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True forgiveness, we will forgive the bigots and the hateful.

  1. Josak profile image61
    Josakposted 4 years ago

    Many people throw around the word forgiveness, but rarely do they embrace the virtue, forgiveness is about sacrifice, sacrificing primal justice and righteous anger. That is what we must do, times are changing and equality for our gay and lesbian brothers and sisters is just around the corner. Majority opinion has changed and quickly the power will lie with the progressives on the issue, we must carefully avoid the temptation of retribution, we MUST forgive, the deaths of so many thousands, the suicides of so many hundreds of thousands due to that bigotry this we must forgive, difficult as it must be to us.
    I hope we can do that for those misguided people and for ourselves.

    1. Onusonus profile image85
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      You are absolutely right, and I for one think we should start by apologizing to the members of NAMBLA by making them all scout masters.

      1. Josak profile image61
        Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Nice try, NAMBLA has nothing to do with equality for gay people, it may be news to you but pedophiles and gay people are different things. Indeed statistically gay people are less likely to be pedophiles according to research.

        http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/h … ation.html

        Don't worry I forgive your ignorance tongue

        1. Onusonus profile image85
          Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Oh I know the difference. But since we want to be completely fair I think I should be able to go camping with a bunch of sixteen year old girl scouts so my rights aren't infringed on as well.

          And I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that 99.9% of people who have raped or molested little boys were of the same gender.

          1. Josak profile image61
            Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh I trust you with the girls tongue

            OF course people being able to go on camp with the children of others is not required fro equality under the law so it's totally irrelevant.

            As to your edit, the majority are normally attracted to women, a large portion have no adult desire whatever and are simply fixated on children. Hardly any have ever slept with an adult of their own sex.

            1. Onusonus profile image85
              Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              It is if they haven't been caught. Then they just look like regular law abiding citizens to everyone else until proven otherwise. I've got four daughters and there is no way in hell they would ever be permitted to go camping with another man. Likewise if I had a son and found out that he was going camping with a homosexual man he would not be going. I'm am not accusing every man out there of being potential pedophiles, but common sense and the safety of children should prevail over political correctness.

              1. Josak profile image61
                Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I would never let my kids go camping with a man unless he was family but his sexuality would and should have nothing to do with it. Indeed as noted gay people are less likely to hurt children. SO it's pretty irrelevant to this topic.

                1. Onusonus profile image85
                  Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  As I said before All the people who rape little boys are of the same gender, that is what we call same sex attraction.

                  1. Josak profile image61
                    Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Gay people and pedophiles have completely different attractions, it's like saying straight men are equivalent to men who molest girls or that it would be better to send gay men with the girl scouts.

              2. A Troubled Man profile image60
                A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Denying permission is one thing, stopping them from doing so is another, usually with failed results. Good luck with that.



                In other words, it's well known that the man is homosexual, yet he is taking the time to be a scout leader,  much like any other guy taking the time to be a scout leader.

              3. HollieT profile image87
                HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                There is absolutely no relationship between being a pedophile and a gay man. A true pedophile is usually unable to relate to other adults in any meaningful way.

                Exclusive pedophiles/hebophiles: A true pedophiles is only interested in pre-pubescent children, usually under the age of 12, by the time the child reaches puberty they are no longer useful. This is their ONLY sexual interest, gender is irrelevant because the relationship is about power and control- nothing more. Even if the abuser manages to form and develop a relationship with another adult, it will only be to gain access to the age group that they have targeted.

                A Hebophile on the other hand, is interested in children around the age of puberty, usually over the age 12, as they grow up they are also no longer useful. Again, the gender of the victim is irrelevant to the abuser- another power and control relationship. Pubescent children are their only sexual interest.

                Gay men have relationships with gay men- not a perverse or abusive relationship, just a same gender one.

                1. Onusonus profile image85
                  Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Yeah, the penis goes in the butt, it's gay, you can't get around it. It's like Afghan's saying that it's not gay unless they want to get married, so they can fool around with men or kids without being labeled a homosexual. And, as we all know, is a death sentence in that country.

