Was Charles Manson really a serial killer or one of the first eco-warriors and a visionary?

What is the truth about Charles Manson?

Charles Manson is portrayed by the mainstream media as a serial killer and dangerous madman. Marilyn Manson picked up on this idea and used the surname to create and boost his own image as a shock-rocker. But not everyone believes that Charles Manson is as he has been depicted.

Manson has many supporters and friends who do not believe the media's version. For me, Charles Manson is a philosopher, visionary and environmentalist, and was possibly the first eco-warrrior. I know I can identify with very much he says and find a great deal of wisdom in his words.

Now I realise that many people out there feel he is a ¨monster", a "psychopath" and a "Satanist" (there are many types!), and I have heard all these labels applied but over the course of many years I have spent countless hours watching videos with him in, reading his words and about him, and I do not accept that this widely held public opinion is the right one. I used to have cassettes of his songs too. Perhaps I am biased because I am a singer-songwriter too and was impressed with his songs? Brian Wilson of the Beach Boys thought very highly of his abiity as a singer-songwriter and musician.

Perhaps I am biased because I care about nature and the environment passionately and know that Manson does too but I don't think it is as simple as that. The fact that he is an outspoken environmentalist is always left out of the majority of discussions about him in the media. Now why would that be?

Am I going to get into the argument about the murders and Manson's guilt or innocence? Not really, because I wish to focus on him as an environmentalist. That is what this article is about - Charles Manson the eco-warrior!

Charles Manson

Charles Manson in 2009. Believed to constitute 'Fair Use' to illustrate this article.
Charles Manson in 2009. Believed to constitute 'Fair Use' to illustrate this article. | Source

Air Trees Water Animals - ATWA

Charles Manson's views on what life is all about are encompassed in his idea of ATWA, which stands for Air, Trees, Water and Animals or "All The Way Alive". He argues that without air we all die, as do all animals.

Trees are the lungs of the planet and keep the air as it should be but people are destructively destroying the forests at an alarming scale. Water, which makes up a large part of out bodies and is essential for life, is running out in many places and is often polluted with toxins in others.

Animals are the amazing living beings we share this planet with as a home but many species are becoming extinct and countless animals are murdered and cruelly abused by humans on a daily basis. Billions of people have lost their respect for trees and animals, or else they would not be behaving as they are doing.

In a conversation dated 6 July 2002, Manson said: "The only food the trees need is water and we are killing that too. Do you understand that by killing the water the air goes with it by way of the tree and so do we one way or another brother, we will stop."

It is obvious to me that what he says is true. It is common sense but strangely so many people seem unaware of what is so obvious, or worse, they do know but do not care!

The Kogi mamos on their sacred mountain home of the Sierra Nevada de Santa Marta have said much the same. They are extremely worried that there is no snow high on the mountain peaks where it should be. The snow and ice and clouds around the mountains create water for lower down and if there is no snow, no ice and no clouds there can be no water. Without water all will die. It is that simple.

Manson has said that the "Air is God" and "Ecology is God." Without air we all die, without a balanced ecosystem animals and plants are dying out and many people are worried about the future of the human race. We cannot keep on destroying nature and waging war against the planet!

The media has lied to you about Charles Manson

Manson was arrested for arson

In the Wikipedia entry for ATWA it is explained that Charles Manson was arrested in December 1969, not for murder, but for arson because he had set fire to a Michigan Loader earth-moving vehicle. This was an attempt to stop road construction in the Death Valley area where he and his group were at the time.

The term eco-warrior was to be coined many years after this, and has been used to describe environmentalist protesters who take direct action to help ensure the safety of the land and natural habitats. Some eco-warriors have engaged in damaging property that belongs to firms that are destroying forests or building roads.

Eco-warriors often end up in court cases. Charles Manson was arrested for arson originally, but he was held and charged with conspiracy to commit murders and it was this that he was convicted of and made the headlines with not his environmental activism.

Whilst many people in today's 'Green Movement' might not like the idea of having Manson held up as a representative of their beliefs because of the reputation he has had as a killer, what he has said about the Air, Trees, water and Animals is clearly the truth!

