Makes you wonder if there is any point in working hard in Britain?

1. 83

   CMHypnoposted 11 years ago

   There needs to be coherent, balanced welfare policies in the UK. On the one hand there are people and families who have genuine illnesses and issues who don't seem to be getting the help they need and then other cases where they are freely allowed to exploit the system
   
   
   
   http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/artic … -stop.html

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      Josakposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Ugh, people like that make me so angry, to manipulate a system put in place to help people who are sick and desperate and use it for your own benefit is nothing less than evil. I agree with Jaxson in some respects, I think that welfare and safety net programs are essential but that all those programs should have a strong emphasis on getting people back into an honest decent job. Indeed as far as I see it the government should have job creation programs intentionally designed to get people on unemployment into work.

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         CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Anything like that just gets stamped on over here and people howl they are being exploited.  There is no acceptance that no job creation/work experience programme is perfect and probably has to run awhile to see what can be done to improve it and make it more efficient.
         
         There was one young lady who spat the dummy big time about being asked to stack shelves for two weeks without being paid, who had no concept that she was still getting her benefits, it was only for a fortnight, it might not be a highly skilled job but would help her get into the habits of work and she might meet some interesting people.  Any initiative and willingness to work also looks good on a CV.

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   CASE1WORKERposted 11 years ago

   What a wally!
   Yes, they are playing the system but he is clearly not incapable of work and the recent government policy changes will see him reeled in and his benefits stopped which will stop her carers allowance too. His award of DLA must be very suspect too- there are a number of so called "lifetime " awards being reviewed and his will jump to the top of the list!
   Governments have tried over the years to stop the burgeoning sick pay system but it is hard when you are fighting against a system. I worked for the BA/JCP for 18 years some years taking people like this to appeals tribunals- we used to joke in the office- the girl who made the decisions to stop benefits had major sight problems and followed a special diet after life saving suregery and the appeals officer was technically deaf and also followed a special diet- we both quaified for benefits but insisted on working!

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      CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      The maddening thing is that these types of cases are just going to make it harder for those in genuine need.  It is always seems to be a handful of idiots that ruin things for everyone else

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   JaxsonRaineposted 11 years ago

   This happens in the US too. There was the recent story of a woman who won $1 million in the lottery, and was still on food stamps. She said she didn't feel bad about it because after she paid off her house, and bought another house, and bought two new cars, she didn't have much money left and was still unemployed.
   
   I think it is very important for any welfare program to be stipulated on(excepting for welfare for permanent disabilities) the person honestly working toward independence again.

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      CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      We had a guy over here who won the lottery, who bought a big house in Ireland that he didn't live in but stayed living on his sickness benefits over here in England, because unlike unemployment benefit, sickness benefit is not related to whatever savings/capital you may have.  Being entitled to something doesn't always make it right to claim it

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   bac2basicsposted 11 years ago

   Hi CM. Don´t even get me started on this one. I agree totally that the whole benefits system needs a good overhaul. Lets face it, there are those in the UK who have no intention of ever going out to work. Shame they can´t put as much energy into looking for work as they put into " Working the system ". Too many do gooders making excuses for them to boot, While good old " working " Joe public are keeping the lazy so and so´s. And you are correct, there are many people who are genuinely entitled to benefits but don´t get them because they aren´t aware of how to claim them , or are too proud to ask.

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      CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Also, I expect that most of us get a headache ever three weeks or so, but some people don't seem to understand that their benefits depend on other people being willing to go to work for them.  Most of us are quite happy that the ill, disabled and elderly are well looked after and understand that people need support for a time if they lose their job or fall on hard times, but it should never be a career choice.

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5. 0

   RTalloniposted 11 years ago

   So glad to see this discussion in progress!
   
   The way these parents take care of the house and yard they are given by tax dollars is very telling--poor kids!  How can the woman say that her children don't know she mooches off tax payers?  If they truly did not before, they do now! 
   
