I've been reading about Occupy Wall Street and I saw on the news where there was a sister group marchng in Washington. I thought about going there tomorrow, to show solidarity. I didn't really expect this movement to effect a change; yet it is a wonderful thought.
But I went online to the website Occupy Together. These things are trying to sprout up all over the world. If the people of the world work together, I wonder if we have a chance against the big banks and corporations that are ruining us all. I am going to a meeting tomorrow. There are only a few people signed up in the area so far, but I'm going to see if I can get a better feel for what's going on.
If anyone is interested in learning about the movement; this website shows groups that are already organizing and gives you the information and help to start one of your own in your own community.
I may be crazy, but they've really piqued my interest. Does anyone think this movement will really get anywhere?
I hope it does! I've had it with the NY Banksters.
And what's the alternative to banks ralph? Are u referring to the corruption of bankers or the concept of banning banks for some alternative?
The option is local banks and credit unions.
Exactly. Local money loaned for local needs. The strongest bank in our area was the one that kept to the traditional ways and didn't buy into the easy lucrative credit schemes that had high interest rates to match. You still got loans, but sensible ones.
Yes, GNelson. But first stop new government socialists and take away control.
It is very interesting that we get in bank let say 1.5% interest. It is gov. regulation. Why we give our tax money to China 40 plus interest %? Why Mr. O. don't borrow money from our citizens for 40%? Do I make the sense?
WOW! Do you guys realize that you just SLAMMED Ralph Deeds ideology! What political party created Freddy MAC & Fannie Mae? DEMS! WHY? So people could qualify more easily for a mortgage. It was feel-good fluff. Medicare & Medicaid , more DEM feel good fluff. All the socialist DEMS hv done over the last 45 years is create environments for corruption and DEBT. The DEMS need to stop mirco managing the economy.
We also need to address the labor cost-advantage of China.
"We also need to address the labor cost-advantage of China."
We need to fight the urge of our companies to bring slave labor back to the United States. We need to address the desire of our companies to destroy unions. We need to address the tactic of our companies holding on to their surplus money they got from us and not hiring any of us to work in their companies. We really need to address the real reasons companies don't want any kind of regulations on the way they do business in this Country.(consider how some energy company wants to destroy the entire northeast with hydro-fracking) Regulations on companies protect our very lives.
http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20 … rs-111009/
I for one; do not want to address the labor cost-advantage of China!
Isn't it funny how they have no idea what they are protesting? I heard an occupy protester the other day on a call in show and when asked what they were trying to accomplish he just screamed it didn't matter the talk show host would lie about it. The host tried to explain that he was on a LIVE call in show and could have his say LIVE the protester just continued on his rant about the host will do nothing but lie. Its sad when people just follow others for the sake of following.
China has the third world advantage of working kids and debt slaves for next to nothing. The republican owners profit from their labor. Is that socialism or communism? Or just plain Greed?
I wonder how many people protesting still have bank accounts with the very institutions they're protesting against. Credit Unions have a good foothold in the USA. Protestors should act with their feet, and move their accounts. Nothing will change until banks and corporations start feeling the pain too.
Yes, a good idea, rather like a mass boycott and will hit them where it hurts them most.
I moved about $10,000 (my last remaining IRA deposits) to the local credit union last month and they practically threw me a party. (I had already moved about $14,000.)
I wonder how many protesting live in their parents basements. Move the money? That makes good sense, do they have any money to move? Are they vested in capitalism or is it just incessant whining? I'm going with they live in their parents basement and have no money and looking for a job would interfere with playing Wii. Life is tough.
Why ask the question, when you have already decided on the outcome?
Btw, not suggesting for one moment that you were unwilling to open your mind and think beyond your existing horizons.
TRANSLATION- If you don't agree with me you're wrong. Maybe you should open your mind, that never occurred to you did it?
Maybe you should open yours, and consider for one moment, that not all protesters are living in their parents basements, looking for a job and playing on the wii. Still, if I were you, I'd be hoping for an response from someone like me too.
You're probably right, I'm sure some of them live in the main part of the house. Now quit protesting and get a job or two.
I have several. But hey, why bother finding out who they really are, when you have all the answers. Mr conformist, conformist
That's the tighty-righty way of looking at their fellow Americans. They are nothing but gargage to them. And it is disgusting.
SOOOO superior and nastily condescending. "Pass the Grey Pupon."
Say--I wonder how many of the protesters lost their job due to greedy business people who NOW want tax breaks to bring jobs back?
Hmmmm, let's see...they got tax breaks to leave, now they want tax breaks to return! Can you say WAAAAAAAA
They ruin lives and think nothing of it *cough* Romney *cough*, then demonize those they ruined!
The contract was broken by greedy thugs. Let's put THEM in a basement for a while.
"help! help!...but, I'm hungry!"....."What? Can't hear you, the tv's too loud watching Beck the Idiot Savant." what is the word for too dumb for words???
Loosely translated does that mean I can't argue with that?
Translation is I don't care to have conversations with hysterical people.
Sorry, I apologise, for both myself and LMC, could you point out as a courtesy where the hysteria is, so that we can rectify our hysterical behavior in the future?
Sigmund Freud always said women were "hysterical" too. Just cause they didn't find him attractive...sheeeeesh.
See--he said they were hysterical cause they were sexually supressed, but really, it was from looking at that mug!
"99 Percent Party Says GET MONEY OUT OF POLITICS
Why...sputter,sputter.....HOW DARE THEY!
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/10/10 … -politics/
Life is tough. I've worked since I was 14. I work now. I own a home. I'm doing ok, in this system. But it isn't fair. Not to everyone. I support this movement. I'm confused why someone wouldn't.
So, you support the idea of government for the corporations, by the corporations and of the corporations?
Why isn't it fair to everyone? Is it fair that one man works hard and then has to give 50% of his earnings to someone who doesn't? The system is fair one just has to WORK for it to work.
That is not true. Corporations take jobs from Americans and send them overseas. Why? Because it is cheaper. Why is it cheaper? Because they can pay less, offer no benefits and run a sweat shop if they choose. Yes, in some ways it does lift that local population up; but not as much as they should. Because to do the right thing there would decrease profits.
If corporations want to do that, if we can't stop it; it should be heavily penalized. For every decency denied a worker; because it increases profits; for evey job lost here that results in less benefits for the worker in the country the job is moved to; there should be penalties that offset those gains. Profit should not be allowed to be a motivating factor in mistreating people.
Why should we give Wall Street perks denied our local businesses? Did anyone offer you a bailout? Why should someone be allowed to offer stocks for trade without our investment being protected with an insistence that these corporations conduct their business with the same values we would use to run our own? Do you make a hefty salary, when your business is tanking? Would you cheat your investors?
It boggles my mind that people fear this frustration with multi national companies. It is as if they think people are anti business. I'm not. I'm anti thugs.
Not only that---they take money from the federal gvt all the time!!!
They are welfare Queens to the max!
Get bail-outs, then do what? Give millions in bonuses.
AIG owes 61 billion to Uncle Sam.....but some college kid is the problem eh?
Get a job, says Cainiac......where? At HIS place, for 7 bucks an hour....Ooooooooh, what a guy.
Blame the president he says. OK--let's get this right:
Coddled corporations and GOP rule for most of the past 50 years: Not to blame.
Obama takes office in 2009: Blame him.
What a goob! Koch-S*cker. Go back to your pizza shop and fight to end the minimum wage, you anti-working-man fool.
That's what I don't get. Is the average person blind? How can they ignore the inequities?
Once again, business does not exist to employ people. This really can't be that hard to understand. Business is not here to employ YOU or anybody else, it exists to make money!! Both Bush and Obama were wrong for bailing out companies that should have failed, but that isn't the fault of business that is the fault of politicians.
I bet you would too, you would gladly take it and run. A business took money to not fail...shocking. But you blame the one taking and not the one giving, you are very confused.
As it was tax payers money, you are the one who is confused for not being angry at them both.
Yes taxpayers, I am angry at government I am not angry at those companies who took money to survive. I was angry that some of them used it to throw lavish parties but in the end it was POLITICIANS who created the problem in the first place. Its always government that causes the problems. No I am not confused at all, the confused are the ones who are complaining that business is somehow responsible for their failures, shoe fits don't it?
No, companies are responsible for THEIR failures!
Failing to be loyal to the country that made them rich is failure numero uno.
The country, the employee's and the consumers....all got screwed by your precious money-grubs.
Greed in not a family value, and it didn't used to be an American one either.
Companies are responsible for peoples failures? You live in the wrong country, you should move to Venezuela as quickly as you can.
I don't "blame" anyone. I know sh*t happens, and sometimes everyone needs a helping hand. It's not a sin to help people. Sorry you feel it is.
I want a gvt that DOES help when people need it, not the other way around!
That is the difference between you and me.
Are you completely whacked? So, the corporation has no responsibility to its employees? No wonder this country is so at odds. You either have never managed a company, or you are the worst boss ever. It's attitudes like that which forced unions to start up.
Repairguy - this is the first time I've heard anyone make any sense. Thank you for leaving your ego out and putting common sense in.
The actual tax rate for the wealthy is clloser to 17%. Less than you pay.
The next time you see the Occupy Wall St folks on the TV look a bit closer. You will discover that a lot of them ARE PARENTS. You can easily tell because they have their children along with them.
Then there are those that haven't got a basement because the fraudulently criminal banksters have foreclosed on their homes.
Also you say: 'The system is fair one just has to WORK for it to work.' Which begs the question which system? The weird communist/capitalist hybrid system that exists in China? Because that is where the crony capitalists - that you seem to be some kind of apologist for - are sending American jobs. Moreover: did you know that those jobs are being exported to China and India etc using the bailout money given to the banks by the American taxpayer?
