Born Again Christians

What is a "Born Again Christian"?

I have several dear friends and family members that have, over the years, become "born again Christians." The term itself is odd, but we'll get to that later. What I'd like to examine is what apparently causes a person to decide to take their otherwise fairly normal life and dedicate it almost exclusively to Jesus.

I do not wish to pass judgment at all here. I love each and every one of the people of whom I speak, but even my own priest and I can have a conversation that does not include attribution to every good thing happening in the world to the blessings of the Lord. I attend church regularly. My children go to Sunday School. But as a T-shirt I've seen said, "I'm not Born Again. I was Born Right the First Time." Obviously, I do not understand what it means to be a "born again" Christian.

Technically, there are passages in the Bible that are read to require people to be "born again," in order to pass into the Kingdom of Heaven. As Jesus talked with Nicodemus, He said "...Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?" Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, You must be born again ...." (John 3:3-7). In this passage, Nicodemus was required to have a change of heart to become reborn. From the Catholic perspective, rebirth can occur through holy baptism.


The Cross, an iconic symbol of Christianity
The Cross, an iconic symbol of Christianity

Born Again Christians: Lead by Example

There certainly is NOTHING wrong with a change of heart to give you the keys to everlasting salvation. However, there are a few attributes that can result from rebirth among people claiming to be "born again Christians." These are not the rule, of course, and many people peacefully live their lives happily after transforming their lives to the glory of Christ.

It is my personal belief that religion is largely your own experience and, though practiced weekly (or perhaps more often) in communal settings, you and your family should ensure that other people with whom you share your beliefs and perspectives are willing to listen.

Of course, you can always lead by example. Just my two cents.

Fervent Conviction of Born Again Christians

Some people appear to have taken a skeptical view of God, and perhaps the afterlife, and reversed it to one of unquestioning acceptance. Familiar strains from the Hymn "Amazing Grace" come to mind, "I was blind, but now I see!"

Of course, faith itself does demand acceptance to some degree of the unknown; the unexplained mysterious forms the basis of many religions of the world. But some so-called "born again Christians" are so convinced of the reality of the miracles of their faith that they may openly proclaim it to many people.

Gone is any sense of questioning or wonderment. It simply seems to be fact that certain miracles occurred. And they will tell us all about it.

Avoidance of "Sinful" Behaviors by Born Again Christians

Many Born-again Christians take a puritanical approach to life, giving up alcohol, smoking, cursing, even sex! Of course, I am not advocating that this is a bad thing, in itself, particularly if the person had a drinking or drug problem to begin with.

But, the proclamation (overtly or covertly) that anyone that engages in these behaviors is sinful can be annoying, if it is part and parcel of the rebirth.

Passing Judgment

I was taught that Jesus loved everyone, and that only God would judge us at the end. So, I do bristle at the thought that the people who have been "born again" might step into God's shoes (should He wear them) and judge me for my shortcomings. I do a good enough job of that myself, thank you very much.

Frequent Attendance of Church

This is usually accompanied by dedicating huge sums of money to the church, as well. Once again, I don't mind at all if you wish to spend your time and money that way. I give a great deal of time and money in furtherance of charitable causes, and I don't feel the need to defend myself either here, or before the Lord. The guilt factor does get old, however, if it is offered up. And the sense that perhaps people that truly cannot afford to tithe to the extent demanded are doing so gives me some consternation. But, I must mind my own business.

The Holy Family
The Holy Family

Have you been Re-Born as a Christian?

Re-birth can mean more than just a myopic view of dedication to Christ. It should also include a recognition of the individual's placement within the world, including his or her relationship to Christ and God and humankind in general.

This means not to elevate oneself to the level of God. It is laudable to take vows, have a change of heart, go to church frequently, and tithe to the extent possible. But if you do not know what is in other people's hearts, do not pass judgment.

That is not your role.

I hope that my research here has improved my understanding of born-again Christians, as well as others. The generalizations here are certainly not representative of Christians as a whole, or reborn Christians, specifically. Again, I speak solely from the heart and personal experience. If you have been re-born, or have a relationship with a re-born Christian, I would love to hear about it. Please leave me a comment below.

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Comments 116 comments

SirDent 8 years ago

First things first. Where you wrote : (I do a good enough job of that myself, thank you very much.) We shouldn't even judge ourselves. We will always see where we fall short.

 Know this right now, that I am a little dense at times and I think this may be one of those times. I am not exactly sure what confuses you about the phrase born again Christians. One must be born in the spirit as Jesus told Nicodemus. It is spiritual as you stated. But one must follow Christ also. The term "Christian" means little Christ. The "world" today has turned it into a profanity.

I am not trying to be argumentative. Maybe I should read it again later, because I just don't get what you mean.


Angela Harris profile image

Angela Harris 8 years ago from Around the USA

I can sympathize in so many ways, Steph. I know lots of born again Christians. Sadly, that very fact has turned me away from church. Not God, mind you, just church.

I do know one born again Christian that I truly admire. She seems to me to be what a Christian should be. As you mentioned, she professes her religion by example, not by preaching at me or being judgmental.

She has lived an unbelievably rough life. Still her faith is unwavering, as is her unconditional love for her family. She is an amazing woman that is a living example of Christianity to me.


stephhicks68 profile image

stephhicks68 8 years ago from Bend, Oregon Author

I so appreciate both of you for commenting. My family members that are born again Christians have had really rough lives. Diabetes since age 9, drug use, infertility, etc. I really don't blame them at all for turning their lives over to God and Christ! I think its great! I started this Hub trying to understand what and why and how this phenomenon comes about. I have a strong relationship to God and Jesus, but its not like that. I'm still trying to understand. I hope more people read this and comment. Because I want to know more! Thanks again!


Peter M. Lopez profile image

Peter M. Lopez 8 years ago from Sweetwater, TX

Great hub, steph. I appreciate you wearing your heart on your sleeve like this. Actually I wrote about Nicodemus too, just a few minutes ago. I'm not promoting, just saving you the time of tracking it down, if you're interested. The term "born again" causes so much confusion, and unnecessarily so. I think we do too good a job of making things too complicated. The new birth is simply a spiritual new birth. If you have received the Holy Spirit you have been born again.

Paul says the Spirit doesn't come in just word, but in power. Most people never experience the power, so they have no choice but to wonder. I commend your exploration.

http://hubpages.com/misc/Heavenly-Humor-Irony-From...


Lissie profile image

Lissie 8 years ago from New Zealand

Great hub - it is a pleasure to see that today's topic is producing some well-thought out hubs which contrast to the partisan rubbish I found when I checked the "religion" tag earlier! I think one of the tragic parts of many proteslysing (sp?) of which Christianity is one, is that they tend to prey on people who have something missing in their lives and are looking for the "one stop shop" to solve all their problems be they self-imposed or situational.

I'm not trying to be promotional but I must say that I think the Monty Python Team did a very good job at explaining the difference between God or Jesus and religion in the movie http://hubpages.com/hub/Monty-Python-Life-of-Brian


PenmanZee profile image

PenmanZee 8 years ago

Tried to post a comment but found myself going too long. Wrote hub by the same name instead.


SweetiePie profile image

SweetiePie 8 years ago from Southern California, USA

This is a very good hub and it got me thinking.  I think going to church and being a Christian or whatever faith people choose is great, but we should not judge each other.  You make some good points.  I like Catholics and I have always felt very accepted in their churches, whereas some other groups made me feel bad if I did not go to their church every Sunday.  I think whatever people decide to do is good, but we should not judge each other.  Well said! I am a Christian and I believe in Christ, but I never impose my views on anyone. That is just my path, but we all must have our own.


amy jane profile image

amy jane 8 years ago from Connecticut

Hey steph, brave hub! I can understand where you are coming from. I was raised by a Catholic father and a "born again" mother so I am intensly familiar with the differences. Not all born again Christians are alike, trying to convert everyone they meet and saying Hallelujiah! every five minutes. And not all Catholics go to confession regularly or even mass occasionally or devote their lives to God entirely, although i know some who do. Ah. Too much to say on this...


kerryg profile image

kerryg 8 years ago from USA

I was homeschooled for much of my pre-college education, and as a result, my family became pretty well acquainted with many born-again Christians, with very similar musings to those you've laid out here. It's nice to know we are not alone in scratching our heads a little over the phenomenon. It's always been a rather disturbing disconnect for me to hear our born again friends, who are wonderful, kind, and loving people, talk with such relish of the Rapture and the End Times, a period that by their own admission will cast anyone who has not "accepted Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior" into a lake of fire for all eternity, regardless of whether they have lived a good life or a bad one, the only requirement for salvation being acceptance of a particularly narrow and controversial set of beliefs that bears, actually, almost no resemblance to anything Jesus actually said.

For just one example, look at all those megachurches taking tithes from people who really can't afford to give them, and preaching that God wants them to be rich, that God makes the deserving rich, as though Jesus had not raged against that very attitude more than almost any other. "It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God," He said, but I almost wonder if many of these Born Again Christians even read the Gospels. They seem to quote from almost everything but. Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Corinthians, Revelations, etc. etc. etc. Where are Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John?


stephhicks68 profile image

stephhicks68 8 years ago from Bend, Oregon Author

I so appreciate everyone reading this hub and writing comments! I am so glad that everyone has their own experiences with religion, Christianity, and even being "born again." Truly, I did learn a lot in researching this hub, and broadened my own mind. Again, thank you! This was a bit risky....


ColeMartin profile image

ColeMartin 8 years ago from Orange County, CA

A lot of interesting perspectives but I could not resist adding my two cents here. I am a Christian. But religion is a personal journey and although I respect the opinions shared in and about this hub, I believe that you need to examine the entire Bible to form your views. While fanatical religious extremist have been at the root of the bloodiest wars in history, it is a shame that people take it upon themselves to judge and attempt to control others. God states over and over in the Bible that he is a God of Love. If people would lead by example instead of forcing their views on others I believe the world would be a much better place.

I am tying to keep this short but as Angela Harris shared about the Christian woman in her life, I believe that being a Christian is to try to act "Christ-like" meaning be humble, be a servant and help others, be a loving and compassionate person. Let the power of your relationship with Christ or your higher power show in your actions. It does not mean that if you are successful you won't get into Heaven, but the point I believe that Christ was making was that you can only serve one God.

I am not saying that you shouldn't follow the laws as they are laid out in scripture but that that is your choice through free will. Being in judgement of of others is a direct counter-diction to what Christ teaches. "How can you point out the speck in your neighbors eye without removing the log from your own."

I know some extremist, I guess they would call themselves born again but their behavior is just as obsessive as any other addiction and personally I don't believe that defines a Christian. It unfortunately taints the views of those in questions.

Sorry this was so long.


SirDent 8 years ago

What defines a Christian is one who comes to Christ. Jesus didn't reject anyone who came to Him with a broken heart and a contrite spirit. He accepted them all no matter what they did. He still accepts them today, but one must go to Him.

Many reject Him today as they did when he walked the earth as a man.

Kerryg mentioned the megachurches taking tithes from people. People give their tithes. To my knowledge the churches do not force them to pay tithes. God loves a cheerful giver. If one has to be coerced into giving then the person may as well keep it.

I am not condoning how some pastors manipulate people into feeling guilty. I have seen it time and time again and I hate to see it. No matter what they do though, my salvation in Christ is personal to me. It has nothing to do with anyone else.

Sometimes people get too emotional in their walk with Christ and seem pushy. I have done ti myself, but I believe I have grown to the point where I can do it the way Jesus would have it done. I still fall short, but I am on the right way.


kerryg profile image

kerryg 8 years ago from USA

SirDent, yes, to the best of my knowledge people are not forced to give tithes, but the social pressure to do so is certainly very strong, and there have been numerous cases of pastors popular among the "Born Again" taking their flock's money and using it for things like Caribbean vacations and fancy cars, while justifying it to themselves and their flocks as God rewarding the "deserving."

Even when the pastor isn't an unscrupulous hypocrite, I've seen poor "Quiverfull" families with 7, 8, 9, or more kids giving money to the church for missionary work that would have been better spent on feeding their own children, and in several cases providing medical care for the younger ones. The youngest child (of 10, in about 14 years) of one of the families I knew was born without an esophagus and in need of constant attention to make sure he didn't remove his feeding/breathing tube (he was 2), and the family made many sacrifices in order to pay both his medical bills and their church's tithes. Now, I am all in favor of donating to charity, even, perhaps especially, if you have to make sacrifices to do it. But sacrificing a new car or an iPod or a night out at a nice restaurant is one thing. Driving your own family into abject poverty is quite another.


ZEV profile image

ZEV 8 years ago from Way Out West

I love any and all faith based businesses. Heck, you don't have to manufacture a thing. You sell a belief strictly based on faith. Something you can neither see nor hold in your hands. Millions of dollars is taken in each year by pastors who fly around in jets, or build mansions for their families. Your right, no one is forced to give tithing, but they do full well knowing that the money they give is going to make those at the top rich. It makes my stomach turn when I see one of these so called preachers telling his flock that God or Jesus wants them to give him money. I hear tell they even have ATM's in churches now. Give me a break, God nor Jesus wants you to give money. Have faith in yourselves! If you turned the faith you have in Jesus inward to reflect the faith in yourself you would become powerful beyond believe. But because we're human we think we have to believe in something or someone out side of ourselves to tell or show us how to act or live. When we let loose of our crutch and soar on our own there will be no limit to what we can do. What would this world look like if we weren't fighting over religion?


SirDent 8 years ago

Zev, I don't know anything about ATMs in churches. If a person gives money, time or anything at all to God freely who is to tell them not to? As I stated before, if a person gives begrudgingly he/she may as well keep it.

God is more than able to keep those who are in need. He exepcts us to ask for what we need. If a person is hungry and doesn't ask for food, they may keep going hungry. To be humble before God is a good thing. To be humble before man is a good thing.


mrs know it all profile image

mrs know it all 8 years ago from The Windy City Suburbs

"holy can of worms"! hahahaha Steph, I just wanted to say that I respect that you were brave enough to display your opinions in such an open forum. This is a great hub just based on the mere controversy it may cause. Since I'm such a new hubber I'll play it safe for now LOL

God moves us all in different ways at different times. What's right for one person may not be for another, but anyone with faith finds ministry, (or it finds them) even if in small ways. One example in my blog: http://one-stop-mommy-shop.blogspot.com

I think your ministry was to create this hub, and like you said, for your own greater understanding. How could someone not respect that?


stephhicks68 profile image

stephhicks68 8 years ago from Bend, Oregon Author

Mrs Know it all - thank you... were it not for the contest, I don't think I would have published this - at least not now. Then again, it has been interesting for me to learn in my research and certainly through the comments. I do have an open mind! thank you for reading and adding your thoughts! steph


Rik Ravado profile image

Rik Ravado 8 years ago from England

Great Hub Steph.

I think the views on both sides have been well put. I am friendly with people who would refer to themselves as 'born again'. But I find the phrase unhelpful because some who use it are over simplistic and worse, judgemental of others.

Once Christians loose sight of God's love and grace then the whole point of Christianity is lost. Paul sums it up well in 1 Cor 13. "Now we see but a poor reflection. But one day we shall see clearly. Now we know in part but one day we will know fully." (paraphrase only).

In other words we mustn't assume to KNOW the truth fully during this lifetime. We are simple called to love God and one another as best we can.

(I can't believe Rik Ravado just wrote that.)


stephhicks68 profile image

stephhicks68 8 years ago from Bend, Oregon Author

Rik, what a great quote from Corinthians! Thank you for insightful comments. Steph


mary 7 years ago

I let a friendship that I treasured go because I grew tired of being judged and corrected by a born again friend who knew it all. She often said things like *I have the answer - now what is the question* and it all got a bit much. We are human beings and therefore not perfect whether born again or not. I cannot quote the bible chapter and verse but know right from wrong I hope and am humble enough to admit that I make mistakes and am not always in the right. Please pray for this friendship.


stephhicks68 profile image

stephhicks68 7 years ago from Bend, Oregon Author

Hi Mary, I have definitely been in your shoes. I am sorry you are having difficulties with your friend and I will indeed pray that you can each accept each other for who you are.

Best, Steph


Arbery  7 years ago

I actually just became a born again christian. I was baptized November 30th. Born again means like Jesus who was baptized that we have let go of our past before we became baptized that we are to be reborn into christ. to be dedicated to the lord Jesus.. ..


diana 7 years ago

I went to a christian church for several month. I learned a lot about bible scripture. But I was so turned off by being judged all the time by my friends that took me there in the first place. If you don't go to church everyday and completely give up everything in your life you don't belong. You are being judged or made to feel that you are doing something wrong. born again christians are very knowledgeable a tool used to show others that they know it all. I don't think god wanted christians to act this way. I just stay way. They are not the example only god is. born again christians must not be getting the right translations from the bible in the way they act... God is love!!!!


mikeq107 7 years ago

Hi steph :0)

Great hub!!!

I wrote this some time back...thought you might like it.

If it takes up to please much space, please feel free to delete...

sorry I have been a stranger, not been on the net much to much going on...

Michael :0)

1. OH FATHER WHERE ART THOU?

Where in the world is God today?

In this fast paced modern Hi Tech internet age has He fallen behind like the rest of the people who refused to conform to the latest craze or fad? Did He pack His bags and head off to a distant planet to start all over again? Only this time no forbidden fruit on a tree and Satan has been left behind to terrorize those that did not make the grade.

If you look at the growth of religious orders and gospels and mega churches He should be able to find a welcome spot. Or have they all just a knowledge of Him or more to the point taken some of His Son's many words and published their version of the Gospel of Jesus and would not know him if he showed up in person? Or maybe he would not meet the educational "No Saint left behind requirements"!

Many of these well meaning organizations have myriads of information on Him and His creation, and followers can quote many of His sacred scriptures, but then again volumes have been written on Shakespeare by people who claim to be authorities on good old Will, but they have never even talked or shared a beer with the guy! Yet for some reason known only to themselves, know how he lived, felt, and thought. Sounds kind of crazy, and yet if Will came back to life and walked among them would they accept him into their fold? Or would they have painted such an unrealistic picture of him that they would call him an impostor and politely ask him to leave? Book him into a mental hotel or Find him a place on Jerry Springer...." See Willy slap the Dickens out of Prince Charles live on Springer!!!!

I think its time someone yelled stop the bus! And let's see who is actually on it..... and why we let them on in the first place? Many of us from birth because of the environment we were raised in have been yoked with burdens that were never a predestined load to bear and all this has accomplished so far (For some of us!) is the slowing down and hindering of our growth and wellbeing.

For example if you grew up in a religious organization you were at an early age introduced to their doctrinal lenses on the world around you.

After a while you would become a clone, marry a clone and produce more clones.

Sounds exciting!!! Amen!

On the other hand you could have had non religious parents who were independent free thinkers and encouraged you to explore and discover the ends of the earth and live a vibrant life. With encouragement like that the world would be your Oyster and you would be a cool person to hang out with and your of spring would be fruitful and multiply? (Sounds real attractive to me)

Then of course you could have grown up in a drug, alcohol, dysfunctional family environment. Learned how to yell, fight, self sabotage and in general live a very depressing and unhealthy life, you know! Marry, Divorce, Re Marry produce more unhappy Fagan's (Oliver twist), who unless they received some serious intervention would carry on the family tradition and be the butt end of comedians jokes. The chances of an early checkout in that sinario are pretty good!

Another case that could find a home in the first and third paragraph above is race and color and that has been the catalyst for some pretty distraous consequences on account of mans false illusions about his superiority.

Now if our mental heath is dependent upon the environment we have grown up in! Then Darwin's theory of the survival of the fittest would most definitely come into play and the world would be a very unfair place, would it not. Just ask your local Rabbi! But that's not happening is it?

Ok! Now ask yourself if there is a God...Where in the world is he in all of this, I mean why would he create man and then let him of the leash only to mess up the backyard and scare of the neighbors. Is this the loving thing to-do?

If you look at the last 2000 years we have had one religious war after another. The middle east, northern Ireland, The Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, WW2( Yes Hitler believed he was doing gods work by eradicating the Jewish population), Bosnia . So if God is a religious God I sure don't want to meet him and most defiantly not on a bad day.

Maybe he is in corporate America? Then again they don't really have a head just a breathing mass of hungry share holders and some for some reason known only to themselves are always hungry for more and will never be satisfied and yes maybe there are some corporations that do genuinely care, can't think of any at the moment lol. But they do care about their public image and the good old bottom line and if you have ever had a pink slip then you know all about corporate unconditional love, no security there!

Now I don't think he lives in statues or religious artifacts because if that was the case you could buy him take home and pop him up on the mantel piece or nail him to the wall or better still stick your old bathtub out in the front lawn end up and depending on which God is in vogue proudly display it, kneel before it, and ask it lots of questions even pray to it. I have news for you whether its made of wood, alabaster or a precious metal it wont answer you back and if it did your property would be declared a scared spot and there goes your peace and quiet as you struggle home through the candle awed multitudes.

I have lived in this country (North America) since June 25th 1988 and while I love the vastness and beauty of this contentment I'm not in love with American Christianity. My journey through the American churches has been sadly disappointing. I came here with a passion for God and all that he has to offer us. I expected (naively) that the church here would be just as passionate, but I was greatly disappointed. You see I had and still have a wonderful love for god and the glorious wonders and life he has to offer through an intimate relationship with him.

Over the past 20 years I have only met a hand full of people who were thoroughly passionate about God, the vast majority had a knowledge about him or were more concerned about their status before others or telling other Christians how they should live their lives or building their own kingdoms and bringing converts into the same bondage as themselves. In short I believe God brought me to this country to teach me how to love the lost sheep of his flock and it has been very hard class to take! Many times I have wanted to quit. But as I slowly progress and gain his understanding of unconditional love I gain understanding of how he feels by the churches rejection of his love. All God wanted in the very beginning was a relationship with Adam and eve. It was so simple! God having healthy fellowship with his creation. They talked about everything and laughed at each others humor , there were no big list of rules to follow except one don't eat the fruit of just one tree....that was it! Yes we all know the rest of the story and the resulting fall out. The world has not lived in peace since and will not until it surrenders its false illusions of grandeur and superiority at the foot of his throne and accepts the free gift of his son Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

There is no other way, the struggle has been going on for centuries and will continue until Jesus returns to claim those that love and follow him and those that have rejected him will tragically not enter into his eternal peace and life everlasting.

So where is God? He is here right now ready and willing to enter your life and the best way to ask him in is to ask him or his


Smireles profile image

Smireles 7 years ago from Texas

Hello Steph,

I am a born again Christian who has lived for the Lord since I was a child. You ask some very good questions, and make some very good points. I am a person of great faith and maintain a regular prayer life. However, I totally disagree with those preachers who talk about the prosperity doctrine. It cannot be found in the Bible. God promised to supply your needs. He did not promise to make you rich.

Jesus said to let your light shine before men that they may see your good works and glorify God. He did not say to take a sword and beat the gospel into people. Leading by example is what Jesus meant.

I think that some people become judgmental without quite knowing it. However, that was never in God's plan. Jesus said plainly, judge not, lest you be judged.

