Only 9 out of 193 voted against granting statehood to Palestine and across Europe massive marches demanded their voice rather than American political pressure decide the vote of their nation.
Yes, indeed, although I'm sure they'll be some posters who highlight the abstentions as non support for Palestine which now appears to have more support globally than at any other time.
Israel has already announced more settlements in the West Bank to punish the Palestinians for the bloodthirsty act of applying for more recognition from the international community.
Of course the settlements might have happened anyway...............I think it is a nice symbolic gesture, but doubt it is going to make much difference on the ground.
No, but as far as Netanyahu is concerned, this is not a very sensible decision for numerous reasons; if there's never to be a two state solution, he has the whole apartheid issue to deal with. If a two state solution ever becomes a reality, some of those settlements may have to be torn down.
Even Israel's allies are not pleased re this decision, he may be forced to rethink. Either way, the world has spoken regarding non member observer status; Netanyahu's actions will only hurt Israel further.
Josak my friend !! You have gotten me into a quagmire ! only joking !
Almost entire world is in troubles and in sin. We are not surprised. There will be one world government, New World Order and Bible prophecy is right. You are dreamers if expecting peace.
I loved this quote from Uri Avenry's article "The Strong and the Sweet"
ON FIRST sight, nothing much has changed. But only on first sight.
What has happened is that the foundation of the State of Palestine has now been officially acknowledged as the aim of the world community. The “Two-State solution” is now the only solution on the table. The “One-State solution”, if it ever lived, is as dead as the dodo.
Of course, the apartheid one-state is reality. If nothing changes on the ground, is will become deeper
and stronger. Almost every day brings news of it becoming more and more entrenched. (The bus monopoly has just announced that from now on there will be separate buses for West Bank Palestinians in Israel.)
But the quest for peace based on the co-existence between Israel and Palestine has taken a big step forwards. Unity between the Palestinians should be the next. US support for the actual creation of the State of Palestine should come soon after.
The strong must lead to the sweet.
You are trying to beak into an open door.
The point is not the palestinian state. If they wanted it, they could have had it long ago. Dig into the history of the time when Egypt possessed Gaza and Jordan possessed West Bank. How easily it could have been done at that time. Also, when Israel was ready to give them this opportunity, but Arafat would refuse to sign it.
Jerusalem was never and never will be any significant to Arabs (it was never even mentioned in Koran)
"Palestinian" refugees never existed. They can be refugees for Arab countries, like Jordan, Egypt, etc.... but they do not want them.
Israel went out of gaza altogether, but Gaza elected a terrorist government.
How cannot you see that Arabs do not want peace, they do not need peace! They just want EVERYTHING for themselves. When they wipe out Israel and Jews, they will go to wipe out other countries and nations.
Wow! Good Stuff ! It was so wonderful to watch all the signatures pouring in from the World from ordinary people who recognise the persecution of Palestine by the enemies of truth and justice.
Now the U.S is threatening to withhold the money they are already withholding..............
good on 'yer' Josak for presenting the issue and hello to Hollie,
best from jandee
My, my, it is unusual for the world's nations to agree on something right for once!
I am perplexed by this. Does this make the world anti Semitic? If it does, is that a good thing? Help me out here. You all say this is good, but I think it begs more questions.
No, wanting Palestine to be an independent country is not in any way anti-Semitic.
Then why is it wrong for Israel to want to be an independent state? When Jordan owned Giza in the 60's why didn't they make it a Palestinian state?
There is nothing wrong with Israel wanting to be an independent state so long as it respects the sovereignty of those people it is currently oppressing and illegally occupying, as for why Jordan did not make Palestine an independent nation it's really irrelevant to the current situation.
