The Evolution of Evolution

Darwin

In my  opinion Darwin was not evil, he was just wrong! (He makes a nice statue though)!
In my opinion Darwin was not evil, he was just wrong! (He makes a nice statue though)! | Source

And now a word from my sponcer...(Just kidding)!

Java Man-I do not know HOW the evolutionist figured out he liked COFFEE but they are the experts!

The suposed missing link...Hay if he is "missing" then why don't I see his peicture on some milk cartons?
The suposed missing link...Hay if he is "missing" then why don't I see his peicture on some milk cartons? | Source

Descent with Modification

Here I go with a subject that seems to be all the rage right now on Hubpages, Darwinism, evolution and Atheism. It should prove to be a fun ride, even wilder than my hub I wrote entitled “Adolph Hitler,Creationist or Darwinist?” Nether one of these articles would have been written if I did not read a hub by Magnolazz called “Why Hitler loved Darwin. Not that these subject have not crossed my mind as possible subjects to write about, they were just not priorities.

When I was sixteen years old, I started what I now call my “shaking my fist at God faze” that lasted up until about the year 2001. It was during that time that I was first introduced to the concepts of Evolution and Charles Darwin. Being very much into nature I was fascinated by this amazing scientist, for I found both South America and the Galapagos Islands as places I always fantasized about traveling to. Even in saying this, I was never able to wrap my mind around the theory of evolution. The reason why, was that I could not comprehend how something could come out of nothing! I know lot evolutionists out there are probably ready to scream at me, that it is more complicated than that. Yes this is true, for the concept of life evolving is by no means simple.

This fact alone was one of the reasons I had such a problem with the theory in the first place! There are just too many things that have to be right for life to happen the way that evolution claims that it has happened. This was a big dilemma for me, because I had also turned my back on Genesis’s account of creation. Nether beliefs made much sense to me which may explain why I started my involvement in the Occult and Shamanism. Even when I became a Satanist I was troubled by the words of Anton LayVay (the founder of the Church of Satan) who claimed that man created God and not the other way around.

This one simple statement took me on an exhausting search to achieve an understanding of just how man created God. Another way of putting it would be to say that I was obsessed with understanding how all these different cultures and religions throughout the history of civilization came to believe in God or gods. There were just too many similarities in the creation “myths” of different religions for there not to be a connection between them. I state this for I want to make it clear that I am not the kind of person who is comfortable in playing “follow the leader.” If I reach a certain conclusion on something, it was usually after turning over as many “stones” of information I could find.

Enough about me and my excessive compulsive tendencies; instead, let us go hut down that elusive animal known as “the truth!” Unfortunately, one man’s truth is another man’s lie; for no matter how clear one fact may be to one person, to another it absolute garbage! With this in mind, let us sneak back into the pass so we can spy on the very beginning of the concepts of evolution.

The seeds that sprouted into evolution did not begin with Darwin or other scientist of his time. It was instead a popular theory with Greeks that was eventually referred to as “Descent with Modification.” This concept is that the parents of any given species will transfer its traits to its offspring. Some of these Greek philosophers developed ideas that have comparable concepts to modern scientist. For example, Thales Mietus and one of his students Anximander, considered a philosophy that all life evolved from the ocean. Anximander even claimed that men morphed from fish into men who lost there scales once they came onto land. Then a man named Emedocles (493-435 BC) was even known as the “father of evolutionary naturalism.” When you think about it, even the perspective of reincarnation could be considered “spiritual evolution” that claims that one can become God like after “eons” of lifetimes.

I now want to jump ahead to the late 1700’s and 1800’s when there was an increase in scientist considering the view of evolution. Two of the most notable were Carolus Linnaeus a Swedish Botanist who wrote 180 books! He was a Christian and Creationist who is said to have been perplexed by the fact that he could create hybrids by cross- pollination. Another important influence in the developing of theories was Emanuese Darwin, the grandfather of Charles Darwin. This man was a physician and an armature scientist who wrote an obscure publication known as the Laws of Organic Life (1794-1796). Being a man who had doubts about the truth behind the views of Creationist, Emanuese may have had strong influence on his grandson forming his own theories.

I will not spend a lot of time and space in this writing about Charles Darwin, for there have been some great hubs already written on this man. This instead is an overview of his life and his conclusions. Like I stated earlier, Darwin journey on the H.M.S. Beagle inspired the insights that would supply the information for him to write The Origin of Species. This event set things in motion for him to become a major influence in the world of Science. It is interesting to note, that there are other key players in Darwin coming up with his theories. One of these men was Thomas Matlthus who Darwin had this to say about his work:

"In October 1838, that is, fifteen months after I had begun my systematic inquiry, I happened to read for amusement Malthus on Population , and being well prepared to appreciate the struggle for existence which everywhere goes on from long- continued observation of the habits of animals and plants, it at once struck me that under these circumstances favorable variations would tend to be preserved, and unfavorable ones to be destroyed. The results of this would be the formation of a new species. Here, then I had at last got a theory by which to work". Charles Darwin, from his autobiography. (1876)

Matlthus believed that poverty and famine were a natural occurrence designed to control over population. However, he also felt that God allowed these disasters to happen to prevent humans from becoming lazy. Another major influence was Alfred Russe Wallace who wrote a paper entitled: On the Tendency of Variations to Depart indefinitely from the Original Type.” This man was a Naturalist who worked in Malaysia and wrote the paper while hallucinating from a fever induced by Malaria. This was intimidating to Darwin who had spent twenty years coming up with comparable conclusions. In the end, both scientists were awarded equal credit. Darwin’s paper On Origin Of Species spawned the book The Origin of Species that was published in November 24, 1859. The conclusions in the book are as follows:

  • ·Natural Selection ultimately produces evolution
  • ·The vast variety of living creatures are a natural outgrowth of the vast ways to live within the environment, or niches that organisms can occupy.
  • ·A species ability to adapt is the essence of evolution.

Because of Darwin’s early days as a Christian and the fact that his wife remained a Christian until her death, there were rumors spread that he recanted his beliefs and returned to Christianity shortly before his own death. These rumors has been spread in part because of the accounts of a woman know as Lady Hope. Even though there became evidence that there was indeed a woman that went by the name of Lady Hope who may have even visited Charles Darwin towards the end of his life, there is no proof that Darwin recanted his views. In fact, in the website Christ Apologetics and Research the President and Founder of this organization Matt Slick makes the following statement concerning Lady Hope’s account:

“We would have liked to conclude that, on balance, her account is truthful, but there is also much against it, and we cannot come to a firm conclusion either way. Whichever side is right, it leaves unanswered questions on the other side. We have presented the evidence for and against, and must leave the reader to decide. No doubt, as ever, the prejudices and bias with which each one comes to this controversy may have already predetermined the result of their conclusions.”

