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Why is it called class warfare?

  1. mio cid profile image66
    mio cidposted 4 years ago

    I, being a political junkie listen regularly to the right wing nut talkin heads, and it is really amazing to me that any mention of the subsidies, tax breaks,loopholes that benefit the rich is immediately labeled as "Class warfare" And makes them start weeping and crying because of the unfairness of the attack on the people who make our country great, the few, the proud, the ultra rich.Meanwhile any attempt to limit or diminish any kind of benefit that is directed to the poor, the working man or the disabled is met with a standing O on their part and seen as fiscal responsibility.Isn't that strange?

    1. Repairguy47 profile image61
      Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      You just explained class warfare and seem to be completely unaware of it. You have learned your lessons well, you just don't know why. Perfect liberal.

      1. Cagsil profile image78
        Cagsilposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        lol

    2. 0
      Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It's a framing issue.  The right knows it cannot defend such policies directly, so they talk in other terms, such as "class warfare" and "job creators."  That way, when a liberal tries to argue against subsidies to an oil company, or giant tax breaks for billionaires, they immediately are engaged in "class warfare" and going after the "job creators." 

      Most people are in favor of raising taxes on the rich, and also ending subsidies to oil companies.  The right completely ignores them, and the left gives them lip service.

      1. Repairguy47 profile image61
        Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Oil companies do not get subsidies they get the same tax breaks as all other businesses get. The bottom 50% of wage earners get subsidized.
        http://ntu.org/tax-basics/who-pays-income-taxes.html

        1. mio cid profile image66
          mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          As they should be.

          1. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Why should they be subsidized? Here is a unique idea, instead of crying because you have nothing try and get something. I don't believe financial equality is a constitutional right.

            1. mio cid profile image66
              mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              you are a perfect example of  what's wrong with the republican party you think it.s perfectly fine to give tax breaks for the wealthy but it'sterribly wrong to help the  needy.

              1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                The bottom 50% are not all needy! Whats wrong is that people like you don't seem to understand that it isn't my responsibility to support others. We should be seeking ways to create jobs for people instead of punishing those who have because it makes your kind feel good. Punitive taxes on the producers result in less production.

            2. Hollie Thomas profile image59
              Hollie Thomasposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Who said Mio Cid had nothing? I know this might be an alien concept to you, Repariguy, but some of us are bright enough to recognise that are many factors which might make an individual poor. And those of us that are fortunate enough to make ends meet and not have to worry about where the next meal is coming from, can actually empathise with those who struggle. Otherwise known as compassion.

        2. mio cid profile image66
          mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Are you going to cry for the earl companies? Let me whip out the world's smallest violin for you and the earl companies.

        3. 0
          Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          LOL.  Using some kind of right wing source that makes ridiculous assertions helps you not one iota.

          Here, from the WALL-STREET JOURNAL, owned by the same man who owns Fox News.  http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 … 54412.html

          "The bill would have affected subsidies paid to BP BP -1.20% PLC, Exxon Mobil Corp., XOM +0.02% Royal Dutch Shell RDSB.LN +0.89% PLC, Chevron Corp. CVX +0.01% and ConocoPhillips COP -0.01% ."

          The Board of Directors for this National Taxpayers Union has some interesting characters on it:   David Stanley, Steve Forbes, J. Kenneth Blackwell, and J. Patrick Rooney. 

          Grover Norquist, the man who has made tax cutting into a religion, was the director of the organization until Reagan pulled him away to head "Americans for Tax Reform."

          1. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Sorry if my source bothers you, the truth usually drives you libs up the wall.

            1. JSChams profile image60
              JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Don't you love how you are only supposed to listen to who they listen to?

              1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I love it I truly do.

            2. 0
              Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              No response to my argument.

    3. Will Apse profile image90
      Will Apseposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      The rich are entirely aware of where their interests lie and pursue them vigorously. Most of the population think interests are stuff like TV sport, crocheting or porn.

    4. JSChams profile image60
      JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Here's why. It really should be called class envy warfare.

      See that guy over there? he's got more than you do. Now doesn't that just eat you up? Is that fair? Doesn't matter how or why he got it it just isn'r right now is it? You know what? i think we should just take it from him. That's it just take it all away and then give it to everyone else.

      Now what we will do when the rich are the poor and the poor are the rich is anyone's guess right?

      1. 0
        Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        See that guy over there?  He lives like a king.  See his workers who make him rich?  They are paid just enough to survive, with a little bit of luxury to keep them quiet.

        Also, see that kid who only gets one or two meals a day, and one of those is from the public school system.  See that kid who grows up in a poor environment, and whose teachers don't care about him.  They just want to pass him through the system. 

        If wanting to eat and be free from continual financial stress is class envy, then yeah most people, especially in places like the Congo, are very much involved in class envy.