As one who has been involved in the church for a long, long, time I understand your questions about ministers who take money and spend it on luxuries for themselves and their families. I have come to believe that the tithing structure in most churches should be changed and the management of church money should be changed. I believe that the minister should not be paid more than the mean income of the congregation. A man who lives above the standard income of his people does not understand the people and cannot offer the advice in a pastoral way that is appropriate.

But, in spite of all this I am still a follower of Jesus Christ. I did not sign on to follow a person who may or may not lead me in the right way. I try to follow the leading of the pastor, but the same Bible that instructed us to obey them that have the rule over you, also said to know them that labor among you.

I became acquainted with Jesus Christ a long time ago and I find no fault with him. I need nothing more. That is why I am still a Christian. People wil fail you. Jesus Christ will not.


Born-again Believer  7 years ago

I'm so excited you're interested in coming to know the Lord. I've been letting myself doubt - a sin in itself and especially dangerous for born-again believers to give into - that anyone really cares about God at all anymore. After all, our society in itself constantly pushes that everyone just do what thou wilt and forget all consequences. However, there is always a price to be paid for every action, both in this life and in eternity.

As for your quest, when you seek the Lord with all your heart (begin by reading the Bible for yourself and asking God - aka praying - to reveal it to you; don't go to others yet to explain; let God prove to you that His Word doesn't come back void), He will be found. Being born-again can only occur when you see yourself as God already sees you - a lost soul that is currently poor, miserable, blind and naked despite your own attempts to cloth it with works of righteousness, which are as filthly rages before the Lord. God has 10 commandments. If you've broken even one (e.g., Jesus says that if you've ever been angry with someone, you've murdered them; sin starts in the heart and is eventually manifested by outward, bodily actions - like in cursing someone out when angry), you're guilty of breaking all 10/the Law (this is what He'll judge non-born-again people by when they stand before Him on the Day of Judgment; born-again people will be spared if they appear before Him clothed in the righteousness of Christ: lived the rest of their lives in submitted obedience to Him as the Holy Spirit led after being born-again).

Once you realize you're a sinner like God already sees, call upon the name of the Lord and be saved. For this, the Lord Jesus Christ came to earth, died and rose again - to give eternal life to all those who believe on Him, even His name. This is how one becomes born-again. Then, to grow you must continue following Christ with the rest of your life - this is why born-again Christians don't drink (we're not to be drunk on wine wherein is excess/gluttony but to be filled with the Spirit; in order to keep in proper fellowship with God, we must continually strive to now walk in the Spirit so we don't fulfill the lusts - lying, anger, sexual lusts, etc. - of our flesh; we don't want to fulfill fleshly lusts because this cuts off our fellowship with God again as no flesh can glory in His presence; when we do sin again, though, we have the privilege to confess our sin to God who is faithful and just to forgive us our sin and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness committed during our re-rebellion: the continual mercies and everlasting lovingkindness of God displayed in a believer's life).

We go to church regularly to fellowship with other likeminded believers as people generally conform to those they hang with most. As well, where two or more are gathered in the Lord's name, there He is in the midst - we've even more of the presence of the Lord and His mind is manifest in a greater way in our midst when we fellowship together by which the Lord then uses us to reprove and edify one another (hence the sermons, testimony time, prayer time, etc. we practice while together). Church is the actual body of believers unified by the Holy Spirit who gives us the mind of Christ to live by when we're gathered together physically or just in the Spirit like happens in private and corporate prayer. It's not a place or event as false forms of Christianity generally showcase today - just going to "church" to do God a favor or even earn merit with Him, etc. but not walking away changed more into the image of Christ - from glory to glory He's changing me.

By the way, if you read this comment and then begin reading the Bible you'll see I've used scripture throughout. The only way to understand any of this really, though, is to tell God you want to believe and then let Him lead you to begin literally trusting Him from His first words in Genesis 1:1 ("In the beginning, God created ...", not chance like evolution claims) to the last word in Revelation 22:21 ("Amen.").

Hope this helps.


cces profile image

cces 7 years ago from New Jersey

As a Christian I avoid using the term "born again", not because it's incorrect, just because of the stigma that it carries. Most people have a false perception of what it means and they can't get passed that terminology.

As far as some of your points are concerned, I think you must have had experiences with the wrong type of people or churches. In terms of giving money to the church, I do so regularly, but I've never felt pressured by the church, and I have been a church goer my whole life.

The same thing goes for the judgement issue. I don't feel that my church or those that I am friends with a judgmental. Many churches today are very welcoming and receptive to anyone, but that's not the common perception.


AlexiusComnenus profile image

AlexiusComnenus 7 years ago from GA

Most Christians today only talk about their faith, not walk it. If the Christians really did stand up and walk their faith this country would not be in the situation it is today. Slaughtering millions of innocent children is not a characteristic of a Christian nation. God blesses the righteous actions of a righteous nation. "The prayers of a humble man availeth much." This nation is not humble. Christians are not active in spreading their faith. They are not active in showing Christ's love. We have blended in with a nation of hypocrites and shallow feelings.


Hxprof 7 years ago from Clearwater, Florida

I agree with you Alexius. Most of us (Christians) believe that once we're saved then everything is set-we're gradually transformed by the Holy Spirit until Christ's character becomes our own. And that's the problem; we're seeing that few Christians are being, "Transformed from within by the renewal of our minds". We walk, the vast majority of us, not as Christ walked, but trying to supress our sinful desires that are still with us rather than cooperating with the Holy Spirit as God "works in us both to will and to do for His good pleasure". You can blame it on many things....I place the blame on false doctrine.


Kanna-Saved by Gods Grace 7 years ago

1. THE Lord has said that until a man is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God. Let alone ‘entering’, he cannot even see it. The bodily eyes see only physical and material things. But God is a Spirit, and to see Him and His Spiritual Kingdom we must be born of the Spirit (John 3:5-6), and then not only will our spiritual eyes see Him, but we shall also reign with Him.

When a man repents of his sin and turns to God, then the Spirit of God works in him, and he is born anew and becomes a new creature, and then and there the Kingdom of God, or Paradise, begins in him. Christ said to the thief on the Cross. ‘ To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise’ (Luke 23:43). This shows that the Lord had full knowledge of and authority over Paradise. He did not say, ‘ Perhaps after sometime you will be with me in Paradise,’ nor that, ‘ I shall go there first and get permission from God, and then arrange for you.’ But as an owner speaking with authority of His rightful possession He gave this comfort to the dying thief, and took this the firstfruits of His Cross with Him to Paradise. So those who now are crucified to sin and the world with Him are on that very day born again, and entering Paradise, or the Kingdom of God, feel a wonderful joy and peace in their hearts. Worldly- minded men can neither ‘see’ the peace of Paradise, nor can they understand what is the meaning of this new birth, or of the Kingdom of God.


Kanna- Jesus Took my Sins upon Him 7 years ago

2. The Lord gives every man his chance to repent, and be born anew, and enter into the Kingdom of God. He knew what kind of man Judas Iscariot was, and how he would betray Him. Still He did not treat him with harshness, but gave him the precious opportunity of living with Him. No one can say that He did not give an evil man his chance. But Judas committed the great folly, that, instead of repenting of his sin and coming back to Christ, he went out and hanged himself. So nowadays there are many who commit Judas’ sin, and instead of entering into Paradise and the Kingdom of God, they go to their own place, and are punished (Acts 1 : 25 ).

‘His own place,’ or hell, means a condition in which man by he exercise of his own free will, in disobedience to God, creates a state of suffering within himself. Hell is not the name of a particular place because if it is a place, then God, Who is present in every place, would then have one part of His being in hell-and that can never be possible. But hell is a state which does not exist in God, and the true worshipper, who is in spiritual union with God, will be saved for ever from this state of sin and its suffering.

Wherever God is there is heaven, or the Kingdom of God, but God is present everywhere, therefore heaven is everywhere. Knowing this, His true worshippers are happy everywhere, and under all conditions, whether in pain or discomfort, whether among friends or among enemies, or whether in this world or in the world to come. For they live in God, and God lives in them eternally; and this is the Kingdom of God (Luke 17 : 20 –21 ).

Outwardly, the sinner may appear to live in a state of ease and luxury, but he can never get rid of the disquiet of his heart. If indeed he could enter heaven, that also would be hell to him, because hell is in his heart itself. He cannot enter the Kingdom of God till his heart is changed and he is born anew.


Kanna - Born again - Spiritual Birth 7 years ago

3. The Kingdom of God is the Kingdom of Love, A man of God saw in a vision that he had gone into a strange country. When he arrived there he was astonished that the people of that land came out and welcomed him with joy, as if he were a long-lost brother, or a friend who had just returned to them. He went into the city with them, and saw great mansions in which were all kinds of furniture, but their owners had gone out and lest them open. He asked some of the men why this was, and they said, ‘There are no thieves here. As long as men’s hearts are locked up to God, so long do they need to lock their doors. But when the door of the heart is open to God, and He lives in it, then there is no need to put a look on any door; for where the Kingdom of God is in the heart it is the Kingdom of Love, where each serves the other in love and desires only his good. Once there were two brothers here. The younger brother learned that the elder had need of some goods, so he took a quantity and set out to take them to his brother’s house. It also happened that the same thought of helping the younger had accurred to the elder brother. They were moved by love alone, and without either saying anything to the other, each set out for the other’s house with some goods. They met on the road. When each saw the unselfish love of the other, they embraced in real happiness. This is the way we should help and love one another, and seek good of our fellowmen.

When the stranger had gone on a little further, he saw a man and an angel meet as true brothers, and begin with one heart worshipping Christ, the Incarnation of Love. On seeing this the stranger’s heart was filled with inexpressible love and happiness, and instinctively be exclaimed, ‘Without doubt this is the Kingdom of God, and our real and eternal home for which the heart of man longs.’ Although heaven begins in man’s heart while he is in the world, yet it continues beyond this life in that state where there is neither suffering, nor pain, nor death, nor tears, but endless life and unbroken joy.


yes2truth profile image

yes2truth 7 years ago from England

Hello

You said:

"What I'd like to examine is what apparently causes a person to decide to take their otherwise fairly normal life and dedicate it almost exclusively to Jesus."

Now here is a deception. Anyone who tells you THEY MADE THE DECISION to follow the Lord Jesus Christ has, in effect, told you a lie. This in turn tells you that they are not Born Again even if they say that they are.

John 6:44 (KJV) No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

We have to be called by The Father in order to follow The Lord. Salvation is in His Hands, not ours.


fishmox profile image

fishmox 7 years ago from where my laptop sits, that be where I am

The term "born again" has been much abused for so many years now.

The Scripture you say that technically REQUIRES a rebirth is not a requirement at all.

Jesus was telling Nicodemus that he will not see the kingdom of God unless he was born from above and it was no requirement at all because one cannot make himself born again, nor can he do certain actions in order to be born again.

It is something that God Himself initiates, and accomplishes in a person.

Those who would make "accepting Christ as Savior" the pre-requisite or the "key" to becoming born again often quote the Scripture you cited, plus John 1:12 which says "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:"

But, notice that colon after "name" ?

That is there because the next verse is a continuation of what is being said, which is, "Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

In other words, Jesus was telling Nicodemus that unless God had made him regenerate (born from above, born again) Nicodemus would never understand what Jesus was saying, evident in his question on how can somebody be born again, should he go back into this mother's womb ?

Other misconceptions.

Repent and be born again. False. You repent BECAUSE you are born again.

Accept Christ, and be born again. False. You accept Christ or receive Christ, BECAUSE you are born from above (Christ said, "my sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they know me".


acousticproject profile image

acousticproject 7 years ago from Dallas, Tx

Hey

I totally understand, that was really good. Jesus is amazing.


christianesk profile image

christianesk 7 years ago from The Global Hamlet

Thanks for baring your soul regarding being born again.

Love one another in truth. Let us love one another...

Seek the truth diligently Steph, and oh, by the way, great smile - you have been saluted! http://hubpages.com/style/Use-Your-Beauty-For-Good


Seasons of Life profile image

Seasons of Life 7 years ago from Southern California

I agree with ColeMartin. Lead by example. Agape Love. Read the whole Bible the truth is all there. I have a good friend that left his wife because she became a born again Christian and they started going to small groups and she would throw him under the bus in front of these people. He couldn't take it anymore and now the words Born Again has left a bad taste in his mouth which is unfortunate. I hope one day he will change his views and not be afraid of the word Born Again.

This is a good example why Christians should be careful with their actions. We are to bring people to Christ not push them away.

Thank you for your Hub Steph!


Mighty Mom profile image

Mighty Mom 7 years ago from Where Left is Right, CA

Hi Steph, I followed Seasons for Life over here and am glad I did. You raise a question a lot of us wonder about but are too afraid (or polite) to ask directly to those who claim to be born again.

Totally agree -- my experience with those who claim to be "Born Again" has not been positive. These seemingly narrow-minded, uptight zealots proseltyze and judge anyone who is not the same kind of "christian" they are (small c used for emphasis). I'm sorry, but if Catholicism is good enough for the Italians, Irish, French, Mexicans, Filipinos and various other groups around the world, I find it arrogant that someone would put "my" brand of Christianity

below theirs.

To me, if you are a Christian your actions will speak for themselves (or as the song I used to love as a young girl says, "And they'll know we are Christians by our love). Why do you have to qualify it with Born Again?


m-perth-aus 7 years ago

Hi i never gave much thought to "born again christian" until my sister in law converted she has changed by distancing herself from her own brother & family i am disappointed in the change as i thought christians loved all but to me it seems they can only love you & be with you if you are "born again" how can they now convince us they are the right religion when they are judging us yet Jesus never did we believe & love the Lord but it makes us wonder about this group the negativity they are creating it feels as though they read the bible but dont understand or interpet it correctly really disappointed a religion ruining a family.


Equalizer1001 7 years ago

Hi Steph,

I am of the Catholic faith and have been spending time with a "Born Again Christian" who seams to look down on those of any denomination of Christianity other than their own. It has been a struggle to communicate concerning matters of the scriptures. I have grown and am growing in the process with a greater understanding of my own faith.

One thing it seems is a great amount of difference between the "Born Again" and Catholic faith stems from the Catholic's tradition and rituals which seems to be perceived as evil by the "Born Again" sect. From what I can tell, there are more similarities than differences with the two and these are what should be focused on to achieve a commend ground for those who have an interest in doing so.

To be a Christian you need to be "born again" so I'm guessing most, if not all denominations of the Christian faith have some point of the excepting process that they promise to give their life to Christ. I propose that to be "born again" is part of the process of becoming a Christian no matter what form it takes; a Born Again Christian is a redundancy for all Christian are "born again" by it's very definition.


skates 7 years ago

i started reading and kinda just started skipping through about halfway down (this is a loooooong thread) so if i repeat something someone else said, sorry in advance

not sure the beliefs on everyone here but from what i read most seem to be of christian/catholic belief to some extent or another so i wanted to give a slightly different point of view as an agnostic for lack of a better fitting description

i can't say i dont believe in god, nor can i say i do, but the same philosophy applies to just about every aspect of my life, in my opinion, its downright conceited of any person to either proclaim or disclaim the existence of any entity without proof, you cant say god exists without proof and you cant say he doesn't, but that theory also applies to many other subjects, aliens, ghosts, etc etc. now that i have explained my point of view and probably made a few enemies, let me continue on with the subject.

in my opinion, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, that being said that same right entitles them to not have the beliefs of others forced down their throats and thats where my opinion becomes a point of contention with some, let me cite 2 prime examples of what i mean from personal experiences

1: when i was about 16 years old (35 yrs old now) i was at the local mall with a friend of mine, we were typical teenagers hanging out at the mall on a friday night, outside the doors smoking when we were approached by a slightly older gentleman approx. 23-25 yrs old or so who started a generic conversation with us, so we obliged and started chatting with him, all seemed normal....until we decided to go back inside and find the rest of our group, his "parting" comment to us was (i will try to get it as close as possible but you will get the rough idea) "by the way i am a member of XXX church on XXX street and we would love it if you guys stopped by to our mass tomorrow night" to which we both replied, politely, no thanks man not interested, this gentleman then proceeded to follow us around the mall for almost an hour until he broke my final straw when we sat down at a table in the food court to eat and he took it upon himself to sit at our table with us and continue on, i had had enough and happen to be on real good terms with the head of security so i had the gentleman escorted away from us and warned by the local PD...sadly it doesn't end there, about 2 weeks later i saw this same guy near a corner store by my house and he then followed me all the way to a friends how yeling behind me about how i would be damned if i didn't come to his church

2: this example is much shorter as it was only a single encounter with an individual although this one went way further in its briefness than the other i believe, i was hanging outside of a local convenience store wearing my jean jacket, and as was the style in the 80's and 90's i had patches of bands and such all over it, the back patch on this jean jacket was the cover of Mercyful Fate's Don't Break the Oath album, the guy proceeded to literally start screaming at me at the top of his lungs on one of the busiest streets in our city that, and this is an exact quote i remember it vividly, my "soul belong to satan" because of the patch on my jean jacket

in summary, the way i see it, everyone has a right to their belief, but when you try to force that belief down someone else's throat you have carried it over a line that you had no right to cross, if you want to walk up to someone and say "do you have a minute so i can talk to you about my religious beliefs" thats just fine, but if they reply with "no" or "i am not interested" then you need to say "ok" and just walk away...or find another subject to discuss, if you push the issue beyond that then you are no longer exercising your rights you are now infringing upon mine, and honestly, if you cant think of another subject to discuss other than you religious belief, then you need to review your religious belief because if it has reached a point of becoming all consuming, then you have reached a point where its just flat out unhealthy


Jay48 7 years ago

All the 'born again' Christians I have met have seemed to be hypocrites.


Mary 7 years ago

I am Catholic. I have been my 42 years of life. I am married and my children attend a private Catholic school. My stepdaughter was diagnosed last year with Type 1 Diabetes. This Thanksgiving my brother-in-law cornered my husband and I at the end of the day and began talking about his faith. He began telling us that his church had faith healing and that we should not rely upon science to heal our daughter, that doing things such as the JDRF walk etc. was wrong. He kept saying "if she were MY daughter....". Then he attacked us by saying "what is Catholic???". He kept asking us how we prayed and if we talked to God. He said he met God personally in the 1980's and was saved. He wanted us to be saved or we would go to hell.

I have to tell you...I ended up telling my BIL to leave my home and I cried for an hour after he left. I felt so attacked and violated. I have a strong belief in God and my own faith and I believe everyone needs to worship in the way they feel is best for themselves. No way is wrong. After all, we all have the same goal and meaning...we believe in God. I just felt so hurt that my BIL put me down for what I believed in. He stood in judgment of me and acted like he was God himself. I further took great pain in hearing him talk to me and my husband about our daughter, acting like we do not do everything possible for her with her illness. I do pray every day for a miracle and for her life to be better, but I also believe doing things such as the JDRF walk is not wrong. It's a support system. It's okay to believe in science and faith both. My BIL has no clue what we go through on a daily basis with my daughter in dealing with such an illness.

So I ask...how is this right for a born again Christian to stand in judgment like this and to criticize? I really don't understand why he did this to us. I still am emotional about it.


amad 6 years ago

Why do you personify God, and why there's the rejection of thought and inquiry, and verification.

I believe in Jesus and the bible, but why those 'new' concepts all the time, and why those newer versions that we need to update ourselves with.

There's a need of thought and analysis that's being neglected, the truth is not as we see here. The truth is hidden everywhere today and needs to be explored.


FarrahZimer profile image

FarrahZimer 6 years ago

Nice Hub. You are very sincere in your exposition. I am a 'bornie' myself ... was raised catholic but fell away in my late teens and found Protestanism better fitted my mind frame. Being a 'follower' of Christ is not easy ... 'judging' others is a human habit. We always feel our way is the best way and many try to pass it onto others in a very harsh way... when I first became a Christian I did just that, but it was only because I felt such a need to share this joy with everyone I loved, I was overbearing.

I am more tempered now, but I still believe in sharing 'the way' of Christ with as many people as I can, as it is what Jesus commanded after all. We are all imperfect beings and will continue to be until we depart this world, so condemning is unacceptable, but judging (in the discerning sense) is a must for all of us in all areas of our life.


Marym 6 years ago

My take on being 're-born' is that it is a psychological need to throw all of your problems on someone else's (God's)shoulders. You thus become free of the stress you are causing yourself with your problems. It then becomes an obsession because if you let it go, then all those problems become your responsibility again. So you start studying the Bible to find verification of this obsessive thinking and find so many passages that you can interpret to justify your thinking that you now become obsessesed with the Bible.

The next step is to let everyone know, because the more people you can convince of these 'truths' the more secure you feel about yourself. You then think that you have all the answers and people should just trust you to get them saved. I would be more convinced of their sincerity if they would just 'live' their brand of faith by example and never breathe a word to anyone their secret of kindness, loving and forgiving of others. I could love someone like that a lot and want to pattern my behavior on theirs without having their 'secret' thrust on me every other day.

As it is, I see them only as having an obsessive-compulsive

disorder and I certainly would not want to go down that path.


paravelian 6 years ago

being a born again christian is not merely an organized religion. . it is better viewed as an intimate relationship with God. . but sadly not all born again Christians embraces that fact.. we must have that "true born again experience" just like what happened to PAul. . from an unbeliever he became a preacher..i believe the best way to show God's glory in your life is to show it through your actions. .


jonathan chm 6 years ago

How could a non-Christian be born again?

Should a person use only one verse to conclude messages that God intends for us? Let’s meditate Matthew 5:9 as follows: Matthew 5:9, “Blessed [are] the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God”. As the word, peacemakers, is mentioned in Matthew 5:9 with the phrase, the children of God, a false message could come about that as long as a person, whether he is a believer or not, declares peace in this world, he or she could be considered as a child of God or a Christian. Thus, using a verse to conclude God’s message is erroneous.

Examples to prove that not all the people, that proclaim to believe in Jesus, will automatically granted with the Holy Spirit:

1) Acts 19:1-2, “And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, He said unto them, HAVE YE RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST SINCE YE BELIEVED? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” The phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, in Acts 19:1-2 implies that not all the people, that believe in Jesus, would automatically be granted with the Holy Spirit or else it would not justifiable for Acts 19:1-2 to enquire whether these people had received the Holy Spirit at the time of their believes with the assumption that the Holy Spirit would automatically be granted at the time when they began to believe.

2) Acts 8:14-17, “…Samaria HAD RECEIVED THE WORD OF GOD,….when they were come down, PRAYED FOR THEM, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.). Then laid they [their] hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.” As the phrase, received the word of God, is mentioned in Acts 8:14-17 with the phrase, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, it implies that believing in Jesus does not imply a person would receive the Holy Spirit automatically unless requesting it.

3) Matthew 7:21, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” The phrase, every one that saith unto me Lord Lord, in Matthew 7:21 refers undoubtedly to those people that believe in Jesus since they call Jesus to be their Lord. Would these believers be accepted by the Lord? No, they will not be accepted by the Lord since Matthew 7:23, “(mentions that) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” As these people, that call Jesus as Lord, could be rejected by Him in the last days, it implies that not all, that believe in Jesus to be their Lord, are Christians.

