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Are the Koch Boys a Threst to American Democracy?

  1. DTR0005 profile image85
    DTR0005posted 6 years ago

    With the recent revelation that Gov. Walker of Wisconsin may be in the back pocket of the Koch brothers of Koch Industry fame, is our democracy in danger?

    1. tony0724 profile image61
      tony0724posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Only if George Soros keeps up his shenanigans. He is equally as manipulative as you claim the Koch Brothers are.

      1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
        Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        There is positive as well as negative manipulation. Soros is a philanthropist who supports democratic values, e.g., in the former Soviet satellite countries in East Europe. The Kochs' motives are to line their own pockets.

        1. tony0724 profile image61
          tony0724posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          What about when he manipulated the British Sterling Ralph? Don't kid yourself he is as slimy as they come.

          1. dutchman1951 profile image60
            dutchman1951posted 6 years ago in reply to this

            I agree Tony, I think we are watching a boxing match right now between Soros and The Koch brothers, with a lot of US emotion caught in the middle.

            I'd like to rid us of both parties. They are rape and run guys, no heart at all.

          2. Ralph Deeds profile image69
            Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Soros is an astute investor/speculator. As far as I know nobody accused him of doing anything illegal. He gave millions to encourage democracy behind the Iron Curtain. No doubt he is a liberal.

            1. lady_love158 profile image60
              lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Its frightening to me how little the left knows!
              http://politicalvelcraft.org/2010/11/10 … d-charges/
              Soros is a convicted felon and yet you are practially raising him up to saint hood! This guy is evil through and through! In Nazi germany he turned against his own people reporting jews to the Nazis!

              1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
                Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                In 2003, former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker wrote in the foreword of Soros' book The Alchemy of Finance:

                    George Soros has made his mark as an enormously successful speculator, wise enough to largely withdraw when still way ahead of the game. The bulk of his enormous winnings is now devoted to encouraging transitional and emerging nations to become 'open societies,' open not only in the sense of freedom of commerce but—more important—tolerant of new ideas and different modes of thinking and behavior.

                The article you linked described what appears to me as an ordinary business dispute. Soros was convicted in France of "insider trading," in a proceeding that was brought 14 years after the alleged incident. This case was similar to the one for which Martha Stewart was convicted. Insider trading is the rule rather than the exception among the Wall Street banksters. How do you think Goldman, Morgan and Citibank, et al, carry out the "Lord's work?"

                1. lady_love158 profile image60
                  lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Everything you want to know about St. Soros but were afraid to ask!
                  http://www.theblaze.com/stories/the-pup … rge-soros/

                  1. DTR0005 profile image85
                    DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    You never disappoint Lady Love - here I checked out your link in good faith and find out that "Glenn Beck's" crack team of journalists supplied "the Blaze" with the down low.

                2. weholdthesetruths profile image59
                  weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  We knew you'd defend insider trading.   And the "character" of Soros.  I mean, he gives money to radical liberal causes and that will ALWAYS BUY YOUR LOYALTY.

                  1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
                    Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    My intent clearly was not to defend insider trading.

            2. weholdthesetruths profile image59
              weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              LOL, as far as you know?   Do you live behind a wall of self imposed ignorance? 

              Soros was a Nazi collaborator and ally in WWII.   By his own admission.   Something he said he had no guilt over doing, in 2004.   

              Where did Soros make his money?   By making things?   By producing things?   By inventing or perfecting things?   Nope.   Soros made his billions PURELY ON SPECULATION.   Soros wealth is 100% taken from someone else.  He did not earn a single cent of it by doing something for society, he just figured out how to take other people's money from them. 

              You , of all people, who would whine and moan that the bankers and wall street do not deserve their millions...   Praise and laud Soros, whose actions are a billion times more predatory and destructive than Wall Street ever was.    He is a political radical, and cares absolutely NOTHING about the United States, you, or anyone else.    He is nothing more than a parasite, a destroyer.   If he could make another 10 billion by destroying a country, wiping out its currency... he would in an instant.   And much of his behavior is aimed precisely to do just that.

              1. lady_love158 profile image60
                lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Yes but the left love him because his interests are aligned with theirs, the destruction of America!

                1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
                  Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  lol, this is a wonderful example of the differences between left and right. The left expose what they perceive to be manipulation by their opponents and say it's evidence of a conflict of interest and ethics violations.

                  The right point at what they perceive to be manipulation by their opponents and say it's evidence of a plot to destroy the United States, OMG WTF run for the hills!!!

                  I know a guy who makes fashionable headwear out of aluminum. You might look him up. I'm sure you'll feel better wearing one.

                  1. DTR0005 profile image85
                    DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                    It's a plot man.... they're all in on it! GD Dummycrats....loll

        2. lady_love158 profile image60
          lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Soros is evil scum who wants to destroy America and usher in a new world order! He made billions shorting the dollar and would love to see the dollar completely destroyed!

          1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
            Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Translated: Soros is a progressive or liberal who supports democratic values in the US and in other countries.

            1. DTR0005 profile image85
              DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Ralph, you really do speak Lady, don't you?

