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Donald Trump on Immigration (Deportation)

  1. peoplepower73 profile image87
    peoplepower73posted 3 months ago

    Trumps speech on August 31 was fraught with lies and miss-information.  He should not call it his policy on Immigration, but it should be called his policy on Deportation.  I watched the entire speech and it gave me chills.  He sounded and acted just like Hitler and Mussolini. Here is the link to FactCheck. org.  The lies are far too numerous to copy and paste. http://www.factcheck.org/2016/08/factch … migration/

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      From your link:
      "The peak for removals processed by the Customs and Border Protection and Immigration and Customs Enforcement agencies, going back to 1892, was 435,498 in fiscal 2013."

      From the Center for Immigration Studies (http://cis.org/ICE-Illegal-Immigrant-Deportations):

      "Total deportations in 2011, the latest year for which complete numbers are available, numbered 715,495 – the lowest level since 1973. The highest number of deportations on record was in 2000, under the Clinton administration, when 1,864,343 aliens were deported."

      Wonder who is right.  And who is misstating factual statistics for political reasons.

      1. peoplepower73 profile image87
        peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

        Wilderness:  If you want, scroll to the bottom of the link and it will give all the sources that fact check used for their disputes.  So you found one thing that is different from all the lies that Trump told and now that gets him off the hook?  I looked at your link.  If you go to their about page, they are all about favoring low immigration rates. In fact, I heard Trump refer to them many times in his speech.

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

          https://www.ice.gov/removal-statistics

          This one gives figures more in line with your link.  It is also for Immigration and Customs Enforcement figures only, and leaves out the deportations from border patrol.  Is that the difference?

    2. ahorseback profile image47
      ahorsebackposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      People power ,You and  Alternative Prime should join the mainstream new news media , You slant is as delusional  as most of that junk today ,     When Trump is elected    watch out  , you're apt to be deported too !   Right after he  jails you for ten years for all the hysterical  posts you create ! 

      Good luck with your most  imaginative  opinions!

      1. peoplepower73 profile image87
        peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

        ahorseback:  I'm betting you didn't even look at the link, because you can't even handle the truth. You have to stay in denial and lash out with insults at those who don't agree with you just like Trump.  It you accepted the truth, your whole world would come crashing down like a house of cards.  You fit the mold of a "compassionate conservative", that is really not compassionate at all.  That's why the GOP is coming apart at the seams because they don't have the right stuff to relate to the changing world.. 

        That's why you like Trump because he doesn't have a compassionate bone in his body and you are willing to overlook all his lies and insults.  Every time he opens his mouth, he lies, insults, and contradicts what has just said and it is recorded for all the world to see. 

        Unlike Hillary who is held guilty until proven innocent with all these never ending investigations that have cost the taxpayers million of dollars.  Just like Joseph McCarthy did with the Witch Hunts of Communists where innocent people where accused of being Communists.  He had no shame, just like Trump.

        You may call my posts and alternative primes posts hysterical, but they involve critical thinking.  That is something I don't think you and the Trump voting base are capable of doing. 

        Good luck to you and people like you if Trump is elected.  I can just see him giving a State of the Union Speech, looking and acting just like Hitler and Mussolini.  If you don't believe me, just google both of those characters and see and hear what they looked like.

        I don't think you would do it so here are the links.  Watch Mussolini puff out his chest and lift his chin, just like Trump does. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOv-Ncs7vQk

        Listen to Hitler say his is going to make his country great again. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFNUdCtMXWE

        1. ahorseback profile image47
          ahorsebackposted 3 months ago in reply to this

          You're running right unto the  "Never Trump " hysteria  of mass naiveté- of a people much younger and inexperienced voter than you and I ,  good luck with that  lack of wisdom ! And yes I watched your low quality  video .

          1. peoplepower73 profile image87
            peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

            ahorseback:  You call it naivete. I call it critical thinking.

            1. GA Anderson profile image86
              GA Andersonposted 3 months ago in reply to this

              Do you really think your comparisons to Hitler and Mussolini are indicative of critical thinking?

              Do you really think your blanket condemnations, without any nod to the reasons for the actions you are condemning, are a result of critical thinking?

              Do you really think your comments are any less partisan than ahorseback's?

              I don't think your responses have earned the laurels you have assumed.

              If you wish to own the mantle of a critical thinker, then be one.

              GA

              1. peoplepower73 profile image87
                peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

                GA ANDERSON:  Yes, I made a statement and I backed it up with you tube presentations. It is not just an empty accusation.  That's called research and analysis.  Unlike Trump who lies, insults, and makes accusatory statements without backing them up.  Other than he says "believe me."  I did the research and analysis of Trumps lies that were presented by FactCheck, with their sources for every statement they made  Unlike Trump supporters who just accept what he says on blind faith, because they have been told Hillary is a criminal.  If she is a criminal, why don't they arrest her instead of holding these useless investigations?  I wish they would arrest her so that they can stop spending our tax payers money on these investigations that are nothing more than Witch Hunts.