Israel is already an independent state and it has been so since 1949. It is now time for the Palestinians to have a place of their own, a place they can call home. It should have happened long ago and support for the Palestinian state is not a vote against Israel
Finally the Palestinians have their country back! I've been waiting for that event to happen at least for 30 years. I've always supported the Palestinians because it is a just cause, like I supported the Irish, like I supported/support the Basques. To mean that the world is anti-semitic it is the extreme. I became anti-zionist because of the violence and the abuse towards the Palestinian community. I know that the US and former Palestine opposed the decision but the world has spoken. Long live Palestine! Maybe peace between the two countries will finally be achieved although since former Palestine aspires to greater borders (to engulf Jordan, Lebanon, Syria), I would skeptical as for their will to accept an international decision!
Good luck to Palestinians. This saga is one of the bloodiest in history. Palestine has come close to being recognized as a independent state before only to find it's dreams quashed by the international community. Whatever happens Palestinians deserve the right to peace, prosperity and meaningful living. I wish this effort well more sincerely.
Remember Palestine was GIVEN to Israel illegally by the British and cohorts--------It WASN'T theirs to give-
Errr...........it belonged to the people who lived there? That would have been the Palestinians' for a few centuries before WWI.
Except it was ruled by the Turks as part of their Ottoman Empire for a while, and after WWI it was ruled by the British. As their "mandate".
Of course before it was inhabited by the Palestinians, in biblical times, it belonged to the Jews. I believe they were thrown out of it by the Romans.
So it depends how long back you want to go in history. At the time that jandee is referring to, the Balfour declaration (I think that was 1917), Lord Balfour (a Brit) declared that he would support the formation of a Jewish homeland in Palestine. At that time the majority of the population were Arab. The Zionist movement was started by Theodor Herzl and other Jewish thinkers in Europe as a response to European anti-semitism. Specifically the Dreyfus affair in France convinced many Jews that they would always be discriminated against in Europe, and rather than assimilating they should return to their ancient homeland of Palestine.
Of course in their absence the land wasn't empty. It was occupied by Arab people-the Palestinians, who were rather unhappy with the idea that other people wanted to establish a homeland in the land that they lived. So the conflict continues..................
Now lets address the "Palestinians"
Lets see if you can grasp this.
The Palestinian identity did not exist before World War I, as convincingly demonstrated Professor of history Rashid Khalidi, himself a Palestinian Arab admits that "Palestinian identity" was the last garb that the Arabs of Palestine tried on when all other possibilities where exhausted. It was shared "by a relatively restricted stratum, and among them as well as among the rural and illiterate majority of the population, the new sense of Palestinian identity competed and overlapped with Ottomanism and Arabism, as well as older religious, local and family loyalties"
In 1947, 65 years ago today, the United Nations voted to partition the British Mandate into two states: a Jewish state, and an Arab state. Two states for two peoples.
Israel accepted this plan. The Palestinians and Arab nations rejected it and launched a war of annihilation to throw the “Jews into the sea”.
From 1948 until 1967, the West Bank was ruled by Jordan, and Gaza was ruled by Egypt. The Arab states did not lift a finger to create a Palestinian state. Instead they sought Israel’s destruction, and were joined by newly formed Palestinian terrorist organizations.
The term "Palestinian entity" was introduced by the Arabs for the first time at the Arab League meetings in 1959. However, it was not recognized by the world and was not even mentioned in UN Resolution 242 after the 1967 Six-Day War. Moreover, the confusions associated with it became obvious during the voting for UN General Assembly resolution of November 5, 1970. "Among the aspects of this resolution, which split the United Nations and indeed the Arab world itself and marshaled the support of only 57 out of 127 UN members, was the reference to 'the Palestinians' as 'an indispensable element' of a Middle East Settlement"
What is really sad is that it is the Palestinian people who will continue being the ones that suffer because their leadership is more concerned with hating Israel than with doing what is necessary to assure self determination for the people they purport to represent. That’s the real tragedy of last night’s vote. Nothing will change for them. Final status and self determination are even further away than before.
A few hundred years ago there were no people with an American identity, does that mean that you don't exist?
I guess being massacred, occupied and having your land confiscated for settlements does wonders at creating a national identity for a people.
Your rebuttals are interesting to say the least.
Maybe this one you will understand
This Zuheir geezer looks pretty old for somebody who only lived for 8 years!