                  1. HollieT profile image87
                    HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    What on earth are you waffling on about? The difference between an abusive relationship ( where under age children are concerned) is not about where the penis goes- but the age of the partners. If you just want to have a homophobic, Islamophobic  rant, then have one, leave pedophilia out of it, because you clearly know nothing about the topic- You're latest comment indicates that you can't differentiate between an abusive relationship and a same sex relationship, even when presented with the evidence.

          2. A Troubled Man profile image60
            A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Interesting, you believe you have the right to deviant behavior with sixteen year old girls. And, you say you know the difference? lol

            1. Onusonus profile image85
              Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              What makes you think I have deviant intentions with sixteen year old girls? I just want to stop being discriminated by intolerant bigots like you, and to be able to go camping with a bunch of underage girls. you are just a hateful person.

              1. A Troubled Man profile image60
                A Troubled Manposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Sure, that;s all you want to do. Camping with a bunch of underage girls.



                lol  <--- me being hateful

    2. profile image0
      Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Oh, that sounds so very nice!  roll
      But I caution you to place blame where blame is due.
      In your opinion, from what I've seen around here,  any person who says homosexuality is wrong, and who fights against liberal activism that would make us legally condone homosexuality, is a bigot, and therefore responsible for the deaths of homosexuals who commit suicide?   
      Is that a correct assumption?
      I want you to be sure and specific in your answer, please.
      Because if that's what you meant,  then your whole sentiment here falls apart, revealing itself for the irony-laced fake-compassion sarcasm that it appears to be.



      Here, just in case you don't follow that,
      I can probably also say it this way---------

      What?!   You're blaming  conservatives for the suicides of gays?!
      And then cautioning liberals to pretend to forgive them,  to not enact "retribution" (vengeance!) upon them?!
      LOLOL.   You deign to urge gay activists to not assault people who simply speak what is right?!    Gee,  how (not) nice of you!

      1. Josak profile image61
        Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Yup people who discriminate against gay people, who label homosexuality as wrong are through their ignorance and bigotry often at least partially responsible for the massive rate of suicides in the LGBT community. My best friend in my youth hung himself in the closet of our orphanage for just that reason, because the nuns who operated it told him what he felt and who he loved was wrong and an abomination. Believe me it takes a lot for me to forgive them for causing a child's death.

        I am not blaming CONSERVATIVES many conservatives have nothing against gay people and support their equality, several of them are here on hubpages, I am blaming BIGOTS correctly for that is where a lot of the blame lies, without their malicious lies and ignorance the rate of suicide for gay people would not be seven times higher, statistical research proves that is a fact not an opinion.

        Assault? No Pretend? No

        I would like people in the gay community and supporters of equality such as myself to not give in to the temptation of retribution for hundreds of years of oppression. Not to for example criminalize homophobia as hate speech.

        I think it's terribly nice of me actually, certainly a lot kinder than what your ilk has been doing for a very long time.

        1. profile image0
          Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Wow.   
          First of all, there is no such thing as "homophobia".
          A phobia, or prejudice, or bigotry, etc.,  means that a person is afraid of something for no reason at all.  There is plenty of reason for people to fear and dislike homosexual actions and especially homosexual activism.   An example is your high-and-mighty attitude here, your condemnation of people who speak about right and wrong.   
          And how dare you even talk about homosexual suicide as though homosexuals are the only confused, hurting people who commit suicide.    I have friends and acquaintances who have, or who've known people who, have committed suicide, and they weren't gay.     Some people just have emotional problems, and yes some of them have been persecuted and insulted and etc.   
          There are people who've been mocked and persecuted because they were fat, or ugly, or skinny, or retarded, or poor,  or conservative, or Christian, or a myriad of other things.    Your agenda is two-fold-----to raise homosexuality to the level of legitimacy that it doesn't deserve,  and to exact some form of vengeance upon those who you perceive as being responsible for hurting the feelings of gays. 
          Sure, there've been people who've mocked, verbally and physically assaulted gays.    But so have gays done that (and sometimes more) to straight people and Christians just because they were Christians and/or straight.    And they've gotten by with harrassing straight people in public;  they don't even try to hide it anymore.   Just like you having the audacity to accuse people here,  with no shame at all.
          You want to blame the nuns who told your friend what right and wrong is?!     At least they told him right.    Hopefully, they didn't mock him;  hopefully, they told him that there is hope for repentance and forgiveness!    But apparently you would blame them even if they did.    Your vengeance is misplaced.    It is actually those like you who tell impressionable kids that they're being wrongfully persecuted,  instead of telling them that their lives are worth living and that they are indeed loveable and that they can indeed have a decent happy life with someone of the opposite sex,  who are to blame.

