Can you imagine what life would be like without land ownership?
Its a very interesting mind-expanding exercise...
and very mind boggling.
...and yet the majority of the indigenous people lived on this continent without owning land.
When you think about it, how CAN anyone truly OWN land? Some tribes tried to claim their territories because they were farmers. These were the more waring types of tribes.
We are so used to the concept of buying a house or two or three that this goal seems to make life go around. Without this goal/reality/concept, what would life be like?
If society decided to try for a more anarchistic existence, could it transition away from the pursuit of land ownership?
Personally, I don't believe we will ever willingly stop playing "Monopoly".
No homes. No factories. No sewage treatment facilities. No roads. No energy production plants. No water production. No mines or quarries to produce raw materials. No significant food production.
The stone age peoples were able to live in spite of this because they were hunter gatherers, without large populations. Any real population growth requires ownership of land, whether by government (communism, socialism) or individuals.
…groups of people living together, some wandering nomadically, some living as large tribes of family members and friends... car production would cease.
no need for gas or oil as travel would not be undertaken…. too much work to do on a local level, either wandering and setting up tents, or maintaining farm-lots where people have rolled cars to live in. (Farm-lots would be abandoned parking lots claimed as territories to live on in a communal way.) They would, of course, need land nearby to farm. They would have to tear up asphalt and cement. Roads would stop being maintained and pipes would not be replaced for water distribution. The farm lots would have to be near natural sources of water. Commune members would most likely own guns and ammunition to protect their territories. Water and ammo would become as valuable as gold.
Those with the most ammo/water source would survive and rule. They would become ruthless in quest for power and might even take slaves… I dare not imagine further.
So much for anarchy.
I'm glad you finally thought this through. Anarchy isn't good for anyone.
As you know I think things through "out loud" to analyze them objectively. No need to insult me.
LOL, so worries, I do the same thing all the time.
I wasn't trying to insult you:)
You and I are alike Kathryn. I say things and people think I'm nuts. I tell them it's for the sake of conversation and getting the viewpoint of others. There is no right or wrong response, just "What do you think?"
Right. I am bored with my own opinion, usually based on a limited amount of actual facts. Others' insights and points of view are interesting. Also, I prefer understanding an issue objectively, rather than subjectively.
(Although, I do have an agenda…see below.)
PS Keep up the good work, Diane.
You're part way there. But it's hard to tear up reinforced concrete roads with a few sticks, and there is no iron to make anything else. Or fuel to run existing equipment. And no chemicals to make gunpowder or bullets.
Nor will putting farms (no farms, either) by rivers help as there are no pumps or energy to power the pumps if there were any. Even digging a ditch from the river is fruitless as you don't have the land to dig on.
No livestock as you can't pasture them or fence them in - we'll become vegetarians. Better not die, though - no graveyards (would that be the new meat source?).
...or to serve what they glean from graveyards to their captives.
So much for anarchy.
What's any of that got to do with land ownership?
Without the vast amount of capital tied up in landownership there would be so much more to develop those things that you think are dependant on land ownership!
If you doubt the stupidity of land ownership look at the UK where the majority of the cost of a new house can be taken up in land costs.
What if land ownership was outlawed in Britain?
The return of knights on horses wearing armor?
(and white satin underneath of course.)
More likely the return of affordable housing.
Where will you build your auto factory? Where will you get the ore to put in the smelters, and where will you put the smelters to make the steel to build cars with? How will you get the steel to the auto factory without roads?
None of those things require land ownership.
I repeat, where will you put your automobile factory if you have no land to put it on? Float it in the clouds? Where will you dig the ore to make the steel for the plant, and how will you get it to the manufacturing facility?
Right where it always was. Available for anyone to do with as they wish. Whether there is a factory (or other valuable things) on it or not. Maybe hold a road race down the aisles. Maybe just vandalism. Maybe a bonfire. Maybe salvage all the iron (as no one has a mine anymore).
Same with a farm; available for anyone to pick and take whatever they wish.