Is it irrational to use Matthew 7:21-23 to jump into conclusion that Christians would lose salvation since 1 Corinth 3:12 opposes it? The following is the extract:

1 Corinthians 3:12-15, “Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. IF ANY MAN’S WORK SHALL BE BURNED, HE SHALL SUFFER LOSS: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire.”

As proved above that Matthew 7:21 should not be applicable to backsliders since Christians would never lose their salvation, the only possible reason to think of and that is those people that are mentioned in Matthew 7:21 that proclaim Jesus to be Lord are not Christians at all.

The same is supported in Luke 13:24-25 that many believe in Jesus and yet not many are saved. The following is the extract:

Luke 13:24-25, “Strive to enter in at the strait gate: FOR MANY, I say unto you, WILL SEEK TO ENTER IN, AND SHALL NOT BE ABLE. When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I KNOW YOU NOT WHENCE YE ARE:” The same is mentioned in Matthew 22:14, “(that) For many are called, but few [are] chosen.”

Some Christians might use the two criminals that hung on the cross as an excuse for not requesting the receipt of the Holy Spirit. They have to bear in mind that Jesus had not resurrected yet at that time and the criminals did confess that they were sinners too. Besides, one of the criminals did not reject when Jesus called him to follow Him to be with Him in the paradise. Do you find this to be his acceptance of Jesus for his confession when he agreed to be with the Lord to be in the paradise without opposing Him?.

Should a Christian declare that faith alone could save a person without accompanying with any action? James 2:21-24, “Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. YE SEE THEN HOW THAT BY WORKS A MAN IS JUSTIFIED, AND NOT BY FAITH ONLY.” The same is mentioned in James 2:18, “(that) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: SHEW ME THY FAITH WITHOUT THY WORKS, AND I WILL SHEW THEE MY AITH BY WORKS. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.”

Should a non-Christian repent for their sins or should he or she declare to believe in Jesus and yet worship Buddha simultaneously? John the Baptist went before Jesus to declare repentance and this shows that repentance is significant for Christianity’s conversion. James 1:21, “(even mentions that) Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.” As the phrase, lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, is mentioned in James 1:21 prior to the phrase, receive…the engrafted word, it implies the significance of repentance prior to receiving Jesus as his or her Personal Saviour.

Why should a non-Christian confess sin? 1 John 1:8, “If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.” As the phrase, we say that we have no sin, is mentioned in 1 John 1:8 with the phrase, the truth is not in us, it implies that non-Christians would not have God’s truth with them if they declare that they are not sinners. As God’s truth is not with non-Christians if they do not confess that they are sinners before God, there is a query whether God would dwell within their bodies at the absence of biblical truth in them. Thus, it is a must for non-Christians to declare before God to be sinners to seek His forgiveness. The absolute promise of God for those who confess their sins before Him and that is: 1 John 1:9, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”

Repentance and confession are significant to non-Christians for their receipts of the Holy Spirit since John 9:31, “(mentions that)…God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.” The phrase, God heareth not sinners, in John 9:31 implies God’s rejection of those non-Christians that insist not to repent and continuing in worshipping Buddha and the insisting that they are not sinners before God. These people would have their prayers to be in vain even if they declare to believe Jesus Christ and Buddha at the same time. The phrase, God heareth not sinners, in John 9:31 implies purity is significant for non-Christians’ conversions and prior to the receipt of the Holy Spirit and that is why it demands non-Christians to repent and to confess their sins before God to have their sins to be cleansed for purity. Thus, it is significant for all the people that declare to believe in Jesus Christ to have their


jonathan chm 6 years ago

Continue from above sentences: (how could a non-christian be born again)

sins to confess before God especially Psalms 5:4, “(mentions that) For thou [art] not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.” Psalms 5:4 seems to highlight to us that God would not dwell among non-Christians if sins are with them. For this reason, it is advisable for all the people that declare to believe in Jesus Christ to confess their sins before God so as to have their sins to be cleansed with purity for God’s dwelling.

Did the Gospel highlight to us to request for the Holy Spirit? The following are the extracted verses to prove that Jesus and even His disciples did request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit:

1) John 4:10, “Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; THOU WOULDEST HAVE ASKED OF HIM, and he would have given thee living water.” The phrase, have asked of him, in John 4:10 has stressed the significance of the request for the Holy Spirit.

2) John 6:32-34, “Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. THEN SAID THEY UNTO HIM, LORD EVERMORE GIVE US THIS BREAD.” The phrase, Then said they unto him Lord evermore give us this bread, in John 6:34 is another proof that Jesus’ disciples did request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit. However, their requests could only be fulfilled until after Jesus’ resurrection in the Calvary.

3) Luke 11:13, “If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?”

From the above extracts, these give an absolute certainty that a person could receive the Holy Spirit through requesting for the receipt of it.

Bear in mind that Romans 8:9, “(mentions that)…if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.” As the phrase, any man have not the Spirit of Christ, is mentioned in Romans 8:9 with the phrase, he is none of his, it implies that those people, that do not have the Holy Spirit/Jesus Christ with them, are not considered to be Christians at all.

Assurance from God that we will receive the Holy Spirit when we ask from Him: Luke 11:10, “For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.” The same is supported in Mark 11:24, “(that) Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive [them], and ye shall have [them].”

Romans 10:9, “(mentions) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.” This verse implies that our faith should be grounded upon the resurrection of Jesus. Muslims too believe in Jesus, but they reject the resurrection of Jesus. However, Romans 10:9 demands not only to confess Jesus but also to believe He has been resurrected.

Sinner’s prayer has met the requisition of the confession since it demands non-Christians to confess themselves before God of their believes in the name of Lord Jesus Christ. It demands also the non-Christians to acknowledge the resurrection of Jesus and that meets the requirement of Romans 10:9. Not only that, it requires non-Christians to confess their sins before God for purification and also to express their needs for Jesus Christ to be their Personal Saviour. One should bear in mind that God will deny those people that believe in Jesus and yet refuse to proclaim the name of Jesus. The following are the extracts:

1) Luke 9:26, “For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and [in his] Father's, and of the holy angels.”

2) Luke 12:8-9, “Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God: But he that denieth me before men shall be denied before the angels of God.”

3) Matthew 10:32, “Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.”

There should not be any worry if a person does not have confidence whether he has received the Holy Spirit before, he should not hesitate but to ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit since spiritual baptism only takes effect once. Once a person has received the Holy Spirit, he would not receive any more in the future since Ephesians 4:5, “(mentions that) One Lord, one faith, one baptism”. The phrase, one baptism, in Ephesians 4:5 implies one spiritual baptism instead of more than once.

Now, let’s meditate Matthew 5:9 again: Matthew 5:9, “Blessed [are] the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God”. As we know once a person receives Jesus Christ to be His Personal Saviour, his spiritual fruits will grow and these include peace in God and that is why Jesus mentions Matthew 5:9 to be appropriate since Christians would have their spiritual fruits to grow and these include peace, one of the spiritual fruits (John 15:5).


jonathan chm 6 years ago

Paul Washer queries why a person should be born again just simply pray one time in his life for sinner's prayer.

Mark 11:24 has the explanation since Mark 11:24, “(mentions that)…when ye pray, believe that ye receive [them], and ye shall have [them].” As the phrase, when ye pray believe that ye receive (them), is mentioned in Mark 11:24 with the phrase, ye shall have (them), it implies that we will definitely receive the Holy Spirit at the time of our sinner’s prayer for the request of the Holy Spirit on the condition that we believe that we have received it. Thus, praying a sinner’s prayer at one time and believing that one has received Jesus Christ, is scriptural since this is God’s promise to us that the Holy Spirit will come into our bodies at the time when we request for the receipt of it and believe it to be so. This gives a conclusion that praying a sinner’s prayer at one time, could cause a person to be born again since praying a sinner’s prayer includes praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

However, bearing in mind that repentance from sin is significant for the conversion since John 9:31, “(mentions that)…God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.” Or in other words, a person that wants to turn to God, has to repent from sinning, such as, discontinuing in worshipping Buddha and etc., and with sinner’s prayer to seek God’s forgiveness of sin.

Bear in mind that Romans 8:9, “(mentions that)…if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.” As the phrase, any man have not the Spirit of Christ, is mentioned in Romans 8:9 with the phrase, he is none of his, it implies that those people, that do not have the Holy Spirit/Jesus Christ with them, are not considered to be Christians at all.

Nevertheless, praying a sinner’s prayer could be a one-time conversion. At the time of the conversion, the spiritual fruits of a person would grow as supported by John 15:5.


jonathan chm 6 years ago

Prior to praying sinner's prayer, a person has to repent from sinning, such as, continuing in worshipping idols and etc. Repentance is the foremost significance for the conversion to Christianity. Without repentance, a non-Christian might pray a hundred times sinner's prayer, God would not listen to him since John 9:31, “(mentions that)…God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.” Sinner's prayer is only effective only when a person fully repents from sinning, such as, discontinuing in worshipping idols and etc., and he then says sinner's prayer, God would then come and dwell into his life.

When a person becomes a Christian through sinner's prayer, he is a Christian even though he might sin in the future and he will never fall away for his promise. This is supported by 1 Corinthians 3:12-15 as follows:

1 Corinthians 3:12-15, “Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. IF ANY MAN’S WORK SHALL BE BURNED, HE SHALL SUFFER LOSS: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire.”

If you have read the book of Romans, you would have discovered even Paul himself was struggling with sin. The following is the extract:

Romans 7:18-20, "For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me."

Indeed, Paul did sin against God since Romans 7:19, "(mentions that) For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do." Even though Paul did sin, Paul is still considered to be a Christian. As Paul himself could fall into sin, it implies that a person is still considered to be a Christian due to his initial acceptance of Jesus Christ to be his Personal Saviour through sinner's prayer even though he might or will sin in the future.

Does this mean Christians should give way to sin? No, God forbids since John 14:15, “(mentions that) If ye love me, keep my commandments.” and the same is supported in John 15:10, “If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in his love.”

Nevertheless, sinner’s prayer is the way to be born again since it demands a non-Christian to request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit. However, once a person is converted, he has to obey God’s commandments. He might sin in the future and yet his salvation is permanent.


Mentalist acer profile image

Mentalist acer 6 years ago from A Voice in your Mind!

I'm inspired by my families renewed faith in Dogma related to the Catholic church as they do not expire their religious intrest upon my open mind.

When attending catachism the interpretatation of theology impressed upon me the right to carefuly express my own annalysis...I have no problem with faith,but that leads to the belief of many dogmas including optimistic scientific philosophy and theory;)


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

DOES THE BOOK OF ACTS SUPPORT THAT BELIEVING IN JESUS ATTRACTS IMMEDIATE RECEIPT OF THE HOLY SPIRIT?

1} Let's meditate Acts 22:12-16 below:

Acts 22:12-16, “And one Ananias…came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive they sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard. And now why tarriest thou? Arise and be baptized, and washed away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.”

From the above verses, it is easily to spot out that nothing is mentioned whether Saul had repented from sinning in persecuting Christians or he had confessed his sin or he had believed in Jesus or the Holy Spirit had come to him except the phrase, be baptized and washed away thy sins. Despite nothing is mentioned that is pertaining to the above factors that contributed to his salvation, it is irrational to conclude that he needed not to exercise any of these elements prior to his salvation. Similarly, it is irrational to conclude that he did not request for the Holy Spirit just simply giving the explanation that the above verses do not mention it. As the phrase, washed away thy sins, is mentioned in Acts 22:10 with the phrase, be baptized, it implies that baptism in the past was accompanied with sin cleansing.

2} Let's meditate Acts 8:14-17 below:

Acts 8:14-17, "Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: Who, when they were come down, PRAYED FOR THEM,, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost."

Nothing is mentioned in Acts 8:14-17 that the Samaria had believed the word of God except the phrase, had received. It is erroneous to use these verses to support that salvation could come about simply by receiving the word of God instead of believing. Thus, the absence of certain factors, such as, repentance of sin; confession of sin; and the requesting for the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:14-17, do not give any strong proof that they did not exercise prior to their conversion to Christianity. The phrase, had received, in Acts 8:14 implies that Samaria should have believed in Jesus at that time. Did they receive the Holy Spirit immediately after believing? No, they did not receive the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:14 until Acts 8:17, "(that mentions that)…laid they their hands on them and they received the Holy Ghost." As there is an obvious gap between Acts 8:14 and Acts 8:17 in which they believed and yet the Holy Spirit was not with them, it implies that believing does not attract the immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit. As the phrase, prayed for them, is mentioned in Acts 8:15 with the phrase, that they might receive the Holy Spirit, it implies that requesting for the receipt of the Holy Spirit is acceptable from the Scriptural point of view. As praying with the receipt of the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:15 should be associated with baptism, it implies baptism in the past should be accompanied with also praying with the receipt of the Holy Spirit in addition to sin cleansing as mentioned in Acts 22:10.

3} The apostles were told to Acts 1:4-5, “…be…assembled together…(and) should not depart from Jerusalem…(so as to) be baptized with Holy Ghost…” Did these apostles ask for the receipt of the Holy Ghost? In order to tackle this question, let’s meditate John 6:32-34 as below: John 6:32-34, “Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. THEN SAID THEY UNTO HIM, LORD EVERMORE GIVE US THIS BREAD.” The phrase, the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, in John 6:33 certainly refers to the Holy Spirit. The phrase, Then said they unto him Lord evermore give us this bread, in John 6:34 implies that the apostles did request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit and yet Jesus turned them down by saying, John 7:39, “(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)” The same is mentioned in John 16:7 that the Holy Spirit came upon the disciples at the absence of Jesus. The following is the extract: John 16:7, “Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.” The same is in Philemon 1:15, “(that) For perhaps he departed for a while for this purpose, that you might receive him forever.” Nevertheless, the Holy Spirit did not come to the Apostles even though they did ask Jesus in John 6:32-34 until the day of Pentecost.

4} Let’s examine Acts 8:26-37 below to determine whether these verses do support sinner’s prayer:

Acts 8:26-27, “And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise…And he arose, and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, a eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians…had come to Jerusalem for to worship…” Acts 8:37-38, “And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and he eunuch; and he baptized him.”

Observe carefully the above verses and you would have discovered that none of the verses between Acts 8:26 and Acts 8:38 mention that the words, believe, and the phrase, the Holy Spirit came to the eunuch except the phrase, he baptized him. The absence of the word, believe, and the phrase, the Holy Spirit comes to eunuch, does not imply that he had not believed in Jesus and that the Holy Spirit did not come to him, The same that it is irrational to use Acts 8:26-38 to jump into conclusion that repentance and confession of sin and the requesting for the Holy Spirit are not necessary just because they are not stated among these verses. The phrase, had come to Jerusalem for to worship, in Acts 8:27, gives us the possible idea that he should have believed in Acts 8:27 or else there should not be any reason for him to travel for worship. The phrase, he baptized him, in Acts 8:38 gives us the idea that he should have received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:38. Despite he had believed in Jesus when he was in Acts 8:27, he only proclaimed his belief that was followed by baptism in Acts 8:38. There is an obvious gap between Acts 8:27 and Acts 8:37 in which he believed and yet the Holy Spirit had not come to him and this could come to the conclusion that believing does not attract immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

As mentioned in Acts 22 above that sin cleansing has to be associated with baptism and that Acts 8:15 that praying for the Holy Spirit has to be associated with baptism. As the word, baptized, is mentioned in Acts 8:38 and that baptism is to be associated with sin cleansing and praying for the Holy Spirit, sin cleansing and praying for the Holy Spirit should have been exercised at the time of baptism even though they are not stated in these verses at all.

5} Let's mediate the extracted verses from Acts 10 below:

Acts 10:1-2, “There was a certain man in Caesarea called Cornelius, a centurion of the band called the Italian band…one that feared God…” Acts 10:30-32, “And Cornelius said, Four days ago I was fasting until this hour; and at the ninth hour I prayed in my house, and behold, A MAN STOOD BEFORE ME IN BRIGHT CLOTHING and said, Cornelius, thy prayer is heard…Send therefore to…Peter…” Acts 10:25-26, “And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him. But Peter took him up, saying,


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

Stand up I myself also am a man.” Acts 10:43-44, “To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sin. While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.”

Nothing is mentioned in Acts 10:1-26 that Cornelius had believed in Jesus except that Peter prevented him to fall down and worship him as mentioned in Acts 10:25-26. It is only mentioned in Acts 10:43-44 that the Holy Spirit came down upon him when he heard Peter that declared that whosoever believe in Jesus shall receive remission of sin. It is erroneous to use Acts 10:43-44 to jump into the conclusion that a non-Christian could be saved simply by hearing the words of God instead of through faith just because Acts 10:43-44 are not indicated that Cornelius believes except that he heard the words. The same is for repentance and confession of sin and the praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit. The absence of all these words in Acts 10:1-44, does not imply that Cornelius did not do it.

6} Let’s meditate Acts 16:29-33 below:

Acts 16:29-33, “Then called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas, and brought them out, and said, Sir, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. And they took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his straightway.”

The phrase, And they said Believe on the Lord, in Acts 16:31 refers undoubtedly to the preaching words from Paul and Silas to the keeper of the prison. However, nothing is mentioned in the subsequent verse that he believed in Jesus or the Holy Spirit had come to him except the phrase, was baptized. As nothing is mentioned that he believed in Jesus or the Holy Spirit had come to him, it does not imply that he had not been born again. The same that nothing is mentioned that he had repented and confessed his sins and even to request for the Holy Spirit, it is irrational to conclude that he did not do it.

7} Acts 19:2, “…HAVE YE RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST SINCE YE BELIEVED?…”

Nevertheless, it could come the conclusion that it is erroneous to extract any event from the book of Acts to comment that certain practices, such as, believing in Jesus; repentance and confession of sin; and praying for the receiving of the Holy Spirit, are not mentioned in that event, and immediately derive a conclusion that those practices are not necessary to be exercised in order to be born again.

It has been proved in Clauses 2 and 4 above that believing in Jesus does not necessarily attract immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

SALVATION IS THE WORK OF FAITH

In order to be saved, a person that believes in Jesus Christ has to be born again through receiving the Holy Spirit. It is irrational to support that a non-Christian that believes in Jesus will automatically be granted with the Holy Spirit since Acts 19:2, “…(enquire those people that believe in Jesus,) HAVE YE RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST SINCE YE BELIEVED?…” Furthermore, Romans 8:9 mentions that those that do not have the Spirit of Christ are not Christians at all. The following is the extract: Romans 8:9, “…if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.”

Salvation is truly the work of faith. When a non-Christian prays a sinner’s prayer, he has to exercise his faith throughout his praying. When he prays to confess his sin before God through sinner’s prayer, he has to believe that God has forgiven his sin immediately after his confession or else he would not expect to receive any forgiveness of sin from God. This is due to James 1:6-8, “(mentions that) But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord. A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.” As the word, wavereth, is mentioned in James 1:6-8 with the phrase, let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord, it implies that a non-Christian, that does not believe that his sin has been forgiven immediately after sinner’s prayer, would not have his sin be forgiven. As his sin would not be forgiven if he does not believe that he has been forgiven immediately after sinner’s prayer, his sin would not be forgiven and that would not cause the Holy Spirit to enter into his body since John 9:31, “(mentions that)…God heareth not sinners…” The same is in praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit, the same person must believe that he has already received the Holy Spirit after sinner’s prayer. Or else, his prayer is in vain and would not cause him to receive the Holy Spirit. Nevertheless, faith has to be exercised throughout sinner’s prayer in order to cause a non-Christian to be born again.

Could a non-Christian mention that he believes in Jesus Christ and yet he does not believe that his sin has been forgiven and he also does not believe that the Holy Spirit has come into his body immediately after sinner’s prayer? Certainly, there is a question whether this non-Christian has believed in Jesus since he questions about whether his sin has been forgiven and the existence of the Holy Spirit in his body immediately after his sinner’s prayer.

Salvation does not depend upon emotion but faith. A non-Christian must believe that his sin has been forgiven and that he has received the Holy Spirit without relying upon feeling. With his faith immediately after sinner’s prayer, he would then be born again.

RELIANCE UPON EMOTION TOWARDS TO EXISTENCE OF THE HOLY SPIRIT

Reliance upon emotion towards the existence of the Holy Spirit within our bodies to determine whether we are born again is not scriptural due to Job 9:2 and John 3:5-8 provides the truth we could not sense the existence of the Holy Spirit. The following are the explanations:

i} Job 9:2, “…God” Job 9:11, “Lo, he goeth by me, and I see him not: he passeth on also, but I perceive him not.” As the phrase, he goeth…and…passeth on, is mentioned in Job 9:11 with the phrase, I perceive him not, it implies that we could never sense the existence of God.

ii) John 3:5-8, “Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. THE WIND BLOWETH WHERE IT LISTETH, and THOU HEARST THE SOUND THEREOF, BUT CANST NOT TELL WHENCE IT COMETH, and WHITHER IT GOETH: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.”

Let’s analyse John 3:5-8 in two different approaches as follows:

a} Let’s relates the word, wind, in John 3:5-8 to be the Holy Spirit and the phrase, the wind bloweth where it listeth, in John 3:8 would turn up to be the Holy Spirit goes as He wishes. The phrase, thou hearst the sound thereof, in John 3:8 can be interpreted as you hear the Holy Spirit speaks to you whenever He guides you in truth or whenever He informs you that you have committed sin or etc. The phrase, thou…canst not tell whence it cometh and whither it goeth, in John 3:8 implies that we cannot tell when the Holy Spirit has come and where He has gone to. We could sense His existence only if we could know when He comes and where He goes within our bodies. As it is mentioned that we could not tell where the Holy Spirit comes and goes, it implies that we could not sense the existence of the Holy Spirit.

b} Let’s interpret the word, wind in John 3:5-8 in a straightforward way that has no connection with the Holy Spirit. The phrase, The wind bloweth where it listeth, in John 3:8 implies that the wind blows as it wishes. The phrase, thou hearst the sound thereof, in John 3:8 could be interpreted as we are aware of the wind by the external environment, such as, the sound of the wind; the coolness of our bodies; the movement of the external objects, i.e. tree & etc. The phrase, but canst not tell whence it cometh and whither it goeth, in John 3:8 implies that w


jonathan chm 6 years ago

we can never have any unusual sensation about the movement of wind within our bodies that drives us crazily. The reason is simply that wind can never penetrate into our bodies & to move within our bodies. The phrase, so is every one that is born of the Spirit, in John 3:8 implies that it happens the same to the Holy Spirit.

As proved above that we could not sense God, our prayer through requesting for the receipt of the Holy Spirit, must rely merely on faith instead of depending upon whether there is any emotion within our bodies to determine the existence of the Holy Spirit within our bodies.

JESUS IS THE SON OF GOD AND HE IS ALSO GOD

There are many instances to prove that Jesus is God Himself:

1} Human beings and angels worship Jesus Christ. The following are the extracts: Hebrews 1:6, “…firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.”; Matthew 2:1-2, “…there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for WE have seen his star in the east, and are COME TO WORSHIP HIM.”; Matthew 2:11, “And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him…”: Matthew 8:2, “And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt,…”; Matthew 9:18, “…there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him..”; Matthew 15:25, “Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.”; Matthew 20:20, “Then came to him the mother of Zebedees children with her sons, worshipping him…”; Matthew 28:9, “And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.”