Even Darwin’s wife denied these accusations, so I doubt that this was the case. After all, the fact that she was a Christine would make you think if it was true she would have said so. I also want to say that I am amazed by those who viewed Darwin as evil for coming up with the hypothesis that he other scientist reached. This is like saying that Einstein was evil for his work with nuclear energy. This man spent his life analyzing and observing nature. He did not come to a conclusion until he investigated it as extensively as possible. Personally I admire the man for his courage in going in the direction he felt the evidence pointed. I disagree with his overall findings and yet, I also disagree that creation has not gone through a form of transformation to adept to life though God’s will. It was no accident; it was the way God allowed it to happen!


The Eighth wonder of The World? OR just a extinct type of Lemur?

Oh how the mighty have fallen...once , not that long ago, the media and some over excitable scients claim THIS was "THE" missing link and yet, new evidance has shown....
Oh how the mighty have fallen...once , not that long ago, the media and some over excitable scients claim THIS was "THE" missing link and yet, new evidance has shown....

Living Lemurs

"Ida's' great, great,great,great,great,great,grandchild!
"Ida's' great, great,great,great,great,great,grandchild!

Another look at this find going beyound all the hype.

Playing footsy with the Dinosours!

Creationest say these are reall and evolution say "bullsnot!" so around and around it goes were it  will stop GOD only knows!
Creationest say these are reall and evolution say "bullsnot!" so around and around it goes were it will stop GOD only knows!

Personaly I never wanted to date a carbon, but to each thier own!

The Oldest Human Teeth in the World?

This throws a "boner" into past  theories  that the oldest living humans came from Africa! Oh no, they have to rewrite the textbooks AGAIN!
This throws a "boner" into past theories that the oldest living humans came from Africa! Oh no, they have to rewrite the textbooks AGAIN!

Here a hoax, there a Hoax, Everywere a Hoax!

Okay, now let’s go study the evidence supporting evolution OR creation. This part of my research has been so frustrating because both sides of the argument about how life begun seem to love to accuse each other of producing hoaxes! On one hand you got your absolute frauds that both sides agree are frauds like Piltdown man that was considered the real McCoy for 41 years! Then in 1921, the Nebraska Man was created out of”the evidence” of a single tooth. Until that is, six years later when more bones were discovered and found to be an extinct American wild pig! Then, what some consider some of the best argument for the missing link, Java man who was discovered 1891 by Eugene Dubois. He was determined to prove Darwin’s theories and sure enough, after extensive searching though the caves in Indonesia, he found a skull cap, three teeth and femur bone. In fact one was that of an Orangutan.

After this there was the Orce Man, which was only a skull fragment, discovered in 1982 in a small town in Spain that may have even been a skull of a 4 month old donkey! Scientist however, quickly point out that a fragment of a skull that small would be hard to determine its origin. Then why would they rush to the conclusion that it was an important find in the first place? Maybe it is the product of my cynical mind that finds amusement from the fact that BOTH EVOLUTIONIST AND CREATIONIST LOVE to spin the facts in what ever way that fits there agenda! Then there is the group that believes that the “proof” points to us humans being the science experiment of “bug eyed aliens” who are shouting as loud as they can “YOU ARE BOTH WRONG!”

Even with “Ida” that created such media hype with all the special features scientists have been looking for to “link” it all together, there are indications of exaggerations and jumping to conclusions. What I am referring to is the latest “so called” missing link. This is a fossil of a lemur-like primate that was at first was thought to satisfy the quest for that oh so elusive piece to the evolutionary puzzle. The scientific classification that was given it was Darwinius masillae (to honor Darwin) . This prize fossil was unearthed by an amateur fossil hunter in a swamp, known as the Messel Pit right outside of Frankfurt Germany.

This lucky hobbyist kept his find under-wraps for twenty six years and this specimen was finally sold for one million dollars. It was first hailed as “the eighth wonder of the world“however, it may end up falling in ranks and many scientist believe that it is not even an ancestor to the “higher primates” (like monkeys, apes and humans, at least as far as evolutionist are concerned). The reason for this possible change in status is that a long lost relative of Ida has just recently been discovered. This fossil was found in Egypt and has been given the scientific name Afradapis longicristatus. The team that discovered this fossil was lead by Dr. Erik Sciffert who is connected to Stony Brook University.

Another palaeoanthropologist Christopher Beard, who hails from Carnegie Museum of Natural History in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, who was not involved in either research team, (the ones who claim she is the missing link or those who say she is from another “branch” of evolution) makes this statement: "Ida is as far away from the human lineage as you can get and still be considered a primate.” Personally I feel the whole debate about what classification “Ida” or any other fossil belongs with is both healthy and important aspect of science. I am glad to see that even evolutionist scientist have different opinions on this subject and it is not just the Intelligent Design group and the evolutionist who are at odds.

Now I would like to observe yet another type of fossil evidence. This is the “so called” discovery of human and dinosaur prints that has been debated or down right dismissed as fraud. It started in Paluxy River Texas, after an event called “The Great Flood of 1908” by the locals. This event was said to expose not only the prints of dinosaurs but also large human footprints. There has been evidence that some of the “human foot prints” that were sold during the 1930’s were carved and yet, there are many more of these human looking footprints that are right among the obviously three-toed dinosaur prints. Over the years more and of these possible human tracks have been reported even as late as 1982, when it was finally decide that all of the prints were in fact dinosaur tracks that has just been eroded to the point that they appeared to be large human tracks.

However, this is not the only place that claims are made that dinosaur tracks have been found in along with human tracks. In fact there are much more evidence that threatens the conclusions evolutionist have reached. Here is just a fraction of the evidence evolution chose to ignore:

  • Human and dinosaurs tracks claimed to be found in area known as Turkmenistan (within the territory of the old USSR and was reported in 1983 in Moscow News (No. 24, page 10). Even so, there seems to be a lack of photographic evidence.
  • Similar claims have been made for British Columbia in place known as Cretaceous Drunuegan Formation. The pictures I have seen have been some what vague…so I can see why this has been disputed.
  • Claim of tracks in Tuba City Arizona (I will supply links)
  • In 1990 a Tyrannosaurus Rex was found in the U.S. and was being moved to Montana State University. One of the leg bones had to be moved by helicopter, and to reduce the weight it was cut into two pieces. The bone was still largely hollow and not filled up with minerals as is usual. Scientists used chemicals to dissolve the bony matrix, revealing the soft tissue still present. Inside they discovered the remains of red blood cells--something that should be impossible if the bone was millions of years old. Paleontologist Mary Schweitzer, who made the discovery in Montana, exclaimed: "Finding these tissues in dinosaurs changes the way we think about fossilization, because our theories of how fossils are preserved don't allow for this."
  • Skeletons of ten perfectly modern humans have been excavated from fifty eight feet down in the Dakota Sandstone, over an area spanning about 50 by 100 feet. This formation is a member of the Lower Cretaceous, supposedly 140 million years old. It is known for its dinosaurs and is the same formation found at Dinosaur National Monument. At least four of the ten individuals are female. One is an infant. Some of the bones are articulated. Some are not, appearing to have been washed into place. No obvious tools or artefacts were found associated with the bones. The bulldozer driver who uncovered the first bones in 1971 expresses certainty that there were no tunnels or cracks in the extremely hard overlying layers of rock. The bones are partially replaced with malachite (a green mineral) and turquoise, thus appropriately named "Malachite Man".

