In today's world, this question will be treated with anger and hostility, accusations of xenophobia and white supremacist will come my way I'm sure. But that's not my arguement. Its simply one of, we, as a society, are so eager to please minorities and be politically correct about everything that white, heterosexual men have the least number of rights.
I welcome all views on this subject. And I guarantee it will be the liberals who are the most aggressive which does make me laugh
Your post makes no sense to me. Are heterosexual white males in a minority in the world today?
If you can tell me when white people were NOT in a global minority then I will say yes. But I think you will find that there have always been more South Asians and East Asians in the world. There are 300 million more caucasians than Africans.
To be honest I think you are talking out of your poop hole. If you really are British then it is time that you watched prime ministers questions, try and count the non-whites, last time I played that game I counted two.
I take it that you are a fully pledged member of the BNP then? You don't have to be "liberal" to dispise the fascist BNP, most "Conservatives" despise you too. Please tell me that you are in the racist BNP, because I could have some fun.
Unless of course you are merely a Daily Mail reader, in which case I simply encourage you to get out of the house more, the world outdoors isn't as scary as they try to make out.
wake up and smell the coffee, Ryankett! We are oppressed!
Why, just the other day while I was sipping on my espresso while driving my Mercedes to the dry cleaners to drop of my Armani suits (the maid was off sick), I thought to myself "I'm soooo tired of all this damn oppression!"
I bought myself a new iphone to feel better, but still...
Now that I come to think of it, I guess that you are right Greek One!
My Filipino freelance oDesk writer asked for a RAISE, she wanted $2.50 an article instead of $2 since she had "proven herself"... how am I supposed to pay for my five star 2012 holiday to Dubai and Hong Kong if the Asians want to try and exploit my vast wealth?
At this rate I will have to start using public transport with the blacks, and shopping at the cheaper supermarkets with the Polish. The world is f*cked, they need to bring back the slave trade Greek One, else I may have to trade in the Jaguar and get an Audi... how embarrassing will that be?
Far beyond that, we poor males have been required for decades to take out the trash. Clearly oppressed by women (they also get too many headaches).
Do you not have the right to get married? Do you not have the right to live wherever you wish? Do you have the right to do whatever you wish with your body? What rights have you lost?
I dunno if they're literally in the minority according to numbers or not, but I do agree they are in danger of their rights being diminished. And yes that's already happening in some cases.
Name one right that has been taken away from white male heterosexuals.
They aren't allowed to racially abuse the blacks anymore! They took away all their fun and now they have to resort to Internet slurs instead! They can still wear those silly pillow cases on their heads though I believe
The right to serve in our military without blatant legalization of immorality being shoved under their noses.
And apparently, according to Eric Holder, the right to stand up and call it like it is in cases of racism and actually have their voices heard.
But I think the worst one is the right to know they've fathered a child and to have a say in whether the mother kills it or not.
There ya go. There's 3 already.
Oh, and in response to ryankett's post above, apparently white people in general (not just white male heterosexuals) don't have the right to even respond to a question like yours, Uninvited Writer, without someone jumping in and accusing that now-evident minority of wanting to physically attack black people.
(I might change my mind about which is actually the worst....
Could be that last one is; it certainly does instigate a huge amount of conflict).
What legalization of immorality are you speaking of exactly? Is it about how the soldiers are forced to treat their prisoners? the law banning the don't ask, don't tell policy? Sorry, your statement with that is kind of vague, so i was just curious as to exactly what you meant by that before making any kind of definitive statement.
Now this is something I can agree with you a 100 percent. I don't know if you read my post in the other forum on eric holder, but i did say that I think it's another example of how America tries to be too politically correct for their own good. Here's what I said, as I don't feel like having to retype it again.
Steven said: To me this sounds really messed up. I'm a minority myself but even I'll tell you that if something like that was suspected of going on, then the police should have legal rights to investigate it. This is one of the things wrong with this country, we try to be so politically correct all the time that we sometimes forget that part of the reason behind the civil rights movement was to preach equality among the races. NOT to gain some sort of special treatment where one minority group can act outside the law to get what they want. That's not the purpose behind the civil rights movement, and anyone that says otherwise is selling something.
Therefore, I think you and might have something we can agree upon for once Brenda.
