The United Nations: A Luciferian Organization


I trust that after the reader finishes reading the last part of my essay, he/she will be compelled to come to the conclusion that the United Nations is nothing but a Luciferian institution with a very sinister agenda.

Two of the greatest influences of the United Nations are Alice Bailey and, in turn, Helena Blavatsky, both very influential New Agers.

Alice Bailey

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Alice Bailey was born on June 16th, 1880 in Manchester, England. She said that being raised in an orthodox Christian family contributed to her unhappy childhood and feelings of suicide with the result she attempted suicide three times before the age of fifteen.


Her first encounter with spirits was remarkably similar to that of Aleister Crowley, them pursuing her first, both being brought up in strict Christian households and both being told they had some grand plan to fulfil. While her family was at church, she saw a man wearing a turban on his head while reading. Muted by her shock, she later described the character as being someone from the 19th century Manchester. She says what he told her in an excerpt of her unfinished biography published in 1951:

“He told me there was some work that it was planned that I could do in the world but that it would entail changing my disposition considerably; I would have to give up being such an unpleasant little girl and must try to get some measure of self-control. My future usefulness to Him and to the world was dependant on how I handled myself and the changes I could manage to make. He said that if I could achieve real self-control I could then be trusted and that I would travel all over the world and visit many countries, “doing your Master’s work all the time” … He added that He would be in touch with me at intervals of seven years apart.”

This was her first contact with her Master Koot Humi.

After divorcing her husband in 1917, she moved to the United States where she first came across the teachings of Theosophy by Helena Blavatsky. She met her second husband, Foster Bailey, then, who was a 33rd degree Scottish Freemason. She progressed through the ranks of Theosophy and soon became the editor of the American Theosophists newspaper.

She encountered her second “master” in 1919 that channelled through her in her writings by automatic writing. She suddenly heard music playing all around her followed by the voice of Djwhal Khul, asking her if she’d like to write some books for him. After turning him down, the voice said he’d return in three weeks to see if she would reconsider. Three weeks on, she did agree to write for him and began the first chapters of Initiation, Human and Solar. However, she was starting to get scared a month into the writings and refused to do anymore work for him. Djwhal Khul told her to consult her first master, Koot Humi. Koot Humi, in turn, confessed to Bailey that it had been him who had sent Djwhal Kul to contact her and gave her permission to continue writing. He proceeded to hone her telepathic communication.

Within her life-time, she produced 24 books, including an autobiography. Nineteen of these books were written by Djwhal Jhul. During these writings, she spent her time formulating “The Plan” as she called it.

Bailey believed that all religions come from the same spiritual source and when humanity realises it, the consciousness of the New Age will ensue. There will be a subsequent new world religion and finally a New World Order. All believers will cooperate with the “Great Plan”, which will be revealed to them by the spiritual leaders of the race.

The leadership shall include various masters, most importantly, a Master Jesus. This Christ is going to be great “Person”, who will emanate the energy love and his return will result in the awakening of that energy in human consciousness. Bailey thought this Christ will be “Sanat Kumara”.

Alice Bailey, along with her husband, Foster Bailey, author of The Spirit of Masonry, established the “Lucifer Publishing Company” in 1920. In 1922, however, it was changed to the “Lucis Trust” to make the Luciferian connotations less conspicuous. It has consultative status with the United Nations having a seat on the weekly sessions. It also disseminates United Nations material.

They went on to establish The Arcane School. It seeks to groom a New Group of World Servers to accomplish the work of the Hierarchy of Masters, “The Christ” being the head. The Arcane School is managed by Lucis Trust as well as World Goodwill. World Goodwill, in turn, is represented at regular briefing sessions at the United Nations in New York and Geneva, being a partner of the United Nations. Several partners of World Goodwill are the United Nations Association, Buddhist Society, New Economics Foundation, World Health Organization, Peace Through Unity, World Wildlife Fund, UNICEF, US Mission of the United Nations, Better World Society (CNN founder Ted Turner), Fellowship and Prayer, Tibetan Buddhist Learning Centre.

I picked out these examples of many to give the reader an idea of the extent to which New Age has infiltrated the world.

Quite startling is the fact that the Lucis Trust used to be situated at 666 United Nations Plaza. It is now currently situated on Wall Street, New York.