                It's very simplistic for ahorseback to blame the liberals for all the countries woes.  I know our congress on both sides has been bought out by big corporations, and big moneyed interest.  I don't just blatantly blame republicans for all the countries ills.  I know that fox news has spread fear and propaganda for years and they are the mouth piece for the republican party. I know the difference between the national debt and the deficit.  I know that Trump constantly talks about Obama's national debt.  I know that he probably doesn't know that each president inherits the debt of the previous president.  So that means he will start with a national debt of around 22 trillion if he is elected.  More than likely, his supporters don't even have a clue.  if they did, they would call him on it.


                You don't know me and you don't know what I am capable of.  I have written many hubs on politics and they have all required research and analysis to get to the root cause of the issues.  Trump doesn't want critical thinkers, because they can see right through his smoke screen of bullying, insults, and incompetence.  Trump, the republican party, and  fox news have created an audience of Hillary Haters that are not critical thinkers, but react to sound bites and dog whistle politics.  That's the way they want it.

    3. 79
      Hxprofposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      I only heard pieces of Trump's speech, and I haven't looked at any of the links provided here.....and I'm not a Trump supporter.  However,  one thing he's been very consistent about is the policy of deporting illegal immigrants.  That's US law.  So, regardless of the lies he told during his speech (and no doubt he did lie), his determination to build a wall and deport illegals fits in with the constitutional requirements of our government to enforce the law.

    4. RJ Schwartz profile image91
      RJ Schwartzposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      The only thing I heard was American First, American Interests Frist, Obey American Law, Enforce the Law, America is a nation not held to any other standards but our own, lawbreakers and illegals will be punished.....

      1. peoplepower73 profile image87
        peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

        RJ SCHWART:  What you chose to hear and what the truth is are two different things.  I bet you didn't even look at the link.  It's amazing how we can filter out what we don't want to hear and see.

  2. Alternative Prime profile image87
    Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago

    "PATHOLOGICAL Liar" is an Under-Statement to DESCRIBE "Delusional Donald" & FACT-Check WEB-Sites Prove this POINT in SPADEs ~

    P.S. ~ Where's Donald's NEW "PRETEND Advisor" Sickly Lookin' Racist Kelly-Anne? If she's unable to give Trump Proper Relevant Critique I guess I'll have to and here it is ~

    Hey Donald, if your gonna' CONTINUE to ACT like Mussolini U need to STOP Lookin' like HOWDY Doody" ~ smile

  3. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    "Interior enforcement activity, including arrests and removals of criminal aliens, which are ICE’s highest priority, has declined significantly. More than 870,000 aliens who have been ordered removed are still living here in defiance of our laws. This dysfunction must be addressed before consideration of more mass amnesties or expansions in admissions of any kind. Until we achieve better control of illegal immigration, and the laws we have are taken seriously and enforced, there is no point in passing new ones."

    http://cis.org/ICE-Illegal-Immigrant-Deportations

  4. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    "The data collected by the Center during the past quarter-century has led many of our researchers to conclude that current, high levels of immigration are making it harder to achieve such important national objectives as better public schools, a cleaner environment, homeland security, and a living wage for every native-born and immigrant worker. These data may support criticism of US immigration policies, but they do not justify ill feelings toward our immigrant community. In fact, many of us at the Center are animated by a "low-immigration, pro-immigrant" vision of an America that admits fewer immigrants but affords a warmer welcome for those who are admitted."

    http://cis.org/About
    (Center for Immigration Studies)

  5. Alternative Prime profile image87
    Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago

    FYI ~ Statistics FLASHED Across my Monitor a FEW Minutes ago which Demonsrtated the FACT that Between 2009 - 2014, the U.S. Realized a "Net LOSS" of 140,000 Mexican Immigrants ~ Stats Courtesy of 'PEW Research" not Random BABBLINGs Spewed from "Delusional Donald's" HATE Filled BIG Racist Mouth ~

    Still believe "Delusional Donald's" FACTLESS  LIE about "IMPENDING Doom" Lurking just over the BORDER ?? sad ~ Everyone understands the Common Sense FACT that the Vast Majority of Immigrants DO NOT Migrate to the United States with Explicit Intent to Commit a Crime, WHY would they when that could be ACCOMPLISHED in their OWN Country? In REALITY, they come here for Opportunity & Documented or NOT, they CONTRIBUTE MORE to the Well Being of this Nation than any BACKWARD Congressional Republican I can think of, Papers or NOT ~

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      Hmm.  A net loss of 1%, at a time when many illegals leave to go home each year. 

      Yes, there is impending doom (probably overstated) lurking over our southern border.  It is unfortunate that liberals see it primarily as a source of votes to maintain their personal power, but that's not surprising in a politician.

