Okay Liberals, Explain This...

It Must Be Magic!

Someone needs to do some splaining here huh? Yesterday, while we were munching burgers and fries at Five Guys, the Frog Princess and I were discussing current events and something relevant popped into my mind. I looked across the table and said, "Did you know that General Electric paid no corporate taxes, that's "zero" folks, on their US profits this past year?" A cloud came over her face and with a stern look she asked, "How?" You see, I'm much more of a news junkie than she is. Using the short reply form, "I replied that they were taking advantage of the tax loopholes that allows corporations to move their profits off-shore." I also told her that if the common man tried to do that we might end up doing time in The Big House.

I am hoping that anyone who reads this isn't a member of "The Feelings Preservation Society," a society that my old buddy "The Ground Squirrel" created. There is a chapter or two or three within that particular Society that is rather touchy about any criticism of Smirksalot and usually reverts to the "You lie, you lie" denial mode when it is leveled. I call them the "Adoring, Slobbering Love Affair" mob. If I hurt their feelings, I'm sorry (not really, I'm just funning you).

The first thing you need to understand is the relationship that exists between Smirksalot (Obama) and Jeffrey Immelt, the CEO of General Electric. To say they are tight is an understatement. He's one of the one's who just benefited from an all expense paid (tax payers paid for the trip) vacation to Brazil and various other South American locales with the Smirksalot entourage. He was part of said entourage. One needs to examine the tentacles of the octopus first to fully understand the nature of the beast. The liberal chant is "Tax The Rich, Tax The Rich!" There's more to the story than that. Part of the story can be found here at this video clip link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi2hxXO0_iQ

The following are "political tentacle" FACTS, not conjecture. You'll find, if you ever bother to read what I write, that I use facts quite frequently. If you doubt any of the facts I use then "Google" it and do the same research I do to obtain them. The use of an occasional link is good, but the use of too many becomes a bit of a distraction.

General Electric was a major campaign contributor to the Obama presidential run so that he could buy a bedroom in The Whine House. The figure is to the tune of $499,130.00. If one bothers to check, one would find that Smirky's campaign contributions from corporations were on the rather hefty side. The liberal crowd needs to understand how that works and examine reality rather than what comes out of the man's mouth. So what does that kind of money buy in The Land Of Smirksalot? Follow along now.

After spending like what seemed forever to shove health care reform down everyone's throats while the economy was burning, the emphasis turned to jobs. Jeffrey Immelt was rewarded in that arena under "The Jobs For Friends Program." He, in effect, has become The Whine House's Job's Czar. Is there a connection there, or am I just imagining things? Obama has given him a seat on his Economic Advisory Board and made him the chair of the newly created Council On Jobs And Competitiveness. These things are done through executive orders which, like all Czar positions, require no Congressional confirmation hearings. In fact, General Electric hasn't fared too well since Jeffrey took the helm, but that is another subject altogether. I just wanted to firmly establish the political connection as we proceed. It is there for all to see.

If one really researches the subject, it is astonishing to see how many of the bailouts we were all howling about have a GE tag on them. Money does buy influence, whether Congressional or Presidential. And Obamaites need to understand that their lily is of the gilded variety. Old Jeffrey and Smirky are as tight as two thieves.

So here's the rub and must surely be the answer to the Princesses question. Let me reiterate that GE is paying "zero" corporate income taxes for this past year. So let me rub another liberal wrong with this statement. Not only are they paying nothing into the coffers, but are receiving tax credits back in the amount of $3.2 billion. This is the second year in a row GE has paid nothing into the US Treasury at tax time. The prior year was because the US operations posted a loss of $408 million while it posted a profit of $10,8 billion on its overseas operations. Something smell fishy here to you by any chance?

This year the stockholders are a little more pleased. General Electric posted a worldwide profit of $14.2 billion, of which it derived a profit of $5.1 billion from US operations. Those are both tidy little sums so with a corporate tax rate of 35%, the second highest rate in the world, how is it this multi-national isn't paying a dime and getting away with it? Isn't that called tax evasion? Don't people go to the slammer for that? Doesn't seem fair, nor legal, does it?

It is legal though and money does buy power and influence. What do you think all those lobbyists are doing in the hallowed halls of Congress every day when they are in session besides drinking and eating up tax payer provided refreshments? Do you think they are making social calls to Smirky at The Whine House just for S & G's? Hardly. They are horse trading. You know the old tit for tat type of thing. You do this for me and I'll do this for you back scratching gig. While Obama says one thing to us, I am certain what is said behind our backs - out of ear shot - is quite different. He is a politician dear reader. Obviously, it isn't just the Republicans who are pro-business up there in Foggy Bottom.

Here's how things really work. In a filing right before the Japanese disaster, the company is in the nuclear reactor business mind you, they reported a tax burden of 7.4% on their US profits but there is a caveat attached to the report. That is "if," and only "if" it trots back any of those profits from overseas to US soil. I don't see that happening, nor should you. Keeping them off-shore, like they do many of the jobs Americans could be holding, effectively allows them to get money back from the US Treasury. Isn't that special?

Over the years GE has spent millions upon millions to curry favor in Washington, spreading the wealth among both political parties to buy its favorable tax position. Did they get a return on their investment. Well, DUH. Do you think that that GE backing Obama on The Cap & Tax proposal was just coincidental? Thank goodness and pass the mashed taters that that economic catastrophe wasn't pounded down our throats too. If you think it coincidental, look at GE's tentacles in the "green" industries. Stinks even more as I go along huh?

Oh it's all perfectly legal and GE's efforts have put them at an advantage over other multi-nationals that do business in the US. So in the future, rather than yell and scream about corporations needing tax hikes in order to milk their coffers, please look closely at who is doing what and who are "buddies" with whom.

