Why do people let religion rule their lives rather than just letting religion be a part of their lives?
the magic question....I like it
I say always question
easy, old white republicans force levitican values into our laws
... said the man who doesn't want a flag to fly on a building....
To me, religion is about bonding with my fellow man and trying to learn to be a better person; more patient, kind, and understanding. I don't even know or care about the afterlife. All I want to do is be a good person in the here and now.
Most likely because that is what they've been indoctrinated to believe, that their god is THE most important thing in their lives, even more so than their families and friends.
Rule? You're speaking of Islam? Not aware of any other religion whose main tenet is obedience.
Try this then;
"I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them.
It is written: "You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve."
Guess where that comes from
Serve? It's a choice. We are living in the dispensation of grace, not the Mosaic law. In the dispensation of grace we serve God with the help of His Holy Spirit to try to see that everyone on earth has an opportunity to hear the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It's about love and it's about faith.
It might be easier to be 'ruled'. But Christianity is all about freedom and choice. And most of all love.
Don't give me the list of Christian mistakes. No one says we are perfect. Right from the git go we were imperfect. Read the New Testament. It's a testament to the imperfection of the church. Like I said it might be easier to be ruled. But then coercion isn't part of God's plan to save mankind from sin. It's a choice. And we will never be perfect in this world.
Whereas Islam and the Qu'ran better be perfect, or else!
Those two things are being used to inspire jihad against people who believe differently right here, right now, John.
I agree. Christianity has done some very foul things in history, but there is no comparing Islam of today, to the Christianity of today.
You mean that you don't wage war with god on your side?
Who then - Satan?
I love it how, even though Republicans demand that we're a "Christian Nation", they refuse to accept that "tearing apart the governments of a sovereign land, and then bombing the people living there for 6 decades" can't be considered "Christian"...
... but then when those people get pissed off and fly planes into our buildings, then "THEY" are "Muslim".
Wait. Really? Westboro Baptist church, anything to do with Catholics and Protestants in Ireland...
These things are somehow NOT like what's going on in Islam?
Yes there was molestation by the catholic, but Christianity does not embrace the practice as islam does... read the links I provided in the other thread... that institution is embedded in Islam by the acts of mohhammud and he being the perfect example of man. Christ did not molest any young children, and no where in the New testament does it condone such an act.
And screaming idiotic viscious remarks is far from severing heads and raping small children, among many other atrocities Islam condones as a religion. Slavery is still practiced in Saudi arabia, E. Temur, and many other Islamic nations to this day.
And these are not cultural practices as some try to twist them to be. The things Muslim have done and are doing are embedded within the Laws and edicts of Islam and condoned in thier use and under-takings.
Can't you folks find anything but those lunatics at Westboro to paint a world of Christianity with?
No they cannot...
I have had them throw up the, "Lords Army", in Africa, but that is more Voodoo and African pagan religions, than Christianity.... so that fell flat on them also.
Other than the occassion loon ranting BS, they cannot point to any viscious acts... oh there is Uganda and the Anti-homosexuality laws.
I do not condone killing gays, or imprisoning them for life, it isn't right. But the do not want the Gay agenda pushed onto their children, and see not other way to fight it except to wage a fanatical war against it, as the fanatical Homosexuals do in trying to force their agenda into other countries. There is a lot of power and money attempting to advance that agenda world-wide.
I believe they are looking at the issue and seeing a more calm path to handling the issue, rather than death and life in prison.
Can't you folks find anything but those lunatics who spill drink over Beck to paint a world of the left with?
Reams and reams and tomes unfortunately, as you know.
Yes, that's the other answer I could have used - thanks, but I chose something a bit more flip.
Well for crying out, loud bring it on. But try to stay in this and perhaps the last century will you?
It's just a part of your Christian reality.
Whereas we don't bomb people for seeing things differently to us, for having different religious and political beliefs!
Come on Ann, get off your high horse, there is no difference between us and them.
Yeah, when God Almighty tells you "IT IS ONLY I THAT YOU SHALL SERVE OR ELSE YOU WILL ROT, BURN, AND BE TORTURED IN HELL!!!"
... that's a choice.
Give me a break - all these religions are the same. People just cherry pick the worst of the other religious texts to say "they" are evil, and then pick the best of their own religion to say that "we" are good.
You can choose who you want to follow. Your choice. God made us in His image. You are made to love him. May not realize it yet. Nobody is without the homing device called a soul and no one doesn't have it in him to recognize his maker. Jesus Christ went to hell carrying the sins of all mankind with him so no one else would have to go to hell.
Going by the good book again I see? Do you believe everything you read?
And islamic people can choose to ignore the parts of the koran that demand killing or following.
Humans have free will no matter their religion.