Source

I’d like to give you a quote from Madame Helena Blavatsky, of whom Alice Bailey is a student:

“Stand in awe of him, and sin not, speak his name with trembling … It is Satan who is the god of our planet and the only god. … When the Church, therefore, curses Satan, it curses the cosmic reflection of God.”

This is from the woman who inspired Bailey, who in turn has a company which has weekly sit in sessions with the United Nations. Is this not incredible?

THE UNITED NATIONS

Now that I have provided the background to what inspires the United Nations, I will concentrate on the United Nations itself.

Can the United Nations be considered a spiritual body? What if its purpose is not to help countries in need and be peace-keepers but rather its purpose is to usher in Alice Bailey’s “Great Plan”?

Consider what former United Nations Assistant Secretary General, Robert Muller, says:

“I would never have thought that I would discover spirituality in the United Nations! Perhaps spirituality is such a fundamental human need that it always reappears in one form or another in life and throughout history and that we are about to witness now its renaissance in a global, planetary context.”

“The religions are working together to make a world spirituality organization — we will talk together …. study …. inspire each other to re-in-store a global spirituality. All cooperations will unite in a global cooperative to preserve nature and humanity. … We should have a second United Nations. … I will continue to fight for a basic reform of the United Nations. And if the United Nations is not reformed I will recommend that the European Union which has now so many countries from even outside of Europe that the European Union should become the World Union. …. Switch on and keep on the positive buttons within yourself … meditative, smile, laugh, dance, sing … We need a new type of world … Let us make paradise earth.”

Robert Muller, “My Dream 3000″

Why is the United Nations bothering itself with a one world religion? Does religion have any business in the United Nations?

There is group of St John’ Cathedral, which is attempting to create a New World religion. It is called the Temple of Understanding. The Temple’s purpose is to facilitate the one world religion, through the promoting and acceptance of all religions, beliefs and rituals. I find this to be a massive contradiction. How can the purpose be to unite all religions when New Agers detest the Abrahamic religions? In fact, the New Age agenda includes eliminating Christianity. This clearly is what the Temple of Understanding wants the public to believe because it does not adhere to their real objectives.

There is something called the “Procession of the Ghouls” that takes place at this Masonic Temple-Cathedral that takes place at Halloween. These are pictures of what this entails:

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This Temple has received full accreditation from the United Nations. There are twelve members listed as Directors or advisors. They also happen to be members of the U.N’s Global Forum councils. Various speakers have spoken about the worship of “Mother Earth”. One such speaker, James Lovelock, says that the Mother Earth, who is actually named Gaia, was the giver of life and had the capacity to heal herself. However, he says that humans are like a cancer to her, being too overwhelming for her to cope with and thus she cannot heal herself. This kind of mentality would explain why the Global Elite so desperately want to keep the population down. I mean, why save those poor Haitians when they are a burden to Gaia?

It also explains why nauseating Al Gore harps on about global warming. His poor goddess can’t cope. He, too, has been a guest several times at the Cathedral of St. John the Divine where he said, “God is not separate from the Earth.” A member of the board of directors of the Temple of Understanding, Thomas Berry, believes that the world is being called to a new, “post denominational”, a post Christian belief system, that will acknowledge the earth as a living being and people being her consciousness. This is in direct contradiction to their aim of merging all religions together. The truth is they want to toss out all religions in favour of New Age.

At the Temple Cathedral’s Lindisfarne Centre, New Age guru, David Spangler says:

“Lucifer, like Christ, stands at the door of man’s consciousness and knocks . . . He becomes the being who carries that great treat, the ultimate treat, the light of wisdom.”

If you wonder why the United Nations takes too slow to respond to disasters, know it is because they are too busy worshipping Lucifer.

To top it off, Sri Chinmony, the United Nations’ Meditation Master said:

“The United Nations is the Chosen Instrument of God, a divine messenger, carrying the banner of God’s inner vision and outward manifestation.”

THE ONE WORLD RELIGION

So what exactly does this one world religion entail apart from the obvious worshipping of Lucifer? It will entail the “Gaia Hypothesis” or “Gain world views”. That is a pantheistic perspective which implies that the earth, as a deity, will have to be worshipped. Apparently Lucifer comes in many forms, clearly, or else these New Agers are smoking something really bizarre. The United Nations considers itself the medium through which the goddess, probably Lucifera, Satan being the bisexual deity that he is, will dictate our forms of devotion.