          "Hate speech" is what you've spoken here--------blaming conservatives, calling them bigots.   You want to hold it over our heads and act like we need your forgiveness?!    Oh my.  It is you who needs to seek forgiveness for your false accusations.

          And let me tell you something else--------suicide results from mental depression and/or mental and emotional disorders.   I know, because I've had friends who committed suicide, and they were not gay.   There are of course sometimes reasons like being mocked or persecuted that precipitate suicide, whether that person's problem is gay temptation or whether it's being persecuted by bullies for whatever invalid reason like being ugly or retarded or whatever.    But in no way is suicide limited to people who have homosexual temptations.   I certainly don't see you having compassion for everyone who's about to commit suicide or who has committed suicide.    So your agenda is flat selfish and is a persecution of conservatives.    And no, a conservative is not conservative just on one issue.   A conservative believes there is right and wrong, and will stand up for what's right.   You have no right blaming anyone including those nuns, unless they mocked the person and refused to give them hope.    A "bigot" and a "bully" is someone who mocks and persecutes someone.    A person who simply tells someone the truth about right and wrong is not a bigot.

          1. Josak profile image61
            Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            As noted the rate of suicide int he gay community is seven times that of the straight community so your objections on that issue are laughable.

            I am not attempting to get Vengeance when i am specifically asking people to forgive. Again laughable.

            There is no serious history of persecution of straight people by gay people there is a massive history of the opposite. Again laughable.

            Nope scientific evidence demonstrates that gay people almost universally cannot have healthy and happy relationships with people of the opposite sex, gay people who marry or go through reformation therapy have 95% divorce rates a suicide rates which are four times higher than the already massive gay suicide rate. Wrong again.

            Nope homosexuality is not wrong, it harms no one and is declared a normal and healthy part of the human sexuality spectrum by every psychiatric, psychological and medical board in the country. Wrong again.

            Again not conservatives, many conservatives have done no wrong on this issue, bigots are the ones who require forgiveness.

            They demonized my friend, moved him to a small room by himself because they were afraid he would rape the other boys and they told him he was an abomination for sleeping with another man, so he killed himself, they committed evil.

            Homophobia is a real thing, psychological and psychiatric experiments prove it all hatred and discrimination of same sex people comes from fear, (it is the fear nodes that light up in homophobes when shown gay people under a brain scan).

            Want to continue being provably wrong?

            It's thanks to people who are so provably wrong such as yourself that gay rights are advancing so quickly so thank you!

            1. profile image0
              Brenda Durhamposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              No, it isn't thanks to me at all.
              It's thanks to people who persist in calling wrong, right, and who push that on everyone else.   And thanks to the people who cave in under the type of pressure that you post here,  cave in for fear of being further accused and harrassed.
              So give credit where credit is due.   It's not my doing at all.   Take the credit for yourself, even, if you wish,  but in time you will not want the credit, because no matter how much bullying and false rhetoric conservatives have to endure,  they will at some point find it worthwhile to speak truth which gives hope to people struggling with homosexual temptations.   Christians and other conservatives offer hope to those who struggle with this.   You and other gay activists offer no lasting hope at all,  only temporary appeasement for selfish reasons.   Any person who struggles with anything needs to know that they're not alone, that they're not hopeless, that they're among a society that struggles with all kinds of sins and temptation, but that they can have closure over persecutors, they can deal with their own personal problems with the help of, not enablers, but of people who understand what right and wrong is, and what repentance and forgiveness is, and can overcome those things by learning the consequences of one's actions and taking one step at a time,  of people who truly do respect each person as a human being and who validate the person's ability to exercise self-control and human dignity.

  2. grand old lady profile image91
    grand old ladyposted 4 years ago

    Could you explain your definition of primal justice? How should primal justice be enforced?
    I have an idea of righteous anger, but how do you define it?
    How far back in history do we have to go to sacrifice the above two in order to move forward?
    What are your parameters for this?