Then you have conflicting information concerning the fossil record. For example, the Coelacanth that was originally considered the missing link between fish and amphibian until it was found alive and well in 1938. In fact the latest one was caught in 1998 in Indonesia. It so sad that the evolutionist had to loose one of there “prim examples” of evolution that was once considered an “index” fossil which means that it would define a certain geological period in evolution.

Here is the latest news flash that will once again send evolution scurrying “back to the drawing board” for there is now a discovery of human teeth in a cave in Israel that is claimed to be 400,000 years old! If this is proven it will make it to where the text book will haft to be rewritten once again! Not only does this question the school of thought that says that human life originated in Africa, it also throws off the whole concept of how man evolved. The reason why I say this is that these teeth appear MODERN! No, not something appearing like “Lucy” and other and some of the other “ancestors” of man. This starts to make one wonder if the forms of reaching conclusions on the dates of fossils are even correct. Maybe we should take another look at the way that we date fossils in the first place. For more precise information on this, watch the video I have provided

Yes it is true, that I do not agree with the overall all premise of evolution and yet, I think a lot of Creationist over look an important fact that happened because of sin. This is that predators must have gone though a metamorphosis to allow them to be meat eaters! The reason I say this is that before sin there was no death so predators could not have possible have eaten meat. However, they are designed to eat meat! In fact, God makes it clear though statements in the Bible, that there will come a time when predators will once again become vegetarian. I bring this up for I believe that God permitted animals to adapt so they could survive in a world which had become corrupted. In fact there are hints in Genesis that suggest that animals must have been greatly affected by the actions of sin.

While I was doing my research for this article, I found an interesting individual that inspired me with some of his concepts. This was Immanuel Kant, a German philosopher the late 1700’s who ventured off into several subject regarding the abilities of the mind and reason. I have found some of his views quite deep and at times hard to grasp. However, he made a couple comments that I found absolutely brilliant which I would like to share with you before I move on. “Act that your principle of action might safely be made a law for the whole world” or “All our knowledge begins with the senses, proceeds then to the understanding, and ends with reason. There is nothing higher than reason .”

It is with that concept of reason that I want to make the theme of this writing. Because the truth is that I have no desire to attack another’s chosen belief. That is not why I write, I write to empress ideas and to listen and absorb the views of other writers. For this to me is true evolution, the evolution of the heart, the evolution of the intellect. Remember that even God talked about reasoning with people in the book of Isaiah, chapter: 18. "Come now, let us reason together," says the LORD. "Though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they are red as crimson, they shall be like wool.” This may appear like I am drifting off subject a little here and yet; even God seeks a certain form of evolution or transformation with man to allow his spirit to abide in man. He seeks a personal relationship with us to be transformed into beings that can become immortal just like he is!

Two of many dinosuar drawings/carvings which makes you wonder...

If dinosaurs went belly-up as long ago as evolutionist say they did , then why all of the neat dino pics though out the world?
If dinosaurs went belly-up as long ago as evolutionist say they did , then why all of the neat dino pics though out the world?
This pic is from a temple in Cabodia that looks a lot like a dino to me!
This pic is from a temple in Cabodia that looks a lot like a dino to me!

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Comments 85 comments

SirDent 5 years ago

Very well written and laid out. Easy to understand and follow. I must say I had never heard of Malachite Man until now. I also love how you use humor in your writing.

I asked you a a question because I thought you would be the best one to be able to answer it at this time. I hope you check it out and write a hub about it.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Helio SirDent, I did not expect to get feed back this fast for I just published this just minutes before! "The Religone of Evolution"...Yep got me thinking there for I could go in several directions. I almost went there in this one but I decided not to, yes I will take the challange! Why not?


SirDent 5 years ago

I believe you could do it better justice than I. I am not as learned in evolution as you are and I have little time to do the research.

I saw on the hubfeed when you first published this and came right over.


Baileybear 5 years ago

yes, there were some false claims by some over-enthusiastic people - including the media. Note that scientists admit mistakes & move on.

Now what about the numerous shrouds of Jesus & teeth & foreskins? Thousands of them - all claimed to be from Jesus.

So, are you going to tackle the creationist side?

BTW, it's christian, not christine (up with Darwin & wife).

Good on you for addressing the point that nothing is black & white. For me there's more evidence in the science camp (dismissing the over-enthusiastic claims etc). I'm prepared to have an open mind.

I don't see any evidence for the religious side, and I find it disturbing how some people will go to the extreme of blaming Darwin for Hitler. Why not blame Newton for the cruise missiles that kill people too.

None of those things above actually disprove evolution, BTW. I used to believe in God - gradually I came to realise that God didn't ever help me out, so why bother.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

What comes after the "rail against god" period is the final "dismissal of god as uninteresting and unnecessary" when one finally grows up and understands that believing in an invisible imaginary friend who can make everything all better if we just get on our knees and talk to him is part of the childish thinking and childish things about which Peter said, "When I became a man I put away...".

Same goes for that fairy tale that starts, "In the beginning". At some point adults should start to think like adults instead of adult-children protecting their childhood fantasies from reality.

If we took this evolution-creation pseudo-debate into another realm it becomes more apparent just how lame and childish the creationists' claims are:

When asked about what caused Nagasaki to be destroyed, the adult evolutionist will explain the power and horror of the atomic bomb.

In contrast, instead of trying to rationally explain what happened the theist-creationist would tell the story of an invisible fire-breathing dragon that lived in the Nagasaki sewers and destroyed the evil Japanese sinners.

One side tries to be rational and adult; the other side relies on childhood fantasies and imaginary worlds.

For me, when I became a man I put away childish things.


SirDent 5 years ago

Is that the same atomic bomb that science had a hand in creating AKA?


Baileybear 5 years ago

SirDent - I think that's the childishness AKA refers to - trying to tar something that originated using science to justify irrational beliefs. And that's why it's so frustrating debating with people like you, because there is no real debate.

I found HVW's latest hubs quite interesting (although they would be even better without the spelling mistakes etc) - not the same usual aggressive attacking I usually read. I'm afraid I didn't think much of Magnoliaz's hub though (and all the similar hubs with black and white views and completely wrong accusations)


SirDent 5 years ago

Not at all BB. Christians are constantly bombarded by those who follow science and evolution. They are constantly accused. They are responsible for amy atrocities according to evolutionists.

Science on the other hand, is not reponsible for anything at all. I have read it written as such more than once. The excuse is that science is a search for knowledge and nothing more, yet science is what built the first A-bomb.

Now either they developed it or they didn't. If science didn't do it, then who did? Who can answer these questions?

Building an atomic bomb isn't just about being able to split atoms. There had to be more technology and science to go along with it.