For instance, if Jesus Christ is not God, worshipping Jesus contradicts the Ten Commandments as mentioned in Exodus 20 and even Luke 4:8, “….Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.”

2} Jesus did miracles, but the surrounding audience glorified God and this implies that Jesus Christ is God Himself. The following are the extracts: Luke 5:24-25, “But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power upon earth to forgive sins, (he said unto the sick of the palsy,) I say unto thee, Arise, and take up thy couch, and go into thine house. And immediately he rose up before them, and took up that whereon he lay, and departed to his own house, glorifying God. “; Luke 13:12-13, “And when Jesus saw her, he called her to him, and said unto her, Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity. And he laid his hands on her: and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God.”; Luke 13:17, “…and all the people rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by him.”; Luke 17:15, “And one of them, when he saw that he was healed, turned back, and with a loud voice glorified God.”; Luke 18:42-43, “And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee. And immediately he received his sight, and followed him, glorifying God…”

3} Jesus is God and is even obvious in John 1. The following are the extracts: John 1:1-3, “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made.” John 1:10-11, “He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not.” John 1:14, “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”

4} Jesus even admitted Himself to be God. John 8:24, “I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.” John 8:27, “They understood not that he spake to them of the Father.”

5} God even called Jesus Himself to be God. The following is the extract: Hebrews 1:8, “But unto the Son he saith, THY THRONE, O GOD, is forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.”; Isaiah 9:6-7, “For unto us a child is born, UNTO US A SON IS GIVEN: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: AND HIS NAME SHALL BE CALLED Wonderful, Counseller, THE ALMIGHTY GOD…”

6} Jesus Christ is our Saviour and yet Titus 1:3, “(mentions)…God our Saviour;”, it implies that Jesus Himself is God since this verse links up God to be our Saviour even though Jesus Christ was the one that died for our sins.

7} Jesus Christ has neither beginning nor ending and the same is for God. The following are the extracts: Hebrews 7:3, “Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.”; John 8:56-58, “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw [it], and was glad. Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.”; John 1:1-3, “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.” John 1:14, “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us…”; Proverb 8:22-24, “The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. When [there were] no depths, I was brought forth; when [there were] no fountains abounding with water.”

8} Jesus Christ is our Lord and yet the name of the Lord is God and this indirectly refers Jesus Christ as God.

The following are the extracts that refer Jesus as the Lord: 2 Peter 2:20, “Lord and Jesus Christ…”; 2 Peter 3:18, “.Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.”;; Hebrews 1:8, “But to the Son he says…”Hebrews 1:10, “And, ‘You, Lord…”; Philemon 1:3, “…the Lord Jesus Christ.”; Titus 1:3, “…the Lord Jesus Christ.”; Titus 1:4, “…the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.” Matthew 8:5, “…Jesus..a centurion beseeching him, and saying, Lord…”; Matthew 8:25, “And his disciples came to him…saying, Lord…”; Mark 16:19, “So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat as the right hand of God.”; Luke 2:11, “…Christ the Lord.”; Luke 6:5, “And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the Sabbath.”; Luke 13:15, “The Lord then answered him…”

The following are the extracts that the Lord is God: Isaiah 30:18, “…for the Lord is a God of judgment…”; Isaiah 33:22, “…the LORD s our King; he will save us.”; Isaiah 45:3, “…I, the Lord…am the God of Israel.”; Jeremiah 32:27, “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all fresh…”; Habakuk 3:18, “…the LORD…the God of my salvation”; Deuteronomy 4:35, “…the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him.”; Psalm 33:12, “…God is LORD…”; Psalm 118:27, “God is the LORD…”; Psalm 144:15, “…whose God is the LORD.”; Psalm 18:31, “For who is God save the LORD? Or who is roc save our God?”

9} Jesus created the Universe and God was the one that created the Universe as mentioned in the Book of Genesis and all these point to the fact that Jesus is God Himself:

The following are the extracts that Jesus was the creator of this Universe: Hebrews 1:1-2, “God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, hath in these last days spoken unto us by [his] Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;” Hebrews 1:8, “But to he Son he says…” Hebrews 1:10, “And: ‘You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands.”; John 1:7-11, “The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all [men] through him might believe. He was not that Light, but [was sent] to bear witness of that Light. [That] was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not.”

10} Jesus Christ was with the Holy Spi


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

Spirit since birth instead of at the time of His baptism with John the Baptist. Matthew 1:20, “But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost.”; Luke 1:34-35, “Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man? And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.”

THE HOLY SPIRIT COMES FROM GOD

1 John 4:12, “No one has seen God at any time…God abides in us.” 1 John 4:13, “By this we know that we abide in him and he is in us, because HE HAS GIVE US OF HIS SPIRIT.”; Numbers 24:2, “…the Spirit of God came upon him.”; Ezekiel 37:1, Isaiah 4:13-14, “…the Spirit of the LORD…”; Proverbs 1:23, “…I will pour out my spirit unto you…”; Nehemiah 9:20, “You also gave Your good spirit to instruct them…”; Isaiah 44:3, “…I will pour my spirit upon thee…”; Isaiah 59:21, “…saith the LORD, my spirit that is upon thee…”; Matthew 3:16, “…the spirit of God…”; John 15:26, “But when the COMFORTER is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, WHICH PROCEEDETH FROM THE FATHER…”; 1 Peter 1:11, Romans 8:9, “…Spirit of Christ…”

THE APPEARANCE OF JESUS CHRIST

The first coming and His next coming will be in physical form absolutely since 1 John 4:2, “(mentions that)…Every spirit that confesseth that JESUS CHRIST IS COME IN THE FLESH is of God:”

Even though the coming of Jesus Christ will be in physical form, he could appear in spiritual form too. The following are the explanations: The phrase, Spirit of Christ, in Romans 8:9 and 1 Peter 1:11 gives us absolute proves that Jesus Christ could be in spiritual form. Another proof that Jesus could be in spiritual as well as physical form could be located in Luke 24:33-37 in which Jesus appeared suddenly in midst of the disciples and caused them to have the fear that He was ghost. Jesus Christ should have been with them in the spiritual form prior to His sudden appearance in the midst of them to cause them to have the fear. The following are the extracts: Luke 24:33, “And they rose up the same hour, and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven gathered together, and them that were with them,” Luke 24:36-37, “And AS THEY THUS SPAKE, JESUS HIMSELF STOOD IN THE MIDST OFTHEM, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. BUT THEY WERE TERRIFIED AND AFFRIGHTED, AND SUPPOSED THAT THEY HAD SEEN A SPIRIT.”

UNIT OF GOD, JESUS CHRIST AND THE HOLY SPIRIT

Does a person invite the Holy Spirit as well as God into his body by praying merely to receive Jesus Christ as his Personal Saviour? John 14:10-12 spelt out the unity between God and Jesus. The following is the extract: John 14:10-12, “Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me,…Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me…” As the phrase, I am in the Father, and the Father in me, is mentioned in John 14:10-12, it implies togetherness between Jesus Christ and God and that they could never be separated. The phrase, I am in the Father and the Father is in me, in John 14:10-12 strongly opposes the possibility of the separation between God and Jesus and it also rejects the likeliness that God might not be in Jesus and vice versa. The same are supported by the following verses: John 8:29, “And he that sent me is with me…”; John 10:38, “…the Father is in me, and I in him.”; John 14:20, “…I am in my Father, and ye in me…”; John 16:32, “…I am not alone, because the Father is with me.” As proved above that God and Jesus Christ could never be separated, that implies that a person, that prays to receive Jesus Christ into his body, receives God into his body too.

The unity of God the Father, the son Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit could be found in the following verses: John 17:22-23, “And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one…”; John 17:21,”…thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us….”; 1 John 5:7-8, “For there are three that bear record in heaven, THE FATHER THE WORD, AND THE HOLY GHOST: and THESE ARE ONE. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.” As the Holy Spirit, God and Jesus Christ are united into one and they can never be separated, that make it possible for one to mention that there is only one God even though there are three persons since none of them could be separated from each other and that the three have been viewed as one as a whole number.

As the Holy Spirit, God and the Holy Spirit could never be separated and they are united into one, a non-Christian, that prays to receive Jesus Christ into his body, receives the Holy Spirit and God simultaneously.


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

Does Acts 19:1-9 (Christians in Ephesus) give a strong proof that believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit?

Let’s meditate Acts 19:1-9:

Acts 19:1-9, “…at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, He said unto them, HAVE YE RECEIVED THE HOLY GHOST SINCE YE BELIEVED? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.”

The phrase, finding certain disciples, in Acts 19:1 does not give any strong proof whether these disciples were Jesus’ disciples or John at the time of their dialogue. There were a number of possibilities that can be viewed for the phrase, certain disciples, as mentioned in Acts 19:1:

a) it could be that there were Jesus’ disciples and they did not know about the existence of the Holy Spirit and yet they did receive water baptism from John;

b) it could be that there were John’s disciples and yet lately believed and followed Jesus;

c) it could be that there were John’s disciples and had not believed in Jesus and yet lately followed Jesus:

d) it could be that there were neither Jesus’ nor John’s disciples, yet had just converted to disciples not long ago; or etc.

In view of the above possibilities, it is hard to jump into the conclusion using Acts 19:1 that these disciples were John’s disciples.

Whether these people were John’s disciples or not, were not significant. The main thing that needs to be highlighted is that these people should not be questioned, Acts 19:2, “..Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?” This is by virtue of if these were John’s disciples and they had believed in Jesus, the Holy Spirit would have come immediately upon them at the time of their believes even though they only received John’s baptism and they did not know the Holy Spirit, with the assumption that believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit. The reason is simply the knowledge that they acquired (whether they knew the Holy Spirit or whether they received only John’s baptism0 would not affect their salvation with the assumption that believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit. As the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, is mentioned in Acts 19:2, it gives an uncertainty that believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

Some might argue that certain parts of the book of Acts were transitional period for the receiving of the Holy Spirit. However, the transitional period should have been ended at the time of Pentecost since John 16:7 mentions the receipt of the Holy Spirit was after the resurrection of Jesus.

Those people that insist not to request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit while they are on earth with the assumption that believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, would regret eternally what if they have discovered their past knowledge was wrong and that Jesus would speak to them that He does not know Him at end time as mentioned in Matthew 7:23.

Disciples in current context. Acts 11:26, “(mentions that)…the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.” As the phrase, the disciples, is mentioned in Acts 11:26 with the word, Christians, it implies that the word, disciple, and the word, Christian, can be interchangeable.


steve simons 6 years ago

well i must say i live with a born again and it is driving me away from religion I am confirmed and bapstised into the anglican church..i swear born again christians are all cult memebers


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Rev. Akins 6 years ago from Tucson, AZ

I appreciate how well you walked the middle ground with born again vs active church goer. Great Hub, and one that obviously caused lots of thought. I fall in the same camp as the T-shirt, as I don't see the need to be born again if I feel I have always followed Jesus the way I think is best. We all have to do what we think is the way to be the best person we can be, and we are going to mess up as part of the learning process. This doesn't mean we need to be born-again ever time we mess up, it just means we need to realize how much we need Jesus in the first place. Again, great Hub, really got me thinking! Thanks!


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

SINNER’S PRAYER (CONTINUED)

THE DEFINITION OF THE WORD, BELIEVE, IN THE BIBLE

The word, believe, in Strong’s Concordance in its original form is as follows: ???????. The transliteration of the word, believe, in the Strong ’s Concordance is pisteu?. The following are the translations of the word, believe, as spelt out in the Strong’s Concordance:

1) to think to be true, to be persuaded of, to credit, place confidence in

a) of the thing believed

1) to credit, have confidence

b) in a moral or religious reference

1) used in the NT of the conviction and trust to which a man is impelled by a certain inner and higher prerogative and law of soul

2) to trust in Jesus or God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: saving faith

3) mere acknowledgment of some fact or event: intellectual faith

2) to entrust a thing to one, i.e. his fidelity

a) to be intrusted with a thing

From the meaning of the word, believe, in the Strong Concordance, it is obvious that the word, believe, in its original word does not include repentance; justification; the immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit; and etc.

THE REASONS THAT EPHESIANS 1:13-14, JOHN 3:16 AND ACTS 16:30-31 DO NOT PROVIDE ANY STRONG PROVES THAT BELIEVING IS SEALED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT IMMEDIATELY:

Let’s meditate Ephesians 1:13-14, John 3:16 and Acts 16:30-31 as follows:

Ephesian 1:13-14, “In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.”

John 3:16, “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”

Acts 16:30-31, “And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.”

From the extracts, it is obvious that none of the verses above mention that a non-Christian needs to repent from sin in order to be saved except that he must believe. The meaning of the word, believe, in its original Greek/Hebrews word as mentioned early, does not give any implication that this word has to be dealt with repentance.

It is erroneous to use Ephesians 1:13-14, John 3:16 and Acts 16:30-31 to support that salvation could come about merely by believing without repentance since Psalm 5:4, “(mentions that) For thou [art] not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.” As the phrase, not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee, is mentioned in Psalm 5:4, it implies total rejection from God for those people, that are without repentant hearts, continue in sinning, such as, worshipping idols and etc.

Despite the absence of repentance in Ephesians 1:13-14, John 3:16 and Acts 16:30-31, repentance of sin, such as, continuing in worshipping idols, has to be exercised in order to be born again. Otherwise, it would turn up to be that a non-Christian could continue in sin, such as, keep on worshipping idols and believe in Jesus at the same time, yet they could be saved on the condition that the concept of believing could be sealed with immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true. The teaching would turn up to be absurd without any justification due to salvation could be brought out simply by believing at the absence of repentance and that the non-Christian could believe in Jesus as well as worshipping idols at the same time without any repentant heart.

The support, that believing has to be followed with repentance, implies that believing is not sealed with immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit since there is something (and that is repentance) to do prior to a non-Christian to be born again. The reason is simply that a non-Christian, that believes, would not receive the Holy Spirit if he does not repent.

It is irrational to use simply Ephesians 1:13-14, John 3:16 and Acts 16:30-31 to conclude God’s message intend for us. Matthew 5:9 is an excellent extract to prove the risk of misinterpretation of the Scripture by means of a single extract: Matthew 5:9, “Blessed [are] the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God”. As the word, peacemakers, is mentioned in Matthew 5:9 with the phrase, the children of God, a false message could come about that as long as a person, whether he is a believer or not, declares peace in this world, he could be considered as a child of God or Christian. Thus, using a verse to conclude God’s message is erroneous.

As repentance is a must in order to be born again and yet it is not stated in Ephesians 1:13-14, John 3:16 as well as Acts 16:30-31, there should not be any unjustifiable ground to think that requesting for the receipt of the Holy Spirit should not be exercised just because it is not stated.

COULD MATTHEW 7:21-23 BE APPLICABLE TO PROFESSING CHRISTIANS?

Let’s meditate Matthew 7:21-23 below prior to our tackling to this question:

Matthew 7:21-23, “Not every one that SAITH UNTO ME, LORD, LORD, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER KNEW YOU: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.”

The phrase, saith unto me Lord, in Matthew 7:21 implies that these people certainly believe in Jesus or else there should not be any reason for them to call Jesus as Lord. The word, never, in Matthew 7:23 implies that the Lord did not and do not and will not recognize them. For instance, if these people are professing Christians, Jesus should mention that He does not and will not recognize them since He surely knew them at the time of their conversion to Christianity initially. Jesus certainly knows His sheep for their callings at the time of their conversion to Christianity since John 10:27-28, “(mention that) My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.” As the word, never, is used in Matthew 7:23 instead of the phrase, does not and will not, it implies that He did not recognize them at anytime of their life span. This rejects the possibility that these people could have been born again in the past since, if that should be so, at least, Jesus should have recognized them in the past instead of mentioning, He never. As Jesus did not recognize them in the past, how could there be any possibility of them to have turning point to be born again? However, if Matthew 7:21 has been treated as there are for non-Christians, the whole sentences would turn up to be justifiable since Jesus did not and do not and will not recognize them due to there are not God’s people. In order to be Christians, Jesus Christ has to come into their lives to dominate in their lives and that is why sinner’s prayer has to be stressed.

It is irrational to use Matthew 7:21-23 to conclude that Christians would lose salvation since 1 Corinth 3:12 opposes it? The following is the extract: 1 Corinthians 3:12-15, “Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. IF ANY MAN’S WORK SHALL BE BURNED, HE SHALL SUFFER LOSS: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire.”

As proved that Mathew 7:21-23 should be applicable to non-Christians. Despite they were non-Christians, yet they believe in Jesus since they call Jesus as Lord as mentioned in Matthew 7:21. What if those people strongly believe that believing is sealed with the Holy Spirit and they fail to pray for the receipt of the Holy Spirit


Jonathan chm 6 years ago

and yet in reality, the Holy Spirit would not be with them, they would regret eternally for their actions in not asking for the receipt of the Holy Spirit while they are on earth since Jesus would tell them that He never knows them as mentioned in Matthew 7:23.

DO THE VERSES IN ACTS 19:1-6 GIVE A STRONG PROOF THAT BELIEVING IS SEALED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT IMMEDIATELY?

There is no justifiable ground for one to assume that Acts 19:1-6 could support that believing is sealed with immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit for the following reasons:

a} The phrase, Have ye received the Holy Spirit since ye believed, in Acts 19:2 was the spoken words from Paul and this verse should not have any doctrinal error especially 2 Timothy 3:16, “(mentions that) All Scripture (is) given by inspiration of God, all (is) profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”

b} The subsequent verses of Acts 19:2 do substantiate the query about the uncertainty of the existence of the Holy Spirit among those people that declare to believe. The following is the elaboration:

Those people did not receive the Holy Spirit when they heard the words of God as mentioned in Acts 19:5. They only received the Holy Spirit after Paul had laid his hands upon them in Acts 19:6. Bear in mind there is an obvious gap between the word, heard, in Acts 19:5 and the phrase, the Holy Ghost came on them, in Acts 9:6 in which they believed and yet the Holy Spirit was not with them.

The following are the extracts for Acts 19:5-6:

Acts 19:5-6, “When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.”

Unless they had received the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:5 at the time of their believes, it is rational to support that believing is sealed by the Holy Spirit. However, they received the Holy Spirit after Paul had laid his hand on them. It implies that believing is not sealed with the Holy Spirit immediately.

As there is an uncertainty that believing could be sealed with the Holy Spirit immediately, those people, that proclaim to believe in Jesus, have to be accompanied with sinner’s prayer in order to be born again.


artemio butalid 5 years ago

@jonathan chm,my friend we know how to read the bible we know where to find im about to convert in your sect but holy bible alone is enough to feed my courios mind in search for truth then i found that catholic church truly the christian church which was build by the apostles seek an answer.your actions remind me of my dear born again friends they like talking it seems that they are right like you.theres nothing wrong of being a catholic,we dont worship idols and engrave images,we catholic are not fools we know the bible we read it and understand it with all our hearts.Baptism is a mystery of death then you are being baptist to be born again,I am born again,all Catholics who were baptist were born again(born in heaven)not born again sect.We catholics encourage young people by their own will not by force nor trick them introduced beautiful ladies to convince us to join in your sect.Everytime i attend in your church the preacher always shouting and looking at me that there is 1 soul are not save,wat is the meaning of this?the preacher is a God?in the middle of the sermon the preacher keep on attacking the Catholics after this i become fault finders of the catholics.my friends in the sect keep on accompanying me everywhere i go they restrict me from going catholic churches,they keep on repeating to remove wat is place in our altar.this people were generous they pay for my bus fare,taxi and even for my groceries and shoppings they gave me also the money for my allowance,this people will give their all just for the sake to acquire more members,those members i feel the burden of the 10% tithes w/c becomes compulsory/mandatory it was mention before that its voluntary even my parents laborers shoulder those burden even though they work on our farm as extra until none of their children goes to school.My parents noticed my behavior as a fault finder they tranfered me into a catholic shool,they answered all my questions that makes me satisfy,ofcourse i ask the priest.born again sect in my place really brain wash me they teach of negative things towards the nuns,monks,priest and all catholic leaders just like they want to put hatred towards them.I shared this story to you if the same thing happen in your sect like in my place.this sect in my pace brings confusion in christianity thats why some of my friends convrted to Islam because born again sect in my place treated non born again sect christian as unclean.Instead i joined Singles for Christ a Catholic ministry i feel like im reborn more than i feel whwn i was in born again sect,they dont judging others,they dont find fault to others,thyre hapi to serve others and hapi to serve the Lord I do give more than 10% of my income and i see it wer it goes then im so much blessed then i found my GG(Gods gift) my wife in the community.

I realized that born again sect in my place were not following Christlike figure they worshipped Christ by word alone not on action nor showing by good example.Many pastors and preachers claim themselves as prophets they assured the things to come were going happen at this date at this moment in Jesus name.they're test the Lord it is written never put to test the Lord your God,8 might be correct words or sentence this is wat i learn and understand, in your sect you include the chapter,verse and the writter.God Bless


Mother in doubt 5 years ago

I have a son who is a born again christian. He was baptized last summer. Big mistake! He has told me that Catholics are killers. He hates his mother. He swears, he lies, he steals he is very unhappy. Is this what the preacher preaches! I think you all freaks! And I'm scared for him. I will continue to pray for him. The Lord Jesus Christ that was born on Christmas day and rose again on Easter Sunday. Amen.


Jon 5 years ago

I am so fortunate for articles like this and everything it has done to help people from across the world! I think everybody deserves a second chance. I had a cousin one time who had drug problems but was able to recover and now he’s just fine! It doesn’t matter when you meet Jesus all that matters is that you do!! I’m glad all of the shows are giving people second chances. I just saw a commercial for that cool game show “Minute To Win It” on NBC where they’re doing a second chance show as well! I think it’s on this Wednesday January 26 at like 8/7c! I know where I’ll be! WE ARE ALL SO BLESSED!


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skye2day 5 years ago from Rocky Mountains

This was written 12 or so ago so I hope you have a better understanding of Born again. It is so simple only the 'world' has to confuse it and make 'born a again' a religions thing. There is the world and we all live in it. Borne again are different because we live in the world but are not of the world. In other words we live the Bible. The one true Bible, not changed by a religion to suit their agenda. We believe in Jesus Christ and live in a Spiritual World. Many will any they are Christians but until Jesus is Lord of live by personal invitation one does bot now him as personal savior. The only way one can understand scripture and know the truth is by the Holy Spirit that abides in us when we ask Jesus Christ into our hearts, repent of sin and confess Him as Lord of our lives. This is written over and over in the Word of God. If a pastor does not teach this then for me I would be so gone from that 'church' The truth is not being gold that is why there is division in the church today. This is why so many think Christians are spoke of as bogus and many people reject us. The enemy likes this. He is in this world decieving many.Christ loves us , he hates God. Jesus is returning. One day every knee will bow and know Jesus is lord. IF you do not know Jesus the Father will not know you. If a pastor does not teach this he decieves you and is evil. I would run the other way. HOw could a patstor not teach the truth??