Dr. Norman Myers from Gaia Atlas of Future Worlds and has been the advisor to the United Nations, states the basic tenets of the Gaian religion, saying there is no longer any “we” or “they”:

“For the first time, and for all time, there is only ‘us’ – all of us humans, together with all our fellow species and other members of the Gaian community.”

In this New Age, there will be no individuality. Everybody will just be part of the “consciousness” and with that, there will be no rights for people.

The September/October 1994 issue of The Futurist magazine reported, “Religions are now headed toward what may ‘eventually form a United Religions Organization (URO), structured in much the same way as the United Nations and with the same goals.” Once created, the URO would be given the task of creating a “new covenant’ for the planet: “The URO will discern the nature of that covenant and with it the responsibilities, rather than the rights, of planetary citizenship.”

This new world ethic will be recognised as imperative by world institutions.

On January 25, 1993, a collection of religious leaders assembled around the “Peace Altar” at the UN’s Temple of Understanding to inaugurate the “Year of Inter-religious Cooperation and Understanding.” “The Declaration of a Global Ethic” document was unveiled and signed by scores of religious leaders.

This document contains an alternative framework for religion to which people will be held accountable. Does anyone get the feeling our freedom of religion will be encroached upon? The document dictates an irrevocable norm for all areas of life, for families and communities, nations, races and religions.

Worse still is the fact that the document states that there will be no individual freedom. We can only do things that are approved by a global government. One of the directives state that there will be severe punishment for those religious leaders who preach “intolerance”. We can assume that these religious leaders will be rebelling against the New World Order. They will have their congregations confiscated from them.

The United Nations meditation room

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There is something called the United Nations Meditation Room. Yes, they do have one. They can’t seem to make decisions without consulting Lucifer first. Former Secretary General of the U.N and follower of Alice Bailey, Dag Hammarskjold, said that the lodestone altar in it is dedicated to the God whom man worships under many name. Hmmm. To think that Kofi Annan was married in the U.N Meditation room…

Along with Hammarskjold, it was also U Thant, another former Secretary General of the United Nations, Dr Robert Muller and Barbara Marx Hubbard, who were involved with the conception of the United Nations Meditation Days. She is the author of the 1983 book, “Revelation: The Book of Co-creation”. She called for a “planetary Pentecost” which would alter the world’s state of consciousness”. This is the process called “The Black Awakening”, which includes a mass extermination of Christians who will be rebelling against the New World Order.

So what exactly do they do in the United Nations Meditation room? Well, regular meditation meetings take place there and it always starts off with a recital of Alice Bailey’s Great Invocation. Here is how it goes:

“From the point of Light within the Mind of God, Let light stream forth into human minds.
Let Light descend on Earth. From the point of Love within the Heart of God. Let love stream forth into human hearts. May the Coming One return to Earth. From the centre where the Will of God is known let purpose guide all little human wills – The purpose which the Masters know and serve. From the centre which we call the human race let the Plan of Love and Light work out. And may it seal the door where evil dwells. Let Light and Love and Power restore the Plan on Earth.”

International participants sit quietly for a few minutes and “link mentally with other members of their triangle”. They invoke the energies of light and goodwill, visualizing these energies as circulating through three focal points of each triangle and pouring through the networks of triangles surrounding the planet. Simultaneously, they repeat the Great Invocation.

Interestingly enough, the Great Invocation was recited during the opening ceremonies in 1992 at the U.N’s Earth Summit in Rio.

Ida Urso of Lucis Trust Arcane School said in 1995:

“It is no coincidence that we are celebrating both the 50th anniversary of the Great Invocation and the United Nations. Both in different ways are pivotal to the Plan… let us together complete the triangle of light… let us contemplate that world body–’the hope of humanity’–which was conceived just 50 years ago under the impulse of the three spiritual Festivals (falling on March 28th, April 27th and May 26th)… It was on April 25, 1945 two days previous to the full moon of Taurus and the Festival of Wesak [note: the best time to recite the Great Invocation, according to Lucis Trust, as the energies of the Hierarchy are in alignment with the Earth] that delegates from 50 nations, met in San Francisco for a conference known officially as the United Nations Conference on International Organization… On this period the Tibetan Master tells us: ‘Not for nothing is this conference being held during the five days of the Wesak Full Moon. It will be a time of supreme difficulty, in which the Forces of Light will face… the forces of selfishness and separativeness.’”