        1. JSChams profile image60
          JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          As I think I have said before....I live in America but if I have a way of making a living that;s good and I do well I am an evil evil man.
          All that crap you just spouted of course happens in every situation does it not. That would mean from the corporate LEFT as well as the corporate right.
          And here come the starving in the Congo.
          Are you old enough to remember Live Aid?

          It is a weapon made to cause class envy. But only against the right. Have we ever noticed that. It makes it so you say squat in a basket about Warren Buffet or GE but scream about all else. Grow up and get over yourself.

          1. 0
            Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh I seem to have struck a nerve.  Good.  Nerves need to be struck.

            Two other points.  First of all, using personal attacks and telling me to grow up does nothing but make you look petty.

            Second of all, what I said applies to GE and Warren Buffet.  But Warren Buffet has openly said his taxes should be raised.  Has the CEO of Wal-Mart or ExxonMobil said such a thing?  No.  They want their taxes cut.

            1. JSChams profile image60
              JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              He says his taxes that he won't pay should be raised. That means they will be raised but he will continue to not pay them but you applaud him for wanting them raised.

              Do you not see a problem there?

    5. Josak profile image59
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      It's not class warfare it's simply class awareness, we all know that the vast majority of the wealth of our country is concentrated on some very rich individuals, and they and their lackeys will do anything to tell us that they deserve that money but we all know that the majority of them are not self made men they are products of inheritance and those who are self made are usually products of amazing luck, so due to the fortune of their birth or more rarely because they got lucky they live in wealth and luxury beyond imagining while just a few miles away from them people struggle to feed and clothe their kids while people lose their homes because of the economic crisis they had no hand in creating and yet those who did continue to live in luxury and yet when Bill Gates has more than 20 houses it is madness and warfare to suggest that some of them should be used to house the homeless instead of simply holding some of his wealth, when the rich entertain themselves with collections of Ferrari, Porsche and Jaguar sports cars in fleets it's crazy to suggest that maybe it's more important that our people can eat than that you have a different car for every day of the month? The only madness is to suggest otherwise, of course the Buffet Tax does not go nearly far enough.

      1. Repairguy47 profile image61
        Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        They do deserve their own money and you don't! Makes no difference how they got it it is theirs and not yours.

        1. John Holden profile image61
          John Holdenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          What, even if they got it by theft!

          1. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Obviously not if you can prove theft. So, can you?

            1. Josak profile image59
              Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Well what I get out of this is that obviously it does matter how they got it, you just think the methods they got it are OK and I don't, just like we both agree that it matters if they got it by theft. Not speaking for John here he might well have a different interpretation.

              1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                If they got it legally then I approve.

                1. Josak profile image59
                  Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Even if you thought the law was wrong? Even if say they made their money through a legal slave trade or by selling arms to people intent on genocide as long as it's legal it's fine with you?

                  1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                    Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I would be depending on your word that it happened, do you have any proof their money was gained through illegal means?

        2. Hollie Thomas profile image59
          Hollie Thomasposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The rest of us do deserve our own money and you don't. Makes no difference how we got it, it's ours and no yours.

          1. JSChams profile image60
            JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Here's the way it's supposed to be:

            1. It's our money, not theirs.

            2. They work for us not the other way round.

            Glad Barney Frank is leaving because he had no concept of either of those realities.

          2. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I'm not asking for yours, see the difference? Doubt you do.

            1. Hollie Thomas profile image59
              Hollie Thomasposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I know you're not. Think austerity measures, see the difference? Doubt you do.

        3. jandee profile image45
          jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I am pretty sure it is not their own money and even if it is I think it makes a considerable difference how they got it, I think we should know just how they got it ! Also our money is obviously ours so why say we don't deserve it ?????????????

          1. John Holden profile image61
            John Holdenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            But the whole capitalist system is based on the idea that all money belongs to the heads and everybody else has just stolen it off them!

      2. 60
        Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Josak,
        Who are you to decide what Bill and Melinda Gates do with their money?  I'm no fan of either of them but they donate more each year to charity then most people in this world.  Who decides what portion of their income is "enough"?  Is it the government?  Well that's subjective.  Who decides what portion of your income is enough?  You're walking a fine line.  Forcably taking the fruits of one's labor to benefit another is the definition of slavery.

        1. Josak profile image59
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          The people decide how much of my money is enough, through their vote and by taxation and I gladly give it, and I would never want a tax or redistribution program instituted that did not have democratic support from the people. Of course the Buffet tax has about 73% support. So my reply is the people decide now and the people will decide in the future, I firmly believe in democracy, I also firmly believe in redistribution and I hope one day so will most people as they have in many other countries.

