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What is the difference between Karl Marx and Bill Gates?

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    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago

    http://s3.hubimg.com/u/5760230_f248.jpg
    I believe that if you show people the problems and you show them the solutions they will be moved to act.     ~Bill Gates

    Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness.    ~Karl Marx

    1. Dave Mathews profile image59
      Dave Mathewsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      One major difference is the spelling and pronunciating of their names how about that?

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        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        What about Gates is showing his teeth, while Marx is not?

    2. Felixedet2000 profile image61
      Felixedet2000posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Bill is an entrepreneur who inspire a generational momentum in information propagation while changing the world positively by so doing, Mark on the other hand was a reformist who revolutionize economic direction and pattern, both are worthy sons of planet earth, I'm next in line dudes.

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    Emile Rposted 5 years ago

    I don't know. I guess the main difference might be that Bill Gates inspired a revolution in the computer world and an entrepreneurial spirit; Marx inspired the world to diddle with a bizarre and oppressive attempt at communism. I'm sure there are other comparisons that could be made

  3. Evan G Rogers profile image83
    Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago

    ....

    one was a raging socialist leader who crafted the poorly thought out ideology that led to hundreds of millions of people's deaths...

    ... the other made life better and affordable for hundreds of millions...

    Go Gates!

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      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I will rather go for Steve Jobs... smile

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        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        ...His ideas were more fascinating.

  4. mel22 profile image61
    mel22posted 5 years ago

    I'd say about 40 Billion dollars

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      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Is '40 Billion dollars' acceptable in the world, to be consumed by a single man?

      1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
        Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        If he earned it!

        No one pointed a gun at my head and forced me to give it to him (taxes on the other hand...), I voluntarily gave him that money because he made my life awesome!!

        If it weren't for him, I wouldn't be able to type this stuff to you.

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          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Well, Mr Gates revolutionized my life with doors and windows...

          "If he earned it!"

          Can you explain a little what exactly you mean by earned?  ...This is getting interesting...

          1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
            Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            He invested his capital in ways that generated wealth.

            He earned it.

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              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              What if he had no capital to invest in the first place? What if he had not had the deluded support of IBM? What is Bill Gates were a slum-child, with same talent?

              -Were he in the place he is right now...?

              1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                So, saving capital and investing it wisely is a good thing? Also, encouraging proper expenditure of wealth is a good thing? And also, punishing improper usage of capital is a good thing?

                The people before Gates earned their money by setting up an economy that could handle Bill Gates. And the people in the future (countless computer programers) are getting / will get rich off of the foundation of capital that Bill Gates helped set up.

                Bill Gates earned that money. Elizabeth Warren's moronic arguments won't convince me.

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                  PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Some people answer in a subconscious way that sounds just such a foolish way to debunk reason...when they are left with no answer to answer the disturbing questions before them. Jokers with a girlfriend are indeed jokers lol

        2. John Holden profile image61
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Nobody held a gun to your head and forced you to pay taxes, you choose to live in a society which has costs that you must pay, just as you chose to use Bill Gates product.
          The only difference is that you generally get value for money from taxes, nobody makes a whacking profit off them.

          1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
            Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            True--roads, bridges, schools, law enforcement, cleaner environment, public parks, safer drugs, air traffic control, etc.

            1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
              Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              In many other countries air traffic control is a private endeavor. France is one.

              And the rest of those services can also be provided through private means.

              1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
                Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                In theory they might but in practice self-regulation hasn't worked out very well as indicated by the latest financial meltdown at WF Global.

              2. Jeff Berndt profile image89
                Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Don't the French air traffic controllers charge the government for their services, which pays for those services with money it got from somewhere....?

          2. Evan G Rogers profile image83
            Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            The only place I can go to avoid taxes any more is Antarctica and a floating ship at sea.

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          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          This is what we call Freedom of Choices...Did Bill Gates really earn his money...or he just unconsciously exploited a system which is flourishing on a Big falsehood??


          http://s1.hubimg.com/u/5761264_f248.jpg

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            PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            When everyone is sleeping...a man who suddenly awoke from his dream, is enough to kill them all.

      2. mel22 profile image61
        mel22posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        if he earned it.YEP Is it right for a gang of socialists to steal from one man who has earned so they can split it into a mediocre amount of money to be wasted on a few cigarettes and a 40 at the bar so that everyone can feel mediocre. If his ambition earned him the money , fine, If he earned through fraudulent means that's a different story. Whether you think he earned it through fraudulent monopilzation is the real question. The Gov't says yes and the manufacturers said yes. I say no. Another software manufacturer had just the same right to make a better OS and put that in front of the manufacturers face in a practice called COMPETITION. This would have driven his prices down to keep the manufactureers on his side. The fact noone had the brains to make anything better at the time just means he Captained that industry. He never Robber baroned the industry as claimed. It was purley ambition and genius that allowed him to do that but by your definition everyone must be mediocre and never have the right to succeed in life. Without the ambition to generate an income he would not have done it .Making the money isn't the problem. Its the non-charitable part that needs to be addresses but last I knew he was going to give half. He has every right to spend it but if he doesn't then people will be benefitted. I would much rather make some money and give it to charities that help truly needy people rather than the government deciding the definition of needy and my money going to an unambitious lazy person who is not really needy but just whines louder than some sick kid with cancer or elderly person. Socialized governments always mismanage money and the money ends up in beaurocrats hands or the lazy rather than going where its needed. How does that help the 'general' welfare  of society. If you ask me i'd say that's 'speciaized' welare and ends up being pocketed by government crooks. There are just as many socialized robber barons as there are capitalist robber barons. We need to get  the captains of Industry and the captains of government in office and the socialized robber barons and capitalist robber barons out.