So, why shouldn't you still have zoning laws or whatever it is you call them?
BTW in the UK land ownership gives you no rights to anything under the land, all you own is the surface. I expect it's the same in the USA.
In the US, property owners usually have mineral rights and water rights. We have a well for our water, and we could even sell the water. Mining and mineral rights for property or claim owners were established during the California Gold Rush and became the basis for property laws across the country.
Does that mean if a mine wants to extract coal, oil or minerals from under your house they have to make an agreement with you?
Yes. (and that would depend of if they could do it without infringing on the rights of your neighbors.-- or messing up the environment.) Any profit from leasing or selling mineral rights would be counted as personal income and taxed, of course.
http://homeguides.sfgate.com/mineral-ri … -7961.html
Note it says that the USA is one of the few countries that allow private individuals to own private mineral rights.
This is interesting. Who owns the mineral rights in the UK? Government? And how does a mining company get an OK to mine on land they don't own? Just walk in and do it, get a permit, what?
That may take me a while to answer. I'd never considered it before.
Seems a lot simpler tan I thought.
Coal is owned by the coal authority, petrol and oil owned by the crown who also own all gold and silver.
The rest owned by the land holder.
Interesting. Wonder what would happen should large deposits of platinum, uranium, lithium or some other valuable resource be found. Take that from the owner as well?
I did see something about water, though, and it seems much like the US. Water, whether underground, running or still, doesn't actually belong to any person although they may have rights to some of it. An interesting one in my local area is hot, geothermal, water - while wells may be drilled and water used (for household purposes, not irrigation), any hot water must be left alone. It can't even be pumped up, heat extracted and put back into the ground. If hot water is encountered the well must be sealed off with Bentonite clay or some other method.
Hot and the UK do not go together in any way shape or form
No, I don't imagine. But I'm not too far from the pacific "ring of fire" and even closer to the biggest volcano in the world - Yellowstone national park. We have lots of hot springs around here, and Boise, biggest city in the state of Idaho, has most of it's government buildings heated with natural hot water. So do quite a few of the older homes.
As long as there are property taxes, no one owns land. But then again if there were no property taxes, children would be forced into the mines to shovel coal, society would come to a grinding halt and more than likely the world would stop spinning on it's axis.
"The state’s planning laws means that land for housing is sold at over-inflated prices by the land-owning classes. For those at the bottom of the social scale even being able to rent or buy a small home is becoming increasingly difficult."
Will I never own the land under my house here in US??
I am working and struggling for only this shack?
It (this shack) does seem way (edit: extremely) over priced, if that's the case.
Oh I wish that were reality. To exchange this demonic artificial simulated reality with true God given reality would be a blessing!
I have a feeling that God is going to come through for us all who want to go back to the reality God gave us.
- are you an anarchist?
How do you view common land ownership as opposed to state land ownership.
I believe no one should tell anyone what to do so I am no communist. I also do not believe in the state absorbing all the land in these national parks and telling people when they can go in and out. I also do not believe in the banks telling you that your house is a bank and having you barrow against it, thus people on fixed income loose their house.
I believe we should not disassemble the nuclear family. I believe we are being destroyed slowly but surely by the dismantled nuclear family.
Because I believe that we should all live together as families on farms, like the Amish they have it right. I guess I would be called an Amish man stuck in a world gone mad.
God gave us the land and some people have tons of money and right now they are stealing all the land look at the BLM. Everyone will see soon enough what we have allowed to take place in America and around the world.
But hey do not take it from me just turn on your television and wait until September rolls around. After September the people (I won't say you I don't know your understanding of reality) will realize what they have given up to live in this brave new world. It is a brave new world indeed.
They seek to undermine the reality God gave us and this world will surely pay for that. Microchips, televisions, computer pets, and so on while oil washes upon the shores and radiation baths us and the sky is full of toxins.
But hey maybe they all can live forever in this bodies we have, that one goal shows me how insane and delusional they really are. The body is a vessel and the masses worship it, not realizing their own true power. The deception is getting so heavy now it will not be too long before it crashes upon all our heads.
