France initiates Liberal Progressive Heaven.

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   JSChamsposted 11 years ago

   http://hotair.com/archives/2012/09/28/y … h-earners/
   
   France has sent their tax rate to 75%. On the wealthy of course. Fine.
   So let's all....and I do mean all...take a break for about five years and leave them alone and see what happens. This is the type of Nirvana tactic  the left wants. Here's the test subject.
   If it works the left can tell us they are right....
   But if not.................................

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      Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      We don't have to look to France as a test case.
      The United States had a similar tax rate for 40 years before Reagan!
      
      http://www.ntu.org/tax-basics/history-o … ual-1.html

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      gmwilliamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      75% taxation way too much!  Well, this is the second French Revolution, instead of saying off with their heads, it is now off with their monies! 
      
      However, there must be some type of income balance.   There should not be any poverty in the world at all but a standardized livable wage instead of minimum wate.  The wealthy should be taxed from 45%-50%.

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      Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      The best years of American development occurred under the same tax rate.

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      Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I would also like to add that there are plenty of examples to look at if you want to see what a moderate socialist state can achieve, take Brazil for example which has been socialist for about a decade, has halved poverty, grown from the 11th to the 6th largest economy in the world and is about to become #5 and it's president has just retired having served his terms as the most popular president in Brazilian history with an approval rating of 85%+ his party won the election comfortably again and everything is going well.

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         Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         And aren't they hosting the Olympics, too?
         Hey -- maybe Romney can go help them make sure it goes off well.

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         TheMagicianposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Can you do me a favor and give me a short simple refresher on what modern socialism would entail compared to what we've got now? It's been a while since I've dabbled in politics and forgot a lot of the specific points in socialism. My minds been stuck in comic book and NBC fall premiere heaven lately

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            Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Good question with lots of answers, saying socialism is as diverse as saying capitalism and one can have all sorts of variations within that system.
            
            In the Brazilian context we are talking public aid for people to start small businesses, free schooling and university, increased regulation taxation and control of major industries by the public, high minimum wage, free healthcare, recognizing traditional land ownership, agricultural reform to ensure the abolishment of a peasant class in favor of small land ownership, free or subsidized public transport, progressive taxation and high investment in reduction of poverty (that's the basics I guess).

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               TheMagicianposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Thanks for that, definitely the context I was interesting in knowing about! I'm curious though, and this is what always confuses me; people would be able to run/own their own businesses, right? But major industries would be controlled by the public... we're not talking major industries like WalMart, are we? More like raw materials, like gasoline or cotton?

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                  Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Correct, things like mining and manufacture, companies like Walmart would be subject perhaps to higher taxation and a higher minimum wage (plus a maximum wage potentially), but they would not be publicly owned (in a moderate system) and yes small business would be encouraged and aided albeit with more resources devoted to the protection and rights of employees. Working with unions it's a astounding how often employees aren't even receiving current minimum wage let alone appropriate overtime pay and workplace treatment.

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                     TheMagicianposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     well modern socialism definitely doesn't sound like a bad thing at all. i will have to read more and study more up on this. thanks a lot for the insight, Josak! much appreciated

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                        Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        More than welcome Magician, glad you found it interesting. If you are interested in doing some reading on the matter I suggest Walden Two by B.F. Skinner and The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists by Robert Tressel and the opposing views obviously, Atlas Shrugged and The Wealth of Nations.
                        Have a good one

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      Mark Knowlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      LOL
      
      This is just hot air. The "wealthy" French live offshore or in Monaco and pay zero taxes - the same as wealthy Americans.

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         Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Hi Mark, do you live in France? I believe I read somewhere once that you did, apologies if I am wrong, if you do what do you think of the new government and what is the public reaction and such like? I don't know anyone from France to ask, it's always interesting to get the view from the ground so to speak if it's no trouble.

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            Mark Knowlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Same as the old government. Much like the USA - it makes no real difference who gets in. They will spend us into the ground, over-borrow and increase taxes to cover the costs.