People are waking up to the truth the world over. Sadly, however, you are obviously not one of them.
peter, you should talk to Obama. They should protest at White house. You do not know anything how communists work.
Communism is a single party system. The protesters are A political. They do not follow any party. They are also leaderless. This is what we need: a leaderless, non-political system of direct democracy.
Without leaders there will be no wars. People do not start wars; they have to be led into them: usually by being told a pack of lies just as we are being lied to now about Iran.
It's kinda like the environmentalists who drive SUVs, use electricity, plastic bottles and paper bags, rubber tires, etc.
All countries should have a central bank that is state owned. This bank would issue a country's currency free of interest and control the amount of money in circulation. Controlling the amount of money in circulation should be the single most important function of any government because it is by controlling this that the private banks control everything else. This is the gun that they are holding to our heads. With this power they can crash an economy anytime they choose - and this is exactly what they did in 1939 and what they are doing now: contracting the money supply.
Thanks for the link Emile R.
The WMF is essentially a world central bank acting on behalf - and controlled by - national central banks such as the Fed/Bank of England. The WMF creates money in exactly the same way as all other banks. That is: when someone signs on the dotted line for a loan from a bank - the bank simply credits itself with the money which it then loans out. This is debt money. Over 90% of money in circulation within a national economy is created in this manner. When a country agrees to a loan from the WMF it is essentially agreeing to owe the IMF money that the IMF doesn't actually possess.
It is absolutely vital that people begin to understand how the world's banking cartels operate. As long as we let these people control the money supply - the single most important function in any economy - we cannot say that we live in real democracies.
Watch the Money Masters on YouTube. Or beter still, get hold of a copy and watch it with your friends. Debate what you learn. When you fully understand the issues get out there and spread the word. If you want to live in a real democracy - and not under a capitalist system in which war and poverty are intrinsic components - you must do this.
Always bear this in mind: To have Power is to Exercise Power. If you let others exercise power on your behalf you will never be truly free.
Wait a minute. They loan imaginary money pulled out of thin air? That's insane; unless, of course, the rest of us can pay our debts with imaginary money. That would simply be a crazy I could get used to.
I'm going to have to do some research to understand this better.
Indeed you will need to look into it.
Money is a hypothetical concept, and the whole thing got corrupted in 1815 when the Rothschild's scammed the English when he spread the rumour that Napoleon had won at Waterloo, which crashed the stock market, whereupon they bought up all they could and became as rich as Midas when the REAL news came out.
From that point onward, the British Monarchy have been in the Rothschild's pocket, and the Rothschild's have been running things all over the world.
What we really need to do is reclaim the money, with compound interest over the 200 year period, that the Rothschild's gained by deception.
I mean, they and a few hundred billionaires ARE the 1% we need to depose.
Hi Emile R it actually gets worse. What you think of as money: those notes in your pocket, are issued with interest already attached. For every dollar issued 1 dollar 10 cents is added to the national debt.
And think of this. Because the banks control how much money is in the money supply at any given time - they can prevent the national debt from ever being paid off - they just ensure that there isn't enough money in the economy to pay it.
They can also contract the money supply: by calling in old loans and not issuing new ones, and crash an economy any time they like. This is precisely what they threatened to do in 2008 if QE 1and 2 hadn't been forthcoming.
And they call this the free market!
Depressions are created by the banks to cause wars which allows them direct access to a nation's taxes. People really do need to understand this stuff.
I have to say, it makes sense. I've never been able to make heads or tails out of why there is still money floating around. It seems like it all gets sucked in one direction, but there's still money down at my level.
I don't know how we are to get out of the hamster wheel. I remember how white Bush's face was, when he adressed the nation. Is there any way to move forward without total economic collapse? You'd think, if the truth came out there would be a way; but no nation would be the first up to the plate out of fear they'd have to go it alone.
The one thing that the banks do not want ordinary working people to understand is this:
For a national currency to work it has to have one vital ingredient. And that is faith. The people who use that currency have to place their faith in it. Why else would they be prepared to give up a large portion of their lives working to acquire that currency? The most important people in the 'money equation' are the ordinary working people. The only reason a dollar is worth anything is because the American people say that it is worth a dollar - not the banks, not the Fed, not even Barrak Obama.
We have the power. But we let others: criminals, politicians and bankers masquerading as democrats and honest men, exercise that power on our behalf. We need to take that power back and exercise it on our own behalf.
The whole world is waking up to this reality.
It began in the Middle East, spread to Europe and now America has awoken.
Think of a snowball rolling down hill. As it goes it gathers speed and grows bigger. At a certain point it will reach critical mass and become unstoppable. This is the mass movement that is sweeping the world. They might be able to suppress the movement here and there. But they cannot suppress it everywhere at once.
We are on a roll here. We are all together - nobody need go it alone.
I notice we talk about worldwide problems, but your solution involves tanking the dollar. Wouldn't that simply make the Euro and Yen stronger? It just shifts things. It wouldn't effect international banking. Am I missing something?
The dollar is - at the moment - part of the problem because it is the world's first reserve currency. America fights wars to preserve that status for the dollar.
In my future there wouldn't a first reserve currency. All national currencies -and the banks that issue them - would be owned and controlled by the people. The amount of money in circulation would be controlled by a simple equation so that there was never too much (which causes a fall in value) or too little (which makes economic activity difficult and causes unemployment). All the world's currencies would therefore be directly exchangeable: one for one. Nobody's currency would be getting a tanking.
That is the New World, plain and simple as predicted in the bible (which by the way has nearly 700 specific prophesies in it, of which less than 40 are still to be fulfilled 100% and those 40 refer to the end times)
One world currency will also lead to a loyalty pledge, aka the Mark of the Beast, and you will have global government.
The intention of the 1% at this time is to see chaos prevail in the world, and when they do see the collapse of fiat currency worldwide, (which transfers your assets to them) they will also see the sheeple demanding order, which they will provide.
If you read NWO materials outlining the plan, you will see we are already heading into the trap.
In order to escape this plan, you have two options:
1. Depose and remove the 1% terminally, and suffer the extreme conditions that would take place whilst the world rearranged itself after the removal of those currently controlling our lives (and planning to totally control our lives, and deaths) - This will result in substantial death all around as the world readjusted to restore sovereign nations, and a new financial system devoid of fiat currency and with the money owned and produced by each sovereign state, backed by (probably) gold or other actual finite mineral assets.
The sheeple will mostly not wish to do this, caring more for their cosy unaffected powerless lifestyles than future generations ability to live in real freedom from their masters.
2. Understand that God has given this information in order that we will not be concerned, that we will let Him have authority over our lives, and that as such we need not worry, for He will be our salvation AGAIN and protect us from the things to come.
Obviously, most sheeple will chose to allow the NWO to bring order from the chaos they have provoked, and will settle back to serve their masters, this time branded as assets, and will chose to ignore the 'removal' of those who resist.
The power of fast food, cheap gas and sattelite TV is amazing!
Hi Aguasilver: religion is - most definitely part of the prolem. And - by the way - the numerological reference that you quote from Revelation refers to a Roman Legate (commander of a legion) called Sextus Hermetidius Campanus. This guy was the main authority in the Roman province of Judea duiring the 90's AD when Revelation was written. Sextus means sixth son and the letters can rendered 666 numerologically. Revelation isn't a prophecy for our time it is a call to war: against Rome, by St John for his time.
I'm not talking about a one world currency either.
Successive generations of seasoned theologians have studied eschatology and never come up with that.
Imagine.....it was a call to arms from John to who?
He was on an island having been almost killed, and was in exile.
Plus the opening words give away it's source, and Christ NEVER called anyone to an armed insurrection.
I'm glad you are not calling for a world currency, but it will happen anyway.
Read Revelation again - but this time pay special attention when St John has Christ (with a double edged iron sword projecting from his mouth) saying 'I will kill them with death' when speaking of Jezebel's children.
I know that John was banished to the isle of Patmos: where he wrote Revelation. The question is why. Was it because he was a practicing astrologer? This was forbidden under Roman law; and guess what: it is still forbidden by Papal Law.
The picture is of the 'Man child' that was 'snatched up unto God and to his throne' with his measuring 'rod of iron'. The Greeks and Romans knew this constellation as Heracles and Hercules respectively.
There are other astrological references in Revelation. The throne of God is the constellation of Ursa Minor. The red drangon is Hydra. The old serpent (from Genesis) is Draco. The Tree of Life is Polaris. The pregnant woman is Virgo (also Isis, Ishtar etc) and the 'star that fell to Earth' is Ophuichus the Serpent Bearer. This stuff really isn't that hard to understand once you begin to compare it with the mythologies that gave birth to it.
And the last people that you want to listen to when attempting to understand the Bible's message are theologians - they all believe in God - a severe impedient to understanding anything.
Lastly - we are getting a little bit off subject with this thread - so I would respectfully suggest that expound your views on what you erronously believe to be prophecies elsewhere.
Nice to see someone here who knows what he is talking about for a change.
Excellent contribution - Peterxdunn-it good
You are right Peter, we are off thread, and I will desist and we will agree to differ.
Actually I would love to see the 1% DETHRONED and that is something we can agree to, I think?
... said the man who supports the Federal Reserve...
just wanted to re-enforce the slightly hypocritical statement by Deeds:
He's against bailing out banks, but he's for the Federal Reserve.
I don't recall saying I opposed bailing out banks. I do believe in more effective regulation of them. For example, I support the Volcker amendment which would help prevent them from driving the world economy off the road.
