Recent news is reporting that Romney bullied a gay student in high school, leading the charge to chase him down and cut off his hair. What does this say about the presidential candidate? Does it change your opinion of him?
If it's true it disgusts me and yes does change my opinion of him which was never very high.
Bullying is NOT a prank!
Over 13 million kids are terrorized every year in this country (from the movie, BULLY).
For Romney to suggest that he cannot remember the incident? If bullying is that insignificant to Romney, he has some serious character flaws, and if he can remember it (he probably does), it leads me to believe he thinks it was okay. If you listened to his interviews on this (go ahead and replay them, they are all over the web), he chuckled the whole time he spoke of the assault. The man has a very strange sense of humor and human decency.
Think about how he bullied his opponents in the primaries. Now he just does it with Super PACS and money, not scissors...
Back when he and a woman were running against each other for governor in MA, there was one debate when he made a really condescending (at best) remark to the woman (who had been in MA politics for quite awhile) that came across as his "reminding" her that her behavior was "unbecoming". It's hard to describe it in a way the would show the smug, condescending, attitude toward the woman; but he was clearly pleased with himself for "handling the situation" the way he did - all smooth, and smiley, and condescending as he presumed to be in a position to tell another adult what was or wasn't "becoming behavior".
Why do I find this so easy to not only believe, but visualize him doing it?
He was a bully in high school, a bully when decimating companies at Bain, a bully when he strapped his dog to a roof, and he is a bully now!
I'm a big benefit-of-doubt giver when I'm not entirely sure about someone; or when they do a little thing here or there. I know what it's like to have people either twist what we've done, or else exaggerate, or else just imagine some motive that isn't there. So, anyway, I've been really reluctant to do more than notice some "alarm bells" that have gone off with this individual My close friend has felt the same about Romney, Tonight when it he showed up and I mentioned the bullying thing, he jumped right in and said he'd heard about it on the news. He said, "That's it. It's done." While I've been saying I haven't been sure I could ever vote for Romney, my friend has been planning to. I asked him, "..you mean you won't vote for him?" He said that's what he meant. He rattled off all kinds of "misdeeds" all kinds of political figures have done, and he said, "I don't care about any of those when it comes down to it. This is something else."
It just kind of ties all those "vibes" from before together, and confirms what others have been saying but what I've been reluctant to believe with my "benefit-of-doubt-for-now" thinking.
I agree. IF this is true, it fits in with a bunch of other stories about him (and numerous public statements he's made) that suggests he has a serious lack of empathy. And IF that's true, that doesn't make him a promising choice to lead the country at a time when so many citizens are hurting.
I'm not necessarily looking for a Hugger-in-Chief like Clinton, but empathy should inform policy, and if you have none, then you can do a lot of damage to a lot of people very quickly.
He is more than a bully - he is a sociopath because he minimizes errors he makes and then acts like a pit bull on crack whenever somebody shows him up. When that reporter corrected his lie about not having any lobbyists in his campaign team, after the speech, Mittens was towering over him trying to intimidate the reporter.
There are more sociopaths in leadership positions than in the general population. It just that Mitty is not very good at it as well as Obama is.
<snipped - no promotional links in the forums>
From outside the US, not particularly interested in the Presidential candidacy/selection at this stage, and therefore basing my comment only on odd news clips, I have to say it doesn't change my view - just reinforces it.
The guy strikes me as a car salesman, insurance agent, realtor archetype. Big smile, big ego, big man in his own mind. I think he's the kind of guy who's realised "Once you can fake sincerity, you've got it made." He'll probably go all the way though, because that trait is the hallmark of successful politicians worldwide. And people seem to lap it up.
I never cared for Romney. Furthermore, reading this confirms my opinions of him. This man is a dangerous bigot period. No one in his/her right thinking mind would vote for him!
It reminds me that high schoolers are often immature, and also that the rumor isn't proven fact, AND the fact that no one's been willing to bring up Obama's past for an even playing field.
Romney's no longer a kid, and doesn't act like a kid.
Unlike the Democrat nominee's actions and words even as an "adult"!
So, the choice between the two is still as clear as it can get.
Romney defined the issue well when he said the Left likes to dangle all kinds of shiny (distracting)baubles in front of the public.
In what way does Obama not act like an adult?
This is a new one.
A whole lot of people have gone through high school (and kindergarten, for that matter) without ever being someone would would be willing to violate another student. The behavior he did is something that shows signs of someone being "just the other side" (at best) of the "average" section on the "conscience scale" (as presented in Ken Magid's and Carol McKelvey's book, "High Risk: Children Without Conscience". The authors noted that a lot of people who aren't criminals or psychos do fall below average and tend to be in some professions. Recent news reports mentioned that stock brokers are in one of those professions.