      1. Alternative Prime profile image87
        Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

        No wilderness, we "Progressive Liberals" View Hispanics, Mexicans, Cubans et al Immigrants Documented or otherwise, as a "Vital & Integral Flesh and BLOOD COMPONENT" of the U.S. FABRIC ~ 99.999 Percent of these HARD Working Individuals have EARNED their RIGHT to Citizenship ~ NEVER Forget, they are "HUMAN Beings" FIRST & Foremost ABOVE ALL Else ~

        WE as DEMOCRATs Appreciate their CONTRIBUTIONs to this ALREADY Great Nation, Contributions which are CLEARLY Evident here in California and NO, we do NOT Consider them to be IN-HUMAN "Rapists & Criminals" who must be "ROUNDED Up, PUNISHED & Inhumanely TORN Apart" from their FAMILIES at all cost as ""Delusional RACIST Donald" is SALIVATING to do ~ But FORTUNATELY, he'll NEVER get that CHANCE from OUR Oval Office due to OBVIOUS Reasons ~

        The VAST Majority of AMERICANs would rather see "Drumpf the SWINDLER" DEPORTED back to whatever LAND he came from, along with SEVERAL CONservative Congressional Republicans who have done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING for the United States in 8 Years aside from OBSTRUCT & File FRIVOLOUS Law Suits ~ sad ~

        1. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
          Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago in reply to this

          why the caps? AP?

          1. Alternative Prime profile image87
            Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

            lol @ Kathryn ~ I find when CONservatives are "Decisively DEFEATED" with FACTs, they RESORT to Petty Little Frivolous Personal Attacks ~

            I'll simply RESPOND by ASKING the FOLLOWING Question ~

            What's with the "LACK of CREATIVITY" ?? I see the SAME Old Boring FONT & Writing STYLE EVERYWHERE ~ I prefer to EXPAND My Horizons all the TIME & NOT Stagnate ~ smile ~

            1. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
              Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago in reply to this

              well, it is it is as irritating as seeing this emoji: ~> wink <~  I 'm sure you know it. lol

              wink

    2. 79
      Hxprofposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      If they're undocumented, that means they're here illegally, and thus are referred to by many as illegal aliens.  They have no business being here.

  6. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    BLOOD COMPONENT FABRIC HARD EARNED RIGHT
    NEVER HUMAN FIRST ABOVE
    WE DEMOCRAT CONTRIBUTION ALREADY CLEARLY
    NO NOT IN-HUMAN ROUNDED
    PUNISHED TORN FAMILIES RACIST SALIVATING FORTUNATELY
    NEVER CHANGE OUR OBVIOUS VAST MAJORITY
    AMERICAN SWINDLER DEPORTED LAND SEVERAL CON  ABSOLUTELY NOTHING OBSTRUCT FRIVOLOUS
    ( looking for secret message. wink)

    1. Alternative Prime profile image87
      Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      smile ~ U ALMOST Got It ~ smile ~ "HUMAN FABRIC"  is the UNDERLYING Theme of my COMMENT ~

  7. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    I suppose  y o u r  HUMAN FABRIC = "OBVIOUS VAST MAJORITY"

    Well, I disagree.  wink

    1. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
      Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      maybe you meant this: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING should OBSTRUCT the FRIVOLOUS. wink

  8. ahorseback profile image47
    ahorsebackposted 3 months ago

    It's very ,very telling that ultra- Liberals cannot see beyond their usual professional   entitle-ist  thought process'  !     America has given - GIVEN -Mexico at least fifty million dollars a year  - for years !
    50,000,000 in foreign aid , and for what ?!!!!

    What has Mexico given America  ?------15- 20 million ILLEGAL  immigrants , some of the worst perpetrators  of crimes to live within our midst !    Not to be included with LEGAL immigrants.

    Nice Trade deal there  ! Vote TRUMP

    In my "closed minded "opinion , Fifty Million dollars a year will continue to finance  a  nice wall !

    1. Alternative Prime profile image87
      Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

      lol smile ~ Yup ~ As USUAL, "Delusional Donald" is LATE by about 2,221 YEARs when the AGE of Building GREAT BiG USELESS Concrete WALLs ENDED with that Ridiculous Monstrosity that was Erected in CHINA, a Communist Place where by the way, your LOSER Candidate OWEs MILLIONs to ~ sad

      BIG Useless CONCRETE Walls SLAPPED Shoddily together by an INEPT Money Grubbing Individual along with his "Demented DREAM" of DIGGING Up the BONES of Patton & MacArthur, two ANTIQUATED 1940's Soldiers "Drumpf" would Commission to Engage in a 21st CENTURY Conflict of today ~

      Yup, I guess if your waiting Patiently for NAPOLEON or Genghis Khan to MOUNT an ARMY and "COME Git us" his ideas might be useful, but I ain't seen SIGNs of either one lately ~ HAVE U ? I'm willing to bet Donald Probably has ~ sad

      Anyway ahorseback, Undocumented Immigrant Human Beings will NEVER Harm U, they are here for OPPORTUNITY just like your ANCESTORs came here for, but "Drumpfy TRUMP's" SCHEME to "CUT your Paycheck" Certainly will HARM U & YOUR Entire Family ~

      NO, "Delusional Donald" will NEVER be Allowed to OCCUPY OUR White House nor get his Petite Little Handz on OUR Nuclear BOMBs, and that should give U & ALL HUMANs some COMFORT ~

      1. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

        "Anyway ahorseback, Undocumented Immigrant Human Beings will NEVER Harm U"

        Fascinating opinion, although a little lacking in depth or honesty.

