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Keith Abt says
Georgianna Lowery says
Too bad georgie doesn't actually know what goes on inside a gun show. All buyers and all sellers must abide by all state/federal laws at a gun show, or over the backyard fence. If not, it is an illegal transaction.
Okay, Jack. So I CAN'T just walk into a gun show and walk back out without the same waiting period I would have if I bought from a local gun dealer? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
George, in a private sale, which is allowed in about 45 states, you can legally buy a gun across your back yard fence, in the parking lot of the local 7/11 or at the 'ol swimming hole. The gun show has nothing to do with where you purchase it.
But George, no matter where it is you buy the firearm both you and the seller MUST abide by all local/state/federal laws or it becomes an illegal sale. You get caught you go to jail.
FWIW, just because we SHOULD abide by the laws, doesn't mean we always DO. I have no problem with the law requiring a background check and a waiting period before ANY gun sale. Of course, this doesn't mean that the people who shouln't have them won't
Really, George... so you think it is completely ~reasonable~ that someone who already has 5 guns at home must wait a week to pick up his 6th gun just in case he is "angry" with someone? And Dear Readers, this is why gun control has failed so badly.
Yes, George, you are right... the bad guys will simply not abide by the law of background checks which pretty much means you're backing a meaningless law that accomplishes absolutely nothing. But it makes you feeeel gooood and that is very important.
If that guy with five guns has to wait a while so that the really mad p.o.'d one who wants to shoot his cheating wife can't do it today, then yes. Ice cream makes me feel good, violent folks with guns make me feel afraid. I don't like fear.
George sets the amount of freedom that others can have by the acts of those around us who are social deviants, weak minded and unable to process life in as a law abiding citizen. Those are the ones who determine your freedoms.
Twist it around all you like, but I believe I should have the right to not get shot by someone freak who shouldn't have a gun in the first place. Also, I refuse to argue anymore with someone who spells my name incorrectly 6 out of 7 times.
Majority rules, minority rights. Just because many people agree to trample the rights of free Americans, doesn't mean they can. Just ask a same sex couple if majority rules or minority rights.
I'm struggling to understand how background checks are trampling anyone's rights. Also, neither the majority nor the minority affected this outcome. Lobbyists did. IMO, big bucks are trampling all over everybody's rights to get what they want.
If background checks don't "affect anyone's rights" then lets have more of them... to buy a Bible... to vote in an election... to write a letter to the editor.... to assemble as a group.... to petition the government. All kinds of checks, eh.
Mr. Burton, you are going to the extreme. Guns can be dangerous. Five years ago I did not have cataracts on my eyes. Today I do. Do you not think my ability to fire a gun accurately has been impaired. I don't want to ban guns. I want reasonable regs.
You don't think religion and freedom of speech can be "dangerous"? And what happened to the concept of personal responsibility? The nanny state trumps all, eh. And sorry, but we don't trust you. When your current "regs" don't work you just come back
Jack made and excellant point by referencing all of the things he did. Cars kill more people than guns, but I don't need a background check to buy one.
I believe that people should have to pass a background check before being provided access to the internet. To pass this check, you must prove understanding that people are allowed to have their own opinions. Some of you need another hobby.
Georgie confuses us knowing that other people can have their own opinions and us knowing that some people have really stupid opinions. It's always those with especially stupid opinions who think their should be mandatory respect for their opinion
No, Jack, the stupid ones keep hammering their own opinions in until either the other folks give up or they think they've "won." It's sad, really.
Tell me about it, Geo. That's why this noted and respected liberal commentator takes fellow libs to task for doing just that over the issue of gun control -- http://tinyurl.com/ce6d7xr . She lays out six exceedingly dumb things the anti-gun folk do.
That's all fine and dandy, Jack, but I'm not a liberal. So I'm not going to bother with this link. I'm also not anti-gun. Thanks for sharing, though.
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Michael Collins says
Michael Valencia says
Warren Samu says
Jack Burton says
Hi Jack (do I know you?)