          1. 60
            Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            So you believe in taking what does not belong to you and what you didn't earn.  But if the people decide not to take any money to redistribute you'd be ok with that too?

            1. Josak profile image59
              Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              It's a matter of opinion, I have an opinion and a right to vote within a democracy so I believe that redistribution is a just an economically sound policy, I base than on my economic knowledge and on studying places where this was done so I would vote for that and I hope others would too, the fact that others have not yet is of course disappointing, most people would like their views to receive a favorable vote but I would not take up arms to make it happen or anything unless the majority of people believed in it. Personally I wouldn't be getting any money, they would be taking some of mine and I don't believe that people in our current system really earn what they have.

              1. 60
                Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Well Josak, as someone with economics degrees as well as other's, I know from experience as does the rest of the world Keynesian economic policies do not work.  Neither do Marx's or Engle's theories in the long run without forced participation.  Even then they are not sustainable.  The central flaw with your postion is the government is better at making decisions than the citizens.  That is not always true.  Name me one place where these policies actually work in the long-term without forced participation and without an overall reduction on productivity.

                To live your dream of wealth redistribution, you don't need government intervention.  No one is stopping you from donating 100% of your income and assets to charity.  No one is stopping you from finding a small commune or kubbutz and living there but you don't. 

                On a personal note, it's funny people need to attempt to validate themselves by constantly giving people their resume.  Notice I didn't flaunt my education even though I am highly educated.  Most people who do this are insecure and need to justify themselves with a qualification in an attempt to make themselves feel superior to others.  I based my position on fact.  The mere attainment of a degree does not in itself demonstrate learning.  There are plenty of highly educated people in this world that lack common sense.  It is the application of what you learn in the real world that demonstrates knowledge.

                1. John Holden profile image61
                  John Holdenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  But Keynesian policies do work. Look at the countries that were the quickest to recover from WWII, all done on Keynesian policies.

                  Charity fails miserably as a means of either wealth redistribution or even as a means of providing aid. Apart from anything else it humiliates the recipient.

                  I'm as thick as two short planks, no degrees in anything, so there!

                  1. WD Curry 111 profile image59
                    WD Curry 111posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Quick recovery? We paid for it. You are welcome.

                    You talk macro systems and charity. I talk community development. If you don't know the difference, I will be glad to teach you. There are rich people who support organized efforts, not hand outs. They help poor folks like me get the job done. I need them and so do you.

                    http://www.commonwealthinc.org/ACTION%20logo.jpg

                    You are wasting time and energy. Wake up and get it right!

                2. jandee profile image45
                  jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Are you 'aving a larf   ?  ? Your intro is all about your economics degree(S) and others .. I see you are highly educated ---even though you didn't flaunt it !
                  Not half..............

                  1. 60
                    Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    I only brought up my education in response to Josak trying to use his as a reason to hold himself out there some sort of economic expert.  Otherwise, I wouldn't have brought it up.  I'm not sure who or what "aving a larf is.  I'm new to Hubpages.  All I'm trying to do point out the flaws in Jasak's arguments.

                3. Josak profile image59
                  Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Julianne, My intention was never to brag about my education, it's just it was implied I was uneducated by one of your right wing friends who was being very rude at the time (he later turned out to be all right guy) I felt it was an accusation I should defend because it was relevant to the topic.

                  I hardly think it's surprising we disagree, of course I can provide you with examples of functioning Keynesian and Socialist thought I would invite you to look at Norway, Finland and Switzerland and their social democratic movement, more controversially I could telly you to have a look a the economic success of Venezuela, Cuba and more recently Argentina. I am also wondering what evidence you have of the reverse that free market capitalism gets results, would you like to go with the US example with the collapsing economy rampant unemployment and exponentially rising poverty rate or the Hong Kong example with the massive poverty rate, wholly inadequate wages for survival and it's flocks of people attempting to leave it to go back to mainland China?

                  I would remind you of the difference between Socialism and Marxism but I know I would be wasting my breath on you, suffice to say Socialist ideology was solidifying  about a hundred years before Marx was born.

                  1. 60
                    Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    You're not serious pointing to Venezuela, Cuba and Argentina as economic success stories are you?  Norway, Finland and Switzerland while they are more socialistic then the United States are also capitalistic enough to export their natural resources which is the main reason why their economies have not collapsed.

          2. JSChams profile image60
            JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            First off the Buffet rule was a joke because Buffet himself  didn't pay his taxes and I have no idea why anyone believes if you increase his tax rate taht will make him pay. He isn't going to pay because he does not believe he should have to. He believes the rest of us should but not him.

            Secondly why should I want everyone else deciding what I should make? Or rather keep?

            1. Josak profile image59
              Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Buffet has no real relation to the Buffet tax, again I am not a fan of Buffet, his actions don't really have any bearing on whether this tax is a good idea or not.

