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Educational Parity In Relationships

  1. gmwilliams profile image82
    gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago

    Studies have shown that people with similar educatonal and socioeconomic backgrounds have a commonality regarding dating and marriage.  They tend to like and appreciate the same things.   This reasoning explains why college educated, professional women are better off dating men from a similar background and/or better.  It is totally unwise for a college educated, professional woman to date a blue collar man and/or a man who does not have the same level of education that she has.   

    She would be at a total loss in a relationship with this type of man.   While she loves learning, travelling, and other cultural pursuits, this man will be just content, watching televiision and hanging out at the bar with his buddies.    The blue collar and/or high school educated man is definitely not for the college educated woman.   He usually earns less than she and has different values than she does.    In essence, there will be clashes in such a relationship.  Do you agree with this premise?

    1. Stacie L profile image87
      Stacie Lposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I have to disagree. I have met self educated men who were  intelligent enough for myself and other professional women to be compatible.
      Its a bit of a stereotype .

    2. Bob Zermop profile image91
      Bob Zermopposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      This is quite a stereotype on both sides, towards the college women and the high school grad man. I disagree with your premise.

    3. By His Way profile image59
      By His Wayposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I have to agree at least just on my account. This was my situation and the end results were not good. That doesn't mean he was not intelligent at all. There are areas hes very bright in. We just werent interested and as knowledgeable in the same areas. I say that while questioning my spelling of knowlegeable...knowledgeable...
      .hmm...    There is infact a big difference in educated/exposed to culture vs the opposite though. Nevertheless, educated does not have to mean college grad. Intelligence always seeks out learning whether in an institution, in life, or self taught.
      It is just about having things in common.

    4. Jynzly profile image65
      Jynzlyposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      In theory:
      most people would like to believe that the wide gap of educational attainment between a husband and a wife is not a major consideration to affect  the quality of their relationship...

      in practice:
      ...the court's decision in the dissolution of my marriage is 99% based in the wide gap of our educational attainment...
      I agree with the premise...though I speak for myself..

      1. gmwilliams profile image82
        gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        +++++++++++++!

  2. knolyourself profile image61
    knolyourselfposted 4 years ago

    Educating Rita 1983 Michael Caine

  3. Courtney Leah profile image60
    Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago

    If they have other things in common, it will be ok. Things like spirituality and sex and other things can contribute to a happy relationship. When it comes to money, I think the educated woman should save up her money just in case of emergencies but it is likely that the blue collar worker may not be able to spot the household if something like that were to occur.

    1. gmwilliams profile image82
      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      I believe that no college and/or postgraduate educated woman should ever go with a lesser educated and/or blue collar man.   First of all, they have nothing in common.   The worldview of the college and/or postgraduate educated woman is more vast than that of the blue collar man.   She also has more intellectual and cultural interests than he does and/or will ever have.

      If she elects to enter into such a relationship, there would be only turmoil.  What can the blue collar men discuss, if he is capable of doing so?  In such relationships, there will be no intellectual discourses.  Furthermore, while she loves fine restaurants and operas, he just prefers sitting on the couch with a beer watching The Simpsons.   An educated, professional woman is better being with a man who has a similar and/or better educational and professional background.  Why attend college and postgraduate school just to settle with someone with a lesser education and job!  It does not make sense and totally defeats the purpose of a tertiary education!

      1. Cardisa profile image89
        Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I disagree with you. I am in a relationship where my fiancé could be considered uneducated. He didn't even attend high school. I am an educated female but we have things in common. The things we don't have in common make for an interesting relationship and an ongoing learning about each that that keeps the relationship from becoming stagnant.

        The purpose of tertiary education is not to settle down with snobs but for self betterment and financial stability. Settling down with someone of lesser educational background defeats the purpose of tertiary education?! Really, are you listening to yourself?

        1. gmwilliams profile image82
          gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yes, I am.  I believe that educated women should not settle for a man who is uneducated.  Now, think, what can such a man offer an educated woman?  Nothing at all but socioeconomic misery and intellectual discord!   What can I intelligently discuss with such a man?  Nothing!   I have to talk to this man in monosyllables because that is all what this man is capable of understanding!  I am an educated woman and will only go with educated men, thank you.   A man who is lesser educated than me will never cross my path! I am way better than that!