Once again your brilliant mind shines through.
Zuheir Mohsen (Arabic: زهير محسن, also transcribed Zuhayr Muħsin or Zahir Muhsein) (b. 1936, d. July 25, 1979) was a Palestinian leader of the pro-Syria as-Sa'iqa faction of the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) between 1971 and 1979.
Oh sorry I forgot about your 'lack of scholarship' and that must be the reason for your most intelligent response.
You have heard of these wise words, if not take heed . .
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.
aaaaaaaaaaaa with you..... who.... needs.... a cable TV........
thanks for a laugh......
Wavegirl you don't seem very sad when saying how the people of Palestine are suffering . You sound rather Gleeful. I hope I am mistaken ?
You are completely mistaken. I take no pleasure in seeing anyone suffer. And I wish more then anything that the Palestinian people did not have to live under terrorist rule. That reality is not pretty for Palestinians. On one side of the land is a booming first-world economy and on the other side (or the two other sides) is third-world chaos — little responsibility, limited municipal services, scant social services, few jobs, a weak currency, not much happening worth waving a flag about.
Palestinian Authority institutions remain completely dependent on foreign aid, limping from crisis to crisis. Yet this year, as the PA threatened to delay payroll for many employees, it tripled payments to convicted terrorists. Today the PA devotes 6% of its annual budget to payments for imprisoned terrorists and the families of suicide bombers, and less than 1% to higher education. In mosques, schools and official media, the PA glorifies terror and promotes incitement against Israelis. Instead of using their budgets for nation-building, they use them for nation-sinking.
In the meantime many innocent Palestinians continue to suffer. But not necessarily under Israeli occupation, as the conventional wisdom would have it, but rather under an incompetent, cruel and corrupt Palestinian leadership. Their iconic leader Yasser Arafat was said by Forbes Magazine to be one of the wealthiest persons in the Middle East at the time. His successors are no different. In a new Palestinian report, Abbas is accused of having put away huge amounts of money in foreign bank accounts knowing that his time at the helm of the PA may soon come to an end. In his desperation to come back to the limelight he is obviously also willing to risk the future of his own people.
For too long the explanations for Palestinian hardship has been sought in the Israeli occupation. Perhaps it is now time to ask the obvious question; when will the Palestinian people take responsibility for their own future by appointing capable leaders that are courageous enough to sit down and negotiate and put the interest of their people ahead of their own interests.
So yes jandee you are mistaken. When the foundations for lasting peace are in place, Israel will not be the last nation to welcome Palestinians to the U.N. they will be the first.
Yasser Arafat ? How dare you ! You know what happened to him.
You know what happened to Rachel Corrie. You know what happened to John from Stockport,U.K.
I have looked at your unimpressive profile!! It says it all about you ??????????? It begins with s....m
A confidential medical report released to the Palestinian Authority from the French hospital in which Yasser Arafat died revealed the Palestinian leader succumbed to AIDS.....
Now this thread is becoming more and more bizarre by the minute. We started off discussing the UN decision to upgrade the recognition of Palestine. We are now reading what reads like something out of a gossip magazine that alleges that Yasser Arafat died of Aids....
and i know exactly what is going to happen to you. Usually I give people the benefit of the doubt but your true colors have been revealed. Go on with your propaganda all you want.
Get one thing straight.
Would you be so kind as to show me a map with the state of Palistine on it.
I am afraid nobody will be able to show you a map with the state of "Palistine" in it. As far as I know, nobody is even trying to establish such a state.....not in this universe at least.
But, ignoring the sp, before 1948 there was no map with the state of "Israel" in it. What exactly is your point?
You won't find many maps of Palestine. But try looking at a map with Gaza and West Bank marked on it. A map of Israel and surrounding areas will also give you an idea of the areas we are speaking of.
So true, You can find maps of that area would be archived as antiquities. They would indicate states like Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Gad, Benjamin, Judah, etc... There would also be maps that include Samaria and Philistia . The Philistines are no relationship to the Palestinians. You might find antique maps with Jebusites, Hevites Mobites, etc as well. .