    1. Josak profile image61
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Primal justice is just what people feel automatically, internally, to be just, the impulse that makes us want to punish things ourselves with violence or retribution.

      Righteous anger is what people who have been wronged, like that gay community have been, feel.

      I guess it's always our lifetime we have to look at, I don't think people should pay for the sins of their fathers so forgiveness is not required there but actions perpetuated by living people do require forgiveness.

  3. maxoxam41 profile image79
    maxoxam41posted 4 years ago

    And why do we have to forgive them? No, they have to make their efforts. I am tired to forgive or being too complaisant with them. They are adults as I am.

  4. John Holden profile image60
    John Holdenposted 4 years ago

    Ah, what short memories!
    Just over 100 years ago several states in the US had an age of consent as low as ten, one state as low as seven!

    Age of consent is an arbitrary figure, it might be right for one person but still far too low for another.

    1. profile image0
      Beth37posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      That's why they make laws.

      1. John Holden profile image60
        John Holdenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Obviously!

        1. profile image0
          Beth37posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          lol

    2. profile image85
      Education Answerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I seriously doubt 7, 10 or even 12 is ever the "right" age.

  5. peeples profile image88
    peeplesposted 4 years ago

    And I'll get back on topic and say Forgiveness is useless.

    1. Josak profile image61
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Can I ask why you believe that? I understand that in itself it does nothing but the consequences of it particularly in non retribution are positive no?

      1. peeples profile image88
        peeplesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        There is a misconception that people who don't forgive are miserable people. That isn't really true. So if it has no negative impact what is the point?

        1. Josak profile image61
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Hmm yeah I was not really suggesting people forgive for their own benefit so much as for the benefit of those being forgiven. Though I do think it's good for the forgiver too since they can move on with their lives without the anger.

          1. peeples profile image88
            peeplesposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I'm sorry in my opinion some people do not deserve forgiveness. I see no benefit to them either. Also lack of forgiveness does not keep everyone from being able to move on. In fact sometimes it provides direction.

  6. profile image85
    Education Answerposted 4 years ago

    Josak,

    It seems that there IS a lot of violence, at least in border states, perpetrated by illegal aliens.  My source is the FBI, and the site actually takes you to an FBI site.  References are included in the site.  I think that’s a pretty good source.

    IF you read the article, you'll find that immigrants, from all over the world, are heavily involved in gang activity in America.  It seems that the Mexican-American border and many illegal aliens do pose a "continuing criminal threat to the United States."

    FBI:

    “The US Southwest Border region represents a continuing criminal threat to the United States. The rugged, rural, and porous area along the nearly 2,000 miles of contiguous US-Mexican territory invites widespread criminal activity, including drug and arms trafficking, alien smuggling, human trafficking, extortion, kidnapping, and public corruption. US-based gangs, MDTOs, and other criminal enterprises in both the United States and Mexico are readily exploiting this fluid region and incur enormous profit by establishing wide-reaching drug networks; assisting in the smuggling drugs, arms, and illegal immigrants; and serving as enforcers for MDTO interests on the US side of the border.”

    “Continued drug trafficking-related violence along the US Southwest border could trigger increased migration of Mexicans and Central Americans into the United States and, as such, provide a greater pool of victims, recruits, and criminal opportunities for street gangs as they seek to profit from the illegal drug trade, alien smuggling, and weapons trafficking. Likewise, increased gang recruitment of youths among the immigrant population may result in an increase in gang membership and gang-related violence in a number of regions.”

    http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publi … assessment

    1. Josak profile image61
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Wait is is this about Mexicans committing sex crimes against children or have you just changed the topic on a thread about forgiveness for people who have discriminated against gay people AGAIN?

      1. profile image85
        Education Answerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        You responded in less than two minutes, and you claim I don't read sources?  Yes, IF you read the article, you should find that it talks about human trafficking.  I'd say that has something to do with sex.

        1. Josak profile image61
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Cool I'll read that then.

          1. Josak profile image61
            Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Yeah it doesn't say anything about children and it mentions many gangs from many different affiliations and ethnicity are using prostitutes and smuggling people into the country for sex, I believe the biggest problem is the US in that area is actually from the Eastern Block with Vory Mafias shipping them in.