        1. John Holden profile image61
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I would be interested to hear how he earned it, does he have blisters on his fingers? Sleepless nights spent dispatching the product, 20 hour days writing the product?

          1. mel22 profile image61
            mel22posted 5 years ago in reply to this

            not all work has to be back breaking to be considered labor intensive.. how many nights did he have to sit up using his brain power to go code typing away( and before anyone else had done so using the easy copy and paste method used today) he created that code. If you don't think that took work you are mistaken.while most people now get a kick from creating a sidebar gagdet this guy was making the operating system for it to work on.. Now all the open source coders are wondering how to get paid after they gave away their time for free and cant pay for their next pizza. Thats not Gates fault that they coded themselves out of work expecting people to donate to their free and open cause so everyone could have a cellphone with cool free apps and not a pot $!@# in while reading it. Why isn't everyone against Jobs for charging for his phones. He didn't have to do any work either right. They both employed alot of people that had to work on it though. That's a Captain of Industry not a robber baron.

            1. John Holden profile image61
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Have you never even heard of Alan Turing?

          2. Evan G Rogers profile image83
            Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            John, you know damned well how he earned it.

            He got a small amount of money doing something, then he invested his money wisely, and generated millions of jobs, millions of products that people wanted at a price they could afford.

            He earned it.

            You are PERFECTLY free to repeat his actions, but I simply doubt you will succeed.

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          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I very small reply indeed...

      3. Ralph Deeds profile image69
        Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Gates is giving most of his money away.

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          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Keeping the half for the poor?

          1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
            Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            He already helped the poor - they can do so many things for so much cheaper with him than without him.

            Almost every branch of every sector of every economy has been influenced by Gates and has thus been able to decrease cost to consumers.

            Quit acting like Gates owes you something - you agreed to give him the money that you now want back. Give me a break.

            You sound just like the execs at that company that's about to go public. They promised their workers stock, and now that they're going public, they're forcing their employees to give up their stock.

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              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              "Quit acting like Gates owes you something"  -Restrain your big tongue Evan. If I start to play that game, you will hardly exist.

              Talk ideas - if you feel I have beaten you with an idea - then respectfully admit that.

              I heard long time ago, that giving money to the poor only intensifies poverty. Did you understand that? Beaten?

              1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                You haven't beaten me with ideas - You're claiming that someone who invested his own money, time, and capital and made billions shouldn't be allowed to spend the money he generated.

                You're claiming - at least everyone else who makes similar claims - that we must tax the rich more because "well, everyone helped them make that money, so it's really everyone's money".

                This is nonsense on stilts.

                I mean, listen to this quote: "This is what we call Freedom of Choices...Did Bill Gates really earn his money...or he just unconsciously exploited a system which is flourishing on a Big falsehood??"

                You then go on to suggest that Bill Gates was the 'sleeping man' who awoke and murdered everyone in their sleep!!!

                "When everyone is sleeping...a man who suddenly awoke from his dream, is enough to kill them all."

                Are you serious?! You expect me to "restrain [my] big tongue" after making these ludicrous claims?

                The man has helped Billions of people live better lives, and you're suggesting that he didn't earn his wealth, and that ... apparently... he goes around murdering sleeping people!!

                And you expect me to take this seriously?

                No. You're asking Bill Gates to be taxed - despite his already helping your life in countless ways - because, apparently, he hasn't helped you enough. And then you suggest that he murders sleeping people.

                Just a reminder: much of that wealth isn't in the form of "money" or "stock", a huge, enormous chunk of that money is in the form of "factories" and "distribution outlets" and the sort.  If you bothered to redistribute his wealth, you'd probably end up with a screwdriver.

                GOOD GOD!! You even suggest that "Bill Gates is giving away most of his money" is a BAD THING!?!?!?

                "Keeping the half for the poor?", was your response to the news. He's giving away his money, and thus making it cheaper for that money to be redistributed and yet YOU'RE STILL MAD AT HIM.

                Restrain my tongue?!!

                This is nonsense on stilts. Very, very high stilts... that have polka dots and chickens on them.

                How, in the flaming depths of Hades, while being probed by small red guys with pitch forks can I even be expected to debate with this!?

                It's clear you just hate rich people. I can't argue against crazy.

                That's a wrap. I'm outta here.

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                  PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Thanks for such a small answer - 'Keeping the half for the poor?' - I said this? What's wrong with that? Please explain...otherwise stop your childish game.

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                    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Once I start mine...people either rush or crash.

                  2. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                    Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    You just got mad at Bill Gates for making a product that has helped your life in countless ways.

                    Then you demanded he give his money away.

                    Then when Deeds points out that he plans on giving his money away, you get mad at Gates for not giving the money to who you want him to give money to.