              1. lady_love158 profile image60
                lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                No Ralph doesn't speak my language so is incapable of translating.

            2. weholdthesetruths profile image59
              weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Neither liberals nor "progressives" support self government, nor freedom anywhere.

              1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
                Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                strawmen aplenty.

                I swear, talking to some people on this forum is kind of like trying to play checkers with someone who keeps moving their guys like random chess pieces and saying "king me!"

                It's funny, I guess, but in a pathetic kind of way.

                1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
                  weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  So, tell me, if you disagree with that, where do progressives support "freedom"?    And please don't make tired and stupid rhetorical blather about "freedom from want" and "freedom from need".   

                  Every "solution" liberals and progressives wish to impose is just more governmental control over other people.   More controls, more authority, more manipulation of others.   Period.

              2. lady_love158 profile image60
                lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                EXACTLY!!! Which is why I refer to them as evil!

      2. DTR0005 profile image85
        DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Tony, I agree with you about Soros being "dirty." I guess he is pretty open about what he supports and what he doesn't. The Kochs are pretty damn secretive about everything. This covertness  is what disturbs me more than anything else.

      3. bgamall profile image86
        bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        The Republicans judged that their father, cofounder of the John Birch Society, and supporter of McCarthyism, was indeed dangerous.

      4. Ralph Deeds profile image69
        Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        What shenanigans are you referring to?

    2. Harlan Colt profile image86
      Harlan Coltposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      You do know that you do not live in a democracy... right?
      Therefore, I am afraid to answer anything further at this point.

      Peace
      - Harlan

      1. bgamall profile image86
        bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        You have free speech. We have a shell of democracy but the elite lie to us. This is a neocon philosophy taught to Paul Wolfowitz by Leo Strauss at the University of Chicago. Strauss had Jewish parents but was not practicing. He was atheistic/agnostic. He did a lot of damage with his teachings. The neocons are atheists who use religion for their own ends.

        1. bgamall profile image86
          bgamallposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          There appears to be a split between the Birchers and the Neocons manifested by the split between Palin and Rove.

          I would like to get inside the heads of those two to understand why.

    3. Torch Harrison profile image88
      Torch Harrisonposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      What democracy?  Why didn't you know our elections are bought and paid for the majority of the time?  Didn't you know our country was run by the FEDERAL RESERVE, with the boys in Washington acting as puppets?  Didn't you know the banks have OWNED this country for a few decades now?  And that anything you and I might have to say about it will be ignored because we DON'T have money?  And didn't you know that Democrats as well as Republicans ascribe to all of this, being errand boys and stand-ins for the real powers behind them?

      My goodness, what idealism!

      Meanwhile, we are building an embassy with a MOAT in London at a cost of $1 BILLION dollars and building a new biological weapon/research facility in Manhattan, Kansas to the tune of $430 MILLON thanks to Jesse Ventura's exposure of Plum Island!  And all this while in Washington they claim to be 'cutting'.  Yeah.  Right.

      There was a man on the radio in the 1980's named Mark Scott, who warned us all that if we citizens didn't get involved and didn't watch what was going on in Washington, sooner or later we'd have to have a revolution to get our freedoms back. 

      That day is here.

    4. weholdthesetruths profile image59
      weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Not from them.   We're in far more danger from the occupant of the White House.

    5. uncorrectedvision profile image61
      uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Really, you find it disturbing that a Governor takes a phone call from a billionaire(ostensibly,) but are undisturbed that Warren Buffet is hand in glove with Shining Handsome Obama.  The opportunity that a billionaire can offer a state's economy requires that a good and responsible governor, especially one of a state where the employees would rather sink the economy than reform, take the call.

    6. rebekahELLE profile image91
      rebekahELLEposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      did you see this article? http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010 … fact_mayer

      it's worth a read.

      1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
        Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Yes. It's an excellent article. It even said a few kind things about the Koch boys.

  2. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    Koch brothers are small time potatoes compared the big-time players of democracy all gone under the big-top.
    Got to love Charlie Chaplin. To bad he was forced, if I remember right, to leave the country.

    1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Who are the "big time players?" The Kochs are about as big as they get so far as I know.

      1. knolyourself profile image61
        knolyourselfposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        "Who are the "big time players?". You do know
        that America is biggest empire in history. It is also the first empire in history where its citizens do not know they live in the seat of
        empire. So who runs the empire and are the biggest beneficiary of it?

        1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
          Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I'll bite. Who? The Wall Street banksters and corporate CEOs who have awarded themselves ever bigger pay and retirement packages?

  3. Flightkeeper profile image77
    Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago

    The Koch brothers are definitely small potatoes compared to Georgie Soros but then since he's backing the looney lefties they weren't complaining and I guess that's all right by them. lol  The loonies as always are a bunch of hypocrites.

    1. DTR0005 profile image85
      DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Well maybe - of course the Koch boys have a combined worth, according to Forbes, of around $50 billions. Soros, by comparison, is a pauper - only about $14 billion.

      And I have mentioned this before in the forums and no one has really responded to it. Soros, and I don't defend him, is an internationalist. He made his money in foreign currency trading yet he supports financial reform. What benefit does he stand to gain? This would appear to be antithetical to his own business interests.. unless of course he is just an idealist... I really don't know.