AA Lite doesnt seem to understand this map as I have posted it on another thread, maybe you can explain it.
And here is a map of Israel with the West Bank and Gaza
Thank you for showing all of us your great spelling abilities, I bow to you. So does my handicap that makes typing very difficult so I use the Dragon program. I will make sure it learns how to spell better for you.
My point is this, A look at ancient maps like this one show an Israel, whether it is a territory or a Kingdom as on this map. I do not see a Palestine, do you?
http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/p … srael1.jpg
You know, everyone claims here that they want peace, if this is truly the case lets stop looking at maps. This is a futile and daft exercise. Israel didn't exist officially before the 1940's and we don't have a map which states Palestine does, but this rhetoric which, I might add, is not going to save the lives of any children be they Israeli or Palestinian, will simply not further peace.
So, a new question, if you are supporter of the right for Palestine to have a sovereign state, what would you ask Hamas to consider in their offering of peace? If you are a supporter of Israel's right to a sovereign state, what would you ask Israel to consider in their offering of peace. I'll start, I think both groups have a right to a nation which they call home- but not at the expense of others. So, Hamas, no more rockets into Israel.
For me: Hamas officially recognise Israel's right to exist. Give up armed resistance.
Israel: stop building settlements. Recognise the right of a Palestinian state to exist within the 1967 borders.
Ofc that brings up its own problems. Hamas is not the only faction, although it is one in leadership position. Even if Hamas completely accepted the deal, other factions might carry out terrorist attacks. In Northern Ireland we had the Real IRA after the IRA entered peace negotiations. Also the Israeli side is not without its extremists. The first terrorist attack after the Oslo agreement was a settler in Hebron who entered a mosque and massacred Palestinians.
Also just stopping settlement buiding right now will not solve the problem of the existing settlements which are already making a two state solution pretty impossible. Some settlements will have to be dismantled, some will have to be swapped for Israeli land.
International observers to ensure both sides are carrying out their part of the deal.
But then I am but an ignorant peasant with no scholarship, so I guess my opinion is worhtless.
Neither are you ignorant nor is your opinion worthless. And Bravo for walking in another man's shoes, you opened with what you would have Hamas do to promote peace, recognizing that there are two sides to this conflict. I agree that the situation is way too complex and goes beyond the boundaries of my question. But still, when the people stop arguing about what WAS, and start to discuss what IS, there is a window of opportunity for progress.
The world cannot expect any neutrality from a country like the US who rounded up all the Indians and shipped them off to the north on land nobody else wanted. It is kind of funny listening to the hypocrisy of the whole situation.
draw lines .
call it a map.
look from space.
these fictional lines.
cant be seen.
Never have heroes ! Never follow anybody !
In Britain we have a government and many of them are members of something called 'The friends of Israel' very suspicious to my way of thinking .
ISRAELIS ARE MADE UP FROM every corner of the globe - let them take off ! Back to their homes from where they were sent to disrupt and cause mayhem.
Oops! Did I make a spelling mistake ? Just watched a very traumatic video on youtube re. Rachel Corrie 20/22 year old American female murdered by the israelis when protecting young palestinian children.
Palestinians mass media, as well as any other biased mass media will twist anything possible.... How about facts, not bias?
The protesters from America were in a wrong place, where they were not supposed to be at all. It was a war zone and the bulldozer, as far as I remember, was flattening the house from where the rockets were fired, or something of the kind..... There were no people in the way besides protesters. The protesters were warned and asked to leave the war zone, however, they did not listen.
"JERUSALEM — Nine years after their daughter was crushed by an Israeli military bulldozer in the Gaza Strip, the parents of American activist Rachel Corrie lost their legal bid Tuesday to hold Israel responsible for her death and force authorities to reopen the investigation.
A Haifa judge rejected the parent's negligence lawsuit, calling Corrie's death an accident that she brought upon herself by refusing to leave what had been declared a closed military zone. "It was a very regrettable accident and not a deliberate act," said Judge Oded Gershon."