                    Sorry, but this is all complete nonsense. I shouldn't even bother wasting my time responding to this.

                    How bout this. If you can find a way to get mad at Gates for this, I promise to never talk to you again.

                    BE MAD AT GATES FOR THIS!!! http://www.gatesfoundation.org/Pages/home.aspx

                    How much money have you donated to ending diseases?

                2. yellowstone8750 profile image61
                  yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Why are you so rude Evan?

                  1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                    Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Sorry, but my body has a natural gag reflex to nonsense.

                    This individual is mad at Gates for all his awesome work making the world better for each and every 7 billion of us.

                    I think being rude is justified.

            2. John Holden profile image61
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Then how come Microsoft got caned by the EU for blocking competitors out of the market?

              1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                Just one of a billion non-"microsoft is evil" possibilities: Because the EU wanted more money because they're all broke?

                Sounds pretty reasonable to me! You have to bribe the government to let you sell things - this isn't new.

                But it is lecherous.

                1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
                  Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  If the entire EU were broke, that'd be a good theory. But the entire EU isn't broke now, and the bits that are broke now weren't broke then.

                  1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                    Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    The EU isn't broke in the same way that the US isn't broke.

                    ... uh oh...

                2. John Holden profile image61
                  John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  So you think it's acceptable for somebody to ride roughshod over free enterprise, as Gates did?
                  If you think that the European and American governments are only in it for the money what about all the private companies who've brought law suits against Microsoft?
                  How do you feel about having to put money in Microsoft coffers even if you don't buy any of their products, as used to happen.
                  Boy, if any government acted as Microsoft have acted you'd be apoplectic with rage.

                  1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
                    Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    Can someone PLEASE explain how "giving your new computer access to the internet via Internet Explorer" is grounds for a monopoly charge?

                    http://www.networkworld.com/news/2009/0 … abuse.html

                    Anyone?

                    Anyone at all?

                    No one?

                    Ok, that's what I thought.

                    IN fact, with my computers, the first thing I do with Internet Explorer is download Mozilla and Google Chrome. LOLOLOL

        2. John Holden profile image61
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          No, Gates is giving his customers money away.

          1. couturepopcafe profile image60
            couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Wow, I guess if I'd created that product and it's accompanying monopoly, I'd fight to keep it, too.  Maybe Gates hated government as much as (some of) the rest of us do.  Then the monopoly was broken, Gates simultaneously grew up and began to see that he didn't really need all that money.

            It's really interesting that we cheer for the little guy (Gates in the beginning) then when he really makes it, we call him a sellout.  Hmmm.

            1. John Holden profile image61
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              I didn't call him a sell out!

  5. Wayne Brown profile image84
    Wayne Brownposted 5 years ago

    It is acceptable to a society which truly believes in freemarket capitalism as a ground on which individual success can be obtained if someone works at it and has a good idea that other people desire to utilize. It can't be both ways...it is either a free market or it is not. Gates paide his dues, got an education, started a small business that was not much more than a garage operation and turned it into the world's largest software producer. If that makes him evil or lacking then maybe you live in the wrong country. You might also note that Gates has placed his family fortunes into trusts which will indeed benefit many people world-wide over time. The fact that he has created a company which earned profits, provided jobs and welfare to people and overall improve our lifestyles should not make him evil because he was succesful at it. Marx on the other hand, espoused an idealic utopia in which all people benefit equally from that which is produced. The fly in that oinment is people eventually stop producing when there is no incentive for individual success. As in the case of Marx, eventually the size of the pie slowly deceased while more and more non-producers lined up for their share. To compare Marx and Bill Gates is beyond the realm of similarity. WB

    1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
      Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      "...it is either a free market or it is not."
      Hate to burst your bubble, but it is not. There hasn't been a truly free market in a very very long time. In some ways this is a good thing--people aren't allowed to dump waste in the river to save the cost of proper disposal anymore. In some ways it's bad--it's prohibitively expensive to compete with say, Tyson chicken, because of the non-result-oriented regulations* a startup would have to meet.

      "The fly in that oinment is people eventually stop producing when there is no incentive for individual success."
      BS. People keep saying that, and it keeps not happening. If that were true, nobody would have made a fortune in the 50s and 60s, when the top income tax bracket was close to 90% instead of the close-to-30% it is now. You'd think that now, with taxes so low, that there would be tons of jobs being created, since now people have greater incentive to create wealth than they did in the 50s and 60s, right? But we see pretty stagnant job market, not a rapidly growing one. That's because high taxes don't make visionaries and entrepreneurs decide to stop being awesome. They just don't. I have no idea why so may otherwise intelligent people believe this falsehood.

      Gates isn't evil. He's successful, and he's a philanthropist. It was pretty easy to scapegoat him whenever my windows-running PC would crash, though. But that didn't make Gates a bad guy. It made Windows a pretty-good-but-still-flawed operating system.

      But to compare Marx with Gates? Well, Gates is using his fortune to benefit people who never worked to help him create that fortune, so maybe they do have something in common after all?