I’m sure most people did not know this about the United Nations. A current motif is the emphasis of love, tolerance and compassion and goodness, yet this is not the impression I get from the United Nations. Take a look at this:

U.N. Finally Forced to Probe Its Pedophilia Scandal

NewsMax.com Wires and NewsMax.com

Tuesday, May 7, 2002

GENEVA, Switzerland – The United Nations’ massive pedophilia scandal has not received 1 percent of the media attention given to the Catholic Church’s homosexual priest scandal. Finally some attention is being paid, now that the U.N.’s cover is blown.

As world leaders converge on New York for the controversial conference on children this week, U.N. investigators and relief agencies say they are finally trying to stop recurrence of sexual abuse against West African refugee children by U.N. “peacekeepers” and aid workers.

Be warned: The United Nations is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

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Comments 42 comments

someonewhoknows profile image

someonewhoknows 5 years ago from south and west of canada,north of ohio

I'd use reverse speech to find out what they are thinking while talking


Wesman Todd Shaw profile image

Wesman Todd Shaw 5 years ago from Kaufman, Texas

Clair is back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey Clair, do you have a copy of "The Hope Of The Wicked" by Ted Flynn?

I used to have several copies. I gave one to each of several persons that probably didn't read them. If I still have an extra one somewhere I'll send one to you.

I keep it near my Bible for study - it's just that relevant a book to the current times.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 5 years ago from South Africa Author

@ someonewhoknows

That's exactly what I do.

@Todd. No I haven't read that. Send it to me if you have a copy. I have a question for you: Why do you get views to your hub even when it is unpublished and only you are supposed to see it.

Thanks, guys.


Wesman Todd Shaw profile image

Wesman Todd Shaw 5 years ago from Kaufman, Texas

The hub views thing is showing YOUR views too. I did a five thousand word hub on Timothy Leary. . .and it had around a hundred views before I published it.

Those were all my views though, as I assembled that monster.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 5 years ago from South Africa Author

Thanks, that was useful.


Disappearinghead profile image

Disappearinghead 4 years ago from Wales, UK

New Age ideas are pretty much harmless, it's their proponents we need to worry about just as we should be concerned with any religious fundamentalism. One only has to study the Hebrew scriptures and Judaism to see that lucifer does not exist, any more than other so called gods and Demi-gods, or demons. New Age philosophies are a nice idea, but they have no spiritual power because these spirts are not real, just people's fervent imaginations and placebo effects. The word is full of spiritual nutters on the fringe, and as long as nobody takes them seriously, no harm done.


Wesman Todd Shaw profile image

Wesman Todd Shaw 4 years ago from Kaufman, Texas

Disappearinghead - ideas aren't really harmless.

Before anyone started putting Jews in ovens or gas chambers ...someone had to have that idea.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 4 years ago from South Africa Author

Disappearinghead, Satan exists and Lucifer is Satan. There is absolutely nothing harmless about wanting to become God as New Agers do. As Todd said, it just has to start with an idea and the idea of New Age is to annihilate Christianity. Then we have a mass slaughter of Christians.


Deborah Sexton 4 years ago

Lucifer is not Satan. Lucifer is A Human.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 4 years ago from South Africa Author

In Isaiah 14:12, Lucifer is described as the morning star cast down from heaven. He is not human.

An interesting topic arises in that Jesus, too, is the morning star. Often the same thing is denotated to both Jesus and Satan. Jesus in Revelations refers Himself to the Lion of the tribe of Judah and Satan is compared to a lion in 1 Peter 5:8, seeking who he can devour.

Jesus is the light of the world and Lucifer, or Satan, is a counterfeit who comes as an angel of light.


Deborah Sexton 4 years ago

Claire Evans

The HEBREW word Hêl?l that was removed and replaced with the Latin word Lucifer, means...

"Son of the Dawn"..Not Sun. and it is not the same as the morning star, which is Venus. Try reading the Hebrew Bible. You have a lot to learn and think you know it all.