          1. Cardisa profile image89
            Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            That's your choice and that's fine with me but I don't believe that as a general rule. There are things we talk about and he is a great conversationalist. A man does not have tp attend college to be intelligent. Academic intelligence is just a minute part of what makes us up as humans.

            I refuse to believe any all or any man is defined by the school he attended. You are defined by character. I have dated educated men before and they weren't have the man the uneducated one I have now is.

            1. gmwilliams profile image82
              gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              People today are defined by their educational and socioeconomic status.   If you are an educated woman who elects to go with an uneducated man, you are looked upon quite negatively.   First of all, people are wondering why would an intelligent, educated woman would want to go with an uneducated man.   They contend that something must be amiss with you as you could not interface with a similarly educated man.   They further portend that probably you are so desperate for male companionship that you would be willing to settle for any man.   Remember, people are KNOWN by the company they keep for better or worse!

              1. Cardisa profile image89
                Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I guess that is true of the society you are from. I am from the Jamaican country side and we see people as people and of course you are respected based educational level but no one looks at me negatively here. I guess because it's common place for people who basically grew up together to go together and one may advance in their education and the other doesn't. 

                It might also be true if I were still in the city but I know for a fact that it's different in the country side where every body knows every body's business..lol

                I use to feel that I will ever date a man who didn't go to college. Then I did date several. I came home alone and this man was smart, wise, caring and understanding. I have known him since I was 17. He stole my heart, but the clincher was his honesty.

                We have lived together for three years and I have no regrets. My family loves him and he is well  respected in the community.

          2. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            If all else fails, perhaps you could work with your man tearing down and rebuilding the engine in your Ferrari.

            What's that you say?  Your fine education only taught you to step on the gas but not what really makes it go?  Well, maybe he can educate you - you certainly seem to need it.

            It always seems funny (and sad as well) that so many people touting their wonderful education and money depend totally on the uneducated, illiterate and stupid blue collar worker for their daily needs.  Without the men and women you are so disparaging of you couldn't survive a week.

            Maybe, just maybe, you need to learn the difference between what really matters in this world and what is just fluff.  Let me help a little getting you started?

            Gossipping about the neighbor with the most horrible fingernail polish color as a method to promote your superiority is fluff.  Helping the lady next door with the broken hand cook her next meal counts.

            Raising your nose into the air at the sight of a 2 year old playing outside in diapers is fluff no matter how important it might seem to let the world know you are disgusted.  Donating clothing to help those in need is what counts.

            Denigrating people with a real life education instead of sitting in a classroom for 4 years while learning very little of any real value may help conceal your own inadequacies, but it is fluff.  Learning how to take care of your own needs instead of always depending on someone else that can and did obtain the necessary know-how is what counts.

            Wining and dining your boss while knowing which fork to use (elegantly kissing a$$ in other words) may seem the epitome of success to you, but loving the man you married for what he is instead of his social graces and book learning is far more important. 

            You have a lot to learn.

            1. gmwilliams profile image82
              gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              Typical plebeian logic of the hoi polloi.  You clearly have a bias against highly educated people.  Highly educated, professional people have more options in life than those who are undereducated.  Blue collar and other nonprofessional jobs are slowly being phased out, automated, and computerized. 

              Most professional jobs required intellectual acumen and either a college and/or postgraduate degree.   People who are undereducated and in nonprofessional and/or blue collar jobs did not have the intellectual capacity to be accepted into college.   So they had to take the crumbs.   

              Frankly, an undereducated person cannot teach me anything at all but I can teach them.   Let us face facts, undereducated people are looked down upon in this postmodern society because higher education is a prerequisite to a middle class and/or better lifestyle.  Those without such educations are being.......well, let me put it succinctly, left behind doing the jobs that no one else in their right thinking mind would want to do.  Education is a good thing.  It is too bad that you do not realize this....well, your loss, not mine!

