Time and again we have seen politicians from both parties going through the revolving doors of corruption in Washington – the most rat infested city imaginable.
Do you believe your vote counts? The way I feel is that the futile effort only validates a fraudulent government and gives “credibility” to an inexistent “democracy”
I had enough of this charade and I will no longer prostitute myself by voting in the land of the "free" and insignifiante
I agree, Petra! I'm no longer voting because I believe the election (of the president, at least) is already decided, and changed via electronic voting machines to fit the desires of the powers that be. Unless the corruption ends I'm not going to make the effort to support the voting charade.
You prefer communist Romania? My impression is that Ceausescu was hardly an example of moral purity. Refusal to participate in the election process is no solution.
I'm glad you said it, Ralph. I never believed all the talk about conspiracy theorists until I started reading some of the comments right here on the forums. Votes changed via electronic voting machines? Really?
I did not come all the way across the ocean to find more of the same. Ceausescu was not worse than American politicians and if you bother to read the history of who made him into the monster he became will will find out it was America and its interest - read my hub on communism again and pay attention this time
I am surprised you do not see the corruption and the futility of even going to the polls.
Not voting should be a message to the politicians that business as usual is not acceptable anymore
It's a bit of a stretch, in my opinion, to blame Romania's and Ceaucescu's problems on the United States.
Ceauşescu visited the People's Republic of China, North Korea and North Vietnam in 1971 and was inspired by the hardline model he found there. He took great interest in the idea of total national transformation as embodied in the programs of the Korean Workers' Party and China's Cultural Revolution. Shortly after returning home, he began to emulate North Korea's system, influenced by the Juche philosophy of North Korean President Kim Il Sung. North Korean books on Juche were translated into Romanian and widely distributed in the country. On 6 July 1971, he delivered a speech before the Executive Committee of the PCR.
This quasi-Maoist speech, which came to be known as the July Theses, contained seventeen proposals. Among these were: continuous growth in the "leading role" of the Party; improvement of Party education and of mass political action; youth participation on large construction projects as part of their "patriotic work"; an intensification of political-ideological education in schools and universities, as well as in children's, youth and student organizations; and an expansion of political propaganda, orienting radio and television shows to this end, as well as publishing houses, theatres and cinemas, opera, ballet, artists' unions, promoting a "militant, revolutionary" character in artistic productions. The liberalisation of 1965 was condemned and an Index of banned books and authors was re-established....
By 1989, Ceauşescu was showing signs of complete denial of reality. While the country was going through extremely difficult times with long bread queues in front of empty food shops, he was often shown on state TV entering stores filled with food supplies, visiting large food and arts festivals, while praising the "high living standard" achieved under his rule.
As I said Ralph,
you may want to read my hub again and go past your preconsived notion of what communism is and what it is not.
Should you insteade want to choose the slice of pizza you like best, that is also an option, so be my guest
And you may want to send a contribution to Senator Russ Feingold or Carl Levin or Richard Lugar, a few of many senators who do their best to act in the public interest. They and quite a few others are not "moral prostitutes." Neither is President Obama.
As you may know Feingold has been doing his best to reform campaign finance laws. And what does he get? Big money contributions to his Teabagger opponent.
I will let the big corporation make their contributions and have thei voice heard (as per Supreme Court ruling).
Those guys are too big to fail and "we the people" are too small to matter; we are becoming more insignificante with each passing day and that is a sad reality whether we want to see it or not
I am supposing that if you don't vote, they vote themselves in anyways so you might as well vote.
hi petra- my philosopy in life has been
if you fight you might win, but if you don't you "DEFINITELY" will lose!
the process needs your vote to make a difference however slight you may consider that difference.
I made this decision about 5 years ago when the most filthy party of thieves and murderers imaginable won the elections in my country despite the general public's loathing attitude towards them.
The miracle is people still vote. Does anyone really think that the people would do and actually do anything for power will leave it to the nation to decide who gets it? If anything, this is a laughable belief.
The only problem with taking such a rational stand is this: What if all the rational people took that stand? The irrational people would still vote, and thus only the irrational people's votes would be counted. The process is the process.
The best hope I can think of is eliminating the entire lobbying industry. Get business influence OUT of politics. That way the elected officials will have no one else to listen to but the people who elected them.
Not sure if I should put a smilie/laughing face or a crying face after that remark!
Real estate prices are pretty high in Utopia. I can't afford it.
I completely agree. Not voting isn't going to solve anything. If you guys are right and the government is actually changing votes, why in the world would a large group of people not voting make them say "Oh, look! Some people aren't voting anymore. Even though it was arbitrary and meant absolutely nothing to our cause anyhow, maybe we should give them a fair election or political system now."