This is kind of subjective Brenda. I too feel it's wrong to kill a child before it's born, but at the same time, I do respect a woman's right to choose to have an abortion if it's in her best interest or if the birth could come at a cost of her life. Plus, I don't see how this can be portrayed as example against white males being persecuted because for one the last time I checked, only a woman can get impregnated. And, the abortion laws as far as I know aren't exclusive to one particular race. Therefore, I don't see how that falls into the discussion of this forum.
Again Brenda, it's a obvious double standard to be quite honest. I too think it's kind of idiotic for minority comedians to make fun of whites and label them under such terms as "cracker" or "honky." Plus, i think it's hypocritical for african americans to be offended by the word, "n****r", yet they adamantly refer to themselves as such during various rap songs and stand up comedy acts. My thoughts are if you don't like other races calling you that word, then you shouldn't use it to define yourself, as that's hypocritical.
However, I wouldn't say whites are the minority in this world, as Ryankett said, we are all oppressed to some degree by our own governments and various corporations. It's really a matter of perception.
Personally, I don't mind people preaching equal rights, as all races deserve equal rights. However, it shouldn't come at the cost of allowing one minority group rights to act outside of the law, as that's not what the civil rights movement was about. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't know what they're talking about.
Edit: By the way, I'm half Chinese, part hispanic and part native american, so nobody here can say I'm a white supremacist with my statements.
"The right to serve in our military without blatant legalization of immorality being shoved under their noses."
The right never to be offended does not exist.
"And apparently, according to Eric Holder, the right to stand up and call it like it is in cases of racism and actually have their voices heard."
You're going to have to expand on that one for me?
"But I think the worst one is the right to know they've fathered a child and to have a say in whether the mother kills it or not."
Well, if he's responsible about having sex (that is, they only have sex with informed competent consenting adults whom they know, love, and trust), then there's not much need for a man to worry that his partner would sneakily abort an unplanned pregnancy without even mentioning it to him.
"apparently white people in general (not just white male heterosexuals) don't have the right to even respond to a question like yours, Uninvited Writer, without someone jumping in and accusing that now-evident minority of wanting to physically attack black people."
Why is that evidence of a loss of rights? That's absurd. Anyone can respond to the question in any way they choose. And people can respond to the response in any way they choose. From your post, you seem to think that white people should be able to say whatever the heck they want to without fear of anyone else criticizing them for what they say. Well, I agree with the part that people should be able to say whatever the heck they want to. But when you say something, and people hear it, those people also have the right to comment on what they heard. Why do you want to silence people who disagree with you, Brenda?
Straight white men's rights are not being diminished. People of color, gay people, women, etc. are asserting their equal rights. There's a difference, and it's pretty big.
Why does it make some people uncomfortable when minorities assert their rights? I don't know. Anybody have any theories?
I just googled the most hetrosexual man in world and there is nothing, but when i googled the gayest man in the world Elton John popped up.
There are women who want you hetro men, but wether you can get a decent job is another matter. xoxox from a hetro woman
I love it when the wealthiest largest group in both America and Britain (excepting women) starts whining that it's oppressed somehow. IN an era where gay people can still not get married obviously heterosexuals are the victims
I don't know if I would say that white heterosexual males are a minority, but I will say that there is a certain degree of reverse racism that does exist in this country. And, it does seem kind of hypocritical sometimes on how minority comedians can openly mock white people with colorful jokes but if a white guy did the same jokes about minorities, then their career would be dead in the water. Personally, I think it's hypocritical if you ask me, but that's just me.
By the way, I'm a minority myself being half chinese, quarter hispanic and part native american, so nobody here can claim i'm a racist with my statements.
Sounds like you're 100% American mutt, Steven.
That thing with the comedians is something I have noticed too and it really annoyed me. I wrote a complaint to the BBC once after I saw Lenny Henry doing a 10 minute set taking the pee out of white people and basically (implicitly) saying how black people are so much cooler and better. I just thought, if it had been the other way around it wouldn't have just been taken off air, the comedian would probably have either been lynched or arrested or both.
You also have this thing were its ok to promote racist myths which make minorities look good (black people have rhythm and can dance better, are stronger / tougher, have some special sexual prowess etc.). Either racism is acceptable or not, you can't have it so that its only ok to be racist against white people or in favour of non-white groups.
being in the majority or minority isn't what's important.
What is important is, if you make everyone except for 'white males' or any other group a protected class, then you are discriminating against 'white males'.
Things like racial hiring quotas are discriminatory and need to end.