              1. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                You are so far off base it is absolutely pathetic.  About the only thing I would agree with is that a "real" professional, say a mechanic, could not teach you anything - you haven't the background knowledge to absorb even the most basic of facts.

                A bias against educated people?  I?  I have a BS in Chemistry (not one of the fuzzy subjects that have no real answers).  I possess a 4 year trade school diploma, and when I passed my journeyman electrician's exam 14 years ago (an exam over half of the people fail the first time they try) it was with the highest score ever recorded in the state, and one that stands to this day. 

                I left my "professional" job in middle management to become a blue collar electrician because it was unfulfilling and boring.  As an electrician I will leave behind me a legacy of schools, churches and other buildings that will outlast the both of us.  I actually produce something with my time and effort, something of lasting value and that is something very few white collar workers can claim. 

                Yes, the workers that built your homes (that you cannot make yourself), that manufacture the car you drive (that you cannot make yourself), that print the very book you learn from (that you cannot assemble yourself) are often looked down on by those of society such as yourself that put false values ahead of those that make life worth living. 

                Although many, many blue collar workers earn a very good living, at least middle class, money isn't the only reason to work.  Some of us enjoy actually producing things of value to society in general instead of pushing paper around in a mostly wasted effort.  We don't all find the social ladder worth climbing; truly some of us aren't interested in the least of getting to the bottom rung.  The company on that ladder generally isn't worth knowing; snobbish fools with no useful knowledge whatsoever that revel in their wasted years of "education".

                You're funny, gm, funny and so sad at the same time.  I really do hope that one day you learn some of what is worth knowing in this world, but it won't come from a book when you do, and it won't come from a college.  It will come from the world around you and from inside you, from your own efforts to learn something yourself rather than having it poured in as if you were an empty pitcher waiting to be filled by the ladder climbers.

                1. gmwilliams profile image82
                  gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  zzzzzzzzzzz.

            2. Cardisa profile image89
              Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              I love you Wilderness! You are so darn smart. People need to understand what is important in life. My man chose not to go back to school and he is one of the smartest people I know. At no time do I ever feel that I am missing something based on our educational differences. I did feel like I was missing something dating educated men!

              1. gmwilliams profile image82
                gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Oh boy, am I the sane and intelligent voice of reason here.   Why are you all so biased against education!  What is the point and logic(read l-o-g-i-c) of being highly educated yourself and going with a person with less education.  Your premises in that regard are beyond illogical.   In fact, in my opinion, anyone who attended college and elect to go with someone undereducated is wasting his/her college education.  He/she might as well not have attended college at all for all the good it has done him/her!  Think with your head and strategize regarding relationships, just do not let your emotions guide youfor emotions can be quite perilous and often lead one into trouble.

                1. Cardisa profile image89
                  Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  lol lol lol HA HA HA HA I find this argument really funny.

                  I didn't go to college to find a man lol

                  No wonder men are intimidated by educated women? My man isn't intimidated by me and I am very happy, isn't that more important than being with someone just so you can all boast about your education?

                  Why should my education be so important in my relationship? I have seen so many people struggle to have a relationship like mine and trust me, the minute they start to realize what is important in life and love they will be more happier for it.

                  1. gmwilliams profile image82
                    gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Neither did I.  What I am presenting here is an intelligent premise.  You have studied hard and made sacrifices to obtain a college education and you are going with an undereducated person-that is totally illogical.  When one obtains an education, he/she would( I hope-maybe I am from a different planet) want a relationship with a person of similar educational background.  This would be the intelligent and logical thing to do!  Why I am explaining this-this should be innate commonsense!  Oh dear me!

              2. Gordon Hamilton profile image95
                Gordon Hamiltonposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Cardisa - he's winding you up. He's a sociologist - in other words, his only language is complete and utter BS. He's trying to get you involved to analyse/analyze the results...

                1. gmwilliams profile image82
                  gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Yes, I am a sociologist and $%#@! proud of it.  What I am presenting is commonsense.  I am an highly educated professional woman and I would stoop to go with an undereducated, nonprofessional man-yeah, right!  I am laughing heartedly right now as I am eating my sushi and drinking sake!