Immelt has been appointed as the chair of Smirky's Council on Jobs And Competitiveness. Why don't we just appoint the fox to watch the hen house? Want a hot button? Obama has plans to have that same council "overhaul" the tax system regarding said system and corporations to make US corporations more competitive and bring back more jobs to our shores. In view of GE's record, do you think it very wise that the scoundrel who is now the CEO of General Electric should be sitting where he is that close to the President of the United States? Why not just force them to pay their "fair share?" Because what is being done is all perfectly legal. Yes indeedy do, money does buy influence. And also some of the finer things in life.

If you want your blood pressure to rise, read the in depth article that appeared in the New York Time's (of all newspapers) business section on March 24th. You can find it by putting "GE avoids taxes" in your search engine. The tentacles are much deeper than those I have outlined here but space constraints, being what they are, I will bid you ado. . Something just isn't right in Frog Town these days. Some wise liberal sage out there might make an attempt at explaining all of this on this administration's watch.

Have a nice day.

The Frog



More by this Author

  • "Ineptocracy" Is A Word
    18

    Ineptocracy is the new system of government that Obama-Biden ushered in. It is a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society...


Comments 109 comments

The Frog Princess profile image

The Frog Princess 5 years ago from Florence area of the Great Pee Dee of South Carolina

I am sure a liberal will say, "Its all Bush's Fault!" Now I plan to start my own little company and put all my copper pennies in some foreign bank just like GE does. Do you think I will get far with that? Why "No" only a free pass to the BIG HOUSE... I will NOT purchase another thing in my lifetime made by GE!


WillStarr profile image

WillStarr 5 years ago from Phoenix, Arizona

Corporate taxes are a scam. Corporations figure taxes as part of their overhead expenses and then adjust their prices to absorb the cost. They have to in order to maintain the profit margin that keeps them in business! In other words, the final consumers pay all corporate taxes by paying higher prices for their goods.

Those final consumers are you and me!

So when you have a smug politician pat you on the head and tell you he's increasing taxes on corporations, you know the smirking, lying, SOB is conning you...he's actually increasing YOUR taxes!

One accountant a few years ago crunched the numbers on the price of a new car and discovered that almost a third of the price was corporate taxation passed on to the consumer!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Will - Let me see if I got this straight. Is it your contention that a politician would lie? Is it in there somewhere that they think the average American is dumber than a box of rocks in Omaha?

Or is it just his way of pacifying a liberal who may not realize that any tax increases are going to passed onto the consumer and they, being sheeple sometimes, bite the hook on that?

ROTFLMAO


rkhyclak profile image

rkhyclak 5 years ago from Ohio

"Luuucy, you've got some 'splaining to do!" Is what ran through my head when I read the headline. Interesting, my husband and I were munching on some chili cheese fries at Skyline yesterday while discussing this load of horse crap. I agree with Princess, it will probably be a cold day in Hell before I make another GE purchase. It's incredible how much conning, thievery and scamming goes on in the white house, and that is just what we know about! There are deals going down everyday that lines pockets of the pres's chums while making the hole in the common citizens pocket bigger.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

rkhclak - What amazes me is when someone wants to try to defend something like this because that's a special deal for Obama and he's the POTUS now. It stinks to high heaven when I read that defense.


WillStarr profile image

WillStarr 5 years ago from Phoenix, Arizona

"Will - Let me see if I got this straight. Is it your contention that a politician would lie? Is it in there somewhere that they think the average American is dumber than a box of rocks in Omaha?"

Bingo!

And for those who stupidly demand that corporations be taxed, here's your sign!


TheManWithNoPants profile image

TheManWithNoPants 5 years ago from Tucson, Az.

Jim (frog)

Very well researched, and very well reported. I'm going to send you a link on G.E. that will turn this four star hub into a five star hub. I was using it in a hub I'm building out their in the "No Pants Shed" but I'm giving it to you, and I'll scrap that old project. I've got an idea on how to bring jobs and manufactoring back home, and I'll work on that instead.

Up, useful, and awesome!

jim


danthehandyman profile image

danthehandyman 5 years ago from Maryland

Corporate tax, personal tax, sales tax, and excise tax, plus fees, duties, and fines, are the only sources of government revenue. Governments produce nothing, they only take and redistribute.

All government revenue is ultimately paid by the consumer, as has been astutely mentioned by your readers, passed on through the price of goods, or directly taken from the consumer’s pockets.

Our government is spending $41,000 per American household each year, only $28,000 of that is funded by revenue, with $13,000 borrowed. GE’s pathetic $3 billion or so in avoided taxes amounts to $30 per household. GE’s tax avoidance is a problem, but it’s a pimple on a gnat’s butt. Scratching it will make you feel better for a second.

The problem is not “loopholes”, it is the amount of money the Federal government spends. There is no tax solution to the problem. If you agree all taxes ultimately pass through to the consumer, we need to raise the average household taxes to $41,000 a year, either directly or pass them through higher product prices.

But it does feel good to scratch when you itch. Your insights has put GE on my scratch list.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Dan - Lets do some math and make some assumptions. First, lets assume that GE has to pay the 35% corporate tax that this nation has.

Then take $5.1 billion and multiply it by 35%. The answer isn't $3 billion my friend. They ended up actually getting back $3.2 billion in tax credits. Something is wrong with that pic. My math isn't that fuzzy.


OpinionDuck profile image

OpinionDuck 5 years ago

Frog Prince

Congress, both parties have made the loopholes for taxes.

In fact, they are all contained in a single book. That book is called the IRC, the Internal Revenue Code.