        Illegal aliens don't take opportunities such as jobs?  They don't use health care without paying?  They don't drive illegally without insurance?  They don't take room in jails?  They don't send children to school at someone else's expense?  They don't ignore the law, providing an excuse for others to do so?

        But of course they hurt no one, do they?  The liberal mind is a fascinating thing with it's ability to ignore reality and fabricate opinions on nothing but thin air.

        1. 79
          Hxprofposted 3 months ago in reply to this

          They do all of these things wilderness, and the other pertinent fact is that we (as a nation) get to decide who can come here and who can't, it's that simple.   There are laws in place to ensure that this happens, but recent presidents have ignored them.

        2. Alternative Prime profile image87
          Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

          lol ~ This KIND of "DERANGED & Delusional" Thinking is one of the Primary REASONs WHY "Drumpf" will be DECIMATED in November along with many of his BACKWARD CONservative Congressional Republicans who are just as IGNORANT ~

          What some Un-Educated individuals Fail to REALIZE is the FACT that the VAST Majority of Undocumented Immigrants are "Hard Working & LAW Abiding" Human Beings unlike CON-Man Trump who has a SIGNIFICANT "Rap Sheet" of UNLAWFUL Activity which includes DE-FRAUDING Our Elderly AMERICANs ~

          So, I guess if "Violation or NON-Violation" of the LAW is the Primary MEASURE by which an individual is HUNTED Down, Cuffed, then TORN Away from his / her Family ONLY to be EXILED to another COUNTRY against his / her will , I guess Donald should be at the TOP of that LIST ~

          1. 79
            Hxprofposted 3 months ago in reply to this

            LOL (many times) - IF individuals are HUNTED DOWN LIKE DOGS, separated from their families and EXILED TO ANOTHER COUNTRY AGAINST THEIR FREKIN' WILL, then do you think, just maybe, that it's because they have come into the country illegally and BROUGHT IT UPON THEMSELVES??? OH MY GOSH, THAT'S IT!!!!!!

          2. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

            Does being hard working negate any of the things mentioned?  Of course not - it's just another false trail to divert from the question - the insinuation that illegal aliens harm no one.  They certainly do, and being hard working doesn't change that.

            1. Alternative Prime profile image87
              Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

              lol ~ The "FALSE Trail" is the DEULSION that we have an "IMPENDING Doom" at OUR Border ~ Just like "DELUSIONAL Donald's" BIRTHER NONSENSE or his "Grand DELUSION" that Ted Cruz' Father was in on some sort of CONSPIRACY to Assassinate JFK ~ RIDICULOUS Nonsense & VOTERs Understand this ~

              The REALITY is we've EXPERIENCED a NET Outflow of Undocumented WORKERs as CLEARLY Illustrated by the FACTs Presented by Pew RESEARCH & sure, we ALL Understand that a Tiny Minority of Un-Documented Human Beings do indeed commit CRIMEs here in the United States, and they of course should be REMOVED from the COUNTRY and or Penalized, but to my KNOWLEDGE, None have SET Up a FAKE University to SWINDLE Thousands of AMERICANs, nor have any to my Knowledge ENCOURAGED the Russians to BREACH OUR National Security, both Incidents do however have Trump's FINGER-Prints ~

              Today, I watched two Gentlemen I presumed to be Un-Documented Individuals TRIM Massive 70 Foot Trees Adjacent to my Property, a Difficult & DANGEROUS JOB very few other Individuals that I know of who would either ACCEPT or Perform ~

              1. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
                Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                This just in:  America NEEDS brave illegal aliens for our Difficult & DANGEROUS tree trimming.

                1. Alternative Prime profile image87
                  Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                  Maybe EVERYONE should try Climbing a 70 FOOT Tree then Proceed to SLICE the Branches aroung them ~ I believe a GREATER Appreciation for this "Labor Intensive & DANGEROUS" JOB might be a Take-Away from the Experience ~

                  BTW ~ U can INCLUDE Car Washing, Hotel ROOM "Cleaning & Maintenance", Crop Harvesting, Landscaping, Restaurant Kitchen WORK, Porcelain TILE Floor Installation etc to that LIST ~

                  There are VERY "Good & Valid" REASONs WHY these "Labor Intensive JOBs" are Performed Primarily by Minorities who are Un-Documented or otherwise, and DESPITE the FOX Loser Network "CIRCUS of LIEs & Ridiculous IGNORANCE Based SPIN" sad the VAST Majority of Hispanics / Latinos / Cubans who happen to be "Paperless" are NOT EMPLOYED at Hughes AIRCRAFT or Skunkworks or the LOCAL Manufacturing PLANT, to the CONTRARY, they do Work which Maintains the Underlying FABRIC of the Community & That's simply an Undisputed HARD-Core FACT ~

              2. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                I assume you've never been involved in manual labor as you don't know a single individual that would do such a dangerous job.

