Events in Paris today will affect us all

1. 93

   LongTimeMotherposted 8 years ago

   If you haven't yet seen news of the attacks in Paris, time to take a look. French borders have been closed and the country is in a state of emergency.
   
   What a tragedy. Sadly, we are all reminded of just how vulnerable we are. There's bound to be a ripple effect around the world.
   
   Thinking of everyone in France today.

   replyreport
   1. 84

      Jackie Lynnleyposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Yes the numbers are even higher...and a scary reminder that we cannot close our borders!

      replyreport
   2. 70

      Elsie Hagleyposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Just heard it on the news, so sad, our thought's are with all who are affected.

      replyreport
   3. 92

      Greensleeves Hubsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      As you say, there is bound to be a ripple effect. Too early to say what that will be, but it will be far reaching and will include both official political reaction and reaction by the general public.
      
      Radical changes to domestic security, relations between different cultures within a nation like France, and greater intervention in the Middle East, are all possibilities to be welcomed or feared depending on your point of view. France is a tolerant nation, but there should be no tolerance towards people who act with this kind of extremist brutality, or support it, or act as apologists for it. The basic freedoms and the cultures we enjoy in Western Europe are under attack, and that attack must be repulsed at all costs.
      
      But just for the moment there should be nothing but sadness. This is less than a year after 'Charlie Hebdo', and the spirit of togetherness generated by different communities coming together in the aftermath of that tragedy was truly uplifting. Thoughts are with Parisians as they once again experience this special kind of evil.

      replyreport
      1. 85

         rebekahELLEposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         +  very well said, Alun. 
         It is very sad in so many ways.

         replyreport
   4. 66

      justholidaysposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Borders are not closed and never will unless France resigns the Schengen agreement (which I consider they should resign and my country should too).
      
      There are only controls at the borders - one car out of X is stopped and controled. 60 check points in grand total on French borders.
      
      Though there are many attacks (Lebanon on Thursday for example) about which nobody talks. What happened in France is horrible, and even more since I live next door; yet attacks happen every day in the world and this one is not going to affect the number of terrorist incidents, but will probably affect the way our leaders deal with them (I doubt as they never cared).
      
      In any way, all my thoughts go to my neighbors and their families.

      replyreport
   5. 84

      tsmogposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Though may sound lackluster, I am baffled because it is the norm for expectation somewhere that is occurring now. My thoughts and prayers are offered in silence. Even though not of choice when leaving my neighborhood to the larger city I walk with a need of more eyes than I have. It seems a must now today.
      
      Here in San Diego near three military bases (Less than 50 miles) I watch for what alert status they are in for hints. The last being May 8 - 2015 increased to Bravo nation wide. There are five levels. One is all visitors will have to show ID's and are subject to a vehicle search including the military personnel themselves for base entrance. The simple wave through with a windshield decal is not a norm now. There have been five since '01. The most recent is specific to ISIS and known factions internal to the U.S.
      
      Not to cause alarm here is an article, yet being informed is key to awareness of this unfortunate 'part of life today' becoming normal.

      replyreport
   6. 69

      annasmomposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      It's incredibly scary and sad.  I think of all the shattered families and weep.

      replyreport
   7. 78

      Credence2posted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Gosh, will the 'City of Light' have to take on the characteristics of a police state? This is not going to help salve the xenophobic mood of Western Europe. There are going have to be changes and I hope that they do not have an adverse affect on the democratic tradition of these societies.

      replyreport
2. 92

   Jodahposted 8 years ago

   This is a shocking event. It is a problem for the entire world. All countries need to be extra vigilant.

   replyreport
3. 94

   Solarasposted 8 years ago

   Predictable with likely much more to come. Europe is inviting armies of ISIS moles into its borders. Even if only 5% of their refugees are terrorists, they are looking at adding an army of 50,000 terrorists. Would it not be better to improve the quality of their lives where they come from than to invite disaster in Eurpoe. I suspect this is the tip of the iceberg.

   replyreport
   1. 66

      justholidaysposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      +100

      replyreport
4. 93

   Phyllis Doyleposted 8 years ago

   It is horrible.  We need to always be alert to the possibility of things like this happening. I agree with Jodah -  "All countries need to be extra vigilant."

   replyreport
5. 60

   Madah Farooqposted 8 years ago

   i just heard it in news, here is morning in Pakistan and i just shocked after listening this news.

   replyreport
6. 92

   jansharesposted 8 years ago

   So tragic, LongTimeMother. We will unfortunately see rippling effects of this horrible affront on humanity. It affected me so much I could not contain my thoughts and wrote a poem hub about it, just to release the ripples within me. A statement that stood out for me as I watched last night's coverage was, "Welcome to the new normal." Very frightening. Be at peace.