      *For example, in a USDA approved facility for processing meat (for example, taking a live chicken, killing it, plucking it, and gutting it so that it's ready to cook), there must be a separate restroom facility for the USDA inspector, which nobody else gets to use. That's in addition to the usual men's and ladies' rooms. No extra bathroom? No USDA approval. Never mind that your operation may turn out chickens that have a hundredth of the bacteria count of the "approved" one. Results don't matter: procedure does. This is an example of a bad regulation.

      1. uncorrectedvision profile image60
        uncorrectedvisionposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        And you keep saying this without qualification as if the tax regulations - credits, deductions, brackets, etc...- are unchanged from the mid-50s.  The tax code is thousands of more pages now.  The number and scope of deductions and the definition of income has radically changed as have tax credits and income brackets.

        You offer this factoid as if it was a meaningful comparison.

        1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
          Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Wait, are you arguing that there are fewer loopholes now than there were in the 50s and 60s? In the same post that you tell us that the tax code has gotten more complex? You haven't offered any facts at all; you've just said, basically, "Nuh-uh!" Demonstrate that 90% taxes plus deductions in the 50s/60s = a lower functional tax rate than 30% plus deductions now, or you're just making stuff up.

      2. Wayne Brown profile image84
        Wayne Brownposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        There is no model to hold up that does not contain some element which is attempting to work against capitalism.  Dominance is the best scenario possible...The U.S. has remained predominantly a capitalism based society with socialism and communism continually knocking at the door.  We are also a society which has made great technological strides since the 1960's thus there has been more and more opportunity to "produce" things  which were not practical to produce in years prior. Still, the opportunity for individual succes and achievement is still there though there is regulation and burden in the marketplace.  Your reasoning assumes that if we take everything away from Bill Gates, he will still continue to add to the expansion of economic growth at the same level.  I seriously doubt that.  I would love to see a list of countries that have totally embraced socialism/communism and achieved the enduring economic climate of the USA.  Possibly we could find some of those in those countries where the Bolsheviks attempted their dominance of government and economy on the basis of all sharing equally in what is produced.

        1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
          Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          "Your reasoning assumes that if we take everything away from Bill Gates, he will still continue to add to the expansion of economic growth at the same level."
          First of all, I never said that. I said that raising taxes on high earners will not make them take their toys and go home (and it won't, if history is any guide). I never ever advocated taking "everything away."

          "I would love to see a list of countries that have totally embraced socialism/communism and achieved the enduring economic climate of the USA."
          Can't. No country that has totally embraced communism has ultimately succeeded. But. Some countries that have taken the best of both systems are doing very well: they don't have the bazillionaires that the US has, but they also don't fear bankruptcy when they fall ill. Denmark, Norway, Sweden, all of them more stable, and more prosperous per capita than the US. And you can't tell me they don't have inventors, innovators, or entrepreneurs in Scandanavia. Denmark gave us Legos. Sweden is the home of Ericsson and Ikea. Norway is a leader in renewable energy research (they're #6 in the world for hyrdopower). These countries have government-run healthcare and education, and an unemployment system that makes ours look pretty luxurious. But for some reason, they still have innovators and entrepreneurs, and we don't hear complaints about Scandinavian welfare queens....

          Are there any hubbers here from Norway, Denmark, Sweden, or Finland who can confirm or debunk me, please?

    2. yellowstone8750 profile image61
      yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      What about a socio-democracy? Sweden? Denmark? Finland? Just wonderiing. I  think some are envisioning Stalinism.

    3. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      "it is either a free market or it is not"

      That's a false dichotomy. Many democratic market capitalist countries are referred to by economists and political scientists as "mixed economies" because they are to a greater or lesser extent regulated and have social welfare programs. They seem to have plenty of "motivation for individual success." There are degrees of freedom and regulation. It's not a black or white, either-or matter.

      1. John Holden profile image61
        John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        It also overlooks the fact that Gates was doing everything in his power to restrict the free market.

        1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
          Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I'm still having trouble figuring out how "using internet explorer to download mozilla for free" could be considered a monopoly.

          The move is clearly just a legalized forced bribe by the government.

  6. 0
    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago

    @Wayne Brown-  Do you see any connection between these two quotes below? I have nothing else to say. Bill Gates is an amiable, and I love him more than anyone who did not understand him ever - when did I say he is evil? Please check that again.


    (I believe that if you show people the problems and you show them the solutions they will be moved to act.     ~Bill Gates

    Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering.   ~Karl Marx)

    1. Ralph Deeds profile image69
      Ralph Deedsposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Sorry, I don't get what you're driving at. Please explain the point you wish to make.

      1. 0
        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Just look a little below.

    2. Wayne Brown profile image84
      Wayne Brownposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      @PW....Connecting those two statements is a stretch and a total distortion of context.  Gates is referring to his faith in people to have th initiative to take the proper action when they understand a problem and the potential solution.  Marx, on the other hand, is selling a philosophy and using a reference to religious unrest to support his reasoning that such unrest is indicative with total unrest about the existing system.  I see you take a position on your feelings as to Gates but stop short of expressing any caution on Marx.

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        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        I don't think Marx ever said that he was immune to correction. His ideas of a bloody revolution is pathetic. No good end comes by evil means. He failed to provide a good solution to replace capitalism.

        But the problem he pointed out was indeed a very serious problem that everyone overlooked, and made over their heads. We need to find the solution ourselves - for poverty, inequality, and a culture prevailed by Billionaires and Slums.