Isaiah 14 is speaking about the Babylon Sovereignty


Deborah Sexton 4 years ago

You do not have permission to copy my hub. You have violated my copyright. See my copyright notice in my proofile.

I am contacting the dcma so they will make Hubpages take it down.


Deborah Sexton 4 years ago

Thief


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 4 years ago from South Africa Author

Geez, Deborah, you could have come to me first and asked me to take it down before going to have a crai to the dcma. I never tried to pass off your material as my own. So here's my revised comment:

I didn't say Lucifer meant Sun. How do you know that son of the dawn doesn't mean Venus? Isaiah 14:12 says, "How you have fallen from heaven, O morning star, son of the dawn!"

Isaiah is saying they are one and the same.

How can the Babylonian sovereignty fall from heaven and be cast down to earth? I think Isaiah is talking about Satan and the King of Babylon. See Isaiah 14:16.

It appears to me that the King of Babylon was guided by the spirit of Lucifer.

Make no mistake, occultists believe they are guided by the light, spirit of Lucifer. He is their god:

Albert Pike, 33rd degree Mason, Grand Commander, and author of Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, in his Instructions to the 23 Supreme Councils of the World on July 14, 1889, reportedly stated that "Lucifer is God, and unfortunately Adonay is also God. ... Lucifer, God of Light and God of Good is struggling for humanity against Adonay, the God of Darkness and Evil". *

They do not see him as the King of Babylon:

New Age guru, David Spangler says:

“Lucifer, like Christ, stands at the door of man’s consciousness and knocks . . . He becomes the being who carries that great treat, the ultimate treat, the light of wisdom.”

“No one will enter the New World Order unless he or she will make a pledge to worship Lucifer. No one will enter the New Age unless he will take a Luciferian Initiation.”

And occultists, especially New Agers, believe that their Christ will come to earth guided by the light of Lucifer. As Bailey's Invocation goes:

“From the point of Light within the Mind of God, Let light stream forth into human minds.

Let Light descend on Earth. From the point of Love within the Heart of God. Let love stream forth into human hearts. May the Coming One return to Earth. From the centre where the Will of God is known let purpose guide all little human wills – The purpose which the Masters know and serve. From the centre which we call the human race let the Plan of Love and Light work out. And may it seal the door where evil dwells. Let Light and Love and Power restore the Plan on Earth.”

Whenever you hear of a "divine light", you know Lucifer is being talked about.

I see a lot of references to light in your hubs for the example, the Middle Pillar ritual where you experience the Luciferian light.

And what's the association with Pentagrams? That's a very Satanic symbol.

Have a look who it is on:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thum

Satanist Aleister Crowley, also associated with the pentagram...

http://www.crystalinks.com/crowleypyrhat.jpg

believed he was the reincarnation of Eliphas Levi. That is why reincarnation is not from God.

I'll address some more stuff on the forum where we have been corresponding on.

Now, will you address my comment?


Disappearinghead profile image

Disappearinghead 4 years ago from Wales, UK

Claire in case you are interested in an alternative explanation of Lucifer, I have written a hub.

Just because Freemasons, occultists, and New Agers believe in Lucifer as some Satan character, it doesn't make it true; they are barking up the wrong tree just like the Church.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 4 years ago from South Africa Author

I think Madame Blavatsky knows better than you. The doctrines of the United Nations are founded upon what she says. I will have to check your blog out.


butterflystar profile image

butterflystar 4 years ago from A Place of Success :)

Excellent article:) great discussions as well.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 4 years ago from South Africa Author

Thanks, butterflystar.


savvydating profile image

savvydating 3 years ago

Sounds like Marxist theology, which was adopted by Stalin, who exterminated 30 million people (or so). And the New Age is saying Lucifer is the the loving God? Please. That which tortures, degrades, removes individuality, kills, steals and dehumanizes, and who never accomplishes any good whatsoever and never has. He is suddenly the good guy? How ridiculous. It's amazing how easily people are deceived. Claire, if you are interested, The Case for The Real Jesus, by Lee Strobel addresses a LOT of this New Age stuff, and quite thoroughly. It is one of my favorite books, as it is based upon scholastic research from renowned, peer respected PhD's who are proficient in Hebrew and many other languages. The author also provides a plethora of research/books you can look up on your own, and from which some of his writing is based.