"The court agreed with an Israeli military investigation that concluded that the driver's field of vision was limited, and blamed Corrie and other activists for putting themselves in harm's way.
"She did not move away as any reasonable person would have done," Gershon ruled. "But she chose to endanger herself ... and thus found her death."
Hard cow ! Why can't you write ? Moron !!!!!!!!!!!?????????????
These are your names? Nice to meet you. My name is Sonya.
P.S. I used to have many hubs, but I took them away to another website where I found more intelligent people with whom we can talk by usage of facts, not bias and terror.
Sonya !Are you thick or just bloody hard ? are you saying that the the young girl who was murdered because she was protecting youngsters was unreasonable and was murdered because she was unreasonable ! i s that whaT YOU ARE SAYING ???
I would really appreciate if we can talk like intelligent civilized people. I am not used to your type of socializing. In my house we use respect and politeness even if we disagree.
I would advise you to read the court reports, as well as investigation reports. Put aside emotions if you are able to and compare the facts.
I mourn the death of a young woman no less than you do. However, if someone goes against a bulldozer in one's clear mind, there is not much you can do to save them... A driver has a limited vision of objects that are close to the machinery.... She was not protecting, she was protesting. Protesters were not allowed to be in the region, you just need common sense to understand this.
The structures that she was attempting to protect by lying down in front of a bulldozer were fronts for tunnels along the border between Egypt and Gaza through which munitions and explosives intended to kill innocent Israelis were being smuggled. Even more to the point, the idea that Corrie was in Gaza to promote peace is a myth. The purpose of the International Solidarity Movement’s activities in Gaza was to shield Hamas and Fatah terrorists and to prevent the Israel Defense Forces from carrying out measures intended to stop the flow of arms and terrorist activity. If Corrie’s parents, who have pursued efforts to hold the state of Israel responsible for her death, should sue anyone it is the group that led the foolish American to Gaza and deliberately placed her in harm’s way.
Words of truth, wisdom and reason. By the ways and methods that people converse you can tell really intelligent people from false experts.
As the judge said in his verdict: “She chose to put herself in danger. She could have easily distanced herself from the danger like any reasonable person would.”
The Jewish Rachels who died at the hands of Ms. Corrie’s Palestinian friends had no such chance. They were blown up or shot by Palestinians with munitions like those smuggled in the same tunnels that Corrie was protecting, while driving in a car, sitting in a pizza parlor, waiting for a bus, shopping in a grocery store or just sitting in their own home. But there are no plays about them.
Rachel Corrie should not have put herself in front of a bulldozer in the middle of the confusion of a military action in a war zone in which she was taking a side. Her death was as unnecessary as the intifada itself. Had the Palestinians accepted Israel’s offers of an independent state in 2000 and 2001 (and repeated and turned down again in 2008), there would have been no need for any hostilities in Gaza. But they chose war instead of peace and were aided by fools like Corrie in this futile endeavor. Peace will never come to the Middle East so long as Palestinians devoted to destroying Israel can count on the support of Western elites and pilgrims like Corrie to support their murderous activities.
You are just one hard bitch
just go away
put your hatred on hold
say no to today
admit you are cold
hate what is bold
admit you are one bitch
I really miss livelonger on these kind of threads. Thanks for speaking up, wavegirl.
thank you rebekahELLE - I miss Jason too. But he is really never too far away! Did u know he just became a daddy!
Does anyone know how much territory this new Palestinian state is going to have..? Over the last few years the Palestinian peoples have had their land stolen from them, it truly is a sad sight to see; glad to see there has been some sort of a resolution on the matter though...
We're nowhere near a Palestinian State yet, but non member observer status does offer a few more rights to the Palestinians in terms of who they can approach with any grievances they have. Also, if we ever get to a place where Israel and Palestine get around the negotiating table again, deals will have to made as to boundaries etc.