            But I still can't see any statistical analysis of Mexicans being responsible for this or anything to do with Mexicans having sex with children.

            1. profile image85
              Education Answerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              OMG

              Wrong.  Illegal aliens are involved in human trafficking and sexual exploitation of children:

              FBI:

              "Human trafficking is another source of revenue for some gangs. Victims—typically women and children—are often forced, coerced, or led with fraudulent pretense into prostitution and forced labor.16 The Bloods, MS-13, Sureños, and Somali gangs have been reportedly involved in human trafficking, according to multiple law enforcement and NGIC reporting."

              http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publi … assessment

              Sureños - "A large share of the immigrant gangsters in the most notorious gangs such as Mara Salvatrucha (MS-13), Surenos-13, and 18th Street are illegal aliens. Their illegal status means they are especially vulnerable to law enforcement, and local authorities should take advantage of the immigration tools available in order to disrupt criminal gang activity, remove gang members from American communities, and deter their return. Once explained, these measures find much support, especially in immigrant communities where gang crime is rampant."

              http://www.cis.org/ImmigrantGangs

              1. Josak profile image61
                Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Uhuh so no statistics, no proof and mentioned amongst several other gangs tat do the same thing. Gangs do bad stuff and poor areas have gangs it's not news to anyone and it's irrelevant to illegal immigration.

                1. profile image85
                  Education Answerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Your denial is laughable.  I have another government site that states that over 40 percent of all gangs in America are composed of illegal aliens.  I can also provide a government source that details the massive crime and violence perpetrated by gangs, detailing the percentage.  None of this matters to you. 

                  Again, God Himself couldn't convince you of something that is not liberal.  This discussion is pointless, with you.

                  I'll hold out for a study by a liberal organization.  Perhaps one will happen, and you'll change your tune.

                  1. Josak profile image61
                    Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Can I see this source that cites it's data that shows 40% of gangsters in the US are illegals?

  7. profile image85
    Education Answerposted 4 years ago

    Josak,

    Criminal Aliens - "55 percent, or 225,390, of the people removed in FY 2012 were convicted criminal aliens – almost double the removal of criminals from FY 2008, and the largest number of criminal aliens removed in agency history."

    http://www.ice.gov/removal-statistics/

    That's right, 1/4 of a million criminal aliens were deported in 2012.   That's no small number. There are roughly 2.2 million incarcerated people in America.  According to the government-provided data, we have deported the same number of criminal illegal aliens in the past 15 years as we have in prison in all of America right now!

    1. Josak profile image61
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yous till have not learned the terminology? Criminal alines are any person not born in the US who commits a crime in the US so it includes legal immigrants. Most of them are simply deported for the crime of illegal crossing so again irrelevant.

      1. profile image85
        Education Answerposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Wrong.  Criminal alien does not mean that when the sources clearly delineate the crimes.

        Did you read the source? 

        Homicides
        Sexual Offenses
        Drugs

        The only thing that is irrelevant is your apathy and lack of compassion for the victims.

  8. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    @Onusuonus, we don't have statutory rape in this country, we have unlawful sexual intercourse charges (in the scenario that you speak of ) and by the very definition will always by high risk, not low. Also, I worked with adults over the age of 21. Our criminal justice system is two tiered, those under the age of 21 are young offenders- not adults.

    An 18 year old with a conviction for a usi would be always be assessed as high level of harm, even if the likelihood of re-offending was low. I have absolutely no idea why you would consider such an offence to be low level of harm. I guess that demonstrates your lack of understanding.

    1. Onusonus profile image85
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      If there is no such thing as statutory rape in this country then why does everybody call it statutory rape? Ah, your little story is starting to fall to pieces...

      1. HollieT profile image87
        HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I was talking of my country, duh! I live in England. Note the "we don't have statutory rape in this country"

        1. Onusonus profile image85
          Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Exactly, and you guys probably still have taxation without representation.

          1. HollieT profile image87
            HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            What, precisely, does taxation have to do with sexual offences? And why "exactly", you appeared not to know that I was in England earlier. Explain the exactly comment, it makes no sense whatsoever.

        2. profile image60
          Lie Detectorposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          What is the age of consent in England?