                I've personally ridden one of those lifts (that I assume they were using) 80 feet in the air during a construction project.  All of my crew did - some 50 people.  All of the other trades did - likely around 1,000 people at one time or another were 80 feet in the air on a snorkel lift.  I was there when one drove off the edge, catching the snorkel on surrounding steel - the people were rescued, the machine put back on it's wheels and work continued.  Use of such machinery is common practice in the construction industry, and it isn't just done by illegal aliens.

                Your pathetic attempt to glorify illegals as doing dangerous work no one else will do is worthless and degrading.

                1. Alternative Prime profile image87
                  Alternative Primeposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                  I'm VERY Familiar with "MANUAL Labor" & Perhaps many of the "Immigrant BASHERs" around here and everywhere should PERSONALLY spend some time in a "BORDER State" for a Hefty "DOSE of REALITY" ~

                  Un-Documented WORKERs Typically LACK the "Discretionary FUNDs" for "CUSHY" Job Enhancing "MACHINERY", not that it's an UNPREFERED Method, so I would QUESTION which one of us is actually EDUCATED on the SUBJECT & which one of us ACTUALLY MEETs, Interacts & Talks to Un-Documented WORKERs on an almost DAILY Basis ~ I do, and given your locale, I would ASSUME "Personal Contact" is a RARITY, unless of course we're TALKING "BIGFOOTs or Leprechauns", who to my knowledge, are indeed PAPERLESS as well ~ smile

                  The Tree Trimmers CLIMBED the TREEs, tied off a Rope as "FALL Protection" and then used a CHAIN Saw & Manual SAW to do the JOB ~ ZERO HIGH Tech Machinery was involved ~

                  At his AGE of 70, and Considering his Obvious BREATHING & Neck Problems, not to mention his Obesity, Petite Handz, Unhealthy DIET, Lack of Exercise & Limited Mental Capacity, we would have to assume "Drumpfy Trump"  would be Extremely LUCKY to MUSTER the PHYSICAL Ability & Strength to merely UN-Pack the TREE-Trimming GEAR.......sad sad

                  1. peoplepower73 profile image87
                    peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

                    Wilderness:  I find it interesting that you compare manual labor to only what you experienced. That's called a false equivalence.   How about all the other menial tasks that undocumented labor is willing to do?  Making beds, cleaning hotels, picking fruits and vegetables, washing cars, and construction work to name a few.  How many white folks do you know who are willing to do those jobs for the same pay as those workers?

                    When Trump gets rid of those workers, is he taking them out all at once or one at a time as they are replaced by loving American citizens as he calls them?  If he takes them out all at once, our economy and all the goods and services that those people contributed to will go down the tubes. And the price of those goods will increase, because nobody is going to work for what their labor costs were.  Those costs will be passed on to the consumer.   

                    If he takes them out one at a time, it will take forever to replace them.  Will he have job fairs for citizens that want to replace those he deported.  These are just a few things have to be thought out before, before he starts pledging concepts as policy. He is working from the big picture and leaving out the details.  Maybe that's how it is done in the real estate world, but not in government policy,  You start with the details and feasibility studies and then summarize what the concept is, not the other way around.  He is doing nothing more than providing false hope for his supporters and those who think they have been disenfranchise by the system.  The big elephant in the room is congress.  If they don't approve his policies, none of it gets done.  He is not a king, as he likes to think of himself.  That's why we have the balance of power and the president is supposed to have very little power.  He claims he won't use executive orders. But he also states that he is the only one that can fix a rigged system.

    2. peoplepower73 profile image87
      peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

      ahorseback:  Trumps said his will wall will cost 8 billion to 12 billion.  At 8 billion, 50 million is 0.625% of 8 billion.  At 12 billion 50 million is 0.416% of 12 billion.  I'm sure that will go a long way to build his wall.

      Let's do some critical thinking here.  He is going to build a wall at cheap price.  That means he is going to use cheap labor.  Cheap construction labor comes from undocumented labor. Is he going to deport them before he builds the wall or after he builds the wall?  His wall is going to have a beautiful door..  There are currently 48 legal border crossings.  Is he going to close all of them except for the door.  Does he build the wall first with the one door and then push everybody through the door or is he going to deport everybody and then build the wall with one door?

      You just don't deport 11 million people in one day.  They have to be detained and processed.  Where is he going to detain and process these people or is he just going to put them in buses and drive them back across the border?  How long is that going to take?   In his last speech, he says he is going to send them far into mexico.  How many airplanes is that going to take? 

      Here is a link that will give everybody some realty about Trump and his wall.

      http://www.attn.com/stories/8502/donald … -wall-cost

      1. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

        "You just don't deport 11 million people in one day."

        You're absolutely right.  But you CAN make a great start by merely enforcing labor laws already in place, giving them a teeth to bite those that disregard them, and increase the labor enforcing them.  No deportation necessary, no detaining and no processing.