                  1. Gordon Hamilton profile image95
                    Gordon Hamiltonposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    Got you! Read back through your own angry reply and amend your grammatical and spelling errors! Why don't you get a real job, one that requires a modicum of common sense and doesn't involve deliberate aggravation of decent people? Sociology is simply a skive from the world. How dare you criticise anyone on this planet, given your sad and pathetic, idiotic, lunatic profession?

                  2. vector7 profile image61
                    vector7posted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    She's better than someone self admittedly.

                    So much for all men [and women] are equal.

                    Not in this one's mind.

                    smile

                2. Cardisa profile image89
                  Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  Gordon.....I think Gmwilliams is a she.....but I am sitting here at my computer laughing my sock off at this BS. He/she wont get a rise out of me. I just want him/her to know how happy two people can be regardless of educational differences.

                  1. gmwilliams profile image82
                    gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    You are dreaming.........dreaming if you believe that education differences are unimportant in a relationship.  I am laughing even harder now!  You as a highly educated woman should know better! Come on!  The premise that love conquers all regarding of educational, intellectual, and socioeconomic background is just a fairy tale fantasy.  We as mature adults KNOW better!

              3. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                You know what, Cardisa - the really smart people don't go to college to learn; they go to get that piece of paper upon graduation.

                Colleges actually teach very little outside of how to think and reason...and some never learn that part of of their education.  All the little facts, the history, even the English lessons pale beside that one simple concept of learning to think, and the smartest among us already know that while the educated ignorant never get it.

                1. gmwilliams profile image82
                  gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  zzzzzzzz.

        2. Courtney Leah profile image60
          Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Yeah, financial stability does many times require that degree.

      2. Courtney Leah profile image60
        Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        GmWilliams, education can mean a number of things. You can be educated by going to school, or you can be educated by just having a lot of natural wisdom. There are loads of people who don't have a degree but yet they are smarter than some of the most DEGREED people out there. And anthoner thing to add is that they may have that sense of humor, that strong relationship in God and they might just be a stronger man in general. And these are all qualities that a woman could possibly want.

        1. Cardisa profile image89
          Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          I totally agree. Couldn't say it much better.

        2. gmwilliams profile image82
          gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Oh, please.  Natural wisdom does not mean anything.  Natural wisdom will not get you that job.  Formal education is the component that helps one get the job.    Yes, there is a marked difference between a person with tertiary education and a person without such education.   From what I have observed, highly educated, professional women who have relationships with lesser educated, nonprofessional men are quite miserable.   Their interests, circle of friends, goals, and desires are vastly different.   Also, a highly educated, professional woman who goes with an undereducated, nonprofessional man is simply looked down upon.  People wonder what is wrong with her as she could not find a man on her educational and professional level or perhaps, she is so desperate for a man that she would go with any type of man.  Educational and socioeconomic status are main components of a relationship.

          1. Courtney Leah profile image60
            Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            I guess that I didn't make myself clear about the natural wisdom. When I say natural wisdom I mean common sense-- almost like streets smarts. You just don't learn that in school, hun. A blue collar, might in fact, be a good match for a highly educated person. Who wants to be around someone who is the same? Spice things up a bit.

            1. gmwilliams profile image82
              gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              There is more to a relationship than just the physical.  Don't you want a man that you can have an in depth intellectual discourse with and take you to fine restaurants(not McDonalds and other fast food places)? Well, I guess not!

              1. Courtney Leah profile image60
                Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                Gmwilliams, I think you spend too much time watching the Bachelor. When life gets serious and people get down to the nitty gritty, it's more about fancy schmancy dates. ok.

                1. gmwilliams profile image82
                  gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                  I shall be completely civil in my response. I do not WATCH television at all.  I read thank you!   What I am saying is based upon experience and commonsense.  The purpose of a college education is to have a HIGHER and BETTER quality of life and relationships, not to settle for an average Joe/Josephina when one can do better, Jeez!  Why are people so content to settle for an amoebic, humdrum, barely surviving existence when they can have an affluently fantastic life?  Well, I am totally nonplussed here!  I thought that intelligent, well educated people want an affluent life-well, I guess not!  Well, YOUR loss, not mine!