System of a Down

System of a Down or SOAD,  as they are also known, are a hard-rock band from Southern California with all of the members being Armenian- Americans. The group are known for being very outspoken and for dealing with controversial subjects in their work and lyrics. 

System of a Down paid tribute to Charles Manson and his ideas with their song Atwa from their album Toxicity.

System Of A Down - A.T.W.A.

Was Charles Manson guilty?

Do you believe Charles Manson was guilty and convicted fairly?

  • Yes
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© 2011 Steve Andrews

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Comments 50 comments

Peter Allison profile image

Peter Allison 4 years ago from Alameda, CA

'Concern for the environment' was only one ruse that Chuck used to lure followers to carry out his violent fantasies. The swastika on his forehead says it all. (I know... that was just theater too.)


The Rising Glory profile image

The Rising Glory 4 years ago from California

Deception is rampant in the USA. While everyone can have their personal beliefs about anything, believing a lie is still a lie.

Charles Manson lives about 30 miles from my home. I personally know guards who have had his security detail. The man is a nutcase through and through.


Karen N profile image

Karen N 4 years ago from United States

To me everything else is over-shadowed by what he did.

While he may not have committed the murders himself, he was the one in charge and his followers were carrying out his orders.

In my opinion the man is insane and is incapable of loving anything except maybe himself. A psychopath is very skilled at manipulating people and telling them just what they want to hear in order to exert his control over them.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

As I said I was expecting comments like yours! The swastika is an ancient symbol of the sun and used by many other cultures and religions before it got its comparatively recent current sinister image. See here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika


Alternative Prime profile image

Alternative Prime 4 years ago from > California

Charles Manson is not the mysterious, mystical, borderline genius/madman who could control the universe with a simple wave of his hand the media always seems to portray him as, quite the contrary. With only snippets of vintage pre-prison film footage and or brief sanitized interviews conducted while incarcerated after conviction to reference, it's fairly easy even for the non professional psycho analyzer to evaluate and render an accurate diagnosis of his stable yet diabolical mental condition.

Charles Manson was essentially a disenfranchised musician who wanted nothing more than to be placed upon an artistic pedestal alongside his idols and true artistic legends such as the Beatles, who, after being denied this accolade, ultimately took his frustration out on society while trying to excuse or mitigate the significance of his atrocities by placing blame on his apparent dysfunctional upbringing.

The distance between his distorted mind and genius is the equivalent of the number of light years between Planet Earth and our possible origins over in Zeta Reticuli, which is quite far the last time I personally measured. However, he was endowed with age and charisma as advantages over his younger immature congregation which can, and did unfortunately, turn out to be a powerful set of tools as he pursued his manipulative purpose.

Eco Warrior? Everyone who is convicted of a crime repents and is miraculously transformed into a man or woman of divine purpose, the "Mantra" he decided to conveniently adopt was "Environmental Advocate". His brief liaisons with activism prior to conviction were in my opinion, something to bring along with him to jail after sentencing.

Intriguing Piece - Thanks For Publishing -

- Alternative Prime -


PaulGoodman67 profile image

PaulGoodman67 4 years ago from Florida USA

The Swastika is an ancient sun symbol, this is true. Manson also believed that groups like the Black Panthers were the start of huge race war that black people were going to initiate against white people. Whether Manson carved a swastiki into his forehead to show sympathy with Hinduism or nazi mysticism, or for some other reason can only be guessed at.

His eco ideas are just part of a bigger, grand theory that he had, according to his followers and himself. Whether you can accept parts of his grand theory and reject other parts, such as his profound racism, his belief in the inferiority of women, and apocalyptic paranoia is questionable. The green ideas are certainly more palatable than some of his other ideas.

Manson is clever in terms of manipulation and people skills and has charisma, but he is hardly an intellectual heavyweight. I genuinely find it hard to understand what was or is uniquely "visionary" about him.

I think Manson did a profound discredit to the eco movement. He was the hippy from hell, a gift to rightwing politicians and people who oppose Green ideals.