Way to go - I take back everything I ever said about you and unreservedly apologise for any irritation I might have ever shown toward you - respect !!!
Keep us informed of what you find out, the news is now so clearly only misinformation.
There was a rally in Tampa this week. People who are out of work brought their small children. Eric Cantor, a Rebublican, is calling these groups mobs. It is a shame for an elected official to call peacefully expressing an opinion anything but American! If the American people want to be heard, they need to speak for themselves. This is a good thing a very very good thing.
It is mob, since they side communists.
There were more protests yesterday around the Tampa Bay area, all remained peaceful.
http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/l … 10-15-2011
http://www.tampabay.com/news/humaninter … ts/1197034
I stated in a previous forum that I think this protest is going to become way more organised, be much more specific with regards to its demands and become a huge movement that will effect change for the better. WTG Emile.
Oh, yeah Hollie, to New Word Order. Communistic dream. Some do not study history well.
I don't think the protesters are all communists Vladimir, and some may feel insulted to be branded that. Equity does not necessarily equate to jealousy or communism.
In all respect Hollie, yes. You are right. Before we fall to communism we did not have any ideas where we are heading. Something sounds good does not make it right.
I know that it must be frightening, particularly when you yourself have had to experience many things that should not have happened. I don't think what's happening in the US, or indeed the world, is because people think that a particular leader or ideology sounds good. I think it's more that people are fed up with all that and are trying to effect a change themselves. Just want a little bit more fairness, justice. People are struggling so much the world over, because of the greed of others, and we are left to pay for their greed. And, if we don't make a stand, they will let us.
Hollie, this is the way I see it. There is no man can solve the problem by demanding fairness. We were not fair to God either and only God grace is one which is fair for all.
Now I wrote another Haiku-Vladiku:
Socialists were in Kremlin
socialists were in Berlin
hate and war started
Both socialists killed each others. All was base on fairness.
German and Soviets
now they call it bankers
just get away from history
There's a protest today on Londons Westminster Bridge. Just announced on Twitter that one of the activists was handed a leaflet saying "we are the 99%"
many abandon God
then troubles came
instead of repent
If some are jealous about rich banks why do not learn and work hard to become one? Socialism and communism failed everywhere don't you know that? All rebellion may end as French revolution.
Vlad, I appreciate the sentiment. More than you could know. But, this is not about jealousy. It is about what is right for all.
I work for a mega millionaire. A good man. He's built a company on solid values. A living wage. A share of profits. Benefits like insurance, fair vacation and paid federal holidays. He's a good and decent man who deserves everything he has. And more.
Multinational banks and corporations do not function within the same parameters. To them, profit is the only bottom line. We see this in every action they take. Now, profit is good. It is a vital part of business. But they are raping the world and they have wormed their way into our governments. This country is no longer for the people. Our government now exists, first and foremost, to serve multinational corporations.
Why would I want to work to become one of them? I despise their selfish lack of concern. People seem to equate wanting to stop international banks and corporations from controlling the laws and actions of governments as an attack on freedom. It isn't. It is a demand for freedom.
I don't support a communist ideology. I support the freedom of the people to elect officials who are not in the back pockets of faceless thugs. I want my government to do the right thing; not the wrong things because they don't own their own votes.
And, I want a fair and equitable world economy. I don't believe this is supporting anything more than what is right for all involved.
Emile R. I do understand all your points. Politician almost all should be voted out. My point is that only people who will be in, should have moral values. The government should not run our country. We can. I had a business and I close it. To have different people in congress means we must have spiritual revival in USA. There is not other possible way of change. I will tell you the reason why: The best freedom system is republic under God. There is only one opposite and it is socialistic communism. No other alternative exists. That way we will loose. Hate cannot be cure by hate, only by love. Money hunger cannot be cure by fairness but by God. Materialism can be cure only by spiritual. Blessing cannot be given by anyone but by God.
The previous 'government under god' has less to recommend it than communism, the dark ages were the first and biggest lesson for 'people'.
No system will ever be perfect because thinking and society is constantly evolving to encompass the new things that come along (like the earth goes around the sun, the internet, etc) What is needed is the old people removed from authority and new people put in, if elections are the weapon of choice then use elections, if it is revolution then get on with it.
Emie, I have last comment, I hope. I watched Egyptians demonstrators. I was surprised not one TV commentator noticed that there were soviet flags about six- eight of them. Now we know who was behind movement.
We did not have so many rich bankers (millionaires) when I came to this country. 40 years ago there were in entire world about 500 millionaires. Now we have more Billionaires only in this country. I noticed that it is more obvious since our country was infiltrated by socialists. Well, socialists are materialists, you know well. Money is number one material thing. Then those people do not believe in God. For them stealing is not big deal.
I noticed that Jesus said: you always have poor. It means we always will have rich also. If He could change it, He would teach about it. Yes, He did stay against the corruption. But He knew He will be murdered by them. There was no other way. He was Lamb of God sacrificed for our sin.
America will never turn to communism. Not in my lifetime. It is possible to find a middle ground. Don't equate not wanting to allow robber barons to conduct their business across national borders unfettered by ethics with a low regard for capitalism.
I think we have to go to streets and pray for healing the land.
Keep praying.....nothing will change that way..
In fact, there are too many "religious minded" who look at our current struggles with an eye on Revelations..."this is the way God said it would be"... (rolling eyes) Instead of acting for change, many among the Christian camp instead prepare for Jesus in the clouds.....though they will never see that day come...
I've heard too many Christians around me following this type of delusion...
It already has. And it's still growing. Not showing signs of petering out.
Lets see in few days, the most important here is the goodness it will bring.
They did a rally here the other day. Only 200 or so people showed up, but it got good press coverage.
It sure would be great to enlist 99%ers from every state on the Occupy Together bandwagon! Love the idea of geting the many, many people around the world who are also sick and tired of being stomped on by Big Finance to stand up and demand to be heard.
No more rewarding the few for screwing the many!!!
Yes, do please keep us posted on your experiences, Emile!
the movement is gaining momentum all over the world - but the American media is not reporting this fact....What else is new?!
Problem is that claiming to be the 99% and actually representing the working class are two different things. I don't see how drug addled trust fund babies with inflated senses of entitlement creating public health and safety hazards while demanding something for nothing represents the views of honest people who want to make smart financial investments and work for a living.
I think rallies are great as long as they remain orderly unlike the Toronto G20 summit or Vancouver I'd also recommend hitting the online venues to email your regional, state and national leaders also a site to watch how your leaders vote, I forget what it's called
Nobody can predict and guarantee there will be not violence.
True, likely provoked by police bullies.
The police are part of the working class that are getting ripped off as public services face budget cuts.
That's interesting, in the UK on Sunday, UK Uncut sent a tweet to the met which read " Don't be brutal, you are one cut away from compulsory redundancy, one cut away from joining us" The bridge became open to protesters that wanted to join.
You mean they're not drug-addled trust-fund babies?
That's true. Most of them are fine people. However, some are bullies.
Hi Emile. Yes I believe these groups and individuals will strike change from the first day I joined them. I participated on the eight day and everyone was still attempting to better give guidance and a plan of action. I wrote a hub about my experience there that day.(check it if you like). I am making a trip down there tomorrow also. I hear they have been funded to print independent press about what's happening as well as their long term demands. I am excited about this historical event occurring in America's backyard and mine literally. It reminds me of the civil rights movement in the 60's except this movement is for ALL PEOPLE, especially the working middle class. I will be there about 10am. I need too to find out the latest happenings and I plan to write more on my experiences as it continues. 1
Did Eric Cantor really call the scared and desperate working people of this Country MOBS? Eric Cantor made hisself a target and enemy of every working man and woman in this Country. Lets show him that we are not a mad mob; but instead we are movement of people that are able to effect political change in this country. Lets seed every protest in this country with people with voter registration forms and pens. Start telling people in the trenches and online what the Repuplican party agenda is all about, (returning this Country and most of the world back to slave labor) Our time is now! Let everybody know that the Repuplican Party was willing to destroy this Country twice. The first time was when they tried to defeat the health care bill, the second time was when they were willing to see this proud Country default on our debts. On top of that you have Republican Governors and Mayors using Union Busting tactic to further destroy the working class people in this Country. Don't just wave signs scream about the bad conditions of that the working man and woman foce every day. Fight effectivly and bring the power of the vote to the table. Register every protestor to vote! Throw the Republicas bums out with the power of your vote! Your vote is the only thing that politicians take seriously. I think, even Eric Cantor will start to pay attention to the regular working people in this Country.
Yes, he did. And he also said that Obama is behind the protests. I actually sent a nasty email to Cantor yesterday...I was so mad!
They are so sleazy!
The whole righty-brigade is out in full force against Americans and the president. They are truly anti-Americans. They hate their fellow citizens! It's sad and shameful.
They do, of course, LOVE the banksters and the wall street criminals. Luv Luv Luuuuuv them!
Here's an article that mentions Occupy Together!
And the mayor of Boston has been really cool about it. He "looks the other way" about permits, as long as people are peaceful.
I think you will find that Democrats on the whole support this movement.
It's the Bagger-Cons who have a problem with it. The Koch-S*ckers.
Cantor calls Americans protesting greed and corruption a Mob, Peter King calls them un-American (oooh--oldie but goodie!), Cain says people are to blame for their own downfall.....
Get the Kochsters OUT!
I appreciate all of the comments. I'm reserving judgment, for now; until after the meet up. I need to get a feel for who is involved and what their personal goals are; and what the force behind it all is expecting in the long run. I honestly don't want to be a symptom of the problem. I hope this thing is truly an attempt to effect positive change through a worldwide community banding together to make their voices heard above the din of the train wreck we've got running things right now.
