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California debates yes means yes sexual assault law

  1. realtalk247 profile image70
    realtalk247posted 2 years ago

    Msn New reported:

    "Legislation passed by California's state Senate in May and coming before the Assembly this month would require all schools that receive public funds for student financial assistance to set a so-called "affirmative consent standard" that could be used in investigating and adjudicating sexual assault allegations. That would be defined as "an affirmative, unambiguous and conscious decision" by each party to engage in sexual activity.

    Silence or lack of resistance does not constitute consent. The legislation says it's also not consent if the person is drunk, drugged, unconscious or asleep.

    Lawmakers say consent can be nonverbal, and universities with similar policies have outlined examples as maybe a nod of the head or moving in closer to the person."

    It's so sad that this needs to be said but I am glad that things are being brought to the attention of law makers.  Sex is not consent when someone is passed out, unconscious, asleep or drunk. There is no excuse and there should be no tolerance. 

    Do you support this law?  What are your thoughts?

    1. gmwilliams profile image84
      gmwilliamsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      It is about time that this is discussed.  Yes, this law should be passed.  College can be a dangerous place for many young women.   Campus rape is more rampant than is acknowledged.  Oftentimes, there is a jock and fraternity culture in college which covertly tolerate the boys will be boys(wink, wink) mentality in which the rape victim is viewed as a villain, "asking for it".    Let me add that this law should be passed and applied to the strictest letter of the law.

    2. dashingscorpio profile image85
      dashingscorpioposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      There is both good and bad about such laws.
      Naturally you want to protect anyone from being forced, drugged, or (unaware/unconscious) from being taken advantage of.

      This law goes even one step further by stating:  "Silence or lack of resistance does not constitute consent." It used to be if at any point if a woman said "no" and the man persisted it was considered rape.

      Now we're saying if she is sober and silently allows a guy to kiss, fondle, undress her, and engage in sex this can be considered rape?

      Most guys would assume she is shy or possibly a little nervous. Naturally they'd think if they were doing something that she didn't want him to do she would say, "no" or "stop". Based upon this law the following day or week later if he didn't call her again she "potentially" could retaliate by stating she was raped.

      What's next having someone sign a "sex agreement" prior to having sex?
      Countless times in college both male and female students have "seduced" one another after smoking pot, drinking, dancing, and heavy petting.  As they use to say; "One thing led to another".

      Essentially the word "seduction" per this law is equivalent to rape!

      "Seduction is the process of (deliberately enticing a person), to lead astray, as from duty, rectitude, or the like; to corrupt, to persuade or induce to engage in sexual behavior."

      Candlelight, (wine),  and music were tools used in the (art of seduction) for many generations.
      Men considered it to be "setting the stage". In a way it was "pre-foreplay" activity. Women viewed it as him making an effort to be "romantic". The women may not have come over with the "intention" of having sex but the (ambiance) put them into a "receptive mood".

      Although I believe the law has great intentions it may be overcompensating.
      In order for there to be true "equality" between the genders both men and women will have to be allowed to say "no" to things they don't want. The law also assumes if both the male and female are "intoxicated"  (only the male is responsible) for what happens in (non-forced) sexual activity.

      Certainly there have been instances where both men and women woke up the next morning and have regretted having sex with someone they either were not all that attracted to or hope no one ever finds out. Most "one night stands" fall into that category. I've heard others refer to their drinking as getting some "liquid courage" to follow through on something they (want) to happen or just to "get through it". One such person was a female married friend. She told me she'd have a few drinks ahead of time when she knew her husband would be wanting sex.

      The biggest problem with "he said/she said" laws is the assumption that all males are predators and women have zero obligation to think about potential consequences before partaking in any activity.
      We tell children to look both ways before crossing the street even though pedestrians have the "right of way." Laws that discourage thinking before acting are dangerous. Years ago I wrote on this topic.

      Acknowledging An Obligation To Be "Aware" Is Not "Blaming The Victim"!
      http://dashingscorpio.hubpages.com/hub/ … The-Victim

      1. realtalk247 profile image70
        realtalk247posted 2 years ago in reply to this

        "setting the stage"
        That's find but if a woman is passed out and unresponsive, no man of decent character would consider it a green light. No woman should wake up to someone straddling them and taking away their option and choice to have sex.  It's not about taking a woman but a woman giving themselves to the other party. 

        If she says no, she says no. The game for men is to make a woman desire to have sexual intercourse, not spike her drink or get her to pass out -take her pants down-and do what you want to do. Those are dudes that deserve to be beat until they "get it."Are we seriously debating this in 2014? Then you have mentalities from celebrities like..............I won't name names.............yes I will Cee Loo Green arguing if she "doesn't remember" then how can you call it rape. Really? Really!? 

        Our society need cpr. Seriously to have to write law like this because men are bullying and victimizing people with no conscience.  CONSCIENCE 1 a : the sense or consciousness of the moral goodness or blameworthiness of one's own conduct, intentions, or character.

        1. wilderness profile image97
          wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          "... because men are bullying and victimizing people with no conscience"

          Interesting statement.  Do you also understand that women are teases, leading on, encouraging and participating only to cry rape when it's over?  Or are women all angels, just too stupid to take responsibility for their actions?

          (Just in case you don't recognize sarcasm, it is in direct response to perhaps the most sexist female chauvinist pig comment I think I've ever seen)

          1. realtalk247 profile image70
            realtalk247posted 2 years ago in reply to this

            Teasing is not an excuse for rape or taking advantage of someone.  Men are responsible for controlling themselves, the difference between human beings and animals is the ability to reason and think.  Men do not act as if they are in the wild doing whatever action they please based on their desires without regarding another persons rights.
            If a woman is teasing then you don't decide to make a decision for her. You can politely choose not to date her in the future if you are wanting something more physical.  If a woman is "teasing" in the heat of the moment then you can be a gentleman and help her gather her things and escort her to the door.

  2. Zelkiiro profile image84
    Zelkiiroposted 2 years ago

    In before Conservatives find something to complain about and/or proclaim that women aren't people.

  3. Aime F profile image83
    Aime Fposted 2 years ago

    The intoxication thing is a bit tricky. That depends on a few things for me. Was the other person intoxicated? If so, how do you determine which person was taking advantage? I also know people who are pretty unobvious drunks, and if someone who didn't know them well hadn't witnessed them drinking, they might not realize they were drunk at all.

    Otherwise, I think it's pretty obvious to most people that having sex with someone who is unconscious constitutes rape.

    1. wilderness profile image97
      wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Intoxication: perhaps everyone past puberty should carry a breathalyzer.  Give each other a breath test and if it's over .05 it means abstinence tonight. 

      Point being, what does "drunk" mean?  As you point out to one person it means one beer; to another it means a fifth or more.