                  1. Courtney Leah profile image60
                    Courtney Leahposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                    You can still have a fantastic life with someone who may not be educated.

            2. vector7 profile image61
              vector7posted 4 years ago in reply to this

              You are speaking to one who doesn't even believe in common sense.. lol

              Just a reminder for argument's sake.

              smile

              1. gmwilliams profile image82
                gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                zzzzzzzz.

  4. clairewait profile image89
    clairewaitposted 4 years ago

    You definitely take some extreme sides in making the point that intellectual compatibility is important.  But I agree.  It IS important.  If there is one thing I plan to teach my own children when they start to search for a future mate, it will not be to find someone as attractive, but to someone as smart.

    1. gmwilliams profile image82
      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      +++++++.

    2. clairewait profile image89
      clairewaitposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Though, I should add, in the case of relationships, intelligence and level of education are not synonymous.

      1. gmwilliams profile image82
        gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Intelligence and education may not be synonymous; however, the more intelligent a person is, there is a more likelihood that he/she has attended college and/or postgraduate school.  People of lower intelligence usually do not pursue higher education.  This explains why those who possess college and/or postgraduate education possess higher IQs than those with high school educations.    Just the facts, just the facts.

        Let me add, that those with tertiary education and above are more broadminded and are willing to consider varied sides of an argument.   People possessing tertiary education are also more liberal in outlook than those with secondary educations.  Contrast child rearing styles of the educated and undereducated.   Educated parents usually use nonphysical and verbal constructive methodology to correct their children while undereducated parents often use harsh physical punishments to correct their children.  On a whole, people with tertiary educations and above are better people overall than persons who elect not to pursue such education.

  5. Lady_E profile image82
    Lady_Eposted 4 years ago

    Not so sure...


    I have seen men marry ladies who only have basic education and they support their partners through further education and it's brilliant.

    Love will support. smile

  6. Disturbia profile image61
    Disturbiaposted 4 years ago

    While I agree that educational parity is important in a relationship, I take issue with your generalizations and stereotyping. Having a college degree, even an advanced degree, doesn't automatically give one culture or refinement any more than not having a degree makes one a Neanderthal.

    1. Cardisa profile image89
      Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Well said Disturbia.

  7. Marcy Goodfleisch profile image94
    Marcy Goodfleischposted 4 years ago

    I do think parity is important, but I'm not sure it needs to be through formal education.   Peter Jennings (brilliant, articulate and successful by anyone's standards) was a dropout.  He was educated, however in every issue of international and political importance and could stand his own with anyone.

    It's also a matter of what each person wants and needs in a relationship.  So parity can refer to intellectual, emotional, financial or any number of other factors, but can meet the individual needs of each partner.

  8. Gordon Hamilton profile image95
    Gordon Hamiltonposted 4 years ago

    The difference of opinion on this thread alone speaks volumes - human beings are individuals and no such stereotyping can (yet!) be made to apply. Should the speculations of Orwell or Huxley ever come to pass, that may of course change...

    From my own experience, my ex was a very highly educated lady and held a number of senior scientific positions while we were together. I was educated in different fields but the difference was not in our levels of education - it was in our attitude to life.

    I was always the type (yes, like Homer Simpson, if you want! smile ) who would throw up his arms in glee at the end of the working day and want to enjoy myself. I wanted sometimes to do things and go places with my ex, sometimes to go to the football or pub with my mates, or maybe sometimes just relax at home. It varied but the big common denominator was that work was over until the next day/week. Not so with my ex. Work to her was life and it was always social events with visiting dignitaries/colleagues, etc, etc, etc... I hated them, especially as most of these events were conducted in a foreign language I didn't understand (literally - not figuratively) and I would usually just sit and get quietly drunk in the corner smile

    I honestly don't believe for a second that educational levels play more than the most minor of parts in whether or not two people can have a deep, meaningful and long lasting relationship. I honestly believe that life and love works on a far deeper, more instinctive level...

    1. gmwilliams profile image82
      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Educational attainment is an important component in a relationship and you have elucidated my point exactly!