Untill a Palestinian State is made with boundaries the Palestinian people are going to continued to be subjected to the raping a pillaging of their lands that they share with the Israelis, it is a sad statement but true. Not to mention the propaganda that is rampant in the media of Israelis, the Palestinians are the bad guys and vice-verse. Its almost the same as what you see in America against people of Islamic Faith and the people of the Middle East. The hatred needs to stop and people need to wake up. This is hard though when your survival is threatened or is given that appearance on an everyday occurrence.
Who are the Palestinians?
"Israel Hayom" Newsletter, December 14, 2011
Contrary to political correctness, Palestinian Arabs have not been in the area west of the Jordan River from time immemorial; no Palestinian state ever existed, no Palestinian People was ever robbed of its land and there is no basis for the Palestinian “claim of return.”
Most Palestinian Arabs are descendants of the 1845-1947 Muslim migrants from the Sudan, Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, as well as from Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Yemen, Libya, Morocco, Bosnia, the Caucasus, Turkmenistan, Kurdistan, India, Afghanistan and Balochistan.
Arab migrant workers were imported by the Ottoman Empire and by the British Mandate (which defeated the Ottomans in 1917) for infrastructure projects: The port of Haifa, the Haifa-Qantara, Haifa-Edrei, Haifa-Nablus and Jerusalem-Jaffa railroads, military installations, roads, quarries, reclamation of wetlands, etc. Illegal Arab laborers were also attracted by the relative economic boom, stimulated by Jewish immigration.
According to a 1937 report by the British Peel Commission (Palestine Betrayed, Prof. Efraim Karsh, Yale University Press, 2010, p. 12), “The increase in the Arab population is most marked in urban areas, affected by Jewish development. A comparison of the census returns in 1922 and 1931 shows that, six years ago, the increase percent in Haifa was 86, in Jaffa 62, in Jerusalem 37, while in purely Arab towns such as Nablus and Hebron it was only 7, and at Gaza there was a decrease of 2 percent.”
As a result of the substantial 1880-1947Arab immigration – and despite Arab emigration caused by domestic chaos and intra-Arab violence - the Arab population of Jaffa, Haifa and Ramla grew 17, 12 and 5 times.
The (1831-1840) conquest, by Egypt's Mohammed Ali, was solidified by a flow of Egyptian migrants settling empty spaces between Gaza and Tul-Karem up to the Hula Valley. They followed in the footsteps of thousands of Egyptian draft dodgers, who fled Egypt before 1831 and settled in Acre. The British traveler, H.B. Tristram, identified, in his 1865 The Land of Israel: a journal of travels in Palestine (p. 495), Egyptian migrants in the Beit-Shean Valley, Acre, Hadera, Netanya and Jaffa.
The British Palestine Exploration Fund documented that Egyptian neighborhoods proliferated in the Jaffa area: Saknet el-Mussariya, Abu Kebir, Abu Derwish, Sumeil, Sheikh Muwanis, Salame', Fejja, etc. In 1917, the Arabs of Jaffa represented at least 25 nationalities, including Persians, Afghanis, Hindus and Balochis. Hundreds of Egyptian families settled in Ara’ Arara’, Kafer Qassem, Taiyiba and Qalansawa.
Many of the Arabs who fled in 1948, reunited with their families in Egypt and other neighboring countries.
"30,000-36,000 Syrian migrants (Huranis) entered Palestine during the last few months alone" reported "La Syrie" daily on August 12, 1934. Az-ed-Din el-Qassam, the role-model of Hamas terrorism, which terrorized Jews in British Mandate Palestine, was Syrian, as were Said el-A'az, a leader of the 1936-38 anti-Jewish pogroms and Kaukji, the commander-in-chief of the Arab mercenaries terrorizing Jews in the 1930s and 1940s.
Libyan migrants settled in Gedera, south of Tel Aviv. Algerian refugees (Mugrabis) escaped the French conquest of 1830 and settled in Safed (alongside Syrians and Jordanian Bedouins), Tiberias and other parts of the Galilee. Circassian refugees, fleeing Russian oppression (1878) and Moslems from Bosnia, Turkmenistan, and Yemen (1908) diversified the Arab demography west of the Jordan River.