In that book, corporations, and the wealthy can pick and choose their loophole, like they were choosing the meals at a fine restaurant.

The IRC has very little use for the average person because they don't have the wealth required to use them.

People that solely earn wages just don't have many options.

I would submit that abolishing the IRC would be the only answer to avoiding tax loopholes. I would then replace income taxes with a National Sales Tax, similar to most State Sales Tax. The mechanism is already there and the wealthy have to purchase things somewhere along the way.

We have thresholds for necessary products for the poor, and the tax doesn't require the full force of the IRS. The state agencies will do most of the work as they audit their own state sales tax.

Many bad corporate business decisions are done trying to elude or reduce taxes. Businesses have to run better without trying to touch the TAX bases, and passing these costs to the consumer.

The key to reducing taxes is reducing the size of government. Every government employee is a Tax Liability. Every government puchase or expenditute is also a Tax Liability. So reducing the government work force and scope of government reduces the Tax Liability.

The most creative ideas of Congress in the last fifty years can be found in the IRC.

my opinion...

Thanks


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

OD - We discussed just having a flat tax of 10% during lunch yesterday. That's 10% on Lotty, Dotty and everybody on any, and all, income they receive.

Of course, the 50% of the nation who pays "zero" now like GE doesn't want to hear anything about that. Being a business major, and now a businessman, I can relate to why many corporations have moved off shore.

First is the corporate tax structure. That is a major component of making location decisions at that level. The second is the cost of labor. Unions have contributed to corporations not wanting to put up with that crap. That's a reality and a flat tax, across the board seems like a fair way to tax the people and businesses who work here.

And you're right. We wouldn't need a monster like what we call the IRS now. That would save a bundle to. I'm just saying...


TheManWithNoPants profile image

TheManWithNoPants 5 years ago from Tucson, Az.

O.D.

I thought we were tight bro. I've been sending people to follow you, and you haven't showed up in the comments section of my hubs in a while. Shame on you. I might have to do a little duck hunting! (laughing)

Seriously, I hope things are well with you. Take care.

jim


danthehandyman profile image

danthehandyman 5 years ago from Maryland

"$3 billion or so" number I used was an out-of-my-butt number used to illustrate the scope of the real problem. By your math they are avoiding slightly less than $2 billion, and additionally are receiving, by your description, unearned credits of $3.2 billion, amounting to $5 billion in avoidance. All that to illustrate a $20 per household difference in a $41,000 per household problem? I don't think GE should avoid taxes or move jobs overseas, but the problem should be put into perspective.


Ms Dee profile image

Ms Dee 5 years ago from Texas, USA

Useful and further enlightening. Appreciate seeing these facts put together here! Sickened by what all this tells us.


34th Bomb Group profile image

34th Bomb Group 5 years ago from Western New York State

In all the years I've "known" you I've never "seen" you lie F.P.

I don't think anyone needs to make up crap about this crew-their "out there" behavior is bad enough you don't have to make it up. I think they REALLY don't get it.

Look what Smirky did just last week! Declares a War-all by his lonesome-had a super vacation with the unlovely wife & kids and mother-in-law (I think) then was praised by the MSM for cutting his trip SHORT to come back to Washington and WORK for a change. (It was cut by what - 2 1/2 hours? What a sacrifice!)

Gotta stop now FP - the B.P is rising again. And I don't want to miss the basketball.

Regards to your Princess - lucky lady!!


richard lloyd profile image

richard lloyd 5 years ago

Well, Frog Prince, you spent a lot of time giving one example of how politics works in America. I think most of us get it. By the way, as a first time reader of yours, I think using the cute nicknames and snide remarks only diminishes the quality of your remarks. But of course, that's just another aspect of politics as well...


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Richard - The remarks are facts and my sense of humor is what it is. I'm not too fond of politicians in light of them not representing the people rather than themselves. We've now been put in dire straits so yes, maybe I will make snide remarks about them. They have them coming.

I spend a considerable amount of time dissecting many aspects of politics. Maybe people will understand, maybe they will deny but the truth remains the truth. Thanks for stopping in.


caltex profile image

caltex 5 years ago

I never knew that a big corporation can post billions in profit, avoid paying taxes, and get tax credits on top of that. How absurd! I did google "GE avoids taxes" as you suggested and the strategy that stood out to me the most is this:

"-Greasing Palms

When GE needed to change Rep. Charlie Rangel's mind about support for a key tax break, it awarded $11 million to various schools in Rangel's district. Afterward, Rangel, who then headed the tax-writing Ways and Means Committee, pledged his support for the tax provision. He says the donation had no effect on his decision. Rangel has also been under intense scrutiny recently for ethics violations unrelated to GE."

Just imagine what GE will do on the next elections! What a scary thought!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

caltex - The article was rather long and detailed. The corruption, not to mention the graft, that has permeated itself into our government needs to be totally unmasked and some trials held where necessary.

It seems that "legal" bribery seems to get a wink and a nod huh?

The Frog


breakfastpop profile image

breakfastpop 5 years ago

Terrific research! The tax code needs a massive overhaul and it needs to be simplified. Frankly, fi it was fairer there would be more compliance and less evasion! Up and useful...


eovery profile image

eovery 5 years ago from MIddle of the Boondocks of Iowa

This is weird. I work for a foreign own company, and every time we do a cost justification and payback time on a project, we have to include the 40% on profits.

I do not see how corporations can get away without paying these taxes.

Keep on hubbing!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog,

Great post, and right on the money. I keep saying over and over again that the FIT is broken. There are too many loopholes, and too much outright cheating. GE may be an extreme case of loopholes, but the general concept applies throughout the land, both at the corporate and individual level.