Racial hiring quotas are not as frequent as you seem to think
Do you think white, heterosexual males are now the oppressed minority?
Only the married ones.
I knew those three letters, B N P, would rear their ugly head at some point in this conversation. No I'm not a supporter of them, I'm actually more socialist than Karl Marx probably. My point is simply to do with rights of individuals and groups and in today's world, the straight, white men are the ones with the least rights. It just makes me laugh how the ones who support freedom are the most aggresive and arguementative. I do believe in freedom for all but as usual the ones who class themselves as politically correct and understanding are often the people who want to silence controversial opinion.
But back to my point, this was posted on here for a reaction and to get a feeling for people's opinion on the matter. Don't be so defensive and violent toward anything that contradicts your view point.
If you made your claim more geographically specific then maybe we could answer you question. I would like to point out however that on a global scale every race can be considered a minority, seeing as you need to achieve 51% to achieve a majority.
Perhaps if you were to make this conversation relevant to one geo area, such as Britain, we could have a serious discussion. Please also define the word "violent", perhaps "aggressive" is a more applicable?
So you are a non-liberal socialist, who is not a member of the BNP? What does that make you then? What the hell is a non-liberal socialist? A communist? Sounds like you are Chinese?
More socialist than Marx hey? So maybe as socialist as hitler? It sounds like your ideology is similar to that of the National Socialist Worker's Party. They were non-liberal socialists.
In political terms, less than 50% can be a majority. I didn't want to make it specific to any country as the people on this site are from all walks of life. So they can in turn speak about their countries, then we can gauge the view of everyone and not be so narrow minded towards ourselves.
OK well I don't think that white people are any more oppressed than anybody of any other race in a global context. I believe that we are all oppressed by governments and by corporations, led by people of all colours. It is the man on the street versus the elite, and generally the only barrier to entry into the elite is wealth. The rich versus the poor, and there are people of all colours in both categories. Although in the Western Hemisphere an overwhelming proportion of the "elite" are white.
Thus I believe that in the Western Hemisphere the "oppressors" are still white, if the white man is oppressed then it is oppressed by its own kind. In the Eastern Hemisphere the oppressors are largely non-white, but then so are the majority of the oppressed. Only, they are also oppressed by white people too. So the biggest oppressors in this world remain white. I fail to see oppression of white people by those of any other race, with the exception of Zimbabwe and possibly soon South Africa - both countries where white people are firmly in a minority and always have been. Only it was them who were oppressing the non-whites, so karma you may say. How is that?
Now that you have allowed a wider canvas, I will answer this in context of India.
Indeed, there are not many of them here, and they are certainly not an oppressed minority.
They were a "sizable minority" about 7 decades back, but then they were certainly not oppressed!
And you did exactly what I wanted you to do...react and I thank you for it. Because, actually its passion that caused that reaction and it's what people use to get things done. Much like the people of Libya right now and more power to them I say. A revolution for the people is never a bad thing
I repeat, what rights have you lost?
I may get some flak for this, but what is BNP? Sorry, i just never heard of it before.
British Nationalist Party, basically the far-right, they represent the views of 1.8% of the British population apparently, all of whom are white
Not all of them are white actually, sounds really stupid I know, but they do have non white supporters. And to answer other questions, white men haven't lost their rights, its simply the government treats everyone else better than them. And Ryankett is correct in that its mostly white men in charge but society itself is so eager to please other people and if a black man called a white man a honky not much would be said but if he retaliated with "F*** off, N****r" he would be in a lot of trouble. And that does happen a lot
The word "honky" is a very American word, I have never heard that used in the UK.
I do understand your point, to a small degree. There seems to have been a period of "positive discrimination" under Labour rule, where they attempted to create equality through the creation of laws which in reality caused an inequality of the white man as a result.
But Cameron's recent speech about the failure of multi-culturism went right to the core of that. Any "positive discrimination" by corporations was as a result of synthetic equality laws. I suspect that these laws will slowly be relaxed by the Conservatives. It was bad taste to do it on the day of the EDL rally though, as they should be held in equal disdain to the Islamic extremists.
Ultimately we went from a situation whereas there was inequality to the detriment of non-whites to inequality to the detriment of whites, neither of which are the ideal. Labour meant well, in the mistaken belief that it would bring "equality". You can fight fire with fire but you can't fight inequality with inequality.