              Furthermore people already decide what you get to keep, it's called taxation, it is central to the idea of a Republic, this motion is about whether that tax should be raised for some people, I doubt you fit into the 1 million a year + bracket anyway.

              1. JSChams profile image60
                JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                That's not the same as what you were talking about. I know taxation. That and people getting to decide en masse who keeps what are two different things. Now you start to get into the people visiting your home to see what you have type of deal.

                1. Josak profile image59
                  Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  You were talking about the Buffet Rule, that is a tax, you said you opposed it because someone got to decide how much you keep, that is just what taxation does, redistribution is a different issue. Besides you do not fit into the 1 million + bracket.

    6. Onusonus profile image86
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      When the left comes out with slogans like "die yuppy scum", "Eat the rich", "no war but the class war", "They only call it class war when we fight back", etc,
      people tend to think that that's what it is.

      No class warfare here. LOL!
      http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQZQ1dITIIfqZrGUPE8WSMJOmtGTa0ZHsBG6sGRqglk6zOy9jsIRCGPVGDWHw

    7. odomirok2 profile image80
      odomirok2posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Was it like this in your country of origin, under a controlling power, by keeping the masses poor and uneducated. America was once all about building the perfect human race thru education and economics to keep up with the cold war race. Now America is about a controlling power breaking down the middle class. They call them republicans.

      1. mio cid profile image66
        mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        The right operates in the same way the world over, but my country today has a socialist  government elected by the people in free elections , it has been governing for two consecutive terms and I hope they keep governing well so they are reelected again but if they don't, they will lose the election and another party will be governing, as it should be.There is a song by Tabare Etcheverry  an Uruguayan  that says It wasn't the murderers it was us who let them die for being there so few of us. If the right is empowered it is our fault because we are not working politically hard enough to win elections.there are more of us than there are of them, but we don't vote in enough numbers.

        1. jandee profile image45
          jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes ! hesitation though when they hold all the cards ! Media and what goes with it.

  2. pagesvoice profile image85
    pagesvoiceposted 4 years ago

    Class warfare is what the elitist right has declared on the middle and poor classes. The class warfare has been orchestrated by the Koch brothers, who have harbored favor with the likes of Mitch McConnell, John Boehner, Eric Cantor, Chris Christie, Mitt Romney, Newt Gingrich, Paul Ryan and on and on the list of bought and sold politicians goes. Trickle down economics have accomplished one thing. The rich got richer and the rest of us were simply covered in a golden shower. That is the real class warfare being waged in this country.

    1. mio cid profile image66
      mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Are you implying they're peeing on your leg and telling you it's raining?

      1. pagesvoice profile image85
        pagesvoiceposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I sure am and that isn't all that is getting dumped on us either.

        1. Repairguy47 profile image61
          Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Obama has dumped a mountain of debt on you, does that bother you?

          1. Hollie Thomas profile image59
            Hollie Thomasposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Was that during 2008?

    2. 0
      Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Thank you Reagan.  You created a new religion that just won't die!

    3. lovemychris profile image79
      lovemychrisposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Robert Reich:
      "Supreme Court says corps are people, so will Wal-Mart get 10 yrs in prison for illegal bribes, and News Corp 25 yrs for illegal hacking?"

      1. Druid Dude profile image61
        Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I wouldn't give you odds on it.

      2. 0
        Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        LOL.  If the universe was just, then yes.

  3. Druid Dude profile image61
    Druid Dudeposted 4 years ago

    Because if the rich are going to be involved in warfare, it's got to be a classy war. If you don't have a jacket and tie...we've got one you can wear!

  4. lifelovemystery profile image89
    lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago

    I am fascinated with the concept of the left and their inability to carry on a conversation about facts.

    Obama's Income 2010: $6 million+
    Obama's Income 2011: Less than $1 million

    In order to get away with NOT PAYING TAXES, Obama (one percenter) sheltered his income.

    The left wants to attack the GOP, but fail to recognize that they have been played. Obama claims that he wants to tax the rich, but the fact is that would affect his income - so he is NOT GOING TO RAISE TAXES ON THE WEALTHY. 

    HE IS NOT GOING TO RAISE CORPORATE TAXES.

    HE IS NOT GOING TO CANCEL THE BUSH TAX CUTS.

    WHY? Because he benefits and so do his rich friends.

    Crony Capitalism. You gotta love it.

    1. 0
      Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      This just proves he wasn't really an economic liberal after all.  He is simply a social one (partially).  Americans are still being spied on; the wars abroad are still being waged; and like you pointed out, it doesn't seem likely the tax cuts for the rich will be repealed. 