A simple national sales tax on end consumer goods and services, in place of the FIT, would put an end to all this nonsense. Vendors of end use goods and services would simply pay a percentage of sales to Uncle Sam, and that would be it. No more cheating, no more avoidance, no more depression of business investment and jobs, etc. And we finally get tax simplification that doesn't make taxes more complex.

Stu


Writer David profile image

Writer David 5 years ago from Mobile, AL

If the press wasn't in the bag for Obama, they should be jumping all over this sweetheart deal with GE. There is a definite conflict of interest here. Why the hell isn't the Justice Department jumping into this? Oh wait...the Attorney General is Eric Holder. I just answered my own question. This makes me mad as hell and even more determined to see Obama kicked out of office in 2012.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

David,

Holder is a shill for Obama. Just look at all the major voter intimidation cases where Holder didn't even allow his own attorneys to investigate, let alone file charges. And what about all of Obama's unconstitutional EO's, which Holder refuses to challenge? Holder is a serial breacher of affirmative duty, and he should be fired. But don't expect Obie to do it.

Stu


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

This does make my blood pressure rise! Not only on the heels of tax time (gulp gulp) but I own a small business. I feel like small businesses are over taxed because we can't afford lawyers like the large corporations who can. It is awful - I had to pay more than $20,000 last year and I'm biting my nails waiting for the accountant to give me this years figure.

I can guarantee you I did not even make 1 million dollars - if I did I would owe 2 billion some how! Uggggggggg! I'm gonna put a shot of Baileys in my coffee now;)


vrajavala profile image

vrajavala 5 years ago from Port St. Lucie

Guess who got to go with the Pres to Brazil? Knelt, CEO if Westinghouse and Madeline Albright's investment group

http://www.michaelsavage.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE...


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

vtajavala - Only to mention a few more. Last night 60 Minutes ran a segment on this obvious tax dodge. They only lightly brushed on GE. There is a connection they missed, or maybe they didn't miss it atall.


OpinionDuck profile image

OpinionDuck 5 years ago

Frog Prince

Maybe you go put up a list of the top ten corporations like GE.

Thanks

~:}


vrajavala profile image

vrajavala 5 years ago from Port St. Lucie

I think Imelt is also the CEO of CNN.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

OD - I'm about to do another piece on GE and might include your suggestion. Good thinking. Thanks


GusTheRedneck profile image

GusTheRedneck 5 years ago from USA

Hi "Froggie" - 2012 cannot get here soon enough.

Gus :-)))


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Gus - This is going to turn into "The Mother Of All Battles" to right our country once again. I think we need to vote this time for some "real change."


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog - An idea on your article about big corporations. It would be great to expose the impact tariff policy has had on American workers. Large corporations bribe Congress to impose export tariffs that are completely non-retaliatory in nature. This is the price China and some other low wage countries exact for giving US corporations the privelege of setting up shop and using their cheap labor (export protection). If Congress eliminated export tariffs, except for cases of legitimate retaliation against countries that are protecting their own local businesses via import tariffs and direct subsidies, countries like China would toss us out, forcing American multinationals to hire more American workers.

Stu


Harvey Stelman profile image

Harvey Stelman 5 years ago from Illinois

Froggy, Sure they gave all that money, why else would B.O. be their buddy. Taxes, ha! They're the GREEN guys! H


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Harvey,

You're right. I've seen a few articles showing that CEO's with easy access to the WH, or that have received favorable legislative treatment, were important important corporate contributors to either Obama or his allies in Congress. I admit that I haven't read enough on this to make emphatic conclusions, but at first glance there does appear to be a pattern.

Stu


poorconservative1 profile image

poorconservative1 5 years ago

Man, oh man, Frog. I love the way you get people all fired up. Damn, I'm fired up. And I can't agree with GusTheRedneck more. 2012 cannot get here soon enough.

Thanks

Chuck


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

pc1 - The American people need to look behind the curtains a bit more and not DENY what they see when they are opened to let the light of day in. The failure to do both of those things, my friend, has led us to our present predicament. Either many are apathetic and keep their blinders in place, not bothering to look at all or they are just in true denial that made a mistake about trusting a politician.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Stu - Certain CEOs and Union Bosses are on the visitor logs for The Whine House quite frequently.

pc1 - The American people need to look behind the curtains a bit more and not DENY what they see when they are opened to let the light of day in. The failure to do both of those things, my friend, has led us to our present predicament. Either many are apathetic and keep their blinders in place, not bothering to look at all or they are just in true denial that they made a mistake about trusting a politician.


cjv123 profile image

cjv123 5 years ago from Michigan

I was aware of the relationship between Obama and GE's CEO but not some of these details. Thanks for the great and helpful info.

You're a talented writer Froggy! Glad you're here!


Pegasis 5 years ago

Doesn't this sound like GE and others jumped with both feet and a bunch of loopholes right into the EIOC notion that people with lots of kids can get bookoos of cash from the IRS--and never mind whether they ever paid any taxes to begin with?


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Pegasis - Taxes? Taxes are for the rich and poor old GE is living in poverty I assume.


junko profile image

junko 5 years ago

If GE has the same rights and more as any as any American citizen, according to the Supreme Court. Would it be too much Political and Economic power for such a small number of people? (People being American corporations) If they form a union of simular corporations enjoying simular loopholes will those with the gold rule? Good Hub, do it again.


Wayne Brown profile image

Wayne Brown 5 years ago from Texas

If it were not for our own stupidity as citizens, we might just be rioting in the streets over such things but Americans are far too busy with the "real issues" of why our country is going to he'll. Great piece of work Frog...and "hi" to the Princess!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Wayne - I just was reading this morning that the Obama's liberal backers are calling for the ousting of Immelt from the positions Obama has appointed him to. Gee! I wonder why?