Baileybear 5 years ago

SirDent - you do not seem to be aware of ethics. Science is neutral. If someone uses scientific understanding to create a bomb and murder people, I consider that to be unethical. But is war ever ethical - whether by atomic bomb or by spears or sling-shots? Some would say yes, some would say no. War over religion - ethical or not?

I happen to like science, and I understand science, therefore I find it irritating when I see people making false claims about evolution to defend their christian beliefs.

Christians have IVF to conceive children. I don't see that as unethical. Others do. I read in the paper about a couple aborting their healthy twin boys, because they want a girl. They are going to the US to have it done if they can. I think it is unethical to abort based on not getting what sex you wanted. However, if a mother was growing a baby that had no brain and no chance of survival, why shouldn't she have the option of terminating the pregnancy?

It's not black and white about 'do not murder' as plenty of god-botherers go to war because of religion.

As for scientists fighting back, I'm sure they're sick of the intelligent design politics which is all pseudo-science. I've written a hub about these politics (and I loathe politics)


SirDent 5 years ago

Of course science is always neutral. That is the problem. if science in some way created a virus that would wipe out most of the population of the world, science could not be blamed for it.

And you call me brainwashed?


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(Is that the same atomic bomb that science had a hand in creating AKA?)

Sir Dent,

Yes, the very same one. The one that engineers helped build and design. It was real.

Not an imaginary fire-breathing dragon.

That is the point. Reality v Fantasy.

Which side are you on?

Btw, what is the Sir Dent thing? The only people I know who use Sir are into BDSM - a form of fantasy role-playing now that I think about it.


Baileybear 5 years ago

SirDent - it is humans that do bad things, not science. But clearly I'm wasting my time trying to explain these things to you.

Not all of us need a religion created by bronze-age goat-hunters so we don't have to figure out for ourselves what is ethical and what is not. No, be a lazy religionist that can't think for themselves - you are brainwashed. I no longer believe in christianity - I am no longer brain-washed into being told what to believe.

You act like science is a religion to attack along with all the other religions you attack. Do you think maths and art are religions too?


SirDent 5 years ago

Thanks for the insult AKA. Haven't had one in a while.

BB, why do you waste your time then? I am trying to converse with you. Are you saying my opinion means nothing? Or are you saying something altogether different? Go ahead and say it.

By the way BB, what type of medications did you use to take care of your schitzophrenia?


SirDent 5 years ago

This is what I see science as being: Searching for knowledge, but never finding the truth.


Baileybear 5 years ago

SirDent - you are not worth talking to - there you go, just like James making insults because you clearly are crapping out in this argument. You think you have truth and certainly don't have much knowledge


SirDent 5 years ago

Making insults? You said James was schitzo and paranoid. So I figure if you think we are like that now because we believe, you must have been there before. Prove me wrong.


SirDent 5 years ago

Tell you what BB, I will stop posting to you here. You can discuss with HVW and anyone else who comes here. I will leave you alone.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

BB,

Sir D is the typical bible-belt Christian evangelical who uses poorly-veiled sarcasm to hide an inadequacy of argumentation skills.

Kind of like pointing to the singing largemouth bass mounted on the trailer's wall and saying, "Oh, yeah, then how do you explain that?"

May as well talk to the wall.

(Thanks for the insult AKA. Haven't had one in a while.)

Sir,

Insult is in the eye and mind of the beholder. I also notice you didn't answer the question.

Is it Sir Dent or do you also answer to master? Not an insult, just a curiosity. BDSM isn't a sin - it's just kinky.


Baileybear 5 years ago

AKA - very well said, thank-you


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Wow you crazy kids had so much fun while I was sleeping!I am glad that I could provied so much entertainment! I will study these commits and be back to address them!


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Hello BB, I apologies for the type errors for I am dyslectic and I have to watch myself like a hawk and sometimes my best efforts still fail. This is not an excuse it is my handicap that I must deal with. First off, I thought I supplied a lot of evidence like the bones that have been discovered in places that according to the evolutionist should not belong. Or the soft tissue in the T-Rex bones? BTW the very fact that many of the animals that were thought to be existent turned out to be still living (did you even read the whole article)? Scientist do not “move on” as easily as you claim, for I am quite certain there will be bickering between the two camps that have different views about “Ida” OR for that mater, the discovery of the teeth in Israel that will be sure to stir up the whole lot of controversy. How about Ernst Haeckel and those who criticized his embryo chart?

I was originally going to harp on that little tidbit but my “hub” was already running close to 4,000 words which for me is JUST TO LARGE! It is interesting that you seem to want to change the subject by stating… “Now what about the numerous shrouds of Jesus & teeth & foreskins? Thousands of them - all claimed to be from Jesus. So, are you going to tackle the creationist side?” What the hay does that have to do with the subject at hand? Are you also dyslectic and have a problem focusing one thing at a time? Personally, I have had tremendous problems with the shroud and other silliness that is presented to “prove” one point or the other!

Now on to AKA Winston, who can not even get the apostils straight! That was not Peter, that was PAUL in 1 Corinthians 13:11! So if want to talk about childish things why don’t we look at this moronic back and forth that goes on in the forums? This is stuff that I have no time for and is the reason that I almost did not write this hub in the first place! Every one is going to believe what they want to believe and one or two things will happen..They will be held accountable by God during judgment, or they will just plane rot in grave without any consequences for the actions or beliefs!

I will write yet ANOTHER hub that will deal with the more spiritual aspects of this subject and yet, it is not a priority for me…so you will just have to patient!


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Wait a second there AKA..are you telling me the A bomb did not just evolve? Then there that firebreathing dragon thing...What the hay are you talking about? It is time to set down the hash pipe!


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(Wait a second there AKA..are you telling me the A bomb did not just evolve?)

No, I'm saying you can believe in reality or fantasy. The A bomb is a reality.

(That was not Peter, that was PAUL)

You are correct - if it is of consequence.

(why don’t we look at this moronic back and forth that goes on in the forums?)

From my perspective, the only moronic back and forth is instigated by those who want to protect their beliefs by challenging known facts.

It is obvious that ID is not attempting to climb to the same level as science, but rather to drag science down to the status of belief system.

Only when science is thought of as another belief system can there be a comparison to religous beliefs.

In reality, it is apples to oranges, but reality seems inconsequential to bible believers.


tonymac04 profile image

tonymac04 5 years ago from South Africa

Darwin's grandfather's name was Erasmus, not Emanuese.

Love and peace

Tony


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(Every one is going to believe what they want to believe and one or two things will happen..They will be held accountable by God during judgment, or they will just plane rot in grave without any consequences)

Highvoltagewriter,

The quote above is a classic example of what causes me to submit comments in defense of the Age of Enlightenment and reasoning over Dark Ages mythical thinking misrepresented as fact.

You portray a binary scenario, yes/no, black/white, to a situation that has almost limitless possibilities for occurences. It is typical of the black/white thinking developed in Christianity - and it is illusory and wrong.