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               Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               It's true.  Why is it true?  Because here in the states, over in Europe, somewhere in Asia - that's what government does.  What makes it so deplorable to us here in the USA is that we're supposed to have the tools to keep it from happening.  But all the best tools in the world mean jack if someone else has more money to hire someone else with more tools.  Which is precisely what happens in government.

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      rfmoranposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Recall the old joke that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results. Check out this amazzing video - entertaining but amazing in its wisdom.  Bar Stool Economics http://bit.ly/faqywt

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         JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Oh yes I have that video in my favorites and have for about a year or whenever he put it out.
         I keep pushing for a deal where the liberals take some place.....NOT the US....and take over and implement all the social insanity they claim will straighten all our problems out and MAKE IT WORK!.
         Nut when I say this they say Denmark! and Sweden! and all sorts of other place sand I say Greece! and Spain! and they blame some form of Conservatism.
         That's why I want them to have some where fresh. do the whole thing and PROVE IT!
         You do experiments on a small scale first.

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            Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            As I said, plenty of countries in South America where socialism was chosen democratically between 10 and 15 years ago, go ahead and look at them, it worked.

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            rfmoranposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Denmark and Sweden realized that socialism is an abyss; Greece and Spain (and of course, France) still hope it will work. How can a person keep thinking the same erroneous thoughts call himself a "liberl." I like "classical liberal" ( libertarian conservative).

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               JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Talk to Josak.

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               Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Greece and Spain both have conservative governments... Particularly Spain. Countries like Norway which have economically superseded the US are moderate socialist nations.

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               JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               They never want to do what i ask. Now South America is utopia.

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                  Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Utopia's don't exist, things are however much much much much improved, economically and socially.
                  
                  World politics unfortunately do not bow to our demands but there are plenty of examples of what you want.

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                     JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     But I want a new fresh example in plain light of day with our ignorant press watching. Not some example years after the fact no one has been paying attention to.
                     California is almost there. make it a nation. you could even get foreign aid from the US. Especially if you let the Muslim Brotherhood run it.

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                        Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        The examples I am giving are still continuing with enough years behind them to see that the results are actually related to the policy, they happened in the light and with the press watching.
                        
                        In the case of Brazil which I qouted we are talking about the 5th biggest economy in the world, people have definitely been noticing.

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                           JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           Well the press must not have been very impressed. Wonder why?

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                              Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              How often exactly do you watch the foreign economics news? Besides "This country is doing well" is not something that really makes headlines.

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                                 JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 Look most of the press here are liberal socialists. You would think they would be really happy to point out the great success of a Socialist nation.

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                                    Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    Well I disagree entirely but press coverage has nothing to do with it, if you are intereted go read up on it, plenty of great resources online.

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                                       JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       The proof is in the pudding Josak. Some of them may not be bad places but on the whole the Constitutional republic reigns. Jingoistic ain't I?

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                                          Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Those are constitutional republics. It's not jingoistic to believe constitutional Republics are the best system, it is a little troubling that you seem to think those are limited to very few countries. I believe every country in South America is a democratic, constitutional republic.

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   JSChamsposted 11 years ago

   So I would think most here would agree that the best course is to wait and watch and see if the supposed history repeats itself.
   That, of course, will also be subject to verification of the results.

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      Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah I haven't had time to study what sort of system France is going to institute but if it's like their last socialist system they will have good results, as did the last one.

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         JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         So then leave it be a find out. You can be a cheerleader all you like. Everything doesn't always turn out the way we hope or believe it will. Right?

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            Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Yeah exactly, given how early it is though I don't know why you made a hub on it rather than one of the many socialist states around at the moment that have had plenty of time. No big deal I guess.

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               JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               I didn't make a hub on it. I have other things in mind for future hubs.

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                  Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Sorry, you are right I meant a forum post.

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   maxoxam41posted 11 years ago

   Finally France is stepping out of the neocons' scheme. Given it is a socialist/liberal (in the economical term) government, it is time to apply the policies the people elected them for!

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      JSChamsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Hey i hope they get what they deserve. No more, no less. Just don't tell me I have to live that way.

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