BTW - Stop by my place when you can. We're having "Unkilled" Hamburgers for lunch. LMBO


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Frog - I'm paying GE's share again! I need to smarten up and keep reading your hubs. Thanks for educating me, I'm not very clever about the political arena. You have my attention!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

RHW - Please do. I aim to inform and while you're at it, stop by my place. We're having "Unkilled" Hamburgers for lunch. Bring your spurs!

The Frog


Harvey Stelman profile image

Harvey Stelman 5 years ago from Illinois

Froggy, I would say you have it all, but we know certain things are sealed. I'll bet it's with B.O.'s birth certificate. H


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Oh I was at school I missed your lunch hour! Darn, I'm starving too - I love red meat:-)!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog - Glad you're serving Unkilled Hamburgers; it's so much more humane to bite into a live animal. That quote from the Hamburger Hub was hilarious; do libby's REALLY think that meat at the grocery store didn't come from animals that were once alive? Maybe they think meat at the supermarket is an industrial product made in a factory like an automobile or a pharmaceutical. At any rate, I do enjoy my steak rare, so I will be stopping by for some Unkilled Hamburgers (and Killed Corn on the Cob). Stu


Stu From VT 5 years ago

RH - Killed or unkilled? Did you catch Frog's blog on that? Stu


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Hi Stu! I usually tell the waiter to just kill it for me, I love my steaks rare:)! I am going to look for the blog on it now. Thanks for the tip:)!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Housewife - Bon Appetite! LMAO


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

I actually was thinking about cooking up some bison burger tonight! Yum! The kids like it well done and they think it's hamburger:)


Stu From VT 5 years ago

RH - Great. I love my steaks rare too, but killed. Bison is a bit greasy; try some deer venison instead (much healthier).


AnnCee profile image

AnnCee 5 years ago from United States

The humor is a great aspect of your writing, Frog Prince. Trips up the mental "conditioning" and that's a good thing.


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

I have had venison before but they do not sell it here. I think that is illegal. I would have to procure my own and I would be a danger to myself and others with a rifle!! LOL!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

RH - you can buy it online (shipped via freezer truck). Stu


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

OOoOooh - I didn't think of that! You are so smart!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

RH - It's a little expensive due to the transportation cost, but it's really good. If you want I can provide a great link. Stu


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Sure send it over! Thanks I wonder if my husband would like it? Hmm...interesting when you've known someone for 20 years and you figure out you don't know something about them! Keeps life interesting!

Thanks again Stu!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

RH - Try out http://www.blackwing.com. Their food is GREAT!

Stu


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

RHW & Stu - A bit off topic for a while here. Maybe "Unkilled" Hamburger might be a better place for this discussion. I'm just saying...


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Oh your are so right Frog!


SheriSapp profile image

SheriSapp 5 years ago from West Virginia

Frog,

Magnificent hub and some really great comments to go along. You are such a welcome "newbie" here in hubworld. You are (to steal the words of another) a GREAT AMERICAN!!


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog, sorry, I'll create a Hub called "Killed Venison." :)


vettergt 5 years ago from Delaware

I was watching CNBC (owned by GE) the other day and the reason they gave for the no taxes is all of the money they lost on GE Capital with the mortgage meltdown allowed them to write off their profits. Even if I bought this, when I lost money on an investment, the tax code only allowed me to write off $3,000 per year and furthermore I still ended up paying taxes. I have said this before, we in America have the best politicians that money can buy.


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

I'm just watching and learning Frog.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

RHW - Please check this out for me. I'm in your corner dear. Believe that.

http://hubpages.com/politics/Shut-Er-Down

The Frog


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Vettergt - "we in America have the best politicians that money can buy" - and they say American productive capability is sinking. Where else could you source such greedy Congressmen? I think things are on the upswing. :)


LRCBlogger profile image

LRCBlogger 5 years ago

Frog, that is a great job. I'm considered a 'liberal' on hubpages but I consider myself to be moderate. I have the exact answer for you: Both sides are owned by those who fund their campaigns. Bribery is legal in politics, it is 'pay to play.' I've long pushed for the "fair elections now act" which would remove the conflict of money in politics. I wonder how much McCain also raised from GE? Congress does not vote in the best interest of the people, they pledge to vote a certain way (As dictated by a special interest or corporation) and are rewarded with campaign contributions once they fulfill their pledge.

It is terrible that this is allowed to go on. I will say this, the "Fair Elections Now Act" had 152 Democratic co-sponsors and only 2 Republicans. The Disclosure Act was also filibustered by Republicans. Both sides are guilty but there are a considerable amount of Dems trying to change the corrupt system (Remember the GOP touting earmark reform before the election? That went very quiet since they regained some power in congress)

I'm a follower, great hub.


RealHousewife profile image

RealHousewife 5 years ago from St. Louis, MO

Ha! I did check that out! I'm following your trail!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

LRC - According to this link GE contributed $1,000.00. How generous of them.

http://query.nictusa.com/pres/2007/Q2/C00430470/A_...

McCain accepted federal money, which Obama initially siad he would then reneged on that promise. That should have gotten people's attention but it didn't.

My proposal is to ban all lobbyists from the Halls of Congress - period. The earmark issue was raised. The House Republicans won't let them in a bill from what I understand. The Senate is a different animal with RINOs like Murkowski pitching a hissy fit about them.

Obama said he wouldn't sign any bill that included them and he has signed every bill that included them.