   replyreport
   1. 92

      Greensleeves Hubsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      And a very good poem too, written almost spontaneously after the event. I know advertising our hubs with links is not something which should be overdone, but as this is not my hub, I hope you will permit me to link to Janis's page for those who wish to read it.
      
      http://hubpages.com/literature/Paris-At … -Terrorism

      replyreport
      1. 92

         jansharesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Very kind of you, Greensleeves. I'm touched that you enjoyed the poem so much. It was indeed spontaneous and in the moment. I don't recall ever writing a hub like that and publishing it within hours. I usually let them marinate. It just goes to show how if something affects you at your core, you can pull it forth and put those emotions it into words.

         replyreport
         1. 85

            rebekahELLEposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            I just read your poem hub.  It's beautiful and real.  These spontaneous poems carry the emotion that is only real when it is felt.  I remember years ago writing a poem in response to the war in Bosnia.  It was named Collateral Damage.  I gave it to a Marine friend of mine and never saved a copy.
            
            It's quite sad seeing blame being aimed at any one person or policy.  Ignorance causes hatred in the heart of man.

            replyreport
            1. 92

               jansharesposted 8 years agoin reply to this

               True about the hating heart, also true that poetry comes out of a moment. Events like this makes you mindful of being in the moment and in touch with your feelings. Thanks.

               replyreport
7. 71

   makingamarkposted 8 years ago

   Oh dear.....
   
   Closing borders betrays a belief that people came from outside to perpetrate this atrocity. That's simply not the case.
   
   I also suggest people should check how long the people who committed the 7 July 2005 bombings in London had lived in Yorkshire!
   
   I think it's very likely that the vast majority of the 8 terrorists who died will be identified by the French security forces as being people who had lived in France for a long time - maybe even born there - and had in some way radicalised.
   
   Closing the borders makes no difference. The only reason France has closed the borders is to stop any accomplices from getting away - as happened re. Charlie Hebdo.

   replyreport
   1. 66

      justholidaysposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      According to terrorism specialists from France and Belgium, it seems that we have to face a new kind of strategy: attackers come from the outside.
      
      Latest news re terrorists:
      
      1. Syrian arrived with refugees in October - found one Syrian passport.
      2. Found an Egyptian passport.
      3. One is a "local" (born or living in France and got the nationality regardless of his merits), well known as radicalist and islamist.
      4. Still don't know much about the 4 others.
      5. Three of the terrorists are suspected to come from Molenbeek District (Brussels). Authorities arrested several people in that district of the European capital.
      
      French and Belgian authorities working together on the case because Molenbeek is known as terrorism HQ.

      replyreport
      1. 71

         makingamarkposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         You really need to check your "facts" before drawing conclusions.
         
         The Egyptian passport belongs to a football fan not a terrorist!
         
         From BBC news
         "11.12
         An Egyptian passport found at the scene of the Stade de France explosions and linked to the attackers belonged to an Egyptian victim, the country's ambassador to France has said.
         
         Ihab Badawi said that the passport belongs to Waleed Abdel-Razzak, a football fan who was critically injured in the attack.
         
         "No charges have been directed at Abdel-Razzak at all," Mr Badawi told Egypt's  CBC news channel.  "
         
         The most reasonable assumption - if you don't find a document on the body of an individual - is that you cannot make any assumption as to who it belongs to. Nor can you make an assumption as to their status. Even people wearing so-called suicide vests can be victims.
         
         Plus It's generally best to leave investigations as to what happened to the professionals....

         replyreport
         1. 66

            justholidaysposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            May I remind you that my post was done 31 hours ago? So 23 hours BEFORE your quote.
            
            As stated in my post: "According to terrorism specialists from France and Belgium, it seems..."
            
            Therefore I did NOT draw any conclusion, I just reported what the French and Belgian press published - I don't read other press than these since I'm a French speaker and live in Belgium. And our press is as worth reading as the Guardian!
            
            And I confirm that investigations continue in Belgium and search warrants have been delivered since yesterday. Also an individual in connection with the same investigation is wanted and his photo published by the police, the press and all social media.
            
            Not sure this is published by the Guardian but it is by French and Belgian press.
            