        ...I said this thing somewhere in this very post...

        Nice that you noticed.

      2. yellowstone8750 profile image61
        yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Marx nailed it.

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          He always does.

          1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
            Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            he nailed the coffins of some 200 million people shut.

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              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Show data dear Evan. If I calculate the active, and the passive damage that Capitalism is doing on this earth - the number will run in billions.

  7. yellowstone8750 profile image61
    yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago

    Although I agree with Marx, what is your point? I agree with Holden, taxes is the only way to solve the problem; however, I m not a fan capitalism.

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Bill Gates, in the quote, was saying that people act when they are clearly shown a serious problem, and its solution. Karl Marx, pointed a big problem that this inescapable capitalism is. Did he gave the correct solution? Did people act?

      -This is my point

      ...It seems Gates and Marx, as thinkers, are not too far away. Or are they?

      1. yellowstone8750 profile image61
        yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Thanks for the reply. I misunderstood what you were saying.

  8. paradigmsearch profile image89
    paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago

    "What is the difference between Karl Marx and Bill Gates?"

    Karl Marx is cute and fuzzy. Bill Gates wears glasses.

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Now this is called research!

      1. paradigmsearch profile image89
        paradigmsearchposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        lol

  9. aware profile image71
    awareposted 5 years ago

    58 billion dollars. that's a huge difference.

  10. MikeNV profile image77
    MikeNVposted 5 years ago

    Gates had the misfortune of coming from an affluent family so he could "play around" and do whatever he wanted while he figured out what that was.

    His real strength (Unlike Jobs) was not innovation, rather the ability to recognize technology with promise, buy it and distribute it.

    All of Gates products came from ideas which were already on the Table.  Sure Jobs took technology from Xerox, but he was also an innovator.

    Marx?  I could care less about him and his ideology.

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Does 'his ideology' carry any weight of truth and reality? ...Why is there poverty? Why are there slums in the world?

      I am not a Marxist.  ~Karl Marx

      However...good to know that you could care less...

  11. aware profile image71
    awareposted 5 years ago

    likes mikes post . articulate and i think accurate.

  12. aware profile image71
    awareposted 5 years ago

    You can prompt people to give. You can make it so that  people  have to give.
    For some giving is a Job.
    Thank god Gates is still alive.
    He does  not  need his purse string tugged to drop a Bill.

  13. Hollie Thomas profile image59
    Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago

    Karl Marx offered an analysis of society/power/class. It's not his fault that a bunch of barmys turned his theories into theater. Bill Gates used his technical knowledge and his instincts as to how society would evolve and what they would want. However, both of them recognized that wealth could be shared.

  14. 0
    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago

    A spider conducts operations that resemble those of a weaver, and a bee puts to shame many an architect in the construction of her cells. But what distinguishes the worst architect from the best of bees is this, that the architect raises his structure in imagination before he erects it in reality.

    ~Karl Marx


    ...Who imagined the existence of Money?...What was his intention?


    Capital is dead labor, which, vampire-like, lives only by sucking living labor, and lives the more, the more labor it sucks.  ~Karl Marx

  15. 0
    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago

    Sell a man a fish, he eats for a day, teach a man how to fish, you ruin a wonderful business opportunity.

    ~Karl Marx

    1. Hollie Thomas profile image59
      Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Do you watch Max Keiser? Before dismissing this question, ask yourself, are we being taught to fish?

      1. 0
        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        We are being taught to produce the fishing-rod, so someone else can fish himself, and sell us the fish.

        1. couturepopcafe profile image60
          couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          lol  ...but true.

    2. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Phenom - I'm not sure...are you in agreement or against Marxist theory?

  16. 0
    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago

    The writer must earn money in order to be able to live and to write, but he must by no means live and write for the purpose of making money.

    ~Karl Marx

    http://s1.hubimg.com/u/5764464_f248.jpg

    1. EmpressFelicity profile image84
      EmpressFelicityposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Sometimes I actually find it quite empowering to think that somebody wants to pay money for stuff I write.

      "No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money." - Samuel Johnson

      1. 0
        PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        What kind of stuff will be like that?  ...Samuel Johnson is an immortal writer, and I will not say a word on such an honorable man. He is far yet superior to a man like Karl Marx.

      2. uncorrectedvision profile image60
        uncorrectedvisionposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Of the two I would rather read Samuel Johnson.

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          ... such an honorable man was he...

  17. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    I think it would be better to compare Marx vs Marx, especially when considering economics...


    Capital is dead labor, which, vampire-like, lives only by sucking living labor, and lives the more, the more labor it sucks.
    Karl Marx


    Dont ever underestimate the importance of money. I know its often been said that money wont make you happy and this is undeniably true, but everything else being equal, its a lovely thing to have around the house.
    Groucho Marx -

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I don't think Marx ever said that he was immune to correction. His ideas of a bloody revolution is pathetic. No good end comes by evil means. He failed to provide a good solution to replace capitalism. Considering the Nordic countries, one wonders if Marx is too old?

      But the problem he pointed out was indeed a very serious problem that everyone overlooked, and made over their heads. We need to find the solution ourselves - for poverty, inequality, and a culture prevailed by Billionaires and Slums.