We need to return representation to the common man as the founding fathers envisioned representation. Many of them up there are career criminals who chose politics as their criminal endeavor.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

LRCBlogger,

The DISCLOSE Bill violated the First Amendment, and offered exemptions to unions, stated big liberal groups, and the NRA (the latter in exchange for agreeing not to fight it and an offer of a new federally funded NRA gun range in the west).

Stu


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Stu - The NRA also endorsed Harry Reid which threw me off their rolls.

Heston must of rolled over in his grave.


LRCBlogger profile image

LRCBlogger 5 years ago

Frog, ban all lobbyist? I'm on your side man! I would def support that.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

LRC - The corruption in Congress emanates from the vermin who hang out in the hallways. LMAO.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog, I didn't know about the Reid connection, but it doesn't surprise me. Basically, Obama was terrified the NRA could get its millions of members to complain to Congress and derail the bill, which is why he bribed them not to. Maybe endorsing Reid was part of the bargain.


LRCBlogger profile image

LRCBlogger 5 years ago

Stu, you peaked my curiosity. How does the disclose Act violate the 1st ammendment??? The disclose Act requires public politicians who run public campaigns and take public financing to disclose who gave them money. Not sure how that would violate the 1st ammendment?

I'm not sure why 100% of Americans would want to know who is buying their politicians?


Stu From VT 5 years ago

LRCBlogger,

There are two issues:

(1) The First Amendment guarantees freedom of expression. Very often major political donors wish to maintain their anonymity. The Disclose Bill would thus interfere with a guaranteed freedom under the Bill of Rights.

(2) The Disclose Bill contained numerous exemptions: all unions, major named liberal political groups, and the NRA (which was "bought out" to prevent it from agitating its millions of members from complaining to Congress and derailing the bill). Thus, the Disclose Bill was highly discriminatory in that it focused on inhibiting conservative free speech only.

It was right and proper that this bill failed in Congress, as it not only violates the Bill of Rights, but it does so in a discriminatory manner.

Stu


LRCBlogger profile image

LRCBlogger 5 years ago

Stu, let me give you some examples to clarify because I honestly do not think you understand the Disclose Act. The Citzens v United ruling allowed corporations to spend their own money on political campaign ads. The Disclose Act requires these corporations to be identified in their ad so they can't run misleading ads. In simple terms, corporations have to disclose that they paid for the ads. It also required shareholder approval if the company is publicly traded.

Secondly, the disclose act exempted non profits above a certain size which included the Chamber of Commerce. As you should know, the chamber is the largest non profit spender on campaign funding and is a completely pro conservative organization.

An argument against the disclose act is an argument that corporations should be allowed to run political ads (for or against a candidate or law) without having to disclose who created the ad. You are also arguing that it is a violation of that corporations free speech. So corporations have the same rights as individuals?

Ask yourself this question: Who is telling you that the law violates first ammendment rights? Is it constitutional scholars or is it politicians who will benefit from the political spending?


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

LRC - In many cases, corporations are treated as an individual. Consult an attorney about the details. They have the same rights as an individual as affirmed by SCOTUS. The Disclose Act was a very poor attempt to circumvent that ruling.


vettergt 5 years ago from Delaware

I wonder what our founding fathers would say about this. Think about the bi-cameral houses in which one is based on population and one is based on everyone getting the same. States like Rhode Island knew that if all decisions were based on might makes right (those with the most population always win) then that state would be at an unfair advantage to states like New York and Penn. So, they compromised and devised a system of checks and balances. We also have an electoral college that helps ensure the Presidential votes in Wyoming, Alaska, SD, and ND are important too. Otherwise, if you could carry California, New York, Illinois, Penn, Michigan, and Ohio (6 of the top 8 most populous states and generally blue) then you may not need much more so promise the moon to those states and the rest get the shaft. (If the discrepancy is too large, families would have left the shafted states of America for the most favored states of America - you know, free market and then this problem would have widened further).

Why do I bring this up. The system of checks and balances in which we rely to make sure not one person becomes all powerful could go by the wayside if companies like CATerpillar with its $41 Billion in profits from just this past year can make it rain with cash on the politicians with this legalized quid pro quo. (If CAT did not get something out of the deal, do you think they or anyone else would spend their money, opps, I meant invest their money, in that way.)


Stu From VT 5 years ago

LRCBlogger,

Essentially, you are right about the two issues of law cited. Citizens United held that corporate, individual, and other entities may exceed FEC limits applicable to PAC contributions, as long as they don't coordinate their activities with any political campaign team. The Disclose Bill would have required disclosure of major contributors to political media buys had it passed into law.

If you read the precise list of exemptions built into the Disclose Bill, you will find FAR more liberal groups exempted than conservative.

Corporations are legal entities. They have some, but not all, rights that individuals have. The court clearly ruled that freedom of expression is a right that corporations do have.

The First Amendment guarantees freedom of expression to all, as long as it is not slanderous or inciting to crime. Both the Disclose Bill if passed, and an opposite decision in Citizens United, would have placed unconstitutional constraints on the exercise of the First Amendment. The clear intent of the Disclose Bill (discriminatory disclosure rules), and the regulatory decisions (discriminatory soft money rules) overturned by Citizens United, was to make it easier for Obama to be reelected in 2012. Obama was basically trying to rig the 2012 political media war in his favor via law and regulation. In simple terms, he was trying to censor opposition speech. He failed in both cases. In Citizens United, the SCOTUS thwarted him on correct constitutional grounds. In the case of the Disclose Bill, massive grassroots complaints to Congress (emails, faxes, phone calls) scared them into dropping it; had it passsed, I believe the federal court system would have vacated it anyway on challenge (First Amendment violation).