I have known modern eco-warriors, such as Earth First. They are generally responsible people with a sense of moral obligation. I am uncomfortable with the idea of you linking Manson with them.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

In my opinion the best way of knowing what Manson's ideas are is not from the media and not from books but from what he says and from what his supporters have said about him. I admit I have heard him speak of women in an inferior way and I cannot agree with him on that at all! With regard to what he says about ecology and the planet I have no disagreement with any of it. He is right: we depend on the air, on trees and water. If we destroy them we die as do the animals.


trecords0 profile image

trecords0 4 years ago from DeLand, Florida

I agree with your right to believe and feel what ever you like, and I support that. The only real research I personally have done on Manson was to read Helter Skelter, and I read it when I was too young to understand "spin". There was a scene described therein about an acid party and how it turned into an orgy, then suicide. Although I know that the swastika was used as a cardinal symbol, I cannot educate the public to believe it was anything but a symbol relating to the Nazis. Just as the Confederate flag is not offensive to me, it is to the black community. Manson is the epitome of what put an end to the hippy culture, good or bad.

I think you did a good thing by stirring up peoples feelings about this subject; that's what we are called to do sometimes as writers. But I also feel like you walked into a room of holocaust survivors wearing the uniform, waving the flag, and singing the praises of Hitler. Might as well be a black rapper with his pants down so he can't run with his arm around a white blond girl at a KKK rally. I feel a lynching coming on, and I'll do what I can to stand by your right to have an opinion, but I'm sorry, I think that's where I draw the line. I would have chosen a better role model to support the fight for ecology.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

You are right about the sort of reaction this is getting as can be seen from the comments here and also at Facebook where I have shared the link. Just because a load of people believe something that has been pushed as the correct version of anything doesn't mean it is true but merely that it has been pushed that well that it has become accepted. You could say the same about any religion - billions believe all the major religions as fact but I believe they are all based around books of stories that have become accepted as the truth by a very large number of people. It doesn't mean that they are true!


stclairjack profile image

stclairjack 4 years ago from middle of freekin nowhere,... the sticks

wow

charles manson is an eco-warior,...

i at least take comfort that you knew and were, i assume, prepared for the responses you would get for this piece..... you got stones my friend,... thats a fact.

i myself am perfectly willing to listen to a reasoned point of view, and aplaud you in being reasoned in your responses as well,...

but wow,... gota say it,...

if you can separate the crimes from the post incarsaration spin so as to talk up the eco-warior status of charles manson,.... you should be in sales,...

ocean front property on the moon,... used cars in amish country,... etc.

so charles got the mother earth thing right,.... yea,... hitler was a master orator and his nazi government were organizational and logistics wizards,... realy if you can compartmentalize that well,... you can make that leap with me,... yes?

even a broken clock is right twice a day,....

if jeffery dahmer wrote and talked about the value of a well ballanced diet after going to prison,.... that doesn't make him a nutritional expert.

best of luck my ballsy friend,.... i loved this by the way,... well done,...fantasy,.... but well done fantasy.

(please try and picture the wry smile on my face with the twinkling fire of respect for a fellow shock jock in my eye)


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you for your feedback! I actually got inspired to put this hub together because I am writing a book entitled The Dropouts and the starting point is my recollection of hearing Manson saying that what Timothy Leary had advised people, namely, turning on, tuning in and dropping out was a bad idea, and he (Manson) was speaking from experience of having lived in the world of the drop outs. As one who took Leary's advice I can see in retrospect that I would have been better off listening to Manson's advice of not doing this had that advice been available to me. A point I am making in my book is that most people I knew that dropped out at the end of the sixties are all dead now. So it's not just his ecology ideas but other stuff he has said too.


trecords0 profile image

trecords0 4 years ago from DeLand, Florida

I totally agree with your comment on religion and that is a better senario than the 2 ways I put it. I figure I would have rather used Frank Zappa as the framework for an ecological article, or even as one who was against the drop out culture of the hippies. I think he was more of a radical by becoming accepted by the freaks through his music and speaking his conservative mind; like a Trojan horse. The Hunter Thompson story of becoming a Hells Angels also comes to mind. The modern word for this is embedded. Interesting thoughts BoE. Thanks for getting the gears going. Tim.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you, Tim! I wanted to write about Manson as he is made reference to in the book I'm writing and in my hub about it. I am actually still looking for the exact quote he made about Leary but there are an awful lot of videos to trawl through and it's probably not that important that I find it. I write hubs about what I am thinking about. I thought I'd explain the positive side of Manson. I believe in credit where credit is due. If something is right it is right. It is not a popularity contest over who said it or believed it, or it shouldn't be! btw I have mentioned Hunter S Thompson in my book Herbs of the Northern Shaman in re him talking about datura in Fear and Loathing and how this led a lot of hippie types to want to try this very dangerous herb. I speak from experience as one who did so and survived. Others I know that used the plant are mostly dead, not killed directly by it but from self-destructive drug usage and lifestyles! Impressionable and searching minds take info from all sorts of sources. Some of the info can result in danger to self or others.