Just be careful - apparently Washington's already having some conservative plants trying to incite violence and discredit the movement:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/0 … ia=siderec
I expect that. Starting up, just as the elections are moving in; no one is going to want the boat rocked. I don't trust either party, or the government.
This thing locally appears to be ground floor, but I was still hesitant to give my name. If this thing grows nationwide, every person involved will probably come under government scrutiny at some level. My sister went through government harassment some years back. It was ugly.
If you don't trust either party; do you at least take a stand during election time and vote for the people you dislike the least? Sitting on the fence at this time is dangerous for our Country. Republicans want to destroy it; Democrats want to fix the damage done by the last Republican President we had to suffer through. Please don't sit on the fence while your Country burns all around you. It will be a pretty useless statement for you to complain about how hot the fence is.
I don't sit on the fence. I've never missed my moment in the voting booth. If you think your vote makes a difference anymore, you have more faith in this government than I have been left with.
Emile you don't trust either party? Just what democrats teach? Then we do not have any solid ground to stand.
Power corrupts. It is the one thing that never changes.
That's right. Emile. Power corrupts! Besides love of money is root of evil, but not having money. Does not sound dichotomy?
All my life I was seeking for the truth. Surprise, I found it.
See it is not only we do not have the jobs. No jobs since gov. is giving high taxes and the same time high control. We are losing incentives and achievers.
Money, itself, is not a bad thing. It's a necessary thing in any developed society. But, it is not more important than people.
I've had an easy life. I'm not rich, but I've never been without money. I've been in a position to help others and I've tried to. What is mine, was theirs, to the extent that I could give them and still cover my own expenses. Because money is a means to an end. If the end doesn't help others, what good is it? Why should we allow a system to continue that puts profit on a pedestal and turns its back on the misery it causes?
You said something about praying for the land to be healed. Why should you ask a god to fix what we are abusing? Why should we not accept that, if there is a God, he is not actively working to ensure that the world is fair. You are obviously religious. Jesus said the poor would always be among us, but I don't remember a quote where he said ' so let them be forced out of their homes and starve, it's good enough for them.'
Left to their own ends, the world economy will only get worse because the big banks and corporations do not care about you or I. They don't have to. They've set the playing field up so they always win and we, the people of the world, have no power against them.
Vladimir, I think you have spoken a great deal of sense on this thread and freely admit that I am not an American. I am British and in my country, I wouldn't miss a TV commercial to go and vote (and I don't watch TV!!!) these days. That is hard for someone who was a part of Lady Thatcher's team in the 1987 General Election to admit. (Oh, how much I miss her Wonderful Exaltedness and her Dear Ronnie...) There is no party or individual in the UK (or the US, so far as I can see,) worth voting for...
Mr. Gordon, nice to see you. Sarah or Michelle would be perfect. But you see what they are doing to them. They know best (democrats) who they are, so they target them. They are afraid of them.
I was in business and I quit. My profession does not allows to move to China or else and I am against it. But I will tell you. The gov. agency was stealing money from me and there were high taxes and unbelievable control. Just example, I had honest bill to gov. agency for $1,400.00. I received two checks, 5 cents each. I framed it. Then Mr. Obama rewarded failing business by spending enormous amount of dollars. You got an idea.
"There is no party or individual in the UK (or the US, so far as I can see,) worth voting for..."
Once you throw up your hands and give up; you're just a waste of space and air. There are good, decent, trustworthy politicians in your Country and in mine. It is your responsibility to make sure they get into office or stay in office. My government is run by we the people. Sadly to many of them just occupy space and waste air. The useless whine about the good ole days instead of studying their politicians and working to get the best people for the job elected. For Gods' Sake! There are politicians in this Country voted into office because of NAME RECOGNITION! Some could'nt even read or write in the last few elections. Our brave children are out there protesting because they are looking for answers. It's so horrifying to think they are out there in the cold getting beat up by cops; while we sit and bitch and wring our hands. How about we teach our children to give politicians the finger? For the politicians that represent us; we use that finger to vote them into office. For the ones that represent only big business and banks, we use our finger to vote them out of office by replacing them with someone that represents us. That takes research and alot of questions. Take the time to use the power you have in that one finger wisely. Don't just throw your hands up; and give up.
Well said, Friendly. Here's Paul Krugman's take on the situation:
"Panic of the Plutocrats
"It remains to be seen whether the Occupy Wall Street protests will change America’s direction. Yet the protests have already elicited a remarkably hysterical reaction from Wall Street, the super-rich in general, and politicians and pundits who reliably serve the interests of the wealthiest hundredth of a percent....
"So who’s really being un-American here? Not the protesters, who are simply trying to get their voices heard. No, the real extremists here are America’s oligarchs, who want to suppress any criticism of the sources of their wealth."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/10/opini … ts.html?hp
Yes, it's VERY telling who is for and against OWS.
I like what Pelosi said about Cantor. "He didn't say anything when the Tea-Party was protesting, and actually spitting on members of Congress. No, he and his colleagues were holding up signs in support of them."
Could NOT be a bigger divide in this country.
It's clear as day.
Paul Krugman is very accurate in his assessment. Unlike the Tea Party there is no Koch money paying the tab. The republican politicians and their owners are always against anything that doesn’t benefit them. Why do you think Eric Cantor called the Occupy Wall Street protesters a mob? He is trained to bark at strangers.
when one don't vote give vote to bad party.
Here's the unknown variable.If the Govt/bankers/elite/??? manage to incite violence every where,what reason would they have for that?
I posted a question about Marshal/Martial...what ever,law the other day[seemed silly at the time]which was treated rather"Conspiracy Nut"ha ha!
I'd like to hear an opinion on that same question now.
Please go to the Govt web site[Y'all know I'm a technopeasant,haven't had time to learn this here computer stuff real good]and look up the last four or five years of executive orders filed.I was shocked and I believe you will be too.
Class war action toys:
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011 … ref=sunday
You could add another one: Tea Party protesters locked up for protesting...with guns. It too, would be empty.
I think few if anyone were arrested for just protesting, and having guns in this country in and of itself is not a crime. Harrassing people, obstructing traffic, public urination and defecation, and so forth, however, are.
And how about the call for violence made by an Occupy LA speaker? Calling a movement non-violent means nothing if the people involved aren't themselves non-violent.
Really? They say they were led onto a bridge BY the police, and then 700 of them were arrested.
And bringing GUNS to a speech IS a threat of violence. IMO
And any one at OWS calling for violence is most likely a right wing plant deliberately stirring up trouble.
lovemychris, are they not stupid who protests? Protesting what? Banking is not illegal. Having gun is legal. But care guns to protest is not good. In fist May in Chicago many people were killed. Why communistic protesters had the bomb?
People should protest hate not Wall Street. There are only two alternatives side. 1. Free country and 2. communism What is your side? .
Peaceful protesting is an American right of Free Speech. I pick Free Country.
Vladimir, how free is the USA when peaceful protesters are arrested and brutalized.?
Hey, Hollie, I never see peaceful protesters being arrested except in Soviet Union. First peaceful protesters were in Chicago in May 1. Protesters had the bomb, for what? Just for pace? If I will go with group to town streets and pray, then we must misbehave to bothers us. But an exception is if we have socialistic government it is other story.
Vladimir I am sorry that you didn't see it. Probably because it isn't being covered in the news like it should be. If you look or ask around you can hear the stories of friends and family getting caught up in beatings at the protests. Oddly enough, the police at Wenceslas Square in 1988 also denied any wrong doing to its citizens. Whats the difference? Well, we are a democratic society, so our beatings are more free.
Vladimir, I found this footage for you. Testimony from a decorated U.S. Marine, Sgt Thomas. In the video he is enraged at the police and repeats himself several times. However, he does give an eyewitness account of WHY he was upset at about 4:15 seconds in.
"I took an Oath that I live by. am NOT anti-NYPD. I am anti- Police Brutality. I am no longer under contract with the USMC so I do NOT have to follow military uniform regulations. I DON’T affiliate myself with ANY GROUPS or POLITICAL ORG. I affiliate myself with the AMERICAN PEOPLE that’s it. I REFUSE to affiliate with anything that SEPARATES. There is an obvious problem in the country and PEACEFUL PEOPLE should be allowed to PROTEST without Brutality. I was involved in a RIOT in Rutbah, Iraq 2004 and we did NOT treat the Iraqi citizens like they are treating the unarmed civilians in our OWN Country. No one was brutalized because our mission was to ‘WIN the hearts and minds.’ why should I expect anything less in my OWN Country."
You seem to be woefully misinformed about what is going on in the real world.
Hit the link I am posting here. It will take you to a YouTube video showing people being arrested by the NYPD for attempting to close their accounts at Citibank.
The directors and boadroom executives of the banks are not elected by the people; yet it appears that it is they whom dictate what happens in our world: not our elected 'representatives'. This includes having people - that are not protesting - arrested for going about their lawful business.
Please pay careful attention to the number of big, burly policemen that it takes to arrest a woman who is not even resisting arrest.
How can you argue that scenes like this ARE NOT indicative of the fact that America is fast becoming a police state?
Sorry, but that video actually seems to be showing people trying to incite conflict, what with that one guy making motions through the window, etc. that could be interpreted as some form of gangster intent?! Looks like a set-up to me. I'm against bank fraud and all, but if this represents the way the OWS "peacefully" protests, it's no wonder there were arrests.
And this one too....
Does the fact that he's a Marine give him the right to verbally bully the Police force? Really, I think not! I cringed at his delivery, 'cause it was just a few steps away from inciting a riot, probably less than that if the wrong person(s) had been in the near vicinity. If I were a cop, I'd probably have arrested him. Come on, people! Civil protesting can be done better than this, surely!