Stu


Stu From VT 5 years ago

vettergt,

Originally, the Senate was chosen by state legislators, but the Constitution was later changed so that Senators were chosen by popular vote. In colonial times, many states wanted to ensure adequate representation in Congress as a condition for joining the union. This demand was met in part by having Senators chosen by state legislators. The amendment stripped the states of any federal representation (other than ratification of constitutional amendments, which now is almost a meaningless thing, since the federal government routinely passes laws and issues EO's that violate the enumerated powers clause of the Constitution, and the federal courts almost always uphold the violations on challenge).

Stu


Texasbeta 5 years ago

Do you really think this just started? Obama did it huh? Get a clue buddy. Go look up Google, Exxon during its days, Enron back in the day...seriously man, get a clue. This isn't new. BTW - go look at each stipulation that allows companies like GE to avoid taxes, and then look up who proposed and who voted for them. THEN, come and tell me that liberals need to explain it. I think you'll be surprised...that is if you actually do it.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Since we're not talking about back in the day, try catching up.


Texasbeta 5 years ago

Oh, okay...so history started with Obama. Got it. Thanks. If you have to ignore the history of the world in order to attack Obama, do you see a problem with that? I doubt it really.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Listen closely since I can't use sign language here. This Hub is about Obama. Stay on tpoic and everything will be just peachy keen.

If you want to add something then add something besides a history lesson. We all know what has happened in the past and it is never an excuse for the current situation.

Now do you get it?


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Texasbeta,

In furtherance to FP's response, nobody is saying Obama didn't inherit a mess. But his job is to fix problems, not make them bigger. He's accelerated an already intolerable debt, cost us almost all our allies, weakened national security, and decimated the Constitution.

BTW, are you REALLY from Texas? Here in VT when I have a TPM meeting, I look in a mirror and talk to myself. Maybe we should swap locales.

Stu


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Stu - I reckon if the guy wants to talk about history he can join or 10th Amendment series, read Part 1 and 2 and get up to speed for when we proceed.


nicomp profile image

nicomp 5 years ago from Ohio, USA

All this fuss over GE's tax bill makes for good fodder on both liberal and conservative blogs, but it's actually a good thing. Corporations shouldn't pay any taxes.

Whining about this (entirely legal) attempt by GE to avoid paying taxes distracts from real problems, like the deficit. It's simply another "tax the rich" mantra, but both sides can sing it this time.

Taxes on corporations are hidden taxes on citizens. When a company turns a profit, that money goes back into the economy in the form of stock dividends, capital expenditures, and *job creation*.

Job creation.

Companies don't stick their profits into mattresses, unless they own a mattress factory. Even if they hoard it in the bank, it's loaned out to people for mortgages and starting businesses. Why in the world do we want Washington to have it? As corrupt as GE is, they have a clearer idea of how to spend money than Congress does.

We all take every tax break that our 1040 allows. GE is no different and they have my congratulations for beating the system. If I could pay no taxes and remain out of jail, yippee.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

nicomp - Yes, it does indeed detract from the real problem. Here's an excellent analysis of how deep the problem is.

Check it out please.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Lets-Regress


nicomp profile image

nicomp 5 years ago from Ohio, USA

"How exactly did he decimate the Constitution, destroy our allegiances and weakened our national security?"

Seriously?? You actually have to ask?

1. Steamrolling bondholders when Chrysler and GM were nationalized.

2. Picking winners and losers by enabling "Cash for Clunkers"

3. Forgetting to roll back portions of the Patriot Act as he 'promised' to do during his campaign.

Address these and I'll provide more...


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Texasbeta - I've been writing on blogs for quite some time. The primary rule of commenting is to stay on topic. I won't warn you again - ever.

You're about to be dismissed for not staying on topic. Your bad, not anyone else's. If you want to write about something you prefer to talk about then do so. If not, then stay on topic.

nicom p - He wouldn't dare to go near my "Not Another Broken Promise" article. The video of Obama speaks for itself. This guy is total denial that he made a mistake when he voted for this fraud.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Texasbeta,

American corporate revenues are growing due to overseas operations, not domestic activity.

The stock market is irrelevant; it's as much a measure of investor gloom or exuberance as it is business fundamentals.

How can the economy be fine when 10% of Americans are looking for work, and another 10% are underemployed or have given up looking?

You need to do more reading. A boatload of Obama bills, EO's, and regulations are in violation of the Bill of Rights (especially the Tenth Amendment), posse comitatus, and constitutional Articles regarding Congressional voting rules. Read about the Disclose Bill, the Federal HC Act, the BATFE AG Firearms Denial plan, the Governor's Conference EO, the internet Kill Switch and Net Neutrality strategems, extension of expiring provisions of the Patriot Act, and the granting of FOIA exemption to Interpol. Bear in mind that this is just a TINY SAMPLE of Obama's crass disregard for both the Constitution and federal law.

Obama's abject refusal to support the fight against Shiite terror has cost us Israel and Central Europe as allies. Further, Obama reneged on an ABM promise to Southern Europe, costing us our allies there as well. All we have left now is England, and they are decimating their defense capabilities due to budget woes. Militarily, the US is now completely isolated.

The above loss of allies, absence of border protection, permitting Shiite groups to operate paramilitary camps on US soil, hiring Islamics with ties to radical Islamic groups to sensitive administrative positions, and singing a new START Treaty that favors Russia over the US all weaken our national security.

I take issue with your implying that mainstream conservatives are reactionaries. We are to the left of libertarians, who themselves are hardly extremists. You seem to be implying that anything to the right of centrism constitutes being part of a secessionary posse.