Most do Evan. But I ask you, where is condemnation by Muslim nations for violent jihad? Muslim terrorists are hidden, supported, assisted, funded, excused, applauded, celebrated in all of the Muslim countries. Money given to Muslim charities in many cases has been proven to be channeled to terror groups. Men who protested in Cairo side by side with women one day came out a few days later to beat and rape those women because they came to the same square to celebrate women's rights.
Sure most Muslims are peaceful but UNPEACEFUL things are institutionalized in their governments and their mosques.
Unlike our governments who very peacefully wage war on those we don't much like?
OK - I want to point out that you agree that all Humans have free will, and that none of us are slaves to their religion.
Thank you for agreeing there.
Now we can talk about what ACTUALLY drives a LARGE group of people to become so pissed off that they want to strap dynamite to their chest and kill innocent people.
In the case of "The US vs. Muslim nations everywhere", I would like to argue that the entire problem dates back to when the UN (read: powerful Christian Nations) decided to rip apart the Muslim countries, and then proceeded to fight against the Arab nations for 7 decades.
Here's a list of books that outline the god-awful things that have been done in the name of the US foreign policy, and how it undoubtedly led to the 9/11 attacks:
"The 9-11 Commission Report"
"Blowback", by former CIA consultant Chalmers Johnson
"Imperial Hubris", by Michael Scheuer -- a former CIA anti-terrorism expert
"Dying to Win", by suicide-terrorism expert Robert Pape.
The disgusting part is that we expect "them" to feel remorse for killing "us", but it's almost impossible to get a regular American on the street to admit that "we've" been over there bombing "their" families for 70 years.
(Sorry, both of those videos are of Ron Paul - but when I aw him b**ch smacked Giuliani with this logic, I woke up. This is when I first heard the argument)
And many religious cults...
It makes me laugh, in a wry sort of way, here am I a lefty, defending the Qu'ran and Islam when they are both much closer to conservative values than I am. I don't advocate the death penalty, I'm easy if some guys are homosexual, don't really get too beaten up by adultery.
I suppose it's just that I see far more honesty than I do in Christianity, much less mealy mouth mumbling.
I don't see that many people letting religion rule their lives. It might be better described as trying to rule other people's lives, at least that's how it comes off in my part of the world.
I believe I stated 'trying'. And yes. I have, on many occasions, had people try to rule my life through an attempt to threaten with personal views on religion. Not to mention legislation that is passed, in support of religious beliefs, which are overturned only after taxpayer funds are wasted attempting to defend them.
I have no idea what you mean by that, but let me use this moment to tell you I have always loved your avatar. Very cute.
Thank you. Yours is pretty.
I was asking you to describe the coercion you have experienced. Also the laws institutionalizing religion in government presumably?
I find it hard to believe I have to tell you this. You should certainly be aware of the tactics in attempts to convert others to Christianity; but the attempts at coercion would include people trying to convince me my immortal soul was in jeopardy for not living by the standards of their religion, as they perceive to be correct. When I am cornered and badgered; and told that the conversation is only because they love me and don’t want anything bad to happen to me, this is an attempt at coercion.
As to laws? Most recently, I would cite South Dakota and the abortion law that was put into effect after the majority voted it down. Religion is the only thing that I can see that would have motivated legislators to go against the will of the people. If I’m wrong, I would certainly like to be enlightened.
Letting religion rule you.
Religion doesn't rule me. It rules society, which I am a part of. It rules based on those in power and their beliefs, which is why- in America, Christians continue to think that America is a Christian Nation. The ignorant politicians keep using specific keywords, to keep the majority of Christians thinking it, so that the politicians can remain in office longer.
As for other religions? It is disgusting, the acts, which occur outside America.
I live my life with a purpose I created. Thus, giving meaning to my life. Life itself isn't a religion, but could be construed as one, depending on the actions of the individuals.
If us Christians were not the most accepting and tolerant of religions and people in the world, there would be no Atheits, nor gays, nor anyone else in conflict with out beliefs living in this nation freely.
And that is a fact that can be seen in the diversity of America, the acceptance of the American people to all immoralities currently flourishing in this great nation, and the tolerance of the expulsion of our God and religion from the Public arena, by the Atheistic Leant Leftists through the courts.
You can be very religious, but not really get the lessons of what the faith teaches. I've seen so many people go to church, participate in church activities, do everything of traditions, but never really grow spiritually, or learn there lessons in life.