      That being said, it is pretty clear why the Koch boys are "buying" legislation. Everyone they are "against" makes perfect sense considering how they make their livings.

      1. Flightkeeper profile image77
        Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        If they are buying legislation then the Dummycrats have been bought ten times over, don't forget they get more money from the unions, the corporations, and George Soros.  They have their own agenda and focusing on the Koch brothers just makes it obvious that the lefties don't like having the same tactics being used against them.

        1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
          Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          "don't forget they get more money from the unions, the corporations, and George Soros."

          Yeah, keep making stuff up. Someone once said "If you tell the same lie often enough, sooner or later, people might start to believe you." I can't remember who that was just now....

          1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
            weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Look, don't act stupid.   The unions, Soros, and the big money corporate donors to the Democrats have bought them all kinds of things.   

            You know and I know that even as far as the GOP goes, it gets less big money donors than the Democrats do.   Don't even try to argue it.  Don't be stupid, be honest, I can't be fooled by your rhetoric.

            1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
              Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              "You know and I know that even as far as the GOP goes, it gets less big money donors than the Democrats do. Don't even try to argue it."

              There'd be no point in arguing. "Never try to rassle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig likes it."

              If you think the dems get more big money from unions than the GOP gets from industry and individual millionaires and billionaires, you're not operating in anything close to objective reality. The willful self-deception is astonishing.

              So you go ahead and keep carrying water for the Koch bros and the Walton family if it makes you happy.

              You're welcome to your own opinion, but you don't get to substitute your own facts.

              1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
                Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                You're wasting your time with this guy!

                http://www.nytimes.com/2011/0ha2/25/opi … ef=opinion

                What do you make of this from the GOP bill in Wisconsin?

                And then there’s this: “Notwithstanding ss. 13.48 (14) (am) and 16.705 (1), the department may sell any state-owned heating, cooling, and power plant or may contract with a private entity for the operation of any such plant, with or without solicitation of bids, for any amount that the department determines to be in the best interest of the state. Notwithstanding ss. 196.49 and 196.80, no approval or certification of the public service commission is necessary for a public utility to purchase, or contract for the operation of, such a plant, and any such purchase is considered to be in the public interest and to comply with the criteria for certification of a project under s. 196.49 (3) (b).”

                What’s that about? The state of Wisconsin owns a number of plants supplying heating, cooling, and electricity to state-run facilities (like the University of Wisconsin). The language in the budget bill would, in effect, let the governor privatize any or all of these facilities at whim. Not only that, he could sell them, without taking bids, to anyone he chooses. And note that any such sale would, by definition, be “considered to be in the public interest.”

                If this sounds to you like a perfect setup for cronyism and profiteering — remember those missing billions in Iraq? — you’re not alone. Indeed, there are enough suspicious minds out there that Koch Industries, owned by the billionaire brothers who are playing such a large role in Mr. Walker’s anti-union push, felt compelled to issue a denial that it’s interested in purchasing any of those power plants. Are you reassured?

              2. uncorrectedvision profile image61
                uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php?order=A

                A list of the largest dollar contributors - it isn't until #18 that a group favoring Republicans appears.

                http://www.opensecrets.org/parties/index.php

                The poor Democrats have more money than those rich rich rich rich...Republicans.

                Business money trends toward the party expected to win for no other reason than to protect themselves.

                http://www.followthemoney.org/database/ … 3b3b7d895d

                Again, Republicans are not the top recipients of Big individual donors.

                http://www.opensecrets.org/bigpicture/t … cycle=2008

                Even when combining businesses, unions, political action committees and other organizations Democrats bring in big big money.

                And it is a story not likely to be told anytime soon.

                http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/bel … cs-writers

      2. Will Apse profile image91
        Will Apseposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        I don't know why you think supporting financial regulation means someone is an idealist. Protecting the banking system from abuse is in everyones interest- especially those who make their money from it directly.

        As for the Koch Brothers- I was once researching a story on energy issues and came across a very dubious site that seemed to be offering data at variance with everyone else's. When I dug around a little, I found that the editor of the site was a renegade academic employed by Koch industries.

        It was just a pure misinformation site aimed at protecting Koch's interests in coal and transportation.

        When you have the wealth of the Kochs you can undermine the democratic process in a whole range of ways.

        1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
          Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          "Protecting the banking system from abuse is in everyones interest- especially those who make their money from it directly."

          The people who want no cops on the beat are the ones who want to rob you.

      3. uncorrectedvision profile image61
        uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Have the Koch Brothers collapsed a major European Bank?
        http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldne … -euro.html

        Our destroyed the currency value of multiple countries?
        http://english.pravda.ru/business/finan … 4-soros-0/

        The poor George Soros - the well defended billionaire saint of liberals - has ruined currencies so his short selling would garner large profits for him.  The currency in his sites now?  The Dollar.
        http://collapse.oldschooleconomics.com/ … ck-market/

        As you watch unemployment remain high, the economy drag along and inflation creep then rush into the market keep blaming everyone else. It is a direct consequence of bad fiscal policy and even worse monetary policy.  Over the last two years the acolytes of George Soros in Washington, D.C. have worked to destroy this economy and the results are showing.