Stu


Stu From VT 5 years ago

nicomp - Thank you for adding some sanity here. Stu


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Texasbeta,

"Obama hasn't refused to support the fight against terrorists, he has stepped up the campaign. The arrests, the kills, the missions, and the drone bombings have all increased under Obama when compared to Bush. That is a fact and easily checked." - What I said was that Obama has defunded the fight against SHIITE terror. I know he's fighting SUNNI terror.

"The ABM didn't cost allies. That is a lie! Poland and the Czechs aren't happy, but they'll deal with it" - That is pure nonsense. We've PROVEN that we are completely unreliable allies. Southern desparately wanted these defenses because Putin is exercising expansionist muscle (e.g., Georgia).

"The idea that you can claim we are losing allies, when you supported Iraq and how that was handled is hilarious." - We ARE losing allies because of all the reasons I stated. I NEVER supported the Iraq invasion. Iraq certainly deserved a REPRISAL because they were violating the UN peace accords from the first Iraq war (no-fly zone, chemical weapons, inspection refusals), but toppling the whole government was not called for.

"BATFE AG Firearms Denial plan - nothing exists by that name" - I don't know the formal name for the proposed bill, but Obama floated a proposal to allow AG Holder to UNILATERALLY deny any firearm application, for ANY reason he saw fit, and if you challenged the denial in court, Holder would be premitted to enter REDACTED evidence. This violates the right to bear arms, as well as the right to confront your accuser (both rights being guaranteed in the Bill of Rights).

"The Governor's Conference EO - means nothing. Did you just put words together on this?" The Governor's Conference EO is an end run around posse comitatus. It provides for ten selected governors to develop a blueprint for the use of the military on US soil should Obama, in his sole discretion, decide it's appropriate. While the Governor's Conference EO itself is not unconstitutional, as it does not directly grant anyone any actual powers, once the president decides to utilize the blueprint, the follow-up EO to execute the blueprint would violate posse comitatus (this law forbids the use of the US military on US soil, except to the very limited extent provided for in the Constitution).

"How about wiretapping without a warrant? Lying us into a war? The Patriot Act itself?" - The Patriot Act violates the First, Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendments. It should be repealed. It's true that Bush created this hideous law, but when three provisions came up for extension earlier this year, Obama chose to extend rather than expire. Obama is as guilty as Bush here.

"The stock market doesn't matter? Tell that to the states who having actually pay for their state pensions because they invested it into the toxic CDOs, which were marked triple A due to bribes so the states could invest in them?" - My meaning was that the level of the stock market is not a reliable measure of national financial health, because it is driven as much by investor emotion as business performance.

"Tell me, do you think he caused that 10%, when he took office and we were losing 700,000 jobs a month?" - There is so much blame here nobody gets a pass. The Clinton era CRA forced banks to issue bumb loans, and Freddie/Fannie to insure them at inadequate premium rates. Bush failed to enforce bank risk regulations. Greenspan kept interest rates so low he created a real estate pricing bubble. Obama's bailouts were so generous they will encourage banks to be sloppy again (grow like crazy via crappy underwriting to pump up your bonuses, defer the losses by posting inadequate reserves, and when it all collapses again, just get another bailout). Home buyers are also guilty, as they paid far more than intrinsic replacement cost for homes after the bubble grew, and financed them with ARM's; when the ARM's reset, they couldn't pay the bills.

Stu


34th Bomb Group 5 years ago

Long story short?

The rest of the world is laughing at us. The United States of America - the world's last, best hope has been decimated in 2 and 1/2 years. NO ONE respects us. How could they with that nincompoop in office?

We are alone - and with more time passing, very few nations are going to feel compelled to help us because we helped them 70 years ago.

It's beyond my understanding that this man has devastated my country in so short a time.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Stu - We can kiss Texasbeta goodbye.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Frog - did you block him? Does Hub let you do that?


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Stu - No block necessary. I just make his comments go POOF! Another method of troll be gone. He has worn out his welcome with his outrageous comments.


Stu From VT 5 years ago

Gotcha, that should send him a message.


Wayne Brown profile image

Wayne Brown 5 years ago from Texas

That is the very reason that we cannot get a "transactional tax" structure in place in America. GE is praticing the old adage...keep your friends close and your enemies even closer. If this does not smell like dead fish in the liberal camp where tax and spend is the battle cry, I don't know what it will take. Thanks for a good one, Frog. WB


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

Wayne - Amazing that GE paid no taxes at all plus received $3.2 billion in tax credits. We should be so lucky huh?


nicomp profile image

nicomp 5 years ago from Ohio, USA

@The Frog Prince : And may I assume that you took no tax credits or deductions against your federal filing?

Just teasing!


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

I take whatever my CPA says I can take my friend. I definitely didn't move any money off shore.


GNelson profile image

GNelson 5 years ago from Florida

I don't think that this is a lib/con thing. A rip-off is a rip-off and GE didn't just start this. I do think it is an American thing and as an American it pisses me off. You are right if you tried it they would lock you up.


The Frog Prince profile image

The Frog Prince 5 years ago from Arlington, TX Author

GNelson - The reason for the headline is obvious. Immelt is Obama's good buddy. He's sitting up there on his council on improving the economic outlook of this nation. It's another case of taking care of those big campaign

contributors while the rest of the tax payers take it in the shorts.


Harlan Colt profile image

Harlan Colt 5 years ago from the Rocky Mountains

Problem is not enough American's care enough (yet) to make it work, and that is why they have us by the frog jibblets.

Great hub Froggy...

- Harlan

    Sign in or sign up and post using a HubPages Network account.

    0 of 8192 characters used
    Post Comment

    No HTML is allowed in comments, but URLs will be hyperlinked. Comments are not for promoting your articles or other sites.


    Click to Rate This Article
    working