      1. yellowstone8750 profile image61
        yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

        The issues/problems he discussed are still relevant. What does your comment about the Nordic countires mean?

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Thanks for this question!

          -I feel we all want Employment, and the Well-Being of the People. If you consider the Nordic Countries in these two directions, you will find that they are doing pretty good at these two.

          These countries are industrialized, they have high tax-rates, but they have the world's highest level of income equality. Unemployment rate is relatively low. And governments offer socio-economic protection for everyone. And they surely don't have a culture prevailed by Billionaires and Slums.

          There is much difference between United States and the Nordic Countries.


          Did Karl Marx ever imagine such Capitalist States like these ones? His solution to replace capitalism gave us countries like Cuba, China and Venezuela.

    2. Jeff Berndt profile image89
      Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      +1

  18. Charles James profile image85
    Charles Jamesposted 5 years ago

    Marx stayed poor trying to help others.
    Gates got rich helping himself.

    Which has the more lasting legacy? - Too soon to call.

    1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
      Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Gates has helped you in so many ways it's astonishing that you would say he's done nothing.

      Newsflash: that thing you're typing with wouldn't be nearly as powerful or popular without him -- even if you're using an Apple.

    2. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Marx was somewhat delusional and his ideas about rearranging the working class status was so inherently flawed.  There (unfortunately) can never and likely will never be total economic or social equality.

      Marx admittedly may have thought he was helping others.  He was just another rebellious thinker.  Not that there's anything wrong with that, but his theory could never work.

      Gates was a genius who just happened to be in the right place at the right time.  Jealous?

      1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
        prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        That's why he is an idealist.

      2. John Holden profile image61
        John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        A genius! How do you make that out?

  19. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    Bill Gates made his money by being an innovator and entrepreneur

    Karl Mark lived by sucking Engel's teet

    1. Hollie Thomas profile image59
      Hollie Thomasposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Correction, that was Engel's partner Mary.

    2. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      When was Bill Gates an innovator?

      1. Evan G Rogers profile image83
        Evan G Rogersposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You've proven yourself ignorant with this comment. I'm done trying to appease your trolling.

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Can you tell me what Gates invented? You are such a rascal...

        2. John Holden profile image61
          John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          So when was Bill Gates an innovator? He invented nothing, just rode on the coat tails of another and made a pretty ropey product into the bargain.

          1. couturepopcafe profile image60
            couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            So you believe his partners at the time were the geniuses and Gates had no input?

            1. John Holden profile image61
              John Holdenposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              No, I don't claim anything of the sort.
              The genius was Alan Turing. All gates did was to take his work and ideas and make money out of them.

  20. Druid Dude profile image61
    Druid Dudeposted 5 years ago

    The difference between a computer wiz and a man barely out of the stone age? Microsoft

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      What about Apple, Oranges, Mango Corporations?

  21. 0
    Home Girlposted 5 years ago

    Karl Marx is dead. If you are not going to take his ideas seriously - you'll be okay.

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Jesus Christ or Gautama Buddha is dead.  If you are not going to take their ideas seriously - you'll be okay.

      1. couturepopcafe profile image60
        couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        First thing you've said I can fully agree with.  That's not to say any of those men did not have great ideas but we may have come to their philosophical conclusions on our own.

  22. couturepopcafe profile image60
    couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago

    Marx believed that those who held the dominant discourse in society determined what was real.  He believed that the 'rich' factory bosses created the realities of the proletariat, whom he saw as 'cattle', unable to control or have a say in their own reality. 

    The flaw in his thinking was that by redistributing manufacturing hierarchies (which was his pet peeve) he was simply allowing another group of people, in this case the poor worker, to create a reality for another class of people who would in turn rise up to do the same thing.

    Marxism, is essence, would have been a vicious circle of strivers getting nowhere because there would always be someone to complain for, to create a new reality for, an oppressed group.  What he failed to realize was that there must be working class heirarchies or the job won't get done.  Extremely anti-capitalist.

    Gates, on the other hand, is simply a self made man who deservedly got rich, filthy rich.  He is a capitalist of the highest order.  He is no longer the richest man because he gives away so much money.  Don't know much else about him (until someone rewrites history wrongly.)

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      I am sure Marx's solution to replace capitalism was wrong and flawed. Do you have one? Why not share that solution?

      1. couturepopcafe profile image60
        couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        The only solution (which works only in theory and likely to never work in reality) is laid out in my hub titled "New Government Plan".  Summarily, each citizen of a zone is given what he needs to survive and must work to support the community.  There is no 'big' government ruling all the land.  The hub is a bit lengthy, and as I said, not likely to ever work because the flaws lay with humans themselves.

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Thanks couturepopcafe, will go through that hub. What you say is quite like what the 'welfare-states' of Nordic countries are doing. They don't have big governments; they take a bit higher amount of tax from the people - but provide socio-economic security for everyone, with that money.

          They provide-  Free education, free health-care, free elderly-care, economic support for the unemployed and those who are suffering economically.

          ...that's a lot?