So, you have this scale (line) where "average conscience" takes up a big section in the middle. Then there's all the people with "better than average conscience" all the way from "a little more" to the example of Mother Theresa at the far end.
That means that it's a minority of people who fall from "just below average" to the other end of the scale, where Charles Manson was shown as the extreme example. Sorry. I don't think a person who shows so many signs of falling (at best) on that "just below average" side of the scale should be President. I think (ideally) the person voted in as President ought to be a better, more naturally moral (respectful, empathetic, whatever), person than that.
My girlfriend and I were in sixth grade when a few of the boys harrassed the life out of a borderline senile and very elderly teacher. It wasn't that great a thing that at eleven we knew enough to try to "counteract" some of the meanness those boys did toward her. People's degree of empathy for others is all there by the time they're pretty young. Not everyone got a big kick of out of bullying their classmates. This individual isn't the only one, that for sure; but he's in the minority of "j.a. kids" who would take part in (or lead) that kind of thing.
Unless someone can come out and prove or convincingly say that the young man's hair really wasn't cut off, and all they did was "scare" the kid with the sound of scissors (which, in itself, isn't great but would at least be a little different), Romney's just lost himself a whole lot of potential voters.
There is no even playing field between these two men. Mitt Romney admitted he was guilty of this "High School prank" and showing the world he's now a grown man without the concience people need to have in order to come clean about past bad deeds. If you're still not convinced; he recently fired a gay employee without cause. How could you even think to compare these two men. The President is a good, honorable man. Mitt Romney is at best a very callous man with no loyalty. At worst; you could say a person with this kind of abusive and un-feeling attitude displays the qualities of a mean, sadistic, sociopath that could be very dangerous givin the right/wrong situation. Mitt Romney being compared to President Obama is an insult to our President, who is a great statesmen and a leader we can be proud of.
Not only have you been drinkin' liberal kool aid, you've swallowed the whole carp!
I'm not Liberal, and I'm not Kool Aid drinker enough to blindly be in favor someone who has lost my vote just because he's what's being offered as the Conservative. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I may just need to let the dead people get my vote.
I wasn't going to respond on this thread but since nobody is getting accurate I have no choice. First the family has come out and said the story was bogus. They said they were outraged but the Obama camp with put out such false stories and politicize them. Personally, it does not matter to me who released it, to not call the family to check on the authenticity of the story is completely low class. This President has done so several times. Remember when he called a DC cop a racist, and it turns out that was not even true. They will throw anything out there to Garner support.
Next bit Romney did not fire a gay staffer. The staffer left on his own accord.
And last copied you possibly call Obama honorable. There has never been such a bully in the presidential office as this man. Even members of his own party draw his ire if they disagree with him.
For Gods' Sake! Crawl out of this Hubpages hole you're in and read a newspaper or watch CNN. I'm the one that has lost patience with you. Romney is a sadistic bully and liar in spite of your revision of history, spoken words, and reality. How dare you use a dead mans family to promote some lie you want to support-OUTRAGEOUS!
http://www.alternet.org/news/155401/wha … _bullying_
"Next bit Romney did not fire a gay staffer. The staffer left on his own accord"
That is a complete distortion of the real facts. By the way, it was more than one Gay Staffer that Romney fired.
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/05 … h-wieworka
Actually the guy left after some really nasty comments by a conservative radio host -- Wall Street Journal : http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 … 34678.html
Then of course there was this incident: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/05/11/t … cal-smear/
Ironically enough I'm not an Obama supporter but this is appalling
Oh my...Howie Carr: The rabid democrat hater! He has a radio show too...drive time. He's the one who called single moms' kids "b*st*rds" all the time. Yet when Bristol Palin had a kid as a teenager and out of wedlock: why---that word never passed his lips!
Oh, and he had such fun when a high school on the North Shore had a rash of teen pregnancies....
"sl*ts on parade" *chuckle* chuckle* But Bristol got the Golden Pass..... as if she was an Egyptian Queen carried on the shoulders of eunics....
And all the R's around here on his show were so very proud of Sarah for taking in the little baby...nary a "b*st*rd" slipped their lips.
I guess they "evolved"!
I am appalled and bullying should never be allowed. A man who is running for President should have had higher morals even when he was young. He knew the difference between right and wrong. If he wasn't compassionate in then he will not be compassionate now. He doesn't have my vote!