When we die, we may be reincarnated, face one of the other myriad of gods who have been proposed, immediately awaken into a separate reality - face the Christian god and find out there is no judgement - who knows? But the choices are certainly not limited to the two you stipulate: Judgemental Christian God versus Nothingness.

Beliefs have nothing to do with probabilities. Because you believe it is a yes/no proposition does not then make reality a 50/50 occurence.

The issue is not that one of the two of us is wrong and the other right - the issue is that neither of us may be right, that we may both be wrong.

This same type error in thinking is often claimed as validation of creation, as an either/or scenario. I read a hub from a theist once who made the ridiculously flawed claim that a 1% chance of naturally occuring life meant there was a 99% chance of creation - nothing could be further from reality or understanding of probabilities. A 1% chance of life means only there is a 99% chance of no life.

This is a similar mistake as with your claim that either we wake up and find judgment or we don't wake up and there is only nothingness, making it sound like a 50/50 proposition. It is nowhere close to 50/50 - in fact the probabilities of this scenario are impossible to predict (just like the probabilities of abiogenesis are impossible because we don't know the total mechanisms responsible for life initition - if we don't know the "how" we can't determine the chances of that combination of events occuring) because of lack of empirical data but simplistic probabilities would say that your ideas of meeting a judmmental Christian god in an afterlife have no more than a 1 in (however many competing possibilities there are) chance of being right. Probably something like a 1 in infinity chance I would guess.

Hardly the 50/50, yes/no, right/wrong margin implied by your comment.

It's like buying a lottery ticket that has a 176-million-to-1 chance of winning but thinking that it either wins or it loses, so it's really 50/50.

Good luck with your afterlife lottery ticket - but don't bet the farm that it's a 50/50 chance you'll be walking the golden streets in heaven someday.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Thank you tonymac for the correction! This was new information for me and I must have written down the name wrong or the name was spelled wrong...AKA,Yea there are zillions possibilities of what may happen to us when we die; I was just trying to keep it simple. Speaking of black and white, I have been on many so called scientific sites that love to scream out “we have absolute proof that we are right” and do not keep an open mind either! Frankly I am bored with this for we could go back at forth tell the cows come home and really what would it prove in the end?


sligobay profile image

sligobay 5 years ago from east of the equator

Thanks HVW for a provocative article. Debate is a healthy element of the process of reason.In the absence of sufficient evidence of either position, a debate can merely frame the issues. It is sometimes helpful that neither position is proven by fact unequivicably so that the search for truth may continue. Cheers.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(I have been on many so called scientific sites that love to scream out “we have absolute proof that we are right”)

Highvoltagewriter,

Rest assured the above proclomation guarantees the site visited is NOT SCIENTIFIC.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Well said silobay..I may end up quoting you sometime (I will make sure I ask you first though). Hay AKA..THEN WHY DO THEY CLAIM TO BE? I tell you what, why don't you go write a hub and then I will come and pick on you for awhile...deal? This only seems fair, since no matter what I say you will find fault with it.


SirDent 5 years ago

You know, it seems to me that anyone who is confident in what they believe to be right, will persist in talking about it. Maybe these who say they believe in evolution are not as confident in their beliefs as they claim to be.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

You know, it seems to me that those who insist that scientific theory is dependent on belief for its value say way too much in public. Maybe those who are ignorant enough to think the value of scientific theory is based on belief are not as educated or intelligent as they claim to be.


SirDent 5 years ago

Thank you once again AKA for the fine insults. My lists of names keeps growing longer and longer :)


Baileybear 5 years ago

HVW - I quite liked your hub - does your dyslexia affect your reading skills when researching, or mainly when writing? I'm not going to bother investigating all your stuff to see if it is correct, as I have seen similar hype in the media (just remember the media is full of crap too).

I think since you seem to be giving the not sure what to make of it viewpoint, it would be nice to see the creationist version, although I understand your bias is towards christianity.

I respect your uncertainty, as opposed to the irritating fundamentalists who think they are absolutely sure


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(Thank you once again AKA for the fine insults. My lists of names keeps growing longer and longer :))

Master or Sir,

Just let me know when your righteous anger directs you to hijack an airliner and fly it into the side of my house, will you? There are some things I need from the store and that would be a good day for errands.

You know what's really creepy? Your paranoia is reality based - every word uttered worldwide really is about you.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

Java man is difficult nowadays to make much of. We no longer have the evidence. It was taken by the Japanese during WW2 and the ship it was on was sunk by the Americans. I do not look upon Java man as a false lead or clue as much as a possible lead removed by the fortunes of war. There have of course been false leads that have been proven to be false. Even so the evidence is overwhelmingly on the side of evolution.

Absolute proof? Scientists as AKA Winston mentions, don't often deal in absolutes. There are Creationists who do so all the time and so they are not, generally speaking, a very scientific bunch.


magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz 5 years ago from Wisconsin

AKA Winston and Bailey Bear, Just wondering, do you two have something to eat everyday? Have you ever known a day of hunger? Probably not! Even though you do not believe in God, in his mercy he feeds you everyday of your life. You should get down on your face and be GRATEFUL to the Lord. I hate it when people whine that God doesn't help them. Look around you, everything you have is a blessing from the Lord. I know...SCIENCE is your God, lets see if that god can save you when the oil and water runs out. Indeed, it is because of science that we will soon be running out of both!

Sir Dent- You are an awesome Christian! God's grace and blessings to you, and I like your name!

Highvoltagewriter- Another great hub, so well written, learned lots that I never even thought about. On the other hand... I don't know what you would call someone who has made millions of people turn away from God, but I would call that person evil and/or an instrument of Satan, pure and simple. Espcially when there is no proof to back what they are saying. When we stray away from Bibical principles we are asking from trouble. As for deathbed confessions, I was a Hospice nurse for 5 years, in that time 100% of the dying atheists turned to God before they died. Interesting is it not?


magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz 5 years ago from Wisconsin

AKA Winston-LOL..You won't wake up to find nothing, you will wake up and find hellfire! Good luck my friend, you truly need it.

Within the next 10 years or so, when DNA proves what man really is, Darwinism will die. Science is constantly reinventing itself.

PS Highvoltagewriter, I have dyslexia too. Just ignore those who correct you every second, and write like you always do. I know what you mean and so do they!


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(AKA Winston-LOL..You won't wake up to find nothing, you will wake up and find hellfire! Good luck my friend, you truly need it)

magnoliazz,

Get this straight, dingbat. You are not my friend. I have no time for fools who clutch Dark Ages mysticism to their breasts and use misrepresentaions and lies to try to force it on all around them because they are so fearful of the unknown that they can't stand the idea of wetting their pants in the dark all by themselves.

Instead of hellfire threats, why don't you just buy some panty liners?


AKA Winston 5 years ago

magnoliazz,

Let me edit down to the heart of your comments to Baileybear and me. You said: "You should...", "I hate it when...", "Look around...", "I know...", and "it is..."

Do you see pattern here? LoLoLoLoL.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Oh you crazy kids! There you go again, hijacking my hub comments! If you are going to sling mud, then you should bring a broom along to clean up the mess, for I like to keep a clean hub! so anyway BB, you really should investagate what I researched for that is the best scientific approach is it not?