        What wide ranging evil has been visited on the entire country by the despicable Koch brothers?  Political opposition to Shining Handsome Obama's agenda? Sounds like an effort to save not destroy America.

  4. PrettyPanther profile image84
    PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago

    Under our current system, elected officials of both parties are beholden to their rich donors. The system needs to be fixed.  No matter how many times we, the voters, think we're voting in someone who will do the people's bidding, we are almost always proven wrong.

    Yes, the Koch boys are a threat to democracy, but they couldn't do it without Walker, who in that phone call, made it clear who he was trying to please.

    1. Flightkeeper profile image77
      Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      And no doubt Trumka's many visits to the WH makes it clear that Shiny is very accommodating.

      lol

      1. PrettyPanther profile image84
        PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Trumka represents unions, which represent working middle class people.  Koch represents his own interests.

        If I had to choose one to have Obama's hear, I'd choose Trumka.

        1. Flightkeeper profile image77
          Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this



          lol lol So you say.

        2. Jim Hunter profile image60
          Jim Hunterposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          "Trumka represents unions, which represent working middle class people.  Koch represents his own interests."

          Lets see, about 12.4% of all employees in this Country are union.

          So he doesn't represent the GREAT majority of the "working middle class".

          In contrast Obama is supposed to represent 100% of Americans, and he is usually found supporting unions rather than us.

          1. DTR0005 profile image85
            DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Good point Jim.. by saying that unions represent 12.4% of all employees in the country are you saying they are "small potatos?" So in one breath, unions are out-of-hand, they wield too much power, but in the other you paint them as being "miniscule" - hardly representative of the "working middle class" because of their small numbers?

            My question is - which is it? Or is it simply a matter of what best supports your argument at the moment?

            1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
              weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Actually, the unions represent the interests of those that RUN THE UNIONS.  They do not represent the members, because they constantly squander the member's money, mismanage their retirement funds, and many other terrible things they do to their members.   Including not listen to them. 

              So, dispense with the "unions represent the middle class".   They represent only big money'd political influence, for the purpose of continued enrichment... of themselves.

              1. DTR0005 profile image85
                DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Mr Patriot, I never said they did. I was quoting what your boy "Jim" said up top.

      2. DTR0005 profile image85
        DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

        I'll BE! I checked that out - Fox has written quite about his visits and it seems Beck is off his meds about it as well....

        1. Flightkeeper profile image77
          Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Good digression!

          1. DTR0005 profile image85
            DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

            You opened the door, I went and checked it out - Most of the pages got "Fox" tagged to them.

            1. Flightkeeper profile image77
              Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Well did you think the loonies were going to announce that? lol lol

              1. Jeff Berndt profile image92
                Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                "Most of the pages got "Fox" tagged to them."

                "Well did you think the loonies were going to announce that?"

                Dude. Didn't you read what DTR said? The loonies did announce it.

        2. PrettyPanther profile image84
          PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I don't know about Beck because I can't stand to watch him, but yes, Fox News is all over the Trumka thing.

  5. Flightkeeper profile image77
    Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago

    I checked out that whole Koch impersonating journalist and Walker thing and by golly it all came from the lamestream and leftist media...

    lol lol lol

    1. DTR0005 profile image85
      DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Agreed.. still it was a hoot. Old "Koch" talking to the Gov like they were best buddies.. did you notice the intimacy in their conversation? Bout brought a tear to my eye - almost like the father and the prodigal son...

      1. Flightkeeper profile image77
        Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Haven't heard it myself, but you enjoyed hearing that intimacy did you?

        1. DTR0005 profile image85
          DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          You ought to listen to it - it's a 20 minute conversation. It might make you cringe - it did me.. I mean that someone could be so stupid as to run his mouth, almost non-stop, for twenty minutes about how he is going to crush the unions... the Faux Koch could hardly get a word in edgewise...

          1. PrettyPanther profile image84
            PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Yeah, the fake Koch barely opened his mouth and Walker launched into a 20-minute progress report.

            1. DTR0005 profile image85
              DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

              I could almost hear the govenor call him, "Dad..."

          2. Flightkeeper profile image77
            Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            It made you cringe but you enjoyed the intimacy did you?

            1. PrettyPanther profile image84
              PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              You're obviously hung up on it.

              1. Flightkeeper profile image77
                Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                But not as much as DT and you since you listened to all 20 minutes of it. lol

                1. PrettyPanther profile image84
                  PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  I used to listen to entire GWB press conferences and interviews, that doesn't mean I enjoyed it.  I wanted to hear it for myself, not filtered through someone else's perception.

      2. PrettyPanther profile image84
        PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        I thought it sounded like an employee giving a progress report to his boss.

    2. Ron Montgomery profile image61
      Ron Montgomeryposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      channeling Palin

    3. Jeff Berndt profile image92
      Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      The story was posted by left-leaning media, true, but Gov. Walker's words were not invented by any media. They were Governor Walker's words, spoken by Walker himself.

      Pretend that he's not in the Kochs' back pocket is you want to, but he's there.