            ETA I forgot to mention that our ministers have made declarations. And I think they are better informed that any journal on Earth.

            replyreport
      2. 71

         makingamarkposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Also worth a read before you draw conclusions about who people are and where they are from
         
         http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/n … th-caution

         replyreport
   2. 84

      Jackie Lynnleyposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Well we could just close them because we have enough already; thank you.

      replyreport
8. 94

   peeplesposted 8 years ago

   I fear the only real ripple here in the USA will be politicians using this as a fear tactic with American people to convince the masses of why we should agree with their political agendas. I'm saddened that the victims of this not only lost their lives or their family's lives, but on top of that, those losses will be used for political gain.

   replyreport
9. 89

   Will Apseposted 8 years ago

   Tony Blair recently admitted that there would be no ISIS without the Iraq war. George Bush Senior said his son had received very bad advice from Rumsfeld and Cheney. Jeb Bush said that he would not have 'gone into Iraq'.
   
   So we know where to put the blame for the hundreds and thousands deaths of that have occurred as a consequence of the invasion of Iraq, including 120 innocent people in Paris.
   
   The bombing of Libya by UK and French forces, the idiotic support for the Arab Spring, aid to Syrian rebels... None of this has helped.
   
   Why not try letting countries develop in their own way and at their own pace?

   replyreport
   1. 66

      justholidaysposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Well put.
      
      Yet France and the entire E.U. are also responsible since they funded and armed ISIS. But taking responsibilities for their acts is not in their agenda.

      replyreport
10. 57

    Alternative Primeposted 8 years ago

    Over a decade ago, Intellectually Challenged George W Bush as the "DECIDER", decided to commence 2 unwinnable wars in the Middle East, one in Afganistan and one in Iraq which was an Unconscionable Mega-Blunder ~ His Negligent Administration was under the Delusion that the victories in both venues would be Swift and subsequently, Euphoric Acts of Democracy would "Break Out" all over the region ~ George W was WRONG about Foreign Policy, Domestic Policy, and Economic Policy, as a matter of FACT, he almost Destroyed this Nation ~
    
    As a direct result, his actions have caused an almost Irreperable Destabilization within the Middle East ~
    
    OUR Prayers are with France and her Peoples, hopefully someday we can REVERSE what George W has set in motion ~

    replyreport
    1. 92

       Jodahposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       +1

       replyreport
11. 92

    Greensleeves Hubsposted 8 years ago

    One or two comments on this forum have taken a strong political stance implying that Western governments are to blame for the Paris atrocity. I don't want to name names, partly because I think I actually have much in common on other issues with the writers, and partly because I'm not sure this is the time or place to be expanding an argument about the rights or wrongs of Western foreign policies. The original post was about the tragedy and sadness of events in Paris, NOT the history of the Middle East.
    
    But let's be clear - whatever mistakes were made before, during or perhaps most importantly after, the invasion of Iraq and involvement in other conflicts in the Middle East (and there are differing views as to the motivation and morality for that involvement), there is no question as to where blame lies for the attacks in Paris. It is not Bush or Obama or Blair or any other political leader. The blame lies squarely with vicious religious fanatics who place their own belief system and their intolerance of other, freely-adopted cultures, above human life. There can be no justification, mitigation or excuse for deliberately (as opposed to accidentally or collaterally in war) killing innocent civilians.

    replyreport
    1. 57

       Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       Hello Greensleeves Hubs ~ Just to Reiterate and Clarify, I'm not "Implying" I'm "Explicitly Expressing" the universally understood fact that George W Bush and his Negligent Policies, is the Primary Reason for the Exacerbated & Excalated Destabilization in the Middle East ~
       
       This Destabilization and lack of Leadership Structure within the region, however unorthodox and or brutal it may have been prior to Bush's "War of Choice", has enabled virtual battalions of Mal-Intended individuals to Flourish ~
       
       It is another Irrefutable FACT that the ill-conceived Conservative Policies of George W Bush, undoubdedly the absolute WORST President in American History, nearly Destroyed the Economic Fabric of the United States in conjunction with his idiotic Ineptitude with regard to the Middle East ~ A 2 Trillion Dollar Tax Cut for the wealthiest individuals combined with Trillions in war expenditures capped off his artociously inept tenure ~ We as Tax Payers are STILL trying to pay for the TRILLIONS in Unecessary Deficit he racked Up while in office ~
       
       Yes, George W receives "Special NOTE" when we realize such heart wrenchingly devastating events as we have unfortunately experienced in France, and the immediate Recognition & Acknowledgement of said political failures can only help us to find a solution as we Re-Visit the Millennium Defining Strategic Failures of the past ~
       
       Prayers & Thoughts with FRANCE ~

       replyreport
    2. 89

       GA Andersonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       point, match, game... You make a point I agree with. ISIS is barbarism that needs no excuses or justifications.
       
       GA

       replyreport
       1. 92

          Jodahposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          +1

          replyreport
12. 92

    Greensleeves Hubsposted 8 years ago

    'Alternative Prime' wrote: 'Just to Reiterate and Clarify, I'm not "Implying" I'm "Explicitly Expressing" the universally understood fact that George W Bush and his Negligent Policies, is the Primary Reason for the Exacerbated & Excalated Destabilization in the Middle East'.
    
