz ban chuke ho..ek bade se bada brahmin or devta bhi jb apne maa baap ntmastak hone ke liye sir jhukata hai toh woh uske charno ko choone ke liye toh akal ke andho sabse uncha staan toh shudr log prapt kr chuke hai...tum nhi tum gire huye ghatiya egoist bande ho jisko god bhi narak mein dalega....i m also brahmin bt i hate castsim okh....say no to community n no caste den reservation should be stop itself...abroad isliye develop kr raha hai bcs unka mind indian ghatiya logo ki tarah nhi hai especially katar hindu..1000 saal baadh bhi india mein koi development nhi hogi yeh aise hi high low ke liye hi mrte rahenge...


suhaani 2 years ago

Hindu (body) four community: brahmin (head) kshatriya (arm) vaishya (belly) shudra (feet) All these four community called as hindu. We all are parts of one body. Without each part our body is not complete. If we lost one part of our body then we become handicap. The human body is the entire structure of a human being. Human Body is considered so loving that God even wants to have it. Spiritual Yogis have found that after going through the 84 millions species this souls get the most dignified human body. So it is the last step to explore the God or to get the view of almighty father god. We know that the soul never dies it takes birth again and again just like as we take new clothes to wear the soul as it takes new body and it is an infinite process. But the body what we get in next birth depend on our karma that thas been cited in Gita by Lord Krishna to Arjuna. We all here to perform our duties. Our action makes our destiny and nothing else. The result is in the hand of supreme power. Karma is the seed of plant and if the seed is genuine it must be fruitful.


suhaani 2 years ago

Many a time, man has taken birth in high caste and low caste; but this does not make him great or lowHaving been born in high caste man thinks himself to be great and being born in low caste thinks himself to be low and pitiable; both of these states of mind are wrong because many times man has been born in high and low castes. Hence, one should not be proud of having been born in high caste and not feel low if born in low caste family.

Greatness has nothing to do with high caste. Man becomes great because of his noble work, exemplary character and becomes loathsome because of his immorality and evil conduct. Thus, it is his conduct only that decides his greatness or lowliness. Who does not know that high family born Ravana, Kansa, Duryodhana and others are censurable; whereas Metarya muni, Harikeshi muni and others, though born in low family, are venerable.

Then, what is the importance of high or low caste?


suhaani 2 years ago

Always remember one thing in ur life when u abuse any lower caste by saying dalit n chamaar then u abusing yourself n ur own religion..bcoz if u accepted that hindu religion is one n hindu religion devided into four community like:brahmin,kshatriya,vaishya,shudra…shudra means pure (pure from soul n heart)..then let me remind u fourth community also come under hindu religion they are also hindu to whom u abuse as dalit n chamaar…so you are not abusing them but abusing yourself n your own religion too..


suhaani 2 years ago

"The world as we have created it is a process of our thinking. It cannot be changed without changing our thinking."

Be a nice human being is important not to have a good or high religion and caste.We need to work towards uniting the nation instead of splitting it. Work towards a society in which there will be no lower castes and no upper castes. We need to respect the way people live instead of looking at where they were born.


suhaani 2 years ago

We always talk about religion and castesim but in reality there is no any caste and religion. We all are same our blood are same.then why we believe in discrimination. God never created any caste they made simple human being.. Mentally sick people take the path of fundamentalism and spread casteism and communism. They suffer from inferiority complex and divide the society into “we” and “they”. They (belonging either to higher or lower ranked caste) have a fear in their heart that if they do not get a higher place for themselves in society, “other” people are going to exploit them and going to put them down.They don’t have believe on themselves and their own work. They have doubt own their capability. People with negative mindset suffer from inferiority complex and divide society into compartments like higher castes or lower castes.and can’t tolerate “others” progress or well-being. They cannot work hard and cannot tolerate anybody else’s achievements. These are the people with negative mindset who believe in ranking some belonging to higher castes and/or some to lower castes. They are coward and they are unable to protect themselves…


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anjalichugh 2 years ago from New York Author

Hi Suhaani: I understand your pent up anger. If ever you want to talk to me, contact me thru Hubpages and I'll email back to you. Thanks for sharing your thoughts here.

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