Angie Jardine profile image

Angie Jardine 4 years ago from Cornwall, land of the eternally youthful mind ...

Hi Bard ... interesting concept for a hub and it would appear that you have opened up a whole can of organic worms here.

I can't say I find Manson particularly charismatic (either then or now) as anyone who disrespects women is, in my book, a totally arrogant idiot. I can't say that I was too impressed by the somewhat needy women who stood up for him either ... he's just some sort of Svengali cult leader and there will always be damaged and gullible women who fall for the spiel of such men.

Leaving aside what he did or did not do all that time ago ... it is possible to find, and admire, much more persuasive eco-warriors ... yourself included.

Anyone can rant on about the destruction of the planet and its animals, anyone can spout about the environment ... I'm a rabid environmentalist myself. Most of us who haven't been living in a hole in the ground know we are destroying our planet and we know how it is being destroyed.

We also know corporate greed is the driving force behind much of the destruction of our world and many of us are worried about that and are trying to do something about it.

But as for Manson ... forget it. Media feeding frenzy of long ago or not ... he is just not a credible witness for environmentalism ... and it's unlikely anyone will consider his testimony relevant.

But well done for starting such an interesting discussion.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

If he really does disrespect women that is something I do not agree with him on at all but that leaves the question of why does he have so many women supporters including those who knew him back then? I wouldn't say they were or are "damaged and gullible women". A point I am making is that Manson hasn't just added this environmentalism on to his image or to gain support because he was on about this sort of stuff to begin with. Personally I find him a fascinating person to listen to on many subjects. Yes, he can come over as "arrogant" but he can also be the opposite. There is a speech he makes in which he calls himself a "nobody" and a "tramp, a bum, a hobo..." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrqaPThCmI


lisadpreston profile image

lisadpreston 4 years ago from Columbus, Ohio

Bard, great hub. I didn't read the comments for fear of the negativity. I knew there was a reason why I liked Charlie. I thought maybe it was because I'm always for the underdog. I have watched many interviews of him and I honestly like the guy's truth. People can't handle his kind of honesty and truth. If he loved the environment and animals, he can't be that bad. We have to think of his time period and how everyone was trying to make statements. He was screwed over on his music career and maybe due to his upbringing, he didn't have what society deems as normal coping skills. I don't condone murder at all, but if society would have put as much effort into helping Manson and listening to him, as they did with his trial and his ongoing bashing, maybe he would have discovered a less violent outlet for his ideas. When someone with his intelligence, passion, drive, honesty, and charisma is not heard and only looked down upon, they will be heard one way or another and oftentimes in a very negative way. He has always said that he was a survivor. I can't fault him for being a poor youth, stealing and committing petty crimes as a youth to survive. Our system failed him as it does so many.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you, Lisa! You see in him a lot that I see!


lisadpreston profile image

lisadpreston 4 years ago from Columbus, Ohio

I see it has been 117 minutes since my comment and that is how long I have been on this hub studying Manson from your links. My writing partner has suffered through it, knowing that I am crazy. Wow. After reading the ATWA site, listening to his songs, reading his statements, Jon and I both have come to the conclusion that he (Manson) was brilliant and honestly, I may have been in his family had I been older during that period. Not as a follower, I don't follow, believe me, but maybe as a co-leader. LOL. I seriously wonder, due to my thinking if I may have had the same mind set. I love his philosophy and I didn't see dates of many of the things he said but surely he was way ahead of his time. I am astonished at his one world order concept. Everyone is so against it, including me, however, if we take the ideas in it's purity it is wonderful. Even communism, socialism, in it's purity is excellent to me. The problem arises when greed corrupts it. So I commend Manson's ideas, his truth, his honesty, his bravery and sadly I relate to him. But like him, I don't follow or give a rats ass what society thinks. Well done, Bard, this was the best hub ever, although you made me think too much.