Through out all of history there has been a battle of religion and christianity and atheism. Principalities and powers of darkness. There is one GOD who sits on the throne, the Creator of heaven adn earth. It does not matter what you do in life a teacher, lawyer, politician, tee hee on that one if you do not kinow Jesus may God Help you. The anti christ will be here and soon signs are all around and will decieve many. If your church does not teach this truth then please check out another. They do not speak of truth. I say this because I know. I did not ask Jesus into my heart until mid 30 yrs old. My life started to mean sonemething The hole filled up not with money and marathons and ms do good but with the love of christ. I loved my brother and I serve Jesus Christ. The Spirit is my guide and teacher. May God be with you. You have everything to gain by knowing Jesus as your savior. You have everything to loose and will be decieved by denying who Jesus Christ is He went to the cross for all sinners so none would perish. Wo would not teach this truth. THe whole bible is about jesus christ. If it is not taught I would run fast and far.skye


Rick Thorne 5 years ago

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jordan 5 years ago

People believe what they want to believe. It's not something I can control. Nor do I care to. What people believe does not affect my life. I am my own person.


nancy fletcher 5 years ago

when i was young i was batize an didnt really understand in the bible it says we all should be batize,,, so now do i have to be batize again to get to heaven?

but in the bible it says if we really believe that jesus die for ur sins an pray to the lord to forgive us then we may go to heaven. i just want to no bout the batizim.


Craig Cave profile image

Craig Cave 5 years ago from Ireland

Hi Steph... I'm very new to hub pages... one of these days I'll write one!! I'm a Christian from ireland, and we are all far from perfect...often really aware of how we can come across.. but I think at its best we "born-againers" (seriously loaded phrase which you cant use in ireland!) long to share something good, and as we seek God to help us root sin out of our lives, we long for others to do the same. We try to be honest about our need, but then we end up coming across as judgemental... it must be hard to be on the outside of that and feel it. But then good conviction of sin is always good isnt it?

You wrote a brilliant hub. It got people responding and didnt offend me as a born again type. you're right on a lot of the tendancies.. but it has to be all about Jesus this faith of ours. Keep coming back to that. We followers are very imperfect, but hes the one to look to. Church structures can be rubbish...you take the good..throw out the bad... but Jesus is the one...

Well done. Take care!

Craig


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Some commentators might strongly oppose the request of the receipt of the Holy Spirit for the fact that the prophecy in John 16:7 pertaining to the receipt of the Holy Spirit should have been fulfilled in Acts 2 by the outpouring of the Holy Spirit during the Pentecost. They treat John 4:10, John 6:32-34 and Luke 11:13 to be applicable only before the day of Pentecost and all the events as mentioned in the book of Acts to be in transitional period and these give them the conclusion that the request of the Holy Spirit should be nullified currently. Discuss.

The comment that, John 16:7 is applicable to Acts 2 in which the disciples received the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and the current practice of requesting of the Holy Spirit should be in vain, has been found to be unjustifiable in the Gospel for the following reasons:

a) John 16:7 mentions that the Holy Spirit had to be descended upon the disciples when Jesus was glorified and it should have been fulfilled in Acts 2. However, neither John 16:7 nor any verses from the Bible does mention that the practice of requesting of the Holy Spirit should be abandoned after the outpouring of the Holy Spirit as mentioned in Acts 2. By asserting that the requesting of the Holy Spirit should be nullified after the day of Pentecost, is simply the act of making presumption in which it is not stated in the Bible. Or in other words, they simply add words of presumption that is not even stated in the Bible. We have been warned in the Bible not to abuse the Scripture by adding or subtracting words. Unless a verse or sentence has been stated clearly elsewhere in the Bible that requesting of the Holy Spirit has to be ceased or to be nullified after the day of Pentecost, it should then be rational to conclude that requesting of the Holy Spirit is redundant and not be to exercised in the future.

b)Some commentators might suggest that the phrase, they were come down prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, as mentioned in Acts 8:15 to be the exceptional case with their presumption that this event should fall during transitional period. However, neither Acts 8 nor any verses from the Bible that mentions that Acts 8 should be meant for transitional period and that should be the ultimate reason for the request of the Holy Spirit. By asserting that the event as mentioned in Acts 8 to be the transitional period has caused one to add words of presumption that is not even mentioned in the Scripture. What if the event as mentioned in Acts 8:15 in reality should not be meant for transitional period, the phrase, they were come down prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, in Acts 8:15 would give the impression that God demands the practice of the praying of the Holy Spirit as mentioned in Acts 2. As nothing is mentioned in Acts 8 that it is meant for transitional period to excuse people in the future to pray for the receipt of the Holy Spirit other than the presumptuous thought from some commentators, the intention to do away the requesting of the Holy Spirit with excuses to be give, would ultimately cause many people to be in the doom with their presumption that they have received the Holy Spirit and yet in reality, they might not have.

c) Some commentators might have suggested that the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2 is meant to be either the spoken words raised during the transitional period or for other excuse reason (such as, this is meant to be for exceptional case due to they had received or known merely John's baptism) to discourage people from requesting the receipt of the Holy Spirit. However, neither Acts 19 nor any verses in the Bible does mention that Acts 19 should be meant for transitional period. The commentators simply add words of assumption to discourage people from requesting of the Holy Spirit. What if Acts 19 should not be considered as transitional period or it was not due to other reason (such as they had merely received John's baptism) in realtiy, those people, that have this presumptuous thought, have undoubtedly added words of presumption in which they are not mentioned elsewhere in the Bible. What if praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit has to be considered as part of the plan for God's salvation, the intention to avoid and mislead many not to pray to receive the Holy Spirit, would cause many to be in the doom for not to be born again.

d)Neither John 4:10 nor John 6:32-34 nor Luke 11:13 mentions that the practice of the requesting of the Holy Spirit should be ceased on the day of Pentecost, it is irrational to add words of presumption in the Bible in which it is not even stated. John 16:7 emphasizes on the outpouring of the Holy Spirit when Jesus was glorified and nothing is mentioned about the cessation of the request of the Holy Spirit after the Pentecost.

Any mis-interpretation on the part of the way to salvation would simply lead people to presume that they are saved and have received the Holy Spirit without the realisation of the possible absence of the Holy Spirit within their bodies.


CARIBQUEEN profile image

CARIBQUEEN 5 years ago

Steph: I just got around to reading this hub. I saw all the comments and I felt really sorry when I read Mary's comments of 15 months ago. Her brother-in-law was so judgmental and it left her feeling hurt and confused. Do you know that this is one of the very reasons that some persons who are really seeking God turn away from the Church and religion. Certain view and rules are imposed upon them and they feel inferior compared to "born again" Christians. From my experience, I know that each individual needs to have a personal relationship with God and a personal experience regardless of church. God is only a prayer away, once you seek Him you will find Him. It is not difficult. Religion is man-made and it divides sometimes more than it unites, which is so sad. We are all one people despite color, creed or race. God loves us despite who we are. You pour out your heart to God and not to Man. Remain strong and trusting.


jonathan chm 5 years ago

Some commentators might use the following verses to oppose the use of sinner’s prayer with the excuse that the Holy Spirit should be with them simply by mentioning that they do confess that Jesus is the Son of God and their recognition about the resurrection of Jesus:

1 John 4:15, “Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.”

Romans 10:9, “That if thou shalt confess with the mouth the Lord Jesus, and shall believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.”

Discuss.

At a glance, the phrase, Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, in 1 John 4:15 seems to imply that all those people, that confess Jesus as the Son of God, must have received the Holy Spirit. However, the following are the two distinctive cases from the Bible that have brought us to the attention that not all the people, that proclaim Jesus is the Son of God, have received the Holy Spirit:

a) Instances below that give us the implication that people could proclaim Jesus to be the Son of God even prior to the resurrection of Jesus:

i) Matthew 14:33, "Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, of a truth thou art the Son of God."

ii) Matthew 27:54, "Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God."

iii) Mark 15:39, "And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God."

iv) John 1:49, “Nathamael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the king of Israel.”

v) John 11:27, “She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.”

The following are the extracts that prove that those people, that are mentioned in Matthew 14:33, 27:54; John 1:49, 11:27, and Mark 15:39, did not receive the Holy Spirit prior to the resurrection of Jesus:

i) John 7:39, “(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive, for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]: because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)”

ii) John 16:7, “Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.”

Despite Matthew 14:33, 27:54; Mark 15:39; John 1:49 and John 11:27 were the events occurred prior to the day that Jesus was glorified and these people should not have received the Holy Spirit as mentioned in John 7:39 and 16:7, yet they could proclaim Jesus as the Son of God at the absence of the Holy Spirit. This gives the ultimate conclusion that those people, that could proclaim Jesus to be the Son of God in this modern society, do not give any strong proof that they have God to be dwelt within their bodies.

b) Instances from the Scripture to prove that even demons could comment that Jesus is the Son of God and yet God do not dwell within their bodies. The following are the extracts:

i) Matthew 8:29, "And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?"

ii) Mark 3:11, “And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.”

iii) Luke 4:41, “And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuke them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.”

iv) Luke 8:28, “When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, what have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most High? I beseech thee, torment me not.”

From the above explanations and the extracts, these could easily arrive at the conclusion that it is irrational to determine whether a person has received the Holy Spirit by simply hearing him/her in proclaiming that Jesus is the Son of God.

As it is irrational to determine whether a person has received the Holy Spirit simply by hearing him/her in proclaiming that Jesus is the Son of God, does it imply that 1 John 4:15 is contradictory to Matthew 14:33, 27:54; John 1:49, 11:27, and Mark 15:39? No, it is irrational to jump into this conclusion what if the word, confess, in 1 John 4:15 should be interpreted with broader definition that it should be accompanied with action instead of restricting it to merely mouth-to-mouth confession. When the word, confess, in 1 John 4:15 has been interpreted with broader definition to include our sincere action towards God in treating and letting Jeus to be truly the Son of God to reign in our lives, we then would discover 1 John 4:15 does not contradict itself with other verses in the Bible. Or in other words, the person that confess that Jesus is the Son of God need to have high respect of Jesus and to allow Him to come into his/her life so as to take control of him/her.

James 2:19 provides the truth that the devils even believe in God and yet they tremble as a result of their faith without action. A person might proclaim that he/she believes in Jesus to be the Son of God and his/her Lord and yet God is interested whether his faith is accompanied with action through his/her willingness to accept Him to be his/her Personal Saviour and Lord. The following are the extracts from James 2:19-24 and these are self-explanatory:

James 2:19-24, “Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only


jo 5 years ago

Thanks Step for all the wisdom gained on this topic, but still cannot digest why there are differences or hatred with the word ROMAN CATHOLIC/CHRISTIAN Church. We all believe in same Almighty Lord Jesus. so the question is why don't we have priest,pastor and the protestantian coming together and preaching the same Word of GOD as one whole unity.Do you agree to this differences/debate in the entire world?


Jonathan chm 5 years ago

Some commentators might strongly condemn sinner’s prayer by mentioning that this is not found anywhere in the Bible.  Discuss. Let’s look into all the factors that should contribute towards sinner’s prayer prior to looking into the matter above: a) Repentance: Repentance is significant for non-Christians for their conversions.  The intention to do away repentance among non-Christians would not cause those that persist in sinning without repentant heart, to be born again due to God regard not their prayer.  The following are the extracts: Psalms 66:18, “If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me.” Isaiah 1:15, “And ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.” Isaiah 59:1-2, “Behold, the Lord’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear: But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.” Nevertheless, non-Christians have to repent from sinning, such as, abandoning in worshipping idols, and etc. prior to their commencement of Sinner’s prayer or else their prayer would simply be in vain. b) Confession of Sins: The introduction of confession of sins in sinner’s prayer among non-Christians would certainly direct their mind to the right path in acknowledging and confessing their sins before God for the claim of the promise of sin’s cleansing as spelt out below: 1 John 1:9, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” The same is mentioned in Proverb 28:13, “(that) He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.” Bearing in mind that iniquities are the barriers that cause non-Christians not to reach out to God since God regard not iniquities.  The following are the extracts for detailed examination and analyses: Psalms 5:4-5, “For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee…thou hatest all workers of iniquity.” Psalms 7:11, “…God is angry with the wicked every day.” Isaiah 59:1-2, “Behold, the Lord’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear: But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.” Proverbs 15:26, “The thoughts of the wicked are an abomination to the Lord…” Proverbs 15:29, “The Lord is far from the wicked…” Would this imply that the verses above contradict the phrase, For God so loved the world, in John 3:16?  No, the verses above do not contradict the phrase, For God so loved the world, in John 3:16 provided that the word, world, in John 3:16 has to exclude evil deeds, disobedience to God and all kinds of iniquities.  Without excluding iniquities from the definition of the word, world, the interpretation would turn up to be unjustifiable that God love people to commit iniquities, such as, stirring up violence, havoc and etc. in the society. The confession of sins in sinner’s prayer enables non-Christian to express their iniquities towards God to ease the sins’ cleansing especially sins have caused them to be separated from God as mentioned in Isaiah 59:1-2 and that is why there is a need for them to confess their sins before God for sins’ cleansing for the claim of the promise as mentioned in 1 John 1:9, “(that) If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”  Romans 4:7, "[saying], Blessed [are] they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered." What if non-Christians insist their perfection without sins, would their sins be forgiven?  1 John 1:8, “If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.”   As the phrase, the truth is not in us, is mentioned in 1 John 1:8 with the phrase, If we say that we have no sin, it implies that God’s truth is not with non-Christians if they insist their perfection without sins.  As God’s truth is not with them if they insist they are without sins, there should not be any possibility that God would be with them or their sins could be forgiven.  The same is mentioned in 1 John 1:10, “(that) If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”  The reason for all non-Christians need to express their sins towards God by confession through sinner’s prayer, has been spelt out as follows: Romans 3:23, “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.” Romans 5:12, “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:” Romans 5:18-19, “Therefore as by the offence of one [judgment came] upon all men to condemnation;…For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners,…” c) Faith has to be exercised throughout sinner’s prayer.  This is due to non-Christians would not expect to receive any from sinner’s prayer if they do not exercise faith throughout/after sinner’s prayer, such as, they do not believe their sins have been forgiven; they do not believe that the Holy Spirit has come into their bodies, and etc.; after sinner’s prayer.  The following are the extracts: James 1:6-8, “But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering.  For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.  For let not that man think he shall receive any thing of the Lord.  A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.” d) Sinner’s prayer should also include forgiveness of sins of others.  This is due to God demand non-Christians to forgive others prior to granting the forgiveness of their sins.  The following are the supporting verses: Matthew 6:14-15, “For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses; neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.” Mark 11:25-26, “And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.  But if you do not forgive, neither will your father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.” The Lord allow confession of sins to be included in prayer.  The following are the extracts for proves: Matthew 6:12, “(mentions that) And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.” Luke 11:4, “And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us.” Nevertheless, there is a preference to include the request of the forgiveness of sins for others during sinner’s prayer. e) Request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit: John 4:10, “ Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.” John 6:32-34, “ Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.   For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.” Luke 11:13, “If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?” Acts 19:2   He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” John 4:10, 6:32-34 and Luke 11:13 above are the spoken words from Jesus that direct non-Christians for the request of the Holy Spirit.  Many commentators say that the request of the Holy Spirit should have ceased on the day of Pentecost.  However, none of the verses in the Bible do mention the request of the Holy Spirit should have ceased after the Pentecost in Acts 2.  What if the praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit should not cease in reality and that the event in the book of Acts 19 was not the transitional period, those people that refuse to pray for the receipt of the Holy Spirit will be in the d


Jonathan chm 5 years ago

doom and the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Spirit since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2 would turn up to be the warning among non-Christians for their earnest request of the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

e) To include acknowledging Jesus’ resurrection in sinner’s prayer: This is by virtue of Jesus’ resurrection is part of the plan for salvation. The following is the extract:

Romans 10:9, “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.”

After reading the above factors that have direct impact upon salvation. Now, let’s examine the book of Acts cautiously below for the reply that some commentators have brought out to do away sinner’s prayer with the excuse that it is not mentioned in the Bible:

1) Acts 6:6-7, “Whom they set before the apostles: and when they had prayed, they laid their hands on them. And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.”

As the phrase, the disciples multiplied…greatly, is mentioned in Acts 6:7, it implies the great number of non-Christians were converted to Christianity. Nothing is mentioned in Acts 6:6-7 or elsewhere that these people did repent from sinning prior to their conversion. One must not be quick in jumping into the conclusion by using this event to support that non-Christians need not to repent in order to be born again or else he/she is simply adding words of assumption in which it is not stated in Acts 6;6-7. As nothing is mentioned in Acts 6:6-7 that they did repent from sin, there are two possibilities with regard to their conversion. First assumption is that they might have repented from sinning and yet it was not mentioned in Acts 6:6-7. Another alternative possibility is that they did not repent from sinning, such as, continuing in worshipping idols; creating havoc in the society; and etc. As repentance has to be sought prior to the conversion to Christianity, they must have repented from sin prior to receiving the Holy Spirit. Thus, the absence of the word, repentance, in Acts 6:6-7 does not imply that they did not repent from sins prior to receiving the Holy Spirit.

The same is for the request of Jesus to come into their lives. Neither Acts 6:6-7 have mentioned that these people did receive the Holy Spirit nor these verses have mentioned clearly that they did or did not request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit. The absence of the words whether they did or did not request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit does not imply that they did not request Jesus to come into their lives. The insisting that they did not ask Jesus to come into their lives even though it is not mentioned at all, has indeed added words of assumption in which it is not even stated in Acts 6:6-7. What if these people did ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit and yet it is not stated in Acts 6:6-7, the discouraging among non-Christians to pray for the receipt of the Holy Spirit would simply cause them not to be born again.

The same is for other factors, such as, confession of sins; acknowledge Jesus to die on the cross, are not even spelt out in the event of Acts 6:6-7. The absence of these factors does not imply that they did not do it.

In conclusion for Acts 6:6-7, despite the phrase, sinner’s prayer, is not mentioned in the book of Acts and yet the elements of the sinner’s prayer can be found here and there in the Bible. Even in the book of Acts, certain part of the event does mention part of it. However, the absence of the elements that should exercise prior to the receipt of the Holy Spirit in Acts 6:6-7, does not imply that they did not exercise it.

2) Acts 8:34-38, “And the eunuch answered Philips, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? Of himself, or of some other men? Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same Scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; What doeth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot the stand still: and they went down into water, both Philip and the eunuch: and be baptized him.”

Meditate the verses above and you would discover nothing is mentioned in the paragraph above that the eunuch had repented from sin prior to his baptism. As nothing is mentioned that he did repent from sin, this event should not be used to conclude that non-Christians could sin continually without repentant heart in order to be saved.

Nothing is mentioned that the eunuch did receive the Holy Spirit except the word, baptism, does not imply that it is not significant to receive the Holy Spirit. As nothing is mentioned in Acts 9:38 that he did receive the Holy Spirit except the phrase, be baptized, the eunuch most likely should have received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:38 in which the phrase, be baptized, is mentioned. Thus, despite he confessed Jesus is the Son of God in Acts 8:37, yet he only received the Holy Spirit after his baptism in Acts 8:37. It is obvious that there is a gap (between the time that he confessed Jesus to be the Son of God in Acts 8:37 and the time that he received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:38) in which the Holy Spirit is not with him. It gives us the implication that confession that Jesus is the Son of God might not be accompanied with immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

The above explanation proves that the absence of the elements of sinner’s prayer in the book of Acts, does not imply the people in the past did not exercise them. What if they did repent from sins; confessed sins before God for the forgiveness of sins; acknowledged Jesus has been resurrected; and praying for the receipt of the Holy Spirit and yet they are not mentioned clearly in the book of Acts, or what if these should be the plan of God for salvation, the intention to do away sinner’s prayer could cause many to fall and not to be born again.

3) Acts 10:44-48, “While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed him to tarry certain days.”

The phrase, they of the circumcision which believed, in Acts 10:45 undoubtedly refers to the Jews since they were circumcised. The phrase, the Holy Ghost fell on them which heard the word, in Acts 10:44 refers to the Gentiles that received the Holy Spirit and yet the word, heard, is mentioned instead of the word, believed. Nothing is mentioned in Acts 10:44 that they believed in Jesus except that they heard the word. The absence of the word, believed, in Acts 10:44 does not imply that the Gentiles did not believe in Jesus prior to the receiving of the Holy Spirit.

Nothing is mentioned in Acts 10:44-48 that the Gentiles did repent from sin, does not imply that Gentiles could continue in sinning without repentant heart prior to the receipt of the Holy Spirit. The phrase, as the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost, is mentioned in Acts 10:45 prior to the phrase, And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord, it implies that the receipt of the Holy Spirit could be before the baptism was performed.

The following are the extracts from other events in the book of Acts in which the word, repentance, is not mentioned and yet those non-Christians should have repented from sin:

Acts 8:12-17, “But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. The


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Then Simon himself beloved also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done. Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and…who, they received the Holy Spirit…Then laid their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.”

Acts 11:14-15, “Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved. And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.”

Acts 11:24, “For he was a good man, and full of the Holy Ghost and of faith: and much people was added unto the Lord.”

Acts 16:31-33, “And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. And they spoke unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house. And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and his, straightway.” Again nothing is mentioned that these people did repent from sin and not even mentioning they did receive the Holy Spirit except the phrase, be baptized.

Some might argue that Acts 2:38 did mention the word, repent, to support that the Book of Acts encourages repentance. My query is why the word, repent, is not mentioned repeatedly in most of the events of the Book of Acts except Acts 2:38. As it is only mentioned in Acts 2:38 instead of in other events of the Book of Acts, it implies that the absence of the word, repent, in other parts of the Book of Acts, does not imply that non-Christians did not exercise it. The same is for the request of the receipt of the Holy Spirit. The absence of the phrase, to ask Jesus into our heart, in the book of Acts, does not imply that they did not exercise it.

From the above extracts and explanations, it could easily arrive at the conclusion that it is not justifiable to conclude that repentance is not necessary for the conversion of non-Christians just simply due to the absence of it in the book of Acts. The same is that it is irrational to oppose people to ask Jesus to come into their heart just because it is not stated in the Book of Acts. Similarly, no conclusion should be drawn out that confession of sins for non-Christians to God should be done away just simply with the excuse that it is not stated in the book of Acts.

Some commentators might suggest that believing leads to immediate forgiveness of sins and the receipt of the Holy Spirit. Discuss.

My personal conviction is that believing does not lead to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit and sins’ cleansing. Non-Christians that believe in Jesus have to be humble themselves before God to confess their sins before God to seek His forgiveness and the request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

For instance, if the doctrine, believing leads of immediate forgiveness of sins, is true, 1 John 1:9 would turn up to be in error for the following reasons:

a) Non-Christians needs not to confess their sins before God since God do not forgive their sins and their sins could not be forgiven unless they believe in Jesus instead of through confession of sins to God provided that the doctrine, believing leads to sins’ cleansing, is true.

b) Christians do not need to confess sins before God due to their believes have granted them the forgiveness of sins and there is no need for them to confess their sins to God provided that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate sins’ cleansing, is true.