      1. Gordon Hamilton profile image95
        Gordon Hamiltonposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Really??? I fail to see how - unless you are for some unknown reason endeavouring to equate entirely unhealthy and unnatural obsession with, "Educational attainment?"

        1. gmwilliams profile image82
          gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Educational attatnment is a very important component in a relationship.  Education affords one more myriad choices in life.   Education makes one more broadminded and appreciate the better things of life.  Believe or not, education is a good thing.

          1. Gordon Hamilton profile image95
            Gordon Hamiltonposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            Sorry - I seem to have taken some form of bait here, like a gullible mackerel in the sea. More fool me for getting involved. I'm signing off now to once again try cracking that two piece jigsaw puzzle I've been working on for the past seven years lol

  9. Dame Scribe profile image59
    Dame Scribeposted 4 years ago

    No way would I close my mind to somebody with 'just' a HS or less, education tongue that's like saying, ' they are incapable of learning'. I think you refer more to 'ambition' to want more. When one isn't happy within themselves, nothing and nobody, can make h/im/er happy regardless the education level. tongue

  10. Aficionada profile image93
    Aficionadaposted 4 years ago

    Gautam Adani

    Edward Albee

    Paul Allen

    Woody Allen

    Paul Thomas Anderson

    Julian Assange

    John Jacob Astor

    Dan Aykroyd

    Carl Bernstein

    Richard Branson

    Joseph Brodsky

    Warren Buffett

    James Cameron

    George Carlin

    Andrew Carnegie

    Bruce Catton

    John Chancellor

    Winston Churchill

    Grover Cleveland

    Noel Coward

    (skipping a few letters)

    Bill Gates

    1. gmwilliams profile image82
      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Brilliant exceptions to the rule.  The average undereducated person does not fit into such illustrous categories.  Their intelligence is extremely negligible to say the least.

      1. Aficionada profile image93
        Aficionadaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        And yet prior to this, you have been absolutely adamant that anyone without a college education was a blue-collar worker and not worthy of your attention. While other posters have commented that it is important to get to know the individual man for what he has to offer, you have insisted - in essence - that there can be no exceptions.  Reread your own posts. You have been inflexible.

      2. vector7 profile image61
        vector7posted 4 years ago in reply to this

        Well I personally find high-mindedness a very unattractive trait.

        If you are so picky why aren't you spending time in a high quality intellectual public surrounding with individuals that fit your preference?

        I don't see much productivity in here.

        smile

  11. tussin profile image60
    tussinposted 4 years ago

    As unpopular as GMWilliams's posted facts may be, they are nonetheless true, statistically speaking.  Statistically, marriages last longer when both parties are similar in a number of respects including especially religion, education, and views on money.  Since money is the number one reason for divorce and since income is generally proportional to education level, it stands to reason that educational disparities can be a harbinger of problems in an relationship.

    If you're going out to meet people for a long-term relationship, it just makes sense to seek out the kind of people who you are most likely compatible with in order to maximize your chances of success. 

    And realistically, most people's social circles consist of people with similar education levels, so it's not like the average highly educated woman is turning down uneducated men right and left.

    1. gmwilliams profile image82
      gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      ++++++++.

    2. Aficionada profile image93
      Aficionadaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

      Tussin, I'm really glad you brought up statistics because it is, in one sense, at the heart of this disagreement. It is true that a marriage or relationship is statistically more likely to succeed if the couple have certain values or traits in common. 

      But, since statistics relies on the normal curve, statistics also tells us that a percentage of relationships that have those same traits will not succeed and also that a percentage of successful relationships will not possess those traits. That is what the majority of posters in this thread have been saying. 

      It is gmwilliams who has been using the offensive "all or nothing" language. For example: "totally unwise... a total loss... no college and/or postgraduate educated woman should ever go with a lesser educated and/or blue collar man... there would be only turmoil... What can I intelligently discuss with such a man?  Nothing!... The blue collar and/or high school educated man is definitely not for the college educated woman."  These extreme statements do not fit in with probability and statistics.