I think we should have a national ID card such as the one from the show Fringe. The card could be the background check, license, proof of citizenship, and currency. A show Me for everyone.
I guess neither of you have gotten your driving license renewed within the last year. It's gone federal now and you have to have all kinds of legal papers with you. Now auto renew now.
So the Lady agrees to background checks and ID for voters?
Jack that is not what I said.
So you do or you don't agree with background checks and ID for voters. After all, an honest citizen has nothing to hide, If you are an everyday citizen you have nothing to worry about said the original post.
My state requires that I produce a valid government issued ID before I vote. It has done that for years.
Good, Larry... then you should have no trouble with it being a federal requirement.
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Marianne Sherret says
Also known as the Anarchist Conundrum.
Because it's those that shoot kids that fall into that wide group. These checks will hopefully weed out some of them. You can't get all of them but at least get some!
The writers and sponsors of the ubc bill said outright that it would not have prevented ANY of the recent shootings. Why does 2bealive keep dancing in the blood of those children to get a useless law? And they wonder why gun owners don't trust them..
@ 2bealive - How about we weed out those who might use their vehicles as a means of committing homicide? That seems to fit with your logic....or does it?
Well, decades of licensing and registration has not "weeded out" a single person who later used their vehicle to kill people... yet you somehow believe it will magically work with firearms, eh.
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I am not real sure about 90% agreeing. Maybe 90% wouldn't mind background check, but that is very different than 90% wanting it. I think gun control people are misrepresenting that fact.
midown... the poll doesn't actually get around to telling people that there already ARE background checks on all guns sold by a dealer. Those "90 percent" are agreeing with a system we already have.
Getting into the "Federal" registry is almost a daily event. Pay taxes, you're in the registry, federal and State. No big deal. It's part of this country. As for confiscating guns. Not likely.
Tell that to the good folk of New York State where they are confiscating guns now.
New York taking guns is a joke. They tried to regulate soda size. NY is violating the 2nd Amendment and they won't hold water in the FED courts. NY is not the federal government. It's just another loud drum being banged.
Doesn't change the fact that you were wrong.
It all depends on what's 'Wrong'. 'Right' Jack?
You said it is "not likely" that guns will be confiscated. New York is now confiscating guns. I would say that puts you squarely in the category of "wrong." Perhaps you have another definition of it, eh.
Jack you have to keep your subjects together. The big stink is the Feds monkeying around with the 2nd amendment. No they are not. NY is stepping outside of the 2nd. Site me a name in the Feds that say the FEDS will take away your guns.
The fact is that US Citizens guns are being confiscated. Key words being US Citizens.
2be has what is referred to as "moving goalposts" in a discussion. When his argument is proven false, he suddenly changes it to a different argument and says, neener, neener, you didn't answer it. Does the gun owner really ~care~ WHO is doing it?
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Larry Wall says
A lot of your suggestions are already successfully implemented in Australia. :)
I think a waiting period before a newspaper can publish a story is a must, because it gives time to allow the government to check the accuracy and thrust of the article, and to make sure the reporter isn't biased or mad when he wrote it.
Plus, journalist need to be licensed by the government and renewed every few years. This allows the government to check previous writings, and to discern a trend if the journalist is no longer able to do the job with accuracy and factual info.
Would that same restriction apply to hub writers, letters to the editor and gun magazine writers?
A recent court case out of the east coast declared a blogger a journalist protect by the state shield law, Do u think magazine writers are "journalists"? Perhaps at least 3 LTEs in one quarter qualifies. It can be negotiated in the petty details.
Mr. Burton a journalism degree does not make someone a journalist. A gun does not make you a marksman. Both can have impact on many people. There are restrictions on journalists. Some restrictions are needed on guns.