  6. Flightkeeper profile image77
    Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago

    I wonder what would have happened if some reporter impersonated Trumka and made a phone call to Shiny? 

    Man, would that conversation be interesting.

    1. PrettyPanther profile image84
      PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      It would be interesting to find out, although I imagine it would be much more difficult for a fake Trumka to get through to the President than it was for a fake Koch to talk with Walker.

  7. Mighty Mom profile image90
    Mighty Momposted 6 years ago

    There is no parallel there. Obama is not refusing access to Republicans or Democrats. Part of the newsworthiness of Walkergate is that he was not taking any calls ... but man, "Koch" had no problem getting through.
    Oh, and I actually saw the faux Koch/Walker conversation covered on Fox News. Not to the extent of other news outlets, of course...

    1. DTR0005 profile image85
      DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Interesting update. ABC news is reporting that "American for Prosperity" is going to apparently fund a $300,000 in television advertising to support the governor in these troubling times with the unions...

  8. Hugh Williamson profile image88
    Hugh Williamsonposted 6 years ago

    I don't think any elected representative should be defended for taking the cash for influence. Unfortunately, many do -- on both sides of the aisle.


    http://s3.hubimg.com/u/4678018_f248.jpg

    1. PrettyPanther profile image84
      PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Agree.

  9. Mighty Mom profile image90
    Mighty Momposted 6 years ago

    Yes. Listening to the tape (or even reading the transcript) is like watching a train wreck. You just can't turn away, even though the subject matter is disturbing.
    Only difference is train wrecks aren't at all funny. This is hilarious!

    1. Flightkeeper profile image77
      Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Thanks MM, if you had been horrified instead of amused, I would have been concerned.  But it just seems like a lot of lefty shenanigans.

      1. DTR0005 profile image85
        DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Sort of like that scam that scam those young kids run on Acorn when they posed as a pimp and a prostitute?????

        1. Flightkeeper profile image77
          Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Now that was really good!  Walker had nothing on those ACORN people.

      2. Jeff Berndt profile image92
        Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Yeah, Walker being in the Koch bros. back pocket is all the fault of the Left. roll

        Gosh, are you even listening to yourself?

  10. Flightkeeper profile image77
    Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago

    big_smile

    http://images.politico.com/global/news/101217_obama_trumka_ap_328.jpg

    However Trumka and Shiny look pretty intimate here.

    1. PrettyPanther profile image84
      PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      You're afraid to listen to the tape, aren't you?  Might put a little chink in your perfect little compartments.  At least some conservatives on these forums are interested in deciding for themselves.

      1. Flightkeeper profile image77
        Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        So you say.

        big_smile

        1. DTR0005 profile image85
          DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Honestly, this tape is the kind of conversation I would have with my boss or my best buddy - we can choose to ignore it, blow it off, but this is pretty damming.

          1. Flightkeeper profile image77
            Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Only to people who oppose Walker, which shouldn't be a surprise.

            1. junko profile image79
              junkoposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              FK: What happened  and was said by Gov. Walker Should be opposed by anybody on the right or left who is not totally corrupt. He is disgraceful and should be recalled. He should resign. Now we know why so many conservatives met in secret and was asked not to discuss what was said. Gov. Walker seem to be real friendly and relaxed in conversation and content of the conversation with the man he thought was Koch. The right agenda and people that support it blindly is a threst to democracy.

    2. Jeff Berndt profile image92
      Jeff Berndtposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Oh, crud, they're onto the plan! Quick! Try and distract them!

  11. Flightkeeper profile image77
    Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago

    And they seem very intimate here.

    http://online.wsj.com/media/Obama_Trumka_DV_20101012173054.jpg

  12. Mighty Mom profile image90
    Mighty Momposted 6 years ago

    I think my reaction was like most people's -- mixed. I'm a bit incredulous that someone had the cojones to do that, and that he pulled it off. Kudos on punkin' the WI governor!
    I'm a bit shocked that there has been no backlash on the prankster, or that David Koch isn't suing him for impersonation.
    But the conversation itself is really quite comical. My take on Walker is he's got a slight megalomania problem. He thinks he is the modern-day Reagan.
    Other people seem not to see the humor. The police chief of Madison is upset. The former WI AG is upset. Here are some excerpts from an interview with her:

    ..."When Gov. Scott Walker discussed strategies to lay off state employees for political purposes, to coordinate supposedly “independent” political expenditures to aid legislators who support his budget repair bill, and to place agent provocateurs on the streets of Madison in order to disrupt peaceful demonstrations, he engaged in what a former attorney general of Wisconsin says could turn out to be serious ethics, election law and labor violations."

    “There clearly are potential ethics violations, and there are potential election law violations and there are a lot of what look to me like labor law violations.”

    “I think that the ethics violations are something the (state) Government Accountability Board should look into because they are considerable."
    Lautenschlager, is a former legislator who has known Walker for many years. She reviewed the tape of the phone call and the transcript at the request of The Capital Times. She noted a pattern of instances where the governor seemed to put his personal political agenda ahead of his duties as the state’s chief executive.