      Gmwilliams is also the one who has taken leaps of logic to make inaccurate blanket statements like these:   "You clearly have a bias against highly educated people"; "Why are you all so biased against education!"; "You are dreaming.........dreaming if you believe that education differences are unimportant in a relationship."  In each of these cases, gmw took her own interpretation of some statements and extrapolated from the poster's nuanced views to her own black-and-white vision of reality.

      Besides her problems with statistics and leaps of logic, she has muddled the descriptions she is using. She frequently confuses undereducated or not-college-educated with blue collar. The categories might overlap somewhat in a Venn diagram, but they are not identical, and they should not be lumped together without better and more insightful explanation.

      I feel a bit embarrassed that she speaks of herself as highly educated and professional, because -- I believe -- her thinking process does not reflect well on educated women.

      Frankly, the only way this thread would make sense to me would be for it to be a sociological experiment that gmwilliams is conducting: observing other people's reactions to her blanket statements.  Maybe she's writing a paper on our reactions!

      1. gmwilliams profile image82
        gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

        I am going to tell everyone a story.  There was an acquaintance of my mother's with a Master's Degree in Psychology.  She had a good job, counselling unwed mothers.  She was going with a surgeon.  She then quit him and went with a postal clerk with an 9th grade education.

        They went together for a while and got married.  Okay, let the games begin.  Of course, this fellow was smooth and nice to her to get her to marry him.  Then she realized the wide chasm regarding the educational, intellectual, and socioeconomic differences between them.   She was earning twice as much as this postal clerk.  She had interests widely divergent from that of the postal clerk.  Their circle of friends were vastly different.

        While she had friends who were doctors, lawyers, and other professionals, he had friends who were janitors, construction workers, and laborers.  Want more sociocultural and educational shocks?  As a highly educated and professional woman, she was interested in the theatre, opera, and other intellectual pursuits. He?  His ideal of relaxation was going to the corner bar with his buddies, watching boxing, and drinking himself into total drunken oblivion.

        They could not discuss anything without it eventually escalating into an argument.   The idea of an intelligent and in-depth conversation was beyond the purview of this man.   He never read a good book, he only read a newspaper which was geared to the fourth grade level.  Want more information?  Wives of his associates only discussed soap operas, mundane television shows, and who was going have the next baby!    In other words, my mother's acquaintance was in utter hell!   The only time she could discuss intellectual things was with her relatives and friends!

        Her parents, both highly educated professionals, warned her against marrying the postal clerk with the 9th grade education.  But she did not listen much to her chagrin and peril years later.   She later regretted marrying the postal clerk.   While she eventually obtained her Ph.D in counselling, he never returned to school to further his education, preferring to be mired in his ignorance.  Let me not digress.   They had a daughter and the daughter saw this.    Yes, their home life was quite chaotic to say the least. 

        This acquaintance gradually lost all of her educated friends and even some relatives.   They intelligently portended that she could do much better than the postal clerk.   Her circle of educated and professional friends got smaller and smaller.  One day, there was an office party where some high level administrators were present.  She took her husband along.   What happened you say?  Well, her husband embarrassed her and cost her the promotion she always wanted.   

        As I have said before, one is known by the company he/she keeps.   Yes, my mother's acquaintance gradually lost the respect of coworkers also because they wondered why would she be with a person like that?  You see relationships and marriages between college educated, professional and noncollege educated,nonprofessional people are often discordant and really do not end up well.   

        Oh, yes, the acquaintance taught her daughter to only date highly educated, professional men and not to make the same mistake that she did.  People, wake up to reality!  In this postmodern and computerized society, highly educated, professional women clearly do not want an undereducated, nonprofessional and/or blue collar men, she wants someone from a similar background whom she can relate to!   She wants a man that she can respect, not look down upon!  To suggest otherwise is totally absurd to say the very least!

        1. Aficionada profile image93
          Aficionadaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

          Thank you for sharing your experience. It clearly falls in the middle of, or towards the lower end of, the normal curve.

          In this thread, several known and well-respected Hubbers - including cardisa, Stacie L, Gordon Hamilton, and wilderness - have shared their real-life experiences that contrast with the one you have described. These fall on the upper end of the normal curve (or on a different curve, depending on the factors being plotted, of course!). Have you welcomed their contributions with professional, scholarly curiosity and courtesy? i.e., "Thank you for elucidating circumstances presenting perspectives that are at variance with my own pet theory?" No, far from it. You have dismissed and diminished their opinions, even though you solicited them in your opening post.