I agree, steve8miller, except for the farm part.
We are/were fine in cities. Farm life is not for everyone. City life is okay. Why do you not agree with cities? People can live harmoniously and happily in cities with all modern conveniences, including technological items. We need the discipline to use technology for good, not bad. I believe some day we will stop going ga ga over the latest items .. (now, the apple watches) and get back to real living.
BTW: Equal opportunity is provided by the Constitution… Land ownership made this country get up and go.
I agree with your comment about the gov't taking land. Obama just took some of our mountain areas away from people who had homes there:
"President Obama designated the San Gabriel Mountains outside of Los Angeles as a national monument Friday, setting aside 346,177 acres of national forest as a recreational area.
Using his authority under a 108-year-old law, Obama's executive action will permanently protect the forest from development and set it aside as an outdoor recreation destination.
The move is not without controversy. Some park neighbors worry about what the move would mean for fire suppression efforts and restrictions on hunting and off-road vehicles.
The San Gabriel Mountains National Monument is the 177th such designation since President Theodore Roosevelt signed the Antiquities Act in 1906. Obama has established or expanded 13 of them, all but one of them without congressional approval.
And I'm not finished," Obama said, hinting that he was actively considering additional national monuments."
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/poli … /17027331/
THE FARM - BEST HOME OF THE FAMILY - MAIN
SOURCE OF NATIONAL WEALTH - FOUNDATION OF
CIVILIZED SOCIETY - THE NATURAL PROVIDENCE
Quote East Side inscription.
The next line on that building talks about how the "Railroad" elite power house bought up the land and created a new world. Breaking free from that horrible prior existence of having to deal with our nuclear families on farms.
Just hope all the Walmart's do not close hope these elites continue to want to feed us. lol
"The Norman conquest of England in 1066 saw all land taken under the ownership of the monarchy. To this day the monarchy - in theory at least - owns all the land. The Normans changed the ownership of land with the King giving land as tribute to Norman lords and barons and depriving the Saxons. The Domesday book was the first audit of land. And the resulting system of feudalism exacted free labour, goods and produce and free military service to the land-owning classes for the rest of the middle ages."
http://libcom.org/news/article.php/land … k-10032006
Power for human beings (I am not talking of god or other creatures) is the origin of land ownership. it is by means of power that the Europeans grabbed lands in Americas and other settled lands. We have to deal with power.
We have to deal with the desire for power in others.
Usually power has to do with survival…
and those who have the strongest desire to survive.
They are also usually the most intelligent.
Sometimes they have heart, sometimes they don't.
I have observed that those with the most will-power have the highest IQ.
Maybe they are also the ones with the most heart...
hopefully… but look at the state of the world!
teetering due to the richest!
Are they helping or hindering?
They COULD be helping.
What prevents them from helping?
lack of awareness of the suffering of others?
How many have to suffer before they (the globalists) grow a conscience?
I don't think they care about land.
- just money.
true or not?
unless they really do want own the whole entire globe!
Meanwhile, here in the democratic republic of the USA, without morals and education/informed citizenry, the possibility of liberty diminishes. By abandoning The Constitution and not defending our founding principles, we hand over our section of the globe to the globalists. Lucky them.
Will THEY give us freedom?
No, they will see us as their captives and slaves.
We will not be allowed to acquire land.
or have individual power.
Have fun with that no land ownership, Anarchists.
Just remember there are more of us than them. We have power in our numbers
...if we are on the same page
United we stand, divided we fall.
We must keep our country for ourselves.
Do NOT vote for either Clinton or Bush!
I believe we are fighting the Globalists.
And we, the citizenry, need to be on the same page in the next election.
We must vote for someone who has NO connection to them.
Additionally, I also believe we need to to resist any force (influencing us through the news media, educational institutions/programs, movies, etc.) trying to split us up over:
1. Racial issues
2. Cops vs the people issues
3. Poor vs rich issues.
4. Youth vs. elders
5. Sexual Identity issues
We must not fall for it!!!
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