I was asked yesterday by someone in my town that knows me what is the difference between someone like me, and someone else? I think it's easy to say all you need is God. But most people are thinking that it's an easy road and think you just have to show up in church, and participate. For me it is learning the lessons, putting them into action in my behaviors, and actions. Like she said you're not sugar coating it. It doesn't mean your life is a smooth ride. It takes a lot of work, discipline, and takes a long period of time. I would say that it has been a life journey, and you have to have the will power to believe there is something more than what you are seeing the present moment. There is a drive to strive to seek the truth out about yourself, god, and the universe. Most people are not willing discipline themselves, or do the work that applies in living it. Instead they act the part, slap a label on them, and wear a christian t-shirt or what ever and say "I am this Religion". Doesn't matter what religion you are, if you aren't getting the message and living it, it is just an empty label!
Totally gob-smacked! Did you write that with a straight face?
Or was it your evil twin sounding off about the evils of Islam and how they should have no right to display symbols of their religion?
That has nothing to do with religious symbolism.
And that Seperation issue you hate so much, was the America Lef, and Atheists, John,they are the ones who pushed for, sued for, and finally obtained that objective. So take it up with them. They are your ilk, not mine.
Go have a read... then google all the cases fought to get that policy instituted through the Courts... they were all Leftist groups and Atheists.
That is a fact.
I much prefer to be able to excersise my religion, or anyone else theirs, any where in public and on public land. Which is the way it used to be... up untill the Liberal/Progressive era.
So for the last time. It was not the Right wing or Independents who did that... that was all the Leant Left john. Your people.
Why don't you ask one of your leftist buddies on here why they did that... see what they say.
Your original complaint was about the flying of a Muslim flag.
You only got on to the illegality of it after a page of responses when Cags brought up the illegality aspect. Until then you were fixated on it being a Muslim flag with no mention of illegality.
My original compliant was that the Black flag of islam does not beloing above the grave of US soldiers and no religious symbols are to be displayed, John.
And yes I do have an issue with the Black Flag of Islam flying over our soldiers graves. But the fact is they were told to take the Christian one down because they had violated the law... and then they want to fly an islamic war flag.
Souldn't be allowed.
They should have never flown the Christian one either... only the American Flag should be on that pole. Put lil ones on the graves for faith.
Your original complaint made no mention of which flag was to be raised;
"While more and more Muslims in America are not hiding their pro-Sharia agenda, non-Muslims here are also aiding them in their attempted Islamic take over of the country. Here is another example of dhimmi aid, and a highly disrespectful one at that!"
and the rest of the post was a copy and paste which made no mention of which Muslim flag either.
The black flag has only been in existence since 2001.
That was copy and paste... that is part of the article john...
Yes, which made no mention of which Muslim flag.
There are only two of them, the White one flies only within the Dar Al'Islam, the black flies in the Dar Al'Harb... fairly simple as to which one they want to fly...
And you do know the literal translation of Islam i,s "Submission"... don't you?
The crescent and stars makes three, though that, unlike the two you mention is not a flag of the extremists.
The crescent and stars were not used by Mohhamud John. The Black flag was and as such represents Islam along with the White flag which mohhamud used after the lands and people were subdued. The crescent and stars is more representative of the older pre-islamic nations in the middle-east and Asia minor, Israel, Moabite, etc... andalso was a representation of certain moon gods whic sort of sit well since mohhmudan worship hubal anmd not the one true living God. Today is more a representation of the Ottoman Turks.
Sorry, try again.
The black flag did not exist before c2001.
And since when did the Taliban represent all Islam?
"The Black Flag of Jihad is more than just a declaration of Muslim faith. It is Mohammed’s battle flag. And has been revived for the war against the west. Just cause you didn't know of it, doesn't mean it didn't exist.
The Army Of Black Flags
The Mahdi’s ascendancy to power is said to be preceded by an army from the east who will be carrying black flags or banners of war. Sheikh Kabbani states:
Hadith indicate that black flags coming from the area of Khorasan will signify the appearance of the Mahdi is nigh. Khorasan is in todays Iran, and some scholars have said that this hadith means when the black flags appear from Central Asia, i.e. in the direction of Khorasan, then the appearance of the Mahdi is imminent.
Another tradition states that:
The Messenger of Allah said: The black banners will come from the East and their hearts will be as firm as iron. Whoever hears of them should join them and give allegiance, even if it means crawling across snow.
In Islam there are two flags. One is white and one is black. Written across both flags in Arabic are the words, “There is no God but Allah and Muhammad is his Messenger”. The white flag is called Al-Liwaa and serves as the sign for the leader of the Muslim army and is the flag of the Islamic State. The black flag is called Ar-Raya and is used by the Muslim army. It is also called the flag of jihad, and is carried into battle. One flag is governmental and the other is a military flag. When Muhammad returned to his home city of Mecca after being exiled for eight years, he returned as a conqueror. With him were ten thousand Muslim soldiers. They carried with them black flags. On the flags was one word written in Arabic: punishment.