Your article is very interesting and informative. I appreciate your having written it.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 3 years ago from South Africa Author

Thanks, savvydating. What can be certain is that New Agers have no clue who Lucifer is. That's the tragedy. I suppose their concept of loving is Lucifer fooling them into thinking they can be liberated from an oppressive god.

That Lee Strobel book sounds pretty interesting. I'll keep it in mind.


andrew savage profile image

andrew savage 3 years ago from USA

Lucifer and Satan are not the same angels.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 3 years ago from South Africa Author

They are the same beings and are not angels. Satan is a spirit.


PoeticFailosophy profile image

PoeticFailosophy 3 years ago from Cuzco, Peroo

Lucifer, Satan, and the Devil are the trinity, right? Religion is so confusing to me, I can never keep up with who's an angel, spirit, fallen angel, dead human, etc etc.


Randy Godwin profile image

Randy Godwin 3 years ago from Southern Georgia

I did a review of Strobel's book mentioned in an above post. It was a total crock as the author merely accepted the apologists speculation and guesses with an, "Okay, makes sense to me." lol! He also didn't allow anything from the critical side of the supposed "case". Not worthy of reading unless you are already convinced.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 3 years ago from South Africa Author

PoeticFailosophy, Lucifer, Satan and the devil aren't the trinity. They are just different names for the same being. Randy, I haven't come across his arguments so I cannot really comment.


Mark 2 years ago

Satan, Lucifer...these are just litterary figures, created by patriarchs and male theologians. Have no fear. They are just you and me, concerning our behaviour.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 2 years ago from South Africa Author

Unfortunately Satan does exist.


savvydating profile image

savvydating 2 years ago

Randy, your statement is flawed. The author is an award winning journalist who asked probing questions of distinguished historians. It was not a thing of, "Oh, it makes sense." In fact, the book does cite other historians who agree and disagree with the premise that we can know who the historical Jesus was, particularly from the synoptic gospels. In any event, the book was created to defend who Jesus is by addressing the issue of modern scholars who say otherwise. Consequently, your statement lacks objectivity. You have summarily dismissed the book at a glance without realizing that it does an excellent job of addressing questions from skeptics, as any good journalism does.


lone77star profile image

lone77star 2 years ago from Cebu, Philippines

Claire, another outstanding write-up. It's nice to shine a light on all those dark corners where the lies are manufactured.

Talking about revelations, you might be interested in my new book. For a limited time, I'm offering a free pdf copy http://thebibleshiddenwisdom.com/

Amazing to see how something that sounds so nice and sweet can prove to be so sinister. And something like Noah's Flood can prove to be merely and only an act of love. Lucifer, it seems, wants to keep us trapped in Ego; God and Christ want us freed from the false self.

Love really is the answer.


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 2 years ago from South Africa Author

Thank you and thanks for your offer.

I'm going through a time where I am being pursued by Satanists. These particular ones pretend to be so good to the public but are wicked inside. This is how evil operates. It is the only way it survives. How can public figures come out and say, "I'm a Satanist but I want you to care for my opinion"? No, they have to pretend they care about the world like world governments do. They need public support. Utter cowardice.

Love truly is the answer, as you said. It disarms evil.


Maurice 23 months ago

David,We who are Catholic believe that Saints and Angels act as idinrmeeiartes. That they can PRAY for us, too. Note that in the second statement we state that Michael's sword defeated Satan. Lies of Satan encourage and increase depression, so one who defeated the creator of those lies is a strong ally. Does your Priest or Pastor not lead you? I can see no problem asking someone close to God to help me see him, when all I can see is DARKNESS and as a depressive, there are times that IS all I see. But in the 3rd statement, we are reminded that Michael DOES bend his will to God. Angels are messengers of God. Always have been. So I really see no wrong in asking his help from the Valley of the Shadow of Death that depression is. Make no mistake, Messengers will not save us, only Jesus can. But they can bring messages of hope, and I often need those. Peace,Ben


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 22 months ago from South Africa Author

Maurice, praying to saints and angels as intermediaries is not biblical. We should only be praying to Jesus. Only Jesus has defeated Satan.

Thank you.