Sounds to me like he was and is still "Homophobic" which is absurd! What he did has completely changed my outlook on Romney and to think he is Mormon.
I never liked Romney to begin with! I don't care what he says, he's a serious lier, I'm in no way, no how, ever going to vote for him.
No, I've had a pretty low opinion of the man all along...
He fits this profile perfectly...
http://www.cracked.com/article_18777_5- … -suck.html
I agree. The incident helps to confirm my opinion of Mittster. If it were a single incident it would be one thing, but it fits his pattern. In another alleged incident at Cranbrook he exclaimed "atta girl" when an effeminate male classmate spoke in class. At the time the incident happened Mitt was basking in the reflected glory of his father who had been CEO of American Motors and was recently elected governor of Michigan. I'm sure this made him a big hero at Cranbrook which was only a couple of miles from the Mormon temple his father was instrumental in building. From Cranbrook Mitt went on to Stanford, then to France of all places as a Mormon missionary, then to Brigham Young, and Harvard Law and Business Schools. Another one of these guys born on third base who thinks he hit a triple.
Ralph, Romney's missionary years in France were not some luxury excursion:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/man … story.html
No, not really. I already knew that he could be quite clueless in some respects, and was thoroughly capable of deceiving himself. (His statement that "no-body was thinking of homosexuality" back in the 1950s was almost surely self-deluding; just about every guy around, straight or gay, was terrified to death that someone would call us a 'fag.')
And I'm an alum of that very same school, graduating just seven years after Mitt did.
How many people could pass the test of what they did when they were nineteen? How would your youth be judged by others.
It doesn't really change it. It just confirms some very negative vibes I've been getting about him.
Oh well, you know Mitt doesn't remember singling out the fellow as a homosexual. After all, this was the 1960s and back then they didn't think about such things.
So really, it wasn't bigoted.
It was just prep school hijinks.
Boys will be boys..... right?
Lets drop all the liberal/Conservative labels we wear for a minute. Look at these two men honestly with the two eyes and common sense God gave you.
Since I'm a Progressive Democrat and atheist, I'm not concerned about their religion either. Obama is working with what he's got. I don't agree with everything he does and, like anyone else, he has a few misses along with hits. The biggest difference is that Obama understands the 99% since he was there himself. Romney is way out in space somewhere when it comes to be in tune with the average American. You tell people to start a business, even if you have to borrow money from your parents. How many of our parents have $50k+ burning a hole in their pocket to lend us on a risky venture? Get real! He gets caught in lie after lie and doesn't admit it. He doesn't have the balls to stand up to talk show hosts or to the right when his campaign spokesdman, Richard Grenell, was shoved out due to his sexual preference. Romney is a liar and spineless. Obama is guts all the way. He stood his ground on the same sex marriage belief, took out Bin Laden, gambled and won big with the US auto industry (Romney being despriate enough to try to take credit for even though he voted against it). He also passed Healthcare Reform Act (Romney passed in his state but all against it when Obama passed it) and regulated Wall Street, one of his biggest contributors during his 2008 Presidential campaign.
Imagine chasing a kid down, 4 guys holding him while he screams, and cutting his hair off....a person who does this is not a nice guy.
In fact: to be a Vulture Capitalist, this requires you to have no conscience, in my opinion.
And he associates with shady characters.Just google it. All of them have the compassion gene missing. Fine it you want another cruel administration representing us to the world.....I'll say No Thanks. Had quite enough thank you.
here is just the example of what this type of mentality is all about.
http://motherjones.tumblr.com/post/2286 … is-selling
and btw...something about the way he calls the gay marriage issue "tender" really really gives me the creeps.
At first glance, I'm sure many Americans found it hard to believe, Romney man handling another guy? How could this possibly be? The possible GOP nominee who takes the shortest, daintiest, crispiest little steps in his walking stride, an obvious result of a muscle underdevelopment due to lack of exercise, actually pinned down another guy physically in high school?