The above shows that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate sins' cleansing, has contradicted the fundamental truth in 1 John 1:9. As 1 John 1:9 contains any error, the doctrine, that believing leads to immediate sins’ cleansing, should be rejected and that there is a need to confess sins before God for sins' cleansing. Thus, there is a need for non-Christians to confess their sins before God to seek His forgiveness and that is why sinner’s prayer must not be done away.

For instance, if the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2 would turn up to be in error for the following reasons:

a) If the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the disciples should not ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit before the Pentecost since the Holy Spirit would not descend upon them prior to the day that Jesus was glorified as mentioned in John 16:7. As the Holy Spirit would not descend upon the disciples prior to the Pentecost, the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2 should not be asked. This is by virtue of the Holy Spirit would descend automatically upon the disciples upon the day of Pentecost and that there is no need for them to ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit provided believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

b) If the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, in Acts 19:2, should not be asked even after the day of Pentecost. This is by virtue of the Holy Spirit would descend automatically upon the disciples after their believing in Jesus provided that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true.

c) If the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, in Acts 19:2 should not be asked among non-Christians. This is by virtue of non-Christians in this modern society need not to ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit since God come to them at the time of their belief provided that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true.

d) If the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, in Acts 19:2, should not be asked among Christians. This is by virtue of Christians in this modern society should not ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit since their believing in Jesus has led to the immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit provided that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true.

As the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, has led to the contradiction of the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2, it implies that this doctrine should be rejected and that the doctrine, believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, should not be established.

Some commentators might oppose sinner's prayer with the excuse that the Scripture does not demand people to ask Jesus into their heart. Discuss.

The most obvious verses to show that the Bible does contain verses pertaining to asking Jesus into our heart:

Acts 8:15, "they were come down prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit..." The phrase, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit, in Acts 8:15 implies that the people did ask Jesus into their heart.

Luke 11:13, “If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?” The phrase, [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him, in Luke 11:13 implies Jesus even mentioned the asking of the Holy Spirit into our heart.

The less obvious verses that give the hint in the Bible pertaining to asking Jesus into our heart:

John 4:10, “ Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.” The phrase, living water, in John 4:15 should refer undoubtedly to eternal life. As the phrase, If thou knewest the gift of God...thou wouldest have asked of him, is mentioned in Acts 4:10 with the phrase, living water, it implies the asking of Jesus to receive the gift of God, that is the Holy Spirit, that leads to liv


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

living water and that is eternal life. The word, asked, is mentioned in this verse.

John 6:32-34, “ Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.” The phrase, the true bread, in John 6:32 should refer to Jesus. As the phrase, Then said they unto him...give us this bread, is mentioned in Acts 6:34 with the phrase, true bread, in John 6:32, it implies that the disciples did ask for the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 19:2, "He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” The phrase, Have ye receive the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, in Acts 19:2 implies the possibility of the absence of the Holy Spirit among the people that believe in Jesus. Or else, there should not be any reason for Acts 19:2 to raise a query that, Have ye receive the Holy Ghost since ye believed? Instead, the verse should mention that the Holy Ghost is in you since ye believed. As the phrase, Have ye receive the Holy Ghost since ye believed?, is mentioned in Acts 19:2, non-Christians have to express to God for their desire to allow Jesus to come into their heart to be their Lord and Personal Saviour.


Hope 5 years ago

Has anybody ever seen Jesus, not just in a picture but in the same room?!!!


Hope 5 years ago

I am asking this because I am worried about a relative that became a born again Christian! I know they are very full on with their views etc but have never heard anyone say they have seen Jesus!!!


Jason 5 years ago

Some Charismatic people say that they could see Jesus and they could feel the presence of God. However, John 5:3-4 mentions that angels could perform miracles:

John 5:3-4, “In these lay a great multitude of impotent folk, of blind, halt, withered, waiting for the moving of the water. For an angel went down at a certain season into the pool, and troubled the water: whosoever then first after the troubling of the water stepped in was made whole of whatsoever disease he had.”

As angels could perform miracles and there are fallen angels, it is hard to tell those that practise the so-called, feeling the presence of God, are from God or from fallen angels. What if this is from fallen angels and not from God, many Charismatic people will be fool by the trick and all cannot be saved then.

This is due to only those that have the Holy Spirit are Christians as mentioned in Romans 8:9.


summer1968 5 years ago

Hi I cannot understand the emphasis on our lord and following christ... is religion not about having faith in god? I also find it difficult to understand how being born again washes away all sins (conviently) and these people will enter into heaven whereas someone that has never sinned other than the sin of Adam and Eve that we were born with will not enter into heaven. I practice a simple religion that I will give no name to. I believe in god I believe have a personal relationship with god. My relationship with god will not be rammed down other peoples throats, it wont cause a war and I will not put extreme pressure or guilt upon myself. How is it that god according to born again christian belief (I may be in accurate) heaven is divided into status chambers? Surely all men are equal in the eyes of god? Religion should be simple you should earn your place not run rampant for years and let when the guilt gets you a process of cleansing begins - expecting to get into heaven seems a bit like a wolf in sheep's clothing!


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Is it rational to support that the reason for Acts 19:2, “…(to mention that) Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?....” is merely the people that had received only John’s baptism and know nothing about Christ?

Detailed analyses of Acts 18-19 as below:

Acts 18:1, “…Paul…came to Corinth;” Acts 18:4, “And he reasoned in the synagogue…persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.” Acts 18:23, “And after he had spent some time [there], he departed, and went over [all] the country of Galatia and Phrygia…” From the above extracts, it is obvious that Acts 19:2 should not have any relationship prior to Acts 18:23 since Paul departed Corinth as mentioned in Acts 18:23. Thus, we have to meditate from Acts 18:24 in order to find out the reason why the query in Acts 19:2 is raised.

Acts 18:24-25, “And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, [and] mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus. This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John. “

Who was the man that commented that he knew Acts 18:25, “…only the baptism of John.”? It was none other than Acts 18:24, “…Apollos…” himself. Who was this man, Apollos, as mentioned in Acts 18:24? Refer to the Strong Concordance where the word, Apollos, is found in Acts 18:24 as follows: A learned Jew from Alexandra and mighty in Scripture who became a Christian and a teacher of Christianity>” This definition can be located in the website at http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

As the phrase, This man was instructed in the way of the Lord…and taught diligently the things of the Lord, is mentioned in Acts 18:24-25 in addition to the reference of the name, Apollos, above, it is easily to come to the conclusion that Apollos was guided by God to the way of the Lord since the phrase, This man was instructed in the way of the Lord, is mentioned in Acts 18:25. This Apollos was not an ordinary Jew since he knew the truth of the Scripture as mentioned in Acts 18:25, “…This man was instructed in the way of the Lord…”

Apollos took the step in reaching out to the Jews in the synagogue about God’s truth since Acts 18:26, “(mentions that) And he (Apollos) began to speak boldly in the synagogue:…”

Not only that, Apollos could even guide Acts 18:26, “…Aquila and Priscilla…(in truth by) expounded unto him the way of God MORE PERFECTLY.” Refer to the Strong Concordance who was this Aquila as mentioned in Acts 18:26? Aquila was a Jew of Pontus, a tent maker to Christ, companion and ally of Paul in propagating Christianity. Certainly! He is a believer. This definition can be located at http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Who is Priscilia then? Priscilia was a Christian woman, the wife of Aquila and this definition can be located in the website at http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Did Apollos know that grace is to live by faith in Acts 18? Yes, he believed since Acts 18:27, “(mentions that) And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, WHEN HE WAS COME, HELPED THEM which HAD BELIEVED THROUGH GRACE:” As the phrase, when he…come, helped them…which had believed through grace, is mentioned in Acts 18:27 with the phrase, the disciples…receive him, it implies that Apollos knew that grace is by faith. The word, grace, in Acts 18:27 has been defined in the Strong Concordance to be Christianity faith as extracted below: of the merciful kindness by which God; exerting his holy influence upon souls; turns them to Christ; keeps, strengthens, increases them in Christian faith, knowledge, affection, and kindles them to the exercise of the Christian virtues The above definition of the word, grace, can be located in

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

This man, Apollos, even believed that Jesus is Christ since he spoke to the Jews and to convince them that Jesus is Christ as mentioned in Acts 18:28, “(that) For he mightily convinced the Jews, [and that] publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.”

As Apollos had already been a believer in Christ as mentioned in Acts 18:25, why is it Acts 18:25, “(mentions that he)…knowing only the baptism of John.”? The only possible reason for Scripture to mention that he knew only John’s baptism is he was speaking concerning the knowledge of the baptism of John and the baptism by the Holy Spirit instead of including other knowledge that are pertaining to whether he knew Jesus is Christ as well as other knowledge. By comparing the two baptisms, Apollos replied that he knew only John’s baptism since he was ignorant about the baptism by the Holy Spirit and this led him to Acts 19:2, “(mention that)…We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” Or in other words, Apollos already believed Jesus is Christ (Acts 18:28) and had already known the way of God (Acts 18:25) and that grace is to live by faith (Acts 18:27). The only thing that he did not know is baptism by the Holy

Spirit as spelt out in Acts 19:2 and that caused Acts 18:25, “(to mention that he knew)…only the baptism of John.”

Even though Apollos believed that Jesus is Christ (Acts 18:28) and had already known the way of God (Acts 18:25) and believed that grace is to live by faith (Acts 18:27), yet he was asked whether he has received the Holy Spirit since Acts 19:2, “(mentions that)…Have ye receive the Holy Ghost since ye be believed?...” and lately he was led to be baptized by Paul and John as mentioned in Acts 19:4 to receive the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:6. For instance, if the concept of ‘believing attracts immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit’ is true, Apollos should not be asked whether there is Holy Spirit within his body (Acts 19:2) and there should not be any mentioning of the receipt of the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:6 since he had believed Jesus to be Christ (Acts 18:28) and that the Holy Spirit should have come automatically into his body.

As the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, is mentioned in Acts 19:2, it implies the possible absence of the Holy Spirit when a person believes in Jesus and that is why we need to request for the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

Is it rational to use Ephesians 2:8-9 to support that salvation is through merely faith?

Let’s meditate Ephesians 2:8-9 below carefully:

Ephesians 2:8-9, “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

The original meaning of the word, works, in Ephesians 2:8-9 in Strong Concordance can be located in the website address as follows: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico... The definition is listed out as follows:

1) Business, employment, that which any one is occupied;

a) that which one undertakes to do, enterprise, undertaking

2) ANY PRODUCT whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or MIND;

3) an act, deed, thing done; the idea of working is emphasized in opp. that that which is less than work

Refer to clause 2 above for the definition of the word, works, and you would discover that the definition of the word, works, in Ephesians 2:9-10 not only include the work of action, but also the work of mind since the word, mind, is mentioned at the end of clause 2. As the word, works, in Ephesians 2:9-10 could include also the byproduct that comes out from mind, it should include faith in Jesus and even confessing Jesus as Lord. Thus, the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:9 implies that we are saved not because any of our works whether it is directed from our mind through faith in Jesus or our confession in Jesus or any work that is directed towards Jesus. This interpretation is confirmed by the phrase, that not of yourselves, that is mentioned in Ephesians 2:9. For instance, if we comment that we are saved merely through our


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

faith in God or our confession in God, it certainly means that our salvation is directed from the work of our mind

that work towards to have faith in Jesus. As the phrase, not of yourselves...Not of works, is mentioned in Ephesians 2:8-9, it implies that we could not give credit of our salvation to our mind and that is to our faith in Jesus or even any of our work of action to God. Instead, our salvation is directed solely from the grace of God or the gift of God through faith. Our salvation is merely through the grace of God through faith in which we have been quickened together with Christ so as to raise us up from death as mentioned in Ephesians 2:5-6, “(that) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:” Or in other words, we are saved by grace not because of our faith in Jesus or our any good work in Jesus. If God do not quicken us together with Christ, we could never be saved even if there is

the work of faith in us or any good work to Him.

Many commentators might suggest that the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:5-6 to be interpreted as we do not need to do any work to God in order to be saved. It is erroneous to support it since the word, works, (please refer to Strong Concordance) in its original meaning not only includes the work of actions, but also the work of mind. As the word, works, in its original meaning should cover the work of mind, the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:5-6 should imply that our salvation should not be from the work of faith in Jesus. Or in other words, the insisting of the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:5-6 to be interpreted as we do not need any work to achieve salvation, would turn up to be we do not need to have any work of faith in us towards Jesus in order to be saved.

As our salvation is not the work of our work of faith in Jesus, why should Ephesians 2:8-9, “For by grace are ye saved through faith;..."? Meditate Ephesians 2:8-9 carefully and you will discover the phrase, by grace are ye saved through faith. The word, grace, in Ephesians 2:8-9 is mentioned. Or in other words, it is the grace that God that quicken us to cause us to be saved through faith and it is not by our work of faith or any good work to Jesus alone but also has to include his abounding grace in us. Thus, it is erroneous to interpret the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:8-9 as we do not need any works to be saved or else we need not to have faith in Jesus since the word, works, should also include the work of our faith in Jesus.

From the above elaboration, it could come to the conclusion that the phrase, Not of works, in Ephesians 2:8-9 should be interpreted as we must not give credits of our salvation to any of our work and even of our mind, i.e. how much faith we have in Christ, since it is purely the gift of God that enables us to be saved through faith.

Does Ephesians 2:8-9 support that the Holy Spirit is solely the one that enables us to believe in Jesus and to enable us to confess in sins and to also enable us to be converted to Christianity without our effort and respond towards God?

Let’s meditate the phrase, For by grace are ye saved through faith, in Ephesians 2:8.

The root word (Etymology), through, in its original meaning from Ephesians 2:8 as spelt out in the Strong Concordance as a primary preposition denoting a channel of act and this can be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico... As the root word of the word, through, in Ephesians 2:8 contains the meaning of a channel of act, it implies the requisition of our action in order to achieve salvation.

The word, faith, in Ephesians 2:8 is defined by Strong Concordance as follows:

1) conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the NT of A CONVICTION OR BELIEF RESPECTING MAN’S RELATIONSHIP TO GOD and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervour born of faith and joined with it

a) relating to God : the conviction that God exists and is the creator and ruler of all things, the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ

b) relating to Christ : a strong and welcome conviction or belief that Jesus is the Messiah, through whom we obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom of God

c) the religious beliefs of Christians

d) belief with the predominate idea of trust (or confidence) whether in God or in Christ, springing from faith in the same

2) fidelity, faithfulness

a) the character of one who can be relied on

The above definition can be located in the website address as follows: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

This phrase, a conviction or belief respecting man’s relationship to God, in clause 1 above has the implication that we have to establish our relationship vertically upward to God with our conviction or belief. Clause 1 a) stresses that our conviction has to be that God is the creator and ruler of all things and he is the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ. Clause 1b) stresses also that our conviction has to be that Jesus is the Messiah through whom we obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom of God. From the extracted definition of the word, faith, from Strong Concordance above pertaining to its original meaning, it could easily derive at the conclusion that salvation has to be accompanied with our response to God since clauses 1(a) and 1(b) are pertaining to our direct relationship towards our conviction to God. Nevertheless, it is rational to conclude that Ephesians 2:8 stresses that salvation has to be through our

faith in Jesus to be the Messiah and that we could obtain salvation through him.

As the phrase, through faith, in Ephesians 2:8 has been defined in the Strong Concordance in its original meaning as explained above to be related to our faith or conviction that Jesus is the Messiah and that our salvation is through him, it certainly refers to the work of our mind in order to achieve faith in God. Does the phrase, through faith, in Ephesians 2:8 contradict with the phrase, Not of works, as mentioned in Ephesians 2:9 since faith refers to salvation has to be the work of mind through faith and yet the phrase, Not of works, refers to not even cover the work of mind? Let’s meditate the phrase, For by grace are ye saved through faith, in Ephesians 2:8 again. Bear in mind both the word, grace, and the phrase, through faith, are mentioned in Ephesians 2:8 indicating that grace has to work hand in hand with the phrase, through faith, in order for salvation to be achieved. Or in other words, salvation is not solely the work of the

mind, i.e. faith in Jesus as mentioned in Ephesians 2:8, but it is the combination of both the grace (that is God's gift that has been granted vertically downward from Jesus to us) and the faith (that is our response to God vertically upward from us to Jesus by means of our belief that Jesus is Messiah and is the only one that could save us). As the word, grace, does not isolate itself in Ephesians 2:8 since the phrase, through faith, is mentioned to be the accompany, it implies that salvation could not work if God grant us grace and yet we do not respond to God by means of our faith in Jesus. Or in other words, salvation could only be at work only when God's grace has been granted to us with our response to God in faith. Thus, it is erroneous to support that the Holy Spirit come to speak to us and we would definitely become Christianity since we have to respond to the Holy Spirit in order to be saved. If the Holy Spirit speaks to us and yet we

do not respond to it, it would serve no purpose on salvation. Meditate carefully the phrase, For BY GRACE are ye saved THROUGH FAITH, in Ephesians 2:8 and you would discover that grace and faith have to work hand in hand in order to be saved instead of mentioning grace alone or faith alone. If you have faith and do not receive God's grace, it serves no purpose for salvation. Even if God's grace inte


Jonathan chm 5 years ago

tends to be for you and you do not respond it with your faith, it serves no purpose for salvation either.

Is it rational to use the phrase, For by grace are ye saved through faith, in Ephesians 2:8-9 to support that we do not need to repent from sin or need not to confess sin before God or do not need to acknowledge the death of Jesus and His resurrection or do not need to confess Jesus as Lord in order to be saved just because the word, faith, in Ephesians 2:8 has its meaning to be restricted to our conviction to Jesus to be the Messiah and He is solely the provider of our salvation as mentioned formerly instead of this has to include other factors? No, it is irrational to support it since the phrase, through faith, is mentioned in Ephesians 2:8 instead of the phrase, only through faith. Unless the phrase, through faith, in Ephesians 2:8 has been replaced by the phrase, only through faith, it is then rational to support that salvation is merely through faith and nothing else. As the word, only, or, alone, is not mentioned with the word, faith, in

Ephesians 2:8 to restrict the scope of additional application, it is rational for one to conclude that salvation is the gift of God through faith but not limited to faith but also include repentance from sin; confessing of sins; acknowledging the death and the resurrection of Jesus; and even requesting Jesus into our lives to be our Personal Saviour.

Some might comment that repentance is only the fruit after converting to Christianity. Discuss.

Let’s meditate Acts 2:38-39 in replying to the above query:

Acts 2:38-39, “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.”

The word, Repent, in Acts 2:38 has been defined in the Strong Concordance with the following definition and it could be located in the website address as follows: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) to change one's mind, i.e. to repent

2) to change one's mind for better, heartily to amend with abhorrence of one's past sins

Refer to clause 2) above of the definition of the word, Repent, and you would discover that this word implies the amendment with abhorrence of one’s past sins. Or in other words, a person has to abandon in sinning. As the word, Repent, is mentioned in Acts 2:38-39 prior to both the word, be baptized, and the phrase, ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, it implies that non-Christians have to abandon in sinning prior to the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

The word, remission, as mentioned in Acts 2:38 has been defined in the Strong Concordance with the following definition and it could be located in the website address as follows: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) release from bondage or imprisonment .

2) forgiveness or pardon, of sins (letting them go as if they had never been committed), remission of the penalty.

The phrase, forgiveness or pardon of sin, is mentioned in clause 2 in the definition of the word, remission, implies forgiveness of sin. As the phrase, remission of sins, is mentioned in Acts 2:38-39 prior to the phrase, ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, it implies that forgiveness of sins has to be done prior to the receipt of the Holy Spirit and that is why we include confession of sin as seeking God for his forgiveness prior to our request of the receipt of the Holy Spirit in sinner’s prayer.

What is the definition of the word, sins, in Acts 2:38-39? The definition of sins is spelt out as follows and can be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) equivalent to 264

a) to be without a share in

b) to miss the mark

c) to err, be mistaken

d) to miss or wander from the path of uprightness and honour, to do or go wrong

e) to wander from the law of God, violate God's law, sin

2) that which is done wrong, sin, an offence, a violation of the divine law in thought or in act

3) collectively, the complex or aggregate of sins committed either by a single person or by many

Refer to clause 1e) above, it refers to the violation of God’s law or God’s commandments. As Clause 2) states that a violation of the divine law in thought or in act, it implies that a person is still considered to be in sin even if he has the mind of it without doing it.

Thus, Acts 2:38-39 demand us to abandon in sinning or seek God’s for forgiveness prior to converting to Christianity.

Mark 1:15 is another proof that repentance of sin has to be achieved prior to believing in the Gospel. The following is the extract:

Mark 1:15, “And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”

Refer to the Strong Concordance and you would discover the original meaning for the word, repent, in Mark 1:15 coincides the word, repent, in Acts 2:38 that has the meaning of amending the past sins. As the word, repent, in Mark 1:15 is mentioned prior to the phrase, believe the gospel, it implies that non-Christians have to repent from sinning prior to receiving the Holy Spirit.

Another instance to prove that it is a must for repentance prior to conversion to Christianity:

Luke 13:1-3, “There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.”

The above event was meant for certain people that told Jesus that Galilaeans were very sin. In response to their words, He mentioned with the phrase, except ye repent ye shall all likewise perish, in Luke 13:3. As the phrase, ye shall all likewise perish, is mentioned in Luke 13:3, it implies that these people were not the disciples of Jesus and could never be granted with salvation unless they repent.

What is the definition of the word, repent, as mentioned in Luke 13:3? If you refer to Strong Concordance, you would have discovered the definition of the word, repent, coincides with the word, Repent, in Acts 2:38 that gives the implication for a must in discontinuing in sins.

What is the definition of the word, perish, in Luke 13:3 then? The word, perish, has its definition as spelt out as below and can be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) to destroy

a) to put out of the way entirely, abolish, put an end to ruin

b) render useless

c) to kill

d) to declare that one must be put to death

e) metaph. to devote or give over to eternal misery in hell

f) to perish, to be lost, ruined, destroyed

2) to destroy

a) to lose

Refer to clause 1a) above, the word, perish, has been defined as to destroy; to put out of the way entirely, abolish, put an end to ruin. Or in other words, these people would not be saved.

As the phrase, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish, is mentioned in Luke 13:3, it implies that these people that approached Jesus to condemn Galilaeans to be sinners could not be saved unless they have repented from sinning. As these words were meant for those people that had not been saved, it implies that non-Christians have to repent from sinning in order to be saved.

The same is mentioned in Luke 13:5, “(that) I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Acts 3:19, “Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;”

Refer to the Strong Concordance, the word, Repent, in Acts 3:19 in its original word has the identical meaning as the word, Repent, in Acts 2:38 to imply the abandoning of sins.

The word, converted, is defined in the Strong Concordance below and it could be located in the website at: http://ww


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http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) transitively

a) to turn to

1) to the worship of the true God

b) to cause to return, to bring back

1) to the love and obedience of God

2) to the love for the children

3) to love wisdom and righteousness

2) intransitively

a) to turn to one's self

b) to turn one's self about, turn back

c) to return, turn back, come back

From the above definition, the word, converted, should simply mean turn back to God.

As the word, Repent, in Acts 3:19 is mentioned prior to the word, converted, it demands non-Christians to repent from their sins in order to be converted to Christianity.