    Lautenschlager noted, in particular, the governor’s reference to displaying a photo of former President Ronald Reagan at the dinner where he explained plans for his budget repair bill — which seeks to strip state, county and municipal employees of their collective bargaining rights, restructure state government in a manner that dramatically extends the power of the governor, undermine the BadgerCare and SeniorCare programs, and sell off publicly owned power plants to private firms like Koch Industries.

    “He essentially parallels what he’s going to do to organized labor with what Ronald Reagan did to the air traffic controllers,” said Lautenschlager, referencing the former president’s firing of striking controllers in 1981. “By doing that at this time, when the contracts for state employees are still in effect, it looks as if he’s signaling a willingness to commit an unfair labor practice violation by refusing to negotiate.

    Lautenschlager noted a body of labor law that prevents employers from using threats of layoffs as a negotiating tactic with unionized workers.

    Regarding another part of the conversation, where the caller  promises to bring the governor to California as a reward when and if the budget repair bill passes, the former attorney general noted the tenor of the conversation.

    “Scott: Once you crush these bastards I’ll fly you out to Cali and really show you a good time,” says the caller identified as David Koch.

    Walker replies: “All right, that would be outstanding.”

    “When an elected official in Wisconsin is offered a trip somewhere to have a good time, and he responds by saying ‘that would be outstanding,' ” said Lautenchlager, “it certainly sounds like something ethics investigators should look into.”

    John Nichols is the associate editor of The Capital Times.

    1. PrettyPanther profile image84
      PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Aw, you ruined it.  I'm sure FK would have preferred you left it at "hilarious."

      big_smile

      1. Flightkeeper profile image77
        Flightkeeperposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Anyone can backtrack if they want.  Shiny does it all the time.

  13. lovemychris profile image81
    lovemychrisposted 6 years ago

    It's pretty simple. you're either "one of them", or you're not.
    If you're not--you don't matter a hill of beans.

    Joe Scarborough is "one of them".
    Fox news OBVIOUSLY, one of them!

    Who knows how many more out there? And my precious Michigan has a Repub gv, and he's "one of them" too!!

    And--that Supreme Court is them too....the righty's on it.

    Nasty nasty things if you aKs me. (right Russshhhhhh, *wink* *wink*)

    Did you hear, he said if you look like Michelle, you should be from Ethiopia????
    Man--that guy is going nuts with all the attention Beckles the Clown gets! lol...he has to be even more idiotic and racist than usual.
    Look at ME look at ME!!!

    Walker can stuff a sock down his bought and paid for pants...maybe he will resemble a real man then, but I doubt it.

  14. lovemychris profile image81
    lovemychrisposted 6 years ago

    Well, we all know what "they" want destroyed....

    Ordinary working Americans.

    Did you hear that Repub joke that "we should use real bullets" on the protestors?

    Talk about having it all ways....they scream that they have the right to bring guns to Obama rallies, then they laugh that they can shoot protestors who are against them.

    Rotten F's is what I call them.

    But I'm not nice like Obama.

  15. AnnCee profile image77
    AnnCeeposted 6 years ago

    Ha!  Take a look at George Soros'  FIVE pages of political contributions.

    http://www.opensecrets.org/indivs/searc … amp;page=1



    And that's just his personal contributions!



    Soros is Chairman of the Soros Fund Management and the Open Society Institute and a former member of the Board of Directors of the Council on Foreign Relations.



    In the United States, he is known for donating large sums of money in an effort to defeat President George W. Bush's bid for re-election in 2004.  During the 2003-2004 election cycle Soros gave $23,581,000 to various 527 groups dedicated to defeating President Bush.

    In 2010, he donated $1 million in support of Proposition 19, which would have legalized marijuana in the state of California.

    He was an initial donor to the Center for American Progress, and he continues to support the organization through the Open Society Foundations.

    The Open Society Institute has active programs in more than 60 countries around the world with total expenditures currently averaging approximately $600 million a year.


    Soros gave $3 million to the Center for American Progress, $2.5 million to MoveOn.org, and $20 million to America Coming Together. These groups worked to support Democrats in the 2004 election.

    {Thanks Wikipedia}


    Poor old Charles Koch is a piker compared to megalomaniac Jewish Nazi sympathizer, Soros.



    Koch's political contributions?   Two measly pages and he even gave Barack Obama two hundred bucks.  big_smile

    http://www.opensecrets.org/indivs/searc … mit=Submit

    1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      How do you get the mud off yourself?

      1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
        weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        LOL, you can't figure out how?   LOLOLOL!!!!!

        Too bad, you've soiled yourself totally a long time ago.   No need to try to pretend otherwise.

      2. AnnCee profile image77
        AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this
      3. Ralph Deeds profile image69
        Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        I think the mud I was referring to somebody, perhaps, LOL, calling Soros a Nazi scum or words to that effect. But you're little energizer bunny Tea Party propagandist as well.

        What do you find sinister or objectionable in Soros' political contributions which have no connection with personal gain for himself while at the same time finding the Koch activities designed to benefit themselves benevolent?

        1. PrettyPanther profile image84
          PrettyPantherposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I was just going to ask her to connect the dots and show how Soros' contributions have directly resulted in benefits to his pocketbook via legislation served up on a platter by a politician he has backed financially.