        1. peoplepower73 profile image87
          peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

          Wilderness:  That's not what Trump wants.  He want's to deport 11 million illegal aliens.  If you want to play nice, then you first have to be deported and then if you want to enter in the U.S. again, you have to comply with point 10 of his 10 point policy:

          "-To select immigrants based on their likelihood of success in U.S. society, and their ability to be financially self-sufficient. We need a system that serves our needs – remember, it’s America First.

          – To choose immigrants based on merit, skill and proficiency

          – And to establish new immigration controls to boost wages and to ensure that open jobs are offered to American workers first."

          You might as well put a cloak over the statue of liberty, it will no longer serve for which it stands.:

          "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

          Ah... not so much anymore.  Sorry, you have been locked out of the "Golden Door" by the Trump Master.  You now have to enter through his big, beautiful door and jump through his hoops.

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

            Obviously disagree with the deportation as it can't be done so easily.

            As far as the others: ALL citizens are equal, including immigrants.  But yes, jobs should be first offered to citizens before those legally here to work.  And not at all to illegal aliens, citizens of another country that are here illegally.

            Yes, the days of inviting anyone and everyone into the country are gone.  We are already supporting too many, citizens and not, for that to be a viable option any more.  The Golden Door is gone, likely forever, and I do not support inviting anyone that wants to feed at the American trough on American generosity.

            1. RJ Schwartz profile image91
              RJ Schwartzposted 3 months ago in reply to this

              I'd disagree - American police forces nationwide arrested 12 million people last year, a large percentage were illegals.  So if all police were instructed to bring illegals in for deportation over a period of a year or two.  Add in the fact of those who self-deport instead of getting arrested first.  Of course, make severe Federal penalties for employing or renting property to an illegal to help the process.  Deny all illegals from any hospital or ER and all public buildings.
              Not too tough now is it?  Deportation is more about WILL rather than money or emotions.

              1. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                If our cops are charged with arresting illegals, it will require a great many more cops.  Don't forget that the mere arrest requires hours of time and that finding  those illegals is the hard and time consuming part of the equation.  It was tried in Arizona, you know, and now the sheriff is under indictment for doing it.

                1. Live to Learn profile image81
                  Live to Learnposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                  What's wrong with not searching for illegal aliens but if someone is arrested and determined to be an illegal alien they are simply turned over to INS? Don't need extra cops for that. Only extra INS agents, though.

                  1. wilderness profile image96
                    wildernessposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                    What's wrong is Obama's executive order for police not to detain based on illegal entry and INS not to accept illegals from cops.

                    But it should be done, notwithstanding Obama's desire to simply grant amnesty to all of them.  While it would not make a huge difference in the numbers, every little bit helps.

          2. GA Anderson profile image86
            GA Andersonposted 3 months ago in reply to this

            When you read Trump's plan, did you consider our immigration laws already on the books - just to see how savagely Trump was going to butcher them? It looks like they are pretty close to Trump's list.

            It appears the first, and most used category for application to immigrate is based on family ties to U.S. citizens, but the next largest application criteria is employment based, and here is our current desired immigrant priorities:

            Job or Employment Based:

            People who want to become immigrants based on employment or a job offer may apply for permanent residence or an immigrant visa abroad, when an immigrant visa number becomes available according to the following employment based preferences:

                First Preference: Priority Workers, including aliens with extraordinary abilities, outstanding professors and researchers, and certain multinational executives and managers
                Second Preference: Members of professions holding an advanced degree or persons of exceptional ability (including individuals seeking a National Interest Waiver)
                Third Preference: Skilled Workers, professionals and other qualified workers
                Fourth Preference: Certain special immigrants including those in religious vocations
                Fifth Preference: Employment creation immigrants (investors or entrepreneurs)


            Here is a summary from a research paper comparing U.S. and Australian immigration policies.

            Apparently our current U.S. immigration laws threw that cloak over Lady Liberty long before Trump came along.

            ps. I also found a "Critical Thinking" link that included this summary:

            A well-cultivated critical thinker:

                Raises vital questions and problems, formulating them clearly and precisely
                Gathers and assesses relevant information, using abstract ideas to interpret it effectively
                Comes to well-reasoned conclusions and solutions, testing them against relevant criteria and standards
                Thinks open-mindedly within alternative systems of thought, recognizing and assessing, as needs be, their assumptions, implications, and practical consequences
                Communicates effectively with others in figuring out solutions to complex problems


            So it is more than just researching a topic, anybody can do that.

            GA

            1. peoplepower73 profile image87
              peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

              GA Anderson:  What you have cited is an academic, intellectual definition of critical thinking.  So if I don't meet the criteria of "The Critical Thinking Foundation" then I'm not a critical thinker?  To me critical thinking is the difference between having blind faith and accepting information on its face value or to question it and do research and analysis to come to the root cause of issues.  There are many people on both sides of the fence that accept what politicians say based on blind faith or because of there circumstances do not have the time or the inclination to research and analyze issues.  Accepting Trump's lies that are recorded for all the world to see and hear is a good example of non-critical thinking.  His lies and contradictions are recorded as hard evidence and yet people just over look them.