    OK. Apart from the liberal use of the word 'fact' for what is actually 'opinion', I can actually agree with much of what you say about Bush. I think he was a bit of an idiot, and a bad president. And there is a strong case to be made that American involvement in the Middle East helped create the current instability there.
    
    But that is - although linked - a debate which I would have thought was more appropriate for another forum. Whether or not he was the 'worst president in American history' Bush is emphatically NOT to blame for the deaths of all those people in Paris. To suggest that he is, only dilutes and diverts the blame which must be attached to ruthless extremist fanatics who have carried out similar atrocities even in countries which had no direct involvement in the Iraq War or in Syria.
    
    That's all I'm going to say about that, because I'm not going to be drawn any further into turning this tragedy into a debate about past Western policy on this forum.

    replyreport
13. 57

    Alternative Primeposted 8 years ago

    I'm not really interested in a DEBATE regarding this subject either Greensleeves Hubs, so I'll just leave you and everyone else with Hard FACTUAL Data ~
    
    * George W Bush invaded Iraq, Removed Saddam, and as a direct result of said military action we now have a DESTABILIZED Middle Eastern State where Mal-Intended Individuals Flourish ~
    * George W Bush Invaded Afganistan with the SAME Results. although this may have been warranted, however, he Failed to at Achieve the Primary Objective of the Mission ~
    * George W Bush Inherited an APPROX 2 Trillion Dollar Surplus when taking office, shortly thereafter, in the FACE of 9/11, he drove us into DEFICIT with a Massive Unecessary TAX CUT which primarily enriched the Wealthiest Individuals & Corporations ~
    * Current Estimates indicate both wars that he Commenced, have to date, cost American Tax Payers anywhere bewteen 2 & 4 Trillion Dollars and STILL Counting ~
    
    I ALWAYS revert to Concrete Data when posting here and elsewhere and I don't think I've used "Liberal Methods" to reveal these FACTS ~ If interested, anyone reading this can easily Find & Explore" this information with a simple google click ~ As a matter of Fact, I Encourage Personal Exploration especially when Conservative Republicans tend to shall we say, "Manipulate & Alter the Truth" on a regular basis ~
    
    * With respect to George W Bush attaining "Worst President" Status? How many other U.S. Presidents can you name that virtually Decimated Foreign Policy, Decimated a Significant Portion of the Middle East, Decimated OUR Economy to the point of being MORE Severe than the Great Crash & Depression of the 1920's, and Converted a 2 Trillion Dollar SURPLUS into a Deficit within Seconds??
    
    ANSWER ~ None

    replyreport
    1. 92

       Greensleeves Hubsposted 8 years agoin reply to this

       As you have used my name, I will say that you have deliberately msinterpreted my previous comment. You say you don't think you've used ' "Liberal Methods" to reveal these FACTS' , implying that I had suggested a Liberal as opposed to Conservative (in a political sense) motivation. As you well know I was actually suggesting that you had applied a liberal use of the word 'fact' (in the sense of very loose use) in your previous comment when what you had been expressing were 'opinions'.
       
       I'm not sure what you're trying to argue anyway. You seem to want to believe that I am some sort of apologist for George W Bush. My points had nothing to do with his policies in the Middle East. My point is simply that the primary blame for the Paris atrocity rests with the killers, not U.S foreign policy. If you think differently, OK. That's all.

       replyreport
       1. 57

          Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

          You've mis-interpreted my comment as well ~  I was not suggesting that my use of the term "Liberal Methods" was Political, it was indeed intended to be understood as precisely what you have stated ""Very Loose" ~
          
          My FACTS are Concrete in this case as they always are, an ocassional mistake not withstanding, I am HUMAN after all but always pride myself in commenting with a very high degree of Integrity & Trustworthiness ~ That's why I ALWAYS Encourage readers here and everywhere else around the Nets to conduct their own Research ~
          
          You are correct, and we also agree that the perpetrators should be held accountable for their actions, however, indirectly and as an un-intentional consequence or perhaps even as the result of Reckless Negligence,  George W Bush played a Major Role in laying the Proverbial Destabilizing Foundation from which these types of horrific incidents can be successfully carried out across the seas ~
          
          Paris is Stunningly Beautiful in Aesthetics, Culture, Cuisine &  Societal Splendor, a World of Unique History, Architecture and Wonderful People ~ My Ancestors Originate just Southeast of this Incredible Country, in Europe Surrounded Entirely by the  Mediterranean  Sea, so I have a very Special Affection for this Breathtaking Region of the World ~

          replyreport