No please, do not take my word for it for the truth is, I highly respect you for I have seen that you also do your research. so becuse of this I am going to recap on somethings that I would LOVE to get your imput on...

Number one on the list, is the whole missing link thing that seems to be such an obsession with the scientific comunity. Were are those silly little links anyway for they all keep getting shot down! Case in point is that oh so wonderful fish known as the Coelacanth. This was the fish that was said to be the missing link from fish to amphibian UNTIL it was caught as recent as 1990! Whoops got THAT one wrong did you not? Then there is Ida, go ahead and check YouTube's videos and you will see it was the scients causeing all the hype NOT THE MEDIA! So does this make the scientist who ebrassed the heck out of there fellow scientist also full of crap?

Go ahead and check it out...I mean did you really READ my hub or just check for type errors? I will be back to talk about all the other mistakes science has made with there theories. But why am I doing this for I already wrote the hub! It is what it is...I spent a lot of research on this alredy, just like the scientis, I think it is time for me to move on to my next hub!

Hello Rod Marsden, it seems to me that there was problems with JM before he got "lost" (how funny a missing link getting lost). Anyway, what about all the other so called ML? What is your take on them?


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(Number one on the list, is the whole missing link thing that seems to be such an obsession with the scientific comunity)

Highvoltagewriter,

You seem at least willing to listen to reason. The need of a "missing link" is a Creationists' hoax, not a concern at all of biological science.

I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that science is obsessed with finding a missing link fossil other than poor choices for information. If you want to understand reality it is best to go to real sources. I wouldn't bet the farm on the accuacy of a youtube presentation.

The idea that there should be a missing link is a red herring, a hoax perpetrated by creationists to throw people off track from the true method of falsification that Darwin himself noted - complexity in nature that is impossible to come about by incremental change.

Fossil records are nothing more than supportive data - supportive because a scientific theory can never be proven right. A scientific theory can only be falsified, i.e., shown to be wrong.

Also, there is no falsification in the finding of a living Coelacanth, as the diversity of life branches out like limbs on a tree - not like stacking cut wood. One limb does not die out the exact instant another branches off from it - it is graduated change.

It is odd that your views are so skewed from the creationism side with so little understanding of the scientific theories you believe have been refuted.

I suggest more research or biology classes - not that you will necessarily change your mind but so you can at least have a clear understanding of what it is you object to.


Yankee Reb profile image

Yankee Reb 5 years ago

having read the first part of your HUB ... this could have been several HUB's

However - let me just point to one Biblical reference which I think came before the Greeks

Gen 1:20 - And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

Now, the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth came from where?

As I see it - the Biblical interpretation of creation actually evolved into itself.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

AKA..You should really read more about what the scientist are saying about Ida...NOT the Intelligent Design camp, or what scients say about the latest teeth that were found out of Israel. check my links and you will find that I do not just research the ID sites and it DOES seem like the evolutionist are obssed with finding the "missing link" that is why they keep making the claim over and over again...(since the time of Piltdown Man).


AKA Winston 5 years ago

Highvoltagewriter,

This is what Scientific American had to say about the Ida controversy:

First this,

"Building a family tree--or phylogeny--always includes some subjectivity: in addition to choosing which species to include, researchers must decide which characteristics of each species to include in the analysis, and then they must score each characteristic."

Did you see that first line? ...always includes some subjectivity. That means it is based on opinion.

Then Scientific American goes on to point out this,

"What we are seeing now with this current exchange of papers is nothing more than the normal back and forth of peer review that takes place every day in the pages of scientific journals far outside the public's imaginations or interest," writes Ciochon. "Science moves forward funeral by funeral ... almost no one ever changes their mind."

So your great whoop-de-whoop about Ida is nothing more than a bunch of paleontologists disagreeing about their opinions of what bones are important and what they suggest.

Nothing about paleontology suggests 100% proof of anything, and the fossil record has no bearing on Evolution by Natural Selection.

Again, you would be better served in trying to learn what evolution is rather than reading Red Herrings headlines of what it is not.

Btw, why don't you try non-partisan sources for your information instead of the Creationist-sponsored ones you quote as sources?

(evolutionist are obssed with finding the "missing link")

You once again fail to grasp the point - there is no black/white, yes/no dichotomy. ANYONE who has an agenda to prove is NOT A SCIENTIST.

It doesn't matter if they are trying to prove evolution or creationism.

Anyone whose goal is to prove one or the other is nothing but a charlatan, a faith healer trying to dazzle the masses with sleight-of-hand magic tricks.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

hay Yankee..you are reaching here a bit are you not? For what about the land animals? If the Bible is talking about "watters bring forth abundently" then the birds in the air...then why does it not say something like "oh by the way...the life in ocean crawled on to the land and then later turned into birds." It does not say that! Now go and read the rest of the hub and get back with me!


magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz 5 years ago from Wisconsin

AKA Winston...Did you even bother to read the hub, or do you just know it all? HVW did an awesome job of researching this entire thing, presented it in a new and fresh way...with a dash of humor for good measure, and you do not even bother to read the hub all the way through before you start downgrading him. I found out new things from this hub that I never even thought much about before. You can tell it took a lot of time and work, thank you Highvoltagewriter! I am back to vote you up again and to support you. I remember how upsetting it was with my unpopular hub, but being a Christian is not about being popular. Its about believing what God tells us is true. God created man in his own image. Its that simple.

And you have to admit HVW went into depth about missing links, but of course, now you say, AKAW, a missing link proves nothing at all. Give me a break!

If the missing link were not so important, then why do the evolutionists continue to search for it? WHY? Because they know they have NOTHING unless those missing links can be found and so far they have come up with a big fat zero. Not one missing link has been found for mammal, reptile, insect, bacteri, or virus,or anything else for that matter! More interesting yet, not once could science prove that a simple bacteri or virus morphed into something else, (like bacteria into virus), and they have studied thousands and thousands of generations and mutations...yet, not once did they see one species morph into another species.

AKA, you show me a missing link for any species and I just might begin to believe you. There was a time I believed in Darwin, that was before I started thinking for myself. And you talk about being brainwashed? LOL! LOL! Most of the time you sound like a parrot!

If you are a logical person you are going to question evolution.

Highvoltagewriter- You hang in there kiddo, just remember, anyone who stands up for the Lord will be unpopular. That's a good sign.

Personally, I will pray for each and every hubber on here who are atheists. They need to know that God's love is for them too.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

highvoltagewriter, it seems to me that Lucy is genuine. Way too much proof has emerged to verify the existence of dinosaurs.

As for standing up for the Lord, this really is taking things too far. If the Lord needs lies and falsehoods and the use of unscientific methodology to continue then we are not talking about any real Lord at all. Darwin's ideas are no threat to Christianity though Creationist nonsense may well be.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

magnoliazz,

My standards for both friendship and discourse exclude those of your intellectual level and intellectual integrity.