Then the story continued and began to make a little more sense by revealing the truth as reported -
Mighty Mitt didn't actually engage in a confrontation face to face, man to man, nor did he exert any physical energy or strength to tackle the youngster as reported, but apparently his wrestling buddy, or other so called "Friends" did -
Then, according to reports, Mitt began to Attack, Assault & Batter the innocent school mate AFTER he was down on the ground -
Once Mitt's "Friend" tackled and pinned the gay youngster to the ground, Romney then began to clip and cut the innocent kids hair, and god knows what other menacing, devious action took place -
The assault by Romney is bad enough, the habitual, compulsive, uncontrollable lies he seems to engage in with such natural ability take it to the next level by re-affirming this life long pattern - Once again, he emphatically stated with quivering lips, and a tinge of laughter, he did not remember the incident - Just like he apparently didn't remember his questionable "Blind Trust" Investments -
Yes, I'm sure we all understand most politicians stretch and contort the truth on occasion but here's the difference - If President Obama were under oath 24/7 he would be sentenced to 2 years out in 1 for good behavior - If Romney were under oath 24/7 he would be sentenced to 30 years to life with no possibility for parole for his egregious violations - And believe it or not, his habitual fibbing might just turn out to be the least of his worries -
Why do I get the distinct feeling the Romney's have more skeletons in the proverbial closet than a Halloween Bash at Hef's place?
Really!! you're worried about Romney associated with shady characters and yet you're okay of all the shady characters Obama was proven to be with. At least Romney is an associated with anybody who blew things up and killed people, at least not that we know of yet
I wouldn't want to be judged now by things I did as a teen. Romney did stupid stuff in high school and in jr. high, as did Obama (pushing a girl down and belittling her, doing drugs, etc). Also, you know that ABC called out WaPo on the article about Mitt, right? WaPo lied about a supposed witness to the barbering event.
I'm more interested in NOW than in stuff that happened decades ago, before the candidates matured. The left and the right are trying to turn this election into a soap opera, and people from both sides are falling for it. I don't think I've ever seen so much political hate in my life. I got into a big argument at a club last night, defending Obama. I actually cringed at what the far-right guy was saying about our president. Ugh.
I don't approve of the bullying event, but it pales in comparison to some of the hazing activities that went on in my own high school. Know what's scary? Some people (mostly men) like Romney more after learning about his barbering. They thought he was a "wuss," but now they see him as a "regular guy."
That is scary, but I'm sure true! Do you think this will help re-energize the right-wing base for him, especially in light of Obama's recent support of gay marriage?
Habee get your facts straight when you're saying things like this. the "Obama" incident happened when he was in 4th grade and the girl was not knocked down. It was in Dreams of My Father. the passage reads like this:
":"For the rest of the afternoon, I was haunted by the look on Coretta’s face just before she had started to run: her disappointment, and the accusation. I wanted to explain to her somehow that it had been nothing personal; I’d just never had a girlfriend before and saw no particular need to have one now. But I didn’t even know if that was true. Iknew only that it was too late for explanations, that somehow I’d been tested and found wanting; and whenever I snuck a glance at Coretta’s desk, I would see her with her head bent over her work, appearing as if nothing had happened, pulled into herself and asking no favors."
You're right - he "shoved" instead of "pushed":
“I’m not her boyfriend!” I shouted. I ran up to Coretta and gave her a slight shove; she staggered back and looked up at me, but still said nothing. “Leave me alone!” I shouted again. And suddenly Coretta was running, faster and faster, until she disappeared from sight. Appreciative laughs rose around me. Then the bell rang, and the teachers appeared to round us back to class."
Obama described Coretta as "plump and dark." Does that mean he's racist and a hater of fat people? No. He was a kid, as was Romney in the hazing incident.
I guess this election will be about Homosexuality, why not? The last one was all about hope and change. Look over her, no change very little hope, but by God I'm for gay marriage! Smoke and mirrors.
Oh Oh! I get it! you're talking about Ralph Nader! Now I get it.
I've never liked him or trusted that smile for one moment. He's fake and a liar. The story, if true, doesn't surprise me at all, and of course, he doesn't remember. And no thanks to Ann Romney as a First Lady.
Everybody's got an opinion about Romney's bullying the gay guy and smashing the blind kid's head into the door and laughing. So it's real. It means something to us. But this is nothing to do with Republicans or Deomcrats. The right way to frame it is different: THIS IS ABOUT AMERICAN AND HOW ITS BEOME A GHETTO.
The story changed my view of him a bit. I never liked him - he's a compulsive liar, has no convictions of his own, and his (current) platform I'm against - but at least he seemed like a nice "ah, shucks" kind of guy. It turns out that he doesn't really have that, and his lies about the bullying (first he said he knew nothing about it, and then he said he didn't know the kid was gay) suggest he didn't really learn anything from the experience.
It's fine to be a terrible kid because presumably you'd learn something in order to be a better adult. Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to have learned anything from the experience; in fact, he doesn't even acknowledge it as having happened. Scary.