   Abuses of systems supposedly designed to help the truly needy are the consequences of a system that should never be in place.  Neighborhoods, communities, churches, and families should be helping each other--that would include oversight and counsel from the people who know/see how the beneficiaries are behaving and then can decide whether they really need help or whether they need to go to work.  The people in a community are the ones who could offer real jobs, then oversee whether the offers are taken seriously and make the deadbeats accountable for their neglect.  Extended family members could work with neighborhood leaders to help parents who want to sponge off tax dollars step up to bat and do right by both their families and their communities.  There is some truth in the quote "it takes a village" because every village has its deadbeats.

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   psycheskinnerposted 11 years ago

   At the end of the day a healthy nation should create mainly people who wouldn't cheat even when cheating is possible.  They should want to spend their days constructively.

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      CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. There are loopholes in every system, doesn't mea we shoud follow them.

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   Will Apseposted 11 years ago

   Benefit fraud is pretty small scale according to the governments own figures. Around 3 per cent of benefit expenditure is lost in fraud or by admin errors.
   
   Demonizing disabled claimants is good politics, though, for a government determined to cut expenditure.
   
   "The most recent estimates put annual revenue losses due to fraud and error in the welfare system at £5.2 billion, or
   almost 3% of total expenditure."
   
   http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/tackling-fra … EA,14H7Y,1
   
   Hammering the legit claimants seems inevitable now and the kinds of reports you see in the Daily Mail are part of the softening up campaign.

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      CMHypnoposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Thing is Will is that this story is not about benefit fraud.  This family are legitimately claiming and it is all above board. They do it because they can and are quite open about it.
      
      There will be loopholes in any system and it is always going to be difficult to balance making sure that the people genuinely in need get the care and support they deserve.  But we have become a nation of welfare junkies, and have had successive governments that have encouraged people to hand over responsibility for their lives.  Some of this money would be better spent on education, training and providing work experience places

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8. 66

   2uesdayposted 11 years ago

   We seem to have developed a system that appears to punish those in the middle ground.
   
   You are OK if you are rich and you are OK if you know how to work the system and do not work. In the middle are the ordinary workers who pay taxes and see the age of retirement retreating over the horizon.  Add to this that some people are spending more and more of their income on filling their cars to get to the place of employment, which means that they have less money left to pay the mortgage and to spend on other essentials. Then we wonder why people are spending less on good and why the recession is not receding.
   
   However, I have to say that I know of people who have lost their jobs and the benefit system then can make it incredibly difficult to manage.

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   John Holdenposted 11 years ago

   Anybody who has ever had to claim benefits, or knows somebody who has, will recognise this story for what it is.
   It is pure Daily Wail hype and hysteria.
   Benefits officers are not sitting around handing out money like free lollipops, on the contrary, they are told to, and do, treat the money as if it were their own. They refuse any payment before they'll accept it and for the man to get DLA he has to either be far more seriously ill than a headache every week or three, or lying.

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      IzzyMposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with this totally.
      
      The story has to be inaccurate as it is very very difficult to be awarded disability living allowance.
      
      Whatever is wrong with this man, it is much more serious than simple headaches as the paper suggests.
      
      I know people who claim this allowance, and who are actually very sick and who deserve it, and even they have to appear in front of panels every few months to ensure they are still as sick as they claim.
      
      It is a very difficult award to get, and no-one can milk the system the way they did in the past.
      
      And look at the story, most of the money this family claims goes on rent.
      
      That's a very nice little earner for the anonymous house owner. I wonder if they declare all their earnings to the Inland Revenue? That's who is really gaining from this set-up.
      
      Who wouldn't want £1,700 a month in rent? What's that, about $2,500? It might be a detached house but it doesn't look very nice from the outside.
      
      They'd never get that money in the private sector.

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      bac2basicsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      John..I agree with you but the problem is if you don´t know how to work the system and / or are not prepared to lie through your teeth, you could be in real need and not get a penny..despite paying into the system for years. There are fraudsters out there who get away with it year after year after year. I don´t live in the Uk now , but have heard how hard it is to get any benefits, and I´m talking about people who have contributed for years and then through no fault of their own have been made redundant or otherwise forced to sign on , and they get nothing. While the lazy fraudster across the road who makes a good living fixing cars at his leisure and has plenty of time for that because he is too ill to go out to work, gets the lot.

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