              You can say that people who support Hillary do the same thing.  But the difference is she is guilty until proven innocent.  There is no hard evidence that she acted with criminal intent.  If there were, she would be prosecuted as a criminal.  The excuse for why she hasn't been prosecuted is that she is so well connected with people in high places in the criminal justice system. 

              That is nothing more than a ploy that doesn't use critical thinking or even common sense logic.  It is nothing more than the propaganda of the right wing because they see her as threat to their agenda.  Further, if she were tried in a court of law, the constitution says you are innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.  The congressional investigations and Trump accusations that she has been under are nothing more than political theater to demean her character, so that she won't be elected. 

              "Trump calls her a bigot.because she only sees black people as a vote, not as humans worthy of a better future."  There are people out there who believe she is a bigot because of that statement.  Nothing could be further from the truth.  If you look at the the support she has given to black people.  Trump doesn't even know how to reach out to blacks.  He holds a rally with white people and talks about how he is going to help the blacks.  Isn't he just looking for their vote, because his poll numbers are so low?  After severely insulting them, he says:  "Vote for me what the hell do you have to lose?"  There are people out there that think that is really great.  My critical thought processes tells me that is B.S.  Oh I could go on and on, but I'm going to end it here.

              1. GA Anderson profile image86
                GA Andersonposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                I understand your political positions, and your emotional investment in them.  Most of us are probably emotionally supportive of our opinions too.

                Although I think there is room for discussion concerning most your Trump issues, my first effort was to point out the shakiness of your footing regarding your opinion of other folk's opinions.

                There is a tone in your comments that yours is the only intelligent and informed position. And that contrary opinions can only be knuckled-headed. Your most recent string was your use of "Critical Thinking" as a club to call an opposing comment idiotic. You stood on the footing of an educated and researched opinion, that you ascribed to "Critical Thinking." You were mistaken.

                Critical Thinking is a recognized school of processes. It is defined by a specific set of efforts. My thought is that most folks hearing the use of critical thinking - think of that critical thinking. That you consider your research and analysis methods as "critical thinking," is not just a semantics point; informed, or intelligent, or even cautious thinking are not synonyms for critical thinking.

                You might easily call your research and considerations to be called informed or intelligent thinking. And they may or may not be well founded, but they are not the results of critical thinking. You may call it so, but you would still be wrong.

                This probably shouldn't be a big deal, but, your use of it as a club to berate other opinions made it so. If you were wrong about the footing  for your superior position, then maybe you are wrong about other things too. Like your opinion concerning Trump's immigration points and that cloak?

                GA

                1. peoplepower73 profile image87
                  peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

                  GA Anderson:  You can call it whatever you want.  It is just a matter of semantics.  Do you think someone who accepts information on blind faith is a critical thinker?  I think you are trying to make a big deal about what I said about critical thinking. 

                  I have heard many people describe the acceptance of propaganda that is being spewed today and not using critical thinking.  Which in layman's terms means accepting information on its face value without question. Critical thinking in my case is a matter of seeking the truth, not accepting propaganda as truth without further investigation.  You are right, research and analysis is very easy to do with today's technology, but there are those out there that don't do it for whatever reason.

                  I can go to fact check. org and see what Trump says in speeches or Hillary for that matter and find the truth.  Because, they do the critical thinking that you are espousing:  Read this about the Annenberg Foundation:

                  "We are a nonpartisan, nonprofit “consumer advocate” for voters that aims to reduce the level of deception and confusion in U.S. politics. We monitor the factual accuracy of what is said by major U.S. political players in the form of TV ads, debates, speeches, interviews and news releases. Our goal is to apply the best practices of both journalism and scholarship, and to increase public knowledge and understanding.
                  FactCheck.org is a project of the Annenberg Public Policy Center of the University of Pennsylvania. The APPC was established by publisher and philanthropist Walter Annenberg to create a community of scholars within the University of Pennsylvania that would address public policy issues at the local, state and federal levels."

                  I know that is just one example, but there are many sources out there like this.  In my view, one doesn't have to use a scholarly process to find the truth to be a critical thinker.  If you want to devalue my efforts, that's your choice.

                  What is your definition for people who accept information on blind faith and how do you define the opposite of that?  Here is an example: Bernie Sanders is a Communist, because he calls himself a social democrat.  People who believe that are not using critical thinking, they are accepting it on blind faith from its source. And believe me, there are many people out there who believe that.

                  1. GA Anderson profile image86
                    GA Andersonposted 3 months ago in reply to this

                    No, it is not just semantics, and I was not trying to devalue your efforts. I was trying to politely point out that your repeated use of "Critical Thinking" as the reason your superior reasoning was right, and others were just mindless parrots, did not pass muster. If your why you are right is wrong, then maybe you aren't so right after all.

