jump to last post 1-3 of 3 discussions (31 posts)

Trump signs sweeping order that could gut Obamacare

  1. promisem profile image93
    promisemposted 2 months ago

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/trump-eo-233950

    Note the steady decline in employer and Medicare costs on the attached chart from the Bureau of Economic Analysis and other sources.

    http://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/13371620_f248.jpg

    1. Credence2 profile image84
      Credence2posted 2 months ago in reply to this

      It thought it was supposed to be repeal and replace. So much for that idea. He wastes no time in screwing the vulnerable, day 1.

      Those among those vulnerable that were dumb enough to vote for Trump will find out that he is not just going to get back at 'those people'.


      Don't blame me, I supported Bernie.

      1. promisem profile image93
        promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

        Before Obamacare, I knew someone who lost a job and then had a terrible accident.

        Four days in the hospital intensive care unit produced bills of more than $100,000. She declared bankruptcy as a result.

        That $100,000 expense didn't vanish into thin air. The hospital simply folded it into pricing it passes on to the insurance companies for people with coverage. It's why medical bankruptcies in this country were skyrocketing before ACA.

        What anti-ACA people don't seem to understand is that our purely market-based system was heading into the toilet before ACA.

        If people don't like ACA, then fix it. But it's naive to think that killing it altogether will make things better. The attached graph from the Bureau of Economic Analysis shows a dramatic improvement in costs for people in the individual market.

        http://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/13371610_f248.jpg

        1. Credence2 profile image84
          Credence2posted 2 months ago in reply to this

          Perhaps you have heard how the GOP apparatchics have been so keen on muzzling The CBO and the the truth they provide as an nopartisan agency saying how repeal of ACA would have an adverse effect upon the budget.

          So, now, we shoot the messenger, it this a harbinger of things to come?

          Of course, now that this once respected agency is not parroting Trump regime propaganda, it needs to be dismantled. At least that is the word I get from the Trump Regime's ideological equivalent of Joseph Goebbles, Newt Gingrich.

          1. promisem profile image93
            promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

            The two charts I posted used data from other agencies as well. It will be difficult to muzzle everyone in government except for the White House.

            You may have read that the new administration has already shut down the Department of Interior Twitter account because it didn't like the postings. I suspect there is more to come.

        2. profile image80
          Hxprofposted 2 months ago in reply to this

          Getting rid of the taxes and the mandates that ride along with the ACA are the main issues, IMO.  If we take those things out of the ACA, we could then leave many elements of it in place.

          1. promisem profile image93
            promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

            If you get rid of the taxes and the mandate, you will have no money for the subsidies that make health care affordable for 20 million people. The system will collapse.

            Then we go back to skyrocketing medical bankruptcies.

            1. profile image80
              Hxprofposted 2 months ago in reply to this

              Look to other ways to keep premiums down.

              1. promisem profile image93
                promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

                Can you provide some examples?

                1. profile image80
                  Hxprofposted 2 months ago in reply to this

                  Not suggesting I have all the solutions....and there may not be any acceptable solutions - I don't know for certain.  But requiring people to buy something is simply wrong, no matter what we're trying to accomplish.  Fine at the state level, but at the federal level that's WRONG.  When the government starts to interfere in people lives that way, the "solution" being provided is worse than the problem we're trying to solve.  That's all.

  2. colorfulone profile image88
    colorfuloneposted 2 months ago

    Trump signed an order to ‘ease the burden of Obamacare’.  Maybe dumb people can't understand that a process has to begin.  Obamacare is a failure, and I look forward to affordable healthcare with renewed hope.

    1. Live to Learn profile image82
      Live to Learnposted 2 months ago in reply to this

      It's always easier to complain than be a positive part of the process.

      I'm with you. There is a first step to everything. I look forward to the revised and, hopefully, more sensible approach.

      1. promisem profile image93
        promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

        What complaint do you mean? Do Trump and the GOP have a replacement after 8 years of complaints about ACA?

        1. Live to Learn profile image82
          Live to Learnposted 2 months ago in reply to this

          Do you care? Would it matter to you? I doubt it. I'm sure you'd still find a complaint; if your posts stay true to form.

          1. promisem profile image93
            promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

            You didn't answer my questions.

            http://www.dictionary.com/browse/civility?s=t

            1. Live to Learn profile image82
              Live to Learnposted 2 months ago in reply to this

              The point of my reply was simply that I haven't noticed any amount of discourse (civil or otherwise) appears to get through to you. And, you (like a few others) appear to try and convict Trump for perceptions of what his actions will be. This is just like the far right was during Obama's presidency. It's good to see that you far ends are all alike. I simply wish you guys could see it too.