        2. uncorrectedvision profile image61
          uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          You are right it isn't Soros who is a Nazi after all liberals can't be Nazis.  It is the Koch brothers whose family over saw the confiscated property of Hungarian Jews.  After all, being a conservative is tantamount to being Adolf Hitler.

          1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
            Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Very true.

        3. weholdthesetruths profile image59
          weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Of course i object to Soros and his agenda.   Soros does not seek a better world, SOROS SEEKS POWER.   And his wealth, he does not employ to help others, he employs it to empower the ideology he envisions will give him the most power. 

          Soros does not seek self government, limited and free people, no Soros seeks socialism, where the people slave for the state... and the state serves him, as the "rich and powerful".

    2. DTR0005 profile image85
      DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Uh Anncee - you might want to check your sources on the "Nazi sympathizer" charge. Soros was born in 1930. That would put him at 13 when the Nazis occupied Hungary. He worked for a "Jewish Council" as a 13 year old as a messenger boy - passing paperwork. These councils were established in occupied territories druing the War by the Germans. If you didn't get deported to a concentration camp or were hidden by sympathetic non-Jewish Hungarians, this was one way not to end of dead.

      So you call him what you want as far as what he has done in his adult, political life, but calling a 13 year-old Jewish kid in Nazi Hungary a "Nazi sympathizer" is a little over-the-top - even for Hubpages.

      1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
        weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        The source is SOROS HIMSELF.   Duhhh.  Don't you learn what people are like before you start making them out to be the savior?

        1. DTR0005 profile image85
          DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

          Uh... I never made him out to be a savior. All I ever said was to call a 13 year-old Jewish boy in Nazi Hungary a "Nazi sympathizer" was over-the-top. That's it -

          1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
            weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Why?  Why is the truth "over the top"?

            1. DTR0005 profile image85
              DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

              To be a "sympathizer" of anything, you have to believe, sympathize with an idealogy. Find some evidence that Soros or any other Jew in Nazi Europe believed they should be deported, exterminated.  You could accuse him of being a "collaborator" if you were truly mentally challenged and fail to see the "disconnect" between the mind of a 7th grader and an adult.
              While you're at it, call the Israelis and notify them that they have overlooked a war criminal.

              1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
                weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                Oh, for pity's sakes.   READ HIS OWN WORDS ON THE TOPIC, stop being an imbecile.

          2. Ralph Deeds profile image69
            Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            That's obvious to anybody commenting in good faith. Many of the neocons were Trotskyites in the thirties and forties before they evolved into Democrats and now GOP warmongers. Whatever Soros did or didn't do when he was a child is irrelevant today to anyone but a scurrilous right wing propagandist.

    3. DTR0005 profile image85
      DTR0005posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      If you want to talk to another "Nazi sympathizer" from Hungary, let me know - I will give you his name and email address. He's a friend of mine and he's Soros' age and a Jew. Maybe he can set the record straight for you on what it was like to do sh1t in order to live...

  16. Ralph Deeds profile image69
    Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago

    Re “Make Everybody Hurt,” by David Brooks (column, Feb. 22):

    When Anatole France wrote that “the law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets and to steal bread,” he addressed his own age’s version of Mr. Brooks’s cant idea that everyone must now share the pain.

    The Republican cuts proposed for federal and state budgets will make little difference to the lives of Americans in the upper-income brackets, but they will harshly affect the health, education and security of everyone who is not: a stealth version of the principle of the flat tax by advocates unwilling to call it that.

    Berel Lang
    Bronx, Feb. 22, 2011

    1. weholdthesetruths profile image59
      weholdthesetruthsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      LOL, what a way to try to re-write reality.   It has always been that economic downturn hurts the poor more than rich.   That taxes hurt the poor more than rich, that economic opportunity evaporates for the poor first, that the poor have the least resiliency to economic variability. 

      The rich can always hide their wealth from the taxman... who is directed by...  Rich liberal members of Congress.   You know, like Ted Kennedy, who always made sure to leave loopholes so HE didn't pay taxes in any signficant amount.   

      And then, after the liberals have spent us into the ground, currently confiscating 2.4 trillion dollars / year, taking it from those who earn, to give to those who didn't, after having destroyed our credit market with Fannie and Freddie, after having chased all the jobs away with insane taxation and regulation and mandates, after having scared every businessman and entrepreneur into self preservation mode by wild, reckless attacks on business and enterprise and by extremely dangerous regulation and spending and by threatening business with "comply or we kill you" type of messages...   

      They then whine that when there's no longer "other people's money" to redistribute, "the poor will get hurt". 

      Well, you have sown the fields we now reap.  It is your insane ideology that has brought about our situation.   It is your lack of respect for proper governance that has shattered our dollar, destroyed our wealth creation, and turned the future into living hell.   SHUT UP and go away.    Let the adults fix things.   And yes, the poor will hurt.   You wanted to hurt people, you did the hurting and now you're complaining about the results. 

      The blame rests on YOU.