  23. ahorseback profile image46
    ahorsebackposted 5 years ago

    Karl Marx , put people to work on a farm,  Bill Gates , Steve Jobs .........employed a few thousand people in America, and millions of jobs in China  and Japan.......Oh yea ,thier my heros......?!?!

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      The solution was wrong...was the problem correctly pointed out?

    2. couturepopcafe profile image60
      couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Marx didn't put anybody to work.  He just complained about the arrangement of the worker.

  24. prettydarkhorse profile image62
    prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago

    Marx is an idealist theorizing about economic system as he sees it.

    Gates is a businesman and an innovative man.

    Different times.

    Better if Adam Smith vs Karl Marx in terms of pol. econ. theories

    1. yellowstone8750 profile image61
      yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      good commparison

      1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
        prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Adam Smith is the one that comes to my mind and they almost lived at the same time.

        1. yellowstone8750 profile image61
          yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Smith said that labor must be treated decently or they would revolt. This is an aspect overlooked in 2011 by the 'bigggies'.

          1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
            Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            +1

          2. prettydarkhorse profile image62
            prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            That is precisely true.

          3. couturepopcafe profile image60
            couturepopcafeposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Is it an aspect overlooked by the biggies of today or an option overlooked by the potential revolters?

            1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
              Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              It's not overlooked by the potential revolters.

              The various tools at the WTO demonstrations have acted very badly, and some of the folks at OWS haven't exactly kept to the standard of nonviolence that the group tries to uphold. The thing is, even the most radical of the thinking OWS folks don't want an actual revolt. As a rule, revolts are, well, revolting. We might get something akin to a second American Revolution, but we're much more likely to get something akin to a second French Revolution or Russian Revolution or something even more horrible.

              What we ought to be striving for is something akin to a second New Deal: something that:

              includes a bunch of neat-o ideas that I'm not going to post here for free. I'm going to write an article about it. If you wanna know what I think (and you know you do: my fans will want to see it, and share it with all their friends, and tell me where my ideas need to be improved, while my detractors will want to see it, poke holes in my ideas, and point and laugh derisively lol) you'll have to read the article when I post it. Soon.

              1. Charles James profile image85
                Charles Jamesposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                I love your dry humour.

                In the words of George W  "bring it on!"

                1. Jeff Berndt profile image89
                  Jeff Berndtposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  It's up. No links allowed, but it's called "Putting OWS to Work."

    2. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      What about the capitalism of sockpuppeting prettydarkhorse? Do they earn money by sockpuppeting??

      http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/86701

      1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
        prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        If you are a sockpuppet then you should know it. I am not a sockpuppet so I don't know.

        Just like Frogdropping said in that forum to you

        "You managed to derail your own dead dog OP.

        I think that might be a first".

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          She did not intend me; I mean, ask her, she pointed that I made someone confess something...what about hearing this?---



          prettydarkhorse posted 5 days ago

          "I don't know the reasons to be honest, but there are precisely reasons ranging from mundane to simple reasons. I can just speculate but I am not sure.

          If you feel that they did something wrong, or you suspect somebody is a sockpuppet and they are being a bully, report them to HP admins, they will look into it. I don't think HP allow sockpuppets. Once they know you are a sockpuppet, you can't post anymore I think. They check it with IP addresses."

          1. 0
            PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            The forum post link, to see the confession- http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/86701

          2. prettydarkhorse profile image62
            prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            Tanmoy, please settle your problem with Evolution Guy.

            You managed to delete your original account Andria Frogdropping meant to say that.

            1. 0
              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              Who the hell is this 'Tanmoy'?

              1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
                prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                The HP staff and you know that Tanmoy Acharya and Phenom Writer are one and the same. You said so in your profile before you deleted that profile

                http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/85441

                1. 0
                  PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  Tanmoy Acharya posted 3 weeks ago in reply to this

                  I JUST READ HIS PROFILE (Evolution Guy): HE SAYS, I QUOTE, 

                  Lenin and all the other great evolutionists and finally got my degree awarded to me in Las Vegas at the Hotel California reception by Elvis Presley in 2005. The real Elvis - not some fake impersonator.

                  WHY ARE YOU DEFENDING HIM, prettydarkhorse? HOW DO YOU KNOW HE HAS WORKED BOTH IN MICROSOFT, AND FOR APPLE, AND WAS STEVE JOBS RIGHT-HAND?


                  I HAVE GONE THROUGH YOUR OWN PROFILE, prettydarkhorse, AND YOU SAY, I QUOTE: "conducted social researches. I have a Masters degree in Demography". THAT SOUNDS A LOT LIKE Evolution Guy.


                  YOU CAN POST WITH YOUR 2, OR MORE ALIASES, IT'S NOT IMPOSSIBLE. YOU ONLY NEED 2, OR MORE SIM CARDS.

                  PLEASE SAY YOU ARE NOT EVOLUTION GUY. IF YOU ARE, THEN SOMEONE, NAMED GOD, MAY BE WATCHING YOU.






                  ...Very interesting forum post. This man Tanmoy is saying that you used to control a sockpuppet, prettydarkhorse, called Evolution Guy. What about that?

                  1. 0
                    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this
                  2. 0
                    PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    prettydarkhorse posted 3 weeks ago

                    Hi Tanmoy Acharya. Is this your real name? I remember a friend from India with that surname, Dr Acharya.