      So vote for Obama in the hope that he may change, or for Romney who is already admitting to a tax plan similar to Dubyas.

      Screwed either way tongue.

      1. JSChams profile image60
        JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Anybody but Obama. I would vote for my cat first.

    2. JSChams profile image60
      JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Hee, hee! You got it! Amen brother!

    3. 60
      Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      That's because facts don't matter to the left.  It's feelings and intentions that matter to them.  It's easier for them to manipulate someone's feelings then actually deal with the root cause of a situation.  It's easier for them to tell the someone who is poor that it is because of the "evil rich" then it is to look at the actual reason behind that person's socioeconomic status.  It's all a fallacy, as long as they have their boogy man, they have power.  If they actually solved a problem, their power base disappears.

      1. Repairguy47 profile image61
        Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        This is a thinking person, too bad Josak will nullify this persons vote.

    4. Josak profile image59
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Oh as a leftist I realize Obama is far from great, he is a politician in our current screwed up political landscape what am I to expect? As a leftist I am happy to say screw Obama, unfortunately he is the lesser of two evils and we have no one better to vote for.

      1. Repairguy47 profile image61
        Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Then why don't you do all of the thinking Americans a favor and not vote?

        1. Josak profile image59
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Ah I love this the arrogance and ignorance displayed, just because I am a leftist I am obviously not a thinking American regardless of how many degrees I might have, regardless that I am qualified economist, regardless of how much time and study I might invest on a field and how many worldwide economic studies I might have conducted on the success and failures of left vs right political position, you are a thinking American and I am not because I am a leftist... big_smile tongue

          1. Repairguy47 profile image61
            Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Well, yeah. You are voting for one because you think he is the lesser of two evils. What study of Romney as President has led you to believe he would be the greater of two evils? Did you vote for Obama in 2008? What history as a 1/2 term statesman led you to believe he was even remotely qualified to be President? Me thinks you went with your heart.

            1. Josak profile image59
              Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Didn't vote for him, probably would have if i had been in the country, I don't give C*&# about Obama or Romney it's just O's economic plans are slightly closer to what I believe is best I think as people they are both useless talking heads designed to look pretty for the public.

              P.S. I presume you mean lesser of two evils, do you really agree entirely with Romney or is his viewpoint just closer to yours than Obama's?

              1. Repairguy47 profile image61
                Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Uhhuh.

                I see you added some, no I am not enamored by Romney, I am hoping for the chance to write myself in, all the studies I have done have proven that I am great.

                1. Josak profile image59
                  Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Informative answer tongue

                2. Josak profile image59
                  Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Hey even I think there have been worse candidates before. Careful though given how fractured the political climate is you might win.

        2. jandee profile image45
          jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          That is what we did in U.K and to our horror we got in the 'Tories'

      2. 0
        Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I live in Oklahoma so my vote doesn't matter anyway!

        1. Repairguy47 profile image61
          Repairguy47posted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Boomer Sooner roll

          1. 0
            Sooner28posted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Not with Landry tongue.

    5. lovemychris profile image79
      lovemychrisposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      You have proof Obama shelters his income?
      Because they have it for Romney....should be easy to get on Obama too.

      The Bush tax cuts will be ended...for the uber rich-- not the middle class.

      They want to end corporate tax loop-holes. So then they may actually PAY the tax they are supposd to. No need to raise them, just make them pay!

  5. maxoxam41 profile image80
    maxoxam41posted 4 years ago

    Since societies are stratified going from the elite, upper-class, middle class to the proletariat or more commonly called working class, each stratus having  different and antagonistic interests, class warfare is ineluctable. Class warfare, however is imposed by the upper stratus to the lowest, and can definitively be alleviated. Their pressure on congress, governments to dictate national policies are a perfect example of their absolute power. Taxation, their favorite tool. When the lowest structures are push to poverty, the upper one benefits of advantages inaccessible to other classes.

  6. lovemychris profile image79
    lovemychrisposted 4 years ago

    I believe that. Just as there is enough of eveything to go around,if it wasn't hoarded.
    Gotta keep the supply limited so the big boys and gals can profit from the "shortage". And control the lives of everyone on the planet.

    And as far as working for a living and an owner/ceo deserving the 583 times the amount of what an average worker makes.....

    Here's what bosses in my industry do:

    Hire a cleaner at $8.00 an hr.
    She/he is supposed to clean 10 rooms in 5 hrs. The rooms go from $80-$150.00, depending on the season.
    Say $80.00. So--for an $800.00 take in, the cleaner makes $40.00 keeping them clean.

    For this--they are supposed to be so eternally grateful, they can't say thank you enough.

  7. WD Curry 111 profile image59
    WD Curry 111posted 4 years ago

    See? This is the real problem. Full grown people sitting around getting their heads all "cised-up" by slanted newscasts and blathering about it on the internet as if that accomplishes something. Get out of the chair. The key? Start locally!