Brenda, you got me to laughing over your comments. I guess, the only way to satisfy the Tea Partiers would be to quietly lay in the streets in protest. The only thing wrong with that is I'm afraid you, and people like you, would just run over me and consider it good riddance.
I have no idea how you decided that poor man in the window of the Citi Bank was giving some gang sign. He looked bewildered and befuddled to me; as I would have been had I been threatened with arrest in that situation.
Everyone spins the truth in their own favor. Others say that while some were led to the bridge, they turned it into an attempt to "take" it. And given who usually has an anti-cop agenda, I'm not likely to believe that everyone arrested was an innocent victim. On an interesting note, the Chinese government has weighed in supporting OWS while stepping up efforts to quash more Arab Spring-style demands for government reform and change in their own back yard.
Why do people find it necessary to spout such rubbish in defense of the indefensible !! Where do you get your snotty little China quote ? did some other liar make it up or is it your own work ?
The Chinese government clearly stated that America should “put its affairs in order" in relation to the protests and the target of the protests, this is neither support nor condemnation.
Profits aren't evil, and these OWS guys are pretty stupid.
They talk about how evil corporations are, then demand that they let them use their restrooms without buying anything.
http://gothamist.com/2011/10/07/daily_s … _prote.php
Profits aren't bad - they tell people where to invest money.
Because of profits, a farmer knows that he can help society the most by planting Corn. He need not know that someone can make fuel with it, another could make animal feed, or that some people want to just eat the stuff.
Profits make it possible.
The real problem is that our government is stealing our money and giving it to failed companies.
"Capitalism is about profit and loss, If you bail out the losers, there's no end to the cost".
Unregulated greed and exploitation of the middle class is indeed an "evil" in the sense that it trumps democracy at every turn in Washington— and if you weren't so biased and obsessive about your ideology, you'd admit it, Evan.
Evan toes the Ron Paul line. I'd like to see him disagree with Paul for once at least. (I've expressed my disagreement with Obama quite a few times although I'm still a staunch supporter.)
"Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell." [Edward Abbey]
It's the ruthless determination and inflexibility of the right-wing that scares me, Ralph.
I disagree that Ron Paul still wants there to be a government at all.
Ron Paul argues that we need to secure our borders - that's nonsense. Let those who want in in.
I have a grocery list I disagree with him about, but I agree with him on the things that I'm most passionate about.
Oh, and every issue I disagree with him on I disagree with everyone else a million times more.
For example: Ron Paul says that it's only because Al Awlawki (sp?) was a US citizen that he deserved a trial. That's BS - it's because he was a HUMAN that he deserved a trial. But then you ask the question to every other pres candidate and they all say "let's kill them t'rrists" -- even Obama.
But I'm completely for him in every way because he'd be the needed step in the right direction.
Thanks, Evan. At least you haven't drunk all the Kool Aid yet. :-)
Ron Paul doesn't sell Kool-aid
He sells only the finest of wines. They are quite refreshing in nature, and are of tastes that only the open-minded can appreciate.
If you want poisoned Kool-Aid, then look for Obama. He won a Nobel Peace prize, ran as a peace candidate, and promised Universal Health care.
Instead we got "buy health care or get fined" (... yeah, it's going to be THAT easy to fix the problem, her der), 3 new undeclared wars, and the assassination of US citizens without trials.
That's some pretty F'ed up Kool-Aid.
As soon as you can show me how 10,000+ different regulations is the same things as "unregulated", I'll listen to your argument.
REGULATIONS?!!? Government and business have LONG been in bed together. Wake up - that's what everyone's so pissed off about.
But everyone blames the corporations as if the government is actually morally strong enough to ignore the billions in bribes they receive!!
You act like we have holy angels elected to government, but disgusting greedy pigs elected (by profits) to CEO positions.
Wake up - they're all human, and they all want profits.
... MY issue is that only ONE of those two groups - corporations and government - can bring an army to my home if I don't want it's services.
Government is the problem, not the companies.
Edit: LOLOLOLOL!!! UN-regulated greed!! HAhahahahahahah!! That's classic.
Edit: PS: how can someone be "biased" in an "ideology"? That's such a nonsensical term. Every ideology makes everyone biased. That's, like, THE definition of ideology. You're guilty of it, too.
It's just that I know I'm right.... LOL! Unregulated Greed!! LOL! Government isn't in bed with companies and banks!! LOL!!
Thanks for the laughs, bud.
The Federal Register is over 25,000 pages long.
http://www.openmarket.org/2010/05/06/fe … 000-pages/
If you can't do math then don't blame the kid getting an A+.
25,000 pages of regulation is NOT "unregulated greed". Especially when the majority of this regulation was written by the businesses themselves.
Anyway - this is exactly what I'm talking about: the OWSers can't even see that government is in bed -- doing REALLY kinky things (think whips and latex) -- with the companies they're supposed to be regulating.
Why blame companies when it's clearly a failure of government? the 10th Amendment (the Ron Paul r3VOLution's favorite amendment) clearly states that half of the things our federal government are illegal - ESPECIALLY THE BAILOUTS.
Anyway, logic is on my side, I'm afraid. If you want to keep claiming things like "25,000 pages of regulations is the same thing as NO regulations" and "companies have no bearing on government whatsoever"... then go right ahead.
Wake up and put the blame where it belongs: The Federal Government.
If your only aspiration is money, every judgment filters out anything that keeps you from your obsession, Evan—and you ARE obsessed with your need for greed. You fixate on propaganda, exaggerate disinformation—though I'm sure you sincerely believe it—however, it's rarely anything more than deluded agitprop.
Nothing like a few facts to scare away the Tea Tards.
Why would that scare anybody? Business doesn't exist to employ people, employees are a luxury that some businesses have. Providing a service or producing a good that fits demand and answering to shareholders is what business is about. By the way most people don't work for corporations.
Of course, a business does not need staff. CEO's are all that is needed, profits are as a result of CEO's (think) By the way, a staggering amount of people work for corporations.
I would love to see the business you would operate, would you hire people to stand around and keep you company? No? Would you pay people minimum wage to do nothing? Employees are a luxury, and just because corporations do employ does not mean that is why they are in business.
Hey repair guy. The corporation I work for suffered greatly in the last recession. Four of our offices were dead in the water. The office I worked for was running balls to the walls for the first part of the down turn. We carried the others. No pay raises, no bonuses, but we kept every employee, company wide, from losing a job.
Our owner carried the company when it all went quiet. It's moving well now; but if money were all that mattered many people would have been let go.
A corporation is not just about money. It was never meant to be.
A corporation is all about the money and was always meant to be. It doesn't matter what one business owner did to get through, if he would have had to lay people off to get by he would have. Be thankful.
Having been raised in the home of a couple of businesses owners who were quite successful; having owned businesses of my own that did OK, having worked for companies that treat their employees fairly; I realize you probably don't have any business experience so don't understand the give and take involved in the business relationship between employer and employee.
Anyway, I don't think your opinion is representative of more than an extremely tiny minority, so it's been interesting conversing with you.
So, you are suggesting that companies hire employees due to their social conscience. Get a grip, business may have found ways to reduce staff and maintain profits, that doesn't mean they don't need staff. Btw, if I employed people I would pay them fairly, even someone like you, not exploit them. And I wouldn't pay them minimum wage to do nothing, I would pay as well as I could afford for an honest days work. Get this, it really is fact, corporations are in business because they employ. They could not trade otherwise (think)
Interesting for me to see where Australia is on that scale, also interesting to note we have "full" employment, and a healthy economy at least for now.
Thanks for calling me a tard.
Just because taxes on the rich aren't high compared to other countries and times does not disprove my argument that there are 25,000 PAGES OF REGULATIONS ON THE BOOKS!!!
You must actually address this problem!! You have yet to address my arguments!!
Also, your graphs take for granted that "GDP" and "employment" are the goals of an economy - THEY ARE NOT!!!
A specified number of regulations does not make regulation bad...
To lump them all together is pretty tarded....with or without a teabag..
Unregulated greed is obviously false when you have 25,000 pages of regulations.
My point remains unscathed.
Again, a page number means nothing..
There were regulations in place on the national level when Enron was destroying California....but the Bush White House made sure the agency responsible for oversight did nothing... It is beyond the rules in the books...it is who is placed in charge of the agency...
When we leave the world of glittering generalities things can make more sense..
The table is big lie. Look to Wiki it vary between 15-35%. I believe it is still incorrect and low. Do not forget we pay also state taxes. Have you all have any business? Let say you own the tavern. You pay fee 10.000 for alcohol license.
Lets talk about doctors business. There is government tax and state tax. Medical license is $75, Narcotic $400 for 2 years. Malpractice $10,000-200,000. Now one bill to Medicate $1400 and you get two checks 5 cents each. Surgical procedure 2,600 pays only $200. Nurse anesthetist receives $300. Take you time and figure out by yourself how % it is.
During Mr Clinton administration, new rules of procedures were approved for year 1994 by AMA. But it took effect in non-existing rules in 1993. We had to pay 3,000 plus back since we broke the law which was non-existing at that time of treatment patient. Well, many Dr. quit, instead of mowing to China. They have unbelievable regulatory procedure and not time for coding and fallowing rules. Each Dr. have membership in AMA and State Medical society which is mandatory. Total cost was about $1000-1500. Medical education outside of city is costly and is mandatory. here is a fee, lodging, food and transportation. Textbook cost $300. coming out every year.
The statistics and graph show only that U.S. corporate taxes are less than most other countries as compared to overall taxes, and that unemployment and corporate profits are about even, though by a circuitous route.