lisadpreston profile image

lisadpreston 4 years ago from Columbus, Ohio

P.S. He nurtured a bird back to life. this is not what psychopathic killers who are evil do. Many psychopaths kill animals and have no respect for life. This is not Manson. I do not believe he was an evil killer, only trying to make a statement FOR life, and that in his eyes and many others such as myself, it was society that is the true killer of life.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

I am glad it has made you think, Lisa! For me that is something no one can deny about Manson - he stimulates a tremendous amount of thought!


LewSethics profile image

LewSethics 4 years ago

I was drawn to this article by the title, but I knew before I read it that I wouldn't like it. I'm old enough to remember the events that made this person famous.

Manson isn't saying anything original now, and he wasn't saying anything original then.

The media claimed to have 'educated' us to our plight with the environment, but in reality it was the companies that polluted our natural resources that were the only ones that ignored the consequences of polluting.

Regular people always knew it was wrong and complained to authorities (who were often beholding to chemical companies who were contributing large amounts of money to election campaigns) but by and by progress was made, without killing pregnant mothers. Only an idiot wouldn't understand that polluting the world will eventually kill it. I wonder when that statement became science.

Rewriting history and glorifying monsters is just the media capitalizing on shock, and you seem to be doing the same here.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

The difference between us is that I am not convinced of his guilt. Also I don't think the rights or wrongs of a person's character should come into judging individual statements of actions they have made. If something is right it doesn't matter who said it! Thank you for your feedback though. You say that "only an idiot wouldn't understand that polluting the world will eventually kill it" so if you are right the world is full of "idiots" seeing as vast numbers of people see nothing wrong with throwing their rubbish away carelessly and making little or no effort to recycle.


LewSethics profile image

LewSethics 4 years ago

'The world is full of idiots', haha, you got me there bud, although Manson being the 'first' eco warrior is stretching it a bit..

Thanks for the feedback, Bard, food for thought.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

I agree I was "stretching it a bit" but I wanted a good title!


Terri Meredith profile image

Terri Meredith 4 years ago from Pennsylvania

I'm so glad that here toward the end of the comments, I started seeing a few somewhat positive ones. I was very young when my mother informed me that Sharon Tate had been killed. After that, the "truth" as the media explained it, became fact. I was in high school by the time I read the book Helter Skelter. Even then, I had trouble understanding why Charlie was convicted. There clearly was no real defining evidence that he had anything at all to do with it. Even if he was the "leader" of the group, how does that translate to their decision to carry out murders as being something he had control over. I might tell you to go play in traffic, so does that mean if you do it, that I am responsible for any injuries you sustain as a result? Now, if I'm your shrink and I tell you it will make you feel better, you might have a case. The law enforcement system, as well as the media, are the ones who created the fabrication known by most as Charles Manson.

While those in power and control have written him off as a total loony toon, a crazy nut-job, they have undersigned a belief that he has some type of super power in being able to control people and their minds. Really? Then why are they maligning him for supposedly exploiting that power they say doesn't exist?

Charles Manson quite possibly may have some mental imbalance. Who really knows for sure? He clearly is extremely intelligent, more so than most humans are capable of understanding his abstract thinking. Most geniuses are referred to as being crazy in some way simply because the average human cannot wrap their heads around the abstract images and explanations which are so obvious to such genius. As far as his "followers" go, they were nothing more than mixed up kids with stars in their eyes, looking for excuses to enjoy their dark anger and pretend it was used for good purposes.

I don't care what he was accused of, or even whether he was involved or not. We all know that we are destroying our planet, now, after we have been forced to begin suffering the consequences. Manson spoke of this long before it was popular to do so. To dismiss the message as though there is no importance simply because we don't like the person uttering it, is like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Really liked your thinking on this, though I couldn't force myself to get through the rambling discussion provided by the young lady who is obviously stoned out of her guord.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you for your well reasoned and positive feedback, Terri!


fpherj48 profile image

fpherj48 4 years ago from Beautiful Upstate New York

Well, well, I need to admit, at first I thought this hub was some sort of a joke or "toungue-in-cheek," PSA.