          1. HollieT profile image87
            HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Sixteen.

            1. profile image60
              Lie Detectorposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Is there an Age Gap Provision?

              Mistake of Age Defense? Just curious.

              1. HollieT profile image87
                HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Below the age of fifteen often determined as rape because child not capable, or deemed capable of consent. At fifteen the charge will invariably be one of USI, unless there has been use of force, in which case rape again.

                But depends on the factors and individual cases. One case for example, which I supervised, was of a twenty five year old man having sex with a fourteen year old girl. Charged with USI, not just because girl looked much older, but her family, including mum and dad, told him she was 19. (I know, what kind of parent would perpetuate a lie like that?)

                But in the main, above 15 a USI, below 15 rape.

                1. HollieT profile image87
                  HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Edit: at fifteen, not above.

                2. profile image60
                  Lie Detectorposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I am surprised by how many States in the U.S. are also 16 It seems way too young to me.

                  1. HollieT profile image87
                    HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I suppose it does (now my daughter has just turned 16 *cringes at the thought*) but I also suppose it depends on the individual and the partner. I think a girl (or boy) of 16 having a relationship with a man of say, 30, just doesn't seem right at all. At sixteen, most kids are still very immature and childlike, so I'd still consider it verging on abusive. Although not defined as such in law.

  9. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    It does get reported, just not as often, so yes we do know that it happens. And by definition, rape can include penetration with an object- women rape too.

    We do not however, know that aliens visit earth. So again, not only a completely irrelevant comparison,  but more speculation and nonsense.

    1. Onusonus profile image85
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Yes, aliens visit the Earth all the time. The reason you don't know about it is because it doesn't get reported, but it does happen. Because I said so.

  10. profile image60
    Lie Detectorposted 4 years ago
  11. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    Thank you, Lie Detector. I had momentarily wondered if in the US rape would be defined in the exactly the same way as the UK. But here in the UK, penetration with an object is also defined as rape.

    1. profile image60
      Lie Detectorposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I'm pretty sure it is.

  12. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    @Onusonus. I don't say it happens, studies and reports say that it happens.

    http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s … report.pdf

    Look to table 4.2 if you don't want to read the whole document. And then you can retract your ludicrous statement about aliens and female sex offenders.

    1. Onusonus profile image85
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      And all I'm saying is there may not be proof that these rapes occur and you can say that it does based on the same speculation that this guy does.
      http://troll.me/images/aliens-guy/im-not-saying-that-it-was-aliens-but-it-was-aliens.jpg

      1. HollieT profile image87
        HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        No, you can't say that there may not be proof, because there has been sufficient evidence (proof) to convict these people. Or, are you saying that the courts, police and entire criminal justice system are lying because you just don't want to hold your hands up and state that you were wrong when you claimed that only men sexually abuse?

        1. Onusonus profile image85
          Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I never said only men sexually abuse. And there's plenty of evidence of ancient aliens. Ever read the book "Chariots of the Gods"? Just think about it.

          1. HollieT profile image87
            HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You said only men sexually abuse boys, you were wrong. Women abuse boys as well as girls. Largely unreported (as I said before) but still reported and convictions brought. So no, has nothing to do with same gender attraction, that is between adults. Abusers don't give a damn about gender. You really need to get that.

            "As I said before All the people who rape little boys are of the same gender, that is what we call same sex attraction" No it isn't. The same abusers also abuse girls. No same sex attraction, just the abuse of children.

            I said we don't if aliens visit the earth, I didn't say they that didn't. See the difference? Working with what we know, not what we think and opinions that we might have.

            1. Onusonus profile image85
              Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Actually I originally  said "I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that 99.9% of people who have raped or molested little boys were of the same gender." Which is verifiable, not based on your speculation. I usually try not to speak in definites but you caught me. I stand by my original statement. Alien abductions go largely unreported because they don't want the unbelieving world to think they are crazy. I can't put a number on it but it's probably a large number. Because I said so. No evidence required.

              1. HollieT profile image87
                HollieTposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Then verify it. I'm not speculating, my knowledge comes from study and experience- working with victims and perpetrators- where does your knowledge (?) come from exactly. I can substantiate anything that I have said. If you require evidence, fair dues, just ask for it!