Mark Twain wrote in Innocents Abroad (American Publishing Company, 1869): “Of all the lands there are for dismal scenery, Palestine must be the prince…. Palestine is desolate and unlovely.” Analyzing Mark Twain’s book, John Haynes Holmes, the pacifist Unitarian priest, the co-founder of the American Civil Liberties Union and the author of Palestine Today and Tomorrow – a Gentile’s Survey of Zionism (McMillan, 1929) wrote: “This is the country to which the Jews have come to rebuild their ancient homeland…. On all the surface of this earth there is no home for the Jew save in the mountains and the well-springs of his ancient kingdom…. Everywhere else the Jews is in exile…. But, Palestine is his…. Scratch Palestine anywhere and you’ll find Israel…. There is not a spot which is not stamped with the footprint of some ancient [Jewish] tribesman…. Not a road, a spring, a mountain, a village, which does not awaken the name of some great [Jewish] king, or echo with the voice of some great [Jewish] prophet…. [The Jew] has a higher, nobler motive in Palestine than the economic…. This mission is to restore Zion; and Zion is Palestine.”
The Arab attempt to gain the moral high ground and to delegitimize the Jewish State - by employing the immoral reinvention of history and recreation of identity - was exposed by Arieh Avneri’s The Claim of Dispossession (Herzl Press, 1982) and Joan Peters’ From Time Immemorial (Harper & Row, 1986), which provide the aforementioned – and much more – data.
Until the Palestinian Authority accepts the fact of the existence of the State of Israel there will be no peace. Peace talks can only achieve so much in an atmosphere that breeds hatred. Unfortunate for Pals they are raising the younger generation to hate. They are educating for the destruction of Israel. The discourse is one of hatred and the destruction of the State of Israel.
I think this is happening on both sides. Nobody seems to take into account that there are also different factions on both sides leaning in other directions. This is not a black and white situation, and too many people try to make it one.
Yeah right and for one dollar you can buy the Golden Gate Bridge.
The bottom line is clear. .
A solution has to be mutual to both Palestine and Israel. It will not help Palastine's case if it rejects respect for the Jewish state. It has to be mutual tolerance.
I don't like to say but I think the issue of recognition of both Islamic and Jewish state is some light years away still.
The bottom line should be clear for you as well.
Both Palestinians and Israelis are entitled to live without fear and repression, both have the right to their own state
Netanyahu does not speak for all of Israel and if there was a really clear bottom line the whole problem would have been solved years ago.
Right now this is the bottom line for any talks of any sort of peace ever happening . .
And I challenge you to find one Israeli that does not agree with these words that comes directly from Netanyahu.
I think there are a number of Israelis here that would say he is full of himself!
Then and now? Which side is lying?
http://www.economist.com/blogs/democrac … alestine_0
why omit the quote I quoted from Netanyahu . .
all I was trying to say there was that
Until the Palestinian Authority accepts the fact of the existence of the State of Israel there will be no peace.
Israel’s right to exist is a given. I am not arguing against that, but there will be no peace until both peoples accept the right of the other to exist. We can listen to both sides of the argument and takes sides but until we are ready to accept that somewhere lays a third option that is the solution the whole discussion is an open ended argument just like the endless peace process has been.
Since its establishment in 1948, the Israelis have tried to get the Arab world to understand that they intend to continue to exist. There have been numerous attempts at peace talks. Each time the Israelis offer an olive branch, with concessions dangling from its branches, and each time they have been rebuffed.
Until the Palestinians (in every language) irrefutably accept Israel’s right to exist — as well as the sheer fact that it does exist — those years will stretch into decades.
Now I'm really confused! Who are these Palestinians who should accept Israel's right to exist? You spent considerable space in this and the other thread expounding on the theme that Palestinians don't exist.
LOL . . did you just wake up, you have been in this state for as long as this conversation has been going on!
What state dear? I'm just curious, for 2 days you've been vehemently claiming there are no Palestinians, and all of a sudden you want them to accept things.
It's a simple enough question, who are these "Palestinians"?
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