Ultimately I am a socialist too, well centre-left, but I would sooner eat my own poop than vote for Milliband and that Ed Balls pleb, I am going to waste my vote on the Green Party.
At EDL rallies you very rarely see an EDL arrest, it is usually the UAF lot who get nicked. Personally I think that there are very bad eggs on both sides of that argument, I try to stay right bang in the middle. The biggest problem in my eyes were Labour policies, they allow immigration far faster than society could integrate with them, and created an environment whereas people had no choice but to employ these immigrants. Sometimes employing them over white candidates is fully justified of course, if they are the best man for the job then go for it. The need to meet targets or statistics was the problem.
Ed Milliband and Ed Balls, what a combo, just need an Eddy now for the trio to be complete because, to be fair, they are cartoon characters themselves. You've grasped my point there exactly, inequality and i knew someone would probe deep enough into this question to get to the result.
We did have a British Communist Party member running round here at one point, I voted for them. However keep your eyes peeled for some more posts that will stir up the emotions from myself.
Pleasure to read posts from an articulate individual who isn't scared to voice his opinion
The British government treats everyone else better than the white male. Come on, I am born and bred black English and I could tell you a few stories. Unfortunately, there does happen to be a wider World out there who are different both ethnically and culturally. It's all about the change to what you are comfortable and familiar with if you look at it honestly.
Oh okay. thanks for the info. as you can probably tell, im not too familiar with british politics.
This is exactly why I posted this question, I knew it would get a lot of reaction. I love controversy, it keeps the mind open and the day interesting. Its good to see passion but my view is don't surpress anyone. If you value freedom and freedom of speech you cannot silence other people even if you don't agree.
If you don't agree with someone and think they are a fool let them talk themselves into the hole, don't dig it for them because you will be seen as the aggressor and they will shine through
I am an alpha male - 'oppressed minority' it doesn't feature in my dictionary
I don't think the word honky has been used since the 70s
They've had centuries of unearned tyrannical rule.
Thanks to revolutions and rights legislation (at least in USA), the rest of us are closing in -- but not fast enough (where is our female POTUS, anyway?).
I take comfort in the idea that they are getting slow and doughy from riding on golf carts and watching everyone else do the work while they collect the cash.
But they've vastly underestimated the opposition.
So listen up, all you ladies and drag queens: Grab your stiletto heels and let's go straightie stomping! If you don't have heels, Nikes are always good to run circles around their fat, tired white-boy a$$es.
Karma's a bitch....
....and when it comes to oppression... so am I
Now there is my point exactly "straightie stomping" and they could probably say that in the street but if someone said "Lets go beat some queers" that would cause one hell of an uproar. But with that statement alone you're whole arguement loses any status except for discriminatory and hate mongering.
Tone down the RHETORIC and VITRIOL and learn to be CIVIL.
Uninvited Writer, you poor sole. Maybe we should paint you a darker colour and see if you still feel the same. The situation today is really about accommodating the rest of the World and you need to stop feeling sorry for yourself. I have learned to do so as black Englishman approaching my half-century.
Yeah, you tell 'er Cags!
Oppression hurts! In fact, my pretty little head's pounding from bumping up against that damned glass ceiling day after day !!
in the case of a white male who is physically disabled and under 65
it's hard to get housing, but then who doesn't have a hard time, and women who are pregnant do have to take care of children in the proper environment. and white males physically disabled under 65 *could* get a computer job, eh?
So I guess that wipes out that one. Sounds like laziness.
As for white people in general
we are becoming a minority in the sense that other nationalities seem to be having the most offspring. this could be your answer
that would weed anyone out over time. .
But, as men, well men I think are still powerful in the workforce, women have not dominated that yet.
as male whites.......no. not in any degree more than others.
Not that I know of, not my dept.
as for the miliatary,Not sure about that, cause....everyone is exposed everywhere -if that's a problem- so I'm not sure why...unless the gay men try to force themsleves which I doubt cause stragiht men are prob much meaner- they haze each other all the time I hear, which I think they force those acts and worse in hazing..so no. Gay men to my knowledge are more" feminine" by nature if you will, and less likely to be that way .. I think!
So my answer is, yes and no.
I got over my moment of silliness and thought the question through again. Why just males? It works for the women too. The things discussed in this thread that affect men can and do affect females.