    You are in New Jersey, right?

    http://media.nj.com/design/baseline/img/logo_njo.gif
    http://www.nj.com/helpinghands/

    1. pagesvoice profile image85
      pagesvoiceposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Great advice WD Curry 111. smile

  8. pagesvoice profile image85
    pagesvoiceposted 4 years ago

    Unless you believe you are or are going to be a millionaire or you don't mind subsidizing the taxes of the ultra rich and you are still going to support these golden shower fanatics then let me remind you of Forest Gump when he said, "Stupid is as stupid does." Listening to the din of insane thinking is making a whole bunch of right wing zealots just a tad loony...(using a Palin phrase)...dontcha think? Now it is time to put on the (oops, again a Palin phrase) big boy pants and think with a clear head. The rich do not care about you or me or anyone else except the rich and the GOP is the party of the rich. If you live in a single or double wide trailer you are not one of them. Hello???

    1. WD Curry 111 profile image59
      WD Curry 111posted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I'm no Republican, but you can't lump people in a group like that. I know rich who care. When you deal in the absolute, inaccuracy is inevitable. It is called an unrealistic extreme.

      https://encrypted-tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQmjWUO73wRNYsu0SDY7yjZG5wM0Q_4KlhoL2JEq-YmRUBtCk1BO96_I5Q

    2. Onusonus profile image86
      Onusonusposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      "The rich do not care about you or me or anyone else except the rich"

      As if one inherently cares about others because they have less money? This is the farce in your logic. Poor people only care about themselves too, it's called motivated self interest.

      The government is not a charity organization. They are the one entity in America that is the least capable of balancing it's own check book. if you give the government more money they will only use it as a license to spend more money.

      See? It's the death of the dollar.
      http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_HChOeYner4c/S0VgXJzbmrI/AAAAAAAAA8s/yY8qTwf7icE/s400/entitlement+spending.jpg

  9. lovemychris profile image79
    lovemychrisposted 4 years ago

    Former candidate Jon Huntsman says Reagan couldn't win primary today, compares GOP to Chinese Communist Party http://thkpr.gs/IkdqyV

    1. Bob Zermop profile image88
      Bob Zermopposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Nice, thx for the link.

  10. jandee profile image45
    jandeeposted 4 years ago

    Hi Josak,

    nobody's perfect !!  All different reasons for abortions and none of them concern men-A Womans right to choose.

    Hunting !  Don't know where you live so can't comment !
    I did notice your comment a few days ago on gun carrying and sussed that you support it. If that had been unlawful maybe we would still have John Lennon writing good stuff,even more wonderful than that which we all know.  I wonder do you have the same belief in people carrying knives and stabbing each other  daily.

    Never heard any Socialist okay the carrying of fire-arms...

    People who abuse animals ,in my book, are the same as the fascists and I would consider the life of my dogs as important as mine and one of the worst aspects ,to me, of capitalism ,and certain Socialist countries,is the constant cruelty in terrible sadistic ways to dumb animals who cannot protect themselves in these so called 'clinics'of animal experimentation.

    Otherwise Josak I enjoyed your writing,

    1. 60
      Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Jandee,

      I think we found somethng we agree upon.  Animal experimentation is awful.  I don't think it is a symptom of capitalim, it is more a symptom of people who don't care about animals.  It disgusts me how some animals are treated.  We founded an animal rescue organization and are in the process of buying land to build an animal sanctuary.  Check out pawsanimalkingdom.org.  I started a hubpage for the organization a few days ago but have not had the time to start any hubs.  They will be coming though.

      1. jandee profile image45
        jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Hello Julieannes,
        Good luck with your land and protection of our friends.  I truly hope it goes well it is close to my heart.  If I can help in any way I would be pleased to do so,
        look forward to hearing from you,
        best regards from jandee.

        1. 60
          Julieannes Worldposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Jandee,

          Thank you.  We just put in an offer on a parcel of land today and are waiting to hear back from the sellers.  Keep your fingers crossed.

    2. Josak profile image59
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Hi Jandee on the first one I feel i can't comment my reasons are too personal, I freely admit I have been biased by my experience so I try to stay away from it all together.

      As for gun ownership well I cried when Lennon was shot but I also grew up under a dictatorship and learnt the value of the citizens ability to defend himself against people who have guns and are happy to use them in them. I grew up during this period: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirty_War and knowing my political leanings you can see why that might have had an impact on me so again I can freely say with no issue that I am biased by my personal experience.

      I also don't like people who abuse animals but animal rights has never been a cause I got involved in, always were too many people being abused to consider, I have no problem with people who are involved in that cause it's just human suffering has always moved me to action more than other things.