                    For instance, your claim that Trump's immigration plan would be the same as tossing a cloak over Lady Liberty's message. I believe that had you compared Trump's plan to our current immigration polices, you would have discovered that although there is much in what Trump says that deserves your criticism, the bulk of his plan is already part our immigration laws and policies.

                    Instead, it appears you latched onto the hot-buttons of "the wall" and mass deportations, as explained by the pundits, as sufficient to condemn him as the man who shot Lady Liberty.

                    Take a look at Trump's core immigration policies and compare them to our current immigration laws. I think that you will find more similarities than you expected. (or at least more than the pundits you listen to talk about)

                    I think the wall idea is dumb, no matter who is proposing it. I think this mass deportation force idea is even more dumb, but neither effect our legal immigration policies. They only apply to the enforcement of policy.

                    You made this point in a previous post:
                    "... If you want to play nice, then you first have to be deported and then if you want to enter in the U.S. again, you have to comply with point 10 of his 10 point policy:

                    "-To select immigrants based on their likelihood of success in U.S. society, and their ability to be financially self-sufficient. We need a system that serves our needs – remember, it’s America First.

                    – To choose immigrants based on merit, skill and proficiency

                    – And to establish new immigration controls to boost wages and to ensure that open jobs are offered to American workers first."

                    You might as well put a cloak over the statue of liberty, it will no longer serve for which it stands..."


                    But... all three of those points you claimed are so outrageously Trump, are already part of our immigration selection criteria. Did you know that, or did you just blindly and mindlessly accept the word of some pundit that said it was so?

                    GA

  9. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    "There is no hard evidence that she (Hillary) acted with criminal intent.  If there were, she would be prosecuted as a criminal." Peoplepower 73   

    And why did she step down as Secretary of State?

    1. peoplepower73 profile image87
      peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

      Kathryn:  So your logic is she stepped down from Secretary of State; therefore, she is a guilty criminal  of all the things she is accused of.  I don't know why she stepped down, maybe you should ask her.  She is the only one that can tell you why.  Everything else is conjecture and conspiracy theory.

      Maybe it was because of all the accusations and investigations, her job as Secretary of State was jeopardized, because she had to prepare for all the investigations.  When you have years of investigations, one of which lasted 11 grueling  hours, how does one do their job? This includes the congressmen who are conducting the investigation.  Why don't they go back to work and do something productive? They are supposed to write laws, instead of 8 years of blocking Obama's initiatives to try to make him a one term president and to try to accuse Hillary of acts with criminal intent?  This is not only a waste of time but also costs the tax payers megabucks.

      Why do they do that?  It's because they want a republican back in office with a republican congress and Trump is just a faulty manifestation of all the right wing propaganda spewed by the Tea Party, Fox News, and Britebart.  The GOP has no one to blame but themselves for this loose cannon, that cannot follow the party line and has to be coached as to how to speak in a presidential manner.  He even criticized people who use teleprompters and now he is using one.

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
        Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago in reply to this

        Your attitude is cavalier. Talk to the mothers of the service men who died because of her negligence. Apparently, she hid the evidence pointing to her as the one responsible.

        … State Department officials were criticized for denying requests for additional security at the consulate prior to the attack. In her role as Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton subsequently took responsibility for the security lapses." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Benghazi_attack

        1. peoplepower73 profile image87
          peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

          Kathryn:  Prove that she had criminal intent. Talk to the mother's of the people including civilians that died in Iraq and Afghanistan, because of George, W, Cheny, and Rumsfeld invading a country under false pretenses.

  10. Kathryn L Hill profile image86
    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 months ago

    "This includes the congressmen who are conducting the investigation.  Why don't they go back to work and do something productive? They are supposed to write laws, instead of 8 years of blocking Obama's initiatives to try to make him a one term president and to try to accuse Hillary of acts with criminal intent?  This is not only a waste of time but also costs the tax payers megabucks." peoplepower73

    What if it had been Romney who did what she did? You would want our congressmen to conduct an investigation and accuse HIM of acts with criminal intent… no matter what the cost.

    Right? yikes ?

    1. peoplepower73 profile image87
      peoplepower73posted 3 months ago in reply to this

      Kathryn: Cost is only part of it. First off there has to be criminal intent. Then he should be tried in a court of law with lawyers, a judge, and a jury and supporting evidence, not a congressional investigation.  And he would be innocent until the evidence showed that he was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt by a jury of his peers.  That is the right that is afforded to all citizens.  Why is Hillary accused of first being guilty and then she has to prove her own innocence to a court of congressmen who have an agenda to begin with? That is unconstitutional, as far as I know.

  11. wilderness profile image96
    wildernessposted 3 months ago

    A part of Trumps plan is "The Wall" - something that liberals love to make fun of.

    Now Britain is building a wall to keep illegals out.  Maybe Trump isn't alone in the desire for secure borders?  It also seems that the French are getting upset at illegals, and citizens are demanding the removal of a camp of some 9,000 of them.

    How is it that other countries, when confronted will illegal aliens, do something about it while the US just plods along, happy to increase profits to those hiring illegally and paying off the legislators to allow it to continue?

 
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