                I also didn't say that I don't think there might be some substance in alien abductions- I think that there may be, it's possible. But I don't know that this is the case. Neither do you. I do, however, know that women and men are convicted for rape and sexual abuse, I also know that men who sexually abuse little boys also sexually abuse little girls.

                But, if you want to go through your life, making silly assumptions, sounding ridiculous and expecting to be taken seriously, well.... that's your choice. But you do not have the right to label as a pedophile other men because they are gay. Stupid rhetoric like this, ruins lives.

                1. Onusonus profile image85
                  Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I think you are projecting just a tad. I never said that All Gay men are pedophiles. And that is how you discredit yourself. I did say that the vast majority of people who rape little boys are men. And just as men should not go camping with young girls, so should homosexual men not make an issue out of exclusion from the Boy Scouts.
                  To stress my point, I have four daughters and there are a lot of young girls that are around my house all the time, however I do not permit them to be in my house when my wife is gone for both their protection and mine. There is one girl in particular who is a pathological liar and if I were to be alone in the house with her at any point I could very easily find myself in trouble with the law should she decide to conjure up a story for her own entertainment purposes. This is called prevention and is purely common sense. Likewise there is no hatred involved in preventing Homosexuals from going camping with young men. 

                  As a side note I noticed that you have classified those people who are attracted to children at various stages of development as having a "sexual orientation" so perhaps you should be defending the folks at NAMBLA since they too were born that way.

  13. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    You said that 99.9% of boys are abused by men, and that this is known as same sex attraction, yet, you repeatedly ignore the fact that those who abuse, abuse both genders, therefore nothing to do with same sex attraction- lust for children, not gender. Has that sunk in yet?

    Yes, the pedophile community want their abuse to be recognised as an orientation, I actually loathe to use the that word because it normalises abuse. But I did not how to get across to you, despite numerous attempts, that abuse of children is not about their gender, but their age. You just don't get it! 

    It is their orientation, but an illegal unhealthy one, for very good reason. THEY. ABUSE. CHILDREN.

    Hetrosexuals and gays have an orientation but it's not about abuse. It's about the gender of the partner. Can you still not recognise the difference?

    And if you're going to go down that road, stating that certain (healthy, non abusive individuals) should not be given any access to minors. Then you have to say that neither orientation, or gender, should be given access to children because both are capable of abuse. Which, frankly, is a ridiculous statement to make.

    Who's projecting?

    1. Onusonus profile image85
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Hollie, don't you think that the existence of NAMBLA is antithetical to your assertion? Clearly they are a "man/boy" love association and not a "man/any gender" love association. And if it is all about power then why do they insist that there are cases where the intercourse was consensual?  Now don't get me wrong It is obvious that young people who may be coerced into it should not be held accountable, but in the predators mind, it would seem at least in some cases, they felt that the sex was consensual.

      I personally believe that if a man gets caught doing something to a child in such a perverse manner, no matter what is going on in that twisted little brain of theirs, they should have their man parts removed in some vial manner. Not just a clean cut either, (that would be to nice), but perhaps with a blender, or a meat grinder.

  14. HollieT profile image87
    HollieTposted 4 years ago

    Onusonus,

    Nambla, and organisations like just like them will always attempt to latch on to some legitimate movement to try validate their own existence. They are fully aware that if they started a movement that  was just about having sex with children- it would get nowhere. Admittedly, that is what it's about- but they try to make it a gay rights issue, a civil rights issue, they can only do that if they attach their orientation to a specific gender.  They have seen how successful the gay rights movement have been when it comes to securing their rights. And they want the same. This is a tactic.

    Sex offenders are the most manipulative, calculating, devious bunch of individuals that it will ever be your misfortune to meet. They will always attempt to minimize their offences, describe them as something else, and  always, always, portray themselves as the "victims" By asserting that they're just gay, they can do just that.

    I could offer you a multitude of examples of how they twist their offences into something else. The man who abuses his girlfriend's son or daughter- in his view is never a pedophile; he's prosecuted because the police don't like him, or because the child lied, or because the mother was having an affair and wanted rid of him. Or it was the child's fault, they were acting in a sexual way and led them on. If you don't believe me then do some research yourself. The victim role is where they're most comfortable- and they'll always find a way to be a victim.

 
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