      1. jandee profile image45
        jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Hi Josak,
        just a few words,
        we should realise that we are animals too.
        Our life ,the majority of us,is dominated by school and work.   Then comes poverty  and war and the oppression of most of us.
        Factory farming as well as the laboratories are animal wars-----Solitary confinement and torture for animals are equally evil acts...........
        Until we treat animals with respect neither can we expect it from others as we are linked.
        When Capitalism is finished there will also need to be a change in the relationship of people and animal exploitation.
        It cannot be put aside for another day!     It is also part of the struggle against capitalism...

        1. Josak profile image59
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Fair enough that seems reasonable.

        2. mio cid profile image66
          mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Let's not forget my favorite  little animal the illegal alien which many times here in the US is treated worse than your household pet

          1. Josak profile image59
            Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh the illegal the favorite punching bag for the conservative movement, according to them illegals are responsible for poverty, the recession, crime, rape and the collapse of American values also god have mercy on you if they should happen to hear you speaking Spanish in public, I had a friend come to visit me form a Argentina a few years back and his English is very poor, we were in the supermarket waiting in line talking in Spanish and a woman came up to us and told us to learn English or go back to where we came from, the tragedy is it soured his opinion of a whole country full of mainly great people, it's amazing the damage ignorance and intolerance can do. Your right those people treat their dogs with more respect.

            1. John Holden profile image61
              John Holdenposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              A year or so ago I was in my local supermarket. One of the checkout operators was talking to another, from what I cold make out,about a birthday party. Both with broad Mancunian accents. The woman in front of me started off on the same tirade about how they should learn our language or go back where they came from!

              I had to say something, it's not repeatable here but I did get a very broad grin off the checkout operator.

              1. Bob Zermop profile image88
                Bob Zermopposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Kudos

              2. Josak profile image59
                Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                In a fair world they would give you a medal for stuff like that.

                "Above all, try always to be able to feel deeply any injustice committed against any person in any part of the world. It is the most beautiful quality of a man."

                I've always felt those are words to live by.

                1. jandee profile image45
                  jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Ho chi minh :          ' Until Women are free neither are men'

                  1. Josak profile image59
                    Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    No one is ever truly free while anyone is oppressed especially if it's half the population or more! Could not agree more, I always was a big admirer of Ho Chi Minh separate from his policies the man had so much serenity, courage and intelligence. I hope you did not take the "man" at the end of that comment to be sexist the man who made that quote was far from it.

              3. jandee profile image45
                jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Oh John! I'm blo...dy fuming ! Wish i'd been there..

          2. jandee profile image45
            jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Which reminds me of a 'superb'-I don't have hero's- person called
            Cesar Millan

      2. jandee profile image45
        jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        To the last paragraph that is exactly the way I feel about charities

  11. Hollie Thomas profile image59
    Hollie Thomasposted 4 years ago

    @Mio Cid,

    I was answering the above poster who appears, I say appears, to think that redistribution only occurs when wealth is passed from the richest to the poorest. I'm reluctant to refer to that as redistribution, because often that is just an attempt by a particular government to make the wealthiest pay their fair share. It's not redistribution, it's fairness. Unfortunately however, the current trend in Europe, and if the Republican party get their way, will be another form of redistribution, from the poorest to the wealthiest. Many from the right leaning persuasion refuse to recognise this form of redistribution.

    1. mio cid profile image66
      mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment , I was trying to point out to the loon righties that redistribution of wealth in the US IS NOTHING NEW IT HAS BEEN IN PLACE THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY'S HISTORY, and is a big part of what has made this country great.

    2. jandee profile image45
      jandeeposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Good one Hollie!

  12. Cagsil profile image78
    Cagsilposted 4 years ago

    I find this is getting to be a very old and very boring subject. So, I shall once again attempt to lay to rest the BS.

    (a) If there were no social classes, there would be no class warfare. Most likely find something else to complain about or just many may wake up to the fact that you should be able to adjust to your environment..thus adapt might become a realization.

    (b) The fact that this is a matter of discussion in the first place should show you how politicians use the status of the wealthiest to divide up America.

    (c) Class warfare is just a distraction method used to confuse people about other things and to take their minds off the actions of government. The fact that people are gullible enough to believe "class warfare" is not a surprise.

    (d) Redistribution of wealth- This is terminology spew that comes from politicians. It is suppose to benefit the people via a trickle down effect. However, this particular system isn't actually beneficial for citizens. It actually damages society, as a whole.