The picture I seen is similar as I seen it in Soviet Union.
You got religious states like Saudi Arabia. You got mafia states like Columbia, Mexico and US.
You got socialist states like Northern Europe.
These sorts of threads, beliefs and proposed actions really frighten me and give me grave concerns me for the future of the Western world.
This is how Communism spread, how an admittedly flawed Czarist state (Russia) became the enemy of freedom, the very antipathy of human concerns and the cause of the biggest and most expensive stand off in our planet's history, The Cold War.
I often look at American and British politicians now and think ruefully to myself: Bloody Hell! - the Soviet Union did actually win, all be it by default...
Above all, however, I look at these ideas for civil disruption (yes -that's what it is) and see the Commies rubbing their hands with glee...
Stalin said: American imperialists sell us ropes and we will hang them on it.
Gordon Hamilton - you need to move to the US and join the Tea Party your ignorance is well suited there. Your concept of communism is laughable. The right wing warmongering politicians should scare you far more than people who'd rather live in peace and leave no one abandoned. Policemen beating up war veterans during a peaceful protest ok with you? No commies amongst those dishing out the violence.
I am so disappointed. I just left the meet up. Apparently this thing is off the ground in the city. They had a rally I missed. There is a march next Saturday. But that's not why I'm disappointed.
I got to the meet up. It was called by a gentleman from China. The organization had suggested groups form to brainstorm. I could barely understand him. No one else showed up. I finally discerned that he wanted to produce t shirts and bumper stickers with logos. I liked the idea. Said I would do everything to help.
And then, (get this) he wanted us to sell them. Sell them for 43% profit and split the profit. I almost cried.
Anyway, I told him I didn't want to be involved; promised to pass his info on to an artist friend and left.
If this is what this thing is going to boil down to, people concerned only for themselves, I don't know what to think. But, I'll go to the march and see.
I admire your honesty with your experience and hope you have found it informative and beneficial in the longer term. You have inspired me to make a similar gesture tomorrow by visiting my local pub (while I am supposed to be working) and consulting the big bloke who sits in the corner called, "Shuggy." He smells and dribbles a bit but at least he makes more sense than Blair...
I shall ask him if he knows your Chinaman and if he wants in on the action. His fee is usually two large whiskies and a pint of heavy... I'll see if I can negotiate you a better deal...
Wow. I'd drink a pint with him now. It might make me feel better.
You should not give up so easy, there will be many different people jumping in with differing agenda, the basic idea will be clear and there will be groups who carry it on I would expect.
I'm not giving up. I had high hopes. This guy brought me down a peg. I'm sure it will be a good thing.
And, like I said, his english was spotty so, other than the t shirt debacle; I don't know much more at this point. I have every intention of participating in anything worthy of participation.
And you wonder why revolutions happen in some countries. The USA is baking a recipe for disaster. You gotta change the system and it shouldn't take years to do so.
Repairguy47, the obvious is that you don't care. So why bother arguing a point this way or that, you don't care, and it shows.
A perfect example: The Idiot Savant...
"Conservative talk personality Glenn Beck, commenting on the Occupy Wall Street protests from his web-based GBTV program, characterized the anti-capitalist activists as 'radicals' that will 'kill everybody.'
The long-standing Occupy Wall Street protests that have spread across the country appear to have unnerved Conservative talk personality Glenn Beck.
In comments made on his Internet-oriented GBTV talk program, Beck expressed his outrage with the anti-capitalist gatherings, characterizing the protesters as "Marxist radicals."
"Capitalists, if you think that you can play footsies with these people, you're wrong," Beck said. "They will come for you and drag you into the streets and kill you."
Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/3 … z1aQu4yMjY
Oh My Gawd
Somebody stop him, before we have another Loughner. Which is what he wants.IMO
Thomas Jefferson wrote, "My wish was, to see both Houses of Congress cleaned of all persons interested in the bank or public stocks - cleansed, that is - of all corruption."
If only Jefferson could see what is happening today. Not only do stockholders own the banks and the rotten, stinkin' derivatives they sold us, they have the nerve to scream about socialism now ... after they have been the recipients of it.
The public stock owners of 1776, those Jefferson wanted cleansed of corruption, now own almost everything of influence in America! -Leslie Griffith, Reader Supported News
"According to the latest data, profits of U.S. corporations are at record levels even as the U.S. economy gasps for air. Profits have been totally divorced from the economic fortunes of the American people.
If corporations or the wealthy have no impact on the jobs and the condition of the average American, then how exactly can one believe in the trickle down effect which says that as the corporations and wealthy do better it will improve the condition of the average American? So exactly how can Mr. Herman Cain asserts that banks and Wallstreet have no impact on folks “not having a job”? If the trickle down effect theoretical works to improves the condition of the average American when corporations and the wealthy do good, wouldn’t it subsequently harm the condition of Average American’s when it goes bad? It seems like this is simply another area where Mr. Herman Cain’s ideology trumps being a rational and logical individual."
http://thyblackman.com/2011/10/06/raisi … -ideology/
Yeah, or being a dumb cluck.
Or just simply being in the pocket of the 1%, cause he is one of them.
And so is Romney. And THESE we want to give the reigns of power?
God help us.
The Corporations are making big profits because they are not paying the levels of tax that they should: especially the oil companies.
Also: share prices are vastly over inflated (ie a bubble) due to the fact that the banks are lending out the money they received under QE 1 and 2 (and now 3) to the speculators at virtually nil interest. This is happening at the same time as those low interest rates - and cost of living inflation - are wiping out savings and the value of pensions. Pensions are in fact receiving a double whammy because all the toxic debt packages that kicked of the meltdown are now getting dumped into them.
Watch Max Keiser on RTTV if you want to understand what's going on here.
But above all - WAKE UP - THE POLITICIANS ARE JUST MOUTHPIECES FOR THE BANKS; NONE OF THEM HAS A CLUE.
How about Hollywood's "A" list yearly pay checks?!
Brad Pitt 17. 5 million per movie. He's never had top billing and had a box office hit. This liberal once turned down a $15 million guarantee, claiming he was an "A" list guy and "A" list guys make 20 million.
Harrison Ford - 20 to 25 million
Ben Affleck - 10 to 15 million
Steven Spielberg, estimated to make at least 5 million per move. He never wrote a movie, risked a dime of his own money in any movie , yet gets a guarantee in every movie. Basically 1 month supervisory work i.e. shows up, sits in a chair, then yells "do over." Flop or not HE GETS PAID.
On and on it goes...
What a life these vastly overpaid 'do nothing people' get to live. Let's see a march on some of their palatial estates.
Why not implement a tax system that goes after them all. Don't remember seeing a post on here that stated celebrities should be exempt from taxation.
"As someone who makes a lot of money, I would like to go on record and say I support the buffett rule.I'm happy to pay more taxes. Any other celebrities feel the same way?" --Chelsea Handler
You can add Buffet, and Bill Clinton and president Obama...
Joseph Stiglitz at OWS:
"Those who worship money believe their buckets of cash, like the $4.6 million JPMorgan Chase gave* to the New York City Police Foundation, can buy them perpetual power and security. Masters all, kneeling before the idols of the marketplace, blinded by their self-importance, impervious to human suffering, bloated from unchecked greed and privilege, they are about to be taught a lesson in the folly of hubris."
Here's a comment from another site:
"I would like to say that up until the internet and now cell phones and social networks the TPTB might have had a chance to enslave all of us, it's now impossible. Have you see all the electronics at Zuccotti Park? they can even generate private cell phone to cell phone calls without using public services! They may look like hippies but these guys are educated and technologizied if there is such a word and they are causing discussions on all sorts of questions the lame stream media loath to cover. I happen to be in the area the first week of the protest and my intuition immediately told me this was the real deal. When you looked into the faces of the individuals you could see the light emanating from within. This is not your ordinary phenomenon, there is some deeply spiritual energy forming around this. Humanity on this planet maybe evolving just fast enough to ward off the great tragic future that's headed our way if we don't wake up."
You know what? Capitalism is good, until is infiltrated and mix with communistic thinkers.
You mean "greed is good"??? The Wall Street banksters played a key role in plunging the world into a deep recession, were bailed out by the taxpayers, and not one has been charged with a crime despite rampant dishonesty and reckless management.
Capitalism is good, until it turns its back on everything but profit. When it becomes the means by which misery is spread throughout the world it is no better than communism.
Capitalism is only worthy when accompanied with ideals that insist on fair treatment for all; when you embark on a quest for wealth. You can't argue for capitalism, for capitalism's sake. It's an empty philosophy unless coupled with a good dose of consideration for the needs of others.
I agree Emilie in certain point. We still have freedom and able freely vote. But how are you going treat country with so many socialists(communists), demanding everything for free? I went through it, and were deceived. We do not have to give money to banks the rich who have money are not in majority. You may use credit Unions. How you will eliminate communists? Drug addicts? Suicide's, killers, immoral, unfaithful, liars, loving money, gamblers, over-spenders, haters and list is long? But money hungry people occurs when materialism is introduced. They teach kids hate achievers, believers, creators they what they are going to be? They do not teach academics, since communists need only followers. Why we need sex edu. in fifth graders? Is it helping? Why we have to be sensitive to killers?
Emily you are responsible for your functioning family. You cannot be savoir of entire world. You know who is Savior, do you? Our families are failing rapidly, but we have to be preoccupied with Africans etc. Tell me where I am wrong. Capitalism is not philosophy it become result of free enterprise country. It was successful. But we do not see behind -agenda. Communists want our money and power. They are working on it since 1020's
So you would deem people like the Koch brothers Communists?