Perhaps you might try listing some of these prior restraint "restrictions" on journalists
Mr. Burton, what is your point. I said there were restraints on journalists. If a journalist does not agree with a prior restraint order, he can fight it in court. However, libel laws are set in stone. Illegally acquiring public document means jail.
libel laws are not prior restraint, neither are the gaining of documents. And no court is going to uphold a prior restraint law. Yet virtually every gun law u want is prior restraint. Punish the people who misuse a gun and leave the rest of us alone
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Alberic O says
Debra Allen says
perhaps you can look into your soapbox to explain why you want to make the 99.999 percent of gun owners jump thru hoops when it is 0,001 percent who cause problems. What other legal products that are misused by such a small percent do you control?
I don't think everyone should own a gun, period ...but those who want one we should make durned sure why they want them--especially if they are more than a had gu or hunting gun. Everyone does not need an assult rifle. That is my point.
What business is it of ~yours~ why people want a gun. As long as they don't hurt anyone with it then you have no more right to know why than I have a right to know why a neighbor wants an abortion.
The Lady doesn't know much about guns but she knows what everyone needs. She doesn't know that her so-called assault rifle is a preferred hunting gun by millions, and the standard deer rifle is much more powerful than that evil black gun she dislikes
Jack, your neighbor's abortion is much less likely to kill you than his AK47.
About ten million AKs and ARs out there in circulation. About 200 of them each year are used to harm someone. You can check my math but as I figure it, the odds are about 1 out of 50,000, or 0.0002 percent that one will harm me or you.
So... Geo., with a 99.9998% chance that me or anyone else owning an AK will never, ever do u or anyone else harm just what do u have against them other then you think they are black/scary looking? And maybe that aborted baby would have cured cancer
Still much higher than getting killed by your neighbor's abortion.
I'd kinda like a cancer cure.
So would I. I would also not like to have to turn on the television and see that some gun toting maniac is shooting up a school. Again. How many of those kids could have cured cancer?
Since the ubc , by the admission of the sponsors who wrote it, would not have prevented Sandy Hook or any of the other shootings using SH as an excuse for passing it is living in fantasy land. I prefer to live in reality.
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The law will have to state which mental illness and which symptoms. Also, it will have state which disorders (if any) can be effectively treated. But schizophrenia pales in comparison to psychopathy and anti social personality disorder
I don't know how they can find out that info with doctor/patient confidentiality. Where would they go to get that info? Plus, what if this happened when the person was a minor. That info is locked.
We already require that those who are forced by the courts to seek mental treatment be banned from getting firearms. Also, certain mental disorders like schizophrenia can be treated, some like psychopathy cannot.
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90 percent of Americans don't even agree if the sun is shining yet you want to use a bogus poll to justify modifying a Bill of Rights provision?Especially since that law would have done nothing to prevent Sandy Hook? This is "reasonable" gun control.
Bogus Jack? 1st. It does nothing to remove your rights to have a gun. It does nothing to take your gun away from you. All it wants to do is keep the guns away from the crazies. What's wrong with that?
Any poll that says '90+% of the country (US)' is bogus. Look at the sample space or how many people were interviewed. The amount of data collected doesn't even amount to 5% of the entire population at most. It's funny how both sides use statistics.
Then 2bealive obviously must agree with the idea of a background check and ID to vote since it doesn't take anything away from the voter. All it does it keep the non-citizen from voting. What's wrong with that?
Btw, I'm not Jack. Jack Burton is Jack. I'm simply telling about the inaccuracy of statistics. How can you take a poll of 10,000 people and say 9,000 that voted 'yes' represents the views of the US population?
Al, there were less that 400 people queried in that poll. BTW, my dear wife is very glad that you are you and I am I. :-)
Haha, you just made a point of my statistic example way stronger. In regarding polls, I'd be impressed if they can even get 20,000 people to take it. But people are too dumb to realize the limitations of polls and statistics.
2bealive, you said it doesn't take away rights, but gun control does not prevent gun crimes either. It is a waste of taxpayer dollars and is a waste of time when we have more important issues in this country.
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