Talk to the hand....

To the assembled masses - those who go into the wilds and dig in the ground are not looking for the fossil of the missing link; no, they are looking for the lost ark of the covenant so they can use it as a weapon of mass destruction against all those Nazi Darwinian Eugenisists that Ben Stein uncovered in "Expelled, No Intelligence Allowed.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Yea RM I will get back with you on Lucy, for there is some questions I would like to ask you but I need to do more research..as for as dinosurs,of course I believe in them, just not the time frame that is said taht they lived in! I question the whole method of dating as I state in this article. I am a little confussed about the "standing up for the Lord" which I never make anykind of stament anywere that is my resons for writing.

What I did say was...

"the truth is that I have no desire to attack another’s chosen belief. That is not why I write, I write to empress ideas and to listen and absorb the views of other writers. For this to me is true evolution, the evolution of the heart, the evolution of the intellect."

I have no desire to lie for ANY reson and I strongly believe that every thing I have expressed is the truth. I do think there are some on the creation side of the fence that do spin the truth in ways that lead to frustration in doing research. I also feel the same way with some of those in the evolution camp that have made statment that seem to want to jump to conclusions.

That is my story and I am sticking to it!


Austinstar profile image

Austinstar 5 years ago from Somewhere in the universe

Hi, Sir Dented! You are familiar with science making the A-bomb, I see. Well, don't you believe that God wiped out the entire PLANET'S population in one fell swoop? And what a nice weapon he used. He created nothing like the A-bomb, oh no! he created WATER to drown everybody! And this in addition to all the other people he killed in lots of other creationist ways. Gotta love it - ALL NATURAL DEATH DEVICES! NON-POLLUTING! FREE OF CHARGE!

Hello Magnoliazzzzzz, I'm so happy that God goes shopping for me to feed me every day. That way I don't have to rely on the farmers and ranchers to toil and sweat to provide wholesale goods that I have to work all day long to earn enough money to buy at retail prices. It's really super nice that he provides me a maid (or slave) to cook and clean too! Thank you Jesus! I will fall on my face tomorrow to properly thank the trinity for giving me a face in the first place.

Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he will feed himself for a lifetime, try to teach a religionist to fish and he will starve to death praying for a fish to come along as a gift from God.

HVW - Nice hub! But can you explain to me just EXACTLY where GOD came from? I'd love to know. Maybe he created himself? Maybe he evolved? from nothing. There's no way to research this. I guess you just have to have faith. And what kind of fish will you be eating tonight?


Marliza Gunter profile image

Marliza Gunter 5 years ago from South Africa

Hey Highvoltage..what a crazy war zone you got going here.. :) which came first the egg or the chicken, the worm or the butterfly..hehe..did I have a tail..hehe..men were made in God's image, but apparently it was proven that men were ape..hehe...now the evolved apes accuse God (remember we were made in HIS image) for the applaudable mess in the ape cages..deep stuff this.. :)


Austinstar profile image

Austinstar 5 years ago from Somewhere in the universe

I'm still wondering why people have such a low opinion of apes. They are magnificent animals, as are we.

The sooner the religionists get off their "high horse" and learn to be the very part of the natural world (like God, for instance), the sooner we will live in a better world.

If we are made in God's image, then we ARE gods! And so is every little atom in the universe. No better, no worse. We are infinity.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Okay I have had it! No more back and forth BS! If you guys want to pick fights then go to Christian fourm for they seem to love this kind of stuff...So from now on if ANY ONE ON ANY SIDE OF THE ARGUMENT ABOUT HOW LIFE BEGAN IS HERE TO SLING INSULTS I WILL HIT THE "DENY" BUTTON!

If you want to have a polite debate then fine...we will also do that on a fourm! I had a good Christian friend warn me that this would happen for God does not need any one to stand up for him! Austinstar,God is beyond time, the end and the begining and he will not fit into your testtube! It appears to me that evolution scients also must have faith, for they keep geting it wrong! (Did modern men first come from Africa or Israel as the "new" evidence seems to point to)? To people like SirDent I must ask you...were is the LOVE? For it seems to be that all you want to do is pick fights with people! I won't have it any more, for this is NOT what I am about!


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Hay Marliza! Quite the hornets nest is it not? It is funny that most of the people seem to come here just to argue and act like they did not even READ the hub! Well I do not have time for it! Hello again Austinstar, the whole "like gods" was Satan's orginal lie! Oh you want to know what I am having for dinner? Ape burgers! LOL,no seriously, we have gotten away from nature, in part thanks to the advancement of science, it is shame!


magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz 5 years ago from Wisconsin

Hello AustinStar-- In spite of our differences, I cannot help but like you! LOL...its fun to spar with an intelligent person. The same goes for Bailey Bear and Rod Marsen too...all add a lot to hub pages. I think we can agree to disagree. If we all thought exactly alike, what a dull world this would be, right?

AKA Winston, LOL, keep it up! I plan to write a few more hubs on evolution, and I know you will want to get your two cents in. People love controversy, and I have a feeling it follows you around.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Hello Magnolia...well I think things calmed down a bit! It is so strange how some people can get there panties in bunch over some ones point of view or insights! I can talk about my own personal darkness and evey one is cool, but say something about evolution and here come the hornets (buz-buz)!Then they try to tell me that evolution is NOT a religion?


Austinstar profile image

Austinstar 5 years ago from Somewhere in the universe

Well, I have to say that Magnoliazz is being nicer to me, so I will return the favor.

But, HVW, you can't just state that God lives outside of time. That's not an answer.

Evolution is a theory - not a religion

Religion is a belief - not a theory

Please present these two things accurately at least.


AKA Winston 5 years ago

(but say something about evolution and here come the hornets (buz-buz)!Then they try to tell me that evolution is NOT a religion?)

Highvoltagewriter,

You do not seem to grasp what is occuring. I doubt there is a single person posting on hubpages who would care at all if science falsified natural selection. I know I would care nothing - that would only mean a better theory would have to be found.

My life wouldn't change.

No, the hornet's nest you allude to is simply the recoil against the lies, delusions, and deceits of those who practice purposeful ignorance in order to protect their beliefs from reality - and then think they have the right to dump this inane collection of creationist garbage onto society's neatly reasoned lawn.


SirDent 5 years ago

Evolution is a religion, based upon a non-factual theory, based upon the words of a man.

Christianity is a belief, based upon faith, based upon evidence that is real and can be seen.

Not one person living or dead can say with truth that God did not create everything there is. The heavens declare His glory. The birds of the air sing praises to Him. All animals praise Him. Humans are the ones full of iniquity.

The Bible says that God rested on the seventh day from creating. This shows evolution, as presented by evilutionists, to be false.


Austinstar profile image

Austinstar 5 years ago from Somewhere in the universe

SirDent, excuse me for saying so, but you are a stupid, stupid man. I'm not calling you names, I'm stating a fact.

HVW, if you wish to delete this comment so be it. I will post it in the forums. I cannot let those words go unchallenged. He is spouting lies and misinformation. I do hope you and your readers can recognize it.