I was once talking to a group of young Muslim men and asking them some questions. I asked them if the obvious superior militaries of America and Israel compared to the militaries of any Islamic nations were a source of difficulty for many Muslims. One of these men then became very angry at my question and snapped out, “You Americans and Zionists better get ready, because the black flags are coming!” At the time, I had no idea what he was talking about. Later I learned the meaning."
http://answering-islam.org/Authors/JR/F … _mahdi.htm
Go read an learn.
The traditions of the Hadith and Sunnah speak plainly of this flag and its intent and mohhamuds use of it.
So try again... denial will not work John. Islam is not the peaceful loving religion you have been led to believe it is.
"The black flag is called Ar-Raya and is used by the Muslim army. It is also called the flag of jihad, and is carried into battle. One flag is governmental and the other is a military flag. When Muhammad returned to his home city of Mecca after being exiled for eight years, he returned as a conqueror. With him were ten thousand Muslim soldiers. They carried with them black flags. On the flags was one word written in Arabic: punishment."
The Al-Uqab is known generally today as the flag of the Spainish Al'Mohad, and was derived from the solid color flags with no inscrptions across them which were flown to identify units within Mohhamud's Army. Not Mohhamud's own battle Flag, that would be the Ar'Raya.
Not worth it, according to you we'll all be murdered by Islam before the matter is resolved.
There you go with your extremism again. You cannot stick to the middle and the reality of things can you... tsk tsk...
I hardly think you are in any position to accuse me of extremism and lecture me on sticking to the middle and the reality of things.
It isn't me whipping myself into a froth because a few Muslims are radical. Does it never occur to you that the vast majority of Muslims that we come into contact with have more or less the seem motivations as us, the same desires and needs?
I hardly think that you can count my desire to have no further part of your extreme hatred a deflection, can you?
Actually, the literal translation of Islam is Peace or submission to God.
I wouldn't have thought you would have a problem with submitting to god!
Kan U show me the Kristian Flag Pleeze?
ALL men have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God.
Looks pretty straight to the point there.
Good heavens! I just noticed Tom and John also bear a striking resemblance to each other. The eyes, the facial expression. It's uncanny. . .
So interesting to see you going at each other all the while looking so benign.
As is radical Christianity or radical anything come to that.
But not all Islam is radical.
NO E. The one thing that is clear, is that Islam is radical. Those are the true Muslims who are carrying out Mohhamud's and allah's commands as a good observant Muslim should.
You have no clue what the vast Majority of Muslims are thinking, or what there desires are. Wander the Middle east and listen to the streets. The death of the West is a prime conversation and a very dear objective. Go to Malaysia, Indonesia, E Temur, Arabia... go to any of the Islamic nations and spend real time with the Muslim people, and let them know you are trustworthy to their religion, and see what they teach you about Islam and it's purpose.
You would be surprised what the majority are thinking and desiring as regards the West.
But I don't live in the middle east, do you really believe they are all going to come to the UK and the US just to overthrow us?
I understand you've lost the Russians and need a replacement bogey man, but really. . .
I have no need of boogey men. I have my Government.
And yes Islam has used immigration and has been very patient many times in history to accomplish the over-throw of many a nation. America is so big that this is a great challenge, thus the teaming up with the Anti-American Leftists and American haters who have also immigrated here, but England... well...
And somtimes john,.. the boogey men are real.
How does it go, they hate you not for what you are but for what you do.
Islam hates you for being a non-believer "Kufr", Polytheist, pagan, Gay, an adulterer, and many, many, other things you would call your Right to be.
So... take it up with Islam.
pointing out the facts of Islam does not make me a hater. Too bad.
And claiming that your hatred is facts doesn't mean you don't hate.
Pointing out facts is not hate John. Too bad. Your anti american Islamic apologist routine is very predictable for a Leant Leftist.
Good morning, man. Hope you have had good day.
But you don't point out facts, you point out prejudices!
For a start, I'm not anti American and neither am I an apologist.
If I was anti American, I wouldn't be here.
Fine today, early start doing housework and waiting for a courier, bank later and . . .
Wow what responses. It truly went as I expected. There was not 1 post that said they just let religion be a pert os there lives. These threads all show that people let religion rule them. I have no stake in this for I do not believe in God. Based on the anseres here and in another thread, I am so glad I feel this way. What hatred you all spew in the name of religion. A few of you truly twist your views and make false statement to try and prove a point. If you belive your point is a good one, then stop giving false statements and try to be civil. I hear better insults on the local playground than what you all come up with. So childish
I'm not at all religious American View, I just believe in live and let live.
Welcome to the religious threads!
My bad! I assumed this was the religious forum.
What excactly is the legal standing under American Law regarding flag flying?
Seems straightforward enough,whotever that is(?)
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