              I stand by my original statement. Let's wait and see before bashing.

              1. promisem profile image93
                promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

                Where do you see an attack on Trump in my original post? I simply posted a headline about his executive order.

                Where is your attempt at civil discourse? You still didn't answer my questions or even make any attempt at discourse. That's the pot calling the kettle black.

      2. colorfulone profile image88
        colorfuloneposted 2 months ago in reply to this

        I don't think Trump was handed a magic wand as impetus people assume.  This is going to take an act of Congress, but the momentum has begun.   We have to leave this up to the big boys and girls.

        I'm with you, too. smile

        1. promisem profile image93
          promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

          Well, yes, he was. He had 8 years to read 60 ACA bills from the Republicans that they sent to Obama.

          1. colorfulone profile image88
            colorfuloneposted 2 months ago in reply to this

            I think we all have known people who have a great need to have things just so, so they can let go of a load.     

            Let 'The Man' get his cabinet in place. 

            http://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/13371679.jpg

    2. promisem profile image93
      promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

      I don't think extracting a three-word phrase from the announcement is a helpful way to imply that reasonable people are dumb

      Trump said repeatedly that he would kill Obamacare on his first day in office. He also said he would call a "special session of Congress" on his first day to kill it then and there. That did not happen.

      Apparently he is one of the dumb people you mention because he doesn't understand the legislative process.

      If you want to provide credible facts on why you think ACA is a failure, please do so. I am interested in your explanation.

      1. colorfulone profile image88
        colorfuloneposted 2 months ago in reply to this

        Have you even bothered to read Trump's plan? 
        https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions/ … are-reform

        However, it is not enough to simply repeal this terrible legislation. We will work with Congress to make sure we have a series of reforms ready for implementation that follow free market principles and that will restore economic freedom and certainty to everyone in this country. By following free market principles and working together to create sound public policy that will broaden healthcare access, make healthcare more affordable and improve the quality of the care available to all Americans.

        Any reform effort must begin with Congress....

        Dumb, Dumb, Dumb, Dumb!  ~  Beethoven

        1. promisem profile image93
          promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

          Have you read the 60 plans that the Republicans sent to Obama?

          "Repeal Obamacare", use "HSA accounts" and "deduct premiums" is not a plan. I already use HSA accounts and deduct premiums. Thanks you.

          I would still love to hear your facts on why ACA is a failure.

          1. wilderness profile image95
            wildernessposted 2 months ago in reply to this

            But without an employer I can do neither (HSA or deduct premiums).  Either or both would be an advantage.

            1. promisem profile image93
              promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

              I just looked at your profile. It says you are an electrician. If you act as a contractor, even for a few jobs a year, you can form an LLC and deduct the premiums as a business expense. If you use a high-dedictible account (which I do now), you can use the HSA.

              1. wilderness profile image95
                wildernessposted 2 months ago in reply to this

                Nope, I'm retired now (don't tell the profile police!).  So I'm on medicare (paying non-deductible premiums) and health care costs that are also non-deductible (unless catastrophic for the year) but also paying premiums and costs for my wife.  Even if I made up some kind of faux LLC, finding a legitimate reason to deduct for my wife sounds tricky.

    3. Faith Reaper profile image88
      Faith Reaperposted 2 months ago in reply to this

      Exactly!

  3. wilderness profile image95
    wildernessposted 2 months ago

    If relieving the burden on citizens means "Gutting Obamacare", then it desperately needs gutting, don't you think?

    1. promisem profile image93
      promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

      Please describe the burden. What is the solution to fix the double digit annual increases in national health care costs before ACA?

      1. wilderness profile image95
        wildernessposted 2 months ago in reply to this

        Perhaps being forced to purchase public products that aren't wanted or of use to the individual.  Perhaps being forced to purchase public products that a business cannot afford.  Perhaps just having the right to purchase as pleased removed.  Do you really not understand that being forced, under law, to spend money can be a burden?

        Discontinue it with all of it's built in useless and unnecessary costs.  Either do without or institute govt. paid health care without requiring the populace to provide profits to insurance companies.

        1. promisem profile image93
          promisemposted 2 months ago in reply to this

          I agree with you.

 
working