    (e) What politicians don't want you to know or realize is that you're being manipulated, which is why the education aspect of the budget fell through the floor, and why the military industrial complex continues to benefit. Government prefers it's citizens to live in fear of foreign threats, so the people will look to the government for answers. Answers, which will never come. The government cannot ensure 100% safety, EVER. Even at a tyrannical extreme point of view, it still couldn't ensure it. The dumbing down of society was implemented over a decade ago and continues today. Yet no one is holding the government responsible. Not to mention, every citizen living today has less rights as they once did.

    Class warfare? Just distortion.

  13. lifelovemystery profile image89
    lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago

    Blaming a single party is pointless. Democrats had the majority for YEARS. So, if wealth redistribution is so important, why didn't they get the work done?

    Because Wealthy Democrats Don't Want To Share The Wealth And Didn't Pass Legislation, But They Will Blame the GOP every time.

    1. Josak profile image59
      Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I don't think this is really a party issue, both sides share the blame for not doing what was necessary a long time ago it certainly seems the democrats are more likely to do it, though in my opinion they don't go nearly far enough.

      1. lifelovemystery profile image89
        lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        They had their chance. You will never see it happen because they lose out. People need to get off their duff, get a job, take care of themselves and stop looking for handouts.

        Obama managed to hide nearly $50K so that he wouldn't have to pay taxes on it in 2011. He can talk big and pretend the GOP is the enemy but the bottom line is that he's in it for himself and will use loopholes for is benefit.

        1. lovemychris profile image79
          lovemychrisposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          GOP is the enemy. Until you learn that, nothing will change.

          1. JSChams profile image60
            JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Oh well good, I'm not GOP just a conservative. So we aren't enemies. Cool.

            1. lifelovemystery profile image89
              lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Me neither. I'm an Independent and don't trust either party.

        2. JSChams profile image60
          JSChamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          No see look....he can do that. Any liberal can do anything like that they want to. These guys don't care It's justice to them not crime. Watch and notice.

        3. Josak profile image59
          Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Well I am not going to say you are wrong, I don't trust any of our current politicians and I think most of them are unfortunately in it for themselves, but I stand by the statement that the democrats have a much better chance of doing it so until I have a better option I will have to vote for them, certainly better than the GOP still very disappointing.

          1. lifelovemystery profile image89
            lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            The Dems HAD their chance. Did you notice that Redistribution was not their Mantra? Rich Democrats in Congress don't want to give up their wealth.

            If they did, wouldn't that be a story?

            The story is they are all greedy bastards and they all use loopholes.

            1. Josak profile image59
              Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Yeah I agree they are all bad, he is justly slightly better, trust me when I say it has never brought me joy to vote democrat even though I can never vote Republican and if I am going to vote for someone else I may as well just stay home.

              1. lifelovemystery profile image89
                lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Don't vote the party line just because that's what you have always done. Vote for the person that can repair our economy, help businesses gain confidence so they will start hiring again and investing in capital. Voting for a single party will not benefit anyone. As an Independent I carefully study the candidates, their voting history, ethics, and family. I encourage you to do the same.

                FYI DEMS VS GOP is nothing short of cage wrestling. At the end of the day it is political theater. We deserve better than that.

                1. mio cid profile image66
                  mio cidposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I as a hispanic voter and an illegal alien at heart, could not vote for a republican candidate if my life depended on it, and for the last few years have been working hard to make sure  any vote I can divert from the party of the xenophobes and the deporters is diverted.

                  1. Josak profile image59
                    Josakposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Illegal alien at heart tongue I like that, I agree even if I was a fiscal conservative I could never vote for the GOP their following is just too repugnant, the racists, the homophones and worst the religious nuts, case in point Santorum was a serious candidate in the GOP nomination, in most countries people like that are the guys on the corner yelling about the coming apocalypse who everyone does their best to avoid.

        4. grillrepair profile image89
          grillrepairposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          in the intro to "Discipline and Punish" there's this awful medieval capital punishment scene that emphasizes our evolution into a seemingly kinder gentler culture because we do not recognize this brutality that is the history of civilized culture.

          Please let me just say it is nice that we're complaining about the president hiding his own money to avoid a tax bracket and a decade-ish ago when the president was hiding illicit sex. 

          30-odd years ago the president was hiding personal gain by selling weapons to the countries training, hiding, supporting terrorists and killing Americans.  Today those weapons are still killing Americans. 

          I'm voting for the guy hiding sex or hiding his own income.   we know they're politicians but i prefer the guy hiding money to the guy whose going to put a gun in the hand of a terrorist.

          1. lifelovemystery profile image89
            lifelovemysteryposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            You prefer the guy (Obama) that doesn't want to pay taxes on his own income?

            This is the same guy that pretends that the GOP is an evil empire.

            Voters are suckers. Obama and the InJustice Department signed off on Fast and Furious.

            So do you prefer him hiding money or putting guns in the hands of terrorists?

 
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