      1. AnnCee profile image77
        AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Well summed!

  17. AnnCee profile image77
    AnnCeeposted 6 years ago

    Oh and George http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/14961298/1/14961298-angel-emoticon.jpgSoros is a hypocrite also, like so many liberals.

    1. junko profile image79
      junkoposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      I thought this thread was about the Koch boys  and democracy, Distraction, If the train goes off the track...

      1. AnnCee profile image77
        AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Just countering our devilish donors with your angelic one.

  18. AnnCee profile image77
    AnnCeeposted 6 years ago

    As far as George Soros buying political influence?   Well he did pay for a product called Barack Obama but it turned out it was just an empty wrapper.  sad



    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/11/1 … 85022.html

  19. profile image70
    logic,commonsenseposted 6 years ago

    Here's the deal.  Check out how much of the stimulus money ended up in the pockets of state and local government employees and who benefits from the dues that are given to political candidates and you will see that what the Koch brothers have donated, pales by comparison.

    1. AnnCee profile image77
      AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Good point, Logic.

      [b]

      Translated: money to the states to save unionized public employees' jobs.   Obama saved jobs all right.  Certain, specific jobs for certain, specific people.  Those people?  The ones who pay dues to unions which make heavy contributions to the Democrat party and candidates.  Convenient.

      1. junko profile image79
        junkoposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        AnnCee the translater for the right. AnnCee will also answer your phone, even if you are home.

        1. AnnCee profile image77
          AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

          I notice a lot of personal digs from the left instead of simply arguing the point they seemingly wish to dispute.  I wonder why?

          1. John Holden profile image60
            John Holdenposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            Probably because they do not have the skill to ignore the personal digs from the right, though really how anybody can remain on topic against the fusillade of trash posted by the right bewilders me!

            1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
              uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

              Honestly, do you see it as so slanted?  People are people and most people can fall into the petty rather easily regardless of what they call themselves.

              1. John Holden profile image60
                John Holdenposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                In the light of your rather sane view I can do nothing but agree with you!

                1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
                  uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

                  Thank you.

          2. junko profile image79
            junkoposted 6 years ago in reply to this

            AnnCee: I don't intent to dig you in a personal way, excuse me.  My intentions was to express an observation or opinion. My bad,  and I try to never be aggressive or disrespectful to a lady.

    2. lady_love158 profile image60
      lady_love158posted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Yes but it isn't corruption when the left does it because they are doing what's best for society and to help the las fortunate! roll

  20. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    Velieve the Birchers were domestic nationalists and the neocons are foreign
    interventionists.

    1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      That's my understanding, too.

  21. AnnCee profile image77
    AnnCeeposted 6 years ago

    Ahh. . .   all sweetness and light amongst us all.http://images.easyart.com/i/prints/rw/lg/7/2/Maxi-Posters-Winnie-the-Pooh---Friends-72852.jpg

    1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
      uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      It must be accepted that there are those one "the other side" who are not blind, foolish, stupid, hateful, ignorant or willfully obtuse.  The confidence in the truth of one's reasoned position should be enough to keep one from personal attacks.  I no longer care if anyone, including people who call themselves conservatives, agree with me.  I do however care how I comport myself and whether all of this entertains me.  I am on the forums for entertainment.

      1. AnnCee profile image77
        AnnCeeposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        Yep!   Fun forum or bye bye.  A little parry and riposte and a lotta lotta laughs.

        http://28.media.tumblr.com/SDYuNy3Skq3u25v8e2Unuid0o1_400.jpg

  22. Ralph Deeds profile image69
    Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago

    The Republicans have gone to Defcon 2 mobilizing every asset for total war against the rest of us.



    The Wisconsin scam is of a piece with the War Against the Caliphate and the Illegal Alien Crackdown.



    It is all b.s..…just like their War on Terror (RIP)


    Courtesy of
    John McCutcheon

  23. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    "It is all b.s..…just like their War on Terror".
    al-Qaeda is a CIA front.

    1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      ??? You sure come up with some off the wall stuff.

      1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
        uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

        He must be a liberal intellectual.

  24. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    Just travel in different circles than you. I study empire politics. You know the "Big Game".
    History as it happens if you know where to look. Aint gonnna live long enough to wait on the historians who only get it half right anyway.

    1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
      uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      Thanks for the laughs.  Liberal conspiracy theories are so entertaining.  Just like the "teabaggers" are idiots and neo-cons are evil and Darth Cheney is coming for your women.  All so funny.  Never ending source of entertainment.  I would bet conservatives have a longer life expectancy than liberals because you get them laughing so hard and that is so good for the soul and the heart.

  25. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    "I am on the forums for entertainment." A true visionary.

    1. uncorrectedvision profile image61
      uncorrectedvisionposted 6 years ago in reply to this

      blah blah blah blah. blah blah blah. what does visionary have to do with anything.   visionaries tend to seek ways of compelling others to live according to their vision.  visions - no thank you.

  26. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    Sorry guy, I am a bit of a punster. Meant only to see life as entertainment is visionary.
    "visionaries tend to seek ways of compelling others to live according to their vision."
    Agree with you there.

  27. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 6 years ago

    Now "That's Entertainment".

 
working