He calls true scientists "EVILutionists" instead of trying to prove that GOD created the universe, he mocks the one theory that in his mind is "non-factual", when instead of trying to understand God's natural world which is all that the theory of evolution attempts to do.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

Sir Dent, I have to side with Austinstar. Evolution is not a religion and it is based upon observation. There are facts behind the theory of evolution.


Austinstar profile image

Austinstar 5 years ago from Somewhere in the universe

"The Bible says that God rested on the seventh day from creating. This shows evolution, as presented by evilutionists, to be false."

Exactly how does this show evolution to be false? What does one have to do with the other?

Thank you Rod. I think we agree that evolution and religion are two very different things and really one doesn't prove or disprove the other.

The religionists attack evolution because it scares them. Why? I don't know.


Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden 5 years ago from Wollongong, NSW, Australia

Austinstar, the theory of Evolution is something relatively new only dating back to the 19th Century and that is why it scares some people.


Lady_E profile image

Lady_E 5 years ago from London, UK

Interesting read. Thanks.


SirDent 5 years ago

So how you doing, HVW?


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

The truth is SirDent, I have gotten bored with the whole back and forth created by this hub. I mean I have found another hub similar to this one that has not created so much controversy even though that writer usesd information that has been proven to be false.

I have written other controversial subjects that did not create so much belly aching and what I see as arguing for argument sake. I just do not have the time or interest to do battle on this subject. If other people want to do so, then great! That are what the forms are for and is the reason why you do not find me in them! I have other fish to fry!


SirDent 5 years ago

I have made an impact on HubPages, not all good as you probably know by now. I have been caled name by many since I first came here three years ago. I am still being called names.

The reason your hub brought so much controversy is most likely because I commented on it. I apologize for that and will leave you to it.

Where good is, evil is also present.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

SirDent: I do not regret writing this hub for I feel that God wanted me to write it and yet, I was amazed with the amount of tension it created. I also do feel that the responses were not all because of your presence. It does seem that you and other Christians at this site have way of ticking a lot of people off.I will return to the subject for I feel there is more that needs to be said.

The reality is that I may not be as active in hubpages for a while, for I have some issues that I must address and other project that will need my full attention. Only God knows how long that may be.


SirDent 5 years ago

Tension comes and goes with or without this hub. Non believers telling us believers that we are wrong and they are right. It is the same as it has been forever. It all started with one called Lucifer.

I pray you are blessed beyond measure.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Thank you SirDent and you are right on this account, the enemy will always find away to come against us for it is not a physical battle (which I tend to forget from time to time...I guess sometimes I wish I could find some middle grown and yet I know there is no such thing!


SirDent 5 years ago

We all forget it sometimes. It would be much easier if it was a physical battle. Sometimes spirits are harder to discern than other times.

Then you have the opinions of many which can vary from one person to the next and eventually all opinions actually mean nothing excpet one, which is the opinion of God Himself. His is the only right opinion and therefore makes it impossible to have a middle ground.


AskAshlie3433 profile image

AskAshlie3433 5 years ago from WEST VIRGINIA

Yeah, great information. Very cool hub Volt! Take care my friend. :)


Erin LeFey profile image

Erin LeFey 5 years ago from Maryland

Great information and great research in a well formatted article. I usually shy away from these types of hubs as my mind just starts to bend around all of the theories from all of the so-called "experts". I found your hub very interesting and fair. Thanks so much!


James A Watkins profile image

James A Watkins 5 years ago from Chicago

This is an awesome Hub! I thoroughly enjoyed reading it. Much wisdom here. Thank you for this illuminating piece of work.


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Thank you Erin for dropping by. It is nice to get positive feedback for this hub seem to stir up a bit of emotion! Hello James! You have become quite notorious for writing controversial hubs, at far as the evolutionist are concerned, so it is good that you stop by and I glad that you appreciate the positive input!


magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz 5 years ago from Wisconsin

Hi There HVW!

I made freinds with all the people I argued with on the evolution hubs...all except for AKA Winston..LOL. AustinStar is really a nice person and so is Rod and BaileyBear too.

Anyhow, I found a website that is all about evolution, and why it does not make sense.

http://www.thercg.org/books/effai.html#c

This guy is really interesting, in fact the entire website is interesting. When I have time, I might write another hub in evolution.

You really got a lot of posts here, great job!

Talk to you later, check out that website, it was good for my soul.


fucsia profile image

fucsia 5 years ago

I really do not know if it is more interesting the Hub or the discussion after... And I am confuse... Now I do not remember what I wanted write in this comment before reading all the interventions! The only think that I think now is " the doubt sets us free".


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Hay magnoliazz! It is good that every thing has calmed down a bit since the monkey pop hit the fan...Yea I think AKA just like to argue..I guess every body got to have a hobby! I back off on answering all the commits for I got bored with the whole mess...

I will eventually write another evolution hub to clarify some of the things I wrote in this one, supply new evidence. However I have several other projects that I am working on (like a new blog and website, plus other articles for other sites). I will check out that link of yours.Anyway I miss talking to you and I may just drop a line to say "Hi"

Hello fucsia, I am sorry that you forgot what you were going to say and now I am a little confused by your statement about "doubt setting us free"...maybe you could explain that for I always thought it was the truth that set you free!


K9keystrokes profile image

K9keystrokes 5 years ago from Northern, California

So clear, cool and captivating. Thanks for doing such awesome research and sharing your findings. I will be back for more of your high quality writing. Evolution proves once again how readily we evolve!

Great work here.

K9


fucsia profile image

fucsia 5 years ago

I say that "the doubt sets us free" because without doubt we do not looking for the truth. Your research is very detailed and interesting: it was born from a doubt.

Sometimes do not exists only one truth and this gives us the possibility to open our mind to different point of views, Is not it fantastic?

You wrote: "one man’s truth is another man’s lie". You say: "Unfortunately", I say: "Fortunately"!

The doubt stimulates our curiosity, our creativity, widens our horizons and... makes us free!


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Hello K9keystrokes (what a cleaver handle)...thanks for your comments they are much appreciated.hay fucsia thank you for coming back and clarifying your comments for your insights are truly thought provoking and I am pleased to hear your viewpoints!


BL Tween profile image

BL Tween 5 years ago

I enjoyed your hub.


JannyC profile image

JannyC 5 years ago

Can science and religion ever go hand in hand? Some say yes but it is very unstable friendship if it is really possible. Very indepth makes you think. Great hub


Highvoltagewriter profile image

Highvoltagewriter 5 years ago from Savannah GA. Author

Yes JannyC, I do believe that science and religion can play well together because I do think that eventually science will find out that God has been behind science all along!


Trish_M profile image

Trish_M 5 years ago from The English Midlands

Hi

I haven't had chance to read all of this hub yet, or all of the comments, but I was very interested to read about the Greek philosophers suggesting evolution so long ago. Fascinating!

By the way ~ did you mean 'Erasmus' Darwin?

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