Manson was fairly smart when a young drifter. He used his IQ to be cunning and coniving. He had props (bible) and magic tricks (learned a few tunes on his guitar) and what some lost souls called, "Charisma." Mentally stable individuals usually refer to this as the gift of bullshit.

An eco-warrior? I see. Wow, if not for Charley, the scientists, environmentalists and ecologists would all be thrashing about aimlessly, not knowing a thing. Personally I owe Manson a debt of gratitude for informing us that without air, we die. Who'd have ever guessed it?

The young lady(?)in the video, who struggles to defend Charley against the mean old media, and the nasty Prosecutor, must be all of 18 years old and sorely under-educated. There goes her career in Public Speaking!

Manson was convicted for the multiple murders because he carefully PLANNED them, groomed his drug-crazed devotees, DROVE THEM TO THE SCENE(S) OF THE CRIMES and rewarded them for a "job well-done."

It does not require "super powers" to brain wash, weak-minded, morally bankrupt individuals. Manson proved any street-bum, fast-talking, guitar-strumming enigma can do it easily.

When 8 precious lives are brutally snuffed out by savage acts of hatred and rage.....without a single twinge of guilt.....most people tend to not give a rat's ass if the guy had some fairly intelligent ideas on the environment.

He used that alleged "intelligence" in ALL the worst ways imaginable. He'll get no kudos from me.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thanks for posting, though I can't say I agree with your opinion!


fpherj48 profile image

fpherj48 4 years ago from Beautiful Upstate New York

You are quite welcome, Bard of Ely. My only intent is to state truth and facts, not to yield "agreement" from anyone. I don't require validation for being knowledgeable on a specific topic. It is what it is.

Have a nice day, Sir.


Kim Cantrell profile image

Kim Cantrell 4 years ago from Deep In The Pages of a Book

Wow, so Charley loves nature and is appalled man is killing our own eco-system yet he apparently had no problem with murdering a pregnant woman.

I'm not impressed.

Yes, Americans can be gullible - I'll agree. But the rest of the world needs to stop thinking it's only us because, fact is, we're not alone.

An earlier comment says they've talked with some of Charley's guards, that's fantastic but any of them working around him now are new-schoolers. My late ex-father-in-law worked in the prison when Charles Manson was FIRST committed. I listened to numerous stories about how whacked out the man was. THEN was actuality, not NOW when Charles has been behind bars long enough and well-medicated, keeping his happy azz calm. A man can get rather philosophical and mature when he has nothing better to do - especially when he's standing at the threshold of his maker's door.

I respect your opinions, but that's just what they are: opinions. But I am insulted that you believe that AMERICANS are misguided and haven't seen Charles Manson for what he is. But more than anything, I'm sadden, that anyone gives Charley what he wants: an argument that he's a GOOD man.

Of course, I'm an expert, you could say, of laughing through the tears so...thanks for the chuckles. :)


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Kim, this has nothing to do with what I am saying about Americans because people in the UK and elsewhere mainly hold the same views as you! I read a book about him years ago that most people accept as the truth. I have also watched countless videos of him talking, videos of others talking about him and read elsewhere about him and I am of the opinion I have stated here. None of us actually know him and none of us were there at the time of the murders so how can any of us be so sure he is guilty? This hub is not about that anyway but about his views on environmentalism.


fpherj48 profile image

fpherj48 4 years ago from Beautiful Upstate New York

Bard...Be honest, please, if nothing else. You went much further than simply state the psycho's views on environmentalism. You basically sang praises and held the jerk up as some sort of BRAIN. A "visionary."?!

At one time, his brain was pretty good (mostly clever) but he USED it in every wrong and distorted way possible.

So SURE he is "guilty??" That's not even worthy of comment!

As Kim has said, so correctly....you cannot be denied your "opinions." However skewered they may be.

Thousands of individuals have had brilliant foresight and impressive views on environmentalism, as well as other "isms".....they have not gone the Manson route in life.