That's whole point! Kids do very bad things in High School and College. When you "Grow Up" you show your maturity and man up to the bad things you did in the past. That's how people gain trust and honor. Being a good wordsmith doesn't help you sidestep the issue, it just makes you look worse.
I believe we all did stupid things in high school that we wish we hadn't. It's a shame that so many are so quick to judge. Romney has the same views as me on many issues and will still be getting my vote.
Cobrafan, I'm glad you know who and what you want to vote for. I think it's important to discuss all these things before an election rather than after!
I think people are judging him more on how he's responded than to the actual event. Yes, many people did things in high school that they later regretted (some worse than others), but it doesn't even seem like this is something he regrets. If he truly doesn't remember it that says a lot about how he processed it (he didn't!) and makes me wonder if it was just one of many mean things he has done throughout his life. I truly think if he had owned up and said, "Yes, I did this, and it was horrible" he would have been better off (though not totally off the hook.)
I agree - why not own up to it. Why even point out that you 'don't remember' - Nixon started that "I do not recall" crap and see where it got him
I with everyone who thinks that just owning up to what you do or did is the way to go. I think what bothers folks is that there seems to be a pattern of this with Romney's casualness in regards to things that matter to them. What I didn't like about it is the "gotcha" factor, like Democrats finally had sometihing on Romney. C'mon, he's always come across in a casual fashion with regards to his interests in people--right?
I agree that Romney's statement of not remembering the incident is attracting more of a response than the actual event. None of this changes my opinion of him because it wasn't very high to begin with. If someone went up to Romney today, pinned him down and cut off any of his hair, that is assault and I highly doubt he'd laugh it off or not feel violated. Perhaps he considers assault a rite of passage that he has outgrown. His response/apology seemed insincere, almost forced. Is the I don't remember phrase going to be his fall back for every mistake he makes as a human being let alone as President? But Pres. Obama isn't perfect either.
I personally am a backer of Mitt Romney. I do not know if he was a bully in High School or not but
I feel like what does that have to do now?
It shows his character as a high schooler, when he was first free to explore who he could be. I smoked weed and drank alcohol in high school. Should that automatically disqualify me from every achieving my dream of becoming a cop? Because of my stupidity as a kid, because I chose to break the law when I was a kid?
Cobrafan: I get your point, but I see two major differences. First, you acknowledge that you engaged in the behavior. Second, I think there is a really big difference in doing something that might be harmful to yourself and committing a violent, hateful act against someone else. Given his lack of recognition that what he did was unacceptable and harmful leads a lot of people to believe that he doesn't think that it was and that he hasn't really changed...
I wore a casts and braces in elementary school and Jr. High, and know how miserable it is to be bullied. When I was 6, after my first spinal fusion, I had to wear a body cast, from my neck down to the end of my spine. I was in the bathroom, and a girl crawled under mine and actually threw stones down my cast! In those days, teachers did not take a stance on bullying, and I still recall that when the cast was cut off, I had pebbles in my belly button. I can't remember the name of the cruel child. But that was despicable behavior, which at that age, one must learn at home. My son is an elementary school teacher. He has long, blond hair down to his shoulders, and it has never been an issue in jobs or important places. But in school he was teased mercilessly, and people threatened to cut it all the time. He's one of the few in the class that went on to be a successful adult. But now that NJ has anti-bullying laws, the inevitable result is that things swing too far in the other direction. As far as Romney, I have read studies that show the HS Football star and prettiest Cheerleader are often the most popular, and the most cruel bullies, and actually many are sociopaths. They know how to charm people while doing the hideous acts behind the teacher's and coaches backs. I don't know if someone should be judged by the mistakes they made so long ago. But the more we know about Romney, the more we find him to be a follower and out of touch with how real Americans live. He said, "Borrow money from your parents, start your own business." How many parents have money like that? We struggled to send our son to a state college. He doesn't seem like a good person.
I canot tell you how many times I wish I had had parents to borrow money from in order to run my businesses!
Seriously! Doesn't he realize that many elderly are living in poverty and more and more adults are having to support their parents (while also trying to raise their own kids). Of course, if we privatize social security....
I watch MSNBC for the laughs (though I am rather liberal on some issues, and they had a facial analyst discussing how Romney's laughs or smiles never reach his eyes, that his eyes look cold even while smiling. You can also try the test with photos, just cover the smiling mouth, and see if you find any humor or warmth in the eyes. Another way is we have a serious and not so serious side to our faces. Try covering the left side of a photo, and check out the right side's facial expression. Then cover the right. One of them will show the truer feelings.
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