The dual-citizen Zionists who guarentee that we pay for Israel, while cutting Americans to shreds....Communists?
The big banks....communists?
Oh, on a note related to this post, the American Nazi Party has lent its support to OWS.
Out of interest, can you post a link, I'd like to read what said about this.
Well now, that would be poetic justice!
Since the International Banksters and American Industrialists supported the Nazis back in the day!
Tables have turned. Even the Nazi's have had enough of greed.
Except for the Zioconistas.....they never get enuff.
They're old skool Nazis.
If that is true they have more sense than the Republican Party who thinks that these Americans who want a little fairness are a mob.
I understand your fears. But, we went through this once before in this country. The robber barons of the twenties. Our freedom survived intact.
We can find a common ground. No one will support the more ridiculous requests of the Wall Street occupiers. But, I see them as the logical reaction to the Tea Party movement.
I wish I could alleviate your fears, but your life has not been mine. I'm glad we have people such as yourself who have experience and are watching and ready to point out problems they perceive us to be headed toward.
Together, as a nation, we have to change course. We can't continue on the path we're on. We aren't free right now. We are enslaved to a system we have no say in.
Emily I am fearless. I am concern about all people in this dear country to me. We were naive and you are as well. I am nor against protesters as such. Only if someone is not on right track it could go wrong way. That's all. I think Tea Party and protesters could go together. Would they? But still there is moral decay and tell me what is the way out?
Sounds to me like a bunch of public school students want something for nothing. Free health care, free education, free whatever. I need a new car. Maybe I should find the nearest Occupy ________, and get me a sign. A new Chevy Suburban would be nice.
Hi Tobey. The only demand the local group I plan on marching with on Saturday has made is that corporations stop being allowed to hold sway over, and make policy for, our government. Two thousand so far have weighed in and I predict the numbers will more than double for the rally.
I don't consider that an unreasonable, or childish demand. Do you?
Nope. My demand would be eliminate tax loopholes for corps.. However, all the legitimate grievances get buried under the idiots make idiotic generic demands like "Eliminate Capitalism" and have no concept of what capitalism is, how to go about it or what to replace it with. I got no problem with the 'real' concerns. It's the professional protesters without a clue that are doing the damage. Besides, who do you think Obama's (meaning the current governing body) biggest donator was? Wall Street. You can actually check the facts. $40 million. If the protesters could formulate a 'message', not 50 messages and they could get the idiots off camera, then you may be right. The movement would grow. Additionally, they want to get Nancy Pelosi , Obama, and a few other politicians to quit throwing in their support. Sort of defeats the purpose.
Well, you'll never get the idiots off camera. That's life. And, I don't think any politician's support should be appreciated. They've all bought into the system. I couldn't imagine one wining an election without corporate backing so they are all suspect.
But it isn't simply tax loopholes I have issue with. Corporations sit in on every policy making meeting. They meet behind closed doors. So you end up with government officials who have been bought and paid for by corporations (so they are little more than employees), and the corporations making laws for the average person.
Our system, top to bottom, has been corrupted. We need to find a way to fumigate Washington and completely kill off the cockroaches so we can have a government that puts the will of the people first.
Emily just check how much liberals are involved.
Ok, look. I approve of protests. It's not only our right but our obligation based on certain circumstances but there is a right way and a wrong way to get your point across. I just jumped over to the web and ran quickly through some of the demands the Occupy Wall Street crowd is making. "Cancel All Debt", "More Community Awareness", "End Greed", "Down with Money-Hungry Fascists" (by the way, the person holding this sign couldn't state what a fascist was). Vague, undefinable demands if you can call them demands at all. The specific get lost in the vague.
Now campare Occupy Wall Street with any Tea Party Rally and no, I'm not supporting the Tea Party. This is a comparison. "Reduce the Federal Government", Reduce Government Spending", Reduce the Deficit". Whether you agree with any of the objectives, they clearly state what's wanted. They don't have people holding up signs claiming 9/11 was an inside job or free some cop killer.
It's not the fact that the Occupy crowd is wrong or bad. They're unorganized, unfocused, unruly and as such, they're not being taken seriously. Clean up, shutup and find a decent spokesman that can articulate. Nothing turns off the average listener more than hearing a 21 year old young woman demanding free education and when asked why it should be free her reply is because millionaires and billionaires got rich off our backs. She instantly becomes a bum that wants something for nothing.
I agree with you on your points. There have been what I consider to be ridiculous demands from the Wall Street bunch. That's one thing I like about the local group. They held a town hall meeting and only demanded what the majority agreed on. That's democracy.
But, this thing will become more organized as it evolves. I don't see it going away. The system is broke and doesn't want to be fixed. Americans need to band together to force it along.
Emily do you know that democracy is mob system? I know many people mean differently. Marx said democracy is road to socialism. I said socialism is door to communism. One it will start you never stop it. Communists will never listen to you. We use to have in my old country old communists. They were all cut off. The communism is distribution of wealth. But it is not really so. It is only cover up. Final dictator will get all money. Power and money. Why America was bothering too much Soviets? They would like to sit in white House. By the way there is not enough rich who would pay all debt. But protesters wants the money for themselves. Then tell me about greediness. Why those students do not start to do jobs by themselves? I know many who became rich and started business in garage at home.
Deductions are good. There are people who are rich and give to charity, which government does not care, for political reason. Government so called charity programs is expensive and spending 60 c for each dollar to administrative cost.
Do you know what? Government is spending money foolishly. Rich people know better how to manage money. They do not put money to pillows. They invest it to businesses and jobs. But our gov. is putting taxes up and up and regulations you do not have any ideas how much. So people went abroad. Do politicians learn the lecture? No.
I do like Tea Party. Those are common people like us. They are moms and pops, families. They are fed up too. But not wanted all for free.
I am making list what I want to see we should demand. Not democracy. Return to God is number one.
"This entire takeover was engineered by taking over who prints our money. That was accomplished in 1913: and everything since then has been about how to shut down every other avenue that is necessary to preventing the overthrow of their control over our money. So, the New World Order went after the Constitutional Republic and everything that once kept that Constitutional Republic strong and free.
This effort has taken them 98 years, in order to get to the end or the Republic, and to usher-in the beginning of the extension of their fascistic-empire that has been in existence for 88 years. The Nazi's were formed in 1923, before Hitler was even a candidate for international-terror. (And after Hitler was defeated, they continued on inside Israel as Zionistas), Today they are ready and just waiting to assume control, after we have 'demonstrated' our way into global-oblivion."
It's not Communistst and college students. It's cold-hard Corporate/Money Thugs.
Fascism = Corporations ARE gvt
And what are you talking about the tea-party not wanting it all for free.....a lot of of them are on social security!!!
After 4 years, you are collecting money you never earned. Difference is they think THEY are entitled...no one else!
I'm afraid I know some Tea Partiers. Their argument reminds me of yours. An inordinate and irrational fear that anyone who wants to get government separated from Big business has a hammer and sickle sitting on top of, and crushing, the baby Jesus. It just ain't so.
Democracy is not mob rule. It's community involvement. No, we couldn't have a government that swayed with every emotion of the people. But, we can have a government that abides by the will of the people. We lost that slowly and we want it back. Because that is freedom.
If the Tea Party has its way, compassion will disappear in the halls of Congress. I have no intention of standing idly by and watching greed, selfishness and lack of love for my fellow Americans shove its way deeper into a government that was formed on the premise of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. The only thing we've been left with is life. I expect more.
And, since you keep bringing up the subject of God. You are aware that the early Christians had more in common with communists than capitalists?
will of the poeple... It depend how you program people.
Every communists say the same. Jesus and first church was communistic. Lady you not know the Bible. I am Bible teacher. Now I know where you stay.
Do you not consider that the reason why so many say that is because it is true?
I don't remember Jesus being too big on every man for himself and the devil take the hindmost.
I'll be blunt about where I stay. I'd rather give my tax dollars to help the downtrodden in this country; than kill innocent people overseas.
I'd rather give my tax dollars to help a poor person get medical care than hand billions to countries who don't do the same.
You may teach the Bible, but if you don't agree with my sentiments you haven't read it. You are pushing capitalist religion.
There is no way to prosper and be free if we are slaves to the corporate interests. I realize it is the dream of wealth that makes the right fight equality. You think pushing them out of government and back into the marketplace is somehow wrong. I say by forcing them to compete on the same level as corporations who don't trade on Wall Street we will ensure free enterprise and fairness. It gives your dream a chance.
Bankster USA Calls for Financial Transaction Tax . . .
Today in Chicago, 40 activists dressed as Robin Hoods kayaked down the Chicago River while several hundred more protesters rallied outside a hotel to deliver a message to the Mortgage Banksters attending a national conference inside: It's time for big banks to Pay U.S. Back!
Meanwhile . . .
Some time ago before Obama became president, UN asked for tax 1.5% for all international financial transaction. It was not approved. Now Mr. Obama is doing the same thing. 1-1.5% is only beginning. They will do more and more. There will be excuses for it. Do you know that UN was founded by US and international communists, mostly Soviet?
Vladimiir, you seem only capable of expressing yourself in simplistic cliches based on either/or thinking. You have made your mind up and I have no desire to read your posts. Sorry! I wish you well, but I can't share your ideology and have nothing else to say to you.
Wizard, it is your choice. Wish you blessing.
Emile, I am much older you are. I lived in Soviet block. I am state board certified in Marxism Leninism, Historic and dialectic materialism, Political Economy. I am the Christian and I live here 40 plus years. I know both sides. I risk my life almost died swimming to freedom to Italy. If our country is not founded In God we trust, where dollar bill statement came from? How you will fix moral decay? Can you build paradise with moral defective people? Please, think.