          The partial list which I posted of highly successful men who never completed college (and, in some cases, never completed high school) was only a tiny drop in the bucket of well-known figures in that category. There are thousands, and more likely millions, more who are successful and respected in their own fields, but who are not famous outside of their own fields or social circles. I have known some of them.  I'm sorry that you have not.  I believe your life would be much more fulfilling and joyful, if you did know and acknowledge some of them.

          I have not seen any responses in this thread that have even remotely implied that a match between a woman of higher education than the man in the relationship will always succeed or that a match between people of equal education will always fail. Those who have posted responses to the OP have used accurate, careful words to express possibilities: can, may, might, etc.  But I have not seen the same caution in your replies to them.

          I am interested in the sad story of your mother's "friend," specifically in the fact that you all blame her failure to be promoted on her husband's behavior. How did your mother's "friend" and your mother know for a fact that that was the reason? Was there not some possibility that her own personality traits contributed to the problem? I can see that as a likelihood, but I also see that it would be much more comforting to place the blame elsewhere than to look inward for clues.

          1. gmwilliams profile image82
            gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

            It does not fall in the middle and/or at the lower end.  What I have presented is the raw and unadultered aspects of the educated, professional female/undereducated, nonprofessional and/or blue collar male relationship.   The examples which you are presented regarding illustrous noncollege graduates happen to one in a million persons.   The average undereducated, noncollege, nonprofessional and/or blue collar man does not fit your stellarly illustruous description.   The names you presented are famous and learned men who had high aspirations early in their lives.  Many of them attended college and dropped out because they had brilliant ideas which came to fruition.

            The average(let me elucidate a-v-e-r-a-g-e) undereducated, noncollege, nonprofessionial, and/or blue collar man comes no way near these geniuses.   This man seldom reads, have little or no concept of any activity if it does not involve brute sports and/or any forms of entertainment, does not want to better himself educationally, intellectually, and/or socioeconomically.  This man would rather exist in an amoebic state than to evolve! A highly educated, professional women, au contraire, is constantly seeking avenues of improvement educationally, intellectually, and socioeconomically!   She wants to explore the myriad facets that life has to offer.  She loves to participate in cultural and intellectual activities.  Based upon these premises, there is no way in either heaven nor hell that a highly educated, professional female will be content with being with such a man!  Now do you understand my point? Good!

            1. Cardisa profile image89
              Cardisaposted 4 years ago in reply to this

              The man's immobility has little or nothing to do with his education. There are many educated men who are lazy and do not aspire to be anything greater. There are also educated men without jobs who seem to always want to get by and mooch off family.

              A persons ambition and desire to succeed has little to do with education but rather their character and personality.

              1. gmwilliams profile image82
                gmwilliamsposted 4 years ago in reply to this

                I concur with you on that premise, Cardisa!  This was a heated but an excellent intellectual discourse.  By the way, it is nice to know you!  God bless you!

            2. Aficionada profile image93
              Aficionadaposted 4 years ago in reply to this


              In the middle of a normal curve is average (let me elucidate a-v-e-r-a-g-e).

              I will express agreement with you on one thing - the post you deleted ("zzzzzzz").  This thread really has become quite boring, and there's little point in continuing. --- Unless, of course, you were merely demonstrating symptoms of Pickwickian syndrome. 

              On the other hand, I do thank you for starting what gave hints of promise to be an interesting discussion.  I'm so sorry that it could not live up to that promise.

              I wish you all the best in your continuing growth and development.

  12. ahorseback profile image47
    ahorsebackposted 4 years ago

    You'll have to excuse my oppinion apparently there's a difference between educational accomplishments and wisdom! Between  maturity and book smart ? We forget sometimes that having more diplomas makes you wiser?.....Right  good luck with that !

  13. ankush0809 profile image61
    ankush0809posted 19 months ago

    yes right. i do agree.

 
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