                    I think that Evolution Guy is just being honest and expressing his feelings. Read his profile so that you can understand him better. Evolution Guy owns half of the Internet BTW.


                    prettydarkhorse posted 3 weeks ago

                    Tanmoy, stop whining over it, enjoy your weekend.

                    BTW, Evolution Guy is a well known adviser of  Steve Jobs and he is greater than G, Microsoft plus Apple combined.


                    @Izzy, he is a very interesting evo guy.




                    ...How did you know so much about Evolution Guy, prettydarkhorse?

  25. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    http://www.gtfo.ro/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/santa.jpg

    1. EmpressFelicity profile image84
      EmpressFelicityposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      lol lol lol

    2. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      This thought is good - I only wish you are not one such kid who will complain when his house, or job, or dignity of life - is taken away by a bunch of bullies. I imagine you are such a non-violent person to swallow your grief into psychosis.

      1. Greek One profile image80
        Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        Merry Christmas to you too!

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I am not a follower of any religion. Sorry sad

          lol

          1. Greek One profile image80
            Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            .. then an early happy new year!

            1. 0
              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              From Merry Christmas to 'early happy new year!', within seconds? You change your fests too early roll

              1. Greek One profile image80
                Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                what about a vague 'season's greetings' then?

                1. 0
                  PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                  The point is - Can we make our fests, or they just come?

                  1. Greek One profile image80
                    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

                    you should be free to do whatever you want, as long as you don't prevent others from doing the same smile

    3. yellowstone8750 profile image61
      yellowstone8750posted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Cool.

  26. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    I also thought these two were fun too...

    http://www.thepeoplescube.com/images/Stalin_Marx_Portrait.gif

    http://pleated-jeans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/karl-marx-yo-mama.jpg

    1. uncorrectedvision profile image60
      uncorrectedvisionposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Marx smack talk - hilarious.

    2. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      i heard once that pigs can smell other pigs...

      1. Greek One profile image80
        Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You read Animal Farm?

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          I heard it was a very subconsciously 'civilized' Novel.

  27. mel22 profile image61
    mel22posted 5 years ago

    Them damn Apple executives. Every last one better give all their wealth away.. They sold me a computer and actually put a price tag on it? Damn them.. Damn them all to Hell!( best Charleton Heston Voice possible) And then when i bought my third apple I phone ( you know the one without the S) they charged me for that! Damn then Again.. those rotten thieves. If you don't give half your salaries away I will be sooooOO(Looney Tunes headshake)Angry! And then when I bought the next pohone(the one with the S added) They made it locked...Damn then for monopolizing my service provider. To Hades with you and your money too. How dare you make money on products by charging me for something I want and am willing to pay for thee times over( not including the one with the S) Everything should be free!(Sarcasm intended)

    Oh wait.. I don't own an iPhone... It must have been a siocialist nightmare I was having !Whew!

    1. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      It's nice that you completely understood what's going on here in this forum post. You have a very sharp intellect. Thanks for your well-considered thoughts.

  28. prettydarkhorse profile image62
    prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago

    Tanmoy, majority of people here knows who Evolution Guy is, he is a guy.

    Evolution Guy and me are not one and the same. Period. I told you that already.

    1. Greek One profile image80
      Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      come to think of it, i have never seen you and Evolution Guy in a room at the same time!

      tongue

      1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
        prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        LOL

        1. 0
          Home Girlposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          Put back your picture on avatar so everybody knows you are not a guy big_smile
          On the second thought, who can possibly trust a picture?

          1. Greek One profile image80
            Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            you're right.. better be a full body nude shot just to be sure

            1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
              prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              LOL!! Surely not those funny pics of Gadhaffi, is the spelling right?

          2. prettydarkhorse profile image62
            prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            after Thanksgiving, I will put back my pic

    2. 0
      PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Stop calling me Tanmoy. sad

      1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
        prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        You are Tanmoy Acharya, when I first read your profile which you deleted you said that you have other profile - Phenom Writer, you know that and you can't fool yourself.

        1. 0
          PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          "you can't fool yourself"

          DROP THOSE WORDS prettydarkhorse, RIGHT NOW

          1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
            prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

            I did read your profile - the one you deleted and it said exactly what I said.

            1. 0
              PhenomWriterposted 5 years ago in reply to this

              drop those words, otherwise there will be consequences

  29. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    New theory....

    prettydarkhorse IS PhenomWriter

    1. prettydarkhorse profile image62
      prettydarkhorseposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      LOL

  30. Greek One profile image80
    Greek Oneposted 5 years ago

    ..and I am HomeGirl

    1. 0
      Home Girlposted 5 years ago in reply to this

      Wait-a-minute, who then am I? or I am?
      Drop whatever you are thinking right now Greek One, or there will be consequences! Don't even think at all!! http://www.pic4ever.com/images/vahidrk1.gif

      1. Greek One profile image80
        Greek Oneposted 5 years ago in reply to this

        i love it when i'm feisty!

        1. 0
          Home Girlposted 5 years ago in reply to this

          We'll see about that...

          http://s2.hubimg.com/u/5776417_f248.jpg

          Returnng to Karl Marx...

 
working