The same is supported by the following verses:

Acts 8:22, “Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.”

Acts 20:21, “Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.”

From the above analyses, it could come to the conclusion that repentance of sin is a must prior to converting to Christianity.

Repentance of sins is an on-going process in Christianity even though Christians would not lose salvation once they have fallen into sins or else Hebrews 6:6 would not mention that Christians could fall into sins and be renewed again unto repentance. Despite Christians might fall into sins, they will not lose their salvation. The following are the extracts for the reference:

Hebrews 6:4-6, “For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, and have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.”

1 Corinthians 3:15, “If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.”

The following are the extracts that Paul even struggled with sin and yet he is saved:

Romans 7:18-19, “For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.”

Why should we include confession of sins in sinner’s prayer?

Acts 2:38, “Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”

The definition of the word, baptized, in Strong Concordance is spelt out as below and it could be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

1) to dip repeatedly, to immerse, to submerge (of vessels sunk)

2) to cleanse by dipping or submerging, to wash, to make clean with water, to wash one's self, bathe

3) to overwhelm

The above definition in the same page of Strong Concordance is also enclosed with a note of the explanation pertaining to John’s baptism and it does equate it as a baptism of repentance to Christian baptism. The following is the extract from the Strong Concordance:

Note on Baptism in Ac.Baptism in water (such as John's) is distinguished from baptism with the Holy Spirit (i. 5, etc.). Those who receive the latter, however, may also be baptized in water (cf. xi. 16 with x. 47); and there is one example of people who had previously received John's baptism receiving Christian baptism as a preliminary to receiving the Spirit (xix. 3 ff.). JOHN’S WAS A BAPTISM OF REPENTANCE (xiii. 24; xix. 4), AS WAS ALSO CHRISTIAN BAPTISM (ii. 38), but as John's pointed forward to Jesus (xix. 4), it became obsolete when He came. Christian baptism followed faith in the Lord Jesus (xvi. 31 ff.); it was associated with His name (ii. 38; viii. 16, etc.), which was invoked by the person baptized (xxii. 16); it signified the remission (ii. 38) or washing away of sins (xxii. 16); sometimes it preceded (ii. 38; viii. 15 ff.; xix. 5), sometimes followed (x. 47 f.) the receiving of the Spirit." (F. F. Bruce. The Acts of the Apostles [Greek Text

Commentary], London: Tyndale, 1952, p. 98, n. 1.)

Now let’s examine Matthew 3:6 as follows in comparison of Acts 2:38 above:

Matthew 3:6, “And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.”

If you refer to Strong Concordance to find out the definition of the word, baptized, in Matthew 3:6 and the enclosed note to baptism, you would have discovered that it has the identical meaning to Acts 2:8 and both refer to baptism of repentance as well as Christian baptism.

As Matthew 3:6 is meant for Christian baptism and the word, baptized, is mentioned in Matthew 3:6 with the phrase, confessing their sins, it implies that confession of sins to God is needed whenever it is associated with the word, baptized.

As the word, baptized, in Acts 2:38 has been defined by Strong Concordance to have the identical meaning of the word, baptized, in Matthew 3:6 and that Matthew 3:6 demands to confess sins at the time to be baptized, it implies that non-Christians have to confess sins before God prior to requesting for the receipt of the Holy Spirit since the phrase, be baptized, is mentioned in Acts 2:38 with the phrase, ye shall receive the Holy Ghost.

The same instance can be located in Mark 1:5 that has the word, baptized, to be found in the Strong Concordance that has the identical meaning as Acts 2:38 as extracted below:

Mark 1:5, “And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.”

Bearing in mind the phrase, confessing their sins, is mentioned in Mark 1:5 with the word, baptized, signifies it is a must for the confession of our sins to God prior to the requesting of the Holy Spirit.

As the word, baptized, is mentioned in Acts 2:38-39 (that is related to the claim of the Holy Spirit) coincides with the meaning of Matthew 3:6 as well as Mark 1:5 and yet Matthew 3:6 and Mark 1:5 demand for the confession of sins, that is why we include confession of sins to God in our sinner’s prayer.

Is it rational to use Acts 2:38-39 to support that we could receive the Holy Spirit only at the time of water baptism?

Acts 10:47, “Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?” As Acts 10:47 is the evidence occurs at the time when the Gentiles had not been baptized with water baptism and yet the Holy Spirit had come unto them, it implies that non-Christians could receive the Holy Spirit prior to the performance of water baptism.

As Acts 10:47 supports that non-Christians could receive the Holy Spirit prior to water baptism, non-Christians could receive the Holy Spirit after repenting from sins and praying the Sinner’s prayer prior to water baptism to be performed.

Is it rational to support that our confession of sins must be in details?

The following are the extracts from the Scripture that confession of sins might not necessarily be in details to express our past wrong doings:

Exodus 34:8-9, “And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped. And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.”

Psalms 25:7, “Remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions: according to thy mercy remember thou me for thy goodness' sake, O LORD.”

Psalms 25:11, “For thy name's sake, O LORD, pardon mine iniquity; for it is great.”

Psalms 41:4, “I said, LORD, be merciful unto me: heal my soul; for I have sinned against thee.”

Psalms 51:1-3, “Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions. Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin. For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.”

Psalms 79:8-9, “O remember n


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not against us former iniquities: let thy tender mercies speedily prevent us: for we are brought very low. Help us, O God of our salvation, for the glory of thy name: and deliver us, and purge away our sins, for thy name's sake.”

Psalms 106:6, “We have sinned with our fathers, we have committed iniquity, we have done wickedly.”

Matthew 6:12, “And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.

Luke 11:4, “And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us.”


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Is it rational to support that the reason for Acts 19:2, “…(to mention that) Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?....” is merely the people that had received only John’s baptism and know nothing about Christ?

Detailed analyses with the commencement of Acts 18 prior to tackling Acts 19:2 as follows:

Acts 18:1, “…Paul…came to Corinth;” Acts 18:4, “And he reasoned in the synagogue…persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.” Acts 18:23, “And after he had spent some time [there], HE DEPARTED, and went over [all] the country of Galatia and Phrygia…”

From the above extracts, it is obvious that Acts 19:2 should not have any relationship prior to Acts 18:23 since Paul departed Corinth as mentioned in Acts 18:23. Thus, we have to meditate from Acts 18:24 in order to find out the reason why the query in Acts 19:2 has been raised.

Who was the man that commented that he knew Acts 18:25, “…only the baptism of John.”? It was none other than Acts 18:24, “...APOLLOS…” He was Acts 18:24, “…an eloquent man, [and] mighty in the scriptures…“ Strong Concordance refers Apollos in Acts 18:24 to be a Christian with the following extract: A learned Jew from Alexandra and mighty in Scripture who became a Christian and a teacher of Christianity. This can be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Was this man guided by the truth of the Lord? Yes, he was guided since Acts 18:25, “(mentions that) THIS MAN WAS INSTRUCTED IN THE WAY OF THE LORD; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord…“

Apollos took the step in reaching out to the Jews in the synagogue about God’s truth since Acts 18:26, “(mentions that)…he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: …”

Not only that, Apollos could even guide Acts 18:26, “…Aquila and Priscilla…(by) expound(ing) unto him the way of God MORE PERFECTLY.” Refer to the Strong Concordance to find out who was this Aquila as mentioned in Acts 18:26? Aquila was a Jew of Pontus, a tent maker to Christ, companion and ally of Paul in propagating Christianity. Certainly! He is a believer. This definition can be located at http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Who was Priscilia then? Priscilia was a Christian woman, the wife of Aquila, and the reference of her personality can be located in the website at http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Did Apollos know that grace is to live by faith? Let’s meditate Acts 18:27 as follows:

Acts 18:27, “(mentions that) And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, WHEN HE WAS COME, HELPED THEM which HAD BELIEVED THROUGH GRACE:”

As the phrase, when HE…come, helped them…which HAD BELIEVED THROUGH GRACE, is mentioned in Acts 18:27 with the phrase, the disciples…receive him, it implies that Apollos knew that grace is by faith. The word, grace, in Acts 18:27 has been defined in the Strong Concordance to be Christianity faith as extracted below: of the merciful kindness by which God; exerting his holy influence upon souls; turns them to Christ; keeps, strengthens, increases them in Christian faith, knowledge, affection, and kindles them to the exercise of the Christian virtues The above definition of the word, grace, can be located in the website address as follows:

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

This man, Apollos, even believed that Jesus is Christ since he spoke to the Jews and to convince them that Jesus is Christ as mentioned in Acts 18:28, “(that) For he mightily convinced the Jews, [and that] publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.”

As Apollos had already been a believer as mentioned in Acts 18:25, why is it Acts 18:25, “(mentions that he)…know…only the baptism of John.”? The only possible reason for Scripture to mention that he knew only John’s baptism is he was speaking concerning the knowledge of the baptism of John and the baptism by the Holy Spirit instead of including other knowledge that was pertaining to whether he knew Jesus is Christ as well as other knowledge. By comparing the two baptisms, Apollos replied that he knew only John’s baptism since he was ignorant about the baptism by the Holy Spirit and this led him to Acts 19:2, “(mention that)…We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.” Or in other words, Apollos already believed Jesus is Christ (Acts 18:28) and had already known the way of God (Acts 18:25) and that grace is to live by faith (Acts 18:27). The only thing that he did not know is baptism by the Holy Spirit as spelt out in Acts 19:2 and that caused Acts 18:25, “(to mention that he knew)… only the baptism of John.”

Even though Apollos believed that Jesus is Christ (Acts 18:28) and had already known the way of God (Acts 18:25) and believed that grace is to live by faith (Acts 18:27), yet he was asked whether he has received the Holy Spirit since Acts 19:2, “(mentions that)…Have ye receive the Holy Ghost since ye believed?...” and lately he was led to be baptized by Paul and John as mentioned in Acts 19:4 to receive the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:6. Take note that there is a gap (between Acts 18:28 in which it is highlighted that Apollos believed in Jesus and Acts 19:6 that he received the Holy Spirit ) in which he believed and yet the Holy Spirit was not with him. He only received the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:6 instead of at the time of his belief that Jesus is Christ in Acts 18:28. As there is a gap that Apollos believed in Jesus and yet the Holy Spirit was not with him, it implies that believing does not lead to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit and that there is a possible absence of the Holy Spirit when a person believes in Jesus.

For instance, if the concept of ‘believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit’ is true, Apollos should not be asked whether there is Holy Spirit within his body (Acts 19:2) and there should not be any mentioning of the receipt of the Holy Spirit in Acts 19:6 since he had believed Jesus to be Christ (Acts 18:28) and that the Holy Spirit should have come automatically into his body. As the phrase, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed, is mentioned in Acts 19:2 despite Apollos believed that Jesus is Christ (Acts 18:28) and had already known the way of God (Acts 18:25) and believed that grace is to live by faith (Acts 18:27), it implies the possible absence of the Holy Spirit when a person believes in Jesus.

Some commentators might argue that Peter had not seen the Holy Spirit fell upon the gentiles as He had on the Jews and that Jewish Christians never would have accepted the gentile Christians and these led them to pray for the Holy Spirit as mentioned in Acts 8:15. Discuss.

Let’s meditate Acts 8:5-17 carefully prior to tackling the query above:

Acts 8:5-6, “…PHILIP WENT DOWN TO THE CITY OF SAMARIA, AND PREACHED CHRIST UNTO THEM…” Acts 8:8-10, “…But there was a certain man, called Simon,… bewitched the people of Samaria,…saying, This man is the great power of God.”

Did the Samaria believe in Jesus after Acts 8:5, “…Philip (had)…preached Christ unto them…”? Yes, they did believe since Acts 8:12, “(mentions that)…THEY BELIEVED…concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of JESUS CHRIST…”

After Acts 8:12, “(Samaria had)…believed…(in) Jesus Christ”, did they follow up with water baptism? Yes, they did since in the latter part of Acts 8:12, “(it is mentioned that)…THEY WERE BAPTIZED, BOTH MEN AND WOMEN.”

Not only Samaria had been baptized, Acts 8:13, “…Simon himself believed also: and…(had been) baptized…”

What did the apostles do after knowing Samaria had Acts 8:12, “…believed (in)…Jesus Christ…(and) were baptized (with water baptism)…”? Acts 8:14-17, “…when the apostles which were at Jerusalem HEARD that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: Who, when THEY were come down, PRAYED FOR THEM, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST.”

Did Samaria receive the Holy Spi


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Spirit immediately after Acts 8:12, “…they (had) believed (in)…Jesus Christ…”? No, they did not receive the Holy Spirit at the time of their belief since Acts 8:14-17, “(mention that)…the apostles…heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they…c(a)me down, PRAYED FOR THEM, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST.” Obviously there is a gap (between Acts 8:12 in which they had believed in Jesus and yet Acts 8:17 that they received the Holy Ghost) in which the Holy Spirit was not inside their bodies at the time of their belief. As Acts 8:14-17, “…the apostles… (came) down, (and) prayed for (Samaria) that they might receive the Holy Ghost” after Acts 8:12, “… they (had) believed… (in) Jesus Christ…”, it implies that believing does not lead to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit.

Did Samaria receive the Holy Spirit immediately after Acts 8:12, “…they…were baptized (with water baptism)…”? No, they did not receive the Holy Spirit immediately since Acts 8:14-17, “(mention that)…THEY…come down, PRAYED FOR THEM, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE THE HOLY GHOST: (For as yet he WAS FALLEN UPON NONE OF THEM: ONLY THEY WERE BAPTIZED IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS.) …”

For instance, if the doctrine, that believing leads to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the people of Samaria should have received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:12. For instance, if the doctrine, that water baptism could direct immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit, is true, the people of Samaria should have received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:12. As the people of Samaria did not receive the Holy Spirit until Acts 8:17, “…Peter and John…prayed for them…”, it implies the possible absence of the Holy Spirit at the time of belief.

Now, let’s tackle the question above that some commentators support that Samaria should be treated as gentile Christians and these led them to pray for the Holy Spirit:

Who were these Samaria? The following are the extracts from Strong Concordance and it could be located at: http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexico...

Samaria = “guardianship”

1)A TERRITORY IN PALESTINE, which had Samaria as its capital

The phrase, a territory in Palestine, is mentioned in this definition and yet in the ancient map of Israel, Palestine was located at the border of Israel and yet Samaria was classified as part of Israel.

As Samaria was part of Israel (1 Kings 16:29, 21:18, 22:51, 2 Kings 3:1, 3:6, 10:36, 13:1, 13:10 and 15:8) instead of to be considered as gentiles, it is erroneous to interpret Acts 8:5-17 to be the event that Peter had not seen the Holy Spirit fell upon the gentiles and that Jewish Christians did not accept them and these caused them to pray for the receipt of the Holy Spirit.

Nevertheless, the event in Acts 8:5-17 does provide the proof that believing does not lead to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit and that is why sinner’s prayer should be stressed.

The following are four distinctive cases from the Bible that have brought us to the attention that not all the people, that proclaim Jesus is Lord, have received the Holy Spirit:

a) Instance that Saul could proclaim that Jesus to be the Lord prior to receiving the Holy Spirit.

Let’s meditate Acts 9:1-18 with detailed analyses as follows:

Acts 9:1, “And Saul, yet breathing out threatenings and slaughter against the disciples of the Lord, went unto the high priest,” Acts 9:4, “And HE FELL TO THE EARTH, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?”

After falling down, did Saul question the Lord who was He? Yes he did question the Lord since Acts 9:5, “(mentions that)…he said, WHO ARE THOU, LORD? …”

What was the reply to Saul after questioning who was He? The Lord admitted that He was Jesus since Acts 9:5, “(mentions that)…the Lord said, I AM JESUS whom thou persecutest…”

Did Saul call Jesus to be the Lord after realizing that the One that he spoke to was none other than Jesus Himself as mentioned in Acts 9:5? Acts 9:6, “And he trembling and astonished said, LORD, WHAT WILT THOU HAVE ME TO DO? …”

If you would refer to the definition of the word, Lord, in Acts 9:6 from Strong Concordance, you would have discovered that its original meaning is identical to the word, Lord, in Romans 10:9 that is defined as allowing Jesus to take control of Saul’s life to be his Master. Or in other words, when Saul mentioned the word, Lord, in Acts 9:6, it implies his desire to have Jesus to take control of him to be his Master.

Could Saul have sight problem after opening his eyes? Acts 9:8, “And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.”

Did Saul receive the Holy Spirit when he called Jesus to be the Lord in Acts 9:6 after realizing that Jesus is Lord in Acts 9:5? No, he did not receive the Holy Spirit when he called Jesus to be the Lord in Acts 9:5 since Acts 9:17, “(mentions that)…Ananias…said, BROTHER SAUL, …that THOU MIGHTEST RECEIVE THY SIGHT, AND BE FILLED WITH THE HOLY GHOST” and Acts 9:18, “…immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.” Thus, despite Saul proclaim Jesus to be the Lord in Acts 9:6 after realizing that the One that he spoke to was none other than Jesus in Acts 9:5, yet he only received the Holy Spirit in Acts 9:18 since the phrase, there fell from his eyes as it had been scales…and was baptized, is mentioned then.

Nevertheless, there is an obvious gap (between Acts 9:6 in which he called Jesus to be the Lord and Acts 9:18 that the Holy Spirit came upon him) in which he believed in Jesus and yet the Holy Spirit was not with him, it implies that a person that calls Jesus to be his Lord might not necessarily have received the Holy Spirit.

What was the reason that the Holy Spirit was not with Saul even though he did proclaim Jesus to be his Lord in Acts 9:6 and that led him to be baptized with the Holy Spirit in Acts 9:18?

Let’s meditate James 2:17-19 for clarification:

James 2:17-19, “Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.”

As the phrase, faith…hath not works is dead, is mentioned in James 2:17, it implies that our confession to Jesus to be our Lord has to be accompanied with action or else our faith is in vain. As the word, Lord, in Romans 10:9, 10:13 and 1 Corinth 12:3 has been defined in the Strong Concordance as allowing Jesus to come and control the lives of non-Christians to be their Master, they have to follow with action to request the Holy Spirit to come into their lives and that is why there is a need for the request of the receipt of the Holy Spirit. We are told from the Scripture not to be the hearers of God’s words but be the doers.

James 2:19 mentions that even the devils believe and yet tremble. The reason is simply that the devils believe and yet they do not follow with action to receive Him as their Master.

The same is mentioned in Matthew 7:21, “(that) Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the Kingdom of heaven; but HE THAT DOETH the will of my father which is in heaven.” Non-Christians are urged to be the doers of the Scripture instead of hearers. When the Scripture demands non-Christians to call Jesus as the Lord, it demands them to allow Jesus to come into their lives to take control of them.

Despite Saul proclaimed Jesus to be his Lord in Acts 9:6, his action to receive Jesus Christ was in Acts 9:17-18 and that caused him to be converted then.

b) Instances below that give us the implication that people could proclaim Jesus to be the Son of God even prior to the resurrection of Jesus:

i) Matthew 14:33, "Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, of a truth thou art the Son of God."

ii) Matthew 27:54, "Now when the centur


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God."

iii)Mark 15:39, "And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God."

iv) John 1:49, “Nathamael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the king of Israel.”

v) John 11:27, “She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.”

The following are the extracts that prove that those people, that are mentioned in Matthew 14:33, 27:54; John 1:49, 11:27, and Mark 15:39, did not receive the Holy Spirit prior to the resurrection of Jesus:

i) John 7:39, “(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive, for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]: because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)”

ii) John 16:7, “Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.”

Despite Matthew 14:33, 27:54; Mark 15:39; John 1:49 and John 11:27 were the events occurred prior to the day that Jesus was glorified and these people should not have received the Holy Spirit as mentioned in John 7:39 and 16:7, yet they could proclaim Jesus as the Son of God at the absence of the Holy Spirit. This gives the ultimate conclusion that those people, that could proclaim Jesus to be the Son of God in this modern society, do not give any strong proof that they have God to be dwelt within their bodies.

c) Instances from the Scripture to prove that demons could comment that Jesus is the Son of God and yet God do not dwell within their bodies. The following are the extracts:

i) Matthew 8:29, "And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?"

ii) Mark 3:11, “And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.”

iii)Luke 4:41, “And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuke them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.”

iv)Luke 8:28, “When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, what have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most High? I beseech thee, torment me not.”

From the above explanation, these could arrive at the conclusion that it is irrational to determine whether a person has received the Holy Spirit by simply hearing him/her in proclaiming that Jesus is the Son of God.

d) The less obvious event that proves that believing does not lead to immediate receipt of the Holy Spirit is taken from Acts 8:27-39 about the conversion of the eunuch. The following is the analysis:

Acts 8:27-28, “…a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch…had come to Jerusalem for to worship, was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet”

What did Philip do when he met the eunuch? Acts 8:35, “…Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.”

When did Philip believe in Jesus as mentioned in Acts 8? Let’s Meditate Acts 8:36-37 below prior to tackling this question:

Acts 8:36, “… THE EUNUCH SAID, See, here is water; WHAT DOTH HINDER ME TO BE BAPTIZED?” Acts 8:37, “And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST IS THE SON OF GOD.”

Some might support that the eunuch believed in Jesus in Acts 8:37 since Acts 8:37, “(mentions that he).. answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.” However, some might argue that it should be in Acts 8:36, “(since)…the eunuch said, …what doth hinder me to be baptized?” Their support to be in Acts 8:36 would be due to there should not be any justifiable reason for him to ask to be baptized if he did not believe in Jesus. In any of the above analyses, the eunuch should have started to believe in Jesus either in Acts 8:36 or in 8:37.

Did Acts 8 mention that he did receive the Holy Spirit after believing? No, it did not mention that, except the phrase, be baptized him, is mentioned in Acts 8:38. The following is the extract:

Acts 8:38, “And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.”

As nothing is mentioned whether the eunuch did receive the Holy Spirit except the phrase, he baptized him, in Acts 8:38, it might come to the conclusion that he only received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:38.

For instance, if he only received the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:38, there is a gap of time in which the Holy Spirit should not be with him in the early part of Acts 8:38, “(that mentions that)…he commanded the chariot to stand still…” and he had not received the Holy Spirit until after the latter part of Acts 8:38 despite he had believed in Jesus in either Acts 8:36 or 8:37.


Jonathan CHM 5 years ago

Some commentators might use Luke 23:43 to support that one of the thieves did not request Jesus to accept him in paradise to support that this verse does not demand non-Christian to ask for the Holy Spirit. Discuss.

Prior to tackling this question, let’s meditate Matthew 27:44:

Matthew 27:44, “The thieves also, which were crucified with him, cast the same in his teeth.”

As the phrase, cast the same in his teeth, is mentioned in Matthew 27:44, it implies that both the thieves did sin against the Lord.

Did one of the thieves repent from sin? Let’s meditate Luke 23:42-43 carefully below:

Luke 23:42-43, “And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.”