What your HUB IS ABOUT, Sir, is what the READERS glean from it. Too late to attempt to "explain" what you think you meant to present.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

I have just re-read what I posted and see that I had already actually written this: "Am I going to get into the argument about the murders and Manson's guilt or innocence? Not really, because I wish to focus on him as an environmentalist. That is what this article is about - Charles Manson the eco-warrior!"


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 4 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

Nice work, Bard.

Thanks so much for this.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you, Huntgoddess!


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 4 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

Np, Bard. Impressive profile --- and body of work. I'll be so looking forward to reading and listening more.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you again!


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 4 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

NP, Bard.

I remember the Bishop of Ely, from Shakespeare's Richard III. Is your name a reference to the Bishop? Or the strawberries? My son played in the role of Buckingham once (Richard's right-hand man --- for a while).

When the bishop arrived with the basket of strawberries, Buckingham took a strawberry and tossed it through the air to Richard --- who caught it perfectly, all the way across the stage. It was quite a moment, and I think somebody even caught it on video.

I don't know Shakespeare well enough to know the exact Act and Scene. It happens in the scene where Richard decides to condemn Hastings. I'm trying to look it up, but not finding anything right now.

Take care, Bard.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Nothing to do with it,no, nothing so interesting as that. My title is because I was living in the Ely housing estate in Cardiff.


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 4 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

LOL, thanks, bard. Just wondering. :-))


Wayne K. WIlkins profile image

Wayne K. WIlkins 4 years ago from Birmingham, England.

I recently conducted an interview with Star, a friend of Manson's, covering many of these topics, including ATWA:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syQbGOIDj5o


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Hi Wayne! Thanks for sharing!


Wayne K. WIlkins profile image

Wayne K. WIlkins 4 years ago from Birmingham, England.

Brilliant hub, by the way. Very refreshing to read and I agree, Charlie probably was the world's original eco warrior. Can only imagine what it's like for him - hearing from Star and Gray Wolf exactly what the hell is going on outside in the world when all he can do is sit and listen, almost oblivious and unable to physically watch. For someone in the mindset of Charlie, who has always been driven by his ATWA theory, it really must be hell.

If his message could get out there, it really could make a difference and a positive impact on the world!

Keep up the great work!


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 4 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thank you, Wayne! So many people have bought the media version and won't consider that it might not be true!


Jodah profile image

Jodah 2 years ago from Queensland Australia

Interesting read Bard of Ely. I had never heard this side or point of view before.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 2 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

I am glad you found this of interest!


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 2 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

Yes, I get so tired of those who just swallow the entire media story, hook, line and sinker.

It seems obvious that he is being drugged so that he looks bad on TV.


Bard of Ely profile image

Bard of Ely 2 years ago from Lisbon, Portugal Author

Thanks for your thoughts on this!


Huntgoddess profile image

Huntgoddess 2 years ago from Midwest U.S.A.

No problem, Bard. Take care.


David 2 years ago

Despite the facts, despite the swastika self-carved into his more head, and by the way, its not a Buddhist swastika, its a nazi swastika. The nazi swastika is rotated 45 degrees as opposed to the Buddhist swastika. But I digress. Charles Manson is insane. This is not a debatable point. Charles Manson masterminded some of the most horrific murders in the history of California. Sharon Tate was 9 mos pregnant, and his followers cut the baby from Sharon's womb. That being said, you have sympathy for this man, because he has spoken eloquently about the environment. Well, thank you for making the rational thought capabilities of rabid environmentalists so plain for the world to see. You hold up Charles Manson as a hero, and you even voice doubts as to whether he was fairly convicted? And some other, equally rationally minded environmentalist stated that it was the system that failed Charles Manson. LOTS of people have horrible, abusive childhoods. They don't become murderous cult leaders. But again, I digress. You hold up Charles Manson as a kindred spirit, a like minded victim of bad press. A convicted killer, a self confessed neo nazi, a racist, a misogynist. But hey, he loves the environment, so he can't be all that bad. You ally yourself with the likes of this man, and I am being generous with that description. But you consider republicans to be satan incarnate. Right. Thank you so much for exposing your own lunacy to the world. All the right wing publications in the world couldn't have been anywhere nearly as effective. By the way, you scare the hell out of me. Society is not safe from Charles Manson, and I am not sure it is safe from another of his converts who is free, and arguing in his defense.

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