It makes no sense. You're never going to stop the majority of people who do vote now from voting, and not voting isn't going to stop anyone from being elected (whether it's happening fairly or, as you guys believe, one is already chosen).
To fix the corruption and problems that everyone is naming, logical rational steps that will PRODUCE RESULTS need to be taken. I'm no polysci major and I can't claim to know what those steps are (though I liked MightyMom's suggestion), but even I know that not voting isn't going to change anything.
To Vote or Not to Vote that is the Question ?
One argument I heard was;
"If voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it!"
The other; "We get the politicians we deserve !"
In analysis both maybe true, however if you DO NOT vote then you have no right to comment or bitch about anything that those in power do or do not do.
As for getting the politicians we deserve, now that is true. Do you want the job ? I certainly don’t so we have to put up with the people who will stand.
There was a time honest people went into politics because they thought strongly enough and thought they could change it. Now on both sides of the pond we have the professional politician. It’s all they know, for the most part they are not ‘of the people’ they certainly have little or no real experience of real life which is fairly obvious when you hear them talking.
However, the worst part of all is the fact that democratic politics is based upon the committee system where all must be heard, no matter how irrelevant their point or argument. Then a compromise has to be reached, no matter how watered down it has to become.
“Have you ever seen a statue erected to a committee ?”
Please keep voting; because if the right people don’t vote then the wrong ones will always win !
I can appreciate and sympathize with Petra's cynicism, but it's obviously a defense mechanism and an ill-considered reaction to our problems. The very same "immoral prostitutes" will win at an even faster pace with her attitude.
Her anger and the mindless fury consuming our politics at the moment is the seed to yet more destruction of our democracy. It plays into the hands of the right wing demagogues who want that destruction so they can consolidate their power and wealth even more.
voting matters most when we vote people out. not in. always remember we have the power to kick these guys out on their cans.and thats a right we should exercise regularly. plus its not politicians that we need to change its the rules they play by. starting with their pay. i want pay cuts across the board for these rich guys who never fail to vote themselves a raise every chance they get.
Yet more petty anger!
Here's a link to a piece that illustrates how people are going to kick out reasonable people willing to compromise for corrupt weasels who are willing to exploit the petty anger of fools who can't see beyond their own rage to vote their own interests.
http://crooksandliars.com/karoli/rachel … d-boat-one
Thanks, but what anger?
How to talk to an angry mob . . .
the petty anger . you posted it. you can be angry and petty all day long . its cool by me
Well Aware—you aren't!
I was referring to the obvious anger in your post . . .
"voting matters most when we vote people out. not in. always remember we have the power to kick these guys out on their cans.and thats a right we should exercise regularly. plus its not politicians that we need to change its the rules they play by. starting with their pay. i want pay cuts across the board for these rich guys who never fail to vote themselves a raise every chance they get."
You're trying to jujitsu it into being my anger is as ludicrous as your resentment about pay hikes.
Well, I'm voting. So is my wife, our children, their spouses and every one I know and like - which includes people who will not be voting as I might wish.
Opting out is foolish. There is much wrong with our political system, but not voting doesn't help change it - it will only make things worse.
Sometimes voting makes things worse: George Bush
Our youngest is 36, the oldest will be 43 this year. They have been voting for quite a while.
DAMN! I thought your picture was a young feller, wearing a Jamaican hat. I just got a look at you. You're flippin' ancient! Geuss my theory about you stuffin' ballot boxes w/ the underage vote was way off base! Sincere aplologies, oh, ancient one. My yougest is 27, oldest 33. Got one in the middle. I'm not too far behind you, unless you were late in bloomin'.
Hi glad . So in our first ever correspondence .You responded to my opinion on the forum question . by attacking me personally? Calling me petty and angry? Let me have my opinions on the issue if i find overpaid elected officials to be upsetting. let me be upset about it and voice it without your badger .
You know there is a cure for the wide open pie hole.its called a knuckle sandwich. lol
and oh yea
this is a writing site .so get your crayons out , try to stay within the lines. and write something worth while
Gee Ray, I sincerely apologize if you feel that I stepped on your toes here, but as I said in the previous post, I addressed "the anger in your post."—not you "personally."
You are totally welcomed to your opinion and your upset, which I don't really care about. You happened to make my point for me right after I posted about the pitfalls of lashing out from anger—even if it's against one's own interest, So it was merely convenient to use your post as an example. I share your opinion and even your upset, but I'm not about to brush my teeth with dog s**t just because I don't like someone else's breath!
You seem sensitive and I'm sure you're aware of the difference—no pun intended—or insult, for that matter.
Any kind of prostitution is fine as long as we get extras!......lol!
Americans just need to man up and kick off another revolution. The right to do so is in the constitution after all.
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