In Old country, Ukraine refugees warned us, but we did not listen. Now all I have is an apology to them but it is too late. It does not help. Dr. Vladimir
That's a cop out Vladimir. I have never understood why those who claim belief in God say such things. He'll protect how he decides? That sounds just peachy. That way, you don't have to care about the homeless person freezing in the streets of Chicago. You don't have to think about the child starving in Africa. You don't have to ponder if it is good to bomb Iraq. Because, gee whiz, God will protect as he decides. It isn't your place to care.
Emily. It is all about priority. Only Christians brought to all world help and light. All communists brought only weapons, revolution. What about Katushas shelling to Israel all the time? How many missionaries were sent? 98% form US.
Yes, God is God of freedom. He protects if one decides to go to hell. But He cries.
We haven't finished the search for a world that can balance personal freedom with concern for your fellow man, and with the ability to follow your dream wherever it leads.
Communism was bad. Capitalism isn't working quite the way we planned. You can't stop working toward an equitable system until you have one.
Nobody's actually tried communism yet. All these so called communist states are capitalism under a different name.
I know. Unfortunately, the desire for power and the selfishness and greed that permeates our thoughts prohibits a large scale attempt.
I don't know that communism is possible. True communism would be utopia, but true communism would be the collective will of the people involved. Any attempt to form a communist government would be little more than forcing an impossible ideal on people. Not everyone would agree to work for the common good. And, without agreement, it is enslavement.
Nope. Communism can never be a part of a free society because it wouldn't be freedom for all.
True, but then you could say exactly the same thing about capitalism under which some are much freer than others.
No argument there. But, I think we can both agree that given only two choices, we'd rather be standing here; not in the old Soviet Russia.
We have to find the balance.
John, I am free and this is what counts. I am free to sin and not to sin. Only mixture of capitalism with socialism is malignant. I am surprise nobody noticed it.
You are only free for as long as you embrace the system. Try living outside the capitalist system and you will find your freedoms rather curtailed.
first society have to have crisis and become poor. Then communism step in.
The bolshevik revolution was funded by - basically - the same institutions that the the occupy Wall St protesters are demonstrating against now. The objective of the Wall St banks at the time was to get rid of the Tsar who wouldn't let the international banking cartels get their greedy, grasping hands on large chunks of the Russian economy.
Hitler's rise to power was, likewise, funded by American banks. In fact, Prescott Bush: G W's grandfather and a director of the Union Banking Corporation, was prosecuted for enabling German industrial and banking interests to invest war profits in America during the Second World War.
So now we should be asking: how many wars have been fought to enable the greedy banksters to seize control of the world's wealth? How many people have died as a result of the bankster's subversion of democracy and promotion of tyranny?
Let's not knock the protesters folks - they're out there saving lives.
is the worm
for catching fish
Peter, ha ha ha
To all: By the way founder of Communism Karl Marx was not atheist, do you know that? He believed in God. And became Satan worshiper.
Sorry I posted my Hub: TREE SYSTEMS.
Hi Vladimir I would like to ask you an honest question. Why do you write in a narrative style that - when read aloud - sounds like a hammy, english speaking actor doing a terrible job of portraying a Russian? Are you really a Russian? Are you really a person (and not a program)?
By the way you are not supposed to post links here.
I can't say that I know a christian without arms in Africa. But, yes. I have helped hungry people. And homeless people. Not as much as I should, or could. I doubt if any of us do.
When I was in Soviet block, we said to teachers Marxism. Communism failed. I did not seen any country who started this evil not saying it. We will do better. Aha. This is the system which is wrong. But breaking capitalism is wrong. Just clean it from socialistic ideas. We went to other countries and preach good news. Almost all countries has opportunity to receive Lord. We taught the natives how to fish, not give them fish.
Socialistic atheists say we shovel gospel through the throat. But what they do? The teach children and feel not guilty of own statement. As I said there are two systems and nothing between. Breaking our system and demoralize bring automatically evil one. It is based on jealousy and hate, materialism. One group has to work other just use them. Nothing new under the sun. I am talking about three systems in my Hub. It is combination of good with evil. This is what we have now. Students are product of (hidden) Marxist schools.
i don't like sleeping overnight with those who haven't bathed...
no matter what their politics are
Greek One, you are a cleanliness snob.
Emile, I know many people know what socialism is. But problem we have is lies. Liberals, you say: Communism is bad, still communism did not exist. It was socialism. Today liberal say: communism is bad but socialism is good. But it is the same system. To tear down capitalism just because mixture of greedy materialist-bankers will not make any good. There money we may steal from them will not pay the bills and overspend.
We need to bring God back to treat materialism out. Protesters have the same greed for money as bakers. Protesters are coming from materialistic socialistic schools.
"So now we should be asking: how many wars have been fought to enable the greedy banksters to seize control of the world's wealth?" Absolutely.
My theory for the fake Iranian Terrorist Plot, after which Obama targets Iranian banks, of which
nobody is mentioning:
You are spot on about the fake Iranian plot. There are also claims that Iran has a nuclear weapons program - which it doesn't - for exactly the same reason.
We could also ask why does the Obama administration want to keep troops - along with their immunity from prosecution if they kill any Iraqis - in Iraq after the end of this year. The answer is: to prevent Iraq from switching back to selling their oil for Euros instead of American dollars. This is what Saddam did in 2000 and this was the reason for the invasion; it had nothing to with wmds, Al Qaeda or 9/11. If the Iraqis do switch back to the Euro then it will probably spell the end for the dollar as the world's first reserve currency.
Furthermore. there are those that believe that the whole meltdown thing: that started with the creation of billions of dollar's worth of securitized toxic debt which was then sold to Eurpean banks, was a deliberate tactic to destroy the Euro as a viable option to the dollar's first reserve status.
This would explain why - instead of being imprisoned for financial fraud - the bankers: that have overseen the loss of billions of dollars, are now receiving huge bonuses.
If it is not Obama he is a useful idiot. He works for the ruling click, and the history of his family has suggested he is CIA.
Can't tell the players without a scorecard.
I'm going to go search for one.
The list of OWS supporters seems to be growing in the most incredible ways.
The real question is: Who is brave (stupid) enough to oppose this movement?
Besides Eric, Rush and Beckles, of course.
Where did the Nazi demographic come from??? lol! I think it would be hard NOT to go against a system that even Nazis hate. lol But, seriously...Seriously???
Yes...Nazi's claim to be Christians too....does that mean Christians are aligned with them?
Nazi's are big on the second amendment....and?
Nazi's believe in the founding fathers and the Bible.....and?
OWS can welcome all people who want a change in the system. Diverse groups can come together on this issue. It's one that affects us all. No matter what color, religion or creed.
Attempts to smear will fail. Attempts to co-opt will fail.
If Fox can come out with the truth, anything is possible!!!
So, in other words...the demographic comes from?????
Sorry--I don't understand your question.
Ah, its probably my fault. What I was reaching for was where did Mighty Mom come across that info that speaks to those demographics? I would like to read the article too:-)
We have Occupy Wall Street in our City , I believe it is a great idea of people become a part of it. Maybe things will change for the better. Anything is possible because people are tired. The people here in my state said they will keep marching until we the American people get answers and change. If all of us did it guaranteed our Government would pay attention!
"It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us, we were all going direct to Heaven, we were all going direct the other way--in short, the period was so far like the present period, that some of its noisiest authorities insisted on its being received, for good or evil, in the superlative degree of comparison only."
This shows it all, vividly—all of America's hypocrisy . . .
i've been paying attention to this one in Vancouver BC...i'm concerned it'll get violent...these folks have moved in and unfortunately a civic election is on the way....ouch!
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nat … le2212281/
GOP trying to make occupiers feel bad. I say bring more to occupy.
Dems spend too much, GOP is just hard-line conservatives who are corporate agenda. The more people, the more voices will be heard. Keep it Going!!
Social Media & Occupy Movement is stronger than GOP & Corporations.
http://thinkprogress.org/special/2011/1 … y-oakland/
Read this! Last night in Oakland the police fired upon the occupy crowd with rubber bullets and such..
hell yay! it's time for a revolution! around the world!
Just noticed this after starting thread on it - where are the protestors about free speech, freedom generally, and the totally censored western news media ? From outside looking in it is absolutely incredible that it is YOUR freedoms that are being trampled, your news that is heavily censored by the simple means of NOT reporting this stuff.
When are the freedom gang going to start speaking out against it - you have always been very vocal about these issue in other countries to the point of being downright rude and obnoxious - where are you now to speak out about it in your back yard !!!
Wasn't on national news either.
Kids are playing with the fire.
Protests cannot eliminate greed. Only God can when revival comes.
Funny, that's not what Ghandi experienced. Protests seem to work just fine for him.
Did Ghandi changed the world? Did he resolved sin and poverty? The same did socialists changed the world? They destroyed everything. Ghandi said: I like Jesus but not Christians. What a "great wisdom". He did not received Jesus inspite of just talking. Jesus came because we Christians were bad. What big deal about Ghandi? Did he died for my sin? He hardly died for himself. I do not hate Ghandi, It was just statement the truth. USA was good until our government removed God from our life.
What? That line of logic is pretty hollow. The man had a cause, he protested for change in India, and consequently things DID change. To say that protests don't work is just wrong. I could have mentioned the entire civil rights movement for our own history, or the Boston Tea Party. By the way, THAT last one did change how things were done in this country. To say that Gandhi was unsuccessful on the strength of a continued presence of "sin" in the world, is just nonsensical. If the presence of sin is some kind of litmus test for success, then by extension the Bible doesn't work and people should not follow that either.
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