Mike 14 months ago

The problem here is taking the words of the bible as literal. Most of it is allegory. In Job, the satan is not out of place among the sons of God. He carries out the will of God and is not an evil entity. Lucifer and Satan are not the same thing. You are wrong about that, influenced by Christianity I'm sure. If you're a bible literalist, tell us where it says they are the same. It doesn't. Lucifer and satan are not even proper names. They are allegory is express ideas. That's all. Just because the church says it does not make it true. You keep saying satan is real. Prove it. You cannot.


someonewhoknows profile image

someonewhoknows 14 months ago from south and west of canada,north of ohio

I thought Lucifer was a fallen Angel! Then I asked myself ! How can an Angel fall? In any case . I've always thought of Satan as Lucifer - a fallen Angel.

Pray to God? Jesus prayed to God! Jesus refuted the Idea that we should worship him. "He" is "The Way" and He taught by example! How to live! How to Treat others as you ,yourself would like to be treated! Respect your elders . Never compromise your faith in God! Or the teachings of his son. Jesus - the "Christ".


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 14 months ago from South Africa Author

Mike, as you say:

The word satan means "challenger", "difficulty", or "distraction" (note that it is not a proper name). With the leading ha- to make haSatan, it refers to /the/ challenger. This describes Satan as the angel who is the embodiment of man's challenges. HaSatan works for G-d. His job is to make choosing good over evil enough of a challenge so that it can be a meaningful choice. In other words, haSatan is an angel whose mission it is to add difficulty, challenges, and growth experiences to life. Contrast this to Christianity, which sees Satan as God's opponent. In Jewish thought, the idea that there exists anything capable of setting itself up as God's opponent would be considered overly polytheistic—you are setting up the devil to be a god or demigod."

http://www.shamash.org/lists/scj-faq/HTML/faq/12-3...

In Judaism, it is not Satan who is the evil one. It is God who is responsible for both good and evil.

It is true that in the OT, Lucifer is not the same as Satan. Planets, like the son of the morning (Venus) represented kings.

Much later, Lucifer became associated with Satan.

"Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable, blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls? Doubt it not!" [Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, p. 321, 19th Degree of Grand Pontiff; Red Emphasis added]

The Spirit of Darkness is Satan.

Ephesians 6:12

12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.

Colossians 1:13

13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves,

Yet Satan is also known as the angel of light imposter:

Colossians 1:13

4 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.

So you see how Freemasonic beliefs dove tail with what Christianity says Satan is.

How do I prove Satan exists over the Internet?


Claire Evans profile image

Claire Evans 14 months ago from South Africa Author

someonewhoknows,

Lucifer isn't a fallen angel. That's a OT myth.

Jesus didn't refute the idea that we should worship Him. First of all, He didn't stop people worshiping Him. Another thing, He did imply He was God incarnate:

John 14:9

Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?


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someonewhoknows 14 months ago from south and west of canada,north of ohio

Why then does Jesus pray to his father in heaven to spare him from tribulation of the cross ? I would agree with you that the spirit of God resided in Jesus body and that God and Jesus "Christ" shared the same .


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Jay C OBrien 2 months ago from Houston, TX USA

Perhaps I am missing something here. I like Order rather than Chaos. I like constructive activity rather that destruction. I like dialog rather than argument. I believe all cultures must be recognized. If they are not, it created hatred. Whether you agree with the culture of another, you should recognize it and learn to get along. Scripture is what You believe it is. There is something good in all cultures, just be constructive. The UN is a good thing: it creates constructive dialog.


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someonewhoknows 2 months ago from south and west of canada,north of ohio

"Order out of Chaos" is the HEGALIAN DIELECTIC - N W O - NEW WORLD ORDER promoters of their ilk intend to bring about their version of a UNITED NATIONS - one world government through CHAOS created by them.Then by imposing their version of ORDER out of the CHAOS THEY CREATE


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Jay C OBrien 2 months ago from Houston, TX USA

I said, "I like Order rather than Chaos." I did Not say, "Order out of Chaos." If you look we have world order now. Cellphones work due to the world order. The entire world shares ground based radar to track satellites. The USA now uses Russian rockets to launch satellites and interface with the International Space Station. Bravo for world order!


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someonewhoknows 2 months ago from south and west of canada,north of ohio

I know what you said! I know what you mean ! I know why you like order rather than chaos! Enough said!


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Jay C OBrien 2 months ago from Houston, TX USA

Out of curiosity, what do you think I mean? How do you know why?

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