I know of an unsettling case that happened recently, between a white, heterosexual woman, and an Asian chap. She called him out for bullying in the work place. He was bang out of order and knew it. He turned the tables the first chance he got, by way of counter accusing her of saying something racist.
She got sacked, immediately, despite her long standing relationship with the company, her trusted position and exemplary record. The company crapped its pants, thought only of the connotations involved with supporting her so they took the easy option.
Disgusting when you think on it.
You're right, TBW. You obviously don't know me or my sarcastic bent, as many others here do (thanks,Ryanket).
I apologize for injecting flippancy into your serious discussion.
My point was that maybe it's time white heterosexual males got a taste of the medicine they've been dishing out for centuries.
But Frogdropping's disturbing post is a sober reminder that there is, alas, a hierarchy of bias.Being on top is no better than being on the bottom!
A rose is a rose is a rose.
But when it comes to workplace discrimination, all screws are NOT equal
Yes, we are the one classification of humanity that it is generally accepted as ok to be racists and sexist towards.
I think heterosexual men feel oppressed generally. With feminists and gay rights people pulling our plonkers at every opportunity, the everyday straight guy appears to be the down trodden at this moment in time. However, I think this is predominantly a perception of the change from holding a dominant position to suddenly giving up market share to other genders and sexualities. The white male's sense of acute injustice is an exacerbated state of the same perception specific to those living in the Western World i.e Europe and America. Not only have they been in a dominant position gender-wise they have also been so socially and politically. Therefore, the change is even more extreme. As with all men though, none of us took a conscious decision to assume gender domination , life until recently made it that way and the animal kingdom provides general evidence of how this situation came about. Change is happening and will continue to happen but I suspect it can only go as far our natural attributes will allow. We still need to fertilise and we certainly cannot cannot give birth to children.
No... straight white men still have control of the money, and control of the money is power - real power.
Well, no. Men own, and I'm not kidding, 98% of the world's property. There are only 13 female CEOs in the Fortune 500. The president of the U.S is a man. The prime leaders of the U.K is a (white) man. In fact, the leaders of all the most powerful countries in the world are men, and usually white. The only reason white men feel oppressed is because slowly but surely minorities are gaining rights, which means the special privileges that only white men have had for decades are being shared out.
Jim, dear, I know you believe everything is a democrat vs. republican issue. Guess what! It's not!!!
At 1st glance some people will be mad however if you read what you wrote they should see your point. As a straight white male I dont really see us having a problem maybe its because I like at racisim as bs!!!
Given the resources at their command, if white, heterosexual males truly felt they were being oppressed, they would rise up in revolt. Don't quite know what the male equivalent of burning bras would be. And not at all sure I want to see that
Are white men becoming an oppressed minority?
Are groups who have been historically oppressed fed up and starting to not let straight white able-bodied christian men get away with treating them like second class citizens? Yup.
Is this phenomenon making some white people uncomfortable? Yup.
Is this phenomenon the same as "oppression?" Not even a little bit.
But white people are so utterly not oppressed. As a rule, white people get the benefit of the doubt even when there's hardly any doubt. Black people, as a rule, do not get the benefit of the doubt.
Case in point, this video The link goes to hulu, to an episode of "What Would You Do?"
It's a 12 minute video, but for the TL;DR crowd, it shows the different reactions of passersby when a white actor pretends to steal a bike, and when a similarly dressed black actor of about the same age pretends to steal a bike.
The white guy gets the benefit of the doubt; most people don't even ask him why he's trying to cut the chain, and nobody tries to stop him, even when they ask him and he admits that it's not his bike. Only one couple tried to stop the white guy from stealing the bike. The black guy, on the other hand, even though he's about the same age and dressed about the same, gets all kinds of attention; people get confrontational, take 'evidence' pics with their cellphones, call the cops.
This is known as "White Privilege," and this is why the idea that white men are becoming somehow 'oppressed' is astonishingly preposterous.
I love what this has done, this has made me realise one question, who in society is right? All I've done is post the question because people often ask this question, fair enough some of them are extremely racist, but even some highly educated and usually impartial people ask this. If you act with hostility towards this subject what does that say about you? It shows you aren't open minded, don't value a person's opinion and if you was in a position of power you would probably abuse it greatly.
However I value all opinion, whether good, bad, aggressive or peaceful. Its why I asked this in the first place, to gauge opinion. But those of you who get annoyed about this subject and often hurl abuse at the persecutors will give them power by making them appear the oppressed and silenced.
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