Nothing is mentioned in Luke 23:42-43 that the thief did repent from sin and it should be there or else it would not be possible for him to inform Luke 23:42, “…Jesus (that), Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom…”

If you would refer the word, Lord, in Luke 23:42, you would have discovered that the definition of the word, Lord, in Luke 23:42 coincides the word, Lord, in Romans 10:9 that the thief directly approached Jesus and demanded Him to take control of his life to be his Master. As the phrase, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom, is mentioned in Luke 23:42, it implies that the thief did request Jesus to accept or in other words, to receive him in paradise. Or in other words, this thief did sincerely ask Jesus to come and take control of his life to be his Master and that caused Him to mention that he Luke 23:43, “…shalt be with (Him) in paradise.”


Suzanne Saunders 5 years ago

I went to church with my parents when I was a child. I had no interest in God or reading the Bible and to be honest I was a rebellious and disobedient child. As a young adult I went to several different churches, hoping to find a church that made sense to me. I wanted to know why people even bothered to go to church, but it seemed like people in church were no different than the people who never went to church. In my late 30s, I began attending a Baptist church and listened to the Pastor as he would talk about Jesus dying on a cross, shedding His blood for my sins, and taking the penalty I deserved. I remember sitting in the pew, weeping, while the Pastor talked about Jesus and even though I did not understand why Jesus had to die, I wanted to know this Jesus who died for me. I followed the Pastor's instructions, went to the altar, and prayed to receive Jesus as my Saviour. To be honest, I believed God was mean and cruel to require Jesus to die for my sins, and I truly did not understand sin. I believed I was a good person because I helped others, gave to others whatever I had, and now I could add church attendance to my good person status. For 20 years, even though I moved a couple of times, I went to church regularly, attended many conferences, seminars, volunteered to help clean, or take care of children, or whatever was needed. There were times I was deeply hurt or saw others being hurt by people in the church, and there were times of great joy. I believed this was all part of life and would somehow work out in the end. Several years ago I was attending a church that offered a class called The Way of The Master. The Way of The Master uses the Ten Commandments to witness to people and it was the first time I had actually looked at the Ten Commandments closely. I had to memorize the Ten Commandments in order to be able to talk about them with others and as I talked about them, prayed about them, found out what Jesus had said about them, I found the Holy Spirit speaking to my heart. The Holy Spirit began to tell me that I had broken all the Commandments, over and over, without thought and without care. At first I could not accept this, as I believed I was a good person who had faithfuly attended church for 20 years. But as the Holy Spirit continued to speak to my heart, it was as if He were crushing me under the weight of my sin, opening my eyes to the sins in my life, and breaking my heart over the many ways I had sinned against God. Finally, I could see what He was telling me was true, and I fell to my knees asking Him to forgive me and show me mercy. As my heart was breaking, I finally understood sin from God's perspective, how wicked and evil my heart was, and that God would not and could not allow sin into Heaven. I began to hate the sin I had once tolerated, justified, and even loved. I began to agree with God that everything He said was sin, I also said was sin, and my heart's desire was to examine myself, repent over my sins, and cry out to God for forgiveness. I finally knew when it means in the Bible to hunger and thirst after righteousness as I began to desire God above all things. I found I desired to read His Word, to know His charater and His will for my life above all things. I had previously told myself the Bible was too hard for me to understand and justified my thinking by telling myself it was written in a language I did not know. I began to experience God pruning away those areas in my life that did not conform to His character or His will. The Ten Commandments, that I had previously ignored, became so important to me that I examine my life daily by them. The blood of Jesus and what He did for me became so precious that I still am awed that He would die for me and I am trying to live a life that honors Him. I confess I fall short too many times, but God is merciful and His Word is encouraging and gives me hope day by day as I struggle to follow Him and deal with my sin nature, the world, my flesh, and Satan's arrows. Do you know the Ten Commandments? Do you know what Jesus said about the Ten Commandments? Please let me encourage you to read them in Exodus 20, then go to the New Testament, Matthew 5, and read what Jesus said about them. God bless you. suzannelsaunders@yahoo.com


cevaughnjr profile image

cevaughnjr 5 years ago from Newbury Park, CA

If Born Again Christians are guaranteed Salvation why do they need Grace?


eve 5 years ago

hello

i'm a filipino catholic

i just have to share my opinion about born again christians

i attended a bible study with them

and I believe that their interpretation of "faith alone" is bogus

sorry for the term

but the thief's case is exceptional

they say the thief only accepted, believed in, and confessed Jesus and he was saved

but if you will read the bible it is also written that we will be judged according to the things that we've done

"You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone," (James 2:24)

there are other instances in the bible saying that works are also important

in catholic the formula of salvation is faith plus good works and i believe in it

how much good works?

only God can tell

He is the Judge and He knows what is inside our hearts

God bless y'all


henryd123 5 years ago

DIET PENTACOSTAL IS CALL BORN AGAIN

When protestants say that "the Bible interprets the Bible" doesn't make a lot of sense. For one, in order to interpret something, you need to have a *thinking* entity that can tell us what something means. But scripture is not a *thinking* entity, its? just ink and paper. That's why we need the Apostolic tradition and the Church to give us the interpretation of scripture.

The most ironic thing about the Sola Scriptura fallacy is that those who advocate it don't actually LET the Bible interpret itself. What is the usual case is that they take individual passages that? are usefull to the preoccupations of their particular sectarian group. Most other matters are simply ignored, especially if their sectarian enthusiasms are contradicted by a given passage.

Look the protestant Church keeps fighting with even each other.. They have? split so many times they are in the thousands last I checked for Protestant Denominations. As they keep splitting with each other and make up new Denominations they will keep watering everything down.. They are already at the point where they have lost where they came from. They will have Church that will resemble a plain office/ rock concert/donation drop box..

the sheer arrogance and pride of the Protestants who believe that they have the authority to pass judgment over the Holy Word of God, even in their fallen, sinful state.

You can keep your watered-down, "diet" version? of Christianity: I'll remain with the one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, founded by Jesus Christ himself upon St. Peter.

The Bible is the Holy Word of God. But by itself, it does not do anything. A believer must read the Word, then interpret its meaning. Left to my own interpretations, I am prone to error due to my sinful nature. Which is why I follow the infallible interpretations of Christ's Catholic Church. Only it has the authority from Jesus to infallibly interpret the true meaning of the Word.


Cathy 4 years ago

Greetings all!!

Yes very much to say... but I will sum it up.....

Yes these famous people on TV - hey we know the colors they like, who they date, their favorite dishes but do we really know them??? Can we say we have a relationship with them???

We want to know much about Christ because we want to be Christ-like and this is good!!! (Christians) But do we really know God? Do we have a one on one relationship with him? THAT'S WHAT HE WANTS TO HAVE WITH US A RELATIONSHIP. Not only Sundays, but also be with him on Monday - Tuesday - Wednesday - Thursday - Friday - Saturday. We want to have a healthy relationship we must communicate through prayer.

He walked right and set high standards for our lives. We cannot show-off and say yea I don't do this or that because with all honestly it's not by our strength. ( I can do all things through Christ). Just as we need to eat each day to stay strong, we also need to feed our self spiritual (by reading scripture - going to church and praying)

I gave my life to the Lord when all was well. I was not a drug addict nor an alcholic. I had a loving family, good education and good job. Apparently all was well until I knew I had an emptiness in my heart that I could not satisfy with anything. Visited a church and felt right in the midst of it. Scripture states that where there is 2 or 3 united in his name he is there.

Loved it no better experience. Now if I have or don't have what I wish it is ok. As long as I have God in my life I AM FULFILLED.


blinks 4 years ago

i personally believe in GOD and in jesus, i dont beleive all that pastors say,my worship to God is personal,come to think of it who wrote the bible bc somethings there are just not right.


blinks 4 years ago

we all know what is right and wrong,and we know the law of karma,which says that whatever you sow you shall reap,so i think the most important thing in life is to love ourselves and others, do the right things, be good and leave the rest to GOD.


wilmiers77 profile image

wilmiers77 4 years ago from Oklahoma City, OK

There is a filling of the Holy Spirit which could take some time or one could be hit by the Light as did Paul, the Apostle. To be "born again" is the moment of knowing Christ Jesus. Steph, you are blessed. My recognition of Jesus as being my Savior came slow for me, and the filling also. The Lord and I had to reasoning together and is still reasoning together; I have gotten to the point that abundant life is "Listening to every word of God and obeying.", all other is vanity. "Seek the Kingdom Of God and His Righteousness and All shall be added unto you."


PAMITCHRUS 4 years ago

To add to what wilmeirs77 is saying.. being born again is actually meeting your Heavenly Father.. At our Physical birth we meet our Earthly Mother. At our spiritual birth we meet our Heavenly Father. We don't remember our physical birth.. To those whom the Spirit of Birth is sent, Well their world is turned upside down and blown away having seen the unseen. Very few I am coming to realize have actually been truly born again, being sealed by the spirit, having meet their heavenly Father and now bearing his name upon their foreheads.

Of course the professing church has no clue as to what being born again means. But they shall not forever be in the dark as they currently are blinded by the god of this world..

Grace and Peace to all who seek truth and shun sin..


Jessica 4 years ago

Hi, I see this has been put up years ago. I just wanna know... are you still a Catholic? Or have you converted to Born Again Christian by now? I am also having the same questions in mind. thanks!


Paul 4 years ago

As for the Karma guy (Blinks)- The Bible says to love God and to love your neighbor as yourself. No where does it say to love yourself.

Christ said in Matthew that there will be many in the day of judgment that will say Lord, Lord, but will not enter into the kingdom of heaven. Many people have their own views of how to get to heaven but totally never think that God already said how. He shows us in His Holy Word. Being born again is to agree with God that you are a sinner. Without God you can do nothing. We are born sinners, hence why we need to be born again. God hates sin so sinners will pay for them in the lake of fire, also known as hell. But God sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to die for our sins. He died in our place. He paid the price. Other areas of the Bible say that Jesus Christ is God. He is God in the flesh. This has to do with the trinity. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. After Christ died, He arose in three days. He ascended into heaven and now sits in His throne. He will come again and subdue all His enemies, which are those who refuse to obey Him. If you are not saved, you have that condemnation. You are the enemy of God if you are not born again. How does one get born again? You must repent. You must agree with God that you are a sinner. You must want to serve God and Jesus Christ. You must believe and accept the sacrifice that Jesus Christ did for you and me. You must call on God and repent of your sins, turn to Him and only then can you be born again. For any further discussion or help visit

www.midcoastbaptistchurch.com


Jerry P from Rockford, IL 4 years ago

Greek scholars say "born again" is better said as "begotten from above" which underscores that we, like in physical birth, are not calling the shots. But BA is a very real life changing event. It's like dog-paddling and getting nowhere and at the same time a hand from heaven reaches to you and you take it. You don't get BA by stopping bad things and starting good things in your life or with any resume. The bible says we are all a piece of crap with zero good in us, but BA changes that.

Those changes are detailed in Romans 6 where Paul shows that what happened is that we are baptized into Christ's death, made one with Him, and now freed from being ruled by our sin nature. To learn more, go to www.thecross.tv and choose "bible college" for more on Ro 6.

One more thing. When you are BA you will know it, because so much happens as you become that "new creature" as told in 2 Cor 5:17. And it's wonderful. The only challenge after that is staying in the faith that saved you instead of trying to EARN your salvation by what the church tells you to do, which God hates. The only gauge He looks at is faith. This seems wierd to us humans, but we aren't God.


Luvash 4 years ago

All i can say is that when you are a born again Christian, you are born of water and spirit. And when you come to accept Christ as your savior, you chose to follow His ways because you love Him and you dont want Him to be saddened by your works. But of course that doesnt make you go to heaven.because only His grace through faith can save each one of us. Its just that when you love Him so much, everything follows. Doing good deeds for Him because it makes Him happy and all that you do will be for His. Its like you no longer live for yourself but for Him only. And most importantly, in my point of view, you are not to look at that person by his behavior or his works and how he lives his life. Whatever he does, it doesnt change the fact that the truth is still true. The commandments are the same. So for me, i dont look at people on what they do. The important thing is that i seek for Him and for what He wants me to do and do it right. Even if my co Churchmates are not doing the same. Lets put in mind that salvation is "claimed" individually.


1blessed 4 years ago

Jesus is the Answer, the only way to salvation. It is very important that everyone knows this, Jesus died for ALL. Speak the word of God boldly Jesus, says my sheep hear my voice.


Ken 4 years ago

When GOD's Holy Commandments bring us to a point in life where we objectively and genuinely compare our lives (both past and present) to the Holiness required by GOD's Law (commandments) so that we stand righteous and acceptable before Him, we cannot honestly believe that we have perfectly kept His commandments and are therefore judged to have disobeyed them, trespassed against them, and fallen short of their requirements so as to depend upon our obedience to GOD's commands in order to be judged and declared righteous and holy and fully acceptable.

A reading of GOD's Word in light of His Law will render us crushed under the weight of our shortcomings (small and great) and cause us to realize that we are destined to spend eternity in Hell - tormented forever with Satan and his demonic angels and ALL sinners who never obtained to perfect righteousness.

If and when we truly realize how hopeless our situation and standing before the Eternal GOD and Judge of all the universe and everyone who has ever lived in it then we are prepared to hear the Gospel/Good News of Jesus Christ's living, dying, returning to life in His resurrection, ascending back into Heaven, and being exalted at the GODHEAD's Father's right hand where, as the Eternal High Priest, He makes intercession on behalf of His own (the saints/elect)and The Holy Spirit reveals to us that what Jesus Christ did was not for Himself but for us and in our name and in our stead.

We are then motivated to repent of our Sin, sinful natures (inherited at birth from Adam and Eve), and sins. We confess our lost condition and upon accepting and believing (trusting in and relying upon) Christ Jesus' Righteousness displacing our unrighteousness we are born again...born anew...reborn (spiritually)...made a new creature and are incorporated into Jesus Christ's body, His Righteousness, His Holiness, His Perfect Obedience and Standing before the Triune GODHEAD. All that He has becomes ours so that we stand before GOD Almighty fully pardoned, fully acceptable, fully a citizen of GOD's Kingdom in Heaven.

As a born again individual who has been saved by Emmanuel (GOD with us and GOD for us in the real Person of Jesus Christ Who was and is and shall ever be both True GOD and True Man) we are pointed back to the Law (Commandments) to see how we are to live as born again Christians so that as The Holy Spirit leads us, counsels with us, instructs us, strengthens us, guards us, and keeps us we will begin to obey and love GOD's Law and strive to hold it in high esteem and strive to carefully uphold it's letter and spirit. If we fail at times we will run back to the Gospel for assurance of our standing rightly before GOD and gladly confess our failing and ask for both forgiveness and ability to do better. Our lives will be a constant desire to trust and obey GOD until the day He transforms us from the temporal body we occupy on earth to the perfected one we will enjoy for all of eternity.

Being born again is the start of a work which will continue in us by the very power of GOD The Holy Spirit Who will perfect that work all the way to completion. We will grow bolder in GOD's grace toward us, bolder in faith (believing/clinging to/relying upon/trusting in Jesus' work on our behalf), and bolder in doing good works which praise and glorify the GODHEAD - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Because we have been justified (placed into right standing with GOD by His grace and through faith given to us by the Holy Spirit so as to believe and trust in Christ Jesus' Gospel) we joyfully and continuously respond to that justification through our sanctification which is the work of the Holy Spirit with and in us.

As we grow in sanctification our living becomes more and more a reflection (although an imperfect one) of Christ Himself so that we know that we are indeed Christian, we are indeed elect, we are indeed saved unto salvation and rescued from death and Hell, we are indeed adopted, through Christ Jesus, into GOD's eternal family and made citizens of His Kingdom.

The beauty of the new birth is that as we grow in it we actually (genuinely) do begin and increase in our knowledge and knowing GOD and in confidence that we (far more importantly) are known of Him as belonging to Him both now and forever.

It's my fervent and heartfelt prayer that my simple words assist you in understanding what being born again is and what it incorporates and how it differs from being religious or simply a professing "Christian" (which, sadly enough is not a Christian at all). May GOD now bless and keep you!


TCurtis Moore profile image

TCurtis Moore 4 years ago

Nice Hubpage! All Christian lets not forget that Paul says in his righting not to argue about words, but to Love one another. Love you all, and God Bless.


Pegusus 4 years ago

I also share your views. I recently had a friend who is a Jehovas witness, now shunned by her church because she questioned their scripture. They will have nothing to do with her, Period. Well, I was talking to her about my beliefs and told her I was a born again Christian and her eyes widened as if I had two heads. At that point, I didn't really feel as if I knew her as well as I thought I did. Almost as if I appeared demonic to her for saying that. Well, I stood my ground and still am a Born again Christian. Was I interpreting her look wrong? Must admit her facial expression and body language definitly made me feel uncomfortable. Any comments welcome.


believer in Christ 4 years ago

It is by the grace of God and by faith that we are saved, and still. God will reward each one according to their works, it is healthy and neccesary for a beleiver in Christ to study the scripture regurlay because 'All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,'2 Timothy 3:16

Psalm 1

1Blessed is the man

who does not walk in the counsel of the wicked

or stand in the way of sinners

or sit in the seat of mockers.

2But his delight is in the law of the Lord,

and on his law he meditates day and night.

3He is like a tree planted by streams of water,

which yields its fruit in season

and whose leaf does not wither.

Whatever he does prospers.

People who dedicate their lives to God and become born again may stop their bad habits such as drinking to be holier.


Perezp910 4 years ago

I have been married now for 11 yrs and have a 2 yr old daughter. 3 years ago my husband became a born again and his life as changed for the better. He was an alcoholic and and now he is a family guy and its great. My own problem is that he is an extremist. Everything we do or say he turns it around and it become a topic of jesus and im hrtting very aggitated with it. What should i do?? I feel guilty even thinking this way... Help me please


Natalie Capaldi 4 years ago

My son and i are born again christians that have been hurt by Pastors and churches all over Melbourne Vic as they didnt want to make time such as 2hours one day a weeknight to go thru the bible with us but didnt want to make time and also our family picks on our weight everytime we were visiting them and we also forgave them in spirit but wont go and visit them and my son then rang them and told them to stay away from us as what they did to us so we left it in God's hands but now my son and I have no christian friends, and other friends to taslk to us and we are so isolated in our house that we have lived for 8yrs and are in distress and cant pray to God like we used to and we need alot of Phyclogical help as we are going insane. What do we do? We are out of patience and are in alot of distress. Plz donbt mention churches to us as we will refuse as all the churches wanted from us is our money and wouldnt help us spiritually with our lives and in the word of God. Then these pastors have the guts to go out in the streets of Australia/Melbourne and preach the Gospel when they dont put it into practice themselves and we are not judging them but telling u the truth about them as we see it in their false fruits.


Natalie and Peter Capaldi 4 years ago

My son and i are born again christians that have been hurt by Pastors and churches all over Melbourne Vic as they didnt want to make time such as 2hours one day a weeknight to go thru the bible with us but didnt want to make time and also our family picks on our weight everytime we were visiting them and we also forgave them in spirit but wont go and visit them and my son then rang them and told them to stay away from us as what they did to us so we left it in God's hands but now my son and I have no christian friends, and other friends to taslk to us and we are so isolated in our house that we have lived for 8yrs and are in distress and cant pray to God like we used to and we need alot of Phyclogical help as we are going insane. What do we do? We are out of patience and are in alot of distress. Plz donbt mention churches to us as we will refuse as all the churches wanted from us is our money and wouldnt help us spiritually with our lives and in the word of God. Then these pastors have the guts to go out in the streets of Australia/Melbourne and preach the Gospel when they dont put it into practice themselves and we are not judging them but telling u the truth about them as we see it in their false fruits.

ps: My son and I had prayers for this situation and all we want from you people is what we need to do physically in getting a Christian or do u know of a born again christian leader in our city or can make phone calls in finding a suitable Tutor in the word of God for us plz. That is all we are asking u plz help us find a good Rabbi that can help us thru the entire bible as we dont understand the scriptures even with the Holy Spirit as we both tried. Please please my broters and sisters help us with this pledge. Thank u kindly your brother Peter and Natalie Capaldi. I am 52 and my son Peter is 27 and are both on the Dissability and Carers Pension.


Kerry43 4 years ago

Good morning, I like that you mentioned those whose approach to their new found way of thinking is often overboard. These people do get on my nerves, most of the time, because they go out of their way to find fault. Perhaps they missed a very important part of the scripture and need a trip back into those pages for a refresher course...a tad like those who give up smoking then curse everyone else who still lights up.

Thanks for your input - very interesting!

Kerry:)


Kiel 3 years ago

the true belief of being religion is born again

and in (JOHN 3:1-7) SAYS;

Jesus Teaches Nicodemus

3 Now there was a Pharisee, a man named Nicodemus who was a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2 He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs you are doing if God were not with him.”

3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.”

4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”

5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit[b] gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’

(1 PETER 1:3-9)

Born Again to a Living Hope

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, 5 who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 6 In this you rejoice, though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 so that the tested genuineness of your faith—more precious than gold that perishes though it is tested by fire—may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ. 8 Though you have not seen him, you love him. Though you do not now see him, you believe in him and rejoice with joy that is inexpressible and filled with glory, 9 obtaining the outcome of your faith, the salvation of your souls.

and (1 PETER 1:23) says;

23 Being born again , not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.


Carl Shanks 3 years ago

No where in the Bible does it say sex before marriage is a sin.

Therefore, that's really unnecessary to take such a wonderful thing away. Considering how therapeutic sex and masturbating are.

But, to each their own. If it works for you, great.


TCurtis Moore profile image

TCurtis Moore 3 years ago

In the new testament God writes his laws on our hearts. When we sin the Holy Spirit will convict you of your sins. If you have not became a born again Christian then you may not be convicted of your sin.

You could ignore the conviction thinking it was your imagination, and that it's okay as long as you feel good. Lots of people do things according to how it makes them feel.

If you have been filled with the Holy Spirit he will guide you into all truths. Read your bible everyday asking the Lord to teach you his will for your life. His ways are not our ways.

If you do something in unbelief then you sin, if you do it in belief then you don't sin.

However just because you think it's okay to do wrong to someone doesn't mean that you haven't sinned. Anything that brings harm to your neighbor can be considered a sin.

If I get onto my neighbor about something they are doing wrong, and they change then it's not a sin. This correction can cause pain in their hearts. This all depends on how they take it, and what they do with what I say to them.

As far as sex before marriage if you marry the person. Then that is between you, them, and God. If you are having multiple partners then this is considered sin in the bible.

If you are a non-Christian and are not going to become one you are on your own to believe what you want. All of us are sinners not because of what we have done, but because we were born into sin.

Therefore we all have sinned because Adam and Eve sinned. We followed after them. If you are not a Christian you are free to do whatever you please it's your life.

But you are still a sinner no matter what you choose. Sin has this power over us, and we can become free from it.

We are more-less slaves to sin, but through Christ we become slaves to righteousness. Christ died to set us free from it, so that it no longer has power over us.

God bless and have a great day.


Maria 2 months ago

I have just had some dealings with "born again" Christians who make me glad that I am not of that faith. They exude all the characteristics of those who are vengeful, greedy, self-serving and think only of their own desires.

This is despite the fact that they go to church regularly, make their 10 month old child pray